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-   -   The Dragon's Den V.4 (https://www.pokecommunity.com/showthread.php?t=231793)

dragoniteuser January 31st, 2011 7:06 AM

I don't have "complete and total knowledge of a mythical beast", nor have i ever said anything that related, but when it comes to dragons, i know A LOT, definetly more than you!
Again, this disscussion is not pokemon related so...

Xilfer January 31st, 2011 8:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dragoniteuser (Post 6424310)
Ok, here's a question for you:
A question that I think even all of you together won't be able to answer completly accurate,
What makes dragon a dragon?

(A real one, not pokemon...)

I dunno, Reptilliasm?

Quote:

Originally Posted by dragoniteuser (Post 6426455)
No, dragons are not lizards, but they are reptiles. They are ALWAYS reptiles, and you'll find a lot of pictures showing fish-like, mammal-like, etc. dragon pictures. Those ARE NOT dragons, and they never will be, no matter what the artist says!
Long necks and horns are optional...

I've been meaning to tell you this but i keep forgeting.
look at the quote above, is speaks only in metaphores, that's not right. You speak in metaphors all the time like "They Are!" and "They Always!" it speaks as if you know everything for sure, when most of the above quote is based on OPINION not absolute fact.
Also, i feel you're becoming kinda hostile.

Quote:

Originally Posted by angel (Post 6427090)
The picture was adorable.

I've never thought of Gyrados as a dragon. He has the appearence of more of a sea beast then a dragon. Gryados is alomst like a huge electric eel, without the electricity.

Hm, that's what i think, Gyrados shouldn't be a dragon, although 50% of me says it should, i dunno, never really thought about it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dragoniteuser (Post 6428343)
I don't have "complete and total knowledge of a mythical beast", nor have i ever said anything that related, but when it comes to dragons, i know A LOT, definetly more than you!
Again, this disscussion is not pokemon related so...

See, this is what i meant by hostile and metaphors, stop acting like you know everything!

tkallab January 31st, 2011 9:16 AM

Okay, I think everyone should relax for a bit...

There's one question I'd like to ask you, draggy.
How many of the things you know about dragons are based on the assupmtion that they exist?

I got myself a nice definition of 'dragon' here:
A mythical monster traditionally represented as a gigantic reptile having a lion's claws, the tail of a serpent, wings, and a scaly skin.




Offtopic: By the way, Xilfer, a metaphor is something different XD

Shadow236 January 31st, 2011 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xilfer123 (Post 6419572)
We have already disputed this, Altaria is a BIRD we all agree! and we're not gonna change our minds, it may be handy early on, but it is a bird, not all Dragon types are registered here because we don't CONSIDER them to be dragons, that's what we're disputing right now, wether Kingdra is a dragon or not.

You know, when I ran the older versions of Dragon's Den we put Dragon pokemon on the list if their types were DRAGON. It's inevitable and just because of how it looks doesn't mean it's not a Dragon. Altaria is a dual type between Dragon and Flying. You can't just decide it's not a Dragon and take it off the list, that BS. No matter what you think Altaria is a Dragon. It's kind of like saying the Earth doesn't revolve around the Sun because, I just think it doesn't. But guess what IT DOES.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dragoniteuser (Post 6428343)
I don't have "complete and total knowledge of a mythical beast", nor have i ever said anything that related, but when it comes to dragons, i know A LOT, definetly more than you!
Again, this disscussion is not pokemon related so...

How do you know that you know more than him?

tkallab January 31st, 2011 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadow236 (Post 6428596)
You know, when I ran the older versions of Dragon's Den we put Dragon pokemon on the list if their types were DRAGON. It's inevitable and just because of how it looks doesn't mean it's not a Dragon. Altaria is a dual type between Dragon and Flying. You can't just decide it's not a Dragon and take it off the list, that BS. No matter what you think Altaria is a Dragon. It's kind of like saying the Earth doesn't revolve around the Sun because, I just think it doesn't. But guess what IT DOES.

A long time ago, the Den voted wether Altaria was a bird or not. I looked for all arguments for both sides and put them in a list. I think I already posted it earlier, but here is the link again.
If this list makes you agree, then I guess everything´s fine. If you don´t, you can request a revote.
I don´t know much about the old Den, but it´s now a club for Dragons, not just Dragon-typed Pokémon. We don´t judge on looks, but on wether a Pokémon is a Dragon or not. And we spend a lot of time and though into debating about that.

With that being said, darn, it feels like everyone´s in some kind of fight.

dragoniteuser January 31st, 2011 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tkallab (Post 6428549)
Okay, I think everyone should relax for a bit...

Quote:

Originally Posted by tkallab (Post 6428549)

There's one question I'd like to ask you, draggy.
1)How many of the things you know about dragons are based on the assupmtion that they exist?

2)I got myself a nice definition of 'dragon' here:
A 3)mythical monstertraditionally represented as a 4)gigantic reptile 5)having a lion's claws, 6)the tail of a serpent, 7)wings, and a 8)scaly skin.




Offtopic: By the way, Xilfer, a metaphor is something different XD

1) Hmm... probably a great deal, but then again, that very assumption is based on my knowledge about dragons, evolution, dinosaurs, etc., etc.

2) Sorry but this is a very bad definition, I'll tell you why:
3) Mythical... sure, but monster..., I wouldn't go that far, cause word monster defines absolutely nothing. There are so many objects that are defined as monster, so that really doesn't help you decide what something is by just calling it a monster. That's like trying to explain someone a horse, and just calling it an animal...
4) No, not all dragons are gigantic, sure, some are big, maybe even gigantic, but definetly not all of them.
5) Wait, "lion's claws"? And where's a difference between lion's and reptile's, or bird's claws? A claw is a claw.
But true, all dragons have claws, as all reptiles have claws.
6) Again, "the tail of a serpent"... Really it looks to me like the person who wrote that did his best to make dragons seem like a fusion of other animal's parts.
A tail is a tail, and all reptiles have tails.
7) I think I said this earlyer. Not all dragons have wings, nor did all of them fly. There are dragons that lived in caves, underground burrows, in sea, etc. that didn't have wings. They lost them by evolving, as they didn't need it.
8) Again "scaly skin". O.o If it's a reptile, it'll have scaly scin, what else kind of skin should it have?

