The PokéCommunity Forums

The PokéCommunity Forums (https://www.pokecommunity.com/index.php)
-   Previous Generations (https://www.pokecommunity.com/forumdisplay.php?f=200)
-   -   6th Gen Primal Reversion Discussion & Speculation Thread (https://www.pokecommunity.com/showthread.php?t=325811)

Pepperton September 5th, 2014 5:22 PM

Magikarp is a pretty cool idea of a Primal, but I really don't see it happening haha especially since Gyarados has a Mega.

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire September 5th, 2014 7:48 PM

My feelings of Primal Rayquaza being announced this month are getting stronger, especially since Get Tv is suppose to announce something on the 14th which is one day before Emerald's 10th anniversary.

Leaf Magics September 6th, 2014 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire (Post 8425292)
From the latest trailer it looks like the legend Primal reverses when we meet them in what seems to be Origin Cave (which will match the originals). So the theory of the orbs causing them seems more likely as it was the orb we were given that caused them to attack us in the originals. Well that or a new item like the Bells in HgSs, whose legends only needed the wing to cause them to appear in the originals, but needed both in the remakes.

This is interesting. Maybe the Orbs will indeed be containers of natural energy. And maybe, if another item is required, it will be held by the legendary Pokémon and act as a Mega Stone for Primal Reversion.

AFeralFurry September 6th, 2014 11:38 AM

This has probably already been mentioned, but I think there's an obvious Primal pokemon choice.

*Looks at Dialga*

Regardless, it's a pretty cool thing, from what I've seen.

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire September 6th, 2014 3:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AFeralFurry (Post 8428265)
This has probably already been mentioned, but I think there's an obvious Primal pokemon choice.

*Looks at Dialga*

Regardless, it's a pretty cool thing, from what I've seen.

Primal Dialga in Japanese (and in many other languages) is 'Dark Dialga' while Primal Kyogre and Groudon are called "Primeval/Primal" or something along those lines.

I think Origin cave being the first place we see their Primal reversions to be fitting as the cave is said to hold an energy equal to Mt. Pyre (another orb connection there). Plus it said to be where life begins (a link to Xerneas maybe? Which is connected to Mega Evolution, as is Yvetal (a link with Mt. Pyre maybe?)). Btw for anyone wondering Cave of Origin's Japanese name is cave of Awakening, so while it's Japanese name doesn't have as strong beginning of life connotations, they're still there, as Life can be described in terms of Sleeping and Awaking up (sleep being death, and awakening being birth, with birth by sleep implying reincarnation/revival).

L0RD G3NGAR September 6th, 2014 3:50 PM

Perhaps Primal will be permanent?
In thisfootage, it showcased Primal Groudon and Primal Kyogre, and revealed that the moveswe've seen them use in previous images are new moves rather than reanimated moves.
I dont knowhow else this would make sense unless they learn a 5th move ir a move gets replaced. I think Primal will be permanent forms

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire September 6th, 2014 4:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flamebot (Post 8428493)
Perhaps Primal will be permanent?
In thisfootage, it showcased Primal Groudon and Primal Kyogre, and revealed that the moveswe've seen them use in previous images are new moves rather than reanimated moves.
I dont knowhow else this would make sense unless they learn a 5th move ir a move gets replaced. I think Primal will be permanent forms

Earlier in this thread I theorized that perhaps Ancient Power will become their signature move after they go through Primal Reversion like how Glaciate turns into Black Kyurem, and White Kyurem's signature move, also how Kyurem's Scary Face turns into one of the Fusion moves while in one of it's formes. They could make it so that the move shifts using whatever code Kyurem's moves use to change.

Leaf Magics September 6th, 2014 5:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flamebot (Post 8428493)
Perhaps Primal will be permanent?
In thisfootage, it showcased Primal Groudon and Primal Kyogre, and revealed that the moveswe've seen them use in previous images are new moves rather than reanimated moves.
I dont knowhow else this would make sense unless they learn a 5th move ir a move gets replaced. I think Primal will be permanent forms

I think I've said it before in this thread, but the problem with Primal Reversion being "permanent" (or just "triggered outside of battle") is that it would leave no reason to use the regular Groudon and Kyogre.

Right now, we know Primal Reversion gives a boost to their Abilities, and that it increases Kyogre's Special Attack and Groudon's Attack, so unless there are any drawbacks we do not know about yet, I think it will be like Mega Evolution, triggered in battle, with a shared once-per-battle restriction.

About their new moves, and adding to what ORAS said: I've suggested before, also in this same thread, that one of their moves could get replaced by a new one for the duration of their Primal Reversion.

