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-   -   kingdra or dragonnite (https://www.pokecommunity.com/showthread.php?t=230112)

simba.vs.bruce August 23rd, 2010 8:20 AM

kingdra or dragonnite
 
i have a team that needs a dragon because it took me forevcer to beat the eighth badge in HG i had to use my gengar and at least 3 revives
my team is
feraligatr
infernape
gengar (strongest poke)
leafeon
two hm slaves
i was thinking either kingdra or dragonite
kingdra only has one weakness but doesn't learn all that many attacks while dragonite has four (i think) but learns some powerful attacks i like kingdra but i dont want to mess up my team if he isnt the right choice...also im trying to build a team that will beat my friends...please help

blaQk August 23rd, 2010 9:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by simba.vs.bruce (Post 6097151)
i have a team that needs a dragon because it took me forevcer to beat the eighth badge in HG i had to use my gengar and at least 3 revives
my team is
feraligatr
infernape
gengar (strongest poke)
leafeon
two hm slaves
i was thinking either kingdra or dragonite
kingdra only has one weakness but doesn't learn all that many attacks while dragonite has four (i think) but learns some powerful attacks i like kingdra but i dont want to mess up my team if he isnt the right choice...also im trying to build a team that will beat my friends...please help

Well, do you want bulk (Dragonite) or speed (Kingdra)?

I'd suggest Dragonite since you receive a Dratini in-game and you don't have to trade to evolve him. His movepool is also huge compared to Kingdra's. Also, Dragonite only has three weaknesses and access to a recovery move, Roost, which takes one of those weaknesses off and cuts the other in half.

simba.vs.bruce August 23rd, 2010 9:10 AM

im not sure which i need bulk or speed i have decent ones of both. and i thought he oonly had three. i dont mind trading thats how i got half my team :p which moves should i teach either? dragonite seems like a tank but compared to clairs kingdra it took me forever to kill that thing and only one hit to kill the rest of her team.

blaQk August 23rd, 2010 9:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by simba.vs.bruce (Post 6097237)
im not sure which i need bulk or speed i have decent ones of both. and i thought he oonly had three. i dont mind trading thats how i got half my team :p which moves should i teach either? dragonite seems like a tank but compared to clairs kingdra it took me forever to kill that thing and only one hit to kill the rest of her team.

Kingdra's base stats are: 75, 95, 95, 95, 95, 85
Dragonite's base stats are: 91, 134, 95, 100, 100, 80

Kingdra lacks the HP and defenses required to be bulky. Kingdra also lacks a recovery move other than Rest.

Here are some movesets for Kingdra and Dragonite respectively: http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/kingdra, http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/dragonite

simba.vs.bruce August 23rd, 2010 10:16 AM

so it sounds like i should go for a dragonite?
how could i get a bagon in hg if there is a way?

the only reason im scared to pick dragonite is that it has 4x weakness to ice attacks while kindra is only weak to dragon

blaQk August 23rd, 2010 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by simba.vs.bruce (Post 6097345)
so it sounds like i should go for a dragonite?
how could i get a bagon in hg if there is a way?

the only reason im scared to pick dragonite is that it has 4x weakness to ice attacks while kindra is only weak to dragon

Bagon can be caught in the Safari Zone - Swamp with all blocks leveled up.

If his weakness to Ice scares you, then you shouldn't choose him. Because you obviously don't understand how to compensate for that.

Edit: And no, I didn't mean go for Dragonite. I was just pointing out that each has it's on niche.

simba.vs.bruce August 23rd, 2010 10:30 AM

how do i set those blocks up?

and im not new to pokemon just have always had trouble setting up great movesets to make my pokemon fully use their moves
thanks for your help blaQk you have been really helpful

blaQk August 23rd, 2010 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by simba.vs.bruce (Post 6097367)
how do i set those blocks up?

and im not new to pokemon just have always had trouble setting up great movesets to make my pokemon fully use their moves
thanks for your help blaQk you have been really helpful

I have no idea how the new Safari Zone works seeing as I've never used it. You'll have to consult Serebii about that.

Mence has a four times weakness to Ice as well, lol.

simba.vs.bruce August 23rd, 2010 10:43 AM

yeah im just gonna go with kingdra
i like the double dancer move set i found
rain dance
waterfall
dragon dance
draco meteor/dragon pulse

blaQk August 23rd, 2010 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by simba.vs.bruce (Post 6097387)
yeah im just gonna go with kingdra
i like the double dancer move set i found
rain dance
waterfall
dragon dance
draco meteor/dragon pulse

Need to replace the last move with Outrage.

simba.vs.bruce August 23rd, 2010 10:52 AM

i didn't think kingdra could learn outrage?
if thats the case how do i get it i wanna put that on him

blaQk August 23rd, 2010 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by simba.vs.bruce (Post 6097403)
i didn't think kingdra could learn outrage?
if thats the case how do i get it i wanna put that on him

. . .