Silhouette January 31st, 2011 2:28 PM

Terribly sorry for the inactivity, all. My computer died, so I'm not sure when I'll next be on. It shouldn't be too long since I need a computer for school anyway.

It seems I've left at a bad time...

Shadow236 January 31st, 2011 7:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tkallab (Post 6428613)
A long time ago, the Den voted wether Altaria was a bird or not. I looked for all arguments for both sides and put them in a list. I think I already posted it earlier, but here is the link again.
If this list makes you agree, then I guess everything´s fine. If you don´t, you can request a revote.
I don´t know much about the old Den, but it´s now a club for Dragons, not just Dragon-typed Pokémon. We don´t judge on looks, but on wether a Pokémon is a Dragon or not. And we spend a lot of time and though into debating about that.

Your arguement is invalid though because Altaria is Dragon type just like Dragonite and Salamence and Garchomp. Altaria's Dragon type and dragon moves make it a dragon. You said you don't judge on looks so it shouldn't matter that Altaria has bird like looks. The way I see it, you're basically taking a pokemon that is inevitably Dragon type(whether you like it or not) and deciding it's not.

Regeneration February 1st, 2011 1:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadow236 (Post 6429593)
Your arguement is invalid though because Altaria is Dragon type just like Dragonite and Salamence and Garchomp. Altaria's Dragon type and dragon moves make it a dragon. You said you don't judge on looks so it shouldn't matter that Altaria has bird like looks. The way I see it, you're basically taking a pokemon that is inevitably Dragon type(whether you like it or not) and deciding it's not.

I strongly agree with what he has said. Altaria is a dragon, and physical appearances don't change that fact.

Let me ask you all those who oppose to Altaria being a dragon, why is Altaria in the same egg group as Kingdra, Dratini, etc. who are considered dragons? Aren't they dragons as well? Let me remind you, if they can interbreed, they are supposed to belong to the same species, biologically speaking. Isn't more than an enough proof that Altaria is a dragon regardless of its physical appearances?

dragoniteuser February 1st, 2011 6:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadow236 (Post 6429593)
Your arguement is invalid though because Altaria is Dragon type just like Dragonite and Salamence and Garchomp. Altaria's Dragon type and dragon moves make it a dragon. You said you don't judge on looks so it shouldn't matter that Altaria has bird like looks. The way I see it, you're basically taking a pokemon that is inevitably Dragon type(whether you like it or not) and deciding it's not.

Very hipocritical of you...
If I'm not mistaken, and I'm not, Tyranitar, Gyarados, Charizard and Aerodactyl were in all previous Dens. They're no dragon typed, yet they were in the club. If a Pokemon that isn't Dragon typed can be in the den, why wouldn't a pokemon that isn't dragon typed be discluded if it obviously isn't a dragon...
http://b.domaindlx.com/cg103006/sky_wondermails/images/334.jpg

If this is a Dragon to you, you should get your eyes checked.

tkallab February 1st, 2011 7:10 AM

Being Dragon-typed is a heavy-weighing argument on decideing wether a Pokémon is a Dragon or not, but it's never final. The very moment you add a Pokémon into the group that isn't Dragon-typed, the club isn't for Dragon-types, but for Dragons. Logically, this means Dragon-typed Pokémon who we believe aren't Dragons can be removed through a voting.

Also, the egg groups don't mean much either. Farfetch'd can breed with Dewgong... And Ekans would be a Dragon too.

Silhouette February 1st, 2011 7:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silhouette (Post 6428949)
Terribly sorry for the inactivity, all. My computer died, so I'm not sure when I'll next be on. It shouldn't be too long since I need a computer for school anyway.

It seems I've left at a bad time...

Well, that was quick. I'm back.
Quote:

Originally Posted by dragoniteuser (Post 6430258)


Very hipocritical of you...
If I'm not mistaken, and I'm not, Tyranitar, Gyarados, Charizard and Aerodactyl were in all previous Dens. They're no dragon typed, yet they were in the club. If a Pokemon that isn't Dragon typed can be in the den, why wouldn't a pokemon that isn't dragon typed be discluded if it obviously isn't a dragon...
http://b.domaindlx.com/cg103006/sky_wondermails/images/334.jpg

If this is a Dragon to you, you should get your eyes checked.

Lolwut? How was Shadow's post hypocritical?
Quote:

Originally Posted by tkallab (Post 6430296)
Being Dragon-typed is a heavy-weighing argument on decideing wether a Pokémon is a Dragon or not, but it's never final. The very moment you add a Pokémon into the group that isn't Dragon-typed, the club isn't for Dragon-types, but for Dragons. Logically, this means Dragon-typed Pokémon who we believe aren't Dragons can be removed through a voting.

Also, the egg groups don't mean much either. Farfetch'd can breed with Dewgong... And Ekans would be a Dragon too.

Farfetch'd breeding with Dewgong is news to me. But in all seriousness, I agree. Here's emphasizing the whole Ekans deal.

It's so hard not to take a side in this argument. :O

Shadow236 February 2nd, 2011 12:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dragoniteuser (Post 6430258)

Very hipocritical of you...
If I'm not mistaken, and I'm not, Tyranitar, Gyarados, Charizard and Aerodactyl were in all previous Dens. They're no dragon typed, yet they were in the club. If a Pokemon that isn't Dragon typed can be in the den, why wouldn't a pokemon that isn't dragon typed be discluded if it obviously isn't a dragon...
http://b.domaindlx.com/cg103006/sky_wondermails/images/334.jpg

If this is a Dragon to you, you should get your eyes checked.

Wrong, it obviously is a Dragon, it doesn't matter what it looks like. The creators made it Dragon type because it is a Dragon. In the previous Den's we added Pokemon like Gyrados because we decided they were Dragons. It's really stupid to take a Pokemon that is literally marked as Dragon and say it's not. In all the other versions we would put every Pokemon on the list that is a Dragon, the rest would be substitute to debate.

And my response to you is: if you think Altaria isn't a Dragon apparently you can't read.

tkallab February 2nd, 2011 7:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadow236 (Post 6431807)
And my response to you is: if you think Altaria isn't a Dragon-type apparently you can't read.

There, I fixed it.

