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Reading through this thread makes me feel as though I missed out big time having not played Emerald; sounds like a great game.
However, I think the vast differences in terms of storyline between R/S and E lead me to believe that if remakes are to be made, they'll be solely remakes of R/S with the original Team Magma/Aqua storyline and with Steven as Champion (similar to how FireRed and LeafGreen didn't introduce any of Yellow's significant changes). A mixed storyline would definitely prove to be more interesting though. |
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The caves I doubt have any relation to Kyogre & Groudon although there's still the possibility but for me I still see it as a relevant hint due to the circumstances. |
The caves are proof that no RS remakes are in the making if anything. Theyd keep Kyogre/Groudon (or however you guys think those cave are any hint) out of BW2 if they were planning to make them stars anytime soon.
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Kyogre & Groudon aren't making an appearence in B2W2 IIRC. Also I've noticed that many of the sprites from Hoenn have been changed between DPPT & BW but if you look at them many have been changed to the original positioning in RSE.. just look at Swellow, Slaking, Altaria, Pelipper and more on Bulbapedia.
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I smell a 3DS remake brewing...that's some major foreshadowing there.
Here is a pic of the supposed cave exclusives in B2W2(one magma based/one water based), cut them out so as to not use the huge image. Took the pic from the CoroCoro scans posted on Serebii. http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/7210/rseforeshadow.png |
I doubt the caves will have Groudon and Kyogre in them, available for you to catch. We got Groudon and Kyogre rather recently in HGSS, and there are other legendaries with more urgent availability needs. The caves may very well be in reference to them, but that doesn't mean Groudon and Kyogre are in BW2, or that there can't be RSE remakes for that matter. And for all we know the caves might not have anything to do with RSE's legendaries; water/fire is a common theme, and if the caves have to mirror each other of course pools of magma would be used as a parallel to pools of water.
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Groudon and Kyogre wouldn't fit into Black & White's plot.. they have no relation and really, I doubt it's something Nintendo would do.
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Maybe they are event areas for a Kyogre and Groudon in-game event. idk.
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Well then I fail to see why they are so obviously hints to anything RS related? Let alone being a clue for upcoming remakes or whatever? People pointed to the damn colours of the "2" in the BW2 logos when they were revealed. |
I think that's more because of how much the remakes are looked forward to, along with the fact that Gen I already had it's remake. Who would have seriously guessed that they'd use those colors for an unrelated matter, aka B2 and W2?
Also, as of now, we don't know what the caves will be used for; we already got Groudon and Kyogre in HGSS recently though, as has been pointed out, and the Magma/Aqua(water) theme has nothing to do with BW, or Unova for that matter(at least not the '2 year ago' version). With that said, I think most of us would like to see the caves as having to do with hinting of the remakes, not that they necessarily mean it. The theme popping up like that seems too...direct to be just coincidence, although we could just be getting trolled again, like was thought of further up this page. |
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Even if Kyogre and Groudon are going to be in those caves, I wouldn't say remakes will be denied by their presence. We know that R/S remakes won't be necessary to get Hoenn legendaries into gen 5 because we can transfer them from older games.
The main reason for R/S remakes will be to render Hoenn into modern graphics. Gamefreak's people have already rendered most of Hoenn-ish environment in gen 5. And now they've rendered lava cave which is Hoenn's signature location. Those water/lava caves look exactly like they should look in remakes. |
A Lava cave isn't Hoenn's signature environment. They had volcanoes in Kanto, Sinnoh, and Johto as well. Now there is one in Unova. Hoenn doesn't stake claim to Magma/:ava and Hoenn itself has not been rendered with Gen 5 Graphics.