There is a reason it's on the provided movesets . . .

It's a tutor move.

jjnerdful August 23rd, 2010 12:18 PM

So let me get this straight. You had trouble with a dragon-type gym, so your solution is to get a pokemon with weakness to dragon? Dragon types are weak against their own type.

You should consider an ice pokemon. You'll be in major trouble with Lance if that kingdra gets knocked out.

Corruptodile August 23rd, 2010 1:09 PM

lolwut, Dragonite or Kingdra to kill dragons? Sure, just make sure you take an outrage to the face. Starmie, or even Lapras makes for better Dragon counters, and help immensely against Lance, (Starmie owns Gyarados with Thunderbolt, Aerodactyl and Charizard with Surf and don't get me started on some Ice Beam/Blizzard on Dragonite).

regardless, if you really want a Dragon type, Dragonite would be better for this team, with it's better bulk and wider movepool.

DraconicDino August 23rd, 2010 1:27 PM

I agree with Corruptodile; if you want to use a dragon, you should probably go with Dragonite. It'll be more work to get one, sure, but it'll be more worth it.
Oh, and Bagon evolves into Shelgon which evolves into Salamence. I think you meant to ask where to get Dratini. You can get a Dratini in the Dragon's Den in Blackthorn if you answer all the questions to the quiz right.

@jjnerdful: If Dragon is weak to itself, then using a Dragon-type could still be effective. Sure, Ice-types work better, but if he really wants to have a Dragon-type, why not?

dragoniteuser August 23rd, 2010 1:34 PM

I think my username speaks for itself! get yourself a dragonite, and soon you'll forget about any other pokemon in your team, including Gengar! This I guarantee!

Perriechu August 23rd, 2010 1:36 PM

If they want a Dragon let them get a Dragon... Like BlaQk said
Bulk Dragonite, or speed Kingdra, for Lance you'll want Speed Kingdra can set up against Gyarados, with DD then just Sweep with Outrage...also Outrage is learnt at the battle Frontier which you can't access yet so go with Dragon pulse

@Draconicdino, he asked where to catch Bagon not Dratini maybe for future uses..

EDIT : You might wanna go with a different approach to the Moveset

Icebeam/Blizzard
Rain dance
Dragon Pulse
Waterfall

DD was taken out because of the lack of Physical Dragon moves

Noctunoir August 23rd, 2010 1:46 PM

If it's an ingame team, you obviously need Fly, so Dragonite is the best choice.

Edit : And I'm not very found on HM-slaves. =/

Okami Chi August 23rd, 2010 1:49 PM

Dragonite is a beast sweep with extreme speed. Dragonite all the way.

Corruptodile August 23rd, 2010 2:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DraconicDino (Post 6097791)
I agree with Corruptodile; if you want to use a dragon, you should probably go with Dragonite. It'll be more work to get one, sure, but it'll be more worth it.
Oh, and Bagon evolves into Shelgon which evolves into Salamence. I think you meant to ask where to get Dratini. You can get a Dratini in the Dragon's Den in Blackthorn if you answer all the questions to the quiz right.

@jjnerdful: If Dragon is weak to itself, then using a Dragon-type could still be effective. Sure, Ice-types work better, but if he really wants to have a Dragon-type, why not?

Not necessarily true, you get a Dratini regardless, but get the questions right and you get Extreme Speed. There is the useless trivia of the day :P

DraconicDino August 23rd, 2010 2:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dragonomega (Post 6097823)
@Draconicdino, he asked where to catch Bagon not Dratini maybe for future uses..

I know that he asked where to catch Bagon, but since he was trying to decide between Dragonite and Kingdra, I get the feeling that he slipped up and said Bagon instead of Dratini.

@Corruptodile: LOL. XD

blaQk August 23rd, 2010 8:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jjnerdful (Post 6097577)
So let me get this straight. You had trouble with a dragon-type gym, so your solution is to get a pokemon with weakness to dragon? Dragon types are weak against their own type.

You should consider an ice pokemon. You'll be in major trouble with Lance if that kingdra gets knocked out.

He said nothing about wanting a Dragon-type because he had trouble with them.

