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-   -   DS vs. PSP (https://www.pokecommunity.com/showthread.php?t=24558)

Kairi December 31st, 2004 3:16 PM

You want 3D graphics? Go get a Gamecube. You want high quality 2D graphics, that, just by being limited to them, have produced countless quality games (IE Pokémon)? Get a GBA.

If you want dated 3D graphics, that is, 3D graphics that have had superiors availablefor a long time, of, get a DS. The GBA offers the highest quality 2D graphics. And 3D is not greater than 2D, it’s just different.

I have my opinion on SM64DS. But I won’t post it, because it’s an opinion of the game and means nothing. DS games aren’t just throwbacks to older titles, they’re throwbacks to older technology (bad) with a few new forced “innovations” for developers.

I don’t like the DS and the PSP. And yet I own all three major consoles, cause all of them have good games. And they’re all more or less the same, from a gameplay point of view. They all offers the mostly same controls and graphics. The DS and PSP retard this simplicity and try to stamp out uniqueness. Developers have never needed touch screens before to make the games people consider best. And forcing it on them isn’t going to necessarily make them make good (or bad) games.

And the PSP offers just the PS2 with the limitations and “benefits” of a handheld. Blah. IMO it all comes down to fandom, like I said. If you can’t draw that form this thread, then I advise you reread it.

Lucifer. December 31st, 2004 3:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pokejungle
Kairi- The rest of us want 3D graphics. You can have your 2D out-dated graphics any day of the week.

They're hardly outdated. Alot of GBA games use buffed-up 2D visuals that look brand-spanking new. The screenshots and videos I've seen of Kingdom Hearts: CoM are amazing.

I'd be perfectly content sticking with GBA visuals for the next 10 years. I don't want a handheld that does everything my console's already capable of.

pokejungle December 31st, 2004 3:24 PM

Kairi, the DS is capable of much better 2D graphics. Now, if developers actually thought gamer's wanted that, then they would make them. The GBA's pixelated screen makes actually playing detailed games tough. Although, I love my GBA, my DS is way better. And, the only reason 2D exists is because that's all the technology that was available when games were first made. That's a dated technology.

Chikorita, Billy-chan- I'm not biased. While it is true that I like the DS better, it doesn't influence my posts. I draw logic from fact, not fandom. Simply put, "I LOVE THE PSP!" I think its awesome, even though I believe the DS to be the better handheld. Once the PSP comes stateside, you can count on me to get it, but only if Sony can show me that there are enough reasons to pay the price. =/

Shinin December 31st, 2004 3:46 PM

I have a DS and like it a lot. I would like the PSP, but it's battery life is horrible (only 4 hours...) and the cost of all the stuff required to actually save a game & use it (the batteries are really expensive).

pokejungle December 31st, 2004 3:50 PM

I know!

http://psp.ign.com/articles/574/574557p1.html <-- Battery test. Got pretty bad results on everything but Sleep Mode [LMAO!] and MP3 playback. Made me a tad less excited. =/

Kairi December 31st, 2004 4:05 PM

Pokejungle: Technically, so are the consoles. But they have 3D, and that’s the main focus of those systems. No one system has ever been able to focus on both graphicstyles at once.

2D is not dated. Why deny Nintendo’s success? I thought you liked them. Nintendo has had a monopoly on 2D games with the GBA. It does not have three 3D monopoly. Hence why the GBA outdoes the GCN, and all the other consoles too. Nintendo would be foolish to not understand the potential they have.

2D games are cheaper to create. This is a large draw for high quality developers. This has been proven by the GBA’s vast lead over the consoles. 2D is still very alive. 2D and 3D games play very differently. Every aspect is different. And 2D games are better suited to mobile hardware. The GBA has inferior graphics, fewer buttons, and a smaller screen than the consoles.

Yet it beats them. Why? Because it has a gametype (2D) that is not commonly found on any other console. This is its strength.

So what does the DS have? Its focus has been primarily 3D, and maybe stealing a little 2D from the GBA. So it doesn’t have the monpoly factor the GBA has.

And it doesn’t have the superior graphics in its 3D realm to make it stand out, either. All it has are its dual screens, touch, and mic. That’s it.

And the PSP has nothing but the fact it’s a handheld. It doesn’t have superior graphics, it doesn’t do 2D. All it is is a slightly modified version of a PS2. That’s not very standout.

So to conclude
GBA= smart, unique games that have been proven effective
DS= dated technology with a few very untested "innovations"
PSP= nothing

Shinin December 31st, 2004 4:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pokejungle
I know!

http://psp.ign.com/articles/574/574557p1.html <-- Battery test. Got pretty bad results on everything but Sleep Mode [LMAO!] and MP3 playback. Made me a tad less excited. =/

That makes me hate the PSP even more...

pokejungle December 31st, 2004 4:18 PM

Kairi-

I'll tell you why the GBA does better:

-It's cheaper
-Games cost less
-Is portable [Big factor]

And, N64+ graphics are dated....for consoles. To put something like that into a portable is a monumental step in technology, a fact you won't accept. Its one thing to have a nice big console to support superior graphics, but fitting in that technology to something up to 1/10 of an X-box is nothing short of breathtaking.

An ending note- The portables with console-calibur graphics do offer something- portability. I don't know wether you have a screen for your consoles and take them everywhere you go, but, I don't. That's why its handy to have a DS, which has graphics that far surpass the GBA's. I guess I don't apperciate pixelated 2D graphics as much as you. I'd rather my next portable Pokemon game in 3D.

The DS also offers PictoChat, which many Sony fanppl pass off as "gimmicks". I don't have any clue why, but, I don't. When I can message my friends during class, have a chat with an anymous person on a train, I apperciate it.

Kairi December 31st, 2004 4:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pokejungle
Kairi-

I'll tell you why the GBA does better:

-It's cheaper
-Games cost less
-Is portable [Big factor]

And, N64+ graphics are dated....for consoles. To put something like that into a portable is a monumental step in technology, a fact you won't accept. Its one thing to have a nice big console to support superior graphics, but fitting in that technology to something up to 1/10 of an X-box is nothing short of breathtaking.

An ending note- The portables with console-calibur graphics do offer something- portability. I don't know wether you have a screen for your consoles and take them everywhere you go, but, I don't. That's why its handy to have a DS, which has graphics that far surpass the GBA's. I guess I don't apperciate pixelated 2D graphics as much as you. I'd rather my next portable Pokemon game in 3D.

The DS also offers PictoChat, which many Sony fanppl pass off as "gimmicks". I don't have any clue why, but, I don't. When I can message my friends during class, have a chat with an anymous person on a train, I apperciate it.

Yes, they are. And the PSP’s graphics are even more of a leap ahead. Ahead of Nintendo. If you want a portable system that’s just better graphics wise than the GBA, get a PSP. It’s better than both of Nintendo’s handhelds graphics wise.

And your view of 2D conflicts with the vast majority of the market. The majority decides who wins and loses, not you. The GBA offers something very different from the consoles. And it doesn't do it with gimics. Nintendo has something with the GBA. I pray they don't kill it with their gimmicy device.

