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Mew~ April 12th, 2011 9:06 AM

Hey guys, I've updated my Negaishipping AMV, take a look;

Stupid sony vegas screwed with cropping and skipped a part near the end - I'll be replacing the Dull fades too soon. :\

Baconkillszombies April 12th, 2011 9:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gunnerpow7 (Post 6572963)
I have to agree with you on May with Ash because they are SO cute together and they are the BEST of FRIENDS..... Remember Pokemon Ranger and the Temple of Sea? MAJOR ADVANCESHIPPING MOMENTS there.... Now that's romance... But, I have to disagree with you on Drew because he just uses his coolness to get the ladies... I bet most ContestShippers out there like the ship because they "pair the spares"... But I have to give an advice... Once you read a shipping you dislike or hate, you start to have respect for that ship and frees you from "pairing the spares"... I once read a ContestShipping fic and I had a little respect for the ship...But it's only minimal but it can free yourself from viewing yourself with the ones you love... Sorry for some things I might offended anyone.. I wanna speak out some facts so sorry...

What do you mean by pairing the spares? :D Yes, another person who likes the same pairing. I dun know though, the only thing that got me to even consider the pair was when Brock commented on May being influcenced by ash. xD
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mew~ (Post 6573407)
Hey guys, I've updated my Negaishipping AMV, take a look;

Stupid sony vegas screwed with cropping and skipped a part near the end - I'll be replacing the Dull fades too soon. :\

Very nice. :)

AshPikastar April 12th, 2011 9:44 AM

The good old days of Advanceshipping. The Pokemon Ranger movie did have some good moments of Advanceshipping and there was one episode that I forgot the name of had a lot of good moments of that shipping.

Mew: I'm going to have to watch that when I get home but I bet's its good.

gunnerpow7 April 12th, 2011 5:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baconkillszombies (Post 6573441)
What do you mean by pairing the spares?

Pairing the spares means that you like one ship, the spares would be paired up so there wouldn't be an interference with your loved ship...

Example: I believe the most known "pairing the spares" example is Poke,Contest,Ikari,Wishful.

Even though I really don't like Poke and Contest, I really love Ikari and Wishful because they look so cool...

Aquacorde April 12th, 2011 5:51 PM

Whaaaat are you talking about "Pair the Spares". For one, fandom version is Ship Mates. And Poke is so not a Ship Mates relationship. Arguably, neither is Contest, as there are plenty of ContestShippers who don't use it to get May out of the way, and support it because they like it.

Really, Ship Mates doesn't even come into play unless discussing multiple, nonconflicting ships at the same time. It's used mainly by fanfic authors/shippers/etc who use Cleaning Up Romantic Loose Ends or Lonely Together. Last Minute Hookup is also used a lot in terms of Ship Mates, as is I Want My Beloved To Be Happy.

What I'm saying is that Ship Mates is a classification that generally differs from shipper to shipper, and no ship can technically be called on Pair the Spares as it stands in canon.

Especially not Poke, good god no.

Nutella April 12th, 2011 10:34 PM

I'm not an avid supporter of any pairing in any fandom, but some I like more than others, obviously.

Quote:

Pairing the spares means that you like one ship, the spares would be paired up so there wouldn't be an interference with your loved ship...


Nutella's "Let's Avoid Confusion" Post!
=)

Pair the Spares: Canon (as in, this actually HAPPENED in the story)
Ship Mates: NOT canon. (a fan-speculated/loved/accepted/whatever)

I can understand the mix-up, but you gotta check your sources before passing on info to others. Just in case you're wrong~

Quote:

Example: I believe the most known "pairing the spares" example is Poke,Contest,Ikari,Wishful.
Just LOL. Last time I checked, PokeShipping is one of, if not, THE most popular ship IN ALL OF POKEYMANZ, and OUT OF ALL THE POPULAR PAIRINGS. Fan fiction is a good measure of what pairings are popular, so I got some numbers down:

Popular Ash Pairings:

Ash x Misty or PokeShipping [1,588 stories]
Ash x May or AdvanceShipping [588 stories]
Ash x Dawn or PearlShipping [509 stories]
Ash x Gary or PalletShipping [317 stories]

Yup. PokeShipping is doomed to Ship Mates-hood, huh? =( 'TIS A SAD DAY. Yes, it depends on who you prefer to ship first, but as a generalised consensus, it looks like PokeShipping receives first priority. BY 52%, and more than those popular pairings COMBINED.

