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Chad - August 22nd, 2010 1:13 PM

Vegetarianism
 
A vegetarian person is someone who practices a plant-based diet that includes fruits, vegetables, seeds, etc.. and stays away from meat products. People often follow this 'practice' for health, religious, environmental, or cultural reasons.

If you are not one, do you support it and do you sometimes consider being one yourself?

And if you are a vegetarian, how does it feel? And what reasons made you become one?

Discuss.

Aether★ August 22nd, 2010 1:22 PM

Negative. I enjoy eating vegetarian food, but not for all the time. Most of the vegetarian dishes are not sated and those dishes, which are sated, are quite expensive to make, though. I have to eat inexpensively, because I'm not rich.

Rich Boy Rob August 22nd, 2010 1:38 PM

No. Humans are Omnivores. We evolved to eat meat, vegetation and fungus which allowed us to reach where we are now. Our herbivorous ancestors are extinct for a reason: We are better.

I do not feel bad about eating animals in any way. If you are a vegetarian/vegan, I ask you; Do you have cat or dog? If so do you feed them dog/cat food? If yes, then how come you have no problem feeding them meat? We are supposed to eat meat just as much as they are.

Besides, if I was a vegetarian I wouldn't survive. Not without bacon.

Charizard★ August 22nd, 2010 1:41 PM

Hmm...interesting topic.


I used to be a vegetarian for 13 years, because of my family and religion. It felt kind of normal to me. I didn't feel any more special just because I was one, although other people used to ask me how could someone be a vegetarian.

Chad - August 22nd, 2010 1:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich Boy Rob (Post 6095159)
No. Humans are Omnivores. We evolved to eat meat, vegetation and fungus which allowed us to reach where we are now. Our herbivorous ancestors are extinct for a reason: We are better.

I do not feel bad about eating animals in any way. If you are a vegetarian/vegan, I ask you; Do you have cat or dog? If so do you feed them dog/cat food? If yes, then how come you have no problem feeding them meat? We are supposed to eat meat just as much as they are.

Besides, if I was a vegetarian I wouldn't survive. Not without bacon.

True. And I'm not a vegetarian and I don't have a cat/dog, that is if you're addressing me. This is a random discussion about a certain 'practice', by the way, so feel free to post your opinions and views.

Timbjerr August 22nd, 2010 1:45 PM

Is it bad that I got a laugh out of the fact that I was eating some leftover chicken as I found this thread? XD

Obviously, I'm not a vegetarian, and I do tend to think negatively on people who try to 'convert' regular omnivorous people to vegetarianism. It's a noble effort to try and prevent animal suffering, but the majority of slaughterhouses nowadays do terminate my steaks humanely. :P

FreakyLocz14 August 22nd, 2010 1:57 PM

It is against human nature to be strictly vegetarian. It is also unhealthy. Vegetarians are commonly lacking in essential proteins and amino acids that come from meat.

poopnoodle August 22nd, 2010 2:25 PM

i was a vegan for four years then quit altogether somewhat recently because it's a failed statement and a pseudo-philosophy. the issue lies where animals are being treated on farms, and boycotting meat isn't addressing the cruelty these animals undergo, it's just wasting the meat that fuels our economy. there's nothing unethical, in my mind, about consuming meat (though i can see the discomfort), it's a part of nature "circle of life" etc, but to treat these animals like merely food instead of invaluable individuals, to imprison them in confined spaces in their own filth for their entire lives and separate them from their young, is wicked and inhumane. the morality of it all has a lot of grey areas and every once in awhile i'll argue with myself about it, but that's my general viewpoint.

Quote:

Originally Posted by FreakyLocz14 (Post 6095231)
It is against human nature to be strictly vegetarian. It is also unhealthy. Vegetarians are commonly lacking in essential proteins and amino acids that come from meat.

there are plenty of alternatives

Charizard★ August 22nd, 2010 3:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FreakyLocz14 (Post 6095231)
It is against human nature to be strictly vegetarian. It is also unhealthy. Vegetarians are commonly lacking in essential proteins and amino acids that come from meat.