Shinin December 31st, 2004 4:28 PM

GBA games: $35
DS games made by Nintendo: $30
DS games not made by Nintendo: $40

GBA games aren't always cheaper.

FaerieEsqueThing December 31st, 2004 4:28 PM

PSP!!

The DS is a fancy gameboy. I HAVE a gameboy. The PSP is actually original!

Zapchu December 31st, 2004 4:29 PM

I already have GBA and games are still coming out for it...why get a DS when there are barely any good games released/announced for it yet? ^^; Nintendo released their new system a bit too quick.

I'm all for the PSP, it looks like it'll have better games for it. I get systems for the games, not for the graphics and battery life.

Shinin December 31st, 2004 4:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ashlein
PSP!!

The DS is a fancy gameboy. I HAVE a gameboy. The PSP is actually original!

It's not as simple as that.

Kairi December 31st, 2004 4:29 PM

Ashlein: The PSP is nothing more than, well, its namesake: A Portable Playsation. Its mobility is the only thing different it offers than the Playsation2.

pokejungle December 31st, 2004 4:30 PM

The PSP may have better graphics, but it lacks the "gimmicks" [which I apperciate] and the battery power for the DS. My farming town is an hour+ away from any convience, meaning I'm in the car a lot. A PSP wouldn't last in my life =/ A DC adapter would be a must for me.

The GBA is an awesome console, no doubt. [joke]It itself was a giant leap from GBC. Did you whine about that step? I bet. And now you're drooling over it. I'd guess you'll be on the DS's side when the next portable revolution takes place =P[/joke]

Lucifer. December 31st, 2004 4:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pokejungle
The GBA is an awesome console, no doubt. It itself was a giant leap from GBC. Did you whine about that step?

It didn't leap into the realms of 3D though.

Kairi December 31st, 2004 4:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pokejungle
The PSP may have better graphics, but it lacks the "gimmicks" [which I apperciate] and the battery power for the DS. My farming town is an hour+ away from any convience, meaning I'm in the car a lot. A PSP wouldn't last in my life =/ A DC adapter would be a must for me.


As others have been told many many times, that’s your situation. Not everyone else’s.
Quote:

The GBA is an awesome console, no doubt. [joke]It itself was a giant leap from GBC. Did you whine about that step? I bet. And now you're drooling over it. I'd guess you'll be on the DS's side when the next portable revolution takes place =P[/joke]
The GBA was a step forward from the GBC. But it kept the 2D gamestyle. So yes, of course. Just like how the GCN is a better 3D console than the N64, the GBA is a better 2D one than the GBC. It’s progression on two separate levels.

Shinin December 31st, 2004 4:38 PM

Of course the GBA was a step forward of the GBC. GBC=8 bit, GBA=32 bit. It skips 16 bit.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kairi
As others have been told many many times, that’s your situation. Not everyone else’s.

The GBA was a step forward from the GBA. But it kept the 2D gamestyle. So yes, of course. Just like how the GCN is a better 3D console than the N64, the GBA is a better 2D one than the GBC. It’s progression on two separate levels.

The GBA was a step forward of the GBA? You need to edit your post... lol...

pokejungle December 31st, 2004 4:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kairi
As others have been told many many times, that’s your situation. Not everyone else’s.

Did I EVER claim it was anyone else's? I'm still wondering why you bothered to comment like that. 0.0'

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lucifer
It didn't leap into the realms of 3D though.

Nope, but sure did have better 2D!

PS- I changed my sig in your honour Kairi ^^

Kairi December 31st, 2004 4:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shinin
Of course the GBA was a step forward of the GBC. GBC=8 bit, GBA=32 bit. It skips 16 bit.


The GBA was a step forward of the GBA? You need to edit your post... lol...

Thanks for the heads up.^^;
Quote:

Originally Posted by pokejungle
Did I EVER claim it was anyone else's? I'm still wondering why you bothered to comment like that. 0.0'



Nope, but sure did have better 2D!

PS- I changed my sig in your honour Kairi ^^

Because -you- brought the point into the discussion, I countered it.

pokejungle December 31st, 2004 4:47 PM

I may have brought it in, but I was relating my personal situation, not trying to claim everyone will be playing on a 2 hr round trip.

Anway, the PSP also suffers from Dead Pixels! IGN had a thing about it. In fact, it suffers a LOT more than the DS...

Lucifer. December 31st, 2004 4:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pokejungle
Nope, but sure did have better 2D!

'zactly. Same familiar gameplay, sparkly new looks. The DS is a totally different kettle of fish.

Kairi December 31st, 2004 4:49 PM

The DS has also had massive dead pixel syndrome. Quick look at the GFAQs board for the hardware shows that.

The PSP has had hardware issues too, though its design isn’t final.

pokejungle December 31st, 2004 4:55 PM

Ummm...for Japan...yes. They've released, and the Japanese market is not going to be pleased if the USA/Euro version is overhauled and designed a lot better, and Sony knows that. I wouldn't be expecting an extreme makeover or anything =/

And yes, the DS has dead pixel problems...so what? Nintendo is replacing them even if only 1 has a problem. Sony hasn't even started to do anything about them.

Kairi December 31st, 2004 4:57 PM

They’ve done that before though, so it’s not too unlikely.

And I’m sure Sony will replace as well, once it launches stateside. That’s when a lot of questions will be answered.

Shinin December 31st, 2004 4:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kairi
The DS has also had massive dead pixel syndrome. Quick look at the GFAQs board for the hardware shows that.

The PSP has had hardware issues too, though its design isn’t final.

The DS's dead pixel syndrome isn't massive. Not too many DSs have it. I go to the GFaqs DS board regularly. And the PSP also has dead pixels, but they're not replacing ones with them like Nintendo.

Kairi December 31st, 2004 4:59 PM

Search “dead” fair enough amount of topics for me to consider it an issue. And I’m not sure about this, but wouldn’t replacing all those units be kinda costly, anyways?

pokejungle December 31st, 2004 5:02 PM

Kairi- What happens to the Japanese gamers then? Do they have to wait 'til the stateside release? This has been a major show of incompetence on Sony's part.

[I'M AN HD-DVD FAN! KILL THE BLU-RAY, IT SUX!] <--That was a rant by the way, and was also off topic, but we were talking about Sony's incompetence.

Kairi December 31st, 2004 5:04 PM

It doesn’t really deal directly with the systems, though. Maybe if you backed It up a little more. Anyways

I’ve heard it’s being kind of mocked in Japan right now, but that was just from comments off of Slashdot. I really don’t have much faith in either, but I’ll try to be fair and give them both another look when the PSP Is released here.

Shinin December 31st, 2004 5:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kairi
Search “dead” fair enough amount of topics for me to consider it an issue. And I’m not sure about this, but wouldn’t replacing all those units be kinda costly, anyways?

On-topic: Nintendo obviously has enough money to replace all the DSs if they're doing it.

Off-topic: You have the search feature on GFaqs? I don't have enough karma yet. What's your username there?