No matter how you look at it, Altaria is a Bird. Name one Dragon-like trait it has.

dragoniteuser February 2nd, 2011 8:12 AM

So if Game-freak says oddish is a Fire type, you'd see it as a fire pokemon?

tkallab February 2nd, 2011 8:25 AM

That's probably not the best example, Draggy :/

But indeed, if GameFreak made, let's say, Swellow a Dragon-type, would you buy that? Probably not, right?

Altaria is a bird. Only birds have beaks, and dragons are reptiles. Which aren't birds.

Regeneration February 2nd, 2011 9:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tkallab (Post 6430296)
Also, the egg groups don't mean much either. Farfetch'd can breed with Dewgong... And Ekans would be a Dragon too.

Look at it this way: Ekans does belong to the Dragon egg group because of the fact that it has serpentine traits. Ekans is a snake, obviously. But Ekans is a Poison type Pokemon, not a Poison/ Dragon type. Altaria on the other hand is a Dragon/ Flying type Pokemon and belongs to the Dragon egg group. Farfetch'd being able to breed with Dewgong is a different issue, that is because they belong to the Ground egg group.

Also, another fact to be taken into account is that Altaria is the only Pokemon to be Flying and Dragon egg groups. I think Nintendo wanted Altaria to be an exception to the stereotypical set of Dragons.

It's true that egg groups are just mechanics of the game, but they provide a basis for linking Pokemon together.

Mew~ February 2nd, 2011 9:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dragoniteuser (Post 6432126)
So if Game-freak says oddish is a Fire type, you'd see it as a fire pokemon?

Well, yeah. They are the creators after all... xD

Could we maybe now start discussing the 5th generation Dragon types? The games are going to be out soon and i'm sure everyone here has seen the pokémon already.

Shadow236 February 2nd, 2011 9:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tkallab (Post 6432151)
That's probably not the best example, Draggy :/

But indeed, if GameFreak made, let's say, Swellow a Dragon-type, would you buy that? Probably not, right?

Altaria is a bird. Only birds have beaks, and dragons are reptiles. Which aren't birds.

Yeah, if GameFreak made Swellow Dragon type, then it would be a Dragon. You guys are acting like the creators are stupid. They wouldn't make oddish fire type alright.... They made Altaria Dragon type because they had a reason too, it's in the Dragon family of pokemon.

Silhouette February 2nd, 2011 10:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mew~ (Post 6432254)



Could we maybe now start discussing the 5th generation Dragon types? The games are going to be out soon and i'm sure everyone here has seen the pokémon already.

You can discuss 5th gen dragons, but please keep it in spoilers. I've been trying to avoid spoiling Black and White for myself, and I'm sure I can't be the only one... okay, maybe I am... :P

tkallab February 2nd, 2011 11:41 AM

What I'm trying to say is, a bird is not a Dragon, and anything with a beak is a bird. But, for the last time, you can request a revote. It's not up to any of us what Pokémon are in the Den, it's up to our majority.

Shadow236 February 2nd, 2011 2:39 PM

I will request a re vote but I think it will be no use, cause you guys will just say no. SO yeah, I'm requesting a re vote and I vote YES

treecko0 February 2nd, 2011 3:27 PM

I would like a revote on the altaria
can we by any chance disscuss sceptile??? it looks dragon-ish to me more like garchomp style though

Regeneration February 3rd, 2011 1:37 AM

I love the way my post was absolutely ignored.

I say we go ahead for a re-vote.

dragoniteuser February 3rd, 2011 5:30 AM

You're not supposed to vote here publicly.
Send PM to tkallab with your vote.

BTW, tkallab my vote is coming to you right away...

@treecko0
No. We already discussed this, Sceptile is a lizard, and there's nothing dragonic (adjective used to adress something dragon related) about it.

tkallab February 3rd, 2011 7:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadow236 (Post 6432740)
I will request a re vote but I think it will be no use, cause you guys will just say no. SO yeah, I'm requesting a re vote and I vote YES

Okay, it's on. Read the rules below.

Quote:

Originally Posted by treecko0 (Post 6432864)
I would like a revote on the altaria
can we by any chance disscuss sceptile??? it looks dragon-ish to me more like garchomp style though

Sceptile, hmmm you're gonna have to find more arguments to support your theory if you want this to pass.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Regeneration (Post 6433887)
I love the way my post was absolutely ignored.

I say we go ahead for a re-vote.

Sorry, I got tangled up in the multitude of votes... I don't like ignoring people, but sometimes I get too comfused and I see past things.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dragoniteuser (Post 6434083)
You're not supposed to vote here publicly.
Send PM to tkallab with your vote.

BTW, tkallab my vote is coming to you right away...

Indeed.

---------------------------------------

Is Altaria a Dragon or not?
Our current debate and vote. The Dragon/Flying Pokémon Altaria was removed from the Dragon's Den some months ago because the majority of Dragon's Den members voted him not a Dragon. Recently, this decision has been questioned, and for this reason, there will be voted again.

Here are the official rules:

Every voter will send me a PM (not VM)
The majority gets their way
In case of a draw I will disregard my own vote
The minority will accept their loss


Let the votes come in!

dragoniteuser February 3rd, 2011 8:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tkallab (Post 6434234)
Okay, it's on. Read the rules below.



Sceptile, hmmm you're gonna have to find more arguments to support your theory if you want this to pass.

Yeah, like that's gonna happen.
Look, we discussed this already, Sceptile isn't a dragon, and you won't be able to find any arguements, cause there aren't any. Some Dragon moves that Sceptile can learn isn't an arguement at all!

Quote:

In case of a draw I will disregard my own vote

I strongly disagree with this!
Why should your vote be any less important?!
I say, if it's a draw, the situation remains the same.
That's perfectly logical.

angel February 3rd, 2011 9:48 AM

Wow. o.O I think everybody needs to calm down! Let's go to another topic while we are voting. We don't need to be ganging up on each other. We are all dragon lovers here. So someone please make another topic.

dragoniteuser February 3rd, 2011 11:54 AM

Which Dragon pokemon (not only Dragon type) should be strongest (in any way you want) in your opinion?