How is it against human nature? Humans evolved to eat both, whatever they found. They can also live off of meat or plants. Mainly plants since they evolved to eat them first. Vegetarians are not lacking in essential proteins and such, as far as I know I was the strongest and healthiest when then my whole boxing and wrestling team. There are many other alternatives.

FreakyLocz14 August 22nd, 2010 3:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Charizard★ (Post 6095404)
How is it against human nature? Humans evolved to eat both, whatever they found. They can also live off of meat or plants. Mainly plants since they evolved to eat them first. Vegetarians are not lacking in essential proteins and such, as far as I know I was the strongest and healthiest when then my whole boxing and wrestling team. There are many other alternatives.

It is not human nature to be an herbivore, it is human nature to be an omnivore. An omnivore eats both meat and plants.

Zet August 22nd, 2010 3:20 PM

Vegetarians are horrible people, they're killing the planet faster than omnivores.

I don't care what a person is. If they choose to become a vegetarian, then that's fine by me seeing as how they have to eat more to get the proteins and crap that meat gives.

shot571 August 22nd, 2010 3:22 PM

Just to point out. I dont think they lack essential amino acids its just harder to get them. You need a bigger variety of food. As far as I can remember from my science lesson a few months back. And I dont mind eating meat....I just dont like killing the animals although I am mainly a meat eater so that may sound a bit strange.Obviously though since I'm muslim I get it halal so its done pretty humanely.

Zet August 22nd, 2010 4:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shot571 (Post 6095472)
Just to point out. I dont think they lack essential amino acids its just harder to get them. You need a bigger variety of food. As far as I can remember from my science lesson a few months back. And I dont mind eating meat....I just dont like killing the animals although I am mainly a meat eater so that may sound a bit strange.Obviously though since I'm muslim I get it halal so its done pretty humanely.

If it makes you feel better, their death is fast and painless.

Quote:

Originally Posted by overer (Post 6095551)
no just no, if you're a vegetablrian you could consider yourself dead to me. we are humans therefore i assume we are all supposed to be omnivores, we need essential proteins that come from meat. do you believe that you'll remembner to take your protien pills every day? or are youg oing to live off of peanuts maybe idk but im not interested, especially if they're unsalted. for a human to live, he needs meat AND lettuce, both of which omnivores not vegertarians eat. do you see my point? we eat meat and are not meant for just lettuce soley. sure who doesnt enjoy a good taco but guess what? on that taco is both lettuce and greasy fattening essential beef that is full of proein and tastes better than an unsalted nut or a horse pill that you may or may not forget to take one day. what of thaT? well you could die from malnutrition, that's what of that.

think twice before trying to save yur friendly neighborhood cow. you might just save your own life.

As mentioned before vegetarians have to eat a large amount of food to get the right amount of proteins and crap.

Charizard★ August 22nd, 2010 4:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FreakyLocz14 (Post 6095446)
It is not human nature to be an herbivore, it is human nature to be an omnivore. An omnivore eats both meat and plants.

Yes I know. But did you also know that they have the choice to eat meat or plants? Humans evolved in an environment where they were scavengers, therefore they ate meat whenever they came across it. But then they slowly became hunters, when that happened they ate meat. But some of the human species adapted by eating more plants then meat. My point is you can't say its human nature to eat meat. :/

revelp8 August 22nd, 2010 4:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by overer (Post 6095581)
lol imagine if all of the vegatarians were fatter than the meat eaetrs and all they were eating is green garbage xD

LOLirony

I went vegan for a few months just to lose some weight. guess what, simply by not eating meat and doing my normal routine, i lost 5 lbs within a months time. I'd imagine i would have lost a bit more if i did exercises as well \lazy\

Im surprised at some of the opinions of the members on vegans though, its not a lifestyle to condemn/to look down upon. its a choice most of the time, and a damn good healthy choice at that.

Rich Boy Rob August 22nd, 2010 4:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chad - (Post 6095179)
True. And I'm not a vegetarian and I don't have a cat/dog, that is if you're addressing me. This is a random discussion about a certain 'practice', by the way, so feel free to post your opinions and views.

I wasn't specifically addressing you, it was more a sort of... general accusation.

