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Homosexuality
Born that way or is it a choice?
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I don't know if you're born gay, but I think once you recognize your sexuality it's hard to change.
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Born that way for sure. Its scientifically proven. I dont want to start a fight but it does tend to bother me when people think its a choice :(
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I was born this way. I didn't choose to be homosexual.
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I've never met a kid who was gay until after the age of like, 10. Not too sure about that one though
inb4flamewar, I think it's mainly choice and what happened in your life. I'm not exactly sure how someone is born gay, since well you know you weren't born that way, although I'm not about to say it's a disease. So, choice. EDIT: Okay I'm not too sure anymore, since apparently sexual attraction begins in the brain, so I guess someone could be born gay. Look the matter confuses me even more so than religion, so don't go bashing me. |
Born that way. Sexual orientation is mentally hardwired into your brain at birth, as such, and the reason people don't identify as gay and such until after 10 - 12 years of age is the simple reason that the hormones that fuel sexual drive aren't in the body until puberty, which doesn't happen till about 10 or 11.
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So yeah, it's in your DNA in my opinion. I don't have studies and stuff to throw at people that disagree, but I personally think it's a dense to think that people who go through a lot of pain, bullying, abuse, and heartache from being gay made that choice themselves. |
In my opinion it's a mental disorder at birth, but I can't be sure about that since I never really do research on it. Either way, being homosexual is not right, there's definitely something wrong there.
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Born that way. You can't really choose to be homosexual xD;;
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Atomico, really? Like really?
Being gay is not a choice whatsoever. |
Well being gay means you have a sexual preference other than the natural one, so in sense yes, it is a disease. Yeah, there is something wrong with the idea of being gay.
Doesn't mean it's wrong, right or whatever hell the third option is. (wait a minute, that doesn't make sense...) And yeah people don't have a choice anymore, which is kinda unfair if you ask me. People accept Autism, but they won't accept gays. What the hell? |
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Well it's not really a opinion, it's kinda like saying all Autistics choose to be that way, which is utter *******.
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You get born with it. There's no way anybody would be able to choose their sexuality. There's nothing wrong with being gay, either. They're normal people, just have different tastes, is all.
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I'm on the right track baby, I was born this way! ;P
Well, actually I'm a pan-romantic demisexual who happens to be in a homosexual relationship. I think the best way to describe my sexual orientation is just not giving much of a damn..XD |
For people saying you don't know until later than like age 10 that you're gay.....well duh. most boys and girls won't go near each other because of cooties until then anyway, so how is one to know that early?
and for those who think it's a choice: explain to me when you chose to be straight. people are born with their sexual orientation but obviously you're not sure of what you want until the hormones start kickin' in. |
I believe you're born that way, seeing has kids don't really know their sexuality, like some other users stated.
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Excuse me, but what year is this again? This isn't an opinion - this is just bigotry. "Born this way"? A phrase that has been monopolized and profited from. Sickening, really. (And not in a good way) I was born gay. There were instances of it in my childhood that were uninfluenced by anything - I had no idea what 'gay' was until I was around 10 or 11. When I was in kindergarten, during the game of 'house' (where you had the husband, wife, kids, pets, whatever and you all lived together and whatever)..I had a husband. When my teachers called me out on this (I went to a private school), I was ever so confused. It most certainly is not a disorder. |
I couldn't call having any sexuality a choice, but nor that everyone is born that way.
Rather, I suppose that our (generally early) life experiences are what decides the matter. Quote:
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I believe that the majority of people have genetically predetermined sexual orientations (whatever they may be), but I don't discount the possibility that a handful of the population can have some level of choice in the matter.
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Well i'm gay and to be honest i don't really know if i was born this was, i know for sure its not a choice but i didn't exactly have the most perfect childhood so you could say the problems back then had something to do with it. but then again i don't really remember most of it so i could've been gay before all of it. i don't know.