Hijax February 3rd, 2011 1:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by treecko0 (Post 6432864)
can we by any chance disscuss sceptile??? it looks dragon-ish to me more like garchomp style though

Sceptile is in the dragon egg group, so theres some more proof.

angel February 3rd, 2011 7:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dragoniteuser (Post 6434334)


Yeah, like that's gonna happen.
Look, we discussed this already, Sceptile isn't a dragon, and you won't be able to find any arguements, cause there aren't any. Some Dragon moves that Sceptile can learn isn't an arguement at all!

[/B]
I strongly disagree with this!
Why should your vote be any less important?!
I say, if it's a draw, the situation remains the same.
That's perfectly logical.

First off, I'm not trying to start the fight over. However, this needs to be said. Sweetie, this wouldn't be fair either, since the people that voted no would get there way. I think it should be put on an undecided list, to be voted on on a later date.

Tony Montana February 3rd, 2011 8:12 PM

I think I'll leave the Den. I have little time to post and school will start for me in a couple weeks, and I have to get ready, so farewell...

dragoniteuser February 4th, 2011 5:21 AM

@Hijax
Sorry, but the rules of pokemon groups say you need to be a member to post in a group...
And a lot of pokemon are dragon egg group that have no resemblance to dragons, such as: Ekans, Arbok, Magikarp, Treeko line, Seviper, Zuruggu, Zuruzukin, so this arguement can be easily used against Sceptile.

@angel
Fine, I'm OK with that too, but I don't think tkallab's vote should be disregarded.

tkallab February 4th, 2011 6:05 AM

No, Hijax is a member. I'm afraid I overlooked you when I was adding the new members, Hijax. Sorry! I'll ad you the list right now.

Also, Draggy, Pokémon in the Dragon egg group that aren't Dragons but evolve into them are justified, of course.

--------------------------------------------------------

Notice: All votes need to be pm'ed to me. If you have posted yours in the thread earlier, you will still have to pm it too, because I'm not gonna search for everyone's votes later.

angel February 4th, 2011 7:52 AM

@Dragonite Me either.

Bye Tony!

Silhouette February 5th, 2011 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dragoniteuser (Post 6434334)



Why should your vote be any less important?!
I say, if it's a draw, the situation remains the same.
That's perfectly logical.

This actually makes sense. However, it depends on the number of voters anyway. If there's an odd number of voters, we won't have to worry.
Quote:

Originally Posted by dragoniteuser (Post 6434637)
Which Dragon pokemon (not only Dragon type) should be strongest (in any way you want) in your opinion?

I'd say Flygon. Because I don't know what else to say. :P
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tony Montana (Post 6435737)
I think I'll leave the Den. I have little time to post and school will start for me in a couple weeks, and I have to get ready, so farewell...

Oh darn. Good luck in school, though.

Mew~ February 5th, 2011 12:25 PM

Let me just break this down to you... -.-"

None of you decide what a Dragon is. There is no proof any such thing exists... In the topic of pokémon, Game Freak decide what a dragon is - not you... I see no point in voting either... And where the hell did tyranitar come from? o.O

I can't wait for you all to complain about Reshiram and Zekrom. Neither look Stereotypically like Dragons...

Finally got that off my chest...

moon February 5th, 2011 12:32 PM

Dragonite should be the strongest dragon, I think. One: because it's big. Two: because it's the original dragon. Three: because the thought of a pokémon that cute being the strongest is a nice thought.

RulerArceus February 5th, 2011 2:47 PM

Favorite Dragons?
Rayquaza,Giratina,Flygon, the Lati Twins,Garchomp, Dragonite,Kingdra,Dialga,Palkia,the list is too long!XD
Should Garchomp and/or Salamence be Uber?
GARCHOMP.DEFINATELY.Salamence is...Meh.
Lance or Clair?
Lance.Erika is right, the cape is ugly.Also, is she wearing a...Power Ranger suit?!?XD
Which Dragon looks best Shiny?
Flygon,the Lati Twins, Charizard and Rayquaza.Flygon and the L Twins are so beutiful in gold, and black is pretty awesome. Giratina is pretty cool too.
Giratina: 'Origin' Form or 'Another' Form?
ORIGIN!The reason I beat the game is to get the G Orb and Decimate the E4 without Bertha giving me Trouble!
Whats your Dragon Team?
Erm...None yet XD. Dragons are hard to find in HG/SS!
Should Tyranitar be a Dragon?
Definatley.that would explain TTar having Dragon Dance.
What is your favorite legendary Dragon?
Giratina.
Soooo.... Now that I answered the questions,can I Join? :).
¬RulerArceus

dragoniteuser February 6th, 2011 3:34 AM

Welcome Ruler Arceus.
I'm sure that tkallab, the co-owner, will add you to the list soon.

Now, if you see couple of us in a strong disscussion, don't be discouraged to join in "the fight", cause we do this quite often here... XD

KitKat13 February 6th, 2011 4:05 AM

I'm joining! :3
Favorite Dragons?
Dragonite, Altaria, Palkia, Giratina, Garchomp, and so on.
Should Garchomp and/or Salamence be Uber?
Of course, they're pretty cool.
Lance or Clair?
Clair, I prefer female dragon trainers. xD
Which Dragon looks best Shiny?
I really like the shiny form of Altaria.
Giratina: 'Origin' Form or 'Another' Form?
Origin form is epic!
Whats your Dragon Team?
Too many. :3
Should Tyranitar be a Dragon?
It doesn't look like one.
What is your favorite legendary Dragon?
Palkia. XD

RulerArceus February 6th, 2011 11:46 AM

Which Dragon pokemon (not only Dragon type) should be strongest (in any way you want) in your opinion?
Thats too many conflicting opinions you have just given me,Dragoniteuser!
I'd say Rayquaza.The Lati's a close second, with Dragonite getting third place.
¬RulerArceus


dragoniteuser February 6th, 2011 1:56 PM

Sorry, didn't think it'd get confusing...
But i agree, Rayquaza SHOULD be the strongest, it's just so epic!
http://media.giantbomb.com/uploads/2/21775/767349-rayquaza_super.jpg
I mean, if this doesn't say: Power, I don't know what does!

RulerArceus February 6th, 2011 2:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dragoniteuser (Post 6441179)
Sorry, didn't think it'd get confusing...
But i agree, Rayquaza SHOULD be the strongest, it's just so epic!
http://media.giantbomb.com/uploads/2/21775/767349-rayquaza_super.jpg
I mean, if this doesn't say: Power, I don't know what does!

