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-   -   5th Gen [Spoiler]Pokemon World Tournament Discussion (https://www.pokecommunity.com/showthread.php?t=280024)

PaxAmericana May 12th, 2012 5:18 AM

[Spoiler]Pokemon World Tournament Discussion
 
Pokemon World Tournament is something in B2/W2 that allows the trainer to battle old gym leaders and champions from other regions. It works similar to a battle facility where you battle single and double battles.

Do you like this newly implemented feature or not?

Ho-Oh May 12th, 2012 5:22 AM

Well I wanna know more about why it exists tbh. I'm not really a fan of having to face all the older gym leaders, but if it's a post-game thing that kinda gives longevity to the games which is good compared to B/W which didn't really have that, so ya.

PaxAmericana May 12th, 2012 5:24 AM

Yea, I was thinking that it was maybe to help add so more things to do in the game, most likely post game, which BW did lack.

PokeGirlBel May 12th, 2012 5:46 AM

I love it. It really is a good idea tbh.

Cordelia May 12th, 2012 6:24 AM

This is great and really should be something special in the games... it'll give us more to do than Black and White, which just kind of dropped off after the story was complete.

RedJ May 12th, 2012 7:24 AM

Really hoping Red (or Blue/Green/Leaf, that would be cool too) comes down from Mt. Silver and gets in on this too. Seems like something he would be interested in.

I love the idea, but I have a feeling that this will cause much rage-screaming @[email protected]

Ghiaccio May 12th, 2012 7:54 AM

It looks like an awesome idea. And for once, we actually have a legit tournament in the games (if you look in the scans, it actually has like a tourney board on there). Although it's kinda disappointing imo that they only have 3 pokemon each (speed up the tournament I guess) but it still looks like an amazing idea!

Killjoy May 12th, 2012 8:01 AM

Looks awesome! Can't wait to hear more about it!

giradialkia May 12th, 2012 8:19 AM

I love it, I love it, I LOVE IT.

Since Ruby and Sapphire, this is precisely the thing I have been waiting for in a Pokemon game. I always felt they needed more continuity in the games, and while people argue (reasonably) that the Tohjo story ended in a satisfactory way in GSC/HGSS, I would have ADORED to be able to battle Gold and the Tohjo Gym Leaders/League. I liked RSE, but I was quite disappointed that there didn't seem to be any more relation between the games, or at least none of real significance.

The fact that these games are actually direct sequels AND that they're including loads of characters from the previous games is very nearly too much for me, and I'm vibrating with excitement as I type this. One thing I'm curious about is, however...

We know that B2W2 takes place two years after BW. And we know that BW must take place a few years after HGSS, because he's married a woman and has a son who must be at the very least 3 years old.
Yet the CoroCoro screens (or whatever) show the older characters in their original art- it's not new. In the case of Giovanni/Steven, it's their Gen 3 art, which is old. And the sprites for Lance and Blue are from HGSS. So I know that their appearance doesn't necessarily mean anything, but I'm surprised they don't look even a little different, seeing as a few years has passed.

I imagine the tournament system will be a bit like the Battle Dome in Pokemon Emerald. Although instead of battling with just two Pokemon, you battle with 3 (going by the screens). I'd prefer to be able to battle with a full team, but that'd probably be overkill, seeing as how hard it can be to take down a Champion's team without items (as I'm assuming items will be banned).

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire May 12th, 2012 8:22 AM

I love it, I'm glad to see all the champs together ^_^. I hope Unova's get in on the action too...this kind of reminds me of the battle dome but with gym leaders and champs though that's a good thing imo ^_^

MrGriszell May 12th, 2012 11:56 AM

I absolutely LOVE IT!!!!!!!!!!!!
My only problem is how are they gonna top future Pokemon games? Will this only be of BW2 or will this be a staple in Pokemon games ?

Scorpiopt May 12th, 2012 12:30 PM

I am all for it and i wonder why has not been made sooner :D

Elite Overlord LeSabre™ May 12th, 2012 1:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redjacketalchemist (Post 7172055)
Really hoping Red (or Blue/Green/Leaf, that would be cool too) comes down from Mt. Silver and gets in on this too. Seems like something he would be interested in.

I love the idea, but I have a feeling that this will cause much rage-screaming @[email protected]

Nah, first of all, he's appeared in enough games as it is and I certainly don't want to see him again. Plus, he strikes me as more the type who'd rather stay parked on that mountain and not associate with others.

I would say "Yes" on Leaf (give my fave character an opportunity to appear in a game that she was denied back in HG/SS), but then there's the issue with bringing back any of the playable characters... how to decide what starter they have, and who's on their team. I'm just against reusing player characters as NPCs in general. I have been since G/S.

Not a fan of the 3 on 3 thing and never have been (Battle Tower/Frontier, Stadium games, etc.) You have six Pokemon, you should be able to use all six!

Otherwise, I'm pretty neutral on this idea, especially if it's going to be implemented as a Tower/Frontier type thing. While it would be nice to see some old familiar faces, there are others I could do without seeing, and IMO it's hard to justify everyone coming over to participate.

And I suppose Giovanni's no longer a wanted fugitive from justice if he's daring to show his face at this event? Hmmm, maybe he has paid his debt to society.

blue May 12th, 2012 1:08 PM

I wasn't surprised to see that nobody had voted "No!" It's an excellent feature which revives all the older gym leaders & champions and brings them into an up-to-date game.

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire May 12th, 2012 1:17 PM

Red appearing would be nice, I would like the rival appear though...bring in Silver, Wally, and Pearl into the fun! Maybe Cheren, Bianca and N will appear...
I mentioned this in the character thread but how will the battle with Lisa and Tate work out? Will the match all of a sudden turn into a doubles?

blue May 12th, 2012 1:26 PM

Well, so far there have been no Hoenn leaders mentioned which may mean that they wont appear or only a few will appear and have yet to be revealed, I don't think every leader/champion will return but just a vast majority.