I'll just repost what I thought back then, since I still think it could work, and we now have confirmation that they are indeed getting new attacks:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leaf Magics (Post 8292542)
This would be great. Kyogre could get something like Great Flood, Groudon something like Supervolcano, and Rayquaza something like Meteor Crash.

Although I think the moves may disappear after they revert to their normal forme. It could work by replacing one of their attacks with the new forme's signature attack during the transformation. Kyogre could get Water Spout replaced, Groudon Eruption, and Rayquaza could perhaps have Outrage replaced.

That was in response to Pepperton suggesting they could get new moves, and it was before they had even released the first quality screenshots that showed Primal Groudon and Primal Kyogre's unique symbols and attacks.

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire September 6th, 2014 5:34 PM

Well Kyurem's formes overshadow regular Kyurem, so it wouldn't be out there for Primal Groudon to overshadow normal Groudon, and Primal Kyogre to overshadow normal Kyogre. However, irc they showed those two transforming in midbattle in what looks like a wi-fi/inferred battle. Plus it's linked to Mega evolution, which isn't permanent.

Leaf Magics September 6th, 2014 7:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire (Post 8428585)
Well Kyurem's formes overshadow regular Kyurem, so it wouldn't be out there for Primal Groudon to overshadow normal Groudon, and Primal Kyogre to overshadow normal Kyogre. However, irc they showed those two transforming in midbattle in what looks like a wi-fi/inferred battle. Plus it's linked to Mega evolution, which isn't permanent.

Ah, I had forgotten about Kyurem's alternate formes. You're right, there's precedent of it happening then.

I still consider it a problem however, especially if you take into account that these alternate formes would overshadow Groudon and Kyogre (both of whom are already very powerful) as opposed to overshadowing regular Kyurem (who actually needed a boost compared to other legendary mascots).

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire September 6th, 2014 7:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leaf Magics (Post 8428661)
Ah, I had forgotten about Kyurem's alternate formes. You're right, there's precedent of it happening then.

I still consider it a problem however, especially if you take into account that these alternate formes would overshadow Groudon and Kyogre (both of whom are already very powerful) as opposed to overshadowing regular Kyurem (who actually needed a boost compared to other legendary mascots).

Kyurem actually has only 10 bst points less than Groudon and Kyogre. It's horrible typing was it's weakest point.

Iceshadow3317 September 6th, 2014 7:11 PM

If I am not mistaking, didn't one of the earlier trailers show Primal Kyogre and Groudon changing from normal in a battle much like Megas?

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire September 6th, 2014 7:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iceman3317 (Post 8428669)
If I am not mistaking, didn't one of the earlier trailers show Primal Kyogre and Groudon changing from normal in a battle much like Megas?

Yes, that's why I think they're temporary only forms.

Leaf Magics September 6th, 2014 7:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire (Post 8428668)
Kyurem actually has only 10 bst points less than Groudon and Kyogre. It's horrible typing was it's weakest point.

It still needed a boost to be closer to the other mascots (it was like 3 tiers below them). Groudon and Kyogre don't.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iceman3317 (Post 8428669)
If I am not mistaking, didn't one of the earlier trailers show Primal Kyogre and Groudon changing from normal in a battle much like Megas?

I think one showed the start of a transformation sequence, then cut to out-of-game graphics.

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire September 6th, 2014 7:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leaf Magics (Post 8428705)
It still needed a boost to be closer to the other mascots (it was like 3 tiers below them). Groudon and Kyogre don't.



I think one showed the start of a transformation sequence, then cut to out-of-game graphics.

I doubt Gf cares about a Mascot's tier. Beside's Black Kyurem is like one or two tiers below the mascots...

Yeah, they did.

Iceshadow3317 September 6th, 2014 9:19 PM

I would also like to point out that Mega Sceptile also seems to be getting a signature move to support the idea of primals being like megas. This seems to be proven in a trailer for the upcoming Mega Evo Part 2 in the anime where it shoots off its tail.

Leaf Magics September 6th, 2014 9:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire (Post 8428709)
I doubt Gf cares about a Mascot's tier. Beside's Black Kyurem is like one or two tiers below the mascots...

Yeah, they did.

Even if ignoring non-Game Freak tiers (which I'll do from now on), they realized it was weaker than the others. In fact, I would even say that Kyurem was originally designed to be weaker. Otherwise, I don't think they would have given it two new formes with 40 extra base total plus some new attacks with no in-battle drawback, given that it was already a box legendary, and already just as ban-worthy as Pokémon like Mewtwo or Arceus, according to Game Freak themselves.

They could have made Kyurem's formes' stats be redistributions of the original Kyurem's, like they did with Giratina, who was already on par with its fellow mascots. But they didn't, because they knew that it was weaker than its counterparts, and knew that it needed higher stats to be closer to them. Of course, Kyurem's alternate formes ended up having higher stats than its counterparts, but they also got a restriction of one per game, and require giving up one of the legendary dragons for as long as one wants to use the alternate Kyurem forme.