To me though i like to think i was born this was as it makes more sense to say its hormones and whatnot that cause me to be attracted to the same sex. Quote:
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Also, making this public: http://screensnapr.com/-/uploads/NHk4nW.png |
Why would anyone choose to be gay? To go through any suffering, mentally and/or physically? Who would choose this path, especially after seeing and hearing the horror stories? I believe you're either born that way or the other way(s). It's most certainly not a disorder, and it's no one's fault. It's just how things are gonna be. Nothing you can do or say.
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You were born that way. The only thing you have a choice over is if you accept it or not, which is why I think that some people get the misconception that being gay is a choice. I think people who believe being gay is a choice are fools. That's like saying that you can choose who you're attracted to, which is silly. You don't just go into a room, and say "I want to be attracted to that person over there!" and then suddenly you're attracted to them.
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Definitely born. I agree with ^. You can't choose just to be gay, straight, or bisexual. I know, for a fact that I am bisexual.
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I think it's a choice due to your surroundings
:t354:TG |
Patchy beat me to it... and put it far more eloquently than I ever could. Who you're attracted to isn't a choice in the slightest, what is a choice is whether you choose to deny such feelings or accept them. You don't choose to be homosexual or bisexual (my personal favourite ;P) in the same way you don't choose to be straight or tall.
Having said that, I wish to avoid the term "Born This Way" at any cost. Quote:
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It's interesting to me the number of people who think sexual orientation is genetic. I honestly think that it varies from case to case. There is no one answer, just like most things in life.
I believe that for certain people, such events have happened in their lives that cause sexual orientation to be a choice. And I prefer to think of it as a choice, myself. Everyone makes such a big deal out of sexual orientation, probably because everyone makes a huge deal out of romance itself. But who says you have to be attracted to one specific gender all your life? If there weren't such taboos and prejudices linked to homosexuality, if it was as much an accepted part of our lives as doing the groceries once a week, I am convinced that many more people would be open to the idea of relations with those of the same sex, and would routinely switch between the two genders, just for kicks. Essentially, if it were not tabooed, a large sum of the population would be bisexual. And then you'd always have a small percentage that obviously don't follow the trends and stick to a specific gender for whatever reason. I prefer to think of it like this: All your life, have you liked one single colour only? Has one colour been your favourite colour since you can remember? Some of you, sure, maybe, and cool for you. But not me, and I'm willing to bet not most of you either. Why did that change? Red used to be your favourite colour, but now it's second-best to green. You can't explain it, you just prefer the shade, you like what it reminds you of, how it makes you feel. Liking a colour, liking anything, is an attraction. Now you see where I'm going with this. Sexual orientation is an attraction and it can change. Not overnight, definitely not, but it can change. And the only reason why it can change is because everyone assumes their child is straight from birth. However, there are always and always will be cases that disprove my view. You can all promote the notion that sexual orientation is genetic, and I won't disagree (completely) because I used to think that way too. But I've thought about it and this is the conclusion I've come to. tl;dr it's a choice. |
Born that way.
Never understood why some people think it's a choice, because why would some people choose something that causes pain, and drives some people to suicide? >_> I mean, really. |
Neither.
Any person is simply the culmination of all of the events they've experienced in their life. Even their sexuality is shaped by people/things around them as they grow up. |
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It's not a choice. Who would choose to be hated and discriminated against? |
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I have never liked a girl in a romantic way. Your color analogy does not work. At all. Color and who you love aren't the same thing. |
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I'm disgusted :< But... To each his own :D I know for sure, no queer person can say that it's a choice. When does one choose to be straight? Or is the world even ready to accept it as a choice? There are still people like "Atomico" who just find it hard to accept homosexuality. You're born gay, definitely. I know for sure; my childhood was spent fighting bullies who called me a "weirdo", "gay", "sissy" or a girl. If I wasn't always gay (bisexual actually) then... |
I don't think you can just pick and choose things like that. And if you find yourself flip-flopping back and forth anyway I'd think you were bisexual or some other terminology that I probably am not familiar with. :x So yeah, I'm pretty sure you figure out your preferences rather than making a direct decision. You could say that's "being born with it" but at the same time I don't really believe that anything is predetermined - you just come into it on your own, I think.
