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-   -   5th Gen Pros and Cons Discussion Thread (https://www.pokecommunity.com/showthread.php?t=232374)

Zelda September 20th, 2010 1:00 PM

Merged since you can discuss what you don't like and/or what you like here. Be sure to look around Black and White before creating a thread as there might already be a thread for an idea you have in mind. ;)

I think one of the cool things B/W did was remove the beeping sound when a pokémon reaches low HP. It got quite annoying sometimes and made me miss out the track music so I could turn off the sound. :\

mrunner4home September 20th, 2010 1:12 PM

I personally think it's awesome that pokemon evolve at such high levels. before, once you got to about lv 50-60, all your pokemon were evolved, knew pretty much all their moves, etc, plus all the gyms were already defeated and the map fully explored...... it made playing the game any further boring and kind of a waste of time.

now, though, pokemon evolve and learn moves at higher levels so it makes you want to play the game more through

[this is talking as the average player who just plays through the game, not hard-core playing. not talking about me because I raise all of my pokemon that I catch (all of the pokedex) and play much more than the average one time-play through player, but talking as someone who knows what they're talking about because he used to be that average player :D]

blue September 20th, 2010 1:12 PM

Not far into the game (Only just defeated 2nd Gym Leader Aloe) and I can't fault the game really, having so much fun playing it, I love it, music, graphics, storyline = epic! :).

coolnick37 September 20th, 2010 1:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Suicune™ (Post 6170467)
I love it, music, graphics, storyline = epic! :).

^^ exactly, after i beat it ill do it once again on the english version then ill just freeze myself untill the 3rd game comes out, probably on 3ds, which means even better graphics and stuff :D
Im just in hiuin city, and im amazed how pokemon changed since gold and silver (my first pokemon games :3)

blue September 20th, 2010 1:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by coolnick37 (Post 6170502)
^^ exactly, after i beat it ill do it once again on the english version then ill just freeze myself untill the 3rd game comes out, probably on 3ds, which means even better graphics and stuff :D
Im just in hiuin city, and im amazed how pokemon changed since gold and silver (my first pokemon games :3)

Yeah, exactily what I plan to do, Complete Japanese Pokemon White then wait untill it comes out in English and buy Pokemon Black with the Different Version Exclusives then I'll buy the 3rd game (if there is one which there probally will be) and I know, they've changed so much since G/B/C and i'm currently in the forest full of Team Plasmas :).

Masterge77 September 20th, 2010 1:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucaspontes (Post 6170534)
I think that game is so unique, that it doesn't deserve to be called Gen. V. The new names could be like that:

Gen. I -> Gen. I-I
Gen. II -> Gen. I-II
Gen. III -> Gen. I-III
Gen. IV -> Gen. I-IV
Gen. V -> Gen. II-I

That's very clever, after all, it's almost an entirely new game.....

stargate1995 September 21st, 2010 12:14 AM

TBH I love everything about this gen, except for 1 thing, the base stats, for someone who has just gotten into competitive battling and has some favorite pokemon(namely salamence and metagross) these pokemon from the last gens are all weak compared to the new pokes, e.g. Salamence with 135 attack, 80 def and spd agianst ononkusa with 147 attack 90 def, 70 spd, the only thing mence has going for him now is his HP :(.

And now thanks to sanderaa(80 base speed, it doesn't even look like it's fast >.>) and his huge sp attack he can now ko Metagross who is just slower then it. This means that I now have two staples on my team that I refuse to replace that are now useless because a ton of pokemon got stats that areway to high!

I mean look at the base stat totals of some of these pokes(the base attack of the new national bugs last stage is 108 >.<) there way to high for some of them...

Quote:

Originally Posted by I Date Flaffy's (Post 6170427)
So i want to know if there any pokemon you hate with a passion from the 5th gen.

Yes sanderaa I wouldn't mind him if he hadn't taken a couple steriods before entering the games.

mrunner4home September 21st, 2010 12:44 PM

how do black and white compare to the rest of the pokemon games?
 
alright, I haven't played it, but I'm looking for what the people who have played it think, to get me more excited for when I do play it :D (and the others who are waiting for the english version, too)


which is the best pokemon game out? does b/w top the rest? if not is it better than any of the games? is it second best? what beats it if it isn't the best?

most importantly: are b/w better than the johto region games (my favorite region so far, which many will agree with)?


what makes them so much better/worse?

