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A few days ago while arguing with people on Pokémemes I realized something.
Long story short, I as always, was trying to tell people that RSE remakes were never properly announced, and with Ruby and Sapphire being compatible by proxy with the current Gen (plus, being at the very beginning of the Pokémon timeline, thus not really contemporary with the current Gen, as was the case with the other remakes) , they aren't as likely to happen as people think... basically the same theory I've expressed a few pages back on this very topic. In addition to some funny backlash, I mostly got two valid counter-arguments:
And then, another user, in passing, mentioned another possibility of an RSE re-release. And I though that that would take care of both problems neatly, bring roughly the same profit (because there's much, much less expenses involved) and give Game Freak more time to develop new things. Plus, it wasn't possible when remakes of the first two Gens were released, so I can imagine them switching to this now that they can. So, here goes: What if the RSE re-release we'll get... is a 3DS Virtual Console release, patched to be compatible with the current games and with trades via Wi-Fi? |
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The only reason for remakes is to be able to catch all the Hoenn Pokémon again. It was the same thing with RS back then, the easiest way to catch all the Kanto Pokémon was just to create a remake of the first games. Same with DPPt and HGSS, there are barely any Johto Pokémon in the Sinnoh games so a remake was necessary. People who want remakes lie to themselves believing this wasn't the reason behind the creation of previous remakes, but it was. Seeing Hoenn in 3D isn't enough reason for a remake. It maybe isn't fair that Hoenn was the only region not depicted in semi-3D, but it would be greatly unfair if Hoenn was the only region among the old ones depicted in full 3D, especially when there's no reason why Hoenn should be so special to the Pokémon franchise. If XY come out and there aren't many Hoenn Pokémon (like, there aren't at least 50 Pokémon from Hoenn), then I'll start believing there's a possibility of RSE remakes, but I'll still think they're unlikely because I think Gamefreak is done with the old regions. In fact, I think the only reason they created HGSS was because GSC were a huge success (way bigger than Hoenn was, for example) and the push for GSC remakes was much bigger than the nostalgia wave we're seeing with Hoenn right now. People wanted GSC remakes since before DP were released. A few years from now the kids who grew with Sinnoh will start requesting remakes of Sinnoh games for the ninth generation Nintendo handheld, and (if I'm still playing Pokémon by then) I'll tell them the same, as much as I love Sinnoh. Quote:
Also, Pokémon data from 3rd gen is incompatible with the later gens and needs to be converted to work properly. Really, the Pal Park was just a way to recreate a 3rd gen Pokémon in 4th gen with 4th gen data. Trading is a completely different matter, both games need to use the same code for Pokémon, and RSE has outdated code which is no longer used in the other games. |
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(plus, they could reuse the Wi-Fi as link cable for more GBA VC releases, so... I'd call it an interesting investment) |
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If we're talking looks wise, then Kanto is already up-to-date(before we go full 3D with X & Y) with the region itself being included in HGSS. Hoenn (itself) has yet to be caught up in this sense. Quote:
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Its game was removed from the circle, that alone is enough for them to add it back in since their whole shtick is connecting games with others. |
I get what you are trying to say, although I was more pointing out that just because a lot of people see no need for Gen III games to be made doesn't mean that they couldn't be. HGSS were just as pointless in that sense.
