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-   -   4th Gen HG/SS - Updated Gym Leaders/Elite 4/Red? (https://www.pokecommunity.com/showthread.php?t=178923)

iTzKaizer May 15th, 2009 7:55 PM

HG/SS - Updated Gym Leaders/Elite 4/Red?
 
I know it's just not me, but a lot of people that thinks G/S/C had the most underleveled pokemon out of all the pokemon games.

I fyou compare them with the ones in RSE, they're a little underleveled.

Now, if you compare them with the ones in D/P/Pt, RBY and FR/LG, then they're REALLY underleveled.

Champions top pokemon, Dragonite, is at level 50. IN Sinnoh's Elite Four you can see stronger pokemon in the first member of the E4!

Do you expect Gamefreak will level up those pokemon, or are you of the people that prefer keep them for nostalgic factors?

hvsep May 15th, 2009 8:36 PM

They're underlevelled because there are 16 gyms to go through. If they went with the D/P/Pt pace, the Kanto gym leaders would have level 80 Pokemon, so what would happen to the Elite 4 and Red? They need to make the levels a little smaller to fit it all.

Zackraa May 15th, 2009 8:45 PM

if they leave out kanto and I hope they do or just turn kanto into a battle frontier then johto should be a kick ass place to train otherwise it'll be easy as hell again

SDODC13 May 15th, 2009 9:09 PM

idk I can agree that they were underleveled but I like the 16 gym idea so no I dont think it should be scratched rather fine tuned...

MetalMario May 15th, 2009 9:16 PM

I have no problem with the later Kanto gyms having teams in their 70s and Red having a team in their 90s. These levels exist for a reason.

Suppose your team's expected to be around Level 55-60 by the time you head to Kanto. Since levels are so hard to gain at that point, you might finish off Kanto at around Level 70, allowing Red to maintain his existing team and still be somewhat of a challenge.

Also, I'd prefer that the *wild* Pokémon of Kanto maintain their low levels to allow it to serve as a place to train low-leveled Pokémon in, just like Johto, but often with different types to facilitate training more kinds of Pokémon. The trainers can have high-leveled Pokémon, and there's certainly no problem with having lots of them.

Naturally, the level curve can be steeper in Johto--G/S/C's low levels were one of its key criticisms. They increased the level curve in Platinum and Emerald, so I don't see why this would be a problem. It would require a little more attention to training your team to keep up, but that's what this game is about, after all. The audience has certainly gotten a lot smarter over the years.

The Hero Without a Name May 15th, 2009 9:40 PM

I'd personally like it if you got to rebattle the E4 with buffed (possibly new?) Pokemon.

BHwolfgang May 15th, 2009 9:46 PM

Well, if they beef everything in this remake, everything will be solved... or would it?!

I would like to see more stronger Gym Leaders, Trainers, Elite 4, etc. Also, while you are adventuring in Johto, shouldn't the Kanto Gym Leaders get stronger as well? They don't just stay in their gym all the time, ya know?

Also, Red's party should be somewhere around level 80-90 so it can be more of a challenge.

Translator May 15th, 2009 10:55 PM

I agree that they were underleveled so I think they will raise the levels in these games. I hope that they will raise the levels of Falkner's Pokemon to Lv. 12 - 15.! Come on, a level 7 Pidgey and a level 9 Pidgeotto for the first gym.?

Wings Don't Cry May 16th, 2009 2:02 AM

I thought the Elite 4 was hard my Pokemon were still in the 30s but the elemental punches solved nearly all my problems, then there was red with a Pikachu at lvl 81 and my Feraligator at 48 so that was a bit hard

Alexithymia~ May 16th, 2009 2:17 AM

The underleveled pokemon made the gyms easy and not really challenging.
But I guess you had a challenge when you battled Red, right? And the fact you went to Kanto...
I didn't really notice when I first played Silver. I just thought my pokemon were like really awesome, and I was just like an amazing trainer.

Artemis May 16th, 2009 4:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hiroshi Sotomura (Post 4645870)
Level 9 Pidgeotto. Strangest trademark gym leader's Pokémon ever. It'd probably be more authentic if Falkner still had it, but it'd be quite strange no less. (On the other hand, we still have level 16 Dusknoir and a Level 1 Regigigas.)


LOL.

You know what, when I first played through the game in the original version, I could have beaten it with my Feraligtr alone. I'm hoping they bring up the levels, and if they get into the 90s by the time of the Kanto then so be it, but I've been looking for the Pokémon game that can give me a challenge, and if this is it, then I wouldn't be disappointed at all.

Stronkadonk May 16th, 2009 4:10 AM

They're definitely gonna increase the Pokémon Levels. They did it from Diamond and Pearl over to Platinum, and they're gonna do it for the newest games.

Nothing else can really be said, but it's pretty obvious, with the trends we've been seeing.

Melodyfree May 16th, 2009 4:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MetalMario (Post 4645349)
I have no problem with the later Kanto gyms having teams in their 70s and Red having a team in their 90s. These levels exist for a reason.

Suppose your team's expected to be around Level 55-60 by the time you head to Kanto. Since levels are so hard to gain at that point, you might finish off Kanto at around Level 70, allowing Red to maintain his existing team and still be somewhat of a challenge.

This. x20.
Gym leaders are supposed to get stronger as time goes on, aren't they? So it's not very reasonable (or particularly fun) if their levels are forever stuck in the high 50s.
If Red has a level 96 Pikachu, so be it. This would only make HGSS the most challenging game of all in contrast to the easy crap that was G/S/C. And a challenge is awesome. It's what makes a game fun.