[EDIT]

Quote:

Originally Posted by revelp8 (Post 6095624)
LOLirony

I went vegan for a few months just to lose some weight. guess what, simply by not eating meat and doing my normal routine, i lost 5 lbs within a months time. I'd imagine i would have lost a bit more if i did exercises as well \lazy\

Im surprised at some of the opinions of the members on vegans though, its not a lifestyle to condemn/to look down upon. its a choice most of the time, and a damn good healthy choice at that.

Uh... hate to break it to you, but veganism is not really a "damn good healthy choice". Assuming you hadn't changed your dietary habits other than cutting out meat/dairy/eggs/anything else that comes from animals, then you were probably not getting enough Calcium, due to you not consuming any dairy (especially if you are still growing), Protein from not eating any meat (unless you ate a Lo-HOT of nuts) and probably some other things that my brain can't think of at 1:30 in the morning.

tl;dr

You need to eat quite a lot more to have a healthy diet if you are a vegan.
It'd be easier just to cut out fatty foods. Not that you don't need to eat fat anyway.
And if you don't mind possibly gaining weight, but getting fitter and healthier then just more/better exercise.

FreakyLocz14 August 22nd, 2010 7:08 PM

Rapid weight loss =/= Healthy

Anorexics, bulimics, and people who are infected with parasites also lose weight rather quickly. Would anyone say that they are healthy?

Livewire August 22nd, 2010 7:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shot571 (Post 6095472)
Just to point out. I dont think they lack essential amino acids its just harder to get them. You need a bigger variety of food. As far as I can remember from my science lesson a few months back. And I dont mind eating meat....I just dont like killing the animals although I am mainly a meat eater so that may sound a bit strange.Obviously though since I'm muslim I get it halal so its done pretty humanely.

You can get protein and the amino acids present in meat from other places, but, not in sufficient levels to meet the bodies demand. you can get protein from nuts, eggs, etc, but no where near the levels from beef, Pork, fish or poultry

Humans evolved as omnivores, eating meat and plants. Always have always will. If you want to go ahead and become vegetarian/Vegan go right ahead. ^_^ i will continue to enjoy steak and cheeseburgers.

revelp8 August 22nd, 2010 8:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich Boy Rob (Post 6095634)
Uh... hate to break it to you, but veganism is not really a "damn good healthy choice". Assuming you hadn't changed your dietary habits other than cutting out meat/dairy/eggs/anything else that comes from animals, then you were probably not getting enough Calcium, due to you not consuming any dairy (especially if you are still growing), Protein from not eating any meat (unless you ate a Lo-HOT of nuts) and probably some other things that my brain can't think of at 1:30 in the morning.

tl;dr

You need to eat quite a lot more to have a healthy diet if you are a vegan.
It'd be easier just to cut out fatty foods. Not that you don't need to eat fat anyway.
And if you don't mind possibly gaining weight, but getting fitter and healthier then just more/better exercise.

see, that's the thing, there are plenty of subsitutes that provide the same coverage of nutrients. Soy beans...and well beans in general provide more than enough proteins and amino acids...without the fat involved like in all meats. calcium is available through cereals and soy milk.

And eating more? not really. you eat just enough to stay satisfied. that's what most people don't even understand yet, proportions of food meals. have you heard your parents tell you to eat everything on your plate? did you know that one plateful, given the size of the plate is like 9in or whichever the general standard is, filled with food can actually feed two people.

the whole reason why most americans are fat isn't wholly because of the diets they eat, it is because they are ignorant of proportions on their plates. People eat to get stuffed and bloated, but don't realize that people need to eat just enough to stay alive and energetic after a meal. but that's beside the point \rant\

Quote:

Originally Posted by FreakyLocz14 (Post 6096047)
Rapid weight loss =/= Healthy

Anorexics, bulimics, and people who are infected with parasites also lose weight rather quickly. Would anyone say that they are healthy?