Kairi December 31st, 2004 5:08 PM

Celes152. First board I ever joined. ^_^;
Yeah, maybe so, but if it is a big issue *not saying for sure it is* then it’d be costly, which isn’t good. If not, it might be a way to build confidence in the system.

pokejungle December 31st, 2004 5:12 PM

The dead pixel thing is shared by all LCD products, so you can't say Nintendo did a bad job manufactoring it.

As good as the PSP looks, I don't hold much hope either. I have doubts of it ever reaching stateside, though they are very minute.

Kairi December 31st, 2004 5:15 PM

You’ve done a decent job of keeping civility. Don’t drag others into this that aren’t even here. That’s your warning from Kairi the administrator.

Kairi the member: I’m quite positive Sony *is* releasing it here. That’s why there’s all the buzz and debate, no?

pokejungle December 31st, 2004 5:27 PM

Post edited. I'll remain civil. I formally apologize. [I always seem to get into trouble. >>; Of course, none to fault but myself XD]

On Topic:
You never know. Nintendo has a lot of power behind it. Sony's already slipping out of the market. I swear, if the Blu-ray fails, they're DEAD! Other companies have managed to offer better products than Sony lately. *Cough, iTunes/iPodcough*

Shinin December 31st, 2004 5:38 PM

If you think about it, the DS is only something Nintendo thought would be cool to compete with the PSP while they make the next Gameboy.

pokejungle December 31st, 2004 5:43 PM

I seriously doubt that. The PSP was made to compete with the DS.

Touch screen is a great innovation. I would like it if Kairi explained why she disagrees.

Kairi December 31st, 2004 5:47 PM

Well, my opinion on the touchscreen is just that—an opinion, so keep that in mind.

I don’t like pressing down so hard on it with your finger, firstly. It seems unweidly. The stylus is nicer, but it’s not practial for controlling games like SM64DS. If the virtual “control stick” was in one place, perhaps. But it seems to me on a lot of games the bottom screen isn’t much more than a distraction to the top. The touching seems to take a lot of effort, and I don’t care for that. I did like the SM64DS minigames involving the stylus, but that’s not enough to make me like the idea as a whole. It messes the screen, and it doesn't seem tight enough of a method of control.

Also, I think the backlight on/off should be a button on the system itself, like the GBA.

pokejungle December 31st, 2004 5:50 PM

The DS screen is virtually black if there's no light =/

The thumbpad works wonders on 64DS. I think the touch screen is a lot easier navigating menus than using a D-pad. i.e, Urbz!

Kairi December 31st, 2004 5:53 PM

I haven’t played a game where its used to navigate menus. It might work in Animal Crossing, perhaps. I just don’t know.

True, but sometimes when you’re in the sun the backlight is virtually useless. Saves on that battery power we’re all so concerned about. ;D

pokejungle December 31st, 2004 5:57 PM

The DS is equipped with enough battery life to have the backlight constantly on. Its the PSP we were worried about, remember?

Shinin December 31st, 2004 5:58 PM

You use the stylus to do menu stuff in almost every DS game. I also find it much easier.

pokejungle December 31st, 2004 6:03 PM

I know. I don't know how much time Kairi's spent playing a DS. Do you have one? [either of you]

Shinin December 31st, 2004 6:10 PM

I do. It's pretty cool. I have like 46 stars is SM64DS right now. And GBA games look really good on it.

pokejungle December 31st, 2004 6:25 PM

I love my DS. FE is almost always the GBA game I play on it. SM64DS is awesome, I have 83 stars =3 But still can't beat Bowser. Shinin, why don't you come over to my house so we can play multi-player XD

Only one person I know has a DS ;_;

Funny story time:

I was walking to the Movie Theatre from the parking lot, carrying my DS. This group of adults [males] were walking by, and one of them whispers, "Hey! That kid's got a DS!"


I thought it was funny >>;

Brittany December 31st, 2004 7:00 PM

I'm not even going to bother refuting half of the stuff I ahve seen on the previous pages. I'm too busy looking at http://utsunomiya.cool.ne.jp/gamers159/image/dm_0502.jpg

That article discusses Square's look on 2004, and some of the plans for 2005.
We already know that FFVII is having a spinoff for PSP(Crisis Core), but why is he drawing a picture of Cloud on the DS? Some kinda sign of what's to come? Or is he mocking it?

pokejungle December 31st, 2004 7:13 PM

SE has already said they have big plans for the DS, I'd assume its a sign of what's to come. The DS looks like its gonna have RPG love, unlike the GCN =3

Shinin December 31st, 2004 8:49 PM

Yeah, SE has like 5 games in development for the DS.

pokejungle December 31st, 2004 8:54 PM

Hopefully some REAL FF games!

Shadow December 31st, 2004 9:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brittany
I'm not even going to bother refuting half of the stuff I ahve seen on the previous pages. I'm too busy looking at http://utsunomiya.cool.ne.jp/gamers159/image/dm_0502.jpg

That article discusses Square's look on 2004, and some of the plans for 2005.
We already know that FFVII is having a spinoff for PSP(Crisis Core), but why is he drawing a picture of Cloud on the DS? Some kinda sign of what's to come? Or is he mocking it?

Perhaps he likes drawing/doodling characters he created and the DS let's him doodle/draw them? I think we know an artist/director for Square-Enix's pick of the two =p

pokejungle December 31st, 2004 9:51 PM

Please fill me in on his choice Shadow.

O December 31st, 2004 10:03 PM

The PSP isn't a portable PS2... It's supposed to be a next generation walkman capable of Playing games... x.x
I myself, would get the DS, It's a lot cheaper, and all the titles I want are on it [Pokémon, MMBN, LoZ] Those Loyal Nintendo-ers. I can kill that guy in Toys R Us who nearly got my mum to buy an XBOX because of the graphics... It's because of the Games... stoo-pid

Pogiforce-14 December 31st, 2004 10:08 PM

I already have a DS, and even though it takes a while to get used to, it is still loads of fun. Besides, I can play my GBA games on it. and the complaint Nintendo isn't adult enough is about to shift. I saw several teen rated games for DS. mostly dealing with relationships.

pokejungle December 31st, 2004 10:09 PM

The DS is awesome. You should really buy one! I love mine! =3

*hugs his DS*

Shinin January 1st, 2005 5:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Omega II
The PSP isn't a portable PS2... It's supposed to be a next generation walkman capable of Playing games... x.x
I myself, would get the DS, It's a lot cheaper, and all the titles I want are on it [Pokémon, MMBN, LoZ] Those Loyal Nintendo-ers. I can kill that guy in Toys R Us who nearly got my mum to buy an XBOX because of the graphics... It's because of the Games... stoo-pid

PSP has PS2 graphics, can play music and play movies.
PS2 has PS2 graphics (obviously >_>), can play music (with CDs) and play movies (with DVDs).

Not much of a difference.

Lucifer. January 1st, 2005 5:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pogiforce-14
the complaint Nintendo isn't adult enough is about to shift.