If you're going the whole region connection route, that can be used for both sides. With the Dsi and onward lacking a GBA slot and the older versions being discontinued, in a way Hoenn(and Kanto, as the stand alone original like you mentioned) have lost their connectivity. That would also keep remakes relevant when you think about it. Btw, Lugia and Ho-oh were both available in Gen III, remember the Naval Rock event? :P If not there, you could always trade Ho-oh from Colosseum and Lugia from XD(after purifying the latter) which of course didn't require events. By normal means or not, they were still available. |
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DSi was not a "New DS" but an Upgraded DS. Even if they were not compatible with GBA, the series they were born into were still compatible. DS and DSlite are compatible and by extension DSi and DSiXL are factored in with them in the larger view. With the games moving to the 3DS we move back to the 50:50 chance as now there is a slight need for remakes, but the need to remake them is no where as bold as it was for Gens 1 and 2. Even if we get Gen 3 remakes, we'll get Gen 1 remakes since they were still on the same system meaning if one gets remade, they both have the same chance of being remade. Just to mix things up as they have been, we may get one of each. With the new goal of "Evolving the Pokemon World" I don't believe we'll get any more remakes anytime soon. Unless they do a focus change from Evolving the games to something dealing with preserving or reliving the past. |
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And don't bring the "GBA was the worst selling Nintendo handheld" card. The GBA was the Nintendo handheld with the shortest lifespan, of course it would sell less than for example the entire Game Boy line, which lasted eleven years, or the DS, counting the DS Phat to the DSi XL, and considering the DSi, despite lacking new games for the 2013 exercise, is still being updated. In fact the 3rd gen games were helped by the fact the old DS still had compatibility with GBA games and by the release of DP a lot of Pokémon were only available via Pal Park. Quote:
So far there are two instances in the series where you need cross-gen trading to acquire all the Pokémon: from RBY to GSC (since GSC didn't have the RBY legends), and from DPPtHGSS to BW. The difference is that they're all within the same generation of console. They wouldn't support the GBA forever, because the GBA carts are huge compared to the DS and they could easily make all GBA games available in Virtual Console, so it was needed to make all Pokémon accessible within the DS only. And Hoenn fans who own only a DS can't complain, as the games feature most of the Hoenn Pokémon if not all of them (I think only Jirachi and Deoxys must be acquired through events). Johto was a neglected region in the 3rd gen. You couldn't access most Pokémon without owning a Gamecube and having the console games. Only Emerald gave you the possibility of acquiring a Johto starter in the handheld series. Whereas in the DS, the Hoenn starters could be acquired in HGSS with no major requirement, and all starters are available in 5th gen through Dream World events. |
Well this is getting fun again.
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Regardless of the fact that they were just that, upgrades, that can't just be a reason to ignore that the later redesigns of the DS and onward dropped the GBA slot and therefore the connectivity of the GBA games(and Hoenn/Kanto if you want to get picky). I'm not even sure how we got on this subject because it's not really going to go anywhere because, even now, we don't have direct connection between all regions and probably never will have it. Other than FrLg(because of them not adding every Pokemon to Hoenn), we didn't need anymore remakes anyways, HGSS obviously included as it is the only other set to date. Johto did not have a real reason to be connected itself with every Poke available from both sets of Gen III games(minus the said few legendaries, although the concept back then only complicated things anyways because of the lack of WiFi),a bigger part than the regions themselves. If we're going that whole connecting regions route, why don't they just prolong every gen so that they can keep all regions up-to-date and directly compatible with every other one? As I mentioned above, we still don't have direct connection between them all anyways. If they remade Gen I also then so be it, no complaints there personally. Quote:
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Looking at that, why is everyone so harsh on Hoenn and act as if the region should just fade into oblivion? Why can it not get the all 'prettied' up treatment like Johto, another region which had no real reason to be remade in itself? Hell, throw in Kanto as well if you must with it being constantly added in as relevant too. |
Seriously, Hoenn should, and likely is getting a remake. It might not have happened this gen, but it will now. Its the one region in the entire series that cannot be accessed on the 3DS, and that alone merits a revisit. Not to mention, Gen 5 was destined to be short, so whatever people say about it not being in gen 5 means its not happening, is null and void in my eyes.
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A feature that R/S still hasn't achieved yet. When we get word of the next handheld series in two or so years, then we'll get due report of the remakes, considering they want to risk not making much money seeing as the remakes don't sell as well as the originals and with the already low sales quota of Generation 3, they stand to lose more than gain. |
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While we likely will be able to transfer from Gen V to Gen VI, no doubt there won't be some huge connection(battling, etc) between the two and this will only make the connection with Hoenn even more tedious than it already is. With Hoenn Pokes being mostly available in the DS era as well, as everyone is using that as relevant, that is only driving the connection to the region itself further away. Going even further, with the GBA slot gone and the DS series to be discontinued altogether in the not too distant future, that will be the final blow to real Hoenn connectivity(and Kanto, once again if you're picky, even though it is available in HGSS). If that isn't enough for you, not including Kanto(just using it's appearance in HGSS as somewhat relevant in this point) and the 3DS being backwards compatible with DS games, Hoenn is the only region completely inaccessible on the 3DS. Quote:
To go along with , we also have people newer to the series who have never played the originals and would have a go if they were remade in this newer age, as a fresh adventure. Along with everyone wanting to revisit the region in a new light, surely this could be the opportunity to take advantage and make the most of that. Quote:
If the whole sales reason is behind why they won't remake the games(using your last statement here), then what exactly is happening in two years that will change that? Nothing. Gen III sales, being long gone, will not magically spring up to others by then enough to change there minds if that is the real reason; They'd still be risking money. |
I think the reason they decided to delay Hoenn is because they didn't want two remakes in one console, plus they proably thought what better way to honor Hoenn than to give it a whole new look in real 3D which would proably gain more interest in the remakes than if they were on the normal DS.
