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Anti January 20th, 2015 1:34 AM

Team-Building Workshop
 
Team-Building Workshop

Purpose
Welcome to a new initiative here at PC, the Team-Building Workshop! The purpose of this thread is to encourage collaboration with team-building in order to make the process less daunting and to improve your building skills, as well as your teams themselves. Unlike RMTs, this thread's purpose is geared more toward helping teams that are "in process." Here are some examples of what types of requests or questions belong in this thread:
  • "I have a core of Pursuit Bisharp, Substitute/Calm Mind Keldeo, and Magma Storm Heatran, but I'm not sure if they fit well together. I kind of like them together, but something feels off. Is there any way to improve the synergy, and might there be glue Pokemon that could make them work without resorting to cookie cutter VoltTurn glue Pokemon?"
  • "I really want to build a stall team, but every time I build one, it gets destroyed by common stall-breaking like Mega Gardevoir, Manaphy, and Landorus, and it's very passive. Does anyone have any ideas? I know I want to use Mega Sableye to control the hazards game and a Clefable of some sort for its overall utility, but I don't even have their movesets and I'm stuck."
  • "I want to build around DD Charizard X but don't really know where to start."
  • "I have a solid team right now of Mega Metagross, Keldeo, Clefable, and Gliscor, but I am having trouble filling in the holes. I feel very Talonflame weak and fear that Waters like Slowbro walk all over it. Any advice?"
While not a specific rule, in general, if you have five or six Pokemon, it probably belongs in an individual RMT, though that is for you to decide. (In particular, an exception might be asking for help on a team that you had previously asked for help for in this thread.)

Resources
Hopefully, being able to ask these types of questions will demystify the team-building process and lead to better teams! Still, we ultimately want everyone to be somewhat independent, so some team-building resources are listed below. Many of them can also be found in the forum's Guidelines & Resources thread, but they are reposted here for convenience.
Checklist
Along with the resources above, we thought it would be useful to provide a general checklist that you can use when building teams. This is very much in process, so feel free to suggest additions or changes.

Does your team have...
  • Stealth Rock?
  • Some form of hazard control or some way of minimizing the effects of opposing entry hazards?
  • A way to handle status? Note that Scald and Lava Plume should be considered here.
  • A way to force out or otherwise obstruct the most common and threatening Pokemon in the metagame? Consult the viability rankings listed above for reference.
  • Methods of defeating common team archetypes like rain offense, VoltTurn, BirdSpam, etc.?
  • A plan against stall teams?
  • Priority attacks, or some other way to revenge kill or do damage in a pinch?
  • Ways of working around Taunt and other stall-breaking Pokemon?
  • A strategy that it tries to execute rather than a team that merely anticipates other strategies?
  • One or more backup plans in case your strategy falls apart or has a bad match-up? Is your team flexible?
Archive
One way we want to encourage participation is by including a team archive that displays the best teams that have come out of the workshop. The BTB staff will determine which teams will be displayed in this archive. There have long been rumblings that this forum have its own team archive, so hopefully this satiates that demand!

None yet.

Nah January 23rd, 2015 5:32 AM

I guess I'll be the first to make use of this thread....

I started making (yet another) OU team the other day, but quickly got stuck. At the moment there's Black Kyurem, Mega Metagross, and Lando-T on the team. But I don't know where to go with it or if what I've already got is even decent. Also I really need to stop putting Lando-T onto every OU team I make. Help please?

Spoiler: Team Importable
Kyurem-Black @ Life Orb
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 56 Atk / 252 SpA / 200 Spe
Mild Nature
- Roost
- Ice Beam
- Fusion Bolt
- Earth Power

Metagross-Mega @ Metagrossite
Ability: Tough Claws
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Meteor Mash
- Zen Headbutt
- Ice Punch
- Earthquake

Landorus-Therian (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- U-turn
- Stealth Rock

Anti January 23rd, 2015 7:29 AM

well, this is looking like it's tryna go for balance or maybe bulky offense, so i'll be working under that assumption.

hmm, what drew you to the mons you chose? both individually (don't bother explaining mmeta, "he's totally borked" will do) and in terns of synergy. i'm mostly wondering about cube since he's an interesting breaker who i don't see much anymore. jw.

anyway, in terms of suggestions, metagross and cube can break down ferro a bit for each other with the right sets. right now, it's walling you, so i would consider hammer arm on metagross and/or hp fire on cube. i definitely like the latter option especially - hp fire allows cube to lure ferro (ice beam aint gonna cut it) as well as bulky mega scizor, who actually walls metagross pretty badly. it can even wear down opposing mmeta, who is freaking impossible to kill as it is. the downside is that it wears down your cube since realistically, it's gonna want to replace roost for hp fire, but it's not like it's much of a stallbreaker anymore anyway (walled by both stall blobs soooo...) so i wouldn't sweat it.

land-t is kind of a utility mon, and while very useful, i wouldn't recommend putting him in so early during building. since he's a glue, i would wait until, well, there are actually things to glue - you might find something else works better. not like he's a bad selection as it stands now.

anyway, since mmeta seems to be the centerpiece here, i would recommend anticipating battle scenarios that might pop up when using it. for example, esp post m-evo, you're gonna be seeing a lot of landorus-t. yeah, ice punch is there, but if it's the scarfer, you're going to have to switch it out. ditto with scarftran. these are the two scarfers i would concern yourself with - you want *reliable* switches into them. your own land-t, should you keep it, is actually plenty fine for opposing ones - easily sponges uturn, eq (lol), even knock. scarftran is more difficult. sdef talon can do that (watch out for ancientpower) and can also handle prankster m sab burns, which you need to be ready for. you'll lose to cm sab unless you run sd tho. azumarill sounds like a really great choice here. can sweep with bd or break with cb (i prefer the latter but it's your call) while a (much) more defensive option is slowbro, or av azum can work too. gyarados is another choice if you really go the offensive route - just note it won't be switching in more than like, once. starmie is a splendid option here since it can spin for your cube and also absorbs scald burns aimed at meta nicely (another thing to be prepped for, though cube is decent enough at absorbing these i guess).

would talk more but i kinda have to go liiiike now, hope that was somewhat helpful but yeah always nice to see a cube and his 3875734 bst.