Artemis May 16th, 2009 5:06 AM

It would be the game challenging, but fun as well. I mean, even if they boost up the levels, if they can somehow manage for us to choose one of the Kanto starters, and start a fresh jounrey in Kanto then I wouldn't mind that, but I don't know how they'll do it is the question. Anyway, Red's Pikachu at level 96. Ha Ha, it'll be about time.

zirico May 16th, 2009 7:57 AM

i think faulkner should atleast have a lvl 14/15 Pigeot as his signature pokemon (i know it is not possible but neither was his pidgeotto), it would just feel so much better and make it a better game in my opinion. i am a trainer that generally trains his pokes to around lvl 20 before the first gym so i hope that all the pokes exept the wild ones rise in level by at leasts three levels.

Zelda May 16th, 2009 11:28 AM

Yes I too realized that they were really low levels. I'm pretty sure they'll make them higher levels. I mean people want some things to be the same, but really to me they were just too under leveled.

Artemis May 16th, 2009 11:36 AM

Compared to the newer games it is definitely underleveled. Now, the Gym Leaders such as Falkner do not need a lv. 15 Pigeot, but at least let us have rematches with them later on will be great.

du1387 May 16th, 2009 4:44 PM

I think what's going to happen is they'll leave the gyms relatively untouched at first, but there'll be rebattles once you go to Kanto, and I'm sure the Elite 4 will definitely see improvements. Most likely we'll have what platinum has and they'll gradually get tougher as the game goes on.

Ŧøry vs. M£A†¥³ May 16th, 2009 4:52 PM

I always though that G/S/C were the hardest Pokemon games compared to the other Pokemon versions.

ckret2 May 16th, 2009 6:26 PM

I'm the kind of player who barrels through the plot with next to no training beyond whatever battles I get into going from Point A to Point B, so the levels in G/S/C never bothered me much. :P Still, it'd be nice if they made the levels in HG/SS more closely match the ones in other games, so I'm all for raising the levels. I'll just have to put up with trudging around in the grass leveling up my Pokémon, heh.

Pochama95 May 16th, 2009 6:29 PM

I agree it was underlevel because it was hard to evolve my starter before getting to the 1st gym if I had 2 more pokemon on my team

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ŧøry (Post 4647563)
I always though that G/S/C were the hardest Pokemon games compared to the other Pokemon versions.


It was Y/B/R for me GS/C was one of the easiest games out there I beat the league on the 1st try any time but yellow took me forever

Astinus May 16th, 2009 6:37 PM

I would be happy to see raised levels in the new games. I'm a grinder, so I'm always training my Pokemon before the next plot point. So in G/S/C, the gyms and the Elite were easy for me. Red was a challenge, because I wasn't expecting that high of a level from him, but challenges make the game fun for me.

Plus, it would make rematches against the Elite Four better.

Pochama95 May 16th, 2009 6:42 PM

Gymleader and E4 pokemon
 
I would love to see some of the gymleaders have different pokemon possibly some out of region pokemon. Like Bugsy and Mothim or Jasmine and Magnezone. What do you think?

Shem May 16th, 2009 6:44 PM

I wouldn't mind raised levels but I don't want to have to level grind on wild pokemon, the trainers between towns and in dungeons should suffice to be strong enough for the gyms.

Oblivion Reaper 2.0 May 16th, 2009 6:55 PM

well this is a remake so don't expect any 4th gen pokemon untill later in the game

Swift! May 16th, 2009 7:20 PM

I'd like to see Morty have a Misdreavus. I mean, it makes sense... doesn't it?

Pokemoerules May 16th, 2009 7:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by .Swift (Post 4647982)
I'd like to see Morty have a Misdreavus. I mean, it makes sense... doesn't it?



It makes complete sense, morty must have Misdreavus.

Ivysaur May 17th, 2009 1:25 AM

Merged another two identical threads~

And I don't think the Johto Gym Leaders/Elite 4 will have an update in the first run. Maybe if you can have rematches or the second time you battle them.

Electricz May 17th, 2009 2:03 AM

G/S was so easy i could complete the game in 3 hours using only my starter pokemon so they should make the leaders stronger and elite 4 stronger

Artemis May 17th, 2009 3:42 AM

If Morty is given a Mistreavous, then I'd like to have rematches with the Gym after obtaining the National Dex. Saying that, it'll be most likely by then he might have the new Mismagius.

NytewolfAU2k7 May 17th, 2009 6:54 AM

I'd like to see Kanto gym leaders and Red a bit tougher, yeah. ;)

Precious Tears May 17th, 2009 7:17 AM

To me the level is not important...
The problem is having TOO native Kanto Pokemon in almost every gymleaders' team...

For example
Falkner... He should instead have a Hoot-hoot and a Noctowl or Murkrow
rather than Pidgey and Pidgeotto
But of course there's some exception, like Morty and Clair
Since the lack of Dragon and Ghost-type...

Quote:

Originally Posted by f l a s h (Post 4648822)
If Morty is given a Mistreavous, then I'd like to have rematches with the Gym after obtaining the National Dex. Saying that, it'll be most likely by then he might have the new Mismagius.

I don't think we should have to wait the National-dex to have Mismagius...
They should kick out some too native Kanto Pokemon like Pidgey, Nidoran...
But include some 4th-gen Pokemon that have connection with 2nd-gen Pokemon like Electivire, Mismagius....

solaris knight May 17th, 2009 7:27 AM

Doubt they'll change their line-ups, and if thay do, they probably won't use anything beyond Gen 2.

I never thought G/S/C were too easy, though thinking back now, It seems they could use a little increase in power.

Precious Tears May 17th, 2009 8:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by solaris knight (Post 4649221)
Doubt they'll change their line-ups, and if thay do, they probably won't use anything beyond Gen 2.

I never thought G/S/C were too easy, though thinking back now, It seems they could use a little increase in power.