It's a stupid whinge anyway. No-one complained that Mario and Link were children's games back in the NES/SNES era. Games like GTA have corrupted peoples' minds. Now, including guns and prostitutes in games is key to getting ratings.

But that's a different thread entirely. :dead:

Houndour2004 January 1st, 2005 6:34 AM

I have voted for Nintendo DS.

Carlito-san January 1st, 2005 8:41 AM

Would you mind explaining why,hun?

Pogiforce-14 January 1st, 2005 9:20 AM

Looking back at the last two pages, I'd liek to refute a couple complaint regarding teh DS.

1. Teh DS was just made to compete with the PSP. My reasoning: usually when a system is made to compete with another, it is produced AFTER the other system. DS, however, was in progress before PSP was a twinkle in Sony's eye, so it seems to me that statement is more accurate on teh reverse.

2. The touch screen is unweildly. My reasoning: THe touch screen is not unweildly at all. I don't know what DS this person was using, by touch screen is incredibly sensitive and it doesn't take a lot of pressure to make it react. Playing Super Mario DS, a simple tap here and there causes it to react and doesn't require excessive pressure. And to make things all the easier, you can just wrap the temporary stylus around teh tip of your thumb, and then all you have to do is reach over and presto! easy play.

looking at the first comment I argued, it was said by a Sony fan, as it's antagonistic and holds no truth to it. The second comment seems to be by one with some minor bias, though not so much as the first.

Just my opinion. I said no names, so don't take offense to my reasonings. (call this a disclaimer, if you will.)

Kairi January 1st, 2005 10:38 AM

I don’t know which was made to combat which. I just know they’re both fighting a war now where no one wins.

That’s your opinion about the touch screen. And the reason there are so many varying opinions is because the touch screen is a risky, untested venture. Which so far hasn’t seen a lot of success or failure, just underwhelming quite a few people.

Pogiforce-14 January 1st, 2005 10:55 AM

underwhelming people? Mind defining that for me? :\

Shinin January 1st, 2005 11:31 AM

Underwhelming=opposite of overwhelming

The DS's touch screen isn't untested.

Kairi January 1st, 2005 11:39 AM

Look back through the thread. Some people who were excited are suddenly finding themselves with not much to enjoy after the long DS wait.

DS’ touch screen has never been used in a major handheld/console before, so sure it is.

Shinin January 1st, 2005 11:43 AM

It's been used in lots of PDA products.

Kairi January 1st, 2005 11:45 AM

PDAs are not primarily gaming systems; they’re designed for handling business.

Shadow January 1st, 2005 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shinin
PSP has PS2 graphics, can play music and play movies.
PS2 has PS2 graphics (obviously >_>), can play music (with CDs) and play movies (with DVDs).

Not much of a difference.

The difference is the format, meaning for the PSP, you have to go back and buy your music, games, and DVDs in a brand new format to be able to play them for about 2 hours on the road. =/ Yup, the PSP is so useful.

pokejungle January 1st, 2005 1:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadow
The difference is the format, meaning for the PSP, you have to go back and buy your music, games, and DVDs in a brand new format to be able to play them for about 2 hours on the road. =/ Yup, the PSP is so useful.

Such is the silliness of the PSP. And people still stick up for it >>;

Lucifer. January 1st, 2005 1:24 PM

Given the choice, I'd never buy a film for the PSP over the DVD version. Ever.

HellishHades January 1st, 2005 1:27 PM

I don't know about the rest of you, but if I want an all-in-one MP3 player, MPEG video / DVD player, and game machine, I'll just stick with the wonderful device that is the laptop. It has a backlit screen, a built-in keyboard, et cetera, et cetera. And if I really want, I can get one that's very small. It's certainly more powerful than the PSP. So why would I want to get one?

There were developers for the N64 that were able to push its limits, and make graphically amazing titles -- and great games. Conker's BFD, anyone? In most cases, developers are lazy. They will often work with the most powerful system, and make ports by decreasing graphics, sounds, and so on from games going to other systems. Instead of finding more efficient ways to work with the unique hardware, they simply remove from the game. The screenshot may look worse on the DS, but that's a reflection of the poor quality of the game developer, not the hardware.

Nintendo has always been devoted to the quality and innovation. The games that we've seen so far on the DS are only the tip of the gaming iceberg. Mario 64 took up the a very small amount of cartridge space, whereas Conker's BFD -- the largest N64 game, took up about eight times as much cartirdge space. Future games will be able to utilise more space, and I'm sure we're bound to see some more Rare -- best developer ever -- gems, like Perfect Dark, before the lifespan of the DS is up.

Carlito-san January 1st, 2005 1:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HellishHades
I don't know about the rest of you, but if I want an all-in-one MP3 player, MPEG video / DVD player, and game machine, I'll just stick with the wonderful device that is the laptop. It has a backlit screen, a built-in keyboard, et cetera, et cetera. And if I really want, I can get one that's very small. It's certainly more powerful than the PSP. So why would I want to get one?

There were developers for the N64 that were able to push its limits, and make graphically amazing titles -- and great games. Conker's BFD, anyone? In most cases, developers are lazy. They will often work with the most powerful system, and make ports by decreasing graphics, sounds, and so on from games going to other systems. Instead of finding more efficient ways to work with the unique hardware, they simply remove from the game. The screenshot may look worse on the DS, but that's a reflection of the poor quality of the game developer, not the hardware.

Nintendo has always been devoted to the quality and innovation. The games that we've seen so far on the DS are only the tip of the gaming iceberg. Mario 64 took up the a very small amount of cartridge space, whereas Conker's BFD -- the largest N64 game, took up about eight times as much cartirdge space. Future games will be able to utilise more space, and I'm sure we're bound to see some more Rare -- best developer ever -- gems, like Perfect Dark, before the lifespan of the DS is up.

Who's side are you on,HH?

Kairi January 1st, 2005 2:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HellishHades
I don't know about the rest of you, but if I want an all-in-one MP3 player, MPEG video / DVD player, and game machine, I'll just stick with the wonderful device that is the laptop. It has a backlit screen, a built-in keyboard, et cetera, et cetera. And if I really want, I can get one that's very small. It's certainly more powerful than the PSP. So why would I want to get one?

There were developers for the N64 that were able to push its limits, and make graphically amazing titles -- and great games. Conker's BFD, anyone? In most cases, developers are lazy. They will often work with the most powerful system, and make ports by decreasing graphics, sounds, and so on from games going to other systems. Instead of finding more efficient ways to work with the unique hardware, they simply remove from the game. The screenshot may look worse on the DS, but that's a reflection of the poor quality of the game developer, not the hardware.

Nintendo has always been devoted to the quality and innovation. The games that we've seen so far on the DS are only the tip of the gaming iceberg. Mario 64 took up the a very small amount of cartridge space, whereas Conker's BFD -- the largest N64 game, took up about eight times as much cartirdge space. Future games will be able to utilise more space, and I'm sure we're bound to see some more Rare -- best developer ever -- gems, like Perfect Dark, before the lifespan of the DS is up.