Roaring Moon May 12th, 2012 3:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by giradialkia (Post 7172123)
Yet the CoroCoro screens (or whatever) show the older characters in their original art- it's not new. In the case of Giovanni/Steven, it's their Gen 3 art, which is old. And the sprites for Lance and Blue are from HGSS. So I know that their appearance doesn't necessarily mean anything, but I'm surprised they don't look even a little different, seeing as a few years has passed.

The artwork could very well just be filler. Giovanni, Steven, and the Hoenn leaders are due for new artwork, anyway.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Suicune™ (Post 7172469)
Well, so far there have been no Hoenn leaders mentioned which may mean that they wont appear or only a few will appear and have yet to be revealed, I don't think every leader/champion will return but just a vast majority.

We don't have any confirmed Johto leaders, either. In fact, the only confirmed leader not from Kanto is Volkner. I still think that every leader and champion will appear, though,.

blue May 12th, 2012 3:42 PM

True, I love the fact that Giovanni is returning, as much as I didn't expect it we haven't seen him in some time.

TCB May 12th, 2012 3:46 PM

More than anything, I'm excited for the Hoenn Gym Leaders and Champion. They finally receive updated in-game sprite poses. The others....not as ecstatic but still awesome nonetheless.

Zelda May 12th, 2012 4:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Forever (Post 7171883)
Well I wanna know more about why it exists tbh. I'm not really a fan of having to face all the older gym leaders, but if it's a post-game thing that kinda gives longevity to the games which is good compared to B/W which didn't really have that, so ya.

It all seems really interesting, but I agree with this. I'm not sure exactly how I feel about the feature yet, but I am excited to try it out!

Nick May 12th, 2012 4:51 PM

What real Pokemon fan wouldn't like this?

Squirrel May 12th, 2012 4:58 PM

Man I love this idea so much. It's about time they had a tournament element in the Pokemon games! And mixing it with being able to fight all the old gym leaders is just... wow. I'm buzzing for this new game, literally cannot wait after seeing this. x] I hope you have an option of watching their battles too; it'd be really interesting to see a battle like Janine vs Pryce. The two types would compliment each other well for a long saturated battle.

Zelda May 12th, 2012 5:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlexOzzyCake (Post 7172802)
Man I love this idea so much. It's about time they had a tournament element in the Pokemon games! And mixing it with being able to fight all the old gym leaders is just... wow. I'm buzzing for this new game, literally cannot wait after seeing this. x] I hope you have an option of watching their battles too; it'd be really interesting to see a battle like Janine vs Pryce. The two types would compliment each other well for a long saturated battle.

Oh Gym Leader VS Gym Leader, yeah I would really want to see that. I'm just glad that GameFreak are bringing in new features into games, and not just the generic things we expect; because who would expect this at all, even?

Ho-Oh May 12th, 2012 5:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luigi-San (Post 7172610)
We don't have any confirmed Johto leaders, either. In fact, the only confirmed leader not from Kanto is Volkner. I still think that every leader and champion will appear, though,.

Well maybe they may end up skipping Johto because it's not entirely the parallel of the Unova region and Hoenn because it's too far away, leaving you with just Sinnoh/Kanto... oh God how boring.

Xander Olivieri May 12th, 2012 5:56 PM

Steven is the Champion from Hoenn so there is a Hoenn trainer that shows up, and Janine being there is a Johto relation as Janine wasn't a Gym Leader in the Kanto Series games.

I can see them bringing Red in since he is the Master champion in GSCHGSS and Blue is both a Champion and Gym Leader. They only list a few so we may not even have the full list yet. Maybe the Tournament randomizes which Gym Leader/Champions you fight.

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire May 12th, 2012 6:17 PM

Was Emerald not cannon, or will Wallace appear later as champ...
I'm also starting to think GF is hiding something...Steven has been the only Hoenn character to appear out of that region, I mean HgSs had three Sinnoh cameo's and so far they don't show any Hoenn gym leaders...
Either way I do wonder how many of the gym leaders will appear. Also I want Red to appear too! Maybe he can be the one we challenge after winning the match against the rest...

bwburke94 May 12th, 2012 6:34 PM

This thread isn't about the Steven/Wallace champion debate, but Wallace might show up and he might not. A full 4-region Gym Leader Castle isn't gonna happen, though.

Xander Olivieri May 12th, 2012 6:44 PM

This is also the first media coverage of the World Tournament. Steven was never a Gym Leader so he's got to be Hoenn's current Champion representing Hoenn. I can see them releasing more info on this next week on Smash.

Aquarius1997 May 12th, 2012 8:04 PM

Kinda happy this is happening but i see a major flaw

Pokemon cant implement this feature into the next few generations because it would be quite redundant(the only new thing would probably be new teams or movesets)

Other than that i LOVE the idea

Ho-Oh May 12th, 2012 10:30 PM

I wonder what the teams will be for the tournament, actually. Anyone think to follow the theme from B/W's elite four it might be 4 Pokemon per gym leader - then 6 for the champion? Then maybeeee the level increase goes up each region, so say 50 @ Kanto +5 for champ, 60 @ Johto +5 for champ, 70 @ Hoenn +5 for champ, 80 @ Sinnoh +5 for champ.That is of course if they ARE including the other regions' gym leaders. :x

Asuf May 12th, 2012 11:26 PM

This is such a great idea! (which many others have said :P )
But seriously though, I wonder if they are going to include everyone? I'm glad there's going to be more to do post game this time.

Elite Overlord LeSabre™ May 13th, 2012 3:05 AM

Well, my guesses are that

(a) Wallace is a Gym Leader, Steven is Champion, Juan from Emerald is the no-show.
(b) If it's three on three battles as some have speculated, it'll probably be done Tower/Frontier style where their levels are adjusted to match your strongest Pokemon's.
(c) Brackets are probably goign to be randomized if it is indeed everyone.