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Alright time for a proper rant from me that I've developed over the past years about this topic (lol.):
So everyone is like "RSE remakes are obvious since it happened 2 times before". Well I disagree. I am confident that Gamefreak realised doing this thing for a third time won't work nearly as good enough as it did for RBY/GSC. Gen III set new standards for the whole "third version" fiasco. It was when they figured they might as well create the initial versions with the third in the back of their minds. Meaning they intentionally told an incomplete story from 2 sides, just so they could combine them and complete them into the full story for the third game. You might (or not) already notice a problem this poses for remake potential. The remakes so far, only featured the initial versions, because the third did not add anything that was such a big deal they couldn't just include it in both versions without affecting anything. If they did this for RS remakes, it would be a mess. Meaning they would have to either remake all three games (which would just spread the sales into more titles), or have to change the main part of the plot in such drastic ways that they would not be actual remakes anymore, OR they could simply leave Rayquaza as a mysterious unexplained postcredits legend on both, which would be quite sad. The second thing to note is that compared to the previous remade generations, gen III pretty much set the last serious mechanics upgrades, and wouldn't play much differently. There is the special/physical split, but thats about it. Graphically also, it was quite more developed, and had very exotic atmospheres. It had a much more distinct visual feel. What I'm getting at here is that just adding 2 or 3 new fun places in some corner will not cut it this time. Nor will plain remakes be easily done without some adjusting of the plot. I'm not saying I don't want to see Hoenn again. Neither am I saying we won't see it again. But they would have to spice up their remake-business a level or two. If I was in charge, the most obvious solution where everybody wins, seems to be in abandoning the plain remake concept (when the games are copy paste down to the point of hidden items and every single trainer roster) and do REVISITS from now on instead. A new player, experiencing the old region but in newer times. It is nostalgia and new at the same time. Not to mention all the fanservice potential with meeting old characters, or their relatives now taking over their gym etc. Just imagine how that would sell compared to the same game with newer graphics, which would maybe get them half as much as the other remakes.. "A completely new adventure in good old Hoenn. Old faces, new faces, discover the changes and the remaining mysteries" For legendaries in particular it could for example explain more about the golems, how they relate to Regigigas. (Also, it's about time Jirachi got an actual ingame event place like the rest.) In short: plain RS remakes=lame same old milking A Hoenn sequel=potential to actually outsell previous remakes I thought this would be the way to go, before BW2 were even announced, but with those 2 games showing us for the first time that sequels are an option, it just makes it even more likely than before! |
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Honestly a Sequel to Hoenn would be awesome. That could easily become the 6th Generation game if they added new Pokemon to it with a new story. Even if it doesn't become a 6th Generation idea the concept of Sequels, especially for this game is an amazing one, the only question is how they would go about doing this. Unlike the other three Major teams, Aqua and Magma disbanded by themselves after seeing the error of their ways, not because some random 10 Year old thwarted us not once, but twice (Gens 1 and 2) or all major parties were Arrested/Mysteriously disappeared (Gens 4 and 5). Aqua and Magma just gave up after realizing their goals only to find out their goals were bad. So that would pretty much require a new bad guy team as well as a new focal legend cause (even though) Kyogre/Groudon/Rayquaza may or may not have been caught since it wasn't mandatory to the stories to catch them. |
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Yes, the awesome way to pull this off would be by making it an actual new generation. The other way I can see it, they could do some ancient formes thing on us, but that would be pushing it lol... and its not like people arent pissed off by formes in particular atm for some silly reason. With the VI gen way, it would obviously be a Johto/Sinnoh-like thing, with maybe adding a hundred pokes that mostly consist of hidden special stuff, with the common ones being Hoenn focused and introducing moar big deal legends. Or... they could make you start off on a new landmass located northwest of Hoenn, but let you visit it, ie what Johto was for Kanto. Anyhow. I want a giant orange nasty Ground/Bug alt evo for Trapinch then! ): < Villainous team you say. Get all the bored passionate Aqua/Magma grunts together, merge them into a single new environmental group, and call them Team Gaia. Ba dum tssss. Create appropriate legends focused on nature and the stage is set. Besides, its time for an important Grass type legendary Id say. :E But yes my point is, anything but plain old remakes involving Hoenn should be the smarter move. Ive been quite confident for a while that gen VI is gotta be a complimenting gen for Unova. But I figured Unova is much better rounded up and has a feel of completness on its own, not to mention BW2 essentially pulls a Johto trick without using new pokemon already... so who knows what they plan lol... |
Sequel for Remakes...imagine Ruby Rayquaza and a Sapphire Rayquaza formes xD Or maybe a stronger forme for Groudon and Kyogre to make them equal to Rayquaza stat wise.
Though the evil team thing is interesting because of what Xander said...unless they make a Team Sky who wants to capture Rayquaza...rule the skies and you rule the world... |
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Having two alternate caves in two versions, one water based and another magma based is another Hoenn-ish element put into gen 5, increasing possibility of R/S remakes in gen 5. |
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No. May I ask what other Hoenn-ish elements in BW2 you are talking about? And how does putting Hoenn-ish stuff in BW2 increase the possibility of RS remakes? I could argue it lowers it. |
As true as all of these points are, they could just be references to the earlier generations. There are probably references to the other generations as well. I haven't played any gen after 3, so I wouldn't know. Try to look for some!