We might see one Rare game. If you haven’t noticed they have become ridiculously lazy (Kameo~)

Developing for a platform with greater technological prowess isn’t being lazy. Just because you’re making a game on the Xbox as apposed to the PS2 doesn’t mean the graphics will be better, to it’s easier to make them better.

What it does mean is the potential *is* there. So if two developers (or even the same one) put an equal amount of effort into their titles on both systems, it will look better on the technologically superior one. Nintendo, with the DS, is forcing innovation. Telling developers how to make games, by shoving all these new features and screens onto their system. With the N64, there was a lot new to love. But it was built on the solid foundation of learning from the past. The N64 was different, but it didn’t totally disregard its roots.

And as for space that games take up, consider that a selling point for developers. Which system has the most space to work with? The PSP. Although with the PSP you might as well develop for the PS2. Cause the PSP is just the PS2 with the limitations of mobility, and, oh yeah, the “Advantages”

Neither of these two systems have the edge the GBA has in the mobile market. They’re trying to be 3D like the consoles, and showing just why it should stay on the consoles.

Drizzt' Do Urden January 1st, 2005 3:04 PM

I think the DS the best and will probably buy it but i also like the psp and will probably buy that two.

Brittany January 1st, 2005 9:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadow
The difference is the format, meaning for the PSP, you have to go back and buy your music, games, and DVDs in a brand new format to be able to play them for about 2 hours on the road. =/ Yup, the PSP is so useful.

Oh please :P
In most cases, buying music isn't neccesary, because most of us already have it. Did you expect for the PSP to come with music already on it? Geez, the lazyness of peoples these days... Soon you'll try to make the same point on an iPod :P

Games? Buying it does have an advantage over... well, not buying it. I'm not really understanding your point here :P
Were you making the implication of having to re-buy it, if you already have it for PS2? Simple solution- buy it for one of them. They will both have their own advantages, nobody is going to force you to buy them both. Even if you always choose PS2 over PSP, I'm sure that there will be a plethora of PSP-only games. We'll just have to wait and see.

And sorry about the movie thing. Nintendo did it first with GBA. Sony is just doing it better. Longer movies, better sound and picture quality. And you can do it longer than 2 hours. Two or three times longer.
Quote:

Originally Posted by pokejungle
Such is the silliness of the PSP. And people still stick up for it >>;

Saying that I stand up for silliness? :P
Please don't down other's personal preferances. Expressing it is one thing, but... nevermind
Quote:

Originally Posted by Lucifer
Given the choice, I'd never buy a film for the PSP over the DVD version. Ever.

Considering that Sony's plans concerning movies(even their own!) aren't concrete yet, I don't think jumping on this issue is a priority.
But anyway, I would. UMD seems like a next-gen disc to me. I can't really see the purpose of Blu-ray or HD-DVD discs for movies, aside from putting all of LoTR or Star Wars on a single disc. :P
Keep in mind, 1.8 GB is the UMD's size single layered. I'm not sure what their plans are concerning multiple layer discs in the near future, or even if it's possible- but the thought of 3.6 GB seems like plenty of space to me.
I know that you're point wasn't really directed towards future home use, so here's a more on topic, PSP comeback-
UMD movies may be bundled with the DVD, coming in a package with a small price increase. Just speculation, but nobody know's their plans concerning this anyway. Poor comeback, but I can't really argue with you for the most part.

HellishHades January 2nd, 2005 9:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billybob
Who's side are you on,HH?

I own a DS. I'll never get a PSP.

In my eyes,
PSP || PS2 = POS;

If you want a console with power, then go for MS X-Box. If you want innovation and creativity, go for Nintendo. If you want a POS, well just see the above.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Kairi
We might see one Rare game. If you haven’t noticed they have been spending a lot of time making sure that their games are stellar and receive the acknowledgement they deserve.

That's better.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kairi
Developing for a platform with greater technological prowess isn’t being lazy. Just because you’re making a game on the Xbox as apposed to the PS2 doesn’t mean the graphics will be better, to it’s easier to make them better.

Gameplay > graphics;
Efficiency > laziness && monotiny;
DS > PSP;

QED;

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kairi
What it does mean is the potential *is* there. So if two developers (or even the same one) put an equal amount of effort into their titles on both systems, it will look better on the technologically superior one. Nintendo, with the DS, is forcing innovation. Telling developers how to make games, by shoving all these new features and screens onto their system. With the N64, there was a lot new to love. But it was built on the solid foundation of learning from the past. The N64 was different, but it didn’t totally disregard its roots.

And as for space that games take up, consider that a selling point for developers. Which system has the most space to work with? The PSP. Although with the PSP you might as well develop for the PS2. Cause the PSP is just the PS2 with the limitations of mobility, and, oh yeah, the “Advantages”

Neither of these two systems have the edge the GBA has in the mobile market. They’re trying to be 3D like the consoles, and showing just why it should stay on the consoles.

The only qualm I have about the DS is the lack of an analog stick. There are ways to make them so they can be embedded in the device so that they don't stick up so much. In fact, they can be shaped like a ball with ridges, and still work as well. Otherwise, it's a perfectly sound device.

The games being ported to the PSP can be pirated from the Internet and played on a laptop with better quality. What's the point of a PSP?

The president of Nintendo said that this is now the age where hardware speeds are not the contributing factor of success. Quality and innovation are key. I couldn't agree more. Nintendo is by no means "forcing" innovation. It is providing it as an option. If some developers want, they can simply put a run-of-the-mill map on the touch screen. But they also have the potenial for great things, new things, innovation.

Brittany January 2nd, 2005 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HellishHades
I own a DS. I'll never get a PSP.

In my eyes,
PSP || PS2 = POS;

Please don't flame the devices.

Quote:

Originally Posted by HH
If you want a console with power, then go for MS X-Box. If you want innovation and creativity, go for Nintendo. If you want a POS, well just see the above.

Again, please don't flame a device. And don't tell people what to do either. I'll go for what I want, just as most other gamers, and developers for that matter- Sony.

Quote:

Originally Posted by HH
Gameplay > graphics;
Efficiency > laziness && monotiny;
DS > PSP;

Disagreed.
I think PSP has better gameplay, graphics, efficiency, and lacks laziness and monotiny. We all have different opinions- just don't force your's upon the rest of us


Quote:

Originally Posted by HH
The games being ported to the PSP can be pirated from the Internet and played on a laptop with better quality. What's the point of a PSP?

Most definetly DISAGREED. Gameboy games have been emulated since their arrival, and pretty easily. Roms are found EVERYWHERE. DS emulators are already in-progress/running. The only PSP emulator was released by Sony, for developing purposes- running at about 1/16 the speed of a PSP with less quality.

Quote:

Originally Posted by HH
The president of Nintendo said that this is now the age where hardware speeds are not the contributing factor of success. Quality and innovation are key. I couldn't agree more. Nintendo is by no means "forcing" innovation. It is providing it as an option. If some developers want, they can simply put a run-of-the-mill map on the touch screen. But they also have the potenial for great things, new things, innovation.

Sure, the option is there. But do most gamers care about that option? I don't.