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Good for you, maybe you're part of the exception. You're really not giving me enough to work with here to actually make a valid argument. My colour analogy works just fine. Colour and who you love are the exact same thing when you break it down to what it is, and for that, I redirect you back to my original post. Quote:
Be disgusted. I really could not give less of a crap. You're taking my argument way too seriously, as if I'm a homophobe of some sort. Just because I think it's a choice does not mean I'm against homosexuals and believe that certain homosexuals can just up and change their sexual preferences. Not at all what I said. What I find hilarious is that I give an actual, detailed response of why I think it's a choice, and all you can come back with is "You're born gay, definitely." oh, damn I'm convinced. You're right I'm wrong. Yeah and my childhood was spent playing Pokemon. Now I'm on a Pokemon forum. I really don't see your point. Just because someone treats you as something doesn't mean you are that thing. Grow a pair, seriously. |
i don't think it's a genetic condition, and i agree with some of (edit: all of, since i've seen his most recent post) what penatrait has to say. i see sexuality as more of a personal fetish than an encoded orientation, and i think the ideas that people are attracted to either one or the other and gender will define your love life are products of social upbringing. i don't think it's the type of attraction that can be easily altered but it differs from person to person, depending on their perspective and their romantic feelings for another. i've seen generally straight people develop attraction to people of their own gender (usually men in the locker room), sometimes because of romantic feelings. in this topic, people tend to exchange love and attraction as if they mean the same thing, but emotional attachment has more bearing on a meaningful, romantic relationship than physical attraction. like, i wouldn't pass a good romantic fling with a woman because i'm generally attracted to masculinity. i feel like i didn't really organize my thoughts well here but ah, i'm done typing
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I'd like to think it is arguably genetic, hence 'born this way', but that would contradict a particular experience my brother had with homosexuality, so my final verdict would be that I seriously have no idea and cannot really fathom it.
The two posters above me make a valid point, though. |
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But in general I agree with you. Sort of. I think that orientation comes out (haha) in several ways and that no single one factor is solely responsible for everyone's orientation. I do think genetics play a big role though. I'm still open to the idea that people can 'choose' how they are attracted to people though I wouldn't want to use the word 'choose' since it implies it's a conscious decision. I don't think it is. If anything I'd say there is an element of association (in which case the color analogy is somewhat applicable) where something that is pleasing to a person get associated with a particular sex, or sexes. I suppose you could equate that to a fetish, but again I don't want to use that word because it carries a lot of baggage, though I personally don't have a problem with non-violent, consensual fetishes. In general I'd think that all sexuality is some mishmash of genetics and environment. The only problem I'm having is why so many people end up becoming straight. I know we're a heteronormative society so there's the constant reinforcement of a female/male dichotomy, but that's so abstract that I have trouble seeing how it would affect someone's, er, mojo libido. I can only feel like there's a strong genetic factor which causes the majority of people to have a default "straight" orientation. |
I agree with lil Penatrait to some extent, after talking on MSN about this. Speaking of that, use some of those examples you used when talking to me. But anyway, I'm a bit in the middle. I think, in certain situations, it is a choice, but more often than not, then no, I don't think it's of that person's choosing. But you know, I don't think there's one definite answer to this tbh. But that makes it all the more fun to discuss, I reckon.
Edit: I don't wanna post again, but I just wanna say I agree fully with Klippy down below me here. |
I personally feel it's just part of who you are. It's not who you are, but it's part of what makes you, you. And whether it be how you're born or a choice that you date men or women, if you're happy with who you are, then that's all that matters in the world.
A family member of mine is gay and has been since a very young age. He didn't know he was, and was nearly engaged to a woman at one point. So do I think he chose to be gay? No, though I don't know whether it was because he realized he was or whether he was dating women to cover it up. Still. It makes me love him no less because of it, and that goes in regards to any relationship, whether friends or family. They're the same person they always were and always will be, but one trait has changed in the many that they have. If someone else thinks it's a choice, then accept that and move on. It doesn't really affect your life by what they think, so why get up in arms about someone voicing their opinion in an opinion-orientated forum? If you don't like seeing other people post what they think, then go find somewhere else to frequent, because this obviously is a poor choice for you to be browsing in. |
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Teenage relationships aren't even serious. I'm disgusted because you implied that all relationships are throw-away non-serious ones. Not being a choice part is my opinion. I'm not dissing out anybody else's opinion. But I'm gonna say something if I don't think your reasons are correct, or at least if they don't make any sense to me. |
Neither.
