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BrandoSheriff November 10th, 2014 6:41 AM

Project M is pretty fun, especially Turbo Mode. That mode is combo city. xD

I like it and all, it brings back just about everything we loved about Melee, but I probably won't ever go back to it now that we have Smash 4, and the Wii U version is coming in less than 2 weeks. Smash 4 has so many things to do (and a lot more characters), and I now find it more fun than PM any day.

Pinkie-Dawn November 10th, 2014 8:41 AM

I've played Project M before. I was so use to Brawl's floaty physics, I wasn't able to get use to the Melee-ish physics and a couple of new animations some of the fighters were given.

Speaking of fighters, here's what the final roster of the Wii U version looks like:

Spoiler:
http://i1.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/861/761/efb.png

Welp, that debunks the rumor of extra characters on the Wii U version, who can also be transferred to the 3DS version. There appears to be less slots than the 3DS roster, which had 4 slots open. We know Mewtwo will fill in the bottom half of the Wii U roster, but what about the top half? It looks like it could be reserved for a DK rep, but the 3DS roster contradicts that. It also can't be for the Ice Climbers either due to technical difficulties on the 3DS version, and I doubt we're getting a new unrepresented IP character as DLC. (sorry, Inklings)

PlatinumDude November 10th, 2014 10:32 AM



Just thought I'd put this here. It's actually funnier than Snake's Codec, IMO.

Spinosaurus November 10th, 2014 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PlatinumDude (Post 8494141)
It's actually funnier than Snake's Codec, IMO.

Hardly

Snake codecs were actually informative and it felt like Snake and his team are actually up against people completely out of their league. Snake was also far more entertaining than Pit because he was actually being completely straight and serious (even among Otacon, Campbell and Mei Ling) in all this mess, making the situation all the more hilarious from seeing Snake's reactions. ("He attacks by...farting? Are you kidding me?!")

Palutena's Guidance is just...boring. Pit is just SUPER EXCITED about everything, which makes me him really annoying, and Palutena hardly goes into the character's background and her tips are crappy (USE THE ORBITARS FOR EVERYTHING). Viridi is the only one entertaining about all this, but she only shines in some of them. This is coming from someone who absolutely adores Kid Icarus Uprising's dialog. Really disappointed.

Nah November 10th, 2014 1:36 PM

The Palutena's Guidance thing wasn't bad, but it wasn't exactly funny either. Except for the ones with Samus and Robin. I don't think that it was meant to be terribly informative though, at least not if you've played Smash and/or fighting games before. Think it was more for if you don't know squat about some or all of the characters.

Also, isn't it a little early for this to be revealed? The WiiU version doesn't come out until the 21st.

bobandbill November 10th, 2014 4:45 PM

I think a bunch of websites which have pre-release copies (for reviews and etc) have started releasing information about the games like these bits and pieces, including a bunch of youtube channels (also a source of music in the Wii U version, and similarly was the case for the 3DS version too. I've checked some out but kinda want to see the rest by myself with what got in and what they sound like).

Aven November 10th, 2014 6:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pinkie-Dawn (Post 8494078)
I've played Project M before. I was so use to Brawl's floaty physics, I wasn't able to get use to the Melee-ish physics and a couple of new animations some of the fighters were given.

Speaking of fighters, here's what the final roster of the Wii U version looks like:

Spoiler:
http://i1.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/861/761/efb.png

Welp, that debunks the rumor of extra characters on the Wii U version, who can also be transferred to the 3DS version. There appears to be less slots than the 3DS roster, which had 4 slots open. We know Mewtwo will fill in the bottom half of the Wii U roster, but what about the top half? It looks like it could be reserved for a DK rep, but the 3DS roster contradicts that. It also can't be for the Ice Climbers either due to technical difficulties on the 3DS version, and I doubt we're getting a new unrepresented IP character as DLC. (sorry, Inklings)

Less slots? What do you mean? If you're talking about how it looks like there are many more on the 3Ds, it's just screen difference that makes the slots bigger etc.

Kameken November 10th, 2014 8:22 PM

While I find it funnier than Snake's (Which half the time sounded like its jokes were written by an eight year old), it's a shame that Pit's Codex isn't very funny for the most part, especially since KIU was so funny.

Pinkie-Dawn November 10th, 2014 9:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aven Starkiller (Post 8494535)
Less slots? What do you mean? If you're talking about how it looks like there are many more on the 3Ds, it's just screen difference that makes the slots bigger etc.

The 3DS roster has four empty spaces left for DLC characters, but the Wii U roster only has two empty spaces, which means we might be only getting two DLC characters, one of them being Mewtwo.

GreenFlame November 10th, 2014 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pinkie-Dawn (Post 8494629)
The 3DS roster has four empty spaces left for DLC characters, but the Wii U roster only has two empty spaces, which means we might be only getting two DLC characters, one of them being Mewtwo.

The Wii U roster has plenty more space, for at least 4 more characters. Besides, they can just shrink the roster when a DLC character is added to it like what happens when you unlock a character.

Pinkie-Dawn November 11th, 2014 7:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreenFlame (Post 8494651)
The Wii U roster has plenty more space, for at least 4 more characters. Besides, they can just shrink the roster when a DLC character is added to it like what happens when you unlock a character.

The problem is, it'll only cause the character boxes to continue shrinking to make more room, causing the character images at be at lower quality and less room for their names to be displayed inside the box.

El Héroe Oscuro November 11th, 2014 7:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pinkie-Dawn (Post 8494946)
The problem is, it'll only cause the character boxes to continue shrinking to make more room, causing the character images at be at lower quality and less room for their names to be displayed inside the box.

Still, you can't rule out the possibility of it. I'd personally sacrifice image quality for a bigger roster. If anything, an update could be implemented which has the roster work in a "page" layout where you hit a button and it flips to the next page of fighters. A little unorthodox, yes, but it could work.

Also +1 for the sweet Mega Man theme you're rocking, mate.

Pinkie-Dawn November 11th, 2014 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by El Héroe Oscuro (Post 8494965)
Still, you can't rule out the possibility of it. I'd personally sacrifice image quality for a bigger roster. If anything, an update could be implemented which has the roster work in a "page" layout where you hit a button and it flips to the next page of fighters. A little unorthodox, yes, but it could work.

One of my online friends finds that improbable because it wouldn't make sense for the player chips being separated from the other page of the CSS.

Quote:

Also +1 for the sweet Mega Man theme you're rocking, mate.
Thanks, it's to celebrate Air Man's theme making the cut in the Smash Bros. soundtrack.

Night Watcher November 14th, 2014 4:24 PM

Fake SSB Prodigy
 
So, I was watching a video of this 10 year old Girl Prodigy, but she was an actor. I was so sad when I found out. She actually made me want to actually learn combos and get better in SSB4. But here's the link.
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/7.864928-Amazing-10-Year-Old-Girl-Playing-Super-Smash-Bros-Turns-Out-to-be-a-Hoax

Aven November 15th, 2014 3:02 AM

*Tumbleweed blows by*
... Hey everyone, Mewtwo's Y form for Smash 4!? Or just as a Alternate costume maybe?

Any possible new movesets for Mewtwo?

Do you want them to remake Mewtwo since it's been so long? Or, "PLEASE JUST LEAVE MEWTWO ALONE HE'S ALREADY AWESOME AND UNIQUE, JUST STOP MESSING UP MY LIHIFE!!!! D'x" Kind of thing?

Anvils Alive November 16th, 2014 2:53 PM

Not sure if anyone's heard yet, but here's DaThings1's hilarious take on the 50-fact extravaganza. Huzzah!

PokéSwimmer November 17th, 2014 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aven Starkiller (Post 8498408)
*Tumbleweed blows by*
... Hey everyone, Mewtwo's Y form for Smash 4!? Or just as a Alternate costume maybe?