Yeah I know that too...
So sometimes I think the original G/S/C are kinda stupid games...
I mean there's wide selection of "new" Pokemon that can be put in those Gym Leaders team...
But why not use those Pokemon?
It's also kinda lame that Houndour, Murkrow etc can be ONLY caught in Kanto...

Artemis May 17th, 2009 11:15 AM

THey always deserved an increase in power, it was just back then, the two reasons levels would go so high, and I think GameFreak was a little skeptical on that.

Anyway, I doubt the lineup of the Gyms and Elites might change because of how the Gyms in FRLG styaed the same like the originals. I can picture it all changing up a bit after the National Dex is obtained and a rematch is called for.

Chris The Nerd May 17th, 2009 2:08 PM

Making Red Stronger
 
Up until the release of Pokémon Platinum, Red - from Gold, Silver, and Crystal - had the highest level Pokémon in any of the games, (Excluding the Battle Towers and Frontiers.) He had a Level 81 Pikachu, level 73 Espeon, 75 snorlax, and level 77 Kanto starters.

In Platinum,The Player's Rival, Pearl, will have his starter at level 85 later in the game, and two of his other Pokémon above level 81, and one At level 81) All of Pearl's Pokémon are at a higher level than Red's Second strongest Pokémon

The question I'm trying to get at is, do you think that Game Freak will boost Red's Party to beat Pearl's, or Leave them alone and make Pearl the reigning champion of all of the Pokémon games?

Hypno May 17th, 2009 2:11 PM

They better boost it a little bit more, he should be the ultimate trainer.

s0nido May 17th, 2009 2:13 PM

I want Red to be the strongest trainer of them all because he is just awesome. :P
Really, though, they should make him stronger, while making everyone else in the game stronger with him, so you don't have such a bad advantage. He was quite easy to beat because most of his Pokemon were a single type or had clear weaknesses. The only problem was that you could never train to his level just like that because of the lack of matching level wild Pokemon to train with. (i.e. level 50-70 wild Pokemon to train with.)

LethalTexture May 17th, 2009 2:18 PM

They should certainly make him better. Having Pearl besting him is simple a travesty.

"Shadow Lugia" May 17th, 2009 2:55 PM

Up until now, Red has been the strongest Pokemon trainer. He deserves that title.

Maybe after beating the Elite Four a certain number of times, his team could jump to lv. 100.

Artemis May 17th, 2009 2:56 PM

I would definitely want Red to gain back his title of having the strongest Pokémon. I mean it'll also give the game a chance to raise the levels of the Elites, Gyms, and so on.

Gummy May 17th, 2009 3:06 PM

For the simple fact of him being Red, they can make all his Pokemon level 90+ and most people wouldn't complain.

"Shadow Lugia" May 17th, 2009 3:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Revolución (Post 4650241)
For the simple fact of him being Red, they can make all his Pokemon level 90+ and most people wouldn't complain.

As long as there's a way for that to happen without the need of massive grinding to beat him, I'm guessing that more people would celebrate than complain.

BHwolfgang May 17th, 2009 3:10 PM

I want to see Red, or formely Ash Ketchum, to be 'the very best'. Having someone like Pearl besting his team is a mockery. Well, not really, but it's a shame to having someone like him to have his party getting beat by the player with one Pokémon.

If I have a say in anything, I would make all his Pokémons in their mid-90's and have Pikachu as level 100.

Chris The Nerd May 17th, 2009 3:13 PM

wait, I just realized something. since there was never a yellow remake, Red shouldn't even have that Pikachu in the remake's canon.

Jαcκςση May 17th, 2009 3:19 PM

Tbh, I think his team should eventually be at level 100 after some point.

Artemis May 17th, 2009 3:41 PM

You know what, why not just make all level 100 for out sakes (LoL). It'll definitely be a challenge, that's for sure.

Oblivion Reaper 2.0 May 17th, 2009 4:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ~KALEIDOSCOPE~ (Post 4650150)
I want Red to be the strongest trainer of them all because he is just awesome. :P
Really, though, they should make him stronger, while making everyone else in the game stronger with him, so you don't have such a bad advantage. He was quite easy to beat because most of his Pokemon were a single type or had clear weaknesses. The only problem was that you could never train to his level just like that because of the lack of matching level wild Pokemon to train with. (i.e. level 50-70 wild Pokemon to train with.)

They will boost diffcutly so be perpared for lv.100 pokemon
Also there will be new areas with stronger pokemon to train...

Artemis May 17th, 2009 4:53 PM

With all these possibilites of a stronger Red and stronger trainers, then Experience will come very easily when time to EV train.

lolwut May 17th, 2009 4:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris The Nerd (Post 4650268)
wait, I just realized something. since there was never a yellow remake, Red shouldn't even have that Pikachu in the remake's canon.

But me, and probably some other people, still might believe that red is actually from the anime. Which did revolve around the video games but also had it's own story, and red had his pikachu all the way up to the emerald series, and he's yet to appear in the d/p/pt series.

Artemis May 17th, 2009 5:03 PM

So it is more than likely Red will have Pikachu no matter what.

Zelda May 17th, 2009 5:13 PM

Most likely. I hope he does, but if he doesn't I really don't mind.

Sweet Smoochum May 17th, 2009 5:18 PM

I wouldn't mind if his Pokemon were level 90s. (My strongest in Platinum is level 87 Dragonite. :D I also have level 84 Mr. Mime, level 82 Infernape, and level 80 Gengar, Togekiss, Vaporeon, Azumarill, Torterra, Gyarados.) Maybe I can bring some of my Platinum pokemon into Heart Gold/Soul Silver to challenge him a second time along with my Johto pokemon if my party in Johto isn't strong enough. I hope he keeps all of his Pokemon. Pikachu, Espeon, Snorlax, Venusaur, Charizard, and Blastoise.