I believe one's orientation is a result of their lifetime's worth of experiences, coming together in a very messy equation chock full of way too many variables to form orientations. While theoretically it can change, it is not as simple as a choice and requires quite a lot more work than simply choosing to actively pursue. Even then, the equation is so full of variables that all you can do even if you want to is guesswork, so it may simply never work even if one tried hard. In short, orientation is a complex, virtually unpredictable (but not technically truly impossible) thing that can potentially be associated with a wide variety of causes, and can also be directly influenced, though how an event influences one is in fact subjective, meaning there is no universal way to effect someone's orientation, though humans vary little enough that a pattern could potentially be made, though it would very easily be destroyed between cultures and through time. Y'know, I wonder if someone has already created and studied a theory like this. That'd be an interesting read. On the off chance nobody has, perhaps one day I will be the one to do so. |
You are born gay/bi/whatever. The same way anyone is born straight. You can't decide what turns you on, and get's the hormones flowing. It's just how your body reacts, and it's the same as how someone might like spicy food over sweet. You can't choose that, you just like that type of food.
BUT, you CAN choose to be in a homosexual lifestyle, but be straight. You could be straight and kiss boys and touch their manly parts. But that doesn't make you gay. Doing does not equate desire. I don't choose to be gay anymore than anyone else chooses to be straight. Let's put it this way: I see a naked dude, my pants get a little tighter. I see a naked chick, nothing happens. I don't believe I choose when to get my erections. |
To a certain extent, it is by birth. I have gay friends who have told me they've never been attracted to someone of the opposite sex. They had no idea why, that's just how it was. It wasn't something they could explain, so I don't really take anyone (who is critical of homosexuality) who claims to understand seriously :/
But then again, for others, it's a choice. Poop happens, people go through things. Things that give people the opportunity to ~make a choice~. I won't go too far into my opinion, the last thing I want is a debate. I guess the bottom line of what I'm trying to say is EVERYONE IS DIFFERENT, DEAL WITH IT LUL. |
People have points with that "why would you chose to be discriminated against" point. It's more accepted now so people can chose it but I think it's more of a fashion mentality. Oh I think this once, it's what I am. You can chose what to be in life.
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Lol at how much provocations this thread made.
Anyway, it's not at birth or anything. It's an acquired trait. Atomic guy btw next time you attempt to troll homosexuals try not to come with a religious reason. (I once trolled a religious forum and most of the responses said it's some mental illness.. hahahahahahaha, the irony. I even went to a friendly neighborhood gay forum and made a giant flamewar haha) |
I think it's more a choice than present at birth. Imo your sexuality is a product of life experiences rather than genetics. I find it hard to believe that there is such a thing as a "gay gene" since to pass on your genes you have to be straight. I know genetic mutation is possible but seriously gay people are not mutants.
As for the choice side of things, meh. As I said I think it's a produce of experiences which may or may not have been by choice. So perhaps some contributing factors were due to choice but overall sexuality is mostly out of an individual's control unless they lie to themselves and try to force themselves into being straight. |
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The idea that choosing to be a sexuality is like choosing your favorite color is a bit far fetched. Sexuality is an animalistic trait. You cannot mentally choose to change what makes your blood flow faster. Things like your favorite movie, color, and so on have to do with our higher intellectual capability. Animals don't see a color and prefer it the way we do, and they don't watch television and understand what's going on. Our intellectual capacity is always expanding and with it the things we like or prefer, due to these changes that take place. So I'll have to disagree completely with Penetrait. People don't choose their sexuality, and if we could, I wouldn't be a lesbian. I'm trying to prove your theory right now but so far I still like a pretty lady. Edit: @Razor Leaf; As a human with compassion for gay people, it's hard to consider them 'mutants'. But when we see people with cancer, or some other physical deformity we don't think of them as mutants, but with your logic they are. A mutation in a gene that would cause you to like the same gender and not further your species which without our intelligence (aka every other animal in the world) would make us useless is probable. Just because you don't want to call them 'mutants' which you don't have to, doesn't mean it's ruled out. And in some cases mutations are good, so you don't need to place negative emphasis on it. Quote:
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I definitely did not choose to be gay, but then I'm not so certain I was born gay either. This is mainly because I could probably identify a few things that might have unconsciously influenced my sexuality. On the opposite side, I can never pinpoint a part of my life where I've felt truly attracted to a female. So I'm not sure? Maybe it's a combination of genetic factors and social/psychological factors.