Kronos September 21st, 2010 1:13 PM

I like much of the music, and the pokemon animations are cool.
I miss the pokemon walking behind you feature, as well as some other features (especially the not bieng allowed to post screencaptures, NoA T.T )

Kenta-kun September 21st, 2010 2:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrunner4home (Post 6172545)
alright, I haven't played it, but I'm looking for what the people who have played it think, to get me more excited for when I do play it :D (and the others who are waiting for the english version, too)


which is the best pokemon game out? does b/w top the rest? if not is it better than any of the games? is it second best? what beats it if it isn't the best?

most importantly: are b/w better than the johto region games (my favorite region so far, which many will agree with)?


what makes them so much better/worse?

Now, do you mean 2nd gen, or the 4th gen Johto games? I happen to prefer 2nd gen, myself, and while I'll admit that a huge chunk of that is nostalgia, another huge chunk is them being incredible games. A close second is the 3rd gen remakes of 1st gen.

If we ignore remakes here for a sec, then 5th gen is probably my second-favorite gen, after 2nd. I love the entirely new batch of Pokemon. Haters gonna hate, and all that. Some look stupid, sure, but even the first 151 had some pretty stupid Pokemon. It's actually sorta hard to include remakes, because I like the remakes in each gen quite a bit more than the actual new games of those gens. I do feel like 5th is a step back from HGSS, particularly in terms of touch screen controls, but there's still a lot to like. The music is excellent, the new battle effects cool. Gameplay is, so far, the same as it's ever been.

Unfortunately, I can't comment on things like plot yet, seeing as how I can barely read Japanese. It seems, as always, even more of a driving factor in the game than the last ones. I have mixed feelings about this. I have always loved the first 2 gens because they didn't try to be much more than a child's journey. They had no delusions: the villains were Saturday morning cartoon villains, there was no attempt to be epic. Team Rocket wanted to steal Pokemon. Stealing is bad; therefore, they are bad. That works fine. It gives you an adversary without straining the player's suspension of disbelief. But when you have environmental terrorists and men with god delusions, trying to get the God Pokemon to become a god, it makes less and less sense that these guys would bend over and just stop because a ten year old's monsters beat their monsters in a battle fought one on one according to an arbitrary system of rules. The more serious the plots try to be, the more dissonant the games become with the core concept, and anyways I like my Pokemon uncomplicated. That said, the opening cutscene of B/W has me intrigued.

I'd say my only real disappointment in the game, touch screen controls aside, is the lack of changing up anything substantial. The HMs are all the same moves again (so far). The starters are all the same types (hell, Pokebuu's evolutions are, yet again, Fire-Fighting. For the third gen in a row). I don't want Pokemon to change up its core battle system much, but it seems the main focus of this one was...whatever the C-Gear does for online battles. And that just seems so incremental.

But yeah! Games are good. I will absolutely buy them (or one, anyways) again in English.

mrunner4home September 21st, 2010 3:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kenta-kun (Post 6172726)
Now, do you mean 2nd gen, or the 4th gen Johto games? I happen to prefer 2nd gen, myself, and while I'll admit that a huge chunk of that is nostalgia, another huge chunk is them being incredible games. A close second is the 3rd gen remakes of 1st gen.

If we ignore remakes here for a sec, then 5th gen is probably my second-favorite gen, after 2nd. I love the entirely new batch of Pokemon. Haters gonna hate, and all that. Some look stupid, sure, but even the first 151 had some pretty stupid Pokemon. It's actually sorta hard to include remakes, because I like the remakes in each gen quite a bit more than the actual new games of those gens. I do feel like 5th is a step back from HGSS, particularly in terms of touch screen controls, but there's still a lot to like. The music is excellent, the new battle effects cool. Gameplay is, so far, the same as it's ever been.