Nah January 23rd, 2015 9:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti (Post 8590869)
well, this is looking like it's tryna go for balance or maybe bulky offense, so i'll be working under that assumption.

hmm, what drew you to the mons you chose? both individually (don't bother explaining mmeta, "he's totally borked" will do) and in terns of synergy. i'm mostly wondering about cube since he's an interesting breaker who i don't see much anymore. jw.

anyway, in terms of suggestions, metagross and cube can break down ferro a bit for each other with the right sets. right now, it's walling you, so i would consider hammer arm on metagross and/or hp fire on cube. i definitely like the latter option especially - hp fire allows cube to lure ferro (ice beam aint gonna cut it) as well as bulky mega scizor, who actually walls metagross pretty badly. it can even wear down opposing mmeta, who is freaking impossible to kill as it is. the downside is that it wears down your cube since realistically, it's gonna want to replace roost for hp fire, but it's not like it's much of a stallbreaker anymore anyway (walled by both stall blobs soooo...) so i wouldn't sweat it.

land-t is kind of a utility mon, and while very useful, i wouldn't recommend putting him in so early during building. since he's a glue, i would wait until, well, there are actually things to glue - you might find something else works better. not like he's a bad selection as it stands now.

anyway, since mmeta seems to be the centerpiece here, i would recommend anticipating battle scenarios that might pop up when using it. for example, esp post m-evo, you're gonna be seeing a lot of landorus-t. yeah, ice punch is there, but if it's the scarfer, you're going to have to switch it out. ditto with scarftran. these are the two scarfers i would concern yourself with - you want *reliable* switches into them. your own land-t, should you keep it, is actually plenty fine for opposing ones - easily sponges uturn, eq (lol), even knock. scarftran is more difficult. sdef talon can do that (watch out for ancientpower) and can also handle prankster m sab burns, which you need to be ready for. you'll lose to cm sab unless you run sd tho. azumarill sounds like a really great choice here. can sweep with bd or break with cb (i prefer the latter but it's your call) while a (much) more defensive option is slowbro, or av azum can work too. gyarados is another choice if you really go the offensive route - just note it won't be switching in more than like, once. starmie is a splendid option here since it can spin for your cube and also absorbs scald burns aimed at meta nicely (another thing to be prepped for, though cube is decent enough at absorbing these i guess).

would talk more but i kinda have to go liiiike now, hope that was somewhat helpful but yeah always nice to see a cube and his 3875734 bst.

Goin' more for bulky offense here.

I picked Kyu because it's a poke that I've always liked (both for non-competitive and competitive reasons) and that set seemed kinda interesting, not to mention that I need something against stall. Put in Mega Meta to handle Dragon, Fairy, and Rock hits for Kyu (that and it's really good). HP Fire sounds like a good idea on Kyu, I just hope that it doesn't miss Roost too much.

I think that I'll put Azu on the team but take out Lando-T for now and see where things go. Would it be a good idea to put Starmie on the team if I have Azu though or should I try a different spinner/defogger?

Anti January 23rd, 2015 2:38 PM

starmie isn't a terrible fit, especially since you will need a better keld check than azumarill and its ability to deal with scald is also nice. the only thing is, you're already pretty bad vs. fast electrics like mega manectric (cube is gonna get voltturned to hell, which is where you miss roost but ehhhh what can you do). one way to work around that could be running offensive spin star with hp fire as a coverage option to free up the roost slot, but honestly, with SR and a little prior damage, cube is losing anyway so i would just be mindful in general that you need something for this. one choice for dealing with this might be something like mamo though i tend to struggle checking these guys myself. hippowdon is probably too bulky for this team but might need consideration. i'm not so sure.

i'm kinda making this up as i go - i'm traveling tomorrow and can give it a little more thought in the downtime known as "bud rides" and give you superior analysis to w/e i'm saying now. i'd say that i really like the azumarill/metagross core, and i think cube can work just gotta get the support right. something like scarf might be in its future here idk like i said i'll get back to you.

u may wanna check out the last resource listed (newly added) - really nice resource just to have everything in the same place and grouped more than the viability rankings or the smogon dex do.

Nah January 23rd, 2015 3:49 PM

That new resource you listed looks really nice Anti (ignoring the fact that it has Ferroseed on it tho XD ).

So I've filled the team up now, looks like this:

Spoiler:

Kyurem-Black @ Life Orb
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 56 Atk / 252 SpA / 200 Spe
Mild Nature
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Ice Beam
- Fusion Bolt
- Earth Power

Metagross-Mega @ Metagrossite
Ability: Tough Claws
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Meteor Mash
- Zen Headbutt
- Ice Punch
- Hammer Arm

Azumarill @ Choice Band
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 88 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def / 164 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Aqua Jet
- Play Rough
- Knock Off
- Waterfall

Heatran @ Air Balloon
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Lava Plume
- Toxic
- Stealth Rock
- Earth Power

Landorus (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Earth Power
- Calm Mind
- Psychic
- Focus Blast

Starmie @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Scald
- Rapid Spin
- Psyshock
- Recover


Made Azu a CB one, though I'm still wondering if I could go AV with it too. Added defensive Heatran for setting rocks, being a birdspam check and absorbing Fire/WoW, put in CM Lando-I to be an Electric and Ground immunity (though admittedly that's a bit of a shaky answer to MegaManectric/Thundurus), and then bulky Starmie to spin and check Keldeo like you said. Though something doesn't feel quite right. Actually Mega Lop might be a problem. But I think that there's more problems than that.

Not like you have to deal with this immediately Anti. It'd be great if some other people got in here and lent a hand too =p

srinator January 23rd, 2015 9:19 PM

The team is very rain weak, esp Kingdra+mega pert cores. Also I think a more offensive starmie would really be better than the hp/speed version ur using right now.

Nah January 24th, 2015 7:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by srinator (Post 8591557)
The team is very rain weak, esp Kingdra+mega pert cores. Also I think a more offensive starmie would really be better than the hp/speed version ur using right now.

Any ideas on how to deal with that? And I'll consider a more offensive Starmie.

Cosmic Neon January 24th, 2015 8:36 AM

I need help, I want to build a VGC team, but I've never even built a Doubles team before...

Meowstic(F) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Competitive
Nature: Timid
EV's: 252 Speed 252 Sp. Atk 4 HP
-Psyshock
-Hidden Power (Ice)
-Energy Ball
-Trick

I would like to build a team around this set, would you happen to know where I should begin as far as teammates go?

Breeder Mac January 24th, 2015 11:12 AM

I wanted to build a mega zard x team and I am not sure if my pokemon right now work together and what I should use for the last 2 slots.

Spoiler:
Mega Zard X
Adamant 144HP/ 252Atk/ 112Spe
Tough Claws
- Dragon Dance
- Roost
- Earthquake
- Dragon Claw
Standard set from what I see. I am open for suggestions if you know a set that works really well with zard x.