And I'm going to reiterate, a certain someone really should stay out of this and remain on his little frozen mountain. He's shown up in 10 games already and needs to be given a rest, and since he doesn't speak, he strikes me as the antisocial type who wouldn't want to be in the public eye at an event like this. If he shows up, that could be the final nail in the coffin as far as me buying the games.

blue May 13th, 2012 3:39 AM

If you notice as the tournament there is only 3 Pokémon per leader/champion etc. so I wonder why it's so limited, it's kind of like a battle frontier in a way.

Ho-Oh May 13th, 2012 3:45 AM

There is? I must be blind. :( If Brock is the first one I don't want Geodude, Graveller and Golem. Just saying. :x

RetroRoller May 13th, 2012 3:47 AM

I don't see why some people are EXTREMELY excited about this. I just think it's gonna be a cool addition to game that may possibly be as boring as it's predecessor once you've beaten it. Anyway, here's what I think.

First off, Giovanni? I like the fact he's gonna show up, but is it gonna spark Maxie/Archie to tag along as well? Heck even Cyrus might show up on his Giratina to crash the party. ;)

I actually think it's likely, that as it has been done in other games before, although the only example I can think of is getting Ho-Oh after beating 100 Mt. Battle trainers...

Red will probably show up, but I'm thinking ONLY after you've beaten several trainers consecutively or something similar.

If the World Tournament repeats, (like, you beat it once and you can do it again) you'd probably have to win the thing consecutively to see him.

If Red was to show up, it might mean the other protagonists would too. Kris, Ethan, Brendan/May, Lucas, heck, even Hilbert/Hilda...

Quote:

If it's three on three battles as some have speculated, it'll probably be done Tower/Frontier style where their levels are adjusted to match your strongest Pokemon's.
Yes, something did strike me as being a tad "Battle Dome" about this. My guess is it's just a grand version of the Dome. Needless to say if that's the case I'm excited. I loved the Battle Dome and Pike from Emerald.

Quote:

Pokemon cant implement this feature into the next few generations because it would be quite redundant(the only new thing would probably be new teams or movesets)
This is what I was thinking as well. My only conclusion for this is that Pokemon are going to finish off their Generation with something grand and that will be well remembered before they move on to something better. Because, it's quite clear the next Pokemon game after BW2 will be for 3DS, (you know, seeing as the 3DS is one of Nintendo's Proudest Achievements and Pokemon is it's crown jewel) which will probably mean they're upping the generation to VI.

Quote:

I imagine the tournament system will be a bit like the Battle Dome in Pokemon Emerald. Although instead of battling with just two Pokemon, you battle with 3 (going by the screens).
After squinting my eyes, I think it'll play out like the original Battle Dome. 1v1, winner faces winner etc. But the fact half the participants are outlined in Red and the other half are in Blue I see your point.

Also, I can't see it too well but on the CoroCoro screens, there look like some more sprites I can't make them out. Yes, I can see the Gym Leader sprites in the Tourney screen but I'm talking about the right hand side, I can't see it too well, but they're probably just more Gym Leaders...

MarioManH May 13th, 2012 5:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aquarius1997 (Post 7173052)

Pokemon cant implement this feature into the next few generations because it would be quite redundant(the only new thing would probably be new teams or movesets)

I kind of agree(To the New Teams + MS Idea), but they can pull off how they did the BF(Same one in Platinum and HG/SS), but it can be that it just got moved to that certain region for that certain time. Also I predict when you first arrive they will say that its in Unova for that certain time period.

Briankelly130 May 13th, 2012 5:58 AM

I'm loving this feature, I've always liked when the games allow you to rebattle the Gym Leaders again, this way, it's five generations of Gym Leaders and that makes me very happy.

RedJ May 13th, 2012 6:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RetroRoller (Post 7173345)
First off, Giovanni? I like the fact he's gonna show up, but is it gonna spark Maxie/Archie to tag along as well? Heck even Cyrus might show up on his Giratina to crash the party. ;)

Except they weren't Gym Leaders, and Giovanni was. The only other Team Whatever member that has any chance of showing up would be N, seeing as he was Champion at one point (at least I think- I haven't beaten B/W yet, but from what I've read he beat Alder, so).

Zelda May 13th, 2012 6:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redjacketalchemist (Post 7173485)
Except they weren't Gym Leaders, and Giovanni was. The only other Team Whatever member that has any chance of showing up would be N, seeing as he was Champion at one point (at least I think- I haven't beaten B/W yet, but from what I've read he beat Alder, so).

Oh this is true. N could possibly be the new champion of Unova even, if Alder isn't. But if that's the case, then I think Alder should appear in the tournament instead.

XtinaIsMeLuvinWWE May 13th, 2012 6:43 AM

This is super cool to me, I'm just ridiculously excited at the thought of seeing all the gang (as in, my fave gym leaders etc lol) back together!! :D :D :D

Xander Olivieri May 13th, 2012 7:23 AM

Serebii says you can download the rest of the Champions and Gym Leaders through special events to participate in the World Tournament so we can get all of them when they are released.

Pokemon Trainers: Gotta Collect 'em all~

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire May 13th, 2012 7:53 AM

So it appears that it's another download characters like in Conquest with the character stories...I guess we might see more of these download characters by Wi-fi soon...that makes me feel like this isn't canon...

Kenshin5 May 13th, 2012 9:47 AM

Its probably not going to be canon which is why Gary(Blue/Green), Giovanni, Steven, Lance still have prior generation art work. Kind of reminds me of what they are currently doing with Fire Emblem Awakening where they have Downloadable characters. So every so often Nintendo issues new downloadable characters and they are just their for the sole reason of fighting and have no bearing upon anything outside of the Tournament.

Kenmoor May 13th, 2012 10:32 AM

If it's going to be 3vs.3 and tag battles then who are we going to fight with? I doubt it if we get paired with people like Giovanni, Blue, and all those rough people who would like to beat us up instead. We'll probably get paired with those nice people such as Erika, Bugsy, etc.