Although, as it's been stated a few times in different ways in this thread, I think what matters is not why we are one way but simply that we all accept each other as equals, regardless. |
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And I'm not just replying to you, it's everyone that has that opinion. I'm not against the point, because it makes sense. But it's worded in a weird way. |
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I'm glad it's not a band-wagon response, gets discussion going. So maybe this should be moved to Other Chat to debate. |
I think that, depending on the case, it could be both. Alot of homosexual/bisexual etc. don't just choose who they're attracted to. Some people are gay but wish they weren't, and probably vice versa. Influence also has alot to do with it. for example, if a child grows up having two mothers or two fathers, they'll grow up to believe it's completely normal and most likely end up being gay. I'm not saying that's what always happens though, some children can grow up like that and simple think it's normal but be straight. It's not really a choice, though. Some people might not always be gay but later start realizing they're attracted to the same sex. Sometimes it's about experience. If a woman has a bad experience with a man, they can often start seeing all men as bad and start preferring other women. Same with men.
So I guess my point is, it's not a choice, but you're not always exactly born that way. |
I believe you're born gay, lesbian.
as for bisexual, I'm not really sure, since I'm bisexual myself, and I don't know what to believe really. But in Gay, Lesbian are born that way, I simply think its beautiful, being born in any sexuality really is beautiful in my opinion. I dont think there should be any hate toward people that are different, since there is no such thing as being normal in any world, since everyone is different in mental sense, and a physical sense. |
i strongly believe that it is not a choice. and there's absolutely nothing wrong with it.
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Unfortunately, I couldn't seem to find it on google. =/ |
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You can choose to appear gay, but you can't choose to be gay. If you actually are, then you were more than likely born that way. |
I'm pretty sure it's a choice. No I'm really sure it's a choice. You can't be born gay. As you grow up, you think to yourself, "I like teh men." And then it goes from there I guess.
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But do you choose to feel that way first?
No. |
I recently watched the documentary The Making of Me: John Barrowman and- if I was not before- I'm now fairly confident that one is born homosexual or heterosexual.
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------------ Honestly, I don't understand this. How many gay people have to post here saying "I DID NOT CHOOSE TO BE GAY" before people believe it? It's ridiculous, and it infuriates me. Do you think we're lying? Do you not think we know better? We're the ones living this out, we know the inner workings of it better than you ever will. SO. Once more, with feeling: Gay is not a choice. You do not choose to be gay. I did not choose to be gay. Sexuality is not a choice. Oh my God. Was that clear enough? |
This has become a nice, extended discussion. So I'm going to be moving it to Other Chat.
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I'm gay. I look at a naked woman, I can't geta hard on. I don't feel anything. I look at a naked man, BAM! There I am. Ready. Do I choose to get a boner? No. Just that boobs and other female bits don't exactly make me pitch a tent. But.. I could kiss a girl right now. I could have sex, and do whatever the hell I want to with her. But I wont feel something. I wont feel love, I won't feel a connection, and I won't even like it. But can I do it? Yes I can. Doing =/= Desire. If you watch American Dad, you'll see my point. Stan tries to be gay, but it doesn't work, he doesn't feel anything, and doesn't like it. He's still straight. |
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^^ Exactly. The only reason people are believed to choose to be gay, is because the majority of people are straight. But.. if the majority of people were gay, then I'm sure that this discussion would be flipped, and that argument could be used for the straight people. It is just different, and that goes against human's natural survival instinct. Different has a chance to be better, and if you're better, then you will survive longer, so it's in our natural human instinct to take out the competition.