No, It's that there are to many awesome dragons, I had a hard time deciding!XD
But yeah, Rayquaza is the Leader of the Hoenn Trio,wich explains both why it's a dragon type and why it's so awesome<3.


Silhouette February 6th, 2011 6:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RulerArceus (Post 6438991)
Favorite Dragons?
Rayquaza,Giratina,Flygon, the Lati Twins,Garchomp, Dragonite,Kingdra,Dialga,Palkia,the list is too long!XD
Should Garchomp and/or Salamence be Uber?
GARCHOMP.DEFINATELY.Salamence is...Meh.
Lance or Clair?
Lance.Erika is right, the cape is ugly.Also, is she wearing a...Power Ranger suit?!?XD
Which Dragon looks best Shiny?
Flygon,the Lati Twins, Charizard and Rayquaza.Flygon and the L Twins are so beutiful in gold, and black is pretty awesome. Giratina is pretty cool too.
Giratina: 'Origin' Form or 'Another' Form?
ORIGIN!The reason I beat the game is to get the G Orb and Decimate the E4 without Bertha giving me Trouble!
Whats your Dragon Team?
Erm...None yet XD. Dragons are hard to find in HG/SS!
Should Tyranitar be a Dragon?
Definatley.that would explain TTar having Dragon Dance.
What is your favorite legendary Dragon?
Giratina.
Soooo.... Now that I answered the questions,can I Join? :).
¬RulerArceus

Quote:

Originally Posted by KitKat13 (Post 6440278)
I'm joining! :3
Favorite Dragons?
Dragonite, Altaria, Palkia, Giratina, Garchomp, and so on.
Should Garchomp and/or Salamence be Uber?
Of course, they're pretty cool.
Lance or Clair?
Clair, I prefer female dragon trainers. xD
Which Dragon looks best Shiny?
I really like the shiny form of Altaria.
Giratina: 'Origin' Form or 'Another' Form?
Origin form is epic!
Whats your Dragon Team?
Too many. :3
Should Tyranitar be a Dragon?
It doesn't look like one.
What is your favorite legendary Dragon?
Palkia. XD

Welcome to the Den, both of ya. Enjoy the wonderful arguments discussions that we provide.

tkallab February 7th, 2011 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mew~ (Post 6438667)
Let me just break this down to you... -.-"

None of you decide what a Dragon is. There is no proof any such thing exists... In the topic of pokémon, Game Freak decide what a dragon is - not you... I see no point in voting either... And where the hell did tyranitar come from? o.O

I can't wait for you all to complain about Reshiram and Zekrom. Neither look Stereotypically like Dragons...

Finally got that off my chest...

I had to think a long time about my reply to this post. Thank you, Mew~. This post and others really made me think.

In a way, we do decide what Dragons are. The Dragon type is an Element, assigned to some Dragons. But there are other Dragons that do not have that typing, the best example being Charizard, the very definition of a Western Dragon. So we add some Dragons to the list.
In the same spirit, Altaria is hardly a Dragon. Because of that reason, he was voted out of the Den long ago. But because he's a Dragon Type, he's still a topic of discussion and should be added in the Den, Dragon or not.

The voting is to make things happen democratically to make sure the majority is happy. Moreover, it's the way to do this I got used to :/

Tyranitar was already in the Den when I got here, but he was a subject to discussion some time ago and I think I'm the cause that he's still here, even though I was for removing him at the end...

Can't wait for Reshiram and Zekrom either... In my opinion, they're both just Dragons, really cool ones at that too...

Also, please don't forget to vote, people! I'll send pm reminders around too, I guess :/

dragoniteuser February 7th, 2011 1:11 PM

And when excatly is the voting over?
The sooner the results are in, the sooner will all this end.

tkallab February 7th, 2011 2:12 PM

I'll figure that out when I stop being ill. But there are only a few people who have voted this far. So I'll go pm a lot of members later, and then we'll see.

treecko0 February 14th, 2011 5:31 PM

Are the results in????????

tkallab February 14th, 2011 10:27 PM

Oh, I'm sorry, not yet. There are still people who need to vote, and it really wouldn't be fair to continue without their votes, because they expressed their opinions very clearly in the thread. I said I was going to pm them, but I haven't done that either, because I need to figure out tho whom I send the pm' then, and I haven't found the time to do that because of IRL stress.

I sincerely apologize, but it's gonna take just a little bit longer. I'm gonna try to make some time today, I've decided.

angel February 16th, 2011 7:17 AM

At the beginning of the show/games I thought Dragonite should be the powerfulest dragon. Now I'm not really sure, so I'm sticking with Dragonite.

dragoniteuser February 16th, 2011 9:44 AM

http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/4756/dragonitec.gif
Well i always said picture says a thousand word!

angel February 16th, 2011 10:11 AM

I agree with you. A picture does say a thousand words. That's a moving picture so its more. Dragonite is one of the strongest dragons in the Pokemon games. Remember Lance's Dragonite? How hard that thing was to beat?

Silhouette February 17th, 2011 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by angel (Post 6459464)
I agree with you. A picture does say a thousand words. That's a moving picture so its more. Dragonite is one of the strongest dragons in the Pokemon games. Remember Lance's Dragonite? How hard that thing was to beat?

Lance's Dragonite was mean. D:

tkallab February 17th, 2011 12:55 PM

Lance's Dragonite was hacked. He had Light Screen, iirc.

dragoniteuser February 17th, 2011 1:12 PM

So...
Dragonite can learn light Screen, don't know why waste move slot though... :/
But it's true Dragonite is VERY strong, i always use Dragonite, and it's always the strongest Pokemon I have...

angel February 17th, 2011 2:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silhouette (Post 6461171)
Lance's Dragonite was mean. D:

I agree. It was really mean! I usually had to use four or five potions to keep my pokemon alive.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tkallab (Post 6461179)
Lance's Dragonite was hacked. He had Light Screen, iirc.