Also Hoenn's games were some of the top selling games in a console that didn't sell very well. Also as time goes by more people will proably desire a Hoenn remake, even some who don't want one now. Also Hoenn is the only region yet to be rendered in 3D (if they do remake it on the 3Ds it'll be some nice irony getting real 3D unlike the other four regions we know the names of), and lacks wi-fi features, night and day, and several other things which would make the remakes better. |
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If there'll be remakes of the Hoenn region, I think they will be launched in 2015, or later.
I always like the remakes because of the possibility of capturing every legendary, but a major part of Hoenn Pokémons are available in the current generation, so I will only play for the sake of seeing Hoenn in 3D with new mechanics. |
Things You Want/Don't Want to see in RSE Remake from RSE
Okay everyone, what is some things you would want to see put into a remake of Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald that was from the original game? It can be anything from the original games! I'll start with some:
Want to See: *Invisible Pokemon. It might have just been me but I actually liked the idea of having invisible Kecleon playing around and fighting them (mainly because I actually liked Kecleon XD ). *Space Center Rocket Launching. I know it doesn't have any big event (now) but I would still like to have it (and actually be able to watch at least one). *Fishing on Pokemon. Something I liked to do for Feebas hunting so I hope it comes back. *Clouds reflecting on water. I actually loved the look of the clouds reflecting on the water and would absolutely love to see it again. *Groudon/Kyogre Hunting. I liked to look around for the two legendary pokemon in Emerald and I hope it stays. Don't Want to See: *Team Aqua/Magma costumes. I'm pretty sure they didn't change them for Team Rocket in FR/LG/HG/SS but I really hope they update the look of their costumes. I feel like an idiot having to fight people who are dressed like pirates or look like they are wearing leg warmers (I know it is suppose to signify the whole water/land thing but come on, it looks silly) *Pokemon Battle Tents. I know they were there to replace the contest (and to help people learn about the frontier) but I didn't really like them because you didn't really get anything and you could just do the frontier at the end. |
Want: Nothing.
Don't want: Everything. Have you played any games past Hoenn? You can fish on top of a surfing Pokémon in every DS game. Why not remake Orre instead? Orre got two games, but it was in a fail console and didn't have a main series treatment. |
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As for Orre, I think you pretty much answered your own question. |
Merged with the existing thread on the matter...hopefully it doesn't get too hectic like it usually does. I wish more people would talk about what they want/don't want in the remake instead of debating the damn timeline. lol
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One thing that weighs heavily against RSE remakes, though, is that the mechanics of the game are mostly unchanged from RSE to B2W2. For the most part it would be playing the same game as the original. The only major addition was the physical/special split in DPPt, but would that by itself warrant an RSE remake? I don't think so. They may introduce a major mechanic overhaul in gen 6 which would even block compatibility with gen 5 (incredibly unlikely), but who knows. |
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Day/Night system: cosmetic thing. Not featuring it in RSE was a developer's decision (and, IMO, mistake). Evolution in certain areas: Impractical with Hoenn's map. HGSS didn't feature it anyway. Hidden abilities (plus extra abilities), more attacks (and pokemon): That's content, not mechanics. Save for the physical/special split, and a few features that were subsequently added to the series, the game as of now plays absolutely the same as it did upon RS's release. The jump from RBY to FRLG is much bigger than the difference between RSE and B2W2. The game wouldn't have more Pokémon either since the remakes usually feature the same regional dex as the originals. Only exception was in HGSS where you could get a few Pokémon that evolved when leveling up with a move learned, like Piloswine and Tangela. All additions would be made to the postgame, and, believe me, there's a heck of a lot they would need to add because Hoenn's postgame is non-existant outside of the Battle Frontier. Furthermore, I don't think GF feels RSE is outdated enough. They're still using sound effects introduced in RS. The minisprites in the Pokémon summary screen are all from RS (at least, the ones from the 386 first Pokémon). The core mechanics of the game are from RS. Unless there's something very significant coming around with XY, we won't see further remakes, be it of RSE, of DPPt or any other game. |
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