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I'm going to agree with Alley Cat, Raichu, and some others.
Although, people keep saying that you can't be born gay, because "there's no gay gene". but lol.. It's not a gene, it's something that fires in your brain, and your body that makes you attracted to the same gender. Likewise, there's a lack of that firing for people who are homosexual when they're around someone of the opposite gender. It's like how people explain kissing as fireworks going off, since it's feelings and reactions their body has when they're really attracted to whomever they're kissing. With straight people, that happens between a man a woman, with homosexuals, that happens only when both people are of the same gender. People who are bi can feel that with either gender, etc. From a young age, before there even can be much influence for it in their lives at all, kids can start knowing whether they're attracted to guys or girls. This is before anything that could make it a choice even occurs, mind you. Some people experience trauma that makes them fearful of the opposite gender, and so due to that fear, they might go against the grain and 'choose' to be homosexual, and that's sad for them, but that's a small percentage. For the most part, gays and lesbians don't choose to become something that makes them an outcast, or causes them depression, or choose something that makes them feel like they're letting their families down. For some, it might be a choice under circumstances that are (most of the time) unfortunate, but in general, we don't choose to be gay. In the same way that we can't suddenly choose to flip that around and become straight. It doesn't work. |
If it was a choice it wouldn't occur in animals that can't choose.
Just saying. |
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^this was the best example I could think of, alley cat. That article didn't mention that their story was made into a children's book, which is banned from some places (I forgot which exactly) for the mere fact that it's about homosexuality.
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Penguins and wolves though don't have the same partners their entire life. They just have on partner at a time (like humans.) |
I heard that once Penguins find their mate they stay together for life?
But that's a bit off-topic. I do believe though that this discussion is dying. So.... In many countries in Africa, homosexuality is only illegal for males, what difference is this? |
I think that you are equal no matter what, and that "gay" shouldn't mean homosexual, but since it's so prominent as an insult, it can continue to be an insult, not meaning homosexual though
I myself are asexual, and I get absolute hell from straights saying that I haven't met the right person... Like seriously, they don't know me. Also, Christian, Muslim, and Jewish religions don't believe in it. Reformed Judaism and I'm sure some versions of Christianity and Islam approve, but for the most part, it's death penalty. (Saudi Arabia is an example) Why can't people focus on other things than sexuality... Seems as if lives are ran by sexual relationships in many people I've met. I don't know anybody other than myself who could live without ever hearing about all of it. Its ANNOYING and SAD that people are ran by their desire to get a gf/bf and crack jokes about it. I haven't heard a FUNNY JOKE in a long time tat didn't involve sexuality -_- |
I was raised Catholic and to believe that homosexuality was wrong. I had never met an actual homosexual (that I knew of). I was expecting the men to be stereotypical effeminate types. The first one I met in 6th grade was not that at all. He was that gangster type.