Tag battle opponents anyone? They don't have to be mono-types but I can't think of any dual/mixed-types right now. Here's a few: Blaine and Flannery. Koga and Janine. Volkner and Elesa . Tate and Lisa... oh wait.
(I swear if anyone starts some shipping on this i'll-... I don't know anymore...)

Will they have this random island for the location? I don't seem to remember an island big enough for all this in Black and White. Unless they make this random island like Fullmoon and Victory. (Just appearing on the map like that... thought I was hallucinating for a minute...) Or the location could be in a cave. Or in the sky for that matter. I always wanted a location/building in the sky in Pokemon.

Stuff-
http://www.serebii.net/black2white2/worldtournament.shtml
http://www.jefusion.com/2012/05/pokemon-black-white-2-features.html
http://geek.pikimal.com/2012/05/13/new-pokemon-black-2-white-2-details-tease-hollywood-minigame/

RetroRoller May 13th, 2012 11:49 AM

Quote:

Except they weren't Gym Leaders, and Giovanni was. The only other Team Whatever member that has any chance of showing up would be N, seeing as he was Champion at one point (at least I think- I haven't beaten B/W yet, but from what I've read he beat Alder, so).
Oh yeah, I didn't think about that :P

Hmm... it's likely N will have something to do with the BW2 storyline... this might mean something happens to him (for example, he runs off again) which could make him not appear in the Tournament.

bwburke94 May 13th, 2012 11:49 AM

Does it matter if it's canon or not?

(Fun fact: if GF is lazy and uses the Unova music, Lance will have used five different battle themes, with him gaining one new theme in each generation. This total excludes Stadium.)

Elite Overlord LeSabre™ May 13th, 2012 1:04 PM

Well, I feel better about this idea now that the trainers are downloadable. So, if there's a particular character who you don't want to see, you can just not download their data (as long as they're not one of the pre-programmed defaults). I'm kinda hoping yo can download individually and not in "packs" for fear of my favorite character being lumped with one I don't want.

And since it's allegedly non-canon, it might just be the ticket to see my beloved Leaf again :) Just don't package her with you-know-who, okay, Gamefreak?

KingCyndaquil May 13th, 2012 1:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaori (Post 7173540)

Oh this is true. N could possibly be the new champion of Unova even, if Alder isn't. But if that's the case, then I think Alder should appear in the tournament instead.

CoroCoro already said that nobody knows where N is, i'm guessing thats the biases of the actual story

JP May 13th, 2012 2:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patchisou Yutohru (Post 7172793)
What real Pokemon fan wouldn't like this?

This sums it up well. I've been wanting a feature like this for a long time and that cafe/bar/whatever in Platinum was a step in the right direction and this kinda takes it a few steps farther. Excited to see how it all pans out, but I'm sure I won't be disappointed. I do wonder if we'll get to battle any of the previous protagonists though? (I'm guessing the last two from B&W1 will appear here.)

Kirbychu May 13th, 2012 4:29 PM

I like it, but it sort of screws with the continuity, just a tiny bit. BW takes place sometime after DPPt, right? And B2W2 takes place two years after that. The characters haven't changed at all over that time (Most likely because Game Freak didn't see the point in updating all the designs of all the trainers).

That aside, it's cool to see old faces again. I've always liked tournaments in Pokemon games.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elite Overlord LeSabre™ (Post 7174050)
And since it's allegedly non-canon

Now that I think about it, that's probably the case.


OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire May 13th, 2012 6:23 PM

The fact that Geo has his gen III art makes me think this might not be cannonical at all... too bad because Steven could've fixed up Hoenn's spot in the timeline...

MegaKuriboh May 13th, 2012 8:13 PM

If the Hoenn leaders don't show up for some reason, then it pretty much confirms for me that RS will be remade.

Xander Olivieri May 13th, 2012 8:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pokemon Trainer Kevin (Post 7174531)
If the Hoenn leaders don't show up for some reason, then it pretty much confirms for me that RS will be remade.

Hoenn Champion is already in the game though, and is one of the preliminary trainers.

bwburke94 May 14th, 2012 3:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Magmaruby and Aquasapphire (Post 7174447)
The fact that Geo has his gen III art makes me think this might not be cannonical at all...

Even ignoring the typos, this makes no sense. The art is placeholder art. I believe that Giovanni had no Gen IV art, so the Gen III art was used. Same for Steven.

wombateiro May 14th, 2012 6:48 AM

I think World Tournament IS canon because:
- it looks like Giovanni has sprite from HG/SS (third on the right on tournament table, I think it's him),
- look at battle titles for Cynthia, Steven, Lance and Gary. They all say "Pokemon Trainer" ポケモントレーナー there won't be problem if Giovanni is classified as still being Gym Leader because he's probably going to be simply called Pokemon Trainer,
- if it wasn't canon both Steven and Wallace would appear in Corocoro being labeled as Champions, but only Steven appeared. It also most likely indicates that B2/W2 take place before R/S/E.

Xander Olivieri May 14th, 2012 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wombateiro (Post 7174997)
I think World Tournament IS canon because:
- it looks like Giovanni has sprite from HG/SS (third on the right on tournament table, I think it's him),
- look at battle titles for Cynthia, Steven, Lance and Gary. They all say "Pokemon Trainer" ポケモントレーナー there won't be problem if Giovanni is classified as still being Gym Leader because he's probably going to be simply called Pokemon Trainer,
- if it wasn't canon both Steven and Wallace would appear in Corocoro being labeled as Champions, but only Steven appeared. It also most likely indicates that B2/W2 take place before R/S/E.

That would depend on which game series they are following. If they don't include Emerald's story as Canon then Juan doesn't exist and Wallace is a Gym Leader while only Steven is Champion.

wombateiro May 14th, 2012 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XanderO (Post 7175245)
That would depend on which game series they are following. If they don't include Emerald's story as Canon then Juan doesn't exist and Wallace is a Gym Leader while only Steven is Champion.