[out of context]fyi; those are eating disorders and usually tied in with today's culture, but i really don't know why your bringing that up in the first place. rapid weight loss usually means that something is WRONG within a person's body, and parasites aren't usually a good sign altogether

Quote:

Originally Posted by Live_Wire466 (Post 6096053)
You can get protein and the amino acids present in meat from other places, but, not in sufficient levels to meet the bodies demand. you can get protein from nuts, eggs, etc, but no where near the levels from beef, Pork, fish or poultry

Humans evolved as omnivores, eating meat and plants. Always have always will. If you want to go ahead and become vegetarian/Vegan go right ahead. ^_^ i will continue to enjoy steak and cheeseburgers.

Yes, you do get more proteins and such from meats but you also get the lovely bonus of fat as well, i do know that fat is beneficial towards a human body, but not in ridiculous amounts. and some meats, like sausages and [vomits] hot dogs are actually higher in fat than they are in proteins. *shudders*

you wouldn't enjoy a cheeseburger anymore if you actually knew what it was made of. then again, I live in california, and thereby, we have the best burgers in the west made at In n Out, so i can't complain XD

MushroomZOMBIE August 22nd, 2010 9:15 PM

I personally find the whole ethical argument for vegetarianism hypocritical. So it's ethical to consume non-animal products and nothing from animals? Just because non-animals don't have a face, that means that you can consume them without feeling guilty? Because they are ALSO living things, after all.

And it's not exactly healthy as many vegetarians say. You get a higher chance of lacking certain vitamins and minerals that the body needs. As some people above said, we're naturally omnivores. It's much too restrictive to a human to forgo meat.

Katie_Q August 22nd, 2010 9:22 PM

I went vegetarian for a while, but since at the moment I live with both my parents and grandparents who make seperate dishes, it was hard making a 3rd dish and I could see it was bothering everyone. plus i love chicken. I will go vegetarian again, but I'll probably cut chicken out slowly (it's really basically the only meat I like the taste off, besides bacon and ham). I'll maybe occasionally get meat from our local butcher, who thinks it's disgusting some ways animals are killed, but the truth it i really don't like meat, never have. Sure I said I liked bacon and ham, but even then half the time I don't even want it if offered. I don't find it that great. But some nice seasoned or crumbed chicken...mmmm... I won't go vegan though. I just don't think I'd be good at that. Plus I won't touch soy. Don't ask. And I love my eggs and dairy.

When i was a vegetarian, i did just fine. Well ok, I did faint one. the docter said it would have just been my body adjusting most likely. But still I had iron tablets a few times a week just incase that was the problem and amultivitimens (I'm a bad speller! xD ) everyday. well thats a lie, I used to forget to take them for days some times weeks at a time. But I was fine, other then the first week. I think you can be healthy as a vegetarian providing you research what type of foods can replace what meat gives you. I never really ate anymore then I used to. In fact my diet barely changed aside from dinner, and sometimes my family would have meat for lunch and I'd just have vegemite and lettuce sandwiches. It actually tasted good to me. And I enjoyed my vegetarian dishes a lot more. Oh sweet, sweet vegetarian lasagne.

But anyway, the main thing I think, is that no one should be discriminated over what they eat. And if some people don't think I'm a human for wanting to go vegetarian, well that's not my problem. Why do so many humans have to discriminate against each other over the stupidest things anyway? (diet, race, clothing, gender, whether somebody's going to college/uni or not) But whatever, we all live our lives differently and thats our choice right?

EDIT: sorry for my little rant

nSpire August 23rd, 2010 12:30 AM

Tofu is absolutely disgusting if you ask me, and I simply couldn't live without meat.

Kirozane August 23rd, 2010 12:55 AM

I agree with a lot of this, but at the same time I can't help but nitpick a lot of it too...

For instance, as true as it may be that vegetarianism is a "good choice" and MAYBE more people should turn to it, there are multiple reasons why a lot of people can't, maybe shouldn't, and probably won't. I know quite a few I am about to mention are true because they are reasons hindering myself and my family, especially.

