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-   -   Rate my NB team please (https://www.pokecommunity.com/showthread.php?t=20639)

Prylace October 23rd, 2004 9:47 AM

Rate my NB team please
 
Ok I'm doing pretty well so far on NB.. with a big exception. Dragon Dancers own me every time >.< I can usually handle Tyranitar.. but Salamence and Gyarados almost always beat my whole team. Here's my team....

Crobat (jolly) @ Choice Band
EVs: 252 Attack 252 Speed
Aerial Ace
Shadow Ball
Sludge Bomb
HP Fighting

Breloom (jolly) @ Lum Berry
EVs: 252 Attack 252 Speed
Spore
Focus Punch
Substitute
HP Ghost

Blissey (calm) @ leftovers
~Serene Grace
EVs: 252 Defence 252 HP
Aromatherapy
Softboiled
Ice Beam
Counter

Skarmory (impish) @ leftovers
EVs: 252 Attack 252 Defence
Drill Peck
Roar
Protect
Spikes

Arcanine (timid) @ Salac Berry (meh, any suggestions on item?)
~Flash Fire
EVs: 252 Special Attack 252 Speed
Crunch
Extremespeed
Flamethrower
HP Grass (countless Swampert/Quagsire killed)

Starmie (timid) @ Choice Band
~ Natural Cure
EVs: 252 Special Attack 252 Speed
Psychic
Surf
Thunderbolt
Ice Beam



A Gyarados or Salamence with 1 stage of Dragon Dance outruns my Starmie and 1HKO's it. Then proceeds to mop up the rest of my party at their leisure.
And if they get a substitute on them as well, they can easily take out all 6 of my Pokemon with little resistance.

For the love of all things Pokemon, someone please help me out with defeating Dragon Dance. I don't know what needs replaceing where but I'm sure someone out there does ; ;

Spike Razzor October 23rd, 2004 10:45 AM

Well, I don't see how Salamence and Gyarados could destroy your team. You have a wall know as Skarmory, its HP and Def should be enough to Roar them away. IMO I would give it Whirlwind and have it attack with Air Cutter, Soundproof is out there. Also, Sp.Atking Blissey is a big no-no. With all the EV's reductions its going to do nothing and will only waste up space in its movepool. Go with Toss if you want a decent ammount of damage because something with Calm Mind like Kazam would sweep your team with ease....

Toothache October 23rd, 2004 10:49 AM

Choice Band on Starmie? Give it Leftovers or Petaya/Salac Berry.

Not a fan of Special Sweeping Arcanine personally, but it's unexpected

Ice Beam Blissey is more about freeze hax than actual damage, which is a bit poor IMO.

Frostweaver October 23rd, 2004 11:05 AM

All dragon dancer but Tyranitar can outrun everything else (besides Deoxys E) in one dragon dance, so it's only natural. However, one thing is that ALL dragon dancer are physical, so a physical tank is by far your best choice against one. The thing is that your Skarmory got no hp so that's why it falls quickly. Also, Skarmbliss is now old and easily defeatable (I keep whining about it, but then I can certainly defeat one if I use a OU team... UU team I'm still working on it). The introduction of rock slide through FRLG is what leads the strategy to a major downfall. Salamence learning rock slide is by far Skarmory's greatest threat.

Crobat- standard

Breloom- now I can see what you're trying to get with substitute, but however, in practice where the opponent can switch away the spored Pokemon and sleep clause will mess up your strategy. Change substitute to mach punch so you got another quick attacker to destroy reversal/flail. Also, a little trick to use is just to focus punch 1st turn without spore if the opponent is slower than you. They will switch to something with anti-sleep, allowing you to focus punch the living daylights out of it. Finish it off with mach punch next turn ;p A rather good strategy to use for the meantime unless the opponent got Gengar.

Blissey- a great moveset certainly. I'm sure you know that you can always get seismic toss instead of ice beam if you want (ice beam is more anti-puncher, while seismic toss is just better in general.)

Skarmory- protect is just USELESS here. THough you can leftover abuse, you don't want to give your opponent a chance to rest up as well, or even worst, a chance to dance up or calm up. Use HP Physical for another attack instead, preferably HP Ground. Recommand you to actually take speed and atk instead for EV, with a speed boosting nature. Now before you question why for this weird setup, listen first.