Any possible new movesets for Mewtwo?

Do you want them to remake Mewtwo since it's been so long? Or, "PLEASE JUST LEAVE MEWTWO ALONE HE'S ALREADY AWESOME AND UNIQUE, JUST STOP MESSING UP MY LIHIFE!!!! D'x" Kind of thing?

I'd prefer if they got creative with Mewtwo's moveset. He was so horribly designed in Melee, that I feel players will welcome the change.

GreenFlame November 18th, 2014 1:08 AM

Hey everyone, Version 1.0.4 is out! This update contains alteration of some fighters for the purpose of balance, which means any old Replays will be invalidated upon downloading the update.

Who do you think they changed? I've heard rumours that they removed Wectoring, and also speculation that they may have nerfed Rosalina slightly.

Edit: Rosalina has been nerfed! Instead of Luma respawning after 8 seconds, it now respawns after 18 seconds!

Nah November 18th, 2014 5:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreenFlame (Post 8501358)
Hey everyone, Version 1.0.4 is out! This update contains alteration of some fighters for the purpose of balance, which means any old Replays will be invalidated upon downloading the update.

Who do you think they changed? I've heard rumours that they removed Wectoring, and also speculation that they may have nerfed Rosalina slightly.

Edit: Rosalina has been nerfed! Instead of Luma respawning after 8 seconds, it now respawns after 18 seconds!

Oh, so they did give Rosalina a bit of a nerf. I wonder if they did anything else?

buff Robin plz

GreenFlame November 18th, 2014 5:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zekrom (Post 8501466)
Oh, so they did give Rosalina a bit of a nerf. I wonder if they did anything else?

buff Robin plz

Oh, they did a lot more. This is what I can confirm:
  • Ike's movement speed and jumping height has been increased
  • ^So has the speed of several of his attacks
  • King Dedede's down throw now sends opponents less forward and more upward slightly
  • Ness' down throw now deals only 7% damage as opposed to 9% before
  • All of Shulk's standard attacks now deal at minimum 1% more damage than before
  • "Bowsercide" - Using Flying Slam on an opponent off of the edge - now kills Bowser first, meaning that when both are on their last stock Bowser loses. Previously, Bowser won the match in this situation
  • Zelda's up-tilt deals 1% more damage
  • Little Mac's jab deals a decent amount less damage
  • "Wectoring" - An aerial momentum glitch exclusive to Wario - has been removed
  • Rosalina and Luma has had the Luma's respawn time increased from 8 seconds to 13 seconds
  • More to come
Keep in mind that I myself have not confirmed the ones about Ike, Shulk, Zelda, Wario or Little Mac, but I can confirm by reliable sources that Wario's is true. All others have been tested by me and I can say they are true.

Nah November 18th, 2014 5:44 AM

Ah, I figured they'd get rid of the Wectoring thing. And I'm so glad that they nerfed the Bowsercide thing, that was so annoying.

I did just do a match as Ike, and he does seem a little faster. Just a little. Either that or I'm imagining it because I was told he's faster.

El Héroe Oscuro November 18th, 2014 6:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zekrom (Post 8501490)
Ah, I figured they'd get rid of the Wectoring thing. And I'm so glad that they nerfed the Bowsercide thing, that was so annoying.

I did just do a match as Ike, and he does seem a little faster. Just a little. Either that or I'm imagining it because I was told he's faster.

So many time's I lost in For The Glory because people would do that. I'm happy they got rid of Bowserciding.

GreenFlame November 18th, 2014 6:38 AM

I've also heard that they nerfed Greninja's lag cancel with Shadow Sneak or something. I think that before you could cancel his down air lag by using Shadow Sneak, and they completely removed that. I can't confirm this either until I test it, but I think it's made some Greninja mains upset.

LauriJ November 18th, 2014 9:17 AM

So, who is your favourite amongst the new characters? I think both Rosalina and Duck Hunt Dog are awesome in their own way.

GreenFlame November 18th, 2014 8:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LauriJ (Post 8501605)
So, who is your favourite amongst the new characters? I think both Rosalina and Duck Hunt Dog are awesome in their own way.

Rosalina is an awesome character, but I just think she was a bit OP so I'm kind of glad she got nerfed because 8 seconds wasn't long enough of a reward for taking out her Luma. Duck Hunt Duo is just flat-out annoying to fight for me, and I don't like them as a character either (sorry).

My favourite Newcomers...
Little Mac
Rosalina and Luma
I think that's it, though I like the addition of Miis.



About 1.0.4 more stuff has been confirmed, Mega Man's Leaf Shield has a lot less ending lag upon throwing it, which means it's actually USABLE now. Sheik's Bouncing Fish has been nerfed to deal less knockback, and personally I think that nerf was uncalled for.

EDIT: THEY NERFED SHEIK'S UP AIR, I'M VERY UPSET ABOUT THIS BECAUSE IT WAS VERY SATISFYING TO KILL WITH THAT MOVE! Also, they buffed Luigi's F-smash by 1%.

Necrum November 18th, 2014 8:39 PM

I needed to post because lol 1%

Nah November 19th, 2014 5:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreenFlame (Post 8502232)
About 1.0.4 more stuff has been confirmed, Mega Man's Leaf Shield has a lot less ending lag upon throwing it, which means it's actually USABLE now. Sheik's Bouncing Fish has been nerfed to deal less knockback, and personally I think that nerf was uncalled for.

EDIT: THEY NERFED SHEIK'S UP AIR, I'M VERY UPSET ABOUT THIS BECAUSE IT WAS VERY SATISFYING TO KILL WITH THAT MOVE! Also, they buffed Luigi's F-smash by 1%.

IDK, I'm a bit glad they nerfed a couple of Sheik's moves a bit. probably only because Sheik players tend to wreck me online

Has anything else been confirmed though?

GreenFlame November 19th, 2014 6:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zekrom (Post 8502497)
IDK, I'm a bit glad they nerfed a couple of Sheik's moves a bit. probably only because Sheik players tend to wreck me online

Has anything else been confirmed though?

Apparently they removed DACUS (Dash attack cancelled up-smash), which involved using a dash-attack then cancelling it with an up-smash. It was very useful for every character, and now it's gone.

UPDATE: Please don't take any of this information as "confirmed". See this post by me.

Here's a changelist of changes discovered by the community for character related changes, taken from this Smashboards thread.

Zero Suit Samus:
Spoiler:
Hitbox fixes:
- Side-b works better now; the first hit doesn't launch directly into the sweet-spot in earlier versions. Also recovers faster due to more interruptable frames.
- Forward Smash connects better and is easier to sweetspot, working better on Greninja among others. It is a little safer on block now.
- Neutral air has a different subtly knockback angle now which makes some old combos not work but enables some new (better) ones.
- Down Smash is safer on block, enough that you can jab before the opponent can drop their shield
- Up-B connects better from down throw now (in the air).
- Down throw knockback is different; it starts lower, and instead instead of growing to eventually become more vertical, they are now launched at a set distance in front Zero Suit and the growth is vertical from that set point. I don't know how to explain this in technical terms, but opponents are no longer at a very vertical point from Zero Suit at high % after down throw.
- Zair recovery tether distance reduced when above the stage or too far below the stage. When she is lateral with the stage it is the same.
- Airdodge landing lag increased to 22f of lag from 15
- Paralyzer Shot's uncharged shot has a few more frames of recovery. Full charge is unaffected.
- Can no longer footstool infinite Robin.