Strickly Gen-V speaking (as well as for current relevance), WishfulShipping being "Ship Mates", I hate to admit it, is wrong as well. Not inclusive of Misty, otherwise it's an insta-LOSS. Of course, there aren't a lot of fics to draw from yet, as B&W is the newest of the lot:

Dento x Iris or WishfulShipping, [26 stories]
Ash x Iris or NegaiShipping [13 stories]
Ash x Dento or CafeMochaShipping [9 stories]

Unsubstantiated bull is no good, brutha! Happy shipping everyone~

gunnerpow7 April 12th, 2011 10:46 PM

Oh...I'm SO sorry!!!!!!!!!

I feel SO STUPID right now...And I AM... =(

I'm sorry for everything I've mostly said... I just want to give knowledge to my fellow shippers of anything so I'm sorry =( =(

Everyone makes mistakes and nobody is perfect so please forgive me guys...

Well, that out of the picture, I've at least joined the contest. I'm so excited for it!!!!!!!! =)

Nutella April 12th, 2011 10:52 PM

Um, it's fine. I guess I can sound a lot ruder than I intend, so 'pologies about that.

So you've joined the contest, 'ey? Because of that damn contest, I got all these ideas and ****... thus, didn't do my essay. Oh well~ I have more time to do the essay than the contest! *WAHAHA*

Baconkillszombies April 13th, 2011 4:26 PM

:3 It's okies gunner, I'm not much into these things these debates these days and fan fics have never been my bag. I used to participate in the simpler naruto pairings thing and it already seems easier than pokeshipping. xD

That said, I'd like to see may and ash become something more,but Misty holds all the cards. Not in terms of time,but the fact that she directly has hinted towards loving ash. Whereas May has been influenced by Ash's pro-ness,but she is following Drew. >>>

AshPikastar April 14th, 2011 6:47 PM

This what usually happens during the series; we hope to have some of the old shipping expand a bit more and then here comes fanfics. We all knew that Misty liked Ash; it was obvious but then we go onto May and all the other females that traveled with Ash. Usually when they travel with them they start liking him since they are starting to know more about the character. At first sight Misty hated Ash in like episode 1 and 2 until she started traveling with him. I started turning into an Advanceshipper once I started watching the Hoenn series. Ash left Hoenn while May wanted to travel by herself so she is starting to go after Drew now while Ash is out of the picture. This is another shipping that I like as well so we don‘t know if Ash still likes May but at least she showed up during DP series and still had that same contest badge that they did back in Kanto. I don’t know if he still has that contest badge now in BW. Dawn and Ash…I didn’t pay attention to this shipping much since I dislike this shipping. I only seen a few shipping moments in it though then Iris and Ash. As much as I am a Wishfulshipper; I don’t mind this pairing that much. They are starting to show a bit more of this pairing in the series.

Ah yes the discussion about the shippings of Ash; wanted to get a good discussion here.

Baconkillszombies April 14th, 2011 7:16 PM

Interesting post, I get most of your sentiments,but I am curious as to why you mention ash taking an interest in May? I'm a bit rusty,especially when a subject about this subject. That said, I haven't looked much into iris and I actually think dawn and ash could work,but she's out of the picture as an up can coming fashion person.

AshPikastar April 14th, 2011 7:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baconkillszombies (Post 6578744)
why you mention ash taking an interest in May?That said, I haven't looked much into iris and I actually think dawn and ash could work,but she's out of the picture as an up can coming fashion person.

I don't remember most of the episodes of the Hoenn series. I guess I need to re-watch it again. I think one episode that got me to think that Ash had taken a interest in May was Date Expectations. I took in most of the hints on how Ash got worried about May once she started crying when the ferry left. It could either be just a friendship thing or him trying to show that he cares and not to mention him still having that contest badge like how he still has that little doll of Misty that he has on his fishing poll.

I never really thought of Dawn going with Ash. Dawn seemed to be too girly for him and I think they had more fights then Adancedshipping. -doesn't remember much of Pokeshipping so I don't remember how many fights they got into-

gunnerpow7 April 14th, 2011 7:35 PM

Actually, Ash shows interest to all of his female companions. There is also some instances, most likely to happen in movies, that Ash save them from danger. I don't know about you guys but the most prominent hint for me is in Pokemon Ranger and the Temple of Sea. Ash actually risk his own life in saving May, Pikachu and Manaphy from the flooding temple. I know some instances that he risk his own life just to save others from being fallen to a cliff, saving them from falling to tall building, etc. but they can easily get out from that situation but in this example, they are trapped and very hard to get out of the temple.