Primal Groudon and Primal Kyogre's restriction could be a one-per-battle limit shared with Mega Evolution, if their transformation happens in battle (which is what I think will happen). The alternative could be a reduction in their other stats, which would probably mean a redistribution like Giratina's in a transformation outside of battle.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iceman3317 (Post 8428782)
I would also like to point out that Mega Sceptile also seems to be getting a signature move to support the idea of primals being like megas. This seems to be proven in a trailer for the upcoming Mega Evo Part 2 in the anime where it shoots off its tail.

Maybe all starters will get signature moves from now on, like the Kalos ones did.

Altairis September 6th, 2014 9:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iceman3317 (Post 8428782)
I would also like to point out that Mega Sceptile also seems to be getting a signature move to support the idea of primals being like megas. This seems to be proven in a trailer for the upcoming Mega Evo Part 2 in the anime where it shoots off its tail.

I don't know how much this information means, because several non-Legendary Pokemon already have signature moves, or have had them in the past before distributed to other Pokemon.

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire September 6th, 2014 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leaf Magics (Post 8428789)
Even if ignoring non-Game Freak tiers (which I'll do from now on), they realized it was weaker than the others. In fact, I would even say that Kyurem was originally designed to be weaker. Otherwise, I don't think they would have given it two new formes with 40 extra base total plus some new attacks with no in-battle drawback, given that it was already a box legendary, and already just as ban-worthy as Pokémon like Mewtwo or Arceus, according to Game Freak themselves.

They could have made Kyurem's formes' stats be redistributions of the original Kyurem's, like they did with Giratina, who was already on par with its fellow mascots. But they didn't, because they knew that it was weaker than its counterparts, and knew that it needed higher stats to be closer to them. Of course, Kyurem's alternate formes ended up having higher stats than its counterparts, but they also got a restriction of one per game, and require giving up one of the legendary dragons for as long as one wants to use the alternate Kyurem forme.

Primal Groudon and Primal Kyogre's restriction could be a one-per-battle limit shared with Mega Evolution, if their transformation happens in battle (which is what I think will happen). The alternative could be a reduction in their other stats, which would probably mean a redistribution like Giratina's in a transformation outside of battle.



Maybe all starters will get signature moves from now on, like the Kalos ones did.

The Hoenn starters themselves were actually the first to get signature moves, Leaf Blade for Sceptile, Blaze Kick for Blaziken, and Muddy Water for Swampert. Followed by the Kanto starters who were given the elemental hyper beams in the Kanto remakes. Sadly those Gen III signature moves were no longer signature moves come Gen IV. Also Unova's had semi-signature moves, but sadly GF didn't make them signature moves, even though they could. Leaving Tepig's line with the only signature move out of the Unova mons.

Anyways I honestly see the Primals being in battle only like Megas too. Now the biggest question is if that's the path they're going to take, will we be able to use both a Mega and a Primal? or will the one mon slot be shared by both.

Leaf Magics September 7th, 2014 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire (Post 8428830)
The Hoenn starters themselves were actually the first to get signature moves, Leaf Blade for Sceptile, Blaze Kick for Blaziken, and Muddy Water for Swampert. Followed by the Kanto starters who were given the elemental hyper beams in the Kanto remakes. Sadly those Gen III signature moves were no longer signature moves come Gen IV. Also Unova's had semi-signature moves, but sadly GF didn't make them signature moves, even though they could. Leaving Tepig's line with the only signature move out of the Unova mons.

That's actually news to me; I never knew any of those were signature moves back then. By the time I started actually paying attention to those things it was Gen IV.

OK, rephrasing: Maybe all starters will get signature moves (that are actually intended to be signature moves and stay like that) from now on, like the Kalos ones did and have kept so far.

Quote:

Anyways I honestly see the Primals being in battle only like Megas too. Now the biggest question is if that's the path they're going to take, will we be able to use both a Mega and a Primal? or will the one mon slot be shared by both.
I think it will be a one-per-battle limit shared with Mega Evolution, like I said before.

Although I honestly would love to be able to use Primal Kyogre along with Mega Mewtwo Y (Mega Mewtwo Y is my favorite Mega and I like how Primal Kyogre looks), but if the boosts are comparable, it would make sense that they share the limit with Mega Evolution.

L0RD G3NGAR September 7th, 2014 10:40 AM

I doubt they will reveal primal Rayquaza, as they obviously dont want us to know Sky pillar is there. Maybe we have to find it ourselves then take it to somewhere >.<
Or Maybe it will be an Event. But I doubt we will be shown it before November 21st. Maybe the December CoroCoro

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire September 7th, 2014 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leaf Magics (Post 8429359)
That's actually news to me; I never knew any of those were signature moves back then. By the time I started actually paying attention to those things it was Gen IV.