Empoleon @Assualt Vest
Quiet 248HP/ 252SpA/ 8SpD
Torrent
- Aqua Jet
- Scald
- Flash Cannon
- Ice Beam
With decent HP and good SpD I thought an AV might work with him. Quiet nature to max aqua jet damage and some priority. I would've used a specially defensive set but I haven't been able to find a calm defog one.

Gengar @Life Orb
Timid 252SpA/ 4SpD/ 252Spe
Levitate
- Shadow Ball
- Sludge Wave
- Focus Blast
- Taunt
To cover the EQ weaknesses and the fighting weakness from emp. Im not sure if LO is the best option as the item.

Forretress @ Leftovers
Calm 248HP / 8Def / 252SpD
Sturdy
- Stealth Rock
- Rapid Spin
- Volt Switch
- Spikes
Every zard needs a spinner. Plus he can set up rocks and volt switch out to build momentum.

My thoughts for the last 2 pokes where dragonite and sylveon


I tend to like bulky offensive pokes, but I have no problem using whatever works out to be the best combo of pokes. Any thoughts/opinions would be most welcome.

Nah January 24th, 2015 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cosmic Neon (Post 8591963)
I need help, I want to build a VGC team, but I've never even built a Doubles team before...

Meowstic(F) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Competitive
Nature: Timid
EV's: 252 Speed 252 Sp. Atk 4 HP
-Psyshock
-Hidden Power (Ice)
-Energy Ball
-Trick

I would like to build a team around this set, would you happen to know where I should begin as far as teammates go?

A good place to start would be with a Follow Me Togekiss, to keep Dark, Ghost, and Bug attacks away from Meowstic. Togekiss resists two of those and has pretty good bulk (and is immune to the common Earthquake), and Follow Me/Rage Powder stuff is really useful in general.

Togekiss @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 248 HP / 192 Def / 68 SpD
Calm Nature
- Follow Me
- Air Slash
- Tailwind/Thunder Wave
- Helping Hand/Roost/Protect

Next thing you might want is a Heat Wave Pokemon, since Meowstic and Togekiss struggle against Steel types, not to mention that spread moves are always good to have in Doubles. MixApe, Heatran, Volcarona, and Mega Zard Y are some possible choices there for you.

Cosmic Neon January 24th, 2015 1:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zekrom (Post 8592197)
A good place to start would be with a Follow Me Togekiss, to keep Dark, Ghost, and Bug attacks away from Meowstic. Togekiss resists two of those and has pretty good bulk (and is immune to the common Earthquake), and Follow Me/Rage Powder stuff is really useful in general.

Togekiss @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 248 HP / 192 Def / 68 SpD
Calm Nature
- Follow Me
- Air Slash
- Tailwind/Thunder Wave
- Helping Hand/Roost/Protect

Next thing you might want is a Heat Wave Pokemon, since Meowstic and Togekiss struggle against Steel types, not to mention that spread moves are always good to have in Doubles. MixApe, Heatran, Volcarona, and Mega Zard Y are some possible choices there for you.

Oh ok, I know I was really thinking about Mega Audino for Helping Hand + Thunder Wave... but people on other sites just tell me it's a huge waste of a Mega (which is a shame considering it's actually one of my favorite Mega Evolutions) :(

Anyways, I see what you're talking about. Could Garchomp be a good partner as well? I know Intimidate and Will-o-Wisp are ever present, but Togekiss's Follow Me could help with stopping burns. As well as the EQ immunity... or would Rock Slide be a better choice for if I go up against Talonflame and Mega Charizard Y?

Anti January 24th, 2015 1:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zekrom (Post 8591317)
stuff

Yeah as sri noticed with rain (and you hinted at with Mega Lopunny), there's a pretty substantial HO weakness here. Bisharp in particular is an issue. I think the reason for this is a combination of poor defensive capacity and a team that is slow overall. Cube is getting worn down really fast from LO and SR, and Landorus is very poor defensively. This might just be me, but I really only like to have one defensive liability on a team, as after that, you just start to become metagame weak from the sheer volume of threats you have to cover in four slots. I wouldn't run Cube AND Lando. Both are going to get rolled by faster teams. (This is even more important since your bulky mons like Azumarill and Meta have no recovery and are therefore quite easy to wear down themselves.) Your team isn't fast enough, meanwhile, to really push its momentum against HO builds. I would either make the team faster or bulkier, starting with the Cube/Land replacement and maybe reconsidering the additional mons (not because they're bad but because you should be adaptable for synergy purposes).

I can be more specific with changes if you'd like, but I do have a tendency to suggest standard things so I don't wanna drown out what you want at all.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Breeder Mac (Post 8592098)
stuff

Zard-X! Great choice - threatens a ton of teams. First, I would consider running Jolly to outspeed Scarf Landorus-T, though this will depend on Zard's teammates. The two attacking moves are always interesting. I think the standard is Blitz/Claw since they're both strong STABs and Heatran can be lured. You actually have Gengar to do that already - Focus Blast shreds it, and sacking Gengar to bring Heatran down to ~20% health may well be worth it. Of course, the advantage of EQ on Zard is that it really opens things up for Gengar. You could maybe even try Blitz/Quake coverage on Zard, though that is admittedly quite daring and experimental. Regardless, they're a nice duo. (Archer covered the inadequacy of the other two just fine.)

I think Bisharp is an intriguing Pokemon to pair with them, but then you're beginning to get into HO territory. If you want to go a bulkier route, I think that a cool partner might be Tornadus-T (either LO or AV), as it can Knock Off Heatrans and give you some momentum to get Gengar and Zard in safely. Azumarill could be cool as well, as it has nice defensive synergy with both mons and can tag-team opposing Ferrothorns with Gar, wearing them down with CB or AV. On a more defensive front, Ferrothorn, as Archer said, is a nice glue poke, but it remains passive as balls and might be too defensive for what you're looking for. Celebi works but compounds weaknesses that Ferro can help with more (in particular Mega Gyarados). Magnezone is always an option for some neo gen 4 shenanigans with Gar+DragMag which still works well.

Kind of threw a lot out there - tell me what (if anything) you like and we can work from there.

Also, glad to see some other voices and opinions. Yay!

Nah January 24th, 2015 1:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cosmic Neon (Post 8592251)
Oh ok, I know I was really thinking about Mega Audino for Helping Hand + Thunder Wave... but people on other sites just tell me it's a huge waste of a Mega (which is a shame considering it's actually one of my favorite Mega Evolutions) :(

Anyways, I see what you're talking about. Could Garchomp be a good partner as well? I know Intimidate and Will-o-Wisp are ever present, but Togekiss's Follow Me could help with stopping burns. As well as the EQ immunity... or would Rock Slide be a better choice for if I go up against Talonflame and Mega Charizard Y?

I've never used Mega Audino, never really looked into it, so I can't comment on it.