Customs:
- Blast Shot and Spreading Shot can now be released before being charged fully.
- Spreading Shot now lasts long enough for ZSS to get a follow-up
- Whip Lash got the same buff as normal side-b, it is interruptable from an earlier point
- Impact Kick now properly absorbs the target so that the final hit connects properly
- Lateral Kick now allows ZSS full aerial movement during special fall
- Low Flip travels faster across the field


Sheik:
Spoiler:
FAIR DAMAGE : 6.8% ⇒ 5.5%
SOURSPOT FAIR DAMAGE : 6% ⇒ 4.8%
UAIR NUMBER OF HITS : 5 ⇒ 4
UAIR DAMAGE : 8% ⇒ 7%​
- Bouncing Fish knockback decreased, killing Mario at 131% from 111%
- Uair knockback decreased, killing ~26% later 6.8%


Rosalina and Luma:
Spoiler:
EARLY NAIR DAMAGE : 6% ⇒ 5%
LATE NAIR DAMAGE : 10% ⇒ 7.5%
LUMA RESPAWN : 8.9 seconds ⇒ 12.5 seconds
LUMA RECALL : Returns to Rosalina faster
LUMA SHOT : Uncharged and lightly charged Luma Shot has slightly less distance
DSMASH : Ending lag increased
GRAB : Whiff animation ending lag increased

- Dtilt has no hitbox on her head anymore
- Dsmash cooldown increased
- Luma shot and Luma callback endlag decreased
- Nair damage (6% -> 5%, 10% -> 7%) and knockback (94->86, 125->103)
- Upsmash Knockback decreased (147->135)
- Fsmash Knockback slightly decreased (154->149)
- Rosalina's up smash has different knockback, either less in general or simply at a different angle
- Luma can attack while Rosalina is being pummeled, but it cannot attack while a throw animation is in progress.


Wii Fit Trainer:
Spoiler:
AIR DODGE LANDING LAG : 12 frames ⇒ 22 frames
- Back hit of Fair no longer goes through shields but does significant shield damage now


Mr. Game and Watch:
Spoiler:
- Bucket no longer charges to full with Pikachu's Thunder!!


Little Mac:
Spoiler:
JAB 2 : Damage reduced by ~1%
JAB 3 : Damage reduced by ~1%
JAB COMBO : Overall damage significantly reduced
AERIAL SIDE B : Distance has been reduced by 10% and slower speed​


Yoshi:
Spoiler:
NEUTRAL B : Slightly longer start-up.
DASH ATTACK : Slightly more ending lag.
DAIR LANDING LAG : Slightly more landing lag.
DOWN B : No longer slides on slopes.
BUGFIX : Teleggporting removed.​


Okay, screw this, I just realised how many characters have been changed, and I am not gonna go to the effort of copy-pasting every single characters changes. If you'd like to see the rest, go to the Smashboards thread I linked above.

Also keep in mind that these are only the ones that have been discovered, there may be more changes that are yet to be discovered. Alternatively, Nintendo could just release patch notes so everyone knows what's changed, but nope, they decide to be vague YET AGAIN.




I just saw the rest of the nerfs Sheik got, and I think I might cry. Seriously though, that's just unfair. They nerfed her U-air like hell, and nerfed her F-air and Bouncing Fish, and it's not something I'm happy about at all.
They also nerfed Mac's jab, which I am more understanding about.

Nah November 19th, 2014 10:20 AM

Gave the OP of that thread a look. I can't say I completely understand the finer points of Smash, but nothing horrendous happened imo. Er, well, I wish that that hadn't buffed Falco's blaster, but whatcha supposed to do?

Someone's gonna have to explain this one to me though:

Quote:

Robin: Footstool glitch allowing an infinite has been fixed.​

And I agree, Nintendo should just give us detailed patch notes already. What's so hard about that?

blue November 19th, 2014 11:15 AM

Super Smash Bros. for Wii U scored 96/100 on Metacritic so far

That's actually one of the best scores I've ever seen, the only other score beating that is GTA V which is only one point higher. Albiet this is early days, but so far things are looking good!

Pinkie-Dawn November 19th, 2014 7:52 PM

So Sakurai finally reveals his reasons on why Ridley wasn't playable yet again: http://playeressence.com/sakurai-says-that-including-ridley-in-smash-bros-would-take-a-lot-of-convoluted-hocus-pocus/

At least now I can hope for a DK rep now that DLC is a thing, but I feel really bad for the Metroid fanbase, since there really isn't anyone important from the series left who has potential to be playable (Mother Brain and Dark Samus being assist trophies, and Ridley being a stage hazard).

Disolia November 19th, 2014 8:16 PM

I'm honestly not sure how games like GTA V even get such high rating, then again I've never actually been a fan of the GTA franchise.

GreenFlame November 19th, 2014 8:43 PM

UPDATE: I've since found out that the majority of the ZSS information from that thread and my earlier post is untrue. There are many people suffering from the Placebo effect, so I advise everyone to take any of the "confirmed" information about any of the characters in that thread or anywhere else with a grain of salt, unless it's confirmed by me doing tests or another reliable source, or anyone else who has confirmed it with side-by-side tests.

Of course, none of this would be necessary if Nintendo would just release patch notes...

GreenFlame November 19th, 2014 9:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zekrom (Post 8502784)
Gave the OP of that thread a look. I can't say I completely understand the finer points of Smash, but nothing horrendous happened imo. Er, well, I wish that that hadn't buffed Falco's blaster, but whatcha supposed to do?

Someone's gonna have to explain this one to me though:

"Robin: Footstoll glitch allowing an infinite has been fixed."


And I agree, Nintendo should just give us detailed patch notes already. What's so hard about that?

Footstool Jumping is where you input a jump while directly above someone's head. It will propel you up a fair distance and they will tumble a short distance, possibly to their death (unless they're on the ground when you jump on them). And no, it's not a glitch (obviously, lol).

As for what the a actual Robin infinite is, I have no idea. But it was clearly unintended, because they fixed it (according to that thread).

EDIT: Sorry for double-posting.




EDIT again: Decided I'll make this post of confirmed information:

Information I can confirm about the update:
  • Using Flying Slam as Bowser on an opponent and taking them offstage now KOs Bowser first
  • Luigi's forward smash deals 1% more damage, and 2% more when fully charged
  • Rosalina and Luma's Luma respawn time increased from 8 seconds to 13 seconds
  • Luma returns to Rosalina faster upon being called back
  • Ness' down throw deals 7% damage, as opposed to previous 9%
  • Falco's blaster on the ground now fires faster than before
  • Sheik's up air KOs later

Information that is probably true, but is yet to be confirmed by me:
  • DACUS (Dash attack cancelled up smash) has been removed
  • Vectoring (also known as VI or Vector Influence) has been removed for vertical knockback only; traditional Directional Influence is necessary now
  • Wectoring (the Wario momentum glitch) has been fixed
  • Lag cancelling has been removed (e.g you can no longer cancel Greninja's lag aerials with Shadow Sneak, or Link's by using bombs)

We'll see more as we discover more. I refuse to post anything under "Information I can confirm about the update" that I am any bit unsure about or I have not confirmed.

Rellek November 20th, 2014 12:08 AM

Actually vectoring hasn't been removed entirely. It has been removed for vertical based knockbacks, but not horizontal ones.

When getting hit by an attack that sends you to the sides or corners, holding up actually INCREASES the amount of knockback you receive while holding down (While being a terrible DI direction) LESSENS the knockback you receive.

It seems to me that this was put into place to make it more difficult for people to live. They saw how much DI can influence people living or dying (mostly living if you're good) and said "Hey! Stop holding up and to the corner when you're hit, because now it's going to help kill you."

Aven November 21st, 2014 9:20 PM

Yay! Our first (semi) major update! Actually changing some character stuff. And yes, I wish Nintendo would at least put a link to their website with all of the things that have been tweaked and changed. I also wish they wouldn't put in secrets to the game that never get found until a year or so later, but that's Nintendo for you.