Why would he consider an Ice-type if he wants a Dragon-type?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Corruptodile (Post 6097727)
lolwut, Dragonite or Kingdra to kill dragons? Sure, just make sure you take an outrage to the face. Starmie, or even Lapras makes for better Dragon counters, and help immensely against Lance, (Starmie owns Gyarados with Thunderbolt, Aerodactyl and Charizard with Surf and don't get me started on some Ice Beam/Blizzard on Dragonite).

regardless, if you really want a Dragon type, Dragonite would be better for this team, with it's better bulk and wider movepool.

Again, why would he need an Ice-type if he wants a Dragon-type?

Starmie and Lapras are horrid checks. Lapras more-so than Starmie. Flygon is actually one of the best Dragon-type counters in the game. Flygon would also do a much better job at sweeping Lance since almost all of Lance's team is SPD heavy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DraconicDino (Post 6097791)
. . . Sure, Ice-types work better . . .

No.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dragoniteuser (Post 6097818)
I think my username speaks for itself! get yourself a dragonite, and soon you'll forget about any other pokemon in your team, including Gengar! This I guarantee!

No.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dragonomega (Post 6097823)
If they want a Dragon let them get a Dragon... Like BlaQk said
Bulk Dragonite, or speed Kingdra, for Lance you'll want Speed Kingdra can set up against Gyarados, with DD then just Sweep with Outrage...also Outrage is learnt at the battle Frontier which you can't access yet so go with Dragon pulse

Ew, god no.

Why would you run Dragon Dance on a special set?

Why would you teach it Dragon Pulse? Tutor Draco Meteor onto it in Blackthorn.

Dragonite would be better in your theorymon scenario because after one Dragon Dance, it'll be faster and harder hitting than Kingdra.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dragonomega (Post 6097823)
EDIT : You might wanna go with a different approach to the Moveset

Icebeam/Blizzard
Rain dance
Dragon Pulse
Waterfall

DD was taken out because of the lack of Physical Dragon moves

No.

Dragon Dance was on there because that was a physical Kingdra, not a bad special one. Plus that set is bad even for a special one.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noctunoir (Post 6097845)
If it's an ingame team, you obviously need Fly, so Dragonite is the best choice.

Edit : And I'm not very found on HM-slaves. =/

If it's an in-game team, he obviously doesn't need to be bad an teach Dragonite fly when he can easily use something else that he doesn't battle with.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Okami Chi (Post 6097852)
Dragonite is a beast sweep with extreme speed. Dragonite all the way.

Extreme Speed is not for sweeping.

Spinosaurus August 23rd, 2010 10:18 PM

Both are great, imo, so I really can't say. But I would actually go with Kingdra for some reasons. I prefer both Flygon and Salamence anyways, but it's your team, so it's your choice.

Corruptodile August 24th, 2010 4:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blaQk (Post 6098886)
Again, why would he need an Ice-type if he wants a Dragon-type?

Starmie and Lapras are horrid checks. Lapras more-so than Starmie. Flygon is actually one of the best Dragon-type counters in the game. Flygon would also do a much better job at sweeping Lance since almost all of Lance's team is SPD heavy.

Read the last part of my comment, I suggested Dragonite over Kingdra.

Flygon won't be sweeping Lance any time soon, since Gyarados is going to Intimidate it, reducing it's effectiveness from the start. Starmie won't have that problem. Flygons most powerful attack against Lance's Dragonites is Draco Meteor, and even then Flygon has to switch out, or Dragon Claw, which is rather pitiful in terms of damage.. Starmie can spam Ice Beams, or Blizzard, as well as Surf/Hydro Pump and Thunder/Thunderbolt for risk takers, and recover off the damage, or use Gravity to make sure the powerful yet inaccurate moves hit everytime. A final note is that Modest Starmie is faster than Jolly Flygon, meaning that Starmie is more powerful and faster, and hits Lance harder. Lapras is pretty fail though, I don't know why I suggested her. xD

EDIT: So this post has something to do with the OP, it's your team however, so choose which ever Dragon you want, even if I say Dragonite :)

jjnerdful August 24th, 2010 10:44 AM

"You'll be in major trouble with Lance if that kingdra gets knocked out" should tell you that the OP should consider an ice pokemon (which I should've clarified as something that can use ice attacks effectively) in addition to kingdra.

None of OP's other pokemon have an overwhelming advantage against dragons. Given that all of Lance's pokemon except 1 carry a dragon move, kingdra could be in major trouble, especially since it's not exactly going to outrace everything and knock them all out in one hit. A properly trained starmie with surf/icebeam/thunderbolt could easily sweep through Lance.

Re-read the original post. "i have a team that needs a dragon because it took me forevcer to beat the eighth badge in HG i had to use my gengar and at least 3 revives."


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