Also, your speculation on the Elite 4 and the Bird-Type Pokemon seems a bit forced. |
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Wow. lol It's funny how people are just grabbing at things and clinging to them as if they're major hints. Ever think it's a coincidence or that Game Freak just wants to troll us? Or that it legitimately has nothing to do with RS remakes? Isn't trolling what they love to do anyway? I wouldn't be surprised if they were reading this thread right now and laughing at all of us.
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Other Hoenn-ish elements appearing only in gen 5 are desert, dive system, different music for Gym Leaders and Elite 4. We know that in B2/W2, there is tropical beach town and cave which is water or magma based depending on version. Who knows what more will be in B2/W2. All those things seem like being put into gen 5 to be reused in R/S remakes, maybe with small design changes. |
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The RS hints are not RS hints. They dont directly relate to RS. Regardless whether there will be RS remakes or not, areas being used for BW2 are used for BW2 so you can experience them in BW2. Quote:
Same for the tropical beach. If you make a tropical region, you will put a tropical beach somewhere. Its not like they would not have put a beach in Unova unless RS remakes were imminent. Choosing to add a beach and making RS remakes are 2 seperate 100% unrelated processes. Dive returning was simply a matter of time. They could have left it out and reintroduced it in generation XXVI if that was when they came up with an interesting use for it like the underwater ruins. Not sure what you mean with the music, theres always been different music wasnt there? <.< The magma and water caves are the only thing until now that might really be used with the intention to remind you of RS, but we cannot be sure of that as it might as well just foreshadow that Groudon/Kyogre will be catchable again or who knows what.... seriously, the caves will be in BW2. Meaning something will be in them. They will have a point. They wont be just empty caves standing there to make you want a remake. |
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It's true that putting Hoenn-ish elements in gen 5 doesn't 100% guarantee remakes, but it's promising that they brought those elements into generation in which R/S remakes are expected the most. Especially dive system, it has only a small role in post-game in B/W, I guess it will be used a bit more in B2/W2 and the most in R/S remakes. |
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Besides, there was items from Johto, and people from Johto, the same timeline and even a news report about the red Gyarados. Those were direct intentional hints. Quote:
It doesnt even 1% guarantee remakes. It has nothing to do with it. Its an element they put in BW. So they used a desert with no grass this time because of RS remakes. It is not making sense. The desert in DPt had a damn sandstorm, just as the one in Hoenn. Ive spent many hours in there chaining for shinies in the sandstorm, barely seeing anything. What was I chaining? Vibrava. What does it mean? NOTHING. Just like BW having a desert has ZERO relation to RS. Not related in any way whatsoever. They put a desert in BW because they can. No person who put the desert in there was thinking anything about RS at any time during production. |
There are just as many "hints" to support R/S remake as there were to support G/S remakes. FRLG had remixes of Violet City & Azalea town, DPPT has a remix of Lilycove City, DPPT had the Secret Potion an item exclusive to Johto, Black & White have the Shoal Salt & Shoal Shell, an item exclusive to Hoenn. What I'm saying is for those who are debunking these hints or references I'd say don't be too hasty, there were people who did similar things for the Gold & Silver remakes and they happened so it's still just as likely.
Oh and I wanted to add, I'm not classifying this as a hint but it's funny how many of the Hoenn Pokemon sprites have been remade to look like how they looked in RSE. (Left Ruby & Sapphire - Right Black & White) http://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/rusa/334.pnghttp://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen5/blackwhite/334.png http://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/rusa/277.pnghttp://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen5/blackwhite/277.png http://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/rusa/383.pnghttp://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen5/blackwhite/383.png http://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/rusa/365.pnghttp://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen5/blackwhite/365.png http://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen3/rusa/324.pnghttp://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen5/blackwhite/324.png |
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We still don't know about all references to Hoenn in B2/W2. It's very likely Shizui is from Hoenn, because he speaks using Kyushu dialect. Hoenn is based on Kyushu in Japan. Original B/W referred to Hoenn technically, B2/W2 might refer to Hoenn directly. Quote:
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Its not nearly as conclusive as the Secret Potion, which had a description saying its from Johto, along with actually being any use, but it is something. But still. There are not just as many hints. Look, I was saying GS remakes were bound to happen. Now I'm saying RS remakes wont happen. At least not in the same way as in the past (either sequels or a Johto like addition to Hoenn with both regions accessible), and definitely not in this generation with BW2 being the last beathing thing for the DS. Why did I think GS remakes would happen? Apart from the DIRECT hints like -A gym leader on visit: Jasmine -A key item, Secret Potion, with description its from Johto -An important event mentioned on TV: Red Gyarados -which also further points out the SAME time as GS But most of all... and if it wasnt for this I wouldnt be sure: -DPt had the coding "From Johto(Gold)/From Johto(Silver)" for Pokemon encounter data. That was essentially evidence, not just some hint. This was the strongest argument. No one was saying we will get GS remakes because they put lakes into Sinnoh or something. RS "hints" don't even compare to this as all we got is -Shoal Shell/Salt from daily item collector event with no possible use, or need for, as you get Shell Bell anyway. -A water/magma themed cave, which we don't know what its there for yet. Quote:
If there is a gen 6 first, then this has no meaning since they brought it back in gen 5 already........ Quote:
*facepalm* |
There may be less hints but that doesn't hinder the likelyhood of remakes, it's mainly for the money but anyway.. another little something that could contribute towards a remake would be this:
"Allows the player to catch wild Pokémon; works better on Pokémon encountered underwaterRSEBW" This is the description for the Dive Ball, in BW Dive was re-introduced for no known reason however no Pokémon are available underwater so unless there are in B2W2 then they must have gone back to it's original function for some reason, right? |
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Its effect is the same as it is in D/P/Pt/FR/LG. Any Pokemon caught while surfing or Fishing gets the bonus to catch rate. The 3.5x boost works while Fishing and Surfing in B/W. The description is almost a carbon copy of what D/P/Pt/HG/SS's. A somewhat different Poké Ball that works especially well on Pokémon that live in the sea. A somewhat different Poké Ball that works especially well on Pokémon that live underwater. Even while surfing on the surface, the Pokemon you battle live underwater. Same with Fishing. Quote:
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There's one more thing about E4 music in B/W. I guess you won't accept it as a hint but part from 1:18 to 1:28 is remixed part of R/S/E music for E4. It's similar like Canalave City music in D/P/Pt is remix of G/S/C ending music, if you listen carefully. Game Freak seems to like remixing tracks of generations they plan to remake. |
RG and RS also both had the first gym you visit unbattleable as well as a forest after the city with that gym.
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R/S the Gym skipped was owned by your father who refused to challenge you until you received 4 Badges before him and is the 5th Gym. That's more a coincidence than a relation since the two scenarios are different. |
^ I agree that's not really a hint...besides in BW you didn't skip past the first gym so there isn't really a pattern there...
My hopes for RS remakes are almost as low now as they were for GS remakes before they finally came out...we need more solid hints like Iris getting a Treeko... |
I'm looking forward for B2W2 to be released to see if there are more hints to R/S remakes.
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I ask again
Do you seriously think they will make another set of games for the DS? Or do you think they would start a new generation with remakes? |
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Look how they Rocket guy spoke in G/S/C/HG/SS. It didn't change when we found him in Unova and he's supposed to be from Unova. As for Anime reference, May had finished her tour in Johto and moved to Sinnoh cause that was the next area that was holding contests, not to mention the Wallace Cup was being held in Sinnoh. Going with "So and So Trainer will have So and So Pokemon" is also grasping at straws. Its not solid enough. We'd need an active Hoenn specific Character to appear in B2W2 outside of the extra features. That is a solid clue. |
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Well I know those things in anime aren't solid hints, they might even not happen, I just think it's possible that Hoenn references might be appearing in this anime season, to promote Hoenn, like they were promoting Johto in gen 4 seasons. Quote:
But if they would make remakes for 3DS, it doesn't mean it has to be new generation. To promote 3DS and keep gen 5 they can still use gen 5 engine, reprogrammed and improved for 3DS. And then gen 6 would use totally new engine, using full potential of 3DS. Something like they did with DS games - gen 4 uses only partially potential of DS, gen 5 uses it fully. |
Summary of this thread:
DER R FIRE POKERMAN IN BW2 HOEN REMAKES IS COMIN My opinion: Remakes are coming in Gen VI, there are no hints, go away. |
I'm pretty sure Hoenn will make a re-appearence in some game, whether that be a remake or not I don't know but what I do know is by the end of 2012 Unova games will be done, I highly doubt they will make a third game of B2W2 because that's just too much Unova. That leaves the whole of 2013 open for new games so unless they plan on bringing Generation VI early then I'd expect to see a return from Hoenn in 2013 and if not, well then tied in with the sixth generation some time. Oh and I'd assume they would be on 3DS considering it would have been two years since it's release in 2013.