AshPikastar April 14th, 2011 7:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gunnerpow7 (Post 6578773)
Actually, Ash shows interest to all of his female companions. There is also some instances, most likely to happen in movies, that Ash save them from danger. I don't know about you guys but the most prominent hint for me is in Pokemon Ranger and the Temple of Sea. Ash actually risk his own life in saving May, Pikachu and Manaphy from the flooding temple.

^ This is also true. Ash is a womanizer He does care about all the girls that he travels with. He would risk his life to actually save May even though he would usually do this for his Pokemon as well but I didn't see anything like that for Dawn and Ash. I mainly remember Ash saving Dawn before she fell off but that was it. It wasn't as dramatic as him risking his life for May. Now as for Iris; there hasn't been much of those in there but they'll most likely be something similar in the new Pokemon movie. Better have some Wishfulshipping hints. Misty went to go save Ash during Movie 2000 when Ash was in the water. I don't remember anything else that was dramatic when it comes to what I mentioned before; also how Ash jumped into May to knock her out of the way from Date Expectations is another good example. Another good episode to mention as well, Grass Hysteria when he came in to save May from the grass Pokemon.

Nutella April 15th, 2011 2:33 AM

No offence, but what's this crap about "SAVIN' PPL MEANS S/HE LURBES HIM/HER?!?!?!"

Saving people from danger isn't canon proof, or even good proof. In fact, it is rare to encounter "canon" proof, especially in something kiddy like Pokemon, where the emphasis is on battles rather than romance. Moving on, friends can choose to save each other from danger, bros. This also applies to saving them from death. Perhaps he does love her, but not in the romantic sense. We won't know.

That's why fan fiction is awesome, 'cos you can pair anybody up together, and it won't be technically OOC unless they're already canonically with somebody else. The real rule is this- as long as you keep each person of the pairing in character, it's not OOC.

Granted, canon reasons aren't needed to ship; that's what fan fiction is all about. However, calling weak "proof" canon "hints" is just plain wrong. I dismiss most pairings, especially when overenthusiastic fans scream tenuous hints are 'canon.' Not what you guys are doing, but it does happen. It's just silly, pals. Enjoy the pairings, but saying ambiguous moments in the anime is proof is irrational.

Quote:

It wasn't as dramatic as him risking his life for May
The level of drama is irrelevant. Otherwise, how one judges romantic levels will be greatly distorted.

RubyJB88 April 15th, 2011 6:06 AM

Quote:

That's why fan fiction is awesome, 'cos you can pair anybody up together, and it won't be technically OOC unless they're already canonically with somebody else. The real rule is this- as long as you keep each person of the pairing in character, it's not OOC.
I agree with this last sentence, only problem is, most people don't follow it.

Baconkillszombies April 15th, 2011 12:44 PM

@Nutella: Most of us can see to a certain extent that any pairing in the anime is slim to none, but dismissing the drama of a moment clearly dismisses the interaction between the two people. How many times does some sacrifice their well being for another person?
Yet I do agree that it can't be used as substantial proof because the only thing that matters is what is explicitly said. Up until this point in time, the only person to even hint towards strong feelings towards ash was misty. IN fact, the person to even have hint at all was misty. >.>

Aquacorde April 15th, 2011 12:48 PM

Dent's been hinting too, if you watch Best Wishes. :D

Edsbob April 15th, 2011 1:50 PM

I think we need to delve into where Pokemon comes from if we are saying that saving someone's life is a sign of ulterior affection.

Darn do I love good ol' (or perpetually young) Ash, but he practically epitomises the 'Shounen Hero' that all Japanese youngsters and now lots of international youngsters know from Anime. You look into other anime and there are young men/boys saving the lives of his mates all the time. And usually the slightly troubled friend is a girl. 'Saving the damsel in distress' isn't something Japan has gotten over- you look at all sorts of anime and the guys do that. Oh the strong willed man, courageously saving the girl- we love it. Obviously, most of those men and women aren't in love with each other. In fact, it's a technique story writers use to a) Heighten the thrill of the story and b) to make the audience like the said 'Shounen hero' more.