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I fail to see what's so wrong about it. There's nothing wrong with it. It's just a matter of love. Which, really, shouldn't cause this much hate. Why would it be a disorder to love someone that just happens to be the same gender as you? Furthermore, why should it matter to you, in any way, who someone loves. Gay people might think being straight is a mental disorder, and you'd damn them to hell for it. Also, if you haven't really done any research on it, why would you comment saying such a controversial thing? You're not having an opinion. You're just being really close-minded and stuck in the dark ages. Some thoughts A lot of people think one thing wrong with being gay is you can't create babies. A majority of human beings will never have sex to create babies. I for one, will never have sex with any boyfriend I have to create a child. I would only do it out of pleasure. People who are gay are completely normal. Sex is an abnormal thing. And the way people decide to do it is their business, not yours, and it's rather silly for you to judge someone based on who they want to kiss and marry. Choice On the subject of choice, there's simply no discussion to be had about it. The only people who would choose a lifestyle that leads to the loss of friends, depression, alienation, suicide, and hate is a masochistic person. Thinking logically, the only choices a gay person can make about being gay are
The really gay scenario Let's try a bit of role reversal. If the "normal" sexuality was homosexuality, and you were straight, how would you feel? You're a minority, you're discriminated against, you lose friends constantly 'cause they think you wanna boink them. We, as children, learned the golden rule, correct? Quote:
The awkward truth All-in-all, there's nothing wrong with homosexuality. Whether you believe so or not, just break it down logically, and you'll see that there isn't. It's just another thing that happens in nature such as retardation, genius, different color pigmentation, and so on. Anywho, that's my thoughts on it. |
I'd say Louis C.K. sums it up pretty well ( ... ) . People seriously need to quit being judgmental. :\ IDK. I haven't had an attraction to other guys, so I don't think I was born that way. If it's not that we're born that way, and it is a choice, then I don't plan on choosing it because I'm happily off the market with my girlfriend. But I mean, I have a friend who is gay and he seemed very curious about other guys. So, there's something to be said for both sides of the argument ( "choosing" to be gay, or "born that way" ). Regardless, I still think Louis C.K. sums it up pretty well. haha. :) |
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"Were you born a bigot or did you grow into one?" |
What I really don't understand is why this is open to discussion. People saying things like "it's a choice in my opinion." I'm sorry, your opinion? This isn't something people get to have opinions on. This is not like abortion or even same-sex marriage where people's views do matter. This is a simple statement of fact:
Gay is not a choice. This is not something where it's appropriate to say "No, I don't think so. That's not true, in my opinion." Unless you yourself are gay, you do not get a vote. You do not get to have a contrary opinion. And the gay people - the ones who this is actually concerning - are all pretty unanimous in saying that it's not something you choose. So what else is there to debate? Quote:
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I honestly don't see why there is such a lack of tolerance when it comes to the homosexual community. So a person is attracted to members of the same sex, so what? I prefer brunettes to blonds, that doesn't give someone the right to discriminate against me, nor does it make my preferences incorrect. Human emotions and preferences are shaped by nature, and grow upon the nature of their nurture.
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I simply think people wallow too much in the traditional, gender roles have been changing over the decades. This is 2011, not the dawn of mankind where women were merely child bearers within their caves while the men played the role of hunter-gatherers. It is quite secluded and short sighted for anyone to simply think homosexuality is a wrong thing, it's just another term much like heterosexuality, and who knows, in 50 years, the majority of people could be homosexual. In the sense of reproduction, homosexuality is obviously going to be counter productive, but other than that, what issues can there possibly be? I don't think the masses are very concerned with birth rates, so there shouldn't be objection to it, in my eyes. It's simply a built in attraction, which cannot be justly classified as being "wrong". From a completely secular view of course. |
It is NOT a CHOICE it will NEVER be a CHOICE.
You are BORN gay, it's an UNCHANGEABLE aspect of your GENES and due to circumstances in the WOMB. The very thought that any sane person would choose to lead a life where so many people hate them just for being attracted to the same sex is absurd, my cousin is a lesbian and I can safely say that she did NOT CHOOSE to be attracted to women, and the stereotypical signs of being homosexual where there from a very YOUNG age, which backs up the whole being born gay thing. While I agree you do not know your sexuality until you hit puberty and the hormone rush begins but there are generally going to be signs of it beforehand. So yeah, if you tl;dr this I'm basically saying: It's >NOT< a >CHOICE< -- You >ARE BORN GAY< |
Idk what causes homosexuality, but I'm not comfortable saying that one is born that way without conclusive, peer-reviewed, scientific evidence that has achieved a general consensus among the scientific community.
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Wow, there are some many obnoxious trolls on the prowl here...
Homosexuality, I believe, is really a combination of both nature (genetics) and nurture (environment), though I think genetics are more prominent. Being biased towards somebody with a socially-unconventional orientation is like being biased against somebody who's parents divorced. They really have no say in the matter and there really isn't anybody to blame. |
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A plethora of studies have also been done on lie detector tests, yet that doesn't change that fact that it's reliability is shaky at best. |
It isn't a choice. You are born that way, or something makes you go that way. Honestly, I think that something could in effect cause someone to turn a straight man or woman homosexual, or a gay man or woman straight. Maybe when they're developing, or due to some kind of trauma, but I'm not willing to put it past that. Unless there is actually a gay gene, then I think this is true.