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I think the question im asking myself now is do i really want a remake now. If one were to look at BW type of story( deeper story compare to other pokemon games IMO) and if the theme to BW2 is complementing than we can speculate that the Story will be equally on the same level if not higher. Now look at RS story line while pretty cool its not on the same level as BW. In order for that to happen they need to tweak the story line, such as adding more gym leader presence in the main story.
Now one of the arguments for a RS remake is that you cant easily get hoenn pokemon in BW. First off its true but not impossible i was actually able to complete my national pokedex in my copy of white, of course it did take me 400 Hours on white, 220 hours on my heart gold and around 20-30 on my Sapphire soul silver and platinum. But i think if it was released next gen it would make it easier if they plan to do a 4th gen remake. Look at this 2013 R/S remake 2013 N/A 2013 Gen 6 2014 gen 6 2014 Gen 6 2014 N/A 2015 N/A 2015 N/A 2015 3rd version 2016 3rd version 2016 3rd version 2016 rs remake 2017 4th gen remake ? 2017rs remake 2017 Gen 7 See if we save the rs remake to gen 6 then it will really be warrented. And if they are gonna keep the pattern would you rather a Gen 4 remake in 2017 or wait for it in gen 7 in 2020 or 2022. By the way if there is a gen 7 i will be middle aged man playing pokemon( and proud of it lol) |
If something happens twice (like remakes in the past 2 generations) its not a pattern.
Not to mention the first 2 were between RS and E, while HGSS were after DPPt, so its not even consistent with the 2 examples we have. And now that they introduced sequels, that might just blow remakes out the window for future games anyway. |
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Red/Blue/Green = Gameboy Gold/Silver/Crystal = Gameboy Color (classified as a different system than a Gameboy) Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald = Gameboy Advance = Fire Red/Leaf Green (Remakes skipped Gameboy Color) Diamond/Pearl/Platinum = Nintendo DS = Heart Gold/Soul Silver (remakes skiped Gameboy Advance) Generation 6 Game = 3DS = Ruby/Sapphire Remakes (possible but no other support, just going by the pattern presented.) So each remake skips to the System that is one after the one released after their making. Since Ruby/Sapphire was for the Gameboy Advance, they'd skip the Nintendo DS since that was made after the GBA and would be released for the 3DS. Its not an official one, just something unproven to be false or accurate as we'd need the R/S remakes to confirm or deny this possibility. |
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I guess I can handle it being in Gen VI which interestingly enough is 2 * 3 like how HgSs was 2*2...though Kanto breaks this but than again it was in GS itself... 2*1...
Will that mean DPPt in gen VIII? and BWB2W2 in gen X...I kind of hope not xD |
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It's not certain if they'll continue making those games that long... try to imagine gen 10 Pokemon. What they would be based on?
There is one interesting issue about remakes in gen 5. After B2/W2 release, there is one Pokemon left to be revealed - Genesect. Two other Pokemon last in their gens' Pokedexes - Deoxys and Arceus were revealed in the time to have something to do with remakes. Dexoys was originally catchable in FR/LG. Arceus was revealed before HG/SS and had event in those games. So why Game Freak created in gen 5 one Pokemon to be left after B2/W2? |
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(Meloetta is Number 299 in the Pokedex and we KNOW there are 300 in this one. Only 1 Pokemon comes after her and that's Genesect.) |
I would definetly buy it. Love and miss those games. Somehow no current version can match up to them.
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Well, if Genesect is going to be in official guide, it might be revealed officially.
They never revealed any Pokemon after last main game of each generation. If they saved Genesect to be revealed after B2/W2, it might mean B2/W2 won't be last main games in gen 5, meaning R/S remakes might be last games in gen 5. Interesting thing is that by the time of R/S 10th anniversary, everything of 5 gen seems going to be released ("third versions" and most likely all Pokemon, including Genesect). Could it mean they really want to release remakes on 10th anniversary? |
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I still think its gunna come out next year if we are getting it. |
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Why would they release RSE remakes on DS? That'd be a stupid move for Game Freak. Am I the only one who thinks logically here? Masuda said that he ran into problems with Black/White because of the DS game engine so there's no way he'd use Gen VI's engine to develop a remake in Gen V. Also, compatibility issues. Using Gen VI's engine, they wouldn't be able to communicate with BW and BW2 in the same way, and there's no way they'd do it on DS because of HeartGold and SoulSilver 2 years ago. Now, if you somehow need more reasons why this isn't happening until 2015 instead of the 10th anniversary... Quote:
RS remakes will come in 2015 two years after the Gen VI primary pair. |
I have had enough of this thread. Done. Don't start a new one.
Locked. |
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