Dawson January 2nd, 2005 10:10 AM

I'm not sure how people can call the DS dated technology. It may be dated compared to console technology but the GBA was seen as a massive step forward in handheld gaming with it's 32 bit capabilities, the DS is just advancing on that, just like the home consoles they went from 8bit>16bit>32bit>64bit. Sony produced the PSP without the knowledge that Nintendo has of the handheld market. They made a system with only a few hours battery life and are pushing games that require a lot of time to put in to playing. I think the DS will win the handheld. I'm not saying that the PSP is a poor console, it's just about 5 years ahead of it's time. However, after saying that, Nintendo rushed the release of the DS so that it could have the extra few months of shelf activity over the PSP and now they find themselves with a console and now big games on the shelves for people to play, just like they did with the GameCube. And a final note about the GBA. The GBA still had a minimum of 2 years life left in it. Nintendo has completely screwed all of the GBA owners with the new console, even though they were perfectly happy with the quality of the system they currently had.

Kairi January 2nd, 2005 11:04 AM


@HH
Quote:

That's better.
They’ve made one game in the many years they’ve been with the Xbox. And most will agree Grabbed by the Ghoulies isn’t up to snuff with their old titles. They’re just lazy. Some of the best games of our time were made under much tighter time restraints.
Quote:

Gameplay > graphics;
Efficiency > laziness && monotiny;
DS > PSP;

QED;
Presentation is an equal part of it. You could have good ‘gameplay’ code, but if you then make the entire screen giant yucky pixels, fact of life is no one will play it. In this world we live in, people expect a standard. Does that mean all games have to have good graphics? No. Does it mean that developers are forced to make their games be presented poorer on inferior hardware? Yes.
Quote:

The games being ported to the PSP can be pirated from the Internet and played on a laptop with better quality. What's the point of a PSP?
I agree with the fact it adds nothing new. The PSP is pointless in the fact it offers nothing new, except a PS2 with the limitations of portability. 3D has had numerous plagues when trying to be made portable. This was Sony’s mistake. Nintendo had a monopoly on 2D games in handhelds. But I guess they didn’t see that, cause they had to go and make a low quality hardware device, with some new innovations. But the fact is their biggest edge was offering unique games because of the style of graphics. The GBA doesn’t need a touch screen or dual screens, no it’s pretty close to perfect as it is. Note that all the DS innovations aren't necessarily going to "offer something new" either. None of the devices on their own are new, and none are known if they can work together to enhance software.
The PSP, however, as the DS, will draw people because of some of the names behind it (FFVII anyone? *rest of the world goes YESPLZ*) Not all PSP games are ports.
Quote:

The president of Nintendo said that this is now the age where hardware speeds are not the contributing factor of success. Quality and innovation are key. I couldn't agree more. Nintendo is by no means "forcing" innovation. It is providing it as an option. If some developers want, they can simply put a run-of-the-mill map on the touch screen. But they also have the potenial for great things, new things, innovation.
Nintendo is forcing it. By putting so many new features into the hardware, developers are pressured to at least use one. And when you build games around a “feature”, they usually don’t do well. But when you build games that actually could benefit, not need, but benefit from one, then you have something. But it doesn’t have to be a peripheral or a touch screen or a mic. It doesn’t have to be a hardware innovation. So maybe the potential is there, but these extra devices are being marketed so heavily, games are coming out that are nothing more than "games" built around them. That's bad. I guess they have to market it that way though, because they sure don't have the graphics/storage of the 3D consoles its trying to be have.

What Nintendo and Sony should do is give as much freedom for developers to work with on their next gen consoles. This means giving the option for good graphics (because, despite how some people believe graphics are inversely proportional to gameplay, a lot of people like them. The majority decides.) giving plenty of storage space, and making the console a solid platform with features we know from experience work. Such as online play.


@Brittany:

IMO he wasn’t flaming. It’s his opinion, and in debates, you’ve got to try and accept it, argue the logic, and so on.

Ho does the PSP have better “gameplay”? The games decide that, not the hardware. Not good graphics, not dual screens. The games.

I think he means the PSP has no games on its own; that they’re all PC game ports. Which isn’t true

@Pheonix:

Please read the thread about when 3D is NOT greater than 2D, just different. You don’t “step up” from 2D.

Brittany January 2nd, 2005 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kairi
@Brittany:

IMO he wasn’t flaming. It’s his opinion, and in debates, you’ve got to try and accept it, argue the logic, and so on.

Agreed, I still prefer that he not refer to it as a 'POS' though. Many other, less rude, options to take, but I guess you're still right.


On topic- I've returned my DS two times now(my uncle is so persistant), but this time with better reasoning(mostly just to not hurt his feelings :P). I think I'll be getting the DS when it gets released in Black(onyx, jetblack, whatever black they use xD)

Kairi January 2nd, 2005 11:36 AM

He did say from his POV. What that says about his POV is up for you to decide and judge, based off the statement.

Debating is fun. ^_^

Shinin January 2nd, 2005 12:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kairi
Debating is fun. ^_^

I don't agree. LOL.

HellishHades January 3rd, 2005 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kairi
Presentation is an equal part of it. You could have good ‘gameplay’ code, but if you then make the entire screen giant yucky pixels, fact of life is no one will play it. In this world we live in, people expect a standard. Does that mean all games have to have good graphics? No. Does it mean that developers are forced to make their games be presented poorer on inferior hardware? Yes.

No game now simply has simply "giant yucky pixels". It a matter of how complex the polygons can get.



Quote:

Originally Posted by Kairi
Nintendo is forcing it. By putting so many new features into the hardware, developers are pressured to at least use one. And when you build games around a “feature”, they usually don’t do well. But when you build games that actually could benefit, not need, but benefit from one, then you have something. But it doesn’t have to be a peripheral or a touch screen or a mic. It doesn’t have to be a hardware innovation. So maybe the potential is there, but these extra devices are being marketed so heavily, games are coming out that are nothing more than "games" built around them. That's bad. I guess they have to market it that way though, because they sure don't have the graphics/storage of the 3D consoles its trying to be have.

That's already answered with a previous quote.
Quote:

Originally Posted by HellishHades
The president of Nintendo said that this is now the age where hardware speeds are not the contributing factor of success. Quality and innovation are key. I couldn't agree more. Nintendo is by no means "forcing" innovation. It is providing it as an option. If some developers want, they can simply put a run-of-the-mill map on the touch screen. But they also have the potenial for great things, new things, innovation.



Quote:

Originally Posted by Kairi
PSP is pointless in the fact it offers nothing new, except a PS2 with the limitations of portability. 3D has had numerous plagues when trying to be made portable. This was Sony’s mistake.

...

I think he means the PSP has no games on its own; that they’re all PC game ports. Which isn’t true

I'll take my FPSes on the PC rather than some tiny box that has horrid controls. D-pads are either be too slow or too inaccurate, since every button press value is fixed, rather than having a variable joystick.

Adding more innovation into the mix isn't a negative thing. It's better to have more options than to simply make a rehash system of a console. If a piece of technology wasn't found to be useful, then it will be removed in the next Nintendo portable system.