But Garchomp is nice too. Gives you a physical attacker and spread moves. And yeah you'll want Rock Slide on it since Talonflame and Mega Zard y are pretty common. Might wanna throw in a Steel poke or something to deal with Fairies since Togekiss can't help out too much there.

You'll also need to prepare for rain and sun teams cuz those are pretty common too iirc.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti (Post 8592267)
Yeah as sri noticed with rain (and you hinted at with Mega Lopunny), there's a pretty substantial HO weakness here. Bisharp in particular is an issue. I think the reason for this is a combination of poor defensive capacity and a team that is slow overall. Cube is getting worn down really fast from LO and SR, and Landorus is very poor defensively. This might just be me, but I really only like to have one defensive liability on a team, as after that, you just start to become metagame weak from the sheer volume of threats you have to cover in four slots. I wouldn't run Cube AND Lando. Both are going to get rolled by faster teams. (This is even more important since your bulky mons like Azumarill and Meta have no recovery and are therefore quite easy to wear down themselves.) Your team isn't fast enough, meanwhile, to really push its momentum against HO builds. I would either make the team faster or bulkier, starting with the Cube/Land replacement and maybe reconsidering the additional mons (not because they're bad but because you should be adaptable for synergy purposes).

I can be more specific with changes if you'd like, but I do have a tendency to suggest standard things so I don't wanna drown out what you want at all.

I would like to keep Kyu if possible (though I'm not opposed to using a different set on it), but I'm open to replacing anything else. And more specifics would be nice; I think leaving it up to me isn't going to result in anything better really.

Cosmic Neon January 24th, 2015 2:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zekrom (Post 8592271)
I've never used Mega Audino, never really looked into it, so I can't comment on it.

Me neither, but I have one right now that's ready for Doubles.

Mega Audino @ Audinite
Ability: Healer
Nature: Bold
EV's: 252 HP 252 Defense 4 Sp. Def
-Dazzling Gleam
-Helping Hand
-Thunder Wave
-Protect

I'm pretty sure I need to give it a different EV spread, but I came up with this set on my own.

All digressing aside... I would now have Meowstic(F), Togekiss, and Garchomp. Before I move forward with other partners I need a good Garchomp set, I was thinking:

Garchomp @ Leftovers/Rocky Helmet
Ability: Rough Skin
Nature: Adamant
EV's: 252 HP 252 Attack 4 Defense
-Rock Slide
-Dragon Claw
-Fire Fang
-Protect

Again, I probably need a better EV spread.

Breeder Mac January 24th, 2015 4:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti (Post 8592267)
Zard-X! Great choice - threatens a ton of teams. First, I would consider running Jolly to outspeed Scarf Landorus-T, though this will depend on Zard's teammates. The two attacking moves are always interesting. I think the standard is Blitz/Claw since they're both strong STABs and Heatran can be lured. You actually have Gengar to do that already - Focus Blast shreds it, and sacking Gengar to bring Heatran down to ~20% health may well be worth it. Of course, the advantage of EQ on Zard is that it really opens things up for Gengar. You could maybe even try Blitz/Quake coverage on Zard, though that is admittedly quite daring and experimental. Regardless, they're a nice duo. (Archer covered the inadequacy of the other two just fine.)

I think Bisharp is an intriguing Pokemon to pair with them, but then you're beginning to get into HO territory. If you want to go a bulkier route, I think that a cool partner might be Tornadus-T (either LO or AV), as it can Knock Off Heatrans and give you some momentum to get Gengar and Zard in safely. Azumarill could be cool as well, as it has nice defensive synergy with both mons and can tag-team opposing Ferrothorns with Gar, wearing them down with CB or AV. On a more defensive front, Ferrothorn, as Archer said, is a nice glue poke, but it remains passive as balls and might be too defensive for what you're looking for. Celebi works but compounds weaknesses that Ferro can help with more (in particular Mega Gyarados). Magnezone is always an option for some neo gen 4 shenanigans with Gar+DragMag which still works well.

Kind of threw a lot out there - tell me what (if anything) you like and we can work from there.

I know those 2 aren't the greatest but I was trying to think outside of the box and trying to use something ppl won't be expecting or rarely see and take him/her by surprise. I probably should've said that I like to use something a little less conventional cuz I hate seeing the same old pokes over and over. But what your suggesting is something like Zard X, LO Gengar, AV Tornad-t/azu, ferro, magnezone? I do like the av azu as I have been thinking bout using him on a team eventually so that would work. Im not so big on ferro and mag but if they happen to be the best to use then Im all for it. But I know that zard needs a spinner/defogger so I was wondering if a defog scizor would work. Typically when I run him its:
Scizor @Leftovers
Impish 248HP/ 252Def/ 8Spd
Technician
- Bullet Punch
- U-Turn
- Roost
- Defog
Or would a more physical spread be better with max hp, max atk and adamant nature?

Nah January 24th, 2015 4:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cosmic Neon (Post 8592346)
Me neither, but I have one right now that's ready for Doubles.

Mega Audino @ Audinite
Ability: Healer
Nature: Bold
EV's: 252 HP 252 Defense 4 Sp. Def
-Dazzling Gleam
-Helping Hand
-Thunder Wave
-Protect

I'm pretty sure I need to give it a different EV spread, but I came up with this set on my own.

All digressing aside... I would now have Meowstic(F), Togekiss, and Garchomp. Before I move forward with other partners I need a good Garchomp set, I was thinking:

Garchomp @ Leftovers/Rocky Helmet
Ability: Rough Skin
Nature: Adamant
EV's: 252 HP 252 Attack 4 Defense
-Rock Slide
-Dragon Claw
-Fire Fang
-Protect

Again, I probably need a better EV spread.

That Mega Audino spread iiiiiiiis probably fine.

As for Garchomp, you'll wanna use a 252 Attack/252 Speed/4 Sp.Defense spread with Jolly, to make use of Garchomp's relatively good Speed stat. You'll also wanna to run Earthquake over Fire Fang; you need the spread and the coverage, other teammates can handle fire stuff instead.

Cosmic Neon January 24th, 2015 6:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zekrom (Post 8592493)
As for Garchomp, you'll wanna use a 252 Attack/252 Speed/4 Sp.Defense spread with Jolly, to make use of Garchomp's relatively good Speed stat. You'll also wanna to run Earthquake over Fire Fang; you need the spread and the coverage, other teammates can handle fire stuff instead.