Wasn't hacked. Like Dragoniteuser said Dragonite can learn it. Light Screen is an egg move of Dragonite's.

tkallab February 17th, 2011 2:30 PM

Oh, sorry, I meant Barrier. Which Dragonite can't learn. I'm calling Hax here >:(

Karasuma February 17th, 2011 3:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dragoniteuser (Post 6459425)
http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/4756/dragonitec.gif
Well i always said picture says a thousand word!

Yes I agree with you in this. I prefer good old Dragonite rather than Garchomp.

VarimathraS February 18th, 2011 5:14 AM

Can I join? Love Dragon Pokemons. :D

Silhouette February 18th, 2011 2:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VarimathraS (Post 6462387)
Can I join? Love Dragon Pokemons. :D

Welcome to the Dragons Den, where we seem to be in a recession of discussion.

JERIICHO February 18th, 2011 2:22 PM

i'm sure lance's moveset for dragonite was
Outrage
Light screen
Wing attack
??? don't know the last one long since i played fire red
sorry i wasn't active internet sucks :|

tkallab February 18th, 2011 2:36 PM

Well, we can just check Bulbapedia or Serebii then, can't we?

In Generation I, his dragonite has Agility, Slam, Barrier (hax) and Hyper Beam... So yeah, I'm pretty sure he owns a GameShark.

@VarimathraS, I'll add you to the list.

Xilfer February 22nd, 2011 9:31 AM

IMA BACK!
 
Oh! people, i thought you were gonna take better care of this place while i was gone! look at this mess! it's pretty close to the bottom this place is! HAHA!

Amore February 22nd, 2011 11:24 AM

Haha, don't know if I'm allowed to do this, especially as I'm probably not going to see the replies, but who cares? Here's a topic:

Are you going to have a dragon pokémon in your team on Black / White?

Before I get accused of being hypocritical with my spoilerisation of all Gen V, you don't have to mention any names of pokémon :D

Have fun guys.

Xilfer February 22nd, 2011 12:07 PM

You ruined my comeback! NVM.

Yeah, if i even bother to get B/W, I probably will have it someday, so yeah, hey did you know that they've already got B/W here! they show the advert here all the time, and there's this cereal called froot loops wich gives away B/W games plus an extra 3DS.

Silhouette February 22nd, 2011 6:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amore (Post 6472078)
Haha, don't know if I'm allowed to do this, especially as I'm probably not going to see the replies, but who cares? Here's a topic:

Are you going to have a dragon pokémon in your team on Black / White?

Before I get accused of being hypocritical with my spoilerisation of all Gen V, you don't have to mention any names of pokémon :D

Have fun guys.

Uh, hi? XD

I'm going to improvise as I run through Unova. Since I don't know anything about the game other than the starters and the region name, it's just going to have to be that way. :P

RulerArceus February 23rd, 2011 1:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amore (Post 6472078)
Haha, don't know if I'm allowed to do this, especially as I'm probably not going to see the replies, but who cares? Here's a topic:

Are you going to have a dragon pokémon in your team on Black / White?

Before I get accused of being hypocritical with my spoilerisation of all Gen V, you don't have to mention any names of pokémon :D

Have fun guys.

Yes, beacause Haxorus is pretty awesome.
~RulerArceus

vaporeon7 February 23rd, 2011 1:20 AM

~I'd like to join please!~


Giratina: 'Origin' Form or 'Another' Form?
I like it's Origin Form better. It looks better to me and is stronger.

Regeneration February 23rd, 2011 1:28 AM

Quote:

Are you going to have a dragon pokémon in your team on Black / White?
I think I would because I have had at least one Dragon Pokemon in each game all along. Most probably it would be Axew.

Xilfer February 23rd, 2011 11:44 AM

You're supposed to either welcome me or Phear me!!! tsk, ugh! is no one surprised to see me back here XD.
Hey, where's the real spice of this club? tkallab and Draggy? where'd they go? soup land? LOL

New topic: ARGUMENT TIME! LETS MAKE AN ARGUMENT FOR ME COMING BACK :D

The Eon Twins

Should we keep the eon twins as dragons? are they true dragons? or are they just some kind of glider thing? you decide!

Sorry if we did this before, it's all i could think of.

tkallab February 23rd, 2011 12:07 PM

We're not even done with Altaria (thanks to me BTW) and the Eon twins are absolutely dragons, in my and probably most others' opinions.

I'm currently Nuzlocking Black, so I don't have any control over wether I get any Dragon Pokémon, but if I get one, I'll use it.

Also, I'll add you, Vaporeon7. Welcome to the Dragon's Den!

Anyway, I'm finally finally FINALLY gonna take some actio regarding our Altaria voting. Everyone, expect a PM later.

JERIICHO February 23rd, 2011 2:19 PM

I disagree with altaria as a dragon type
the only thing it has thats dragon are moves and stats
but thats not what makes it a dragon
for starters,
a beak what dragon in fairytales or strories has a beak?
no talons?
it has no talons or claws except its chicken feet
all other dragon pokemon are superior to it
it's known as the blue PHOENIX pokemon phoenix's are birds
it evolves from a bird type a FLYING type gym leader uses it
and finally Drake is the ONLY elite four/gym leader who uses one which is dragon
and that pretty much wraps up my point its not a dragon fair is fair.

VarimathraS February 23rd, 2011 3:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JERIICHO (Post 6474812)
I disagree with altaria as a dragon type
the only thing it has thats dragon are moves and stats
but thats not what makes it a dragon
for starters,
a beak what dragon in fairytales or strories has a beak?
no talons?
it has no talons or claws except its chicken feet
all other dragon pokemon are superior to it
it's known as the blue PHOENIX pokemon phoenix's are birds
it evolves from a bird type a FLYING type gym leader uses it
and finally Drake is the ONLY elite four/gym leader who uses one which is dragon
and that pretty much wraps up my point its not a dragon fair is fair.

Can't disagree with that. I don't really like Altaria as a dragon type. He really doesnt look like a dragon.

angel February 23rd, 2011 8:59 PM

*Tackles Xil* Welcome back. XD

I feel stupid asking this but who are the Eon twins?

Welcome Vaporeon7. :3

vaporeon7 February 23rd, 2011 11:32 PM

I think of Altaria as a Dragon type.
My reason beside of its in game typing is that Lance owned one in HeartGold/SoulSilver. Think about it. He owned other dragon-like Pokemon such as Aerodactyl, Gyarados and Charizard despite their non-dragon typing. This shows that Altaria's dragon typing is not the only reason he owns it. They had other dragon Pokemon he could have: Kingdra, Flygon but no he has a Altaria meaning it must be a Dragon.