That would mean they shouldn't include Eusine in HG/SS because Crystal's story is not canon. I don't believe they will ever don't count third game as canon.
Actually, third games are more important as canon because they contain more expanded storyline. In B/W Cynthia compares player to that trainer who encountered Giratina, referring to canon event she witnessed in Distortion World in Platinum. All third games are counted as canon.

Xander Olivieri May 14th, 2012 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wombateiro (Post 7175262)
That would mean they shouldn't include Eusine in HG/SS because Crystal's story is not canon. I don't believe they will ever don't count third game as canon.
Actually, third games are more important as canon because they contain more expanded storyline. In B/W Cynthia compares player to that trainer who encountered Giratina, referring to canon event she witnessed in Distortion World in Platinum. All third games are counted as canon.

Platinum was already revealed as Canon with Looker. Never said anything about Third games only Emerald. Twice Steven has been shown as the Champion of Hoenn despite Wallace taking over in Emerald. It may just be Emerald that wasn't counted. RSE have conflicting stories already, after all they happen at the same time with two different sets of Final Gym and Champions) so they'd have to choose one or the other. They seem to have Chosen Ruby and Sapphire's story over Emeralds's.

With Steven still being Champion, they are saying that Ruby/Sapphire's story takes precedence over Emerald's.

wombateiro May 14th, 2012 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XanderO (Post 7175299)
Platinum was already revealed as Canon with Looker. Never said anything about Third games only Emerald. Twice Steven has been shown as the Champion of Hoenn despite Wallace taking over in Emerald. It may just be Emerald that wasn't counted. RSE have conflicting stories already, after all they happen at the same time with two different sets of Final Gym and Champions) so they'd have to choose one or the other. They seem to have Chosen Ruby and Sapphire's story over Emeralds's.

With Steven still being Champion, they are saying that Ruby/Sapphire's story takes precedence over Emerald's.

Well, D/P and Platinum also have conflicting stories... stories of Giratina and Cyrus are different in those games. If they've chosen Crystal's and Platinum's stories to be canon, they will also choose Emerald.
They will never exclude any third game from canon. Emerald is also part of canon. We just don't have proof yet, because R/S/E seem to be last in timeline. Platnium is already proven to be canon only because it takes place before B/W and B2/W2.

Assuming that all third games are canon, World Tournament confirms that B2/W2 take place before R/S/E.

GSCyndaquil19 May 14th, 2012 12:21 PM

Nobody has seemed to mention this. Remixed themes for all those Gym Leaders and E4.

blue May 14th, 2012 2:17 PM

That's what I thought, I wonder if they will just be designated either the same sound track or remixed of their regional gym music. There was a soundtrack coded into Black & White for the Champion of Kanto but was never used in the games, surely this would be perfect for Green.


Also, still looking forward (assuming they do) to them revealing some more gym leaders returning, by the looks of things we'll get a few more considering day by day we've learnt about a couple more appearing, just want to know if we'll see any Hoenn leaders.

voicerocker May 14th, 2012 8:05 PM

I don't think anyone has mentioned this yet.

Giovanni and Janine weren't Gym Leaders at the same point in time. Any thoughts on this? I doubt they would invite a known criminal organization leader in to a tournament of respectable trainers unless he was still a Gym Leader and it was still a secret, unless it's not supposed to be considered canon and these are all cameo-like appearances.

And Blue, would he be there under his most recent title of Gym Leader or his highest title as Champion?

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire May 14th, 2012 8:10 PM

I too wonder what title he'll have...
I hope that they update the themes to B2W2, I'll like to hear an updated version of Steven's theme in the tournament :3.

Scorpiopt May 15th, 2012 8:30 AM

having to get opponents via wifi just like they do with pokemon is stupid

blue May 15th, 2012 8:34 AM

http://pokebeach.com/news/0512/black-2-white-2/16.jpghttp://pokebeach.com/news/0512/black-2-white-2/17.jpghttp://pokebeach.com/news/0512/black-2-white-2/18.jpg

Just some clearer/new pictures of the Tournament, I love how the OW sprites look of the Gym Leaders in the third image, we haven't seen them BW style before!

Ho-Oh May 15th, 2012 8:37 AM

You know, if your character is in the tournament... why? Is it after you beat the Elite Four twice - and become the best in the region? Are you only qualified to compete because of that? Are you invited to join after stopping Plasma (?) from ruining Kyurem (?) by Juniper? That's what I wonder tbh.

Also I love how I was right-ish. :3

wombateiro May 15th, 2012 8:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Charlie Brown (Post 7176084)
Noooo, because RSE takes place at the same time as Rby due to the team rocket people and stuff.

What are you talking about? There's no Team Rocket in R/S/E storyline.

More on-topic: I think World Tournament might be limited on purpose in B2/W2 (not all Gym Leaders, not full teams) to be improved in future games. Kinda like it was done with limited Gym Leaders rematches from Platinum improved in HG/SS.

blue May 15th, 2012 8:56 AM

Considering each of them have three Pokémon maybe again it's like a Battle Frontier feature i.e they're set at Level 100 specialising in their typing which would be accessible post-storyline.

Also, although there are no Johto/Hoenn leaders there currently that doesn't rule them out..
"You can download more trainers via special distribution methods such as the Nintendo WiFi Connection, as time goes on. These include many of the special trainers seen below"
Even then, we don't have full details on it yet.

Elite Overlord LeSabre™ May 15th, 2012 11:07 AM

Particularly if it's non-canon, perhaps former player characters and evil team leaders would be announced. Not that I'm particularly in support of either (besides Leaf, of course) because I really don't like having anything non-canon in the handheld Pokemon games.

Xander Olivieri May 15th, 2012 11:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elite Overlord LeSabre™ (Post 7176803)
Particularly if it's non-canon, perhaps former player characters and evil team leaders would be announced. Not that I'm particularly in support of either (besides Leaf, of course) because I really don't like having anything non-canon in the handheld Pokemon games.