Hmmm, I guess I was just thinking about relying on Tailwind for the speed, may not be a good thing to do now that I think about it. As for dealing with weather, I was wondering if there are any viable Pokemon with Cloud Nine, either that, or I can add my own weather setter.

srinator January 24th, 2015 8:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zekrom (Post 8592493)
<needs better way of tagging people>


its your team so it is up to you how it should look but i will try to explain how each slot should/could be used if your making the team around metagross and kyurem black ( both very hard hitters so i shall go for a more offensive team,I don't really ho much so if the end product looks like ho, well yay? lol)
ok since every team needs a rock setter, we could go for a rock setter that could also force swwitches on metagross and cube's switch in's. also apply more general pressure etc. ferrothorn seems to run 128 spd ev's to avoid the 2hko from lo ice beam, hp fire is actually great since it lets it hit scizor ferro etc, i have never seen hp fire kyurem before but i think everything runs hp fire now .-. anyway metagross would appreciate something that could remove walls skarm etc esp if kyurem is down since lo wears it down too fast. heatran/azelf/mixape/lando-i would be really good setters here. i would prefer something from either lando-i or azelf.

if you look at the team it seems extremely bisharp weak, so a dark resist would be really helpful along with something that could beat mega sableye, opposing metagross could also be a problem since it can carry ice punch (and that speed .-.), would be cool if u have eq on ur meta. sub cm keldeo would be nice since it can act as a stall breaker, dark resist but i am not sure if it can beat mega sableye effectively.
Spoiler:
+2 252 SpA Keldeo Scald vs. +2 252 HP / 96+ SpD Sableye: 96-114 (31.5 - 37.5%) -- 85.7% chance to 3HKO
i dont think you should have too much of a problem


so kyurem,meta,lando/azelf,keldeo

lando and keldeo should help you dent on stall, so nnow we need to beat more offensive/hyper offensive teams esp volt turn teams (mega man,scarf lando, wash, scizor etc). i saw people run band pursuit scizor again for meta lol! also you need to remove your hazards for cube. you could try ass vest exca if u like but i dont oh even defog scizor can be used, anyway starmie would be cool as it acts as a keld check/water resist in general and remove hazards. you are still weak t volt turn but lets address that later.

cube,meta,lando i/azelf,keldeo,(hazard remover)
your sixth slot would really need a glue mon like lando which could act as a pseudo bird check but this team gain seems rain weak so you could consider breloom. sash set seems cool since starmie (if u choose that can actually take status moves) and you dont really need the sd poison heal set since you beat stall enough already. you are also very weak to the char megas, so thats another point to lando for rk purposes. gyarados is also cool option and could act as a mixed wall (lol?) or as a bulky set up mon, other than those mons i can only think about scarf heatran (Which is really a god) and uh azu, i could say more but i think thats all i can recollect rn for offensive.

anyone is welcome to point out any errors I have made in assumptions or have ideas on better and more effective mons.
Spoiler:

• Stealth Rock? check
• Some form of hazard control or some way of minimizing the effects of opposing entry hazards? check
• A way to handle status? Note that Scald and Lava Plume should be considered here. check
• A way to force out or otherwise obstruct the most common and threatening Pokemon in the metagame? Consult the viability rankings listed above for reference. check i guess since i think we took care of almost all s rank mons
• Methods of defeating common team archetypes like Rain offense, VoltTurn, BirdSpam, etc.? not sure
• A plan against stall teams? check
• Priority attacks, or some other way to revenge kill or do damage in a pinch? (depends on what you chose)
• Ways of working around Taunt and other stall-beaking Pokemon? check
• A strategy that it tries to execute rather than a team that merely anticipates other strategies? (i guess? idk lol)
• One or more backup plans in case your strategy falls apart or has a bad matchup? Is your team flexible? check

Anti January 25th, 2015 5:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Breeder Mac (Post 8592472)
I know those 2 aren't the greatest but I was trying to think outside of the box and trying to use something ppl won't be expecting or rarely see and take him/her by surprise. I probably should've said that I like to use something a little less conventional cuz I hate seeing the same old pokes over and over. But what your suggesting is something like Zard X, LO Gengar, AV Tornad-t/azu, ferro, magnezone? I do like the av azu as I have been thinking bout using him on a team eventually so that would work. Im not so big on ferro and mag but if they happen to be the best to use then Im all for it. But I know that zard needs a spinner/defogger so I was wondering if a defog scizor would work. Typically when I run him its:
Scizor @Leftovers
Impish 248HP/ 252Def/ 8Spd
Technician
- Bullet Punch
- U-Turn
- Roost
- Defog
Or would a more physical spread be better with max hp, max atk and adamant nature?

I don't love Scizor as a Defogger, but you can never have too many MMeta checks. Worth a shot, certainly.

To clarify, the mons I suggested were independent of one another (I don't rly like Ferro/Mag on this team together etc.) but yeah I think Azumarill would be a good choice. I think it's really great in this meta, though I would experiment with all of its sets just to see what works well.

With that core, you'd want some VoltTurn coverage as your first priority, as well as your own rox. I do think that together Scizor and Azumarill might make your team a little slow, which is something to look out for. (Sort of depends on how much you like speedy teams, but thought I'd throw it out there.)

--------------------------------------------

@Zekrom:

Well, building around Kyurem-B can be a little tricky, but it's certainly doable. If I were building this like my team (and assuming MMeta as well), here's how I'd look at it:

With Cube, I think that on stall, I'll be drawing an initial switch-in of Clefable and then Chansey once the set is scouted. Ferrothorn is another Pokemon to watch out for. Against balance, I would expect a lot of Clefs and Ferros, while also being mindful that Keldeo, Latias, and Mega Gardevoir can RK me. As you get more offensive opposition, you'll be more worried about getting Cube in at all, while also worrying about Latios, Scarftran, Scarf Landorus-T, etc. (which are often found on bulkier builds as well).

Mega Metagross helps with a lot of these threats and allows you to keep momentum fairly well, though you may want backup checks since you won't want it worn down. Looking at the core as a whole, I notice that Chansey (and stall more generally) will need to be addressed: Cube is not a stall breaker, but a balance breaker. If you wanna run your original set with Roost>>>HP Fire, I may consider that just to keep it healthy. I think mons that die in two or three turns tend to be quite poor choices, usually, and I would opt for Roost. (Taking back my previous suggestion, basically.) Anyway, Mega Metagross is also a balance breaker, and they form a nice core against teams that make up a big chunk of the metagame.

Meanwhile, Meta draws in Scizor, Ferro, Landorus-T, Hippowdon, Suicune, and Slowbro. I would pay special attention to Mega Slowbro, who you will want a very solid answer to. Cube can wear down Ferro decently, but you'll want something that isn't bugged too much by Leech Seed (doesn't have to be a Grass-type, defensive Heatran is such an example), a very strong Mega Scizor counter, and a plan for Scarf Land-T. Scarf Magnezone can annoy this core as well.