Artemis May 17th, 2009 5:21 PM

You know, I always thought it strange for him to have Espeon, since he is kind of based off of Ash, who never caught an Eevee in his life as yet. Anyways, if he's in the 90's then I'll definitely need a good enough team to take him on. I just pray he'll gain his title with the highest level Pokémon, he deserves it.

Oblivion Reaper 2.0 May 17th, 2009 5:24 PM

don't forget that Red in G/S/C had a Espeon
plus there was a free Eevee in R/B/Y

Apathetic_Yen May 17th, 2009 5:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slowpokez (Post 4650592)
But me, and probably some other people, still might believe that red is actually from the anime. Which did revolve around the video games but also had it's own story, and red had his pikachu all the way up to the emerald series, and he's yet to appear in the d/p/pt series.

He's more likely to be based off of the manga than the anime, but I think he's just his own character. He'll never be stronger than Pearl now anyways; he's got a Pikachu, which still has terrible stats at Lv100 (even with the light ball)

True Reign May 17th, 2009 5:52 PM

I say we have all his Pokemon at level 100 to make it even. :P

That Pikachu would sweep everyone.

Detox May 17th, 2009 5:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Apathetic_Yen (Post 4650734)
He's more likely to be based off of the manga than the anime, but I think he's just his own character. He'll never be stronger than Pearl now anyways; he's got a Pikachu, which still has terrible stats at Lv100 (even with the light ball)

Um....what?

Pikachu with a light ball can exceed 400 Special Attack...

I think they should make Red's whole team level 90-95, just to outclass Pearl...I mean serously, dont ya think lvl 100 is a bit too tough for an in-game trainer?

Sirius May 17th, 2009 5:56 PM

I definatly think they should. I mean, if you're able to beat him with 40's and 50's, against around 80's, then it needs to be stronger.

Translator May 17th, 2009 5:57 PM

I want Game Freak to raise Red's Pokemon levels a bit. Red is the strongest Pokemon Trainer and he deserves it. :)

Apathetic_Yen May 17th, 2009 6:06 PM

Hopefully when you go through the game the first time the gym leaders and E4 get roster updates. Don't wanna see another trainer with duplicate pokemon on their team (3 Dragonites? Really now?!)

Apathetic_Yen May 17th, 2009 6:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Syndrome (Post 4650844)
Um....what?

Pikachu with a light ball can exceed 400 Special Attack...

I think they should make Red's whole team level 90-95, just to outclass Pearl...I mean serously, dont ya think lvl 100 is a bit too tough for an in-game trainer?

yeah, if only it could get an attack in without being felled by the first blow, and its base 90 speed isn't going to help it much against most other pokemon

manga_meijin2 May 17th, 2009 6:17 PM

I think the more you fight him, the better he'll get until it reaches a capping point.

manga_meijin2 May 17th, 2009 6:19 PM

They'll level them up for sure, they could make the first half of the game a little longer for preparation

Ultima0071 May 17th, 2009 6:20 PM

What Game Freak should do and what they will do might be completely different. However, I hope they add 'boosts' to Red's pokemon every time you battle him, eventually making his entire team full of beastly pokemon. His pokemon should also have the correct movesets and items of a battle-ready team.

BHwolfgang May 17th, 2009 7:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ~Morning Bliss~ (Post 4650665)
Most likely. I hope he does, but if he doesn't I really don't mind.

I would totally spaz out. It wouldn't be the same to see Red without Pikachu. ;-; Well, to me, it is.

Quote:

Originally Posted by f l a s h (Post 4650348)
You know what, why not just make all level 100 for out sakes (LoL). It'll definitely be a challenge, that's for sure.

No matter how much I like that idea, I can't see that happening. XD

Cherrim May 17th, 2009 9:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris The Nerd (Post 4650135)
Up until the release of Pokémon Platinum, Red - from Gold, Silver, and Crystal - had the highest level Pokémon in any of the games, (Excluding the Battle Towers and Frontiers.) He had a Level 81 Pikachu, level 73 Espeon, 75 snorlax, and level 77 Kanto starters.

In Platinum,The Player's Rival, Pearl, will have his starter at level 85 later in the game, and two of his other Pokémon above level 81, and one At level 81) All of Pearl's Pokémon are at a higher level than Red's Second strongest Pokémon

The question I'm trying to get at is, do you think that Game Freak will boost Red's Party to beat Pearl's, or Leave them alone and make Pearl the reigning champion of all of the Pokémon games?

We already had a thread for discussing the beefing up of opponents in the game so I've merged yours with it. :>

Inferno1 May 17th, 2009 9:56 PM

I think all the levels Should be raised Heaps like 5 to 15 levels and would like kanto to be heaps harder cause i mean come on all the gym leaders had pokemon in between 40 and 60 and i mean come on your pokemon have to be that high to do the elite four its like come on i think their levels should be some where between 50 to 70 maybe even higher but that is just me i thnk this should be the most challenging game

Psyburn May 18th, 2009 6:20 AM

The only reason the newer games E4 teams are more difficult (imo) is due to the fact that it's made tedious by them having a load of full restores and pokemon that seemingly won't die without going through several turns. the E4 in RGBY were challenging by their own strengths, not a cheap supply of full restores. And I dont know what it is but people seem to think high levels = challenging in pokemon. They hardly mean anything these days. Looking at Pearl and his 85's, im thinking "wow, this guy sure fights like a moron...as always"

Zelda May 18th, 2009 6:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GymLeaderLily (Post 4650686)
I wouldn't mind if his Pokemon were level 90s. (My strongest in Platinum is level 87 Dragonite. :D I also have level 84 Mr. Mime, level 82 Infernape, and level 80 Gengar, Togekiss, Vaporeon, Azumarill, Torterra, Gyarados.) Maybe I can bring some of my Platinum pokemon into Heart Gold/Soul Silver to challenge him a second time along with my Johto pokemon if my party in Johto isn't strong enough. I hope he keeps all of his Pokemon. Pikachu, Espeon, Snorlax, Venusaur, Charizard, and Blastoise.