Its just Champions and Gym Leaders. Since none of the other PC's are "Champions" by programming in the games, I doubt they'll appear.

Kinda hope the Unova Gym Leaders get added to the Tournament cause I would love to see what Homika and Cheren would be using if the teams don't alternate.

blue May 15th, 2012 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XanderO (Post 7176810)
Its just Champions and Gym Leaders. Since none of the other PC's are "Champions" by programming in the games, I doubt they'll appear.

Kinda hope the Unova Gym Leaders get added to the Tournament cause I would love to see what Homika and Cheren would be using if the teams don't alternate.

I would have thought that this would be exclusively for the other region Gym Leaders and then the Unova Leaders will be rematchable in their gyms after the E4. I hope they have gym rematches in B2W2, it was a disappointment that they didn't in BW.

bwburke94 May 15th, 2012 1:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wombateiro (Post 7174997)
- if it wasn't canon both Steven and Wallace would appear in Corocoro being labeled as Champions, but only Steven appeared. It also most likely indicates that B2/W2 take place before R/S/E.

Assuming remakes are canon, which they most likely are:

R/S/E occurs before HG/SS (confirmed by Steven referencing the Hoenn protagonists)
HG/SS occurs concurrently with D/P/Pt (Red Gyarados news report and various other hints)
D/P/Pt occurs before B/W (confirmed by Cynthia referencing the Sinnoh protagonists)
B/W occurs before B2/W2 (direct sequels)

Therefore, R/S/E occurs before B2/W2. As for the Wallace argument, he didn't appear as a gym leader either.

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire May 15th, 2012 2:49 PM

I find it interesting that in the Kanto Bracket picture Blue's missing, perhaps this means that they'll save the eighth gym leader for last.

Kirbychu May 15th, 2012 4:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wombateiro (Post 7174997)
It also most likely indicates that B2/W2 take place before R/S/E.

Which makes no sense, considering that BW confirmed that RSE takes place before HGSSDPPt with the ""after a long travel through time"" message present on Pal Park'd Pokemon's summaries.

And this still doesn't excuse the fact that all the trainers look exactly the same after so many years.

wombateiro May 16th, 2012 7:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bwburke94 (Post 7176963)
R/S/E occurs before HG/SS (confirmed by Steven referencing the Hoenn protagonists)

Steven doesn't say anything that is 100% about Hoenn protagonists. No proof at all. Events from gens 1, 2 and 4 are 100% confirmed to have already happened before B/W, while only R/S/E events are not even mentioned. Why?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kirbychu (Post 7177119)

Which makes no sense, considering that BW confirmed that RSE takes place before HGSSDPPt with the ""after a long travel through time"" message present on Pal Park'd Pokemon's summaries.

Where is that confirmation? "Travel through time" can mean as well that R/S/E take place after B/W and B2/W2. It's not said if Pokemon arrived from past or future.
Anyway, this message about travel through time is shown only for Pokemon transfered from GBA games. Pokemon transfered from R/S remakes won't have this message anymore, so there is no proof at all.

This timeline discussion is for another thread, so if you have any other ideas to prove I'm wrong about timeline, post them in appropriate thread.

garjora May 16th, 2012 7:56 AM

This is exactly what everyone wanted and i'm glad that it's happening.

mikey May 16th, 2012 8:27 AM

Not sure how I feel about this yet. I like the idea, but I need to see what the restrictions are and all that stuff. Hope it lives up to my expectations though.

Turn-it May 16th, 2012 9:04 AM

Yes this sounds amazing! Something to keep me interested when I get the game! :D

YouHar May 16th, 2012 9:13 AM

Is anyone more excited for the show or for the game? I'm for the game, but how can this guy's name also be Black in the manga if Black's name is Black?

Jellicent♀ May 16th, 2012 9:15 AM

I'm super excited for this. I can't wait for the games to come out, that way I can abuse the heck out of this feature. I'll be sure to get every download possible to be able to battle every person available! I'm really excited to see what the Pokemon for each person will be!

blue May 16th, 2012 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jellicent♀ (Post 7178010)
I'm super excited for this. I can't wait for the games to come out, that way I can abuse the heck out of this feature. I'll be sure to get every download possible to be able to battle every person available! I'm really excited to see what the Pokemon for each person will be!

Same here! I sometimes don't bother downloading some of the event Pokémon but I'll be definitely downloading all the leaders that become available for this feature, I love how it looks and I can tell it's just going to be awesome!

Elite Overlord LeSabre™ May 17th, 2012 4:38 AM

So, has it been confirmed that other Leaders are going to be the only type of downloadable trainers available, or is the possibility still open for other types of trainers to be released for this?

Xander Olivieri May 17th, 2012 8:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elite Overlord LeSabre™ (Post 7179149)
So, has it been confirmed that other Leaders are going to be the only type of downloadable trainers available, or is the possibility still open for other types of trainers to be released for this?

If you go by the description of the World Tournament, Its all Leaders and Champions only. We are still missing Johto, Hoenn, and Sinnoh Leaders and only Champion we are missing is Red unless Gamefreak doesn't count him since he's a PC.

Twilight-kun May 17th, 2012 2:09 PM

Mm...I hope the Unova leaders can be re-battled too

and I really hope Steven gets an all 80's team like Red (but no higher then level 87, because Red's Pikachu must remain the highest leveled pokemon controlled by an NPC...

Korsola May 17th, 2012 2:36 PM

Being a big fan of gym leaders in general, I have a feeling that I'm going to love this new feature. I think it will have some post-game longevity because in each tournament you're only facing a certain number of leaders/champions, so in order to face all the available characters you're gonna need to run through it again.

I hope that they keep it on a certain day of the week instead of being able to do it whenever you because it would make more sense in the game and it would give me something to look forward to every week. I don't know, just an idea.