So as a "checklist" of stuff to cover, I might have:

general:
- Rain (have a check for its sweepers)
- HO (surround the two with either bulk or Speed - seems like you'd prefer bulk)
- Stall (counterteam this with a stallbreaker)
specific:
- Scarf versions of Heatran, Magnezone, Landorus-T
- Latis check to save Metagross
- Opposing MMetas
- Mega Scizor
- Keldeo
still need:
- SR/hazard control (esp. w/ Cube)

Just off the top of my head. Such a long list is normal - you only have two mons.

I'd worry about stall later and deal with the offensive checks first, as they are more common and seize more momentum in battle situations. You won't really find a blanket check to these, but something to handle offensive Fire-types would be good. sri mentioned Keld, who obviously pairs very well with MMeta. I actually like Slowbro (or even AV Slowking lol) as well if you wanna go more defensive: it doesn't wear down so easily, can spread paralysis, can shakily check Keldeo, MMeta, etc., and more generally just gives you a very nice defensive backbone. It won't be helping you against VoltTurn mons, but it covers a lot of the other holes. More offensively, Starmie can do some of these things (but not all) while providing a little more Speed. I think Slowbro is a better fit, but you *will* need a spinner w/ Cube and even Meta, sooo...

Have to go, but hopefully that's a decent enough start in the specificity department. Will return sometime later to add on.

(just to clarify not disagreeing w/ sriface just providing more options/opinions/blah blah blah since it's your team etc.)

Nah January 25th, 2015 11:38 AM

Spoiler:

Kyurem-Black @ Life Orb
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 56 Atk / 252 SpA / 200 Spe
Mild Nature
- Roost/HP Fire
- Ice Beam
- Fusion Bolt
- Earth Power

Metagross-Mega @ Metagrossite
Ability: Tough Claws
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Meteor Mash
- Zen Headbutt
- Ice Punch
- Hammer Arm/Earthquake

Slowbro @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 232 Def / 24 SpD
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Fire Blast
- Thunder Wave
- Slack Off

Keldeo-Resolute @ Leftovers
Ability: Justified
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Scald
- Secret Sword
- Substitute
- Calm Mind

Heatran @ Air Balloon
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 12 HP / 252 SpA / 244 Spe
Timid Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Fire Blast
- Will-O-Wisp
- Earth Power


So I went and put both Keldeo and Slowbro on the team. Slowbro sounded nice since it can actually handle Mega Loppuny to some degree and Regenerator and Thunder Wave are really nice too. SubCM Keldeo basically beats Bisharp (who's troublesome for Kyu/Meta/Bro) and gives me a stallbreaker. But then idk what to do now. I put in Air Balloon Heatran to set up rocks and stuff, but idk if that's a good option.

It feels like there's too much shit to deal with and not enough 'mons, or whatever I pick causes as many problems as it fixes or is a rather shaky answer =(

Anti January 25th, 2015 4:36 PM

You definitely want Psyshock on your Slowbro so that you can beat Keldeo.


I might as well turn to some stuff I've been working on lately if anyone wants to comment on it or help out.

The rise in bulky teams has made bulky sweepers really great in the metagame, and they tend to be CMers: Clefable, Keldeo, Slowbro. I've used the former two a lot (and would love to really make a great Clefable core and team, but that's for another post or more likely a future RMT), but haven't really used Slowbro. Here's the set I've been planning on running:

http://www.pkparaiso.com/imagenes/rubi-omega-zafiro-alfa/sprites/animados/slowbro-mega.gif
Slowbro @ Slowbronite
Trait: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 80 Def / 176 SDef
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Psyshock / Iron Defense
- Calm Mind
- Slack Off

I'm eager to use this because, while stall can pretty easily handle it with status, Leech Seed, and Unaware, most other archetypes struggle with him a lot. Outside of stall's answers, I think the ones I would expect are offensive Electric-types (Raikou, Magnezone, Thundurus, and Mega Manectric), Manaphy, Celebi, and uhhh Mega Sceptile I guess? Of course, there are soft checks like Toxic Heatran or Ferrothorn, but I like that Slowbro needs little support to remove them: Heatran simply cannot switch into Scald too much, and Ferro can switch in until burn puts it on a timer (plus team support). Really, only Celebi and to a lesser degree Manaphy like coming in on this guy, as the Electrics simply cannot take a ton of Scalds. It seems like the way to beat offense is simply "kill the Electric and then set up," while balance is basically that or maybe Celebi. And just speaking from personal experience, I find myself pretty much 6-0ed by this guy unless I very specifically prepare for him.

On the defensive side, it provides utility against a ton of potent physical attackers like Lopunny, Diggersby, Mega BrokenGross (this is honestly the biggest selling point lol), and Talonflame. Great stuff.

I am torn on the Psyshock/Iron Defense moveslot. The former obviously helps a lot with coverage and makes beating opposing CM sweepers like Suicune and Clefable much less painstaking. The latter is really nice for stuff like Zard-X, SD Diggersby, SD Garchomp, and other set-up attackers. I am leaning Psyshock, especially for Keldeo, but thought I'd pose this to y'all.

Anyway, in terms of support, I wanted something that could wear down Electrics. That's when I thought of this guy:

http://www.pkparaiso.com/imagenes/xy/sprites/animados/tornadus-therian.gif
Tornadus-T @ Life Orb
Trait: Regenerator
EVs: 40 Atk / 252 SAtk / 216 Spd
Hasty Nature (+Spd, -Def)
- Hurricane
- Superpower
- Knock Off
- U-turn

An odd choice seeing as it *loses* to Electrics, but I liked its ability to wear them down with U-turn and grab some momentum. I also like that Torn-T is a nice balance breaker and has a ton of utility against all playstyles because of its Speed, movepool (not great, but has the right tools), and high base power (but low reliability, sadface) STAB. Also, it forms a nice Regenerator core. I like that it can deal with Slowbro's Grass-type checks pretty directly and benefits from the Rain Manaphy summons.

I kind of got stuck here, because I wanted something that can defensively handle Electrics that isn't a total tempo killer. I ended up settling for Hippowdon and then running Rush Exca, Specs HP Bug (lol) Keld, and MG CM Stored Power Clefable to round out the team, and it has done pretty well so far, but it seems a little shaky to me. I could go the Sand route, but I'm not sure if it's actually the best thing for my team. Seems like it might just wear down the two core Pokemon above, but I definitely want hazard control because hazards can ruin Slowbro's defensive utility while ROX hamper Torn-T's insane survivability.