Unfortunately, I can't comment on things like plot yet, seeing as how I can barely read Japanese. It seems, as always, even more of a driving factor in the game than the last ones. I have mixed feelings about this. I have always loved the first 2 gens because they didn't try to be much more than a child's journey. They had no delusions: the villains were Saturday morning cartoon villains, there was no attempt to be epic. Team Rocket wanted to steal Pokemon. Stealing is bad; therefore, they are bad. That works fine. It gives you an adversary without straining the player's suspension of disbelief. But when you have environmental terrorists and men with god delusions, trying to get the God Pokemon to become a god, it makes less and less sense that these guys would bend over and just stop because a ten year old's monsters beat their monsters in a battle fought one on one according to an arbitrary system of rules. The more serious the plots try to be, the more dissonant the games become with the core concept, and anyways I like my Pokemon uncomplicated. That said, the opening cutscene of B/W has me intrigued.

I'd say my only real disappointment in the game, touch screen controls aside, is the lack of changing up anything substantial. The HMs are all the same moves again (so far). The starters are all the same types (hell, Pokebuu's evolutions are, yet again, Fire-Fighting. For the third gen in a row). I don't want Pokemon to change up its core battle system much, but it seems the main focus of this one was...whatever the C-Gear does for online battles. And that just seems so incremental.

But yeah! Games are good. I will absolutely buy them (or one, anyways) again in English.

- I meant both really. just the johto region in general is excellent.

- the touch screen isn't like it was in hg/ss? that's disappointing. how so do you mean? like back to the diamond way things were? because I'm pretty sure I saw a screenshot with the game saving on the bottom screen... so is it a total jump back or just some features of the touch screen were taken away?

- I thought hm's were taken away from the new games, with all tms just being permanent. is this not true or do they just categorize the two still?

- yeah, the fire-fighting starter is a real let down. I always took the fire starters before they came. I used each of the fire-fight ones and hated them all... hopefully the 5th gen one isn't so bad because water and grass pokemon are too common, and fire ones aren't common enough

Kenta-kun September 21st, 2010 3:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrunner4home (Post 6172905)
the touch screen isn't like it was in hg/ss? that's disappointing. how so do you mean? like back to the diamond way things were? because I'm pretty sure I saw a screenshot with the game saving on the bottom screen... so is it a total jump back or just some features of the touch screen were taken away?

It's not as bad as 4th gen, but instead kind of occupies a point between DPP and HGSS. Basically, yes, the menu is on the touch screen. However, X still needs to be pressed to bring it up. There's no scrolling through text (outside of battle, anyways) or interacting with the environment on the touch screen, no accessing set items through it, and you have to hold B to run again.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrunner4home (Post 6172905)
I thought hm's were taken away from the new games, with all tms just being permanent. is this not true or do they just categorize the two still?

HMs are still categorized separately. I'm actually not sure if they can be forgotten or not, I haven't tried yet. The TMs don't break, though, that part is right.

mrunner4home September 21st, 2010 3:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kenta-kun (Post 6172928)
It's not as bad as 4th gen, but instead kind of occupies a point between DPP and HGSS. Basically, yes, the menu is on the touch screen. However, X still needs to be pressed to bring it up. There's no scrolling through text (outside of battle, anyways) or interacting with the environment on the touch screen, no accessing set items through it, and you have to hold B to run again.


so in other words it's on the touch screen but not touchable? O_o'

Kenta-kun September 21st, 2010 3:52 PM

Aah, sorry, yeah. It can be touched, once X brings it up. The touch screen just doesn't have the insane level of functionality that it did in HGSS, is all. Just the menu (which can't even be brought up with the touch screen. I find this bizarre), the C-Gear, and battle stuff.

mondays suck September 26th, 2010 9:53 AM

Not sure if this is true or has been discussed yet, but to me it appeared that exp gain is modified by the level distance of your Pokemon towards the enemy.
For example, some days ago when I made an attempt at a BW Nuzlocke and tried to bait+switch-grind my Angrydoof, it got about double the exp my Smugleaf got. Or, when I was grinding for the first gym on the route between the second and third city, I got decent exp early on, but around level 12, level 7 enemies only seemed to give about 30-40 exp.
Has this been viewed before or am I just an idiot?