Quote:

He did say from his POV. What that says about his POV is up for you to decide and judge, based off the statement.

Debating is fun. ^_^
My POV still say says the PSP is a POS (lots of acronyms there). The DS may be a step down from the PSP in terms of power, but the PSP is just a downgraded laptop. There are many less rude ways to refer to the PSP, but they don't hold the same truth to the system nor does it continue the nice acronym repetition.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Kairi
Presentation is an equal part of it. You could have good ‘gameplay’ code, but if you then make the entire screen giant yucky pixels, fact of life is no one will play it. In this world we live in, people expect a standard. Does that mean all games have to have good graphics? No. Does it mean that developers are forced to make their games be presented poorer on inferior hardware? Yes.

It's interesting how you enjoy debating, yet you answer your own rhetorical questions.

Aren't rhetorical questions used to force your answer of a question onto the opposing point of view?

Kairi January 3rd, 2005 2:50 PM


Quote:

No game now simply has simply "giant yucky pixels". It a matter of how complex the polygons can get.
This is part of debating you don’t seem to get. It’s an over exaggerated statement to show how graphics do matter to a large portion of gamers out there.
Quote:

That's already answered with a previous quote.
However there are so many devices, the developers are looking at the “innovations”, then trying to make games to fit around them. Not approaching the DS with their games, and finding they can improve them on the DS because it has these things. Most of the games out there for the DS now are just novelties designed to show off the features. I get what you’re saying, that it offers innovation. But so so much, and most untested, developers feel pressured not to use it as they need it, but to work it in any way they can. Look at the game out now, almost all of them follow this.

Quote:

I'll take my FPSes on the PC rather than some tiny box that has horrid controls. D-pads are either be too slow or too inaccurate, since every button press value is fixed, rather than having a variable joystick.


Adding more innovation into the mix isn't a negative thing. It's better to have more options than to simply make a rehash system of a console. If a piece of technology wasn't found to be useful, then it will be removed in the next Nintendo portable system.
You seem to think I’m marketing for the PSP. I’m not. I think all 3D needs to stay off handhelds, because, yeah, it works better on consoles. I prefer those games on a TV/PC screen, and a touch screen isn’t going to cover that up. Nintendo is just as much to blame for rehashing old technology, then covering it up with some clever ideas. Even if they work, the meat of the console is still stale. At least the PSP is using modern technology. The DS isn’t, and again, it’s using these devices to cover it up. But both don’t belong in the handheld market.
Quote:

My POV still say says the PSP is a POS (lots of acronyms there). The DS may be a step down from the PSP in terms of power, but the PSP is just a downgraded laptop. There are many less rude ways to refer to the PSP, but they don't hold the same truth to the system nor does it continue the nice acronym repetition.
The DS is just a downgraded console with a few peripherals if you want to put it like that. The GCN is just a less powerful Xbox. But there’s more to it than that.

And there is no truth in what either of us are saying, except when we link to statistics. Because the PSP being a POS is your opinion. Me thinking they’re both a waste is my opinion. I’m not trying to pass it off as fact. I thought you were criticizing my debating style?

Quote:

It's interesting how you enjoy debating, yet you answer your own rhetorical questions.

Aren't rhetorical questions used to force your answer of a question onto the opposing point of view?
I was showing you how games will be presented poorer on inferior hardware, no matter how hard the developers work. I don’t see your point?

WolfWood January 3rd, 2005 2:54 PM

Meh neither handheld empresses me I wish they would of stayed with the SP.

HellishHades January 4th, 2005 8:44 AM

Quote:

This is part of debating you don’t seem to get. It’s an over exaggerated statement to show how graphics do matter to a large portion of gamers out there.
This is part of debating you don’t seem to get. It's a means by which your rhetoric can be disregarded/belittled.


“This has huge potential. It's very nice that we can create games using DS that were not possible before.”
-- Yoichi Haraguchi, Vie President of Namco

“When Nintendo came down and presented the DS platform to us, … I think everyone was in shock. It was amazing. … Our technical and central technology guys were kind of drooling at the abilities and wanting so much to program and dive into programming for the system. … Nintendo DS, I believe, is a revolution in change for hand-held gaming.”
-- Will Kassoy, vice president, global brand management, Activision

“The Nintendo dual screen is something that we’re really excited about developing for. It’s very innovative, which is classic Nintendo.”
-- Nick Earl, vice president and general manager, Electronic Arts

“The fact that touch panels can be associated with many terms about touching that we never had, such as touch, push, feel, rub, slide and pat is wonderful. … I have been working in this industry for 20 years. During that time I made many games. But I think this is the first time that we have a new input device.”
-- Yuji Naka, senior corporate officer, development division, Sega

Nintendo DS is “a new game machine that will build the future of the game industry. … Our frontier spirit has been awoken.”
-- Tsunekazu Ishihara, chairman and CEO, Pokémon

“Nintendo DS is going to push the hand-held technology to really uncharted territories. By that I mean that it’s going to bring amazing new game mechanics, new game design.”
-- Yves Blehaut, senior vice president, Atari

“I think the DS will stimulate the process of game development.”
-- Tomofumi Gotsubo, president and CEO, Konami of America

You said that developers didn't like the added peripherals? Few games are out now. You can't expect that a system's features will be fully taken advantage of at the onset of the system's life.

Pressure seems to be nonexistant with developers regarding the DS. Indeed, there is a great sense of enthusiasm and renewed creativity. Where was your point going?

Kairi January 5th, 2005 5:35 PM

As soon as I get well I’ve more points to make, although perhaps the pressure isn’t as bad as I’d feared. But yeah, just letting you know I’m still in this. ^_~

Brittany January 5th, 2005 8:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HellishHades
This is part of debating you don’t seem to get. It's a means by which your rhetoric can be disregarded/belittled.


“This has huge potential. It's very nice that we can create games using DS that were not possible before.”
-- Yoichi Haraguchi, Vie President of Namco

“When Nintendo came down and presented the DS platform to us, … I think everyone was in shock. It was amazing. … Our technical and central technology guys were kind of drooling at the abilities and wanting so much to program and dive into programming for the system. … Nintendo DS, I believe, is a revolution in change for hand-held gaming.”
-- Will Kassoy, vice president, global brand management, Activision

“The Nintendo dual screen is something that we’re really excited about developing for. It’s very innovative, which is classic Nintendo.”
-- Nick Earl, vice president and general manager, Electronic Arts

“The fact that touch panels can be associated with many terms about touching that we never had, such as touch, push, feel, rub, slide and pat is wonderful. … I have been working in this industry for 20 years. During that time I made many games. But I think this is the first time that we have a new input device.”
-- Yuji Naka, senior corporate officer, development division, Sega

Nintendo DS is “a new game machine that will build the future of the game industry. … Our frontier spirit has been awoken.”
-- Tsunekazu Ishihara, chairman and CEO, Pokémon

“Nintendo DS is going to push the hand-held technology to really uncharted territories. By that I mean that it’s going to bring amazing new game mechanics, new game design.”
-- Yves Blehaut, senior vice president, Atari

“I think the DS will stimulate the process of game development.”
-- Tomofumi Gotsubo, president and CEO, Konami of America

You said that developers didn't like the added peripherals? Few games are out now. You can't expect that a system's features will be fully taken advantage of at the onset of the system's life.