So yeah, go crazy. I am open to replacing Torn-T (in large part because I HATE low-reliability mons and Hurricane bl0ws) but definitely keep the M-Slowbro: I find him intriguing and the best Pokemon that no one hypes. :)

Dark Azelf January 25th, 2015 7:36 PM

Id go psyshock, it actually really hammers Chansey after a CM, lets you not lose to keld, megasaur, suicune and lets you beat all Clefable (unaware AND MG) 1vs1 due to you crit blocking Unaware then you win with a crit lol. I dont see Iron Defense of any particular use really. None of those sweepers you mentioned beat Slowbro 1vs1anyway. Zard gets 2hko'd with Scald and Rocks up at +0, Diggersby gets wasted by Scald same with Chomp if it tries to set up on you (takes about 40% from scald at +0).

Honestly id look into Talon if you dont like Torny-s accuracy as it too lures in electrics (sup im ground natural gift etc) and then a grass type to handle said electrics defensively for a nice fwg core. Defog is also an option because Spikes and/or rocks will be going up vs megabro since it draws in stuff like Ferro and Chansey, its inevitable and you cant really avoid it. That and status are the main things that mess up bro too.

jombii January 26th, 2015 2:12 AM

I'm planning on starting my own Gen VI competitive battles soon but I'm having problems on how to build my team. I'm planning to use an M-Venusaur core but, aside from Heatran, I can't really think of any other Pokemon that cooperates well with M-Venu.

This is what I got right now.

Venusaur @Venusaurite
Trait: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 HP/ 240 Def/ 16 Spe
Bold (+Def, - Atk)
~ Giga Drain
~ Sludge Bomb
~ Synthesis
~ Leech Seed

Basically, what I'm trying to do is a stall team . I'm thinking of adding Regenerator Slowbro and Gliscor to the team but I am not so sure yet.

Breeder Mac January 26th, 2015 7:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti (Post 8593279)
I don't love Scizor as a Defogger, but you can never have too many MMeta checks. Worth a shot, certainly.

To clarify, the mons I suggested were independent of one another (I don't rly like Ferro/Mag on this team together etc.) but yeah I think Azumarill would be a good choice. I think it's really great in this meta, though I would experiment with all of its sets just to see what works well.

With that core, you'd want some VoltTurn coverage as your first priority, as well as your own rox. I do think that together Scizor and Azumarill might make your team a little slow, which is something to look out for. (Sort of depends on how much you like speedy teams, but thought I'd throw it out there.)

I do like azu its a monster. So, so far I have zard x, gengar, and azu. Would you recommend excadrill over scizor as the spinner? Also, for zard x is it better to be 252Atk and 252Spe or would some HP investment make sense?

As for the VoltTurn and rocks would a physically defensive Landorus-T work? With lefties, rocks, u-turn, EQ, and knock off.

Cosmic Neon January 26th, 2015 9:57 AM

For the weather problem concerning my team so far, I've decided on a few different approaches:

-Run either Zard Y or Ninetales for sun support (Ninetales if I decide on having another member for the Mega slot), I would also have to build the rest of my team around the sun in this scenario.
-Run Tyranitar for sand support (meaning I would likely use Megachomp over the previous set, again, building the rest of my team around this weather).
-Consider ditching Togekiss for Cloud Nine Altaria or adding Cloud Nine Altaria alongside Togekiss. Ditching Togekiss would result in me having to find another viable partner to support Meowstic and the rest of the team (worst case scenario).

Any helpful thoughts or opinions?

GengarsTeeth January 27th, 2015 8:51 AM

I'm looking to switch over to ORAS soon and as I'm now happy with what I can produce myself while breeding I'd really like to start competitive battling. I haven't done any battling since DP so I'm totally rusty.. my favourite pokemon are ghost so I would really like gengar on my team, I also really like rotom and any rotom forme would be cool to use, I was thinking scizor as a physical sweeper and maybe bulbasaur as a damage sponge and poisoner or something. some of my favourite mons are in my sig.

Based on the info given and the mons in my sig, does anyone think they could sugest me a team to get started with please?

Detox January 27th, 2015 3:53 PM

Alright, I need some help here. I found an interesting core of Heatran, Toxicroak, and Rotom-W earlier and decided that I’d try to team build around it. However, me being out of battling for like…five years or so, has led me to a roadblock. I find that the core itself has amazing synergy, with one of the only flaws bwing its inability to handle Mold Breaker Excadrill in certain scenarios. To remedy this, I added in a Scarf Landorus-Therian (and also unintentionally formed a secondary VoltTurn core). So now I’m pretty much stuck. I’m considering adding in a Politoed or some other weather user like Tyranitar just so that I don’t get slapped around by people who also use it. The current team is in the spoiler below.

Spoiler:

Heatran @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 248 HP / 192 SpD / 68 Spe
Calm Nature
- Lava Plume
- Earth Power
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic

Toxicroak @ Life Orb
Ability: Dry Skin
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Drain Punch
- Gunk Shot
- Sucker Punch
- Swords Dance

Rotom-Wash @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 212 Def / 44 Spe
Bold Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Volt Switch
- Will-O-Wisp
- Pain Split

Landorus-Therian @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 24 Def / 232 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Knock Off
- U-turn

GengarsTeeth January 27th, 2015 5:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Syn (Post 8596594)
Right, well I found an interesting core of Heatran, Toxicroak, and Rotom-W earlier and decided that I’d try to team build around it. However, me being out of battling for like…five years or so, has led me to a roadblock. I find that the core itself has amazing synergy, with one of the only flaws bwing its inability to handle Mold Breaker Excadrill in certain scenarios. To remedy this, I added in a Scarf Landorus-Therian (and also unintentionally formed a secondary VoltTurn core). So now I’m pretty much stuck. I’m considering adding in a Politoed or some other weather user like Tyranitar just so that I don’t get slapped around by people who also use it. The current team is in the spoiler below.

Spoiler:

Heatran @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 248 HP / 192 SpD / 68 Spe
Calm Nature
- Lava Plume
- Earth Power
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic

Toxicroak @ Life Orb
Ability: Dry Skin
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Drain Punch
- Gunk Shot
- Sucker Punch
- Swords Dance

Rotom-Wash @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 212 Def / 44 Spe
Bold Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Volt Switch
- Will-O-Wisp
- Pain Split

Landorus-Therian @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 24 Def / 232 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Knock Off
- U-turn

thanks man, I have been working on a team with someone and what we came up with was Gengar, Rotom - w, Slowbro, mega venusaur, Bisharp and Garchomp.