I agree that Sheik's fish jump move thing (assuming it is true) Was a little uncalled for, since I was SO bad at landing that thing anyway. I personally haven't fought many Sheik's online before, But I suppose if Nintendo got multiple complaints that the launching power of it was too much and people WERE constantly getting easily KOed, then I could understand. But if not? Way uncalled for. I also can't speak for her Up Air because I don't play her often and I don't honestly know how it does or did, but sorry anyway. I'm guessing sad stuff like that is going to happen pretty regularly, but unlike most games I'm pretty sure Nintendo will do a great job of keeping us happy too by fixing stuff we've been annoyed by :) So don't think that this is totally the end for Smash just because you feel uncomfortable with your characters new move style.

Has anything major, or anything at all changed with Marth? I feel like there's really nothing they can do to hurt Marth just because they nerfed him so much already, but I'm soooo hoping they fix him.

GreenFlame November 21st, 2014 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aven Starkiller (Post 8505392)
Has anything major, or anything at all changed with Marth? I feel like there's really nothing they can do to hurt Marth just because they nerfed him so much already, but I'm soooo hoping they fix him.

There's been rumours, like they made his d-air meteor easier to land, or they slightly improved the speed of some of his attacks, but as far as I know there's been nothing confirmed. I will update this post if I do find out anything. (I wish they would improve the length of his sword just a tiny bit)
EDIT: It appears nothing has changed specifically about Marth, but the removal of vertical Vectoring is technically a huge indirect buff to Marth because of how it will be easier to juggle opponents and land Dancing Blade etc.

About Sheik, basically her u-air was her primary juggling tool, and they nerfed it to do less hits, less knockback, and less damage. It was also a great kill move, but now it's less so.

Bouncing Fish used to be able to take a stock early if you hit them while they're offstage - I've heard it's a lot harder to do that now because of the nerfed knockback. It was also a good kill move at high-ish percents, but it's now harder to kill with.

Saeran November 22nd, 2014 10:21 AM

Don't have it myself but played on a friends DS and it was FUN!

Aven November 22nd, 2014 8:22 PM

Thank god they fixed the Luma spawn. That was a huge nerf (and a very good/needed one) In my opinion. Those Rosalina's shouldn't be too tough now Flame :p

Pinkie-Dawn November 23rd, 2014 7:50 AM

So I've been hearing some nasty comments on how unfair the CPUs are at higher difficulties on the Wii U version compared to the 3DS version. I had my fair share of these brutal CPUs on Event Mode when trying to beat the last two matches on a hard difficulty.

Dragon November 24th, 2014 7:37 AM

Has anyone bought the Wii U version of Smash bros.? I just got it, so, hopefully it goes better than the 3DS version. :3

Aven November 24th, 2014 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pinkie-Dawn (Post 8506749)
So I've been hearing some nasty comments on how unfair the CPUs are at higher difficulties on the Wii U version compared to the 3DS version. I had my fair share of these brutal CPUs on Event Mode when trying to beat the last two matches on a hard difficulty.

CPU's are way too easy for me compared to Melee and Project M. So don't worry about random noobs in the Smash community that are still struggling to beat level 6's.

LightBlast November 24th, 2014 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreenFlame (Post 8503399)
UPDATE: I've since found out that the majority of the ZSS information from that thread and my earlier post is untrue. There are many people suffering from the Placebo effect, so I advise everyone to take any of the "confirmed" information about any of the characters in that thread or anywhere else with a grain of salt, unless it's confirmed by me doing tests or another reliable source, or anyone else who has confirmed it with side-by-side tests.

Of course, none of this would be necessary if Nintendo would just release patch notes...

Can you tell us which infos got deconfirmed? Would have been great if one of my mains got buffed but I guess ZSS really was too strong for more buffs.

Aven November 24th, 2014 12:48 PM

Oh also, I can confirm that the "rumors" about Marth were not true. He is definitely not faster and his sword is definitely not longer. I know Marth super well so yeah, he hasn't changed sadly :/

GreenFlame November 24th, 2014 5:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aven Starkiller (Post 8508104)
Oh also, I can confirm that the "rumors" about Marth were not true. He is definitely not faster and his sword is definitely not longer. I know Marth super well so yeah, he hasn't changed sadly :/

Yeah, no changes to Marth, except for fixing that Counter glitch where Marth would be killed if he used Counter in the air after having the ledge stolen by him or something. But like I said before, the removal of vertical Vectoring seems to be a nice buff to Marth.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LightBlast (Post 8508099)
Can you tell us which infos got deconfirmed? Would have been great if one of my mains got buffed but I guess ZSS really was too strong for more buffs.

This is what the Smashboards thread says now about ZSS, after having the information presumably confirmed by testing (I think):
ZERO SUIT SAMUS

AIR DODGE nerf
LANDING LAG : 15 frames ⇒ 22 frames​

USMASH nerf
HITS ON : Frame 9 ⇒ Frame 11​

PARALYZER nerf
ENDING LAG : Increased​

SPREADING SHOT buff
ENDING LAG : Reduced​

Aven November 24th, 2014 5:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreenFlame (Post 8508358)
Yeah, no changes to Marth, except for fixing that Counter glitch where Marth would be killed if he used Counter in the air after having the ledge stolen by him or something. But like I said before, the removal of vertical Vectoring seems to be a nice buff to Marth.


This is what the Smashboards thread says now about ZSS, after having the information presumably confirmed by testing (I think):
ZERO SUIT SAMUS

AIR DODGE nerf
LANDING LAG : 15 frames ⇒ 22 frames​

USMASH nerf
HITS ON : Frame 9 ⇒ Frame 11​

PARALYZER nerf
ENDING LAG : Increased​

SPREADING SHOT buff
ENDING LAG : Reduced​

Oh thank god! Finally! ZSS was just way too fast after she stunned you. Give a guy a chance man xD

Pinkie-Dawn November 25th, 2014 8:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aven Starkiller (Post 8508011)
CPU's are way too easy for me compared to Melee and Project M. So don't worry about random noobs in the Smash community that are still struggling to beat level 6's.

Some of the comments were also coming from pro Smash players, so I guess it entirely depends on your skill against the CPUs.

Aven November 25th, 2014 9:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pinkie-Dawn (Post 8508904)
Some of the comments were also coming from pro Smash players, so I guess it entirely depends on your skill against the CPUs.

"pro Smashers"? Like who? And trust me, if you've ever fought a level 9 Fox in Melee compared to a level 6 Fox on Project M you'll know what I'm talking about. Because a level 6 Project M Fox is better than the level 9 Melee Fox. I think most of the complaints might just be because some people aren't used to the newer strategy type characters such as Rosalina, Pac-Man and Villager. But honestly, even if they are extremely hard in Smash 4 Wii U, I'll be way more happy than sad. When has there been a time where ALL cpu levels were too hard? Not ever, but there has been a lot of times where even the highest level 9 was too easy and got boring. So I personally don't see the problem?

Pinkie-Dawn November 25th, 2014 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aven Starkiller (Post 8508971)
"pro Smashers"? Like who?

The people of Smashboards, which has a thread explaining about this: http://smashboards.com/threads/is-it-just-me-or-are-cpus-way-cheaper-in-the-wii-u-version.379088/


Quote:

And trust me, if you've ever fought a level 9 Fox in Melee compared to a level 6 Fox on Project M you'll know what I'm talking about. Because a level 6 Project M Fox is better than the level 9 Melee Fox.
Well of course Project M's CPU will be harder, because it's a mod. They can easily manipulate their A.I. at will.