Either way, this will be a great addition to the game! :D

Ephemeral Euphoria May 17th, 2012 3:02 PM

Doesn't sound too great imo, would prefer something less linear like another BF or something similar tbh. That and I've already battled Cynthia, Giovanni, Lance, etc. every other gym leader/champion from the previous games too many times to count as well. Battling Akuroma does get a slight chance of intrigue from me but I'm not expecting him to be that much of a challenge sadly.

Elite Overlord LeSabre™ May 18th, 2012 4:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Twilight-kun (Post 7179740)
(but no higher then level 87, because Red's Pikachu must remain the highest leveled pokemon controlled by an NPC...

No, just no. Someone needs a team in the 90's so the highest leveled trainer in the franchise is someone who's actually a challenge. Perferably that someone is a cute girl for a change.

And I'd rather have the current crop of Gym Leaders be rematchable in some form other than this tournament. So Akuroma's presence along with the old leaders isn't encouraging...

Roaring Moon May 18th, 2012 7:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wombateiro (Post 7177908)
Steven doesn't say anything that is 100% about Hoenn protagonists. No proof at all. Events from gens 1, 2 and 4 are 100% confirmed to have already happened before B/W, while only R/S/E events are not even mentioned. Why?

Wasn't it already established that the events of the Kanto and Hoenn games occur at the same time, likewise with the Johto and Sinnoh games, only 3 years later?

wombateiro May 19th, 2012 3:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Luigi-San (Post 7181491)


Wasn't it already established that the events of the Kanto and Hoenn games occur at the same time, likewise with the Johto and Sinnoh games, only 3 years later?

It was established only by fans' speculations. But in games, there is nothing coming even close to prove that. Steven's appearance as Champion in B2/W2 also supports theory that R/S/E take place after all other games.
......................

If there are going to be more Gym Leaders downloadable after B2/W2 release, is it possible that there might be new designs for Hoenn Gym Leaders, designed for R/S remakes, hidden in B2/W2 coding? Or maybe old designs from original R/S/E?

Xander Olivieri May 19th, 2012 6:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wombateiro (Post 7181884)
It was established only by fans' speculations. But in games, there is nothing coming even close to prove that. Steven's appearance as Champion in B2/W2 also supports theory that R/S/E take place after all other games.

Um...no there is a lot of things in the games that support Kanto and Hoenn being at the same time, you just don't acknowledge any of it cause you don't like the idea. Yes Steven makes a comment about the Hoenn Protags. It was a reference, the same things you used to justify music as a coincidence. If it wasn't a reference he wouldn't have said that. They also wouldn't have included the Lanette/Bill work, nor would they have acknowledged that Bill and Lanette were co creators of the PC System.

Its more fan speculation with little to no support that Hoenn comes after them in the time line. Why would they make a game that is so far in the time line so early? Why were the new Special Pokeballs that were invented in Gen 3 still in Gen 4 if Devon Corp hadn't invented them yet? Why was scott Searching around the world to test his One of a Kind Facility if there were other versions in Kanto and Johto? Yes Scott Opened the Battle Fronteir in Emerald, it wasn't opened/finished until Emerald's Post game. There are many facts from the games that support its placement with Kanto or between the three year period between Kanto and Johto.

Steven is still the Hoenn Champion meaning Wallace is a Gym Leader, so they are following Ruby/Sapphire story if Steven being in the World Tournament is any reference to Hoenn games. We've been told to stop discussing this in other threads, so lets stop please neither side is going to accept the other, all major sources have Kanto and Hoenn at the same time, so unless Gamefreak comes out and says that Hoenn is in the future it isn't.

----
On topic:

We know that all the Gym Leaders will be downloadable cause the World Tournament says you can battle all of them from different regions. We also know that each Gym Leader can only use 3 Pokemon similar as to how the Battle Frontier usually works.

My question is what do you think the Gym Leaders will use? Some had more than three and obviously they'd use their best Pokemon. Though would they only use Pokemon from their Region?

I can see Brock sporting Onix, Golem, and Aerodactyl.
Misty I see sporting Starmie, Golduck, and Seadra.

SkyRyder May 19th, 2012 8:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XanderO (Post 7182007)
We know that all the Gym Leaders will be downloadable cause the World Tournament says you can battle all of them from different regions. We also know that each Gym Leader can only use 3 Pokemon similar as to how the Battle Frontier usually works.

My question is what do you think the Gym Leaders will use? Some had more than three and obviously they'd use their best Pokemon. Though would they only use Pokemon from their Region?

I can see Brock sporting Onix, Golem, and Aerodactyl.
Misty I see sporting Starmie, Golduck, and Seadra.

Well, what I think might happen is that each leader is given six Pokemon, but during the tournament the game selects three random Pokemon from that list. That's what I hope they will do.


Anyways, I'm looking forward to seeing this feature implemented. It'd be nice seeing downloadable characters like Red or N maybe, and not just leaders/champions. I wonder if Akuroma himself is either participating in this tournament, or if he's hosting it. Serebii says Cynthia's hosting it, but I don't really see it anywhere seeing as she's participating aswell from one of the screenshots.

Elite Overlord LeSabre™ May 19th, 2012 8:42 AM

I'm thinking that they'll have a pool of Pokemon to choose from, and three will be randomly chosen each time you battle, just so you don't battle the same three each time... that would get boring. I'd hope that they'd be creative in their teams and movesets so you can't just go in with a supereffective Pokemon and sweep them. Using Blaine as an example, he could equip a Typhlosion with Thunderpunch or something, or use a Clefable with Fire Blast.

Right now it's just Champions and Leaders, but there's always some possibility of extending the roster to include others at some point in the future. If they, Leaf would be my vote - they've used her male counterpart in way too many games thus far. She needs love :) Again, they may limit it to Leader and Champions and not include others at all; it's still too early to call. GF has been pulling some pretty crafty tricks with these games; nothing would surprise me at this point.