If Red's pokemon were in the 90's I would have to train a whole lot. Though I wouldn't mind, except for the fact that I would be spending a lot of time training but it depends on how fast the pokemon will level up.

Anyways, I would say he could be around the 70's or 60's.

d[-_-]b May 18th, 2009 5:19 PM

add a challenge orange islands lv 80=90 and e4 rd 2

Artemis May 18th, 2009 5:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ~Morning Bliss~ (Post 4652017)
If Red's pokemon were in the 90's I would have to train a whole lot. Though I wouldn't mind, except for the fact that I would be spending a lot of time training but it depends on how fast the pokemon will level up.

Anyways, I would say he could be around the 70's or 60's.

Oh no no, then that would be degrading him from his original games. In the original GS his Pikachu was already level 81.

Zelda May 18th, 2009 5:28 PM

Oh yes I recall that. I wouldn't mind him just being in the high 80's. Well 80 is just so close to 100 so I wouldn't actually mind if his pokemon is lv. 100.

Kristy Haruka May 23rd, 2009 11:29 PM

Gym Leader/Elite Four Roster Changes
 
One thing that really disappointed me in GSC were the horrible Gym Leader rosters. I expected all of them to introduce new Johto Pokemon, but only a few of them did! >_<; Here is what I think they should change their teams to:

Falkner: Hoothoot, Pidgeotto, Signature Pokemon: Delibird

Hoothoot replaces the weak Pidgey with a still weak, but Johto themed Pokemon. Delibird has low base stats and is easily taken down, but still has the Johto theme as well as being a bird Pokemon.

The Mud Slap TM sucks, too. :X

Bugsy: Ledyba, Spinarak, Pineco, Signature Pokemon: Scyther or Yanma

His team needed a complete revamp. Ledyba, Spinarak, and Pineco are all Johto bug types available before Goldenrod city and fit perfectly with his theme (and are not completely useless like Metapod). Scyther stays for some difficulty, but it could also be replaced by Yanma.

Whitney: Clefairy, Aipom, Furret, Signature Pokemon: Miltank

With so many new Normal types introduced, I'm surprised Whitney still had to rely on a Kanto Pokemon. It makes sense that they limited her Pokemon, though, since Miltank was such a pain for most beginning trainers! D: I still think Aipom and Furret are good additions, though!

Morty: Gastly, Haunter, Gengar, Signature Pokemon: Misdreavus

Uhm... there were only 4 Ghost types in GSC, and Gamefreak didn't even bother to add in the newly introduced Misdreavus into Morty's team. -_-; I think this speaks for itself!

Jasmine: Magnemite, Magneton, Skarmory, Signature Pokemon: Steelix

Jasmine was a joke and really needed a boost. Skarmory or Forretress would have been great additions to her team! And even though Ampharos isn't a steel type, it fits her theme!

Chuck: Tyrogue, Machoke, Poliwrath, Signature Pokemon: Hitmontop

Uhm yeah... Tyrogue and Hitmontop were the only new Fighting types... and he didn't have them. -_______-;

Pryce: Dewgong, Sneasel, Jynx, Signature Pokemon: Piloswine

Pryce needed some new Ice types to make him a little more difficult...

Claire: Dragonair (x2), Gyarados, Signature Pokemon: Kingdra

Her team was fine. :]

I'll add the Elite Four later!

sudden_hit May 24th, 2009 1:14 AM

Very nice idea's, and i completely agree.

The idea about Jasmine having her Amphross is one thing i would like incorperated.

-Tom

Lt. Silver May 24th, 2009 1:59 AM

But if you battle her at night ampharos would have to be in the lighthouse so that wouldn't work.

Ryanniny May 24th, 2009 2:09 AM

I also think they need to be quite a bit stronger, i mean, a level 7 pidgey & level 9 pidgeotto for Falkner? pfft >__>

I like your improvements, but i think Chuck should have a sudowoodo maybe, instead of tyrogue, cos thats kinda weak for the 5th gym leader.

TheAliveTrain May 24th, 2009 2:14 AM

Theres just one pokémon that I completly disagree: delibird o.O
If his team levels up so pidgeotto can be level 16, I guess Hoothoot and Pidgeotto are ok.

Lt. Silver May 24th, 2009 2:15 AM

sudowudo isn't fighting type though it would be best to stick to the gym leaders at least only having 1 type of pokemon

TheAliveTrain May 24th, 2009 2:17 AM

More than one type in their teams would be good because Morty has no choice, there are only 4 ghost types, and 3 of them are from the same family

Starom May 24th, 2009 2:19 AM

Good ideas ^^ It'd be nice to see the levels of the Gym Leader's a little higher too, as someone mentioned. That was the one problem with G/S/C - it got quite hard to level up after a point because most of the opposing trainers had pokemon < level 50. Even the Elite 4 were pretty weak.

D i v i n e X May 24th, 2009 2:23 AM

They won't introduce 4 pokemon at the second gym.
Here are my thoughts.