OK, rephrasing: Maybe all starters will get signature moves (that are actually intended to be signature moves and stay like that) from now on, like the Kalos ones did and have kept so far.



I think it will be a one-per-battle limit shared with Mega Evolution, like I said before.

Although I honestly would love to be able to use Primal Kyogre along with Mega Mewtwo Y (Mega Mewtwo Y is my favorite Mega and I like how Primal Kyogre looks), but if the boosts are comparable, it would make sense that they share the limit with Mega Evolution.

I have a feeling the Kalos starters will lose their signature moves come Gen VI like how the Hoenn starters did :(.

On topic. Yeah, I can't see them allowing us to use two very strong Pokemon in one battle.

Now, if Rayquaza get's a signature move I wonder how it'll look like. Groudon's is half cooled down lava, Kyogre's looks like a powerful jet of water arrows. Since their signature move shows off their Primal's typings well, and if Rayquaza like Kyogre keeps the same typing as it's normal form, perhaps Rayquaza will get a meteor attack that involves slicing winds. Whatever it ends up looking like I see it coming from above, in contrast to how Groudon's move comes from below, and Kyogre's comes towards you from in front. Well behind could work too. Or maybe it'll start from above and end with something hitting the opponent from behind.

Btw, has anyone else noticed how the legendary Pokemon with Megas have signature moves? Latios has his Luster Purge, and Latias has her Mist Ball, the Mewtwos have Psystrike, and Diancie has it's Diamond Storm...

Leaf Magics September 7th, 2014 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire (Post 8429373)
Now, if Rayquaza get's a signature move I wonder how it'll look like. Groudon's is half cooled down lava, Kyogre's looks like a powerful jet of water arrows. Since their signature move shows off their Primal's typings well, and if Rayquaza like Kyogre keeps the same typing as it's normal form, perhaps Rayquaza will get a meteor attack that involves slicing winds. Whatever it ends up looking like I see it coming from above, in contrast to how Groudon's move comes from below, and Kyogre's comes towards you from in front. Well behind could work too. Or maybe it'll start from above and end with something hitting the opponent from behind.

I think something to do with meteors or ozone would fit it nicely. Ozone Buster from the TCG would look great on it. It or whatever attack it gets could be like a physical Draco Meteor, or a flying- or dragon-type equivalent of Water Spout and Eruption. It could also just be an equivalent of the new moves, assuming those two are equivalent among themselves.

Quote:

Btw, has anyone else noticed how the legendary Pokemon with Megas have signature moves? Latios has his Luster Purge, and Latias has her Mist Ball, the Mewtwos have Psystrike, and Diancie has it's Diamond Storm...
Well, many legendary Pokémon have signature moves already, so as more legendary Pokémon get Mega Evolutions, they will start overlapping.

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire September 7th, 2014 12:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leaf Magics (Post 8429453)
I think something to do with meteors or ozone would fit it nicely. Ozone Buster from the TCG would look great on it. It or whatever attack it gets could be like a physical Draco Meteor, or a flying- or dragon-type equivalent of Water Spout and Eruption. It could also just be an equivalent of the new moves, assuming those two are equivalent among themselves.



Well, many legendary Pokémon have signature moves already, so as more legendary Pokémon get Mega Evolutions, they will start overlapping.

I hope it ends up being a Flying type move as Rayquaza lacks good flying type moves. Maybe Primal Rayquaza will get Aerleiate too.
Primal Groudon can get Solid Rock, and Primal Kyogre can get Water Absorb. That is if they don't gain brand new signature abilities.

Centipede Chan September 7th, 2014 12:59 PM

I have an idea for the names of the new moves for Kyogre and Groudon:

Groudon - Primal Burn
Kyogre - Ancient Wave

Yes? No?


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 8:01 AM.


Like our Facebook Page Follow us on Twitter © 2002 - 2018 The PokéCommunity™, pokecommunity.com.
Pokémon characters and images belong to The Pokémon Company International and Nintendo. This website is in no way affiliated with or endorsed by Nintendo, Creatures, GAMEFREAK, The Pokémon Company or The Pokémon Company International. We just love Pokémon.
All forum styles, their images (unless noted otherwise) and site designs are © 2002 - 2016 The PokéCommunity / PokéCommunity.com.
PokéCommunity™ is a trademark of The PokéCommunity. All rights reserved. Sponsor advertisements do not imply our endorsement of that product or service. User generated content remains the property of its creator.

Acknowledgements
Use of PokéCommunity Assets
vB Optimise by DragonByte Technologies Ltd © 2023.