Ash is a good kid with a kind heart, pretty oblivious to love (and I swear the makers changed his character from early first season to match that, after all that sort of thing is still hot with the Japanese girls) and you see him frequently put his well being on the line in the anime (taking attacks for his pokemon, for instance). He's set to be the guy that treasures his friends and so there's no real difference between taking an attack (small scale) to risking his life (a much larger scale). He has his pokemon that he trusts with him, he trusts that person that he saves and his ability too.
It's a nice story don't you think? I think so, I'm a sucker for that stuff. Not very surprisingly, that's the thing the makers of the anime want.

We can't look at the 'saving her life' situation realistically, it's a fictional story and world with many people with clearly fictional character. Saving people happens often and much easier in the anime than real life. Not only that but once again those characters don't think like we do. They're not real. They won't die. They're cartoon heroes after all.

I don't mind people making shipping fics/manga/art between anyone despite not being a serious shipper myself. I don't mind, in fact I like people using situations which could be used as a plot point in their works. I even don't mind people grasping at things they believe could be evidence for a ship (the Japanese fandom). But I don't like people desperately claiming things from an anime-- which many around the world hate to admit but know is aimed at children more than any other age-- as definite evidence and use it in debates as if it actually proves something (knowing what the Pokemon anime is). I don't even need words for evidence, but there's not many words or body language coming from any one except Brock to the ladies.

Quote:

Dent's been hinting too, if you watch Best Wishes. :D
Hahaha; "I want to go where you are going Ash" >> Uh-Oh, watch out Ash!

Pairings (like DentxAsh) are fun to look at for me. Fun for me to think "Hahaha, this is a good 'what if' they did like each other" in pairing works based on the anime. But I never take anything as actual evidence, because there isn't anything to support this 'evidence'. I just say 'YES THIS IS GOOD'.

Aquacorde April 15th, 2011 1:59 PM

Hmm, you're kinda bashing the whole point of our little Shipping Debates corner over here. :< Just saying.

Evidence is evidence, too. Hints are canon, and we pull them from canon to support our theories. Some go more overboard on it than others, but it's the same concept. You can't completely disregard these kinds of things, which is what you seem to be doing.

Edsbob April 15th, 2011 2:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheSmartOne (Post 6580080)
Hmm, you're kinda bashing the whole point of our little Shipping Debates corner over here. :< Just saying.

Evidence is evidence, too. Hints are canon, and we pull them from canon to support our theories. Some go more overboard on it than others, but it's the same concept. You can't completely disregard these kinds of things, which is what you seem to be doing.

Sorry if I did that, that wasn't my intention. And I must not have grasped the concept of this thread. I was just really thinking where do we draw the lines between hints and... misconceptions? I find pairings of many sorts to be likable without all of that thought. I think now I get that the people on this thread like all the deep thought and debating it.

Despite how I sounded I don't like bashing other people's hobbies, especially one which I indulge in every now and then (or even more frequently thanks to BW, hahaha) too. I was just explaining my serious view on the evidence on while also hinting that I like the works that come from the ’hints’ in the anime.

Frostik April 15th, 2011 4:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baconkillszombies (Post 6579900)
@Nutella: Most of us can see to a certain extent that any pairing in the anime is slim to none, but dismissing the drama of a moment clearly dismisses the interaction between the two people. How many times does some sacrifice their well being for another person?

Ash is the action hero; if he's not saving people in danger, he's not doing it right. Saving someone isn't a hint, because it's part of his character (or what the target demographic expect of him). 9 out of 10 times it's the girl or a pokémon; seriously, he risks his life for everything, whether he means to or not. And not the chicks, either. Like mentioned, he's saving his pokémon, he's saving other people's pokémon; he's not madly in love with them (Pikashippers/HatThiefshippers/Chikoshippers are allowed to disagree with me).

You going to stand by and do nothing if your friend or some stranger is about to fall over a cliff, and you might have the power to save them? I hope not.

Unless the save in question is characterized as special (*points to May and Drew*), it's run of the mill action and shouldn't be confused for evidence Ash (or any character) is madly in love with another. Because he's going to save his friends always, that bloody masochist.