The iron consumption issue. I know, there are supplements to fix it, but I doubt many people realize how important it is to keep an eye on what you consume along with those supplements as well. Iron in plants is not as readily absorbent as iron in meat. This is mostly because of all of the inhibitors that plants have on iron absorption. Fiber, for instance is an Iron inhibitor found more often in plants. And the oxalates in leafy greens also inhibits the process. And then there are the meat-free, more artificial products that bring up the same problem. Tea, coffee, chocolate... Basically anything with caffeine or iron inhibiting phosphates. I had to do extensive research on this due ot not only my anatomy class, but the fact that my mom, who was vegetarian at the time, had a hysterectomy and was diagnosed with iron-based anemia shortly thereafter. She then had to (and still has to) eat foods that are rich in Iron, but not iron inhibitors.... Which are, you guessed it, MEATS. Perhaps the fact that she did not consume enough vitamin C in accordance, which actually cancels out the inhibitors to an extent, may have had something to do with it. But a lot of people make the decision without enough research to keep them adequately nourished in the terms of essential vitamins and minerals. They are essentially blinded by the "Do it because its better for you" argument and don't really tend to research it until it is too late.... Until something goes wrong. But then, that's how a lot of people tend to be... especially Americans. (I can easily say this, for I am one.)

Which brings me to my next reason. Procrastination/laziness. A lot of people will look at labels extensively, combing them inside and out for any meats/animal products or nuances to such or calorie intake, but that tends to be as far as they go. As true as it is that Carbs, nucleic acids and proteins have less calories than lipids (the first three convert to 4 calories per gram I believe, while lipids convert into nine) It's really a win/lose. Though many people don't realize it and thus the recommended caloric intake is greatly exceeded by non-vegetarians, vegetarians sometimes don't meet the recommendation. It's usually too much, or not enough... From what I've seen, there aren't many people who can hit and stick to the healthy median without the research that those who don't meet it tend to forgo. Again, blinded by the fact that it is "better for you."

And also, omitting one of the four organic molecules is a BAD IDEA. They're all necessary to life for a reason... and really there is no way to fully omit them luckily. Each one serves at least one function that is vital to survival, and thus cannot be carried out as well when replaced by another. For instance. Those who consume more carbs than lipids tend to be more or less sprinters. Due to fewer calories from their intake, they don't have enough caloric energy to burn to really have exceptional endurance. Thus they are USUALLY more suited for sports that require bursts of energy, rather than a long extensive store. However, if those who consume enough lipids do not train their bodies to use as much of the store as possible at a time (AKA exercise) the body will store it for emergency needs... Thus weight gain. To have a PROPER energy store, there needs to be a balanced consumption of all stores, though in the end, lipids will make up most of your energy capacity, as they have a little over double the calories. After all, your body burns fat as a priority over everything else.

The last point I will bring up is more a personal preference than anything, but I've heard enough complaints about it to make it countable. FLAVOR. I understand some things have to be sacrificed, as most of the time, flavor comes from fats. Which is why meats tend to be naturally more flavorful than vegetables and such. I can't even begin to fathom how rich I'd be if I had a nickel for every time I heard that someone would go vegan if it didn't cost so much to make it taste better.

I guess the point of this incessantly long rant is that not enough people have extensively pointed out a few of the problems with it as I have tried to do... (I may have failed since it is 3 AM here.) They tend to stick to more of the positives and try to defend themselves when negatives are thrown out. But really, believe it or not, I DO believe that the decision is solely up to the person in question. I choose not to, due to all of the negatives I have seen... but I actually will not condemn someone for choosing that particular path. It's all a game of tolerance, which a lot of people tend to not know how to play due to exposure to opinions when younger.

Okay I think I'm done now.

インフェルノの津波 August 23rd, 2010 1:12 AM

I became a vegetarian because I don't like the taste of meat. And I hate the fact of where it comes from, especially eggs (UNBORN CHICKENS! YOU MONSTERS!)

That's pretty much it, I eat organic cause of pesticides. I needs meh brains.

As for how I get my vitamins, MorningStar and other companies contribute in that. I'm also a gluten-free person, just so you know.

Katie_Q August 23rd, 2010 1:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nSpire (Post 6096477)
Tofu is absolutely disgusting if you ask me, and I simply couldn't live without meat.

What is tofu exactly? despite once being a vegetarian I never tasted it. I had a packet of it but never actually tasted it.


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