Quote:

But honestly, even if they are extremely hard in Smash 4 Wii U, I'll be way more happy than sad. When has there been a time where ALL cpu levels were too hard? Not ever, but there has been a lot of times where even the highest level 9 was too easy and got boring. So I personally don't see the problem?
This type of mentality is why I don't understand hardcore gamers. Not every game needs to be ridiculous hard like the NES/SNES days in order to be good and frown upon difficulty settings because they want rookies to have the same experience of difficulty they had when they were kids. Smash is no exception.

Spinosaurus November 25th, 2014 12:16 PM

I don't see any pro Smasher in that thread. (Don't consider mods pro smashers, they normally aren't)

Also Project M AI is ridiculous and not fun at all, unless your idea of fun is going against a thing that has insane reactions and can counterplay you at any giving moment with no possible way of baiting and trapping it.

GreenFlame November 25th, 2014 4:09 PM

I don't think the AI will ever be truly fun to fight, because they always have insane reactions, it's unavoidable. That's what makes up for their difficulty. In general, it's better to fight real people.



On a different subject, does anyone else think Lucina is competitively pointless while Marth exists? That's not to say she isn't competitively viable, but since she is just a direct downgrade of Marth once a player has spacing, if someone is truly playing to win in the competitive scene, there is no reason to pick her over Marth.

Spinosaurus November 25th, 2014 4:14 PM

Yeah all Lucina has over Marth is up smash and down air. Marth is pretty much better in every other way and is SAFER on block. (and has slightly better reach because he's a little taller)

So unless you wanna handicap yourself in some way or just like the character there's no reason to pick her over Marf.

Pinkie-Dawn November 26th, 2014 9:53 AM

But wasn't Marth's air-game and speed nerfed, whereas Lucina is suppose to be what old Marth use to be other than the lack of spacing?

Nah November 26th, 2014 11:29 AM

Nah, the only difference between Marth and Lucina (besides appearance and voice) is Marth's tipping thing. Not sure how Marth's safer on block (or what that even means), but there's very little difference between the two.

And I can see how, in the hands of more skilled players, that Marth > Lucina. If you're really good at keeping the right amount of space between you and your opponent, Marth will always hit harder and for more damage than Lucina. What's better about Lucina than Marth on a larger scale is that she's easier to use for less competitive/skilled players since you don't have to worry about spacing/tipping at all to get the most out of her.

Spinosaurus November 26th, 2014 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pinkie-Dawn (Post 8510109)
But wasn't Marth's air-game and speed nerfed, whereas Lucina is suppose to be what old Marth use to be other than the lack of spacing?

Absolutely untrue
http://smashboards.com/threads/before-you-ask-the-differences-between-marth-and-lucina.376180/
Quote:

Originally Posted by Zekrom (Post 8510213)
Nah, the only difference between Marth and Lucina (besides appearance and voice) is Marth's tipping thing. Not sure how Marth's safer on block (or what that even means), but there's very little difference between the two.

And I can see how, in the hands of more skilled players, that Marth > Lucina. If you're really good at keeping the right amount of space between you and your opponent, Marth will always hit harder and for more damage than Lucina. What's better about Lucina than Marth on a larger scale is that she's easier to use for less competitive/skilled players since you don't have to worry about spacing/tipping at all to get the most out of her.

Check the above link. It's easier to punish Lucina when you shield her attacks than you could against Marth. It's a slight difference at a glance if you look at the frame data, but those can make all the difference between winning and losing in reality.

Which means she's actually HARDER to use than Marth because she cannot be as aggressive as him and instead needs to be more patient and careful. Moreover, you don't need to hit tippers with Marth consistently, as long as you do hit it occasionally. He's easier to use, more aggressive and just plain better.

Dragon November 26th, 2014 1:08 PM

If that's all the case, why did they even bother creating Lucina for the game? D:

Nah November 26th, 2014 1:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spinosaurus (Post 8510283)
http://smashboards.com/threads/before-you-ask-the-differences-between-marth-and-lucina.376180/

Check the above link. It's easier to punish Lucina when you shield her attacks than you could against Marth. It's a slight difference at a glance if you look at the frame data, but those can make all the difference between winning and losing in reality.

Which means she's actually HARDER to use than Marth because she cannot be as aggressive as him and instead needs to be more patient and careful. Moreover, you don't need to hit tippers with Marth consistently, as long as you do hit it occasionally. He's easier to use, more aggressive and just plain better.

Ooooooh, I see now. I usually never notice these subtleties. It also explains a few things I noticed while fighting with her....

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dragon (Post 8510315)
If that's all the case, why did they even bother creating Lucina for the game? D:

People wanted to play as her. I know I did.

Spinosaurus November 26th, 2014 1:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dragon (Post 8510315)
If that's all the case, why did they even bother creating Lucina for the game? D:

Filler. She was an alt skin but promoted as a playable character to pad the roster after certain unexpected cuts. She's popular enough to warrant a slot.

Why didn't they bother making her comparable to Marth is the question, really. :V

GreenFlame November 26th, 2014 5:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spinosaurus (Post 8510357)
Filler. She was an alt skin but promoted as a playable character to pad the roster after certain unexpected cuts. She's popular enough to warrant a slot.

Why didn't they bother making her comparable to Marth is the question, really. :V

Exactly. I kind wish she was an alt for Marth, or like you said at least comparable to him. No offense anyone, but she's got a lot more personality than Marth (who doesn't speak english). His hair was not very good in Brawl. It looks better in Smash 4, but in Brawl it looked girly and I actually wasn't sure what gender he was supposed to be when I played Brawl (I didn't know what Fire Emblem was), until I read his trophy description.

Here's Brawl Marth compared to Smash 4 Marth, and looking at the pictures, you can't blame me for thinking he was a girl...(pics from SmashWiki):

Marth has more of a 'heroic' vibe than Lucina though, but in the end, both characters aren't bad. I just wish I had the option to play Lucina as an alt of Marth if I wanted to.

Pinkie-Dawn November 26th, 2014 6:06 PM

With all of these comparisons, I have a feeling that Lucina is first in line to get the boot for the next game, as well as to make room for an FE rep from the latest installment, unless he/she suffers the same issues as Chrom.

Nah November 26th, 2014 6:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreenFlame (Post 8510603)
His hair was not very good in Brawl. It looks better in Smash 4, but in Brawl it looked girly and I actually wasn't sure what gender he was supposed to be when I played Brawl (I didn't know what Fire Emblem was), until I read his trophy description.

Here's Brawl Marth compared to Smash 4 Marth, and looking at the pictures, you can't blame me for thinking he was a girl...(pics from SmashWiki):

IDK, I always knew that Marth was a guy......

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pinkie-Dawn (Post 8510651)
With all of these comparisons, I have a feeling that Lucina is first in line to get the boot for the next game, as well as to make room for an FE rep from the latest installment, unless he/she suffers the same issues as Chrom.

There's little doubt in my mind that Robin and Lucina won't be making it into future Smash games. I think at this point it's safe to say that Marth and Ike (probably) are going to be our regular Fire Emblem reps and anyone else who comes along from the series is just gonna be a one-timer. That's the feeling I get anyway. It's too bad though; Robin has a kinda unique play style.

Pinkie-Dawn November 26th, 2014 6:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zekrom (Post 8510662)
There's little doubt in my mind that Robin and Lucina won't be making it into future Smash games. I think at this point it's safe to say that Marth and Ike (probably) are going to be our regular Fire Emblem reps and anyone else who comes along from the series is just gonna be a one-timer. That's the feeling I get anyway. It's too bad though; Robin has a kinda unique play style.

I'm pretty sure Robin's gonna stay, because he represents the avatar, which is becoming a staple to the series since Fire Emblem 12. Robin just happens to be the most popular variation of the avatar feature.

GreenFlame November 26th, 2014 7:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zekrom (Post 8510662)
IDK, I always knew that Marth was a guy......