Falkner:
Pidgey/Hoothoot, Pidgeotto. Signature Pokemon:Delibird/Noctowl

Bugsy:
Ledyba, Pineco. Signature Pokemon: Yanmga

Whitney:
Teddiursa, Furret,
Signature Pokemon: Miltank

Morty:
Haunter, Misdreavus
Signature Pokemon: Gengar

Jasmine:
Magneton, Steelix
Signature Pokemon: Skarmory

Chuck:
Machoke, Hitmonlee, Hitmonchan
Signature Pokemon: Hitmontop

Pryce:
Cloyster, Dewgong, Delibird
Signature Pokemon: Piloswine

Claire:
Dragonair x 2, Seadra, Kingdra

E4

Koga
Ariados, Muk, Weezing, Arbok
Signature Pokemon: Crobat

New Ground Member
Piloswine, Steelix, Golem, Rhydon
Signature Pokemon: Donphan

Will
Starmie, Alakazam, Espeon, Xatu
Signature Pokemon: Slowking

Karin
Sneasel, Murkrow, Umbreon, Houndoom
Signature Pokemon: Tyranitar

Now, the final member could be
1. Lance
Aerodactyl, Gyarados, Charizard, Dragonair x2, Dragonite

2. Silver (Rival)
Whatever team they come up with

3. New NPC


Ryanniny May 24th, 2009 3:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 4669728)
sudowudo isn't fighting type though it would be best to stick to the gym leaders at least only having 1 type of pokemon

i agree, kinda.
but other gyms break trends - Jasmine having steel/electric/rock pokemon and Bryce having ground & ice etc.
Plus, Chuck having a sudowoodo would be a nice contrast, as it'd be strong against flying types used for the gym.

Pokedra May 24th, 2009 3:34 AM

I actually want them to stay roughly the same but increase their levels to make it harder. the rosters were fine, just a little weak which made the game too easy at times.

Pyrax May 24th, 2009 3:46 AM

Higher levels and different Pokémon.

Falkner
Hoothoot - 11
Zubat - 11
Pidgeotto - 13

Bugsy
Ledian - 16
Pineco - 17
Scyther - 18

Whitney
Clefairy - 24
Snubbull - 24
Miltank - 26

Morty
Misdreavus - 28
Gastly -30
Haunter - 30
Gengar - 32

Chuck
Primeape - 33
Hitmontop - 34
Poliwrath - 37

Jasmine
Magneton - 39
Scizor - 40
Steelix - 41

Pryce
Seel - 39
Dewgong - 43
Sneasel - 42
Piowine - 44

Claire
Dragonair - 45
Gyarados - 46
Seadra - 46
Kingdra - 48

Will
Wobuffet Lv.48
Alakazam Lv.48
Slowking Lv.50
Exeggutor Lv.52
Espeon Lv.54

Koga
Beedrill Lv.48
Crobat Lv.49
Muk Lv.50
Ariados Lv.53
Venomoth Lv.55

Bruno
Machamp Lv52
Heracross Lv.54
Primeape Lv.55
Hitmontop Lv.55
Poliwrath Lv.57

Karen
Murkrow Lv.57
Sneasel Lv.57
Houndoom Lv.58
Umbreon Lv.58
Gengar Lv.59

Lance
Aerodactyl Lv.59
Charizard Lv.59
Gyarados Lv.60
Kindra Lv.61
Dragonair Lv.61
Dragonite Lv.62

Kazukii May 24th, 2009 3:47 AM

I've got to agree with this.

TheAliveTrain May 24th, 2009 4:00 AM

Nintendo wouldn't change their signature Pokémon, as Xatu for Will

Shadow May 24th, 2009 4:27 AM

Delibird is too powerful for that early on in the game (never thought I'd have to call Delibird powerful...). Not to mention, that'd give Chikorita a 4x weakness to the first gym, something they've never done.

I'm assuming they'll keep the rosters similar, as they did with FireRed and LeafGreen. I would enjoy if they did something similar to Platinum, however. An area where you can fight them later in the game with a filled-out team of high level Pokémon.

Also, on this topic, I'm assuming each gym leader will need a new TM, like in FireRed and LeafGreen. I thought of this earlier with Falkner especially; Mud Slap is no longer a TM and there's no 'low level' TM I can think of for Flying type or one that would match Pidgeotto.

Melodyfree May 24th, 2009 5:00 AM

This is assuming that some 3rd/4th gens will be thrown into the Johto dex. This is unlikely, but how I'd like to see it.

Falkner
Hoothoot - 11
Gligar - 12
Pidgeotto - 13

Hey, Gligar is a Flying-type! Besides, unless Falkner does wicked hax the only Ground-type move the little guy learns is Sand-Attack. I would have given him Skarmory but that's a little too much hax for the first gym. Maybe in a rematch, Flippy.

TM: Aerial Ace

Bugsy
Ledian - 14
Yanma - 15
Scyther - 18

Needs moar Yanma.

TM: U-Turn or Silver Wind

Whitney
Skitty - 24
Furret - 24
Miltank - 26

Replacing Clefairy with Skitty because Skitty suits Whitney more, I think. Also, Furret is cute. :D

TM: Attract

Morty
Misdreavus - 29
Rotom -30
Shuppet - 30
Gengar - 33

God, I hate teams that rely on a single pokemon line. The Johto dex NEEDS more ghosts, and I think that Rotom and Shuppet would be fine additions.

TM: Shadow Ball

Chuck
Primeape - 33
Heracross - 34
Hitmontop - 35
Poliwrath - 38

WHY does Chuck have three crap pokemon when there's freaking Heracross in there? WHY?!

TM: Focus Punch

Jasmine
Magneton - 39
Mawile - 40
Ampharos - 40
Steelix - 43

Not my fault that there's hardly any Steel-types around. :/ Besides, it's not like there's a nearby lighthouse in need of the light given off by Amphy's tail lololol~

TM: Iron Tail

Pryce
Glalie - 40
Dewgong - 44
Sneasel - 43
Pilowine - 48

Seel is a wimp.

TM: Ice Beam

Claire
Dragonair - 50
Gyarados - 48
Altaria - 49
Kingdra - 52

The only reason I didn't give her Vibrava was to keep the blue theme going.

TM: Dragon Claw

Lady Gaga May 24th, 2009 5:09 AM

Here is my idea.