And I've said this before, but I'd really rather see the Unova Gym Leaders have a rematch system separate from the tournament. I'm still wondering as well what Akuroma's role in all this is because he's not a Champion or a Leader, and he's not a character from a past game.

Still not sure if I'll like this, as the Battle Tower/Frontier was always a source of rage and frustration for me due to the hax luck, but I'll say it's an interesting idea.

wombateiro May 20th, 2012 11:31 AM

I think Cynthia, Lance and obviously Gary are not real Champions because they already lost their Champion titles to their games' protagonists, knowing that gens 1, 2 and 4 have already happened before B2/W2. That's why their all battle titles say "Trainer" not "Champion". I think they are just decided to be labeled as Champions instead of protagonists because they have more defined teams and aren't completely silent. Steven might the only real Champion left, seeing how in HG/SS he still says to be official Champion, meaning that most likely R/S/E take place after B2/W2.
..................

Quote:

Originally Posted by XanderO (Post 7182007)
Um...no there is a lot of things in the games that support Kanto and Hoenn being at the same time, you just don't acknowledge any of it cause you don't like the idea. Yes Steven makes a comment about the Hoenn Protags. It was a reference, the same things you used to justify music as a coincidence. If it wasn't a reference he wouldn't have said that. They also wouldn't have included the Lanette/Bill work, nor would they have acknowledged that Bill and Lanette were co creators of the PC System.

Its more fan speculation with little to no support that Hoenn comes after them in the time line. Why would they make a game that is so far in the time line so early? Why were the new Special Pokeballs that were invented in Gen 3 still in Gen 4 if Devon Corp hadn't invented them yet? Why was scott Searching around the world to test his One of a Kind Facility if there were other versions in Kanto and Johto? Yes Scott Opened the Battle Fronteir in Emerald, it wasn't opened/finished until Emerald's Post game. There are many facts from the games that support its placement with Kanto or between the three year period between Kanto and Johto.

Steven is still the Hoenn Champion meaning Wallace is a Gym Leader, so they are following Ruby/Sapphire story if Steven being in the World Tournament is any reference to Hoenn games. We've been told to stop discussing this in other threads, so lets stop please neither side is going to accept the other, all major sources have Kanto and Hoenn at the same time, so unless Gamefreak comes out and says that Hoenn is in the future it isn't.

I replied to this in new thread in Gaming Central.

Peeta May 20th, 2012 11:33 AM

I don't just like it, I love it. It will give more to do than just run around, beat the E4, then do nothing but wifi and/or Battle Subway in Nimbasa ;; and eastern Unova is so BORING so I hope that this game is much improved in that area... post game, that is.

Korsola May 20th, 2012 5:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XanderO (Post 7172883)
I can see them bringing Red in since he is the Master champion in GSCHGSS and Blue is both a Champion and Gym Leader. They only list a few so we may not even have the full list yet. Maybe the Tournament randomizes which Gym Leader/Champions you fight.

I think I saw something on Serebii.net where you can download additional gym leaders and champions during certain times. Maybe there will be events where you can download a new character for the tournament?

But yeah, I'm sure the game will randomize which characters you fight so that it's not redundant each time you enter. Well... at least I hope that this is what they'll do. o_o

PokeFreak201306 May 21st, 2012 5:28 AM

Huge Bracketed Tournament....
Heck Yeah :D

Kenmoor May 23rd, 2012 5:17 PM

I think the Champions/Leaders should all be at least over Lv.70 and above IF the team levels aren't modified, i.e. random Battle Tower changes to Lv.50. Maybe Red's highest Pokemon could be Lv.100? (They need to retire Red... humiliating him with every game... honestly being beaten by the new kids on the block? Tsk, tsk...) I just hope Game Freak won't mess up this Battle Tournament for us with some pre-set level stuff. Well unless that's just one mode among more modes.

It'd be fun to go against teams that "cheat"/ have these random move sets that they normally shouldn't have. Also the AI should be programmed to use moves at the RIGHT time. Too many games have been ruined for me because the random Champion used moves that weren't supposed to be used (*stares at Cynthia's Milotic for overusing Aqua Ring*) as they could have beaten me. I like winning, just don't obliterate the epicness of the match.

I wonder what sort of event they'll have for the downloading? Wi-Fi seems the most probable. I do not want to go to Toys"R"Us for this...

Xander Olivieri May 23rd, 2012 5:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kenmoor (Post 7188307)
I think the Champions/Leaders should all be at least over Lv.70 and above IF the team levels aren't modified, i.e. random Battle Tower changes to Lv.50. Maybe Red's highest Pokemon could be Lv.100? (They need to retire Red... humiliating him with every game... honestly being beaten by the new kids on the block? Tsk, tsk...) I just hope Game Freak won't mess up this Battle Tournament for us with some pre-set level stuff. Well unless that's just one mode among more modes.

It'd be fun to go against teams that "cheat"/ have these random move sets that they normally shouldn't have. Also the AI should be programmed to use moves at the RIGHT time. Too many games have been ruined for me because the random Champion used moves that weren't supposed to be used (*stares at Cynthia's Milotic for overusing Aqua Ring*) as they could have beaten me. I like winning, just don't obliterate the epicness of the match.

I wonder what sort of event they'll have for the downloading? Wi-Fi seems the most probable. I do not want to go to Toys"R"Us for this...

You probably haven't seen, but Nintendo pulled down the distribution centers in all the toys R us and Gamestops so the only way to get events is through wifi now.

Zerrah. May 23rd, 2012 6:09 PM

All I can say is, if there is more opportunity to keep me interested post-game, then I'll take it. Hopefully they make the battle music awesome so I'll appreciate battling them over, and over, and over...

Ho-Oh May 24th, 2012 8:29 AM

Oh yeah with the music there's lots of different routes they could go. For example, you could have the normal battle theme remixed, remix the gym leader theme of B/W OR have a theme for everyone... or just have it based on region, each region gets its own specific theme song, idk, whichever was the e4 theme song of each region maybe?


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