But look at his hair and his face in Brawl. He does look a bit like a girl, right? I wasn't sure, because I'd never known the character before.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zekrom (Post 8510662)
There's little doubt in my mind that Robin and Lucina won't be making it into future Smash games. I think at this point it's safe to say that Marth and Ike (probably) are going to be our regular Fire Emblem reps and anyone else who comes along from the series is just gonna be a one-timer. That's the feeling I get anyway. It's too bad though; Robin has a kinda unique play style.

They'll likely keep Robin because of that unique playstyle. They usually only cut clones, except for Snake who was a third-party "guest character", and Mewtwo who is coming back as DLC anyway.

Lord Raven November 27th, 2014 3:18 AM

I highly doubt Lucina stays in the next smash; I think a huge part of Lucina's role in Smash is the fact that she was one of the main pulls of Awakening. The mystique behind this masked Marth coming out of nowhere in Awakening I think sold the game quite a bit.

It's really strange what they did to Marth though, considering this is his official art in the most recent game:

http://old.serenesforest.net/media/fe12illust/marth2.png

Aven November 27th, 2014 7:16 AM

Too much stuff to comment about xD But I will say that I'm confused on all the hate on Project M? I find that beating a level 9 Fox on Project M is fairly simple? Not trying to brag all I'm saying is that it's not totally unbeatable. And yes versing a real live person will always be better, but why make it very easy for noobies and then once they advance into pros there's no challenge anymore?

saifors November 27th, 2014 7:37 AM

Well Lucina can still be good if you're like me and get into your opponents face all the time which you can't do alot with marth because the tipping will be really ineffective.
Also I prefer Lucina as a character because in the entirety of shadow dragon Marth only talks about enough to fill one page and is an incredibly bland character.

GreenFlame November 27th, 2014 8:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aven Starkiller (Post 8511201)
Too much stuff to comment about xD But I will say that I'm confused on all the hate on Project M? I find that beating a level 9 Fox on Project M is fairly simple? Not trying to brag all I'm saying is that it's not totally unbeatable. And yes versing a real live person will always be better, but why make it very easy for noobies and then once they advance into pros there's no challenge anymore?

Hate Project M? Who hates Project M? I haven't played Project M, but why would anyone hate it? And I agree with what you're saying.

What's your opinion on Marth's Brawl appearance? Do you think that he looked just a little like a girl? I didn't know anything about Fire Emblem, and I couldn't tell what gender Marth was. Maybe I was just stupid...

Also what's your opinion on Lucina? Downgrade of Marth?

P.S. "Versing" isn't a word. You would instead use "fighting", "battling" etc. You may have noticed by now that I sort of have a compulsion to correct other people's grammar/spelling errors...I hope it's not annoying xD

Spinosaurus November 27th, 2014 9:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreenFlame (Post 8511321)
Hate Project M? Who hates Project M? I haven't played Project M, but why would anyone hate it?

It's a jumbled mess with too many gimmicky characters. It has the design philosophy of making every character OP for "balance' without so much set back and as such characters tend to rely on the one thing that makes them that good. And the thing is? Characters are significantly easy to use in comparison to like Melee or even Brawl. (Brawl Diddy is waaay harder to use right than PM Diddy)
I mean, Jigglypuff and Fox are largely the same from Melee (Except Fox is easier to use) yet Jigglypuff is one of the worst in Project M (despite being top 5 in Melee) and Fox is still the undisputed best in Project M like in Melee. It should tell you how screwed up it is when Puff, a pure fundamental character that doesn't require much execution, fell back significantly. It means Project M favors gimmicks and techniques over solid fundamentals. Smash 4 on the other hand is practically Street Fighter Smash 4 in that fundamentals are the one thing that reigns above all and as such all characters are actually properly balanced.

Mew2king and Hungrybox complained about Project M for its stupid gimmicks (well Hungrybox moreso for the Jigglypuff reasoning), and they're absolutely right.

Pinkie-Dawn November 27th, 2014 9:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spinosaurus (Post 8511352)
It's a jumbled mess with too many gimmicky characters. It has the design philosophy of making every character OP for "balance' without so much set back and as such characters tend to rely on the one thing that makes them that good. And the thing is? Characters are significantly easy to use in comparison to like Melee or even Brawl. (Brawl Diddy is waaay harder to use right than PM Diddy)
I mean, Jigglypuff and Fox are largely the same from Melee (Except Fox is easier to use) yet Jigglypuff is one of the worst in Project M (despite being top 5 in Melee) and Fox is still the undisputed best in Project M like in Melee. It should tell you how screwed up it is when Puff, a pure fundamental character that doesn't require much execution, fell back significantly. It means Project M favors gimmicks and techniques over solid fundamentals. Smash 4 on the other hand is practically Street Fighter Smash 4 in that fundamentals are the one thing that reigns above all and as such all characters are actually properly balanced.

Mew2king and Hungrybox complained about Project M for its stupid gimmicks (well Hungrybox moreso for the Jigglypuff reasoning), and they're absolutely right.

And yet I've been reading comments on Smashboard about fans planning to onto Project M as a response to Sakurai's statement on why Ridley, as a playable fighter, wouldn't work, in order to prove him wrong that he can work. Remember the old saying: "The customer is always right," and these guys have already voted on their to not buy Smash Bros. 4, because they truly believe Ridley's role will determine whether the roster is good thus making the game itself good, despite Mewtwo coming back as DLC. It goes to show how powerful Project M, or any fan-made mods/hacks, can be for the fans to criticize all the content that Sakurai worked hard on.

Spinosaurus November 27th, 2014 9:27 AM

Except the Project M team themselves couldn't get Ridley to work properly. :V

Imafroggy November 27th, 2014 9:31 AM

So my brother and I are looking to get into competitive.

He mains Mario and I main Peach. We know their moves and their capabilities pretty well.
I secondary Pac man and his is Ike.

Any tips for us?
We do okay online.
We win some we lose some, more win that lose to be honest and the only time we lose is to super sweaty mega try hard ultra deluxes. Just kidding haha but yeah really any tips?

Aven November 27th, 2014 9:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreenFlame (Post 8511321)
Hate Project M? Who hates Project M? I haven't played Project M, but why would anyone hate it? And I agree with what you're saying.

What's your opinion on Marth's Brawl appearance? Do you think that he looked just a little like a girl? I didn't know anything about Fire Emblem, and I couldn't tell what gender Marth was. Maybe I was just stupid...

Also what's your opinion on Lucina? Downgrade of Marth?

P.S. "Versing" isn't a word. You would instead use "fighting", "battling" etc. You may have noticed by now that I sort of have a compulsion to correct other people's grammar/spelling errors...I hope it's not annoying xD

K, first off I'm going to ignore all the random hate from Spino. But yeah, Brawl's graphics style was weird overall and Marth looked extremely weird. And I definitely don't think Lucina is a downgrade. I mean in some cases, for example Marth has more potential than Lucina. But Lucina is faster and can combo better and she's even stronger (If you're not good with landing Marth's tippers. If you are, than Marth is stronger) Overall Lucina is an easier character to use, and for that reason I think she's a pretty needed character.

And it's not annoying, no worries.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Imafroggy (Post 8511385)
So my brother and I are looking to get into competitive.

He mains Mario and I main Peach. We know their moves and their capabilities pretty well.
I secondary Pac man and his is Ike.

Any tips for us?
We do okay online.
We win some we lose some, more win that lose to be honest and the only time we lose is to super sweaty mega try hard ultra deluxes. Just kidding haha but yeah really any tips?

DON'T OVERUSE SPECIALS!