(Wording for the above is phrased to reflect that James saved Cilan and Ash saved Jessie leik woah and seriously, it won't equal love, but I haven't seen it, so don't know emphatic is was.)

Taemin April 15th, 2011 7:39 PM

Be that as it may, that doesn't at all mean that fans aren't and shouldn't have fun pairing characters up. Is it canon? Mostly likely not, it's Pokemon. However, in any series (anime or not), romance is something that attracts a huge portion of the fandom, and if that group of fans wants to pair up or find hints for two characters just because they hugged once or twice, then let them. A lot of Pokemon fans enjoy finding romantic hints, or hints of heavy friendship. In an anime that's not ruled by romance, people take what they can get.

Would Ash really confess his undying love for Misty? Probably not, but that doesn't mean people can still wish, or write fanfics, or speculate, if that's what they find to be fun.

Nutella April 15th, 2011 9:34 PM

Quote:

@Nutella: Most of us can see to a certain extent that any pairing in the anime is slim to none, but dismissing the drama of a moment clearly dismisses the interaction between the two people. How many times does some sacrifice their well being for another person?
That's not only what I was saying, Bacon. I wasn't dismissing the drama, I was dismissing the fact that the amount of drama does not govern how "shippy" a scene is. Please learn to read thoroughly! What about characters that are naturally calm and unemotive? Just because they don't go "OMG LANA DON'T ****ING DIE ON MEEEEE I WILL SAVE YOU", doesn't make the possibility of their love for them any different.

Quote:

How many times does some sacrifice their well being for another person?
Not a lot, but friends and family members do this too. What you're basically hinting at is "IF YOU DO THEN IT MUST BE LOVE." That's just silly~ I'm not going to pair you up with your close friend just because you risked your life to save theirs. Doesn't that sound dumb?~

Quote:

Saving someone isn't a hint, because it's part of his character (or what the target demographic expect of him). 9 out of 10 times it's the girl or a pokémon; seriously, he risks his life for everything, whether he means to or not. And not the chicks, either. Like mentioned, he's saving his pokémon, he's saving other people's pokémon; he's not madly in love with them (Pikashippers/HatThiefshippers/Chikoshippers are allowed to disagree with me).
HOW DARE YOU DISMISS MY FAVOURITE PAIRINGS! PIKA/ASH IS CLEARLY CANON COS HE LIKE SAVED HIS LIFE AND SHIZZ LOLLLOL James and Dento is clearly canon, people. -___- Damn James, always playing hard to get! ♥

Quote:

Be that as it may, that doesn't at all mean that fans aren't and shouldn't have fun pairing characters up.
I see where you're getting at, but I'm not telling people that they should pair CANON ONLY and not to have fun. It's just stupid to say something is a hint when it isn't.

Quote:

Evidence is evidence, too. Hints are canon, and we pull them from canon to support our theories. Some go more overboard on it than others, but it's the same concept. You can't completely disregard these kinds of things, which is what you seem to be doing.
I don't want to seem that I'm attacking you, but hints are not canon. Hints are subjective observations from canon. Yes, what people see as hints differ from person to person. However, I won't pretend to deny the stupidity of a "hint." The "ASH SAVED [X]" is especially dumb, because like a few have said, it's in his character.

Also, this is a debate, so people can argue whatever they like as long as it's in topic and strays from name-calling... I think, at least. Some people think a pairing will happen, some don't. Some even think any won't happen at all.

Given that the last statement would holds the most water in regards to Pokemon, I don't see why Edsbob was bashing the point of this thread. I thought the point of this thread was to debate any pairing in general. Given that you can debate whatever pairing you want, why can't one dismiss every single one?

It's okay to like a pairing because [x] happened so [y] loves [z], but it's wrong to think it will canonically happen as a result. Edsbob probably said "evidence" in place of "canon". Because like I said, hints/evidence is an interpretation, not actual canonical fact. There's NOTHING wrong with that; nothing wrong with liking crack pairings and such, but it's irrational (not incorrect) to proclaim a pairing as canon... when it obviously isn't or won't be.

Taemin April 15th, 2011 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nutella (Post 6580909)


I see where you're getting at, but I'm not telling people that they should pair CANON ONLY and not to have fun. It's just stupid to say something is a hint when it isn't.

I agree that some of the simplest gestures of typical friendship get taken too far sometimes, but like I said, people take what they can get with Pokemon. xD;


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