I don't know the movesets yet really, I think thats what I'm gonna go for at first though. I will show my mate your list as well and see if we can do something with it

Anti January 28th, 2015 3:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dark Azelf (Post 8594211)
Id go psyshock, it actually really hammers Chansey after a CM, lets you not lose to keld, megasaur, suicune and lets you beat all Clefable (unaware AND MG) 1vs1 due to you crit blocking Unaware then you win with a crit lol. I dont see Iron Defense of any particular use really. None of those sweepers you mentioned beat Slowbro 1vs1anyway. Zard gets 2hko'd with Scald and Rocks up at +0, Diggersby gets wasted by Scald same with Chomp if it tries to set up on you (takes about 40% from scald at +0).

Honestly id look into Talon if you dont like Torny-s accuracy as it too lures in electrics (sup im ground natural gift etc) and then a grass type to handle said electrics defensively for a nice fwg core. Defog is also an option because Spikes and/or rocks will be going up vs megabro since it draws in stuff like Ferro and Chansey, its inevitable and you cant really avoid it. That and status are the main things that mess up bro too.

This sounds good. After some absurd amount of Hurricane misses, let's just say I tilted a bit. Talonflame will definitely be getting a look, lol. x_x

Also, figured on Psyshock, but thanks for some confirmation.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Varys the Galvantula (Post 8594473)
I'm planning on starting my own Gen VI competitive battles soon but I'm having problems on how to build my team. I'm planning to use an M-Venusaur core but, aside from Heatran, I can't really think of any other Pokemon that cooperates well with M-Venu.

This is what I got right now.

Venusaur @Venusaurite
Trait: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 HP/ 240 Def/ 16 Spe
Bold (+Def, - Atk)
~ Giga Drain
~ Sludge Bomb
~ Synthesis
~ Leech Seed

Basically, what I'm trying to do is a stall team . I'm thinking of adding Regenerator Slowbro and Gliscor to the team but I am not so sure yet.

This sounds like a really nice start. Mega Venusaur stall can definitely still work. Venu/Tran/Bro/Glisc is a really excellent start. Most stall teams run Unaware, and Clefable fits in well there. You could also run Chansey. The last slot would be your Spinner or Defogger, and there are a lot of choices for that: Skarm, Zap, Latis, etc. I'm not the best at making stall builds though...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Breeder Mac (Post 8594674)
I do like azu its a monster. So, so far I have zard x, gengar, and azu. Would you recommend excadrill over scizor as the spinner? Also, for zard x is it better to be 252Atk and 252Spe or would some HP investment make sense?

As for the VoltTurn and rocks would a physically defensive Landorus-T work? With lefties, rocks, u-turn, EQ, and knock off.

Zard X with Adamant usually runs something like 200 Speed, which iirc outspeeds +speed base 80s? With Jolly, I don't remember what the exact number is, but hit 310 to outspeed Jolly Landorus-T. Put the rest in HP in both cases.

I would try both Exca and Scizor and see which one you like better.

And sorry if I was unclear - I meant you should prepare for common VoltTurn cores, not necessary add them yourself. Of course, Landorus-T helps with that and does fit in alright, so I think you might as well try it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by GengarsTeeth (Post 8596135)
I'm looking to switch over to ORAS soon and as I'm now happy with what I can produce myself while breeding I'd really like to start competitive battling. I haven't done any battling since DP so I'm totally rusty.. my favourite pokemon are ghost so I would really like gengar on my team, I also really like rotom and any rotom forme would be cool to use, I was thinking scizor as a physical sweeper and maybe bulbasaur as a damage sponge and poisoner or something. some of my favourite mons are in my sig.

Based on the info given and the mons in my sig, does anyone think they could sugest me a team to get started with please?

Do not use Bulbasaur.

Mega Scizor, Rotom-W, and Gengar can work together on some kind of bulky offense or balance. What exactly did you have in mind?

jombii January 28th, 2015 4:39 AM

So I got this one,

Venusaur @Venusaurite
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 HP/ 240 Def/ 16 Spe
Bold Nature
- Giga Drain
- Sludge Bomb
- Synthesis
- Leech Seed

Heatran @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Lava Plume
- Toxic
- Stealth Rock
- Roar

Slowbro @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 232 Def / 24 SpD
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Fire Blast
- Thunder Wave
- Slack Off

Gliscor @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 HP / 56 Def / 200 Spe
Impish Nature
- Roost
- Toxic
- Acrobatics
- Earthquake

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Moonblast
- Wish
- Protect
- Heal Bell

Zapdos @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 168 Def / 68 SpA / 20 Spe
Bold Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Roost
- Defog
- Heat Wave

I am feeling a bit off on having two Toxic-spreaders on the team, but I guess since I am building a stall team, two is better than one. Any suggestions?

Thanks Anti!

GengarsTeeth January 28th, 2015 8:13 AM

I actually really like toxic teams too so that is exciting to me, thanks guys, so many ideas. i'm gonna try out everything of course though, when learning it is best to sample everything I find, you never know what's gonna suit you

Quote:

Do not use Bulbasaur.

Mega Scizor, Rotom-W, and Gengar can work together on some kind of bulky offense or balance. What exactly did you have in mind?
the team my friend had suggested to me was.. bisharp, mega venusaur, slowbro (for ice beam mainly, tis the only ice beam user I can access in OU and works with the team) Garchomp, Gengar and Rotom-W

I don't know if anyone seen this list as it seems you were improving on my first post..

this is all good tho man as i wanna learn everything I can.

edit: ah right, I did say bulbasaur, I meant venusaur! lol.
.

Nah January 28th, 2015 11:43 AM

So after some thinking and shit I finally got 6 pokes together for the team:

Spoiler:

Kyurem-Black @ Life Orb
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 56 Atk / 252 SpA / 200 Spe
Mild Nature
- Roost/HP Fire
- Ice Beam
- Fusion Bolt
- Earth Power

Metagross-Mega @ Metagrossite
Ability: Tough Claws
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Meteor Mash
- Zen Headbutt
- Ice Punch
- Hammer Arm/Earthquake

Slowbro @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 232 Def / 24 SpD
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Psyshock
- Thunder Wave
- Slack Off

Clefable @ Life Orb
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 SpD
Calm Nature
- Moonblast
- Calm Mind
- Flamethrower
- Soft-Boiled

Landorus-Therian (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Stone Edge
- U-turn

Starmie @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Rapid Spin
- Thunderbolt
- Ice Beam


As great as SubCM Keldeo is I felt like it was not allowing me to fill enough holes, so I replaced it with CM Magic Guard Clefable to hopefully be a stall answer and Lati check. And despite wanting to not use Lando-T initially, I decided that I there probably was nothing better to put in, so there it is. Final slot went to offensive Starmie to spin, sorta check a couple of