Falkner:
Hoothoot, Spearow, Signature Pokemon: Pidgeotto

Bugsy:
Pineco, Spinarak, Signature Pokemon: Syther

Whitney:
Teddiursa, Clefairy, Signature Pokemon: Miltank

Morty:
Haunter, Misdreavus, Signature Pokemon: Gengar

Jasmine:
Magneton, Steelix, Skarmory, Signature Pokemon: Ampharos

Chuck:
Machoke, Primape, Poliwrath, Signature Pokemon: Hitmotop

Pryce:
Cloyster, Piloswine, Dewgong, Signature Pokemon: Mamoswine

Claire:
Dragonair x 2, Seadra, Signature Pokemon: Kingdra

E4

Will
Xatu, Exxugetor, Espeon, Alakazam, Signature Pokemon: Slowking

Koga
Ariados, Muk, Weezing, Venomoth, Signature Pokemon: Crobat

Bruno
Onix, Hitmonlee, Hitmonchan, Machamp, Signature Pokemon: Heracross

Karin
Weaville, Honchcrow, Umbreon, Houndoom Signature Pokemon: Tyranitar

Lance
Aerodactyl, Charizard, Dragonite, Kingdra, Signature Pokemon: Gyrados

Swift! May 24th, 2009 5:36 AM

GYMS
Falkner

Pidgey, Hoothoot & Pidgeotto.

Bugsy
Spinarak, Ledian & Scyther.

Whitney
Teddiursa, Furret & Miltank.

Morty
Misdreavus, Haunter, Misdreavus & Gengar.

Chuck
Tyrogue, Primeape, Hitmontop & Poliwrath.

Jasmine
Magnemite, Forretress, Skarmory & Steelix.

Pryce
Swinub, Sneasel, Dewgong & Piloswine.

Clair
Dragonair, Gyarados, Dragonair & Kingdra.

Elite Four
Will
Xatu, Exeggutor, Xatu, Girafarig & Slowking.

Koga
Ariados, Weezing, Muk, Venomoth & Crobat.

Bruno
Hitmonlee, Hitmonchan, Hitmontop, Onix & Machamp.

Karen
Murkrow, Pupitar, Umbreon, Houndoom & Tyranitar.

Lance
Dragonair, Gyarados, Aerodactyl, Charizard, Kingdra & Dragonite.

TheAliveTrain May 24th, 2009 5:52 AM

I completly agree with Swift's choices.

Artemis May 24th, 2009 5:59 AM

Yeah, I doubt the rosters will change. THough, if anything were to be different then it would be the low levels they all had.

I do like .Swift's idea though, it really is a good one.

Blazers May 24th, 2009 6:05 AM

I just hope something is done about that damn milktank! =)
Hopefully they give out better TMs so i don't end up having to battle her 100 times.

Michii May 24th, 2009 6:15 AM

While it's possible, I doubt that there were be any changes in the Gym Leader/Elite Four's rosters. If I remember, FRLG had the same exact teams to be fought against, level and all. If we solely use inductive reasoning for this, then HGSS should have the same teams. However, given that the game was a breeze for many people in regards to battles against the Gym Leaders/Elite Four, I could see a potential bump up in strength and levels.

Artemis May 24th, 2009 6:18 AM

FRLG is a goos source to look back on, but you never know if they might come to conclude to change anything, just because they are using a new gaming system.

~*!*~Tatsujin Gosuto~*!*~ May 24th, 2009 7:43 AM

I agree with you, but I still can't get over the fact that Falkner has a level 9 Pidgeotto, what a cheater!


:t354:TG

Artemis May 24th, 2009 7:46 AM

IT doesn't really count as cheating if the Gyms have underleveled evolutions, as levels are just a factor in the game when a Pokémon has to evolve. It doesn't necessarily mean it has to be implemented for everyone. I mean like said before, in DPPt, we could have even caught a level 4, Staravia, Bibarel, and even a Luxio.

Charmageddon May 24th, 2009 9:16 AM

Nice ideas for the gyms, I’d do something similar. I’d definitely keep all the same signature Pokemon though (save for new evolutions), and also, I’d throw in a few Gen 3/4 pokemon too. One of the things that annoyed me about FR/LG was how it was too much of a straight remake, only allowing you to catch Kanto pokemon (bar the Sevii islands). We’ve got new pokemon, we may as well use them. I know some people don’t want any changes from the original, but I’d much prefer drastic changes to playing the same game again with updated graphics.

Falkner:
Spearow (lvl. 10)
Hoothoot (lvl. 10)
Pideotto (lvl. 12)

Maybe he should be a little stronger, but that team feels good. The levels needed upping, Spearow is stronger than Pidgey, and Hoothoot gives the team a Johto element.

Bugsy:
Ledyba (lvl. 13)
Spinarak (lvl. 13)
Beedrill (HG) or Butterfree (SS) (lvl. 14)
Scyther (lvl. 17)

I’ve always liked the idea of gym leaders having different pokemon depending on which version you’re playing, so I’ve done that here. Ledyba and Spinarak replace the useless cocoon pokemon, and Beedrill/Butterfree add a little extra to the team. Scyther is tough enough as he was in the originals, so I’ve only given him one extra level.

Whitney:
Clefairy (lvl. 18)
Glameow (lvl. 17)
Miltank (lvl. 21)

Whitney’s team was decent enough in the originals, but a little small. Clefairy’s the same, and I’ve just added one level onto Miltank, as she was a real bitca to take down. I’ve thrown in Glameow because it pads out the team and fits her theme of “cute” pokemon.