Regeneration February 24th, 2011 1:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by angel (Post 6475559)
I feel stupid asking this but who are the Eon twins?

The Eon twins are Latias and Latios.

tkallab February 24th, 2011 2:07 AM

Latias and Latios are known as the Eon twins because, according to their Pokédex entries, they are Eon Pokémon. But I don't think anyone has any reason to have a discussion over them, sorry Xilfer :)

Anyway, I sent everyone a PM, please read and reply to it asap.

dragoniteuser February 24th, 2011 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vaporeon7 (Post 6475703)
I think of Altaria as a Dragon type.
My reason beside of its in game typing is that Lance owned one in HeartGold/SoulSilver. Think about it. He owned other dragon-like Pokemon such as Aerodactyl, Gyarados and Charizard despite their non-dragon typing. This shows that Altaria's dragon typing is not the only reason he owns it. They had other dragon Pokemon he could have: Kingdra, Flygon but no he has a Altaria meaning it must be a Dragon.

Lance does not, will not, nor ever did have an Altaira in his team.
He never even used it, ever!

vaporeon7 February 24th, 2011 1:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dragoniteuser (Post 6476294)


Lance does not, will not, nor ever did have an Altaira in his team.
He never even used it, ever!

In his rematch in HG/SS he does!
LOOK HERE! AND SCROLL DOWN TO SECOND BATTLE!

dragoniteuser February 24th, 2011 2:03 PM

Yeah, you're right..., sorry, didn't see that.
But that still doesn't make it a dragon...

Silhouette February 24th, 2011 2:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vaporeon7 (Post 6475703)
I think of Altaria as a Dragon type.
My reason beside of its in game typing is that Lance owned one in HeartGold/SoulSilver. Think about it. He owned other dragon-like Pokemon such as Aerodactyl, Gyarados and Charizard despite their non-dragon typing. This shows that Altaria's dragon typing is not the only reason he owns it. They had other dragon Pokemon he could have: Kingdra, Flygon but no he has a Altaria meaning it must be a Dragon.

I've never thought about this. I like this logic.
Quote:

Originally Posted by dragoniteuser (Post 6476651)
Yeah, you're right..., sorry, didn't see that.
But that still doesn't make it a dragon...

XD Comedy relief for the win.

Xilfer February 24th, 2011 3:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tkallab (Post 6474540)
We're not even done with Altaria (thanks to me BTW) and the Eon twins are absolutely dragons, in my and probably most others' opinions.

I'm currently Nuzlocking Black, so I don't have any control over wether I get any Dragon Pokémon, but if I get one, I'll use it.

Also, I'll add you, Vaporeon7. Welcome to the Dragon's Den!

Anyway, I'm finally finally FINALLY gonna take some actio regarding our Altaria voting. Everyone, expect a PM later.

Hm, i didn't know you were re voting Altaria, after all that fuss about it not being one, Hm, i'll just stay on the side lines and see how this whole thing turns out, then i'll send my vote.

Quote:

Originally Posted by angel (Post 6475559)
*Tackles Xil* Welcome back. XD

I feel stupid asking this but who are the Eon twins?

Welcome Vaporeon7. :3

Woah! hehe, thanks angel, i'm glad to be back around all me old buddies ^^

Latios and Latias, don't worry about it, i know loads of others who made the same mistake, we call them that because they are both the "Eon" pokemon, it's a custom fan name i suppose, i've never officially heard it.

well, i'm not really up to date on the new members but hey! welcome Vapo7, enjoy your stay here.

angel February 24th, 2011 3:56 PM

^^ Good. We missed you too.


Oh, ok. Thank you guys. ^^

Even if Lance had Altaria it doesn't make it a dragon to us. That's what the creators chose for its type.

RulerArceus February 25th, 2011 12:11 AM

Me:Altaria looks like a flying bird hidden by clouds.
Ethan:Um...How does that make it a Dragon?
Me:Exaclty.
See?This short conversation pretty much sums up why its not a dragon.
CASE CLOSED.
~RulerArceus

Regeneration February 25th, 2011 2:08 AM

I don't really understand why Altaria isn't a dragon. Nintendo mas made it a Dragon type, and no one can change it. I know that the obvious answer that I'd get is that this is a club for dragons, not Dragon types. Tell me, if Forretress was made as a Bug/Steel type, would you argue against that?

tkallab February 25th, 2011 3:31 AM

Actually, we tried arguing against Forretress being a Bug in the Bug Fan Club, but we came to the conclusion that he was some kind of a bagworm surrounded by metal.

Anyway, a lot of people have sent me their votes, I'm happy this time we get more than, like, five votes :) I'll wait a bit more to see if more members are still gonna vote. after two days without anymore answers, I'll announce the results.

Xilfer February 26th, 2011 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Regeneration (Post 6477813)
I don't really understand why Altaria isn't a dragon. Nintendo mas made it a Dragon type, and no one can change it. I know that the obvious answer that I'd get is that this is a club for dragons, not Dragon types. Tell me, if Forretress was made as a Bug/Steel type, would you argue against that?

This club isn't about whats dragon TYPE its about whats DRAGON, Altaria sucks as a dragon, i will always agree to this, and yes, Forretress isn't a bug either, it's a bagworm surrounded in steel, it sucks as a bug too!

Quote:

Originally Posted by tkallab (Post 6477882)
Actually, we tried arguing against Forretress being a Bug in the Bug Fan Club, but we came to the conclusion that he was some kind of a bagworm surrounded by metal.

Anyway, a lot of people have sent me their votes, I'm happy this time we get more than, like, five votes :) I'll wait a bit more to see if more members are still gonna vote. after two days without anymore answers, I'll announce the results.

Well, there's not too much to stay from the sidelines from, so i'll send in my voties.

Silhouette March 3rd, 2011 7:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xilfer123 (Post 6480556)
Forretress isn't a bug either, it's a bagworm surrounded in steel

XD lolwut

I wouldn't say Forretress sucks. But, that's not a dragon topic, so I'll leave my opinion at that.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Xilfer123 (Post 6480556)
Well, there's not too much to stay from the sidelines from, so i'll send in my voties.