Pressure seems to be nonexistant with developers regarding the DS. Indeed, there is a great sense of enthusiasm and renewed creativity. Where was your point going?

What developers say and what they do are two totally different things. Developing games with all of these special features might sound like a fun idea, but their finished product is yet to be experianced.

Like I said many times before, waiting is probably the best option to take, considering that zilch is really known about these products game-wise. =/

John Denver January 6th, 2005 8:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brittany
What developers say and what they do are two totally different things. Developing games with all of these special features might sound like a fun idea, but their finished product is yet to be experianced.

That's not always the case...heck, Namco expected Tales of Symphonia to flop, and it sold wonderfully...

What I can say is, usually what the deveolpers say is true, but there are the rare occasions where the two are totally different things, which is what your saying.

Brittany January 6th, 2005 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dakota
That's not always the case...heck, Namco expected Tales of Symphonia to flop, and it sold wonderfully...

What I can say is, usually what the deveolpers say is true, but there are the rare occasions where the two are totally different things, which is what your saying.

*developers
*you're
:P

Anyway, what I'm saying is, assuming the best for a product, when we have almost nothing to base it on, isn't a particularly smart move. Of course, you may be right, but it's still a risky move in my opinion. Of course, developers will love it's novelty design and features, but saying that it is easy or even feasable may be words that we shouldn't put into developer's mouths. Utilizing those features may compromise classic gameplay. Why?
-Cartridge space is low.
-Hardware's performance is behind the times- finding balance(more of a compromise IMO) between gameplay and features always has to be met to make the game run smoothy.
-Usage to appeal to gamer's interests

Sacraficing what we already have, to get new 'features' is a dilemma developers will have to face sooner or later.

HellishHades January 6th, 2005 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brittany
What developers say and what they do are two totally different things. Developing games with all of these special features might sound like a fun idea, but their finished product is yet to be experianced.

Like I said many times before, waiting is probably the best option to take, considering that zilch is really known about these products game-wise. =/

* experienced

If a developer says that they will be able to do many things with a system and they continue to develop for a system, that developer hasn't any pressures regarding "forced innovation". That's all I was trying to say.

The new features on the DS will allow games to be made and played in different ways, unlike the PSP. The PSP's name says it all. It's just a portable Playstation 2. The games for the PS2 have already been done. The genres available and hardware limitations have been established, and if anything, a portable version of the PS2 will have more limits than the actual PS2 (i.e. Where's the analogue stick?). In effect, there will likely be more rehash than anything else. That's Sony's problem with their portable device.

Brittany January 6th, 2005 1:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HellishHades
* experienced

If a developer says that they will be able to do many things with a system and they continue to develop for a system, that developer hasn't any pressures regarding "forced innovation". That's all I was trying to say.

The new features on the DS will allow games to be made and played in different ways, unlike the PSP. The PSP's name says it all. It's just a portable Playstation 2. The games for the PS2 have already been done. The genres available and hardware limitations have been established, and if anything, a portable version of the PS2 will have more limits than the actual PS2 (i.e. Where's the analogue stick?). In effect, there will likely be more rehash than anything else. That's Sony's problem with their portable device.

Sorry for the misunderstanding then, but I still brought up another point.

PSP isn't just going to be a portable PS2. It will have it's share of PSP-only games- especially when PS3 gets released. I don't think PSP will come any close to the graphics possible with PS3 and it's Cell. Considering that PS2 could perform PS1's FMV graphics as gameplay graphics, I expect the future to follow in a similar fashion. *dreams of CG cinemas being performed in real time*


Oh yes PSP does have it's analogue stick, you may have not noticed it. :\

HellishHades January 6th, 2005 1:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brittany
Sorry for the misunderstanding then, but I still brought up another point.

PSP isn't just going to be a portable PS2. It will have it's share of PSP-only games- especially when PS3 gets released. I don't think PSP will come any close to the graphics possible with PS3 and it's Cell. Considering that PS2 could perform PS1's FMV graphics as gameplay graphics, I expect the future to follow in a similar fashion. *dreams of CG cinemas being performed in real time*


Oh yes PSP does have it's analogue stick, you may have not noticed it. :\

It's pretty flat for an analogue stick. I don't know that you could call it one. It's more like a really multidirectional control pad.

Brittany January 6th, 2005 5:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HellishHades
It's pretty flat for an analogue stick. I don't know that you could call it one. It's more like a really multidirectional control pad.

Well, it works well. A tiny bit getting used to, but it works nicely nevertheless.

Sadly I don't own a PSP for myself yet though, I was at my uncle's house. :(

Carlito-san January 6th, 2005 5:55 PM

It is a Analog nub,not a stick of any sort.

Shinin January 6th, 2005 6:04 PM

It's an analog disc, not stick or nub.

Brittany January 6th, 2005 6:41 PM

Call it what you want, but it serves it's purpose, and it works nicely. I wouldn't want a stick poking out of my pocket anyway.

HellishHades January 7th, 2005 11:56 AM

http://www.joy-stick.net/images/gopad.jpg

Sony and Nintendo should be using the analogue device (on the left) on the above PC controller. It works as well as a conventional stick and it is no more high than buttons. I have a controller like this, and the control is nice.

dezmond January 10th, 2005 8:32 AM

I choose for PSP,

Simply because I really liked the playstation far more then the n64.
And it will be probably the same for PSP and DS.

The Playstation had,
Better graphics
Better games, it had much more games and also longer games. (the good RPG's for example)
Better controlller
Discs >>>>>>>> Carts

And the idea of the touch screen, is pretty useless. It is really difficult to control, it takes for ever to get used to it.

And the very kiddy games on the DS are one reason I won't buy it.
If I would be younger (like 10) I might have bought one.

Kairi January 10th, 2005 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HellishHades
http://www.joy-stick.net/images/gopad.jpg

Sony and Nintendo should be using the analogue device (on the left) on the above PC controller. It works as well as a conventional stick and it is no more high than buttons. I have a controller like this, and the control is nice.

Not an official post here, but quote for emphasis. D-pad only is just stupid with 3D games, for both handhelds.

HellishHades January 10th, 2005 12:48 PM

A game can be programmed to interpret an analogue stick like a D-pad, but the controls on the converse just stink. Mario 64 was easier to play than Mario 64 DS.

Kairi January 10th, 2005 12:55 PM

That’s a point I made way back, somewhere in here. Kinda disappointing, cause frustrating controls can often cover up a good game. That’s why they should stick with 2D or games that actually use the stylus, like Warioware. >P

loony January 10th, 2005 1:14 PM

i go for the ds^__^and i dont know if its told here yet the psp has a cooling problem o.0; its get overheated after a little time>_<


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