You might not be born gay. That's what I believe. But, it isn't a choice. If it was people like Seth Walsh wouldn't have killed themselves over being bullied and teased. They got some of the worst of it, and after do you think that they'd still choose to be gay? Doubt it. There was this one gay guy who going through school, people would beat the crap out of him, push him in urinals, and molest him because he was gay. Do you still think that he'd choose to live a life like that? I don't. I'm not saying you're born that way, I'm not saying I know what causes it. But what I can say for 100% ascertainment, being gay is NOT a choice. Have a nice day. As for what causes it, that's one of those questions that I don't much care about the answer to. We're here, we're queer, get used to it. I hope people don't find out the answer, because this might be the end of the Gay community as we know it if they can stop it. Make it so the child comes out straight. Which I believe would be inhuman and shouldn't be done. |
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Just so you guys know, a child with two parents of the same sex are more likely to be heterosexual than homosexual. With that said, environment has a minimum effect at all.
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I go by the current majority view in the scientific community. As I usually do if that particular branch of science isn't my main branch. That is that sexuality is a spectrum: you can be straight, bisexual with a straight lean, 'true' bisexual, bisexual with a homosexual lean or homosexual. And that it isn't entirely pre-birth determined, but is affected by a large variety of things, including both genetics and culture/upbringing.
That doesn't mean that it can be changed; all attempts to do that have failed. And it most certainly isn't a mental disorder. It's also not a choice, but it can be influeced by choice (e.g. someone who is bisexual could choose to live a straight life for religious reasons or because they are afraid of stigma). If it was entirely genetics without room for bisexuality, it would have been bred out through evolution for obvious reasons. Quote:
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I was addressing specifically the people who say that homosexuality is a choice. This has nothing to do with the scientific aspects of the debate, and the only evidence needed is for gay people to say "I did not choose to be gay". As far as the "whether it is a choice" argument is concerned, nobody's opinions matter except the gay people themselves. |
It seriously pointless to post your own opinion in threads like these especially if it is contradictory of what is expected for an answer. You know what you want to hear, so why make or even post in the thread. Just to stay relevant, I believe gay is a choice. Its good to have an open opinion on a subject like this and the confidence to go against the norm. Now isnt it (:
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You know what grinds my gears? The fact that gays think they're right about the subject simply because they are gay.
If that's true, you'd have to also be straight to be right about being straight. But one defines the other. Problem? |
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I have another way to put this after reading through the posts for a while. Quote:
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&& Assume were wrong on the birds flight patterns and etc. All it would take is one bird to tell us otherwise. I'm proud of my life, and given the choice to stay gay, I would choose to stay gay. But I know, that in the beginning, I was afraid to come out and wished that I wasn't gay, and didn't think of my best friend as more than a best friend. I wanted to be normal. But then.. I realized.. I am. |
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I agree with Penatrait and Nameless in their other posts I'm too lazy to quote. |
If it came off as me calling straights ignorant/not being able to have insight on the subject, that isn't what I intended. Because they can, they do, and they will. I know straight people who have questioned their sexuality.. so I know that's possible too. There just a slight difference between being gay, and being curious. If being gay is a choice, then it is certainly not one that I would have made when I discovered that I was gay. Maybe now I would make it, but certainly not back then.
for me, at least, being gay has not been a choice. for others, it might be different. but for me, and everyone that i know personally, being gay has not been choice. i have not met single person who has chosen to be gay. and now i need to get some sleep so i can be careful as not to offend people. && again, sorry for offense dealt. |
If you believe that gay and straight people are equals than how can one intrinsically know that it's a matter of choice more than the other?
"Did the X person choose to be X or was it due to their genetics and upbringing?" X could be gay or straight. Birds may not know why they fly in a V formation, we don't know why we yawn. |
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