Perriechu September 26th, 2010 10:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mondays suck (Post 6183472)
Not sure if this is true or has been discussed yet, but to me it appeared that exp gain is modified by the level distance of your Pokemon towards the enemy.
For example, some days ago when I made an attempt at a BW Nuzlocke and tried to bait+switch-grind my Angrydoof, it got about double the exp my Smugleaf got. Or, when I was grinding for the first gym on the route between the second and third city, I got decent exp early on, but around level 12, level 7 enemies only seemed to give about 30-40 exp.
Has this been viewed before or am I just an idiot?

I think your right.

When I received my Monkey, I noticed it was getting more Exp that Mijumaru,
Like in the first gym I was battling blah, I switched out for the Monkey, and it gained more.

On topic : I don't really hate anything about the new game.
I love how they took away the horrible beeping noise when you get into red health and replaced it with different music, I actually like the music to this gen more than the others.

The only thing that bugs me is that they took away the Pokemon following you. Other than that everything is amazing.

fenyx4 September 26th, 2010 4:50 PM

OK, I just noticed another con. Apparently, BW only introduced one new Poke Ball, the Dream Ball, which I assume is going to be used specifically to catch Dream World Pokemon... But not only that, the Apricorn Balls are unobtainable except by hacking! :cer_pissed:
Would it have been that hard to include areas to grow Apricorn trees in the games (not to mention Berries)?

I don't even have HeartGold yet, and I was already intrigued by the Apricorn Balls...

kohei September 26th, 2010 6:21 PM

Some points which I didn't like:
- Panic music, when your Pokemon's HP is low. It's ok for regular trainer battles, but ruins the moment in gym/E4/event battles with unique music.
- No auto-run.
- Touch screen isn't as useful as HGSS.
- Rearranging Pokemon in the PC box seems slower, and no mass-select like RSE.
- No rematching against most trainers, some exist but only in fixed areas.
- Unable to bring items from 4th gen (though this is 5th gen, and I understand they're trying to establish that by means like this.)

hamguy4456 September 26th, 2010 6:42 PM

Forgive me if I'm the only one who felt like this, but does this game seem more difficult than previous games? I'm on the fifth gym and I've noticed that it's more challenging than before. I find this to be a good thing - the Pokemon games needed a bit of challenge. The only problem I have with the game is the insane base stats of Isshu Pokemon. Most previous generation Pokemon are obsolete.

インフェルノの津波 September 26th, 2010 6:48 PM

In response to Hiro, the Nat'l Dex is back because some people will miss their Charizard and stuff, plus remember, GOTTA CATCH'EM ALL.

On a separate note, the only con I find is Meraruba is a ***** to train.

JP September 26th, 2010 8:15 PM

At this point, the only con that bother me are, as many have said, no way to rematch trainers and gym leaders. Also the lack of animated trainer sprites is a bit bothersome. The Touch screen being downgraded a bit as well, which is disappointing.

Those things are really the only major things that bother me. The rest of the games are fantastic, and I can't wait to get my hands on the English versions so I can further understand the story.

Livewire September 26th, 2010 9:22 PM

The only legitimate con I have is that I have to wait until March to play B&W. /sadface

Urugamosu September 27th, 2010 2:20 AM

1 pro is that pokemon don't get poisoned outside of battle anymore! :D

Editman September 27th, 2010 2:39 AM

I don't like 90% of the pokemon (Munna WTF>:)). Something about the game just really seems off (I haven't got my fourth badge yet though)

I hate team Plasma, they are an epic fail to me.


I do like the whole big city thing,
I like how they're are black trainers now, and even a black gym leader. (Atleast they look black)
I like the livecaster
I hate how no old region pokemon make an appearance in the game. (Like the ones that just natrually should be there...Zubat Magikarp ETC.)
I like how you get two actual Trainer Rivals.

Surmonter September 27th, 2010 2:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Editman (Post 6185163)
I don't like 90% of the pokemon (Munna WTF>:)). Something about the game just really seems off (I haven't got my fourth badge yet though)

I hate team Plasma, they are an epic fail to me.


I do like the whole big city thing,
I like how they're are black trainers now, and even a black gym leader. (Atleast they look black)
I like the livecaster
I hate how no old region pokemon make an appearance in the game. (Like the ones that just natrually should be there...Zubat Magikarp ETC.)
I like how you get two actual Trainer Rivals.

You do encounter old Pokemon in the game. Just not until you beat the E4.


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