Skarmory should be sufficient to handle Gyarados, as Gyarado's standard attack are only HP Flying and earthquake. However, Gyarados seeing Skarmory will know that you're trying to roar it, and it'll probably unleash a taunt asap. First turn for Skarmory should be just drill peck immediatley to break the taunt (and a small dent in Gyarado's HP, but it should be in green still due to intimidate messing you up.) Use roar on the 2nd turn instead, where it's not as likely to taunt you again. As for Salamence, you're just messed due to some fire blasting ones. Those with rock slide also do neutral damage to you, which will probably mean that you survive at the cost of losing like 70% of your hp at least.

Arcanine- lol I have no idea why Swamperts/Quaggys aren't expecting hp grass, as all fire/water types use hp grass. CERTAINLY take intimidate. It is the difference of surviving a rock slide with 40 hp left or not. As for item, salac seems fine. It's either salac or petaya anyway.

Starmie- choice band? It doesn't boost sp.atk as its just giving you a free howl. Change that to leftovers.


The problem with salamence is that Salamence alone destroys ALL of your Pokemon but Starmie. Here's the analysis.

Crobat cannot OHKO Salamence in one round due to intimidate (neglecting the choice band bonus), and therefore can dragon dance one round, activate liechi, then rock slide you.

Breloom- don't even need to explain... HP Flying OHKO.

Blissey- you can't OHKO Salamence with one ice beam, which results in the Crobat scenario then.

Skarmory- discussed it a bit already... rock slide doing neutral damage will hurt you a LOT

Arcanine- dead in one earthquake

So you see, Salamence can solo sweep your entire team (after one or 2 dragon dance, Starmie gets OHKOed as well.) A chance of team member is certainly necessary to get out of the mess. The movesets are already the best they can do already. It's the team setup that's the problem.

Crobat: can be replaced to Aerodactyl. Does the same thing, but you do have a STAB rock slide to start off if you meet up with Salamence before it begins dancing (after a dance, Aero goes down by rock slide as well). However, doing this will result in your team having Gengar vulnerability (as you lose shadow ball then)

Breloom: in terms of usefulness, I don't like it. Very stiff and predictable moveset... though it's useful against anything that's slower than Breloom. If it does meet up with someone that's slower than breloom, it's almost gurantee that someone dies.

Skarmbliss: if you're willing to sacrifice a small tanking power in order to shoot down Gyarados and Salamence, take Regice or Milotic instead. Regice can handle both dragon dancer with tbolt and ice beam, but in return you get some nasty poor typed junk. Milotic can handle Salamence with extreme ease as long as Salamence got no more than 2 dance, but gets messed by Gyarados unless you got toxic (and even with toxic, Gyarados can sweep for quite awhile before toxic ends it.) Skarmory can always shift to Weezing, which IMHO is superior over Skarmory due to subpunch invulnerability and will o wisp/haze (and tbolt to severely hurt Gyarados, allowing Arcanine to finish it off with extremespeed next round.) Torment is very underrated on Weezing, who puts Gyarados/Salamence to a near complete stop if used correctly (and if they didn't get too much dances)

Arcanine- it's just fine.

Starmie- fine

The main problem with dragon dancer is that it's automatically gg if anyone got 3 dragon dances. You'll have to know when is it time to force a sacrifice by doing as much damage as you possibly can, and then let Arcanine come out to extremespeed it off for good. The better choice will be never give it a chance to even dragon dance, of course, or paralyze/will o wisp it before it can do anything.

Prylace October 23rd, 2004 4:20 PM

Thanks bunches Frostweaver, that helps a lot. I'm going to try replaceing Skarmory with Weezing for a while.

I'm not sure if I would want to change Skarmory's EVs though, I like how Impish Nature and 252 Defence EVs make a Rock Slide only do like 60 damage.. but I'll try the Speed EVs sometime just to see how it works out.


You mention "break the taunt" I thought if they use Taunt you have to use only attack moves until you switch out, even if you used an attack move the first turn Taunt was used. I'll check it out.

Substitute on Breloom is mostly for when I'm not sure what someone is going to do. Say I Spore on the first turn and they don't switch out and fall asleep.. I could Focus Punch on the 2nd turn, but they might switch out to something like Gengar.. if I use Substitute then it will be up and ready to take a hit for me so I can use Focus Punch or HP Ghost accordingly. (Or Spore again if Sleep Clause is out the window) Assuming they don't switch out again, but usually that doesn't happen. And if it does I still have my subby. I'll try Mach Punch anyway though just to see how it works out.

Well off I go to see The Grudge. Hope this is worth the $8.00

Edit: What EV spread would be best for Weezing on this team? I'm thinking 252 HP and 252 Defence but I'm not sure. And for a moveset I'm thinking
~Haze
~Will o Wisp
~Taunt
~Pain Split

With all these edits I hope I'm not late for the movies ; ;


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