That's the only tip I have for anyone xD

Night Watcher November 27th, 2014 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spinosaurus
It's a jumbled mess with too many gimmicky characters. It has the design philosophy of making every character OP for "balance' without so much set back and as such characters tend to rely on the one thing that makes them that good. And the thing is? Characters are significantly easy to use in comparison to like Melee or even Brawl. (Brawl Diddy is waaay harder to use right than PM Diddy)
I mean, Jigglypuff and Fox are largely the same from Melee (Except Fox is easier to use) yet Jigglypuff is one of the worst in Project M (despite being top 5 in Melee) and Fox is still the undisputed best in Project M like in Melee. It should tell you how screwed up it is when Puff, a pure fundamental character that doesn't require much execution, fell back significantly. It means Project M favors gimmicks and techniques over solid fundamentals. Smash 4 on the other hand is practically Street Fighter Smash 4 in that fundamentals are the one thing that reigns above all and as such all characters are actually properly balanced.

Mew2king and Hungrybox complained about Project M for its stupid gimmicks (well Hungrybox moreso for the Jigglypuff reasoning), and they're absolutely right.

I really feel like you haven't even really tried Project M yet. I've played Melee and Project M for a while and I don't feel like Project M is "a jumbled mess with too many gimmicky characters."

P.S. Mewtwo is better in Project M. ;)

Spinosaurus November 27th, 2014 10:06 AM

...I did play Project M. I even played it online a lot of times.

You think I made up my reasoning out of thin air?

Night Watcher November 27th, 2014 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spinosaurus (Post 8511417)
...I did play Project M. I even played it online a lot of times.

From this sentence, i'm guessing you have played Project M a long time ago, but not the recent version, speculating that you don't know how much they changed before the online version was discontinued.

Spinosaurus November 27th, 2014 10:20 AM

Last time I played it was just a bit before Smash 4's release, which isn't a long time ago.

I can still play online via an exploit.

Night Watcher November 27th, 2014 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spinosaurus (Post 8511436)
Last time I played it was just a bit before Smash 4's release, which isn't a long time ago.

I can still play online via an exploit.

That was a while ago, considering that the smash 4 release for the 3ds was in october 3rd and that Project M had a huge update.

Spinosaurus November 27th, 2014 11:02 AM

I really doubt the update (which was released just recently) fixed my major problems with the mod.

Aven November 27th, 2014 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spinosaurus (Post 8511483)
I really doubt the update (which was released just recently) fixed my major problems with the mod.

You should probably stop calling it a mod since it's pretty much it's own game.

Spinosaurus November 27th, 2014 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aven Starkiller (Post 8511498)
You should probably stop calling it a mod since it's pretty much it's own game.

Errr it's a modified Brawl. It's a mod.

Aven November 27th, 2014 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spinosaurus (Post 8511502)
Errr it's a modified Brawl. It's a mod.

I know? I meant its play style, characters and stages, it's its own game in general.

Spinosaurus November 27th, 2014 11:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aven Starkiller (Post 8511521)
I know? I meant its play style, characters and stages, it's its own game in general.

We'll be arguing semantics then. It's a mod because it's modified on Brawl and needs Brawl to run. That's what I meant.

GreenFlame November 27th, 2014 7:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Imafroggy (Post 8511385)
So my brother and I are looking to get into competitive.

He mains Mario and I main Peach. We know their moves and their capabilities pretty well.
I secondary Pac man and his is Ike.

Any tips for us?
We do okay online.
We win some we lose some, more win that lose to be honest and the only time we lose is to super sweaty mega try hard ultra deluxes. Just kidding haha but yeah really any tips?

Peach's floating ability is very useful for edgeguarding. Her most powerful aerial is her forward-air, which has high knockback but is a bit slow on start-up. She can actually go under Final Destination using her floating, but it's mostly pointless. Mario can gimp extremely well with his FLUDD and cape, and you can jump offstage and hit them with cape and reverse their recovery. I can't really give too much more advice, because none of your mains or secondaries are characters I've ever used properly.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aven Starkiller (Post 8511408)
But yeah, Brawl's graphics style was weird overall and Marth looked extremely weird.

It was, they made everybody with a realistic style and it definitely didn't suit any of them except for Snake really.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Aven Starkiller (Post 8511408)
And I definitely don't think Lucina is a downgrade. I mean in some cases, for example Marth has more potential than Lucina. But Lucina is faster and can combo better and she's even stronger (If you're not good with landing Marth's tippers. If you are, than Marth is stronger) Overall Lucina is an easier character to use, and for that reason I think she's a pretty needed character.

Lucina is easier, but that's all she's got over Marth really. If you can space well, Marth is a direct upgrade. Lucina is NOT faster than Marth, they're both exactly the same except for the tipper and their hitlag modifier (Marth is actually safer on shields than Lucina). Technically, Lucina is more useful for an aggresive playstyle because she doesn't need to worry about spacing. But other than that I think they need to make some other change to Lucina to make her more different from Marth and less downgrade from Marth.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Aven Starkiller (Post 8511408)
And it's not annoying, no worries.

Oh good, because I'm going to continue to do it in the future :).



I can't say much about what I think of Project M, I've never played it, only watched it. It actually looks fun, though.

Aven November 28th, 2014 7:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spinosaurus (Post 8511527)
We'll be arguing semantics then. It's a mod because it's modified on Brawl and needs Brawl to run. That's what I meant.

Oh, I wasn't trying to argue. I just think you have the wrong view of Project M, and that you're missing out on a lot of fun :)
#PlayingProjectMWithFriends x)

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreenFlame (Post 8511902)
Lucina is easier, but that's all she's got over Marth really. If you can space well, Marth is a direct upgrade. Lucina is NOT faster than Marth, they're both exactly the same except for the tipper and their hitlag modifier (Marth is actually safer on shields than Lucina). Technically, Lucina is more useful for an aggresive playstyle because she doesn't need to worry about spacing. But other than that I think they need to make some other change to Lucina to make her more different from Marth and less downgrade from Marth.

Oh no, I meant Lucina was faster in terms of not having any tippers or spacing to worry about, so like you said, making her faster and more aggressive. And yes I still think Marth is a big upgrade from Lucina if you can land the tippers, but in Melee, no one gave a second thought to Marth before Ken because his play style back then before we discovered it was, a little bit confusing. And Roy of course was/is almost harder and more confusing then Marth because he was slower and more difficult to play. That is why I said Lucina is a very needed and well thought character, because now newer players are giving a second thought to Marth/Lucina because Lucina is so easy and fun to play as. I wouldn't mind at all if they added more things to Lucina in general to make her differ a bit more than Marth, as long as it's nothing more advanced and difficult like Marth.

Sorry for the long post, but I hope you understand where I'm coming from. Simplistic characters are needed to get newer players started so they can advance too.

saifors November 28th, 2014 8:39 AM

I kinda just wanted sakurai to make a chibi ridley and be extremely weak to shut the Ridley fans up "Here I sized him down, now he's pathetic. Are you happy now?"

machomuu November 28th, 2014 8:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saifors (Post 8512369)
I kinda just wanted sakurai to make a chibi ridley and be extremely weak to shut the Ridley fans up "Here I sized him down, now he's pathetic. Are you happy now?"

Yeah, the bawwing for Ridley was (and still is) pretty annoying.

But Sakurai would never do that since he actually cares about his work.

Kameken November 28th, 2014 8:48 AM

I respect that Sakurai doesn't want Ridley in the games, but the people claiming it would be terrible are just a little bit
Spoiler:
completely wrong

machomuu November 28th, 2014 8:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kameken (Post 8512378)
I respect that Sakurai doesn't want Ridley in the games, but the people claiming it would be terrible are just a little bit
Spoiler:
completely wrong

Eh. I'd want Ridley as a playable character as soon as I'd want the cyclops from Megaman or Xenoblade's Metal Face as one.

I like characters, but I also like the integrity of the original works kept in tact, which Smash does a pretty good job of.