Morty:
Sableye (lvl. 22)
Haunter (lvl. 24)
Misdreavous (lvl. 26)
Gengar (lvl. 28)

Morty was always a bit of a shady character, so I’ve given him a dark-type in Sableye, who’s always interesting to battle, what with having no weaknesses and all. Misdreavous adds a Johto element and keeps the team from being too focused on the original Ghost trio from Kanto. I’ve added a few levels onto Gengar, and he’d have a better moveset too, as he was surprisingly easy to defeat in the originals.

Chuck:
Primeape (lvl. 31)
Machoke (lvl. 32)
Hitmontop (lvl. 29)
Poliwrath (lvl. 35)

Chuck in the originals was, frankly, a joke. The fifth gym leader needs to have much more than two pokemon. Hitmontop gives that all-important Johto element, and no fighting team in complete without a Mach-mon. The levels have also been upped significantly.

Jasmine:
Magneton (lvl. 36)
Skarmory (lvl. 34)
Lanturn (lvl. 37)
Steelix (lvl. 38)

Steelix was a good pokemon in the originals, but a little low-levelled, so I’ve upped them. However, her support pokemon were ridiculous (two Magnemite?), so I’ve evolved Magnemite and given her Skarmory to cover her Ground weakness, and Lanturn to cover fire. I know Lanturn’s not a steel-type, but it’s not uncommon for gym leaders to have one or two pokemon outside their speciality, and Olivine is a seaside town, so a fishy pokemon looks right on her team.

Pryce:
Dewgong (lv. 39)
Piloswine (lvl. 40)
Sneasel (lvl. 40)
Mamoswine (lvl. 42)

I’ve evolved his Piloswine, but gave him another and kept Dewgong, though the levels have been upped. Sneasel is a good pokemon that adds another typing to his team.

Clair:
Seadra (lvl. 41)
Dragonair (lvl. 41)
Gyrados (lvl. 42)
Dragonair (lvl. 41)
Kingdra (lvl. 45)

Clair was just about tough enough in the originals, but I wanted to get her levels a bit higher so I could drastically up the Elite Four’s levels. Three Dragonairs made her a little dull to battle, so I’ve taken one away and given her Seadra and Gyrados to make things more interesting.

I’d change the Elite Four more drastically. All of them should have full teams, as they are the four most powerful trainers in Kanto and Johto, it’s silly for them to have an empty slot in their party. Also, I’d give them more noticeable signature pokemon (because does anyone remember Wills or Kogas?), and up the levels significantly.

Will:
Xatu (lvl. 46)
Slowking (lvl. 42)
Gallade (lvl. 47)
Solrock (HG) or Lunatone (SS) (lvl. 45)
Jynx (lvl. 47)
Alakazam (lvl. 50)

Alakazam is THE psychic pokemon, I was shocked that neither him nor even Kadabra was in Will’s original team. He is now Will’s signature pokemon, and a whole 8 levels higher than his previous highest level member. I’ve added the Lunatone/Solrock for more version differences and a good typing, as well as Gallade to combat Dark-types. Slowbro is changed to Slowking, who has higher Special scores, and will be given a water-type move, which he lacked originally. Xatu and Jynx keep their places, but their levels are higher.

Koga:
Weezing (lvl. 46)
Ninjask (lvl. 45)
Venomoth (lvl. 48)
Nidoking (HG) or Nidoqueen (SS) (lvl. 48)
Crobat (lvl. 50)
Scizor (lvl. 52)

Koga’s team was difficult to decide on, and ended up quite different to the original. Venomoth and Crobat were kept, but Forrestress was booted in favour of Ninjask, who fits Koga’s ninja theme much better. Muk was replaced with Weezing, who gets immunity to Ground (making ½ the team immune to Ground), and the Nidos were added, adding a lot of versatility to the team (they can both learn moves of all types bar Grass). I had trouble deciding on a signature pokemon. Crobat sort of filled this role in the originals, but was too weak to be memorable. I toyed with the idea of Drapion, as he has a psychic immunity, but he was already a signature pokemon in the Sinnoh E4, so I went with Scizor instead, who fits the whole ninja theme well.

Bruno:
Hitmonlee (lvl. 48)
Steelix (lvl. 51)
Hitmonchan (lvl. 48)
Rhydon (lvl. 50)
Lucario (lvl. 52)
Machamp (lvl. 54)

Machamp is once again Bruno’s signature pokemon, and the Hitmons find their way back onto his team, though Hitmontop is excluded as he has already been on Chuck’s team. His trademark Onix has been upgraded into a Steelix, and Rhydon and Lucario have been added for extra type differentiation (and for being damn cool).

Karen:
Umbreon (lvl. 53)
Gengar (lvl. 53)
Honchkrow (lvl. 51)
Spiritomb (lvl. 53)
Weavile (lvl. 54)
Houndoom (lvl. 56)

This team hasn’t changed drastically, but gone is the not-dark-type Vileplume, and her Murkrow has evolved. Gengar, Umbreon and Houndoom stay as they are (though if I were making this game then the Pokedex would contain my own made-up evolutions, so Murkrow would have evolved into Vulkrow, and Houndoom into Cereburn). Spiritomb, also being Ghost-type, fits the theme, and Weavile is an excellent pokemon that adds another typing.

Champion Lance:
Charizard (lvl. 55)
Dragonite (lvl. 58)
Salamence (lvl. 58)
Aerodactyl (lvl. 55)
Kingdra (lvl. 56)
Dragonite (lvl. 60)

Lance loses one of his legendary Dragonites, but gets a Salamence to make up for it. Charizard and Aerodactyl also make return appearances, but Gyrados is replaced with Kingdra for resistances against pretty much everything. Also, it is the only Gen II Dragon-type, or even quasi-Dragon type.

So yeah, that’s pretty much it. What do you guys think?

Artemis May 24th, 2009 9:46 AM

For me, I'd keep the 3rd and 4th Gen Pokémon out until a rematch after the Nat. Dex is obtained.


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