Sounds good. Hopefully I'll be around when we figure out where Altaria is going.
Quote:

Originally Posted by tkallab (Post 6477882)
I'll wait a bit more to see if more members are still gonna vote. after two days without anymore answers, I'll announce the results.

Sounds good to me. :D

Double post much needed for activity.

New topic:
Which legendary dragon would you give a pre-evolution to?

zapdos926 March 3rd, 2011 7:24 PM

I haven't posted in forever, but i have been following along via e-mail. I don't want to be kicked out, but just for future reference, i do understand what's going on.

on topic: I would give one to Rayquaza. Rayquaza is epic right now, so a pre-evolved form would be terrifyingly cute or just as epic, but at a miniature scale.

As for the topic of the eons, I have no idea why they're called the eon "twins." In the movie, Latios is older, and Latias, therefore, (waiting for the "Captain Obvious" remark) is younger. Even in most fan-fics, they aren't twins. I have actually never seen that. I have heard people refer to them as that, but never seen it in typing.

tkallab March 3rd, 2011 10:01 PM

In the movie, they are indeed just brother and sister. But you can say 'twins' in one syllable, which is of course much shorter ;)
And in the games, they can be found at the same level. But anyway, it's just a fandom term, like [email protected]

And considering pre-evolutions, I'd give Kyurem one for now, while he doesn't have a backstory yet.

If no one sents me anymore vothes today, the results will be announced tomorrow!

Silhouette March 4th, 2011 2:13 PM

I would give Giratina a pre-evolution, seeing as how you can get one as an egg (technically), and it is at level one. I guess the same goes for Dialga and Palkia.

Quote:

Originally Posted by zapdos926 (Post 6491197)
I haven't posted in forever, but i have been following along via e-mail. I don't want to be kicked out, but just for future reference, i do understand what's going on.

on topic: I would give one to Rayquaza. Rayquaza is epic right now, so a pre-evolved form would be terrifyingly cute or just as epic, but at a miniature scale.

As for the topic of the eons, I have no idea why they're called the eon "twins." In the movie, Latios is older, and Latias, therefore, (waiting for the "Captain Obvious" remark) is younger. Even in most fan-fics, they aren't twins. I have actually never seen that. I have heard people refer to them as that, but never seen it in typing.

Hmm.. you're right. Perhaps "Eon Pair" would've been a more appropriate term.

dragoniteuser March 5th, 2011 5:21 AM

Actually no...
If you check the movie more closely, you'll see that Latios is Latias's older brother.
Which means thy're not twins, but they're not a pair either...
And the pre-evo... I'd like a baby [email protected]

Pika-power March 5th, 2011 5:45 AM

Can I join?
My favorite Dragons:
Dragonite, Salamence
Which dragon looks best shiny?
Either Gyrados or Dragonite.
What's your drgon team?
in the sig.

vaporeon7 March 5th, 2011 6:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dragoniteuser (Post 6493269)
Actually no...
If you check the movie more closely, you'll see that Latios is Latias's older brother.
Which means thy're not twins, but they're not a pair either...
And the pre-evo... I'd like a baby [email protected]

But at the end of the movie when Latios dies 2 Latios and 1 Latias are born. Meaning that that Latias and Latios are twins. I just call it the Eon Duo.

But to the topic... I'd give Rayquaza a pre-evolution. I think that would be epic.

tkallab March 5th, 2011 7:54 AM

Are we really arguing about fandom terms..?
First I started thinking of arguments why 'Twins' and 'Pair' are correct terms, but really, they are just names given by the fandom to show that those Pokémon have something in common. So basically, any term is right, as long as it reflects that.

Anyway, didn't I mention something about announcing the results? Why, yes I did.

---------------------------------------------------------------

Out of the 22 votes I got in, which I believe is a record amount of votes sent in the history of the Dragon's Den, at least Version 4, there was a majority of 12 votes, meaning that the two opinions almost got the same amount of votes. It really was a close call for the winning side.

Now then, the winning side was...
Spoiler:
ALTARIA IS NOT A DRAGON

That's right, our majority still does not think Altaria is much of a Dragon. Most of the voters mentioned that they think Altaria is a bird or 'a ball of cotton'. Everything will stay the way it was.

Of course, this does not ban Altaria from being discussed in any kind of way in the Den, because he's still a Dragon Type.

zapdos926 March 5th, 2011 9:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vaporeon7 (Post 6493358)
But at the end of the movie when Latios dies 2 Latios and 1 Latias are born. Meaning that that Latias and Latios are twins. I just call it the Eon Duo.

But to the topic... I'd give Rayquaza a pre-evolution. I think that would be epic.

no, no pokemon are born, smart one. I'm pretty sure that that's the same latias, and that the two latios are the ghosts of the father and brother.

dragoniteuser March 6th, 2011 3:24 AM

Zapdos is right.
Those were the father and the son.

@tkallab
Told ya.
New voting isn't gonna change anything, but i think that now we can finaly give it a rest...

Regeneration March 6th, 2011 3:37 AM

Since the votes were pretty close, I suggest you just state that the position of Altaria as a dragon is disputed. Imposing the will of the majority is tyranny, not democracy.

If this was the parliament, something like this would be passed only with 3/4th majority anyway. :P

tkallab March 6th, 2011 5:00 AM

Here's what you said:
Sure, the democrats got the majority of votes, but it was pretty close, so let's vote again XD

Quote:

Originally Posted by tkallab
Here are the official rules:

Every voter will send me a PM (not VM)
The majority gets their way
In case of a draw I will disregard my own vote
The minority will accept their loss

My history teacher has always been very clear on rule 2 and 4. To quote his definition of democracy:
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Schut
Half plus one gets their way
The minority accepts their loss
The majority does not abuse the minority
You can sue the state
The media is independant

Ummm, so the last two rules aren't of interest here...
But yeah, this is very democratic. And if you're going to call on rule 3, it was the minority who requested the voting... So yeah.

I say we've concluded the whole Altaria mess with this. But it isn't fair to say that it'll always stay this way, because there might be a shift in opinions later on. Let's just say this can't be discussed anymore until september or something, in half a year.


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