Pinkie-Dawn November 28th, 2014 4:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saifors (Post 8512369)
I kinda just wanted sakurai to make a chibi ridley and be extremely weak to shut the Ridley fans up "Here I sized him down, now he's pathetic. Are you happy now?"

It's actually more on the lines with the fact that Ridley constantly flies all the time and briefly fights on ground unless he's forced to stay on the ground under certain circumstances and how it's a key trait to his character portrayal. Sakurai wants to be accurate with each fighters' character portrayal while, at the same time, not messing with the gameplay's balance. Of course the fans are accusing Sakurai as a hypocrite and used Ganondorf, Ness, Wario, and Kirby as primary examples on how these fighters aren't being portrayed correctly. These same fans also move onto Project M as the definitive Smash Bros. experience and try to make a working Ridley model to prove Sakurai wrong.

Spinosaurus November 28th, 2014 4:03 PM

Wario and Kirby aren't accurately portrayed? What the ****?

I get Ness and Ganondorf but considering their situation it's understandable.

Pinkie-Dawn November 28th, 2014 4:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spinosaurus (Post 8512801)
Wario and Kirby aren't accurately portrayed? What the ****?

I get Ness and Ganondorf but considering their situation it's understandable.

Wario was being portrayed as a gross character who uses his own flatulence as a weapon, which is a trait that he never had in any of the Wario games prior to Brawl. Most Wario fans at Smashboards were ticked about this, because he's suppose to be a greedy anti-hero with super strength, not an acrobatic clown with a gross personality. Kirby's fly ability was limited to 5 times in the Smash Bros. titles rather than unlimited times in his own games, minus Kirby 64, and they used that as a counterexample as to how Ridley can still work with his fly ability trait.

Alfieri November 28th, 2014 4:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pinkie-Dawn (Post 8512809)
Wario was being portrayed as a gross character who uses his own flatulence as a weapon, which is a trait that he never had in any of the Wario games prior to Brawl. Most Wario fans at Smashboards were ticked about this, because he's suppose to be a greedy anti-hero with super strength, not an acrobatic clown with a gross personality. Kirby's fly ability was limited to 5 times in the Smash Bros. titles rather than unlimited times in his own games, minus Kirby 64, and they used that as a counterexample as to how Ridley can still work with his fly ability trait.

In a game like Smash Bros, unlimited flying is a no-no.

Spinosaurus November 28th, 2014 4:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pinkie-Dawn (Post 8512809)
Wario was being portrayed as a gross character who uses his own flatulence as a weapon, which is a trait that he never had in any of the Wario games prior to Brawl. Most Wario fans at Smashboards were ticked about this, because he's suppose to be a greedy anti-hero with super strength, not an acrobatic clown with a gross personality. Kirby's fly ability was limited to 5 times in the Smash Bros. titles rather than unlimited times in his own games, minus Kirby 64, and they used that as a counterexample as to how Ridley can still work with his fly ability trait.

You do realize that Wario has been depicted to be gross and disgusting ever since the first Wario land, right?
Christ, he powers up by eating raw garlic in Wario Land 1, and Wario Land 2 starts the game with Wario sleeping with a huge snot coming out of his nose. That's ignoring Warioware.

Wario fans my ass.

Dragon November 28th, 2014 4:36 PM

Even with or without unlimited flight, I don't see how this meant that Kirby wasn't really 'portrayed right'. D:

He had some of his normal copy abilities, and even his swallow powers. @[email protected]

machomuu November 28th, 2014 4:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dragon (Post 8512822)
Even with or without unlimited flight, I don't see how this meant that Kirby wasn't really 'portrayed right'. D:

He had some of his normal copy abilities, and even his swallow powers. @[email protected]

And to build on that, there are Kirby games (specifically, the 3D ones. Or at the very least Crystal Shards) where he has limited flight.

Though I do find it interesting that people think the creator can misrepresent their own character in his own game, especially since Kirby has historically taken influence and even some features from the Smash Bros Series.

Aven December 1st, 2014 7:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spinosaurus (Post 8512801)
Wario and Kirby aren't accurately portrayed? What the ****?

Wario can literally do whatever he wants. I think he was portrayed beautifully :)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Alfieri (Post 8512810)
In a game like Smash Bros, unlimited flying is a no-no.

So? Mewtwo doesn't care. But on the whole Ridley debate (which I wish we hadn't gotten into anyway >.>) I think you guys are a little off about Ridley being too big and that he wouldn't be portrayed right. It's true Smash doesn't portray characters as identical to them in their games, but they get close enough to make the moves recognizable and fun. Peach is in there, and she's all about hearts and love (though she still kicks butt) I think if they did add Ridley, in the future or even before they released the game, he would have to be constantly hovering over the ground and continually flapping his wings while idle (in my eyes at least, and I think he would pretty beast like that. Heh, get it?) Anyway, I won't go over how I imagine all of his side tilts, aerial attacks and such, but I will say that I wouldn't mind, and would even love if they added Ridley (along with a Meta Ridley alternate costume please :3) There are a few problems however (like many have stated, and can stop stating >.>) One of them being, in my opinion, that without some serious thinking his fighting style would end up way too similar to Charizards (like really, just imagine Ridley doing Charizards down throw, yeah it would look cool but still, too similar) There's a thought O_o Ridley as a Charizard alternate- You know what never mind, please don't do that.

Anyway, my final say in this, (and I hope everyones had their final say or this could go on a while) Is that me and a lot of other people would enjoy having Ridley finally make it into Smash. And the other group of people that either hate him or don't even know who he is honestly wouldn't mind. But with all the complications, and with all the people that would probably think Sakurai made a big mistake with Ridley, one Smash may or may not get more hate than love for adding Ridley. Two, to give it to you easy and simple, Ridley is unnecessary, plain fact. You can try to tell me that a lot of characters in Smash are unnecessary, but that would be untrue. No one wants Ridley because it would give them a fun new play style to master, only because Ridley is famous. Sure, most people in Smash are famous, but they do have a pretty unique style. Ridley, being a dragon, fighting like a dragon and just being a dragon isn't unique enough for me to say that he's necessary. But if anyone has ideas for Ridley's move set that can be both unique and not totally overpowered at the same time, please share them so we all can get a better idea of Ridley.

Shining Raichu December 1st, 2014 7:56 AM

OK so am I the only one who is really disappointed with the Wii U game?

The graphics are awesome, character roster is pretty great (despite getting rid of Lucas and Wolf, RIP) and it's a beautiful looking game all around, but... where's the content? There's no single player story mode. There's no story mode at all. I know that seems like a shallow gripe in a game like Smash Bros but after the awesomeness of Subspace Emissary, playing the game without a single player campaign to glue the game together just seems pointless and directionless. Without it, it's just endless replays of Classic Mode and Endless Smash which make the game seem tedious and really hard to get into.

Spinosaurus December 1st, 2014 8:46 AM

This game has way better content than Brawl because the modes are actually good. (Especially Events and Online)

Also SSE was awful. I'm glad it's gone. :V

El Héroe Oscuro December 1st, 2014 9:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spinosaurus (Post 8515977)
This game has way better content than Brawl because the modes are actually good. (Especially Events and Online)

Also SSE was awful. I'm glad it's gone. :V

Have you attempted the 8 player brawls on the larger maps yet? I was wondering how that plays out considering I'm indifferent on it based on videos I've seen.

Spinosaurus December 1st, 2014 9:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by El Héroe Oscuro (Post 8516003)
Have you attempted the 8 player brawls on the larger maps yet? I was wondering how that plays out considering I'm indifferent on it based on videos I've seen.

Not yet. Game was only out last friday and I only tried out Events (awesome), online (awesome), amibo (cute, I got the DK one) and Smash Tour (awesome with people.) ORAS took most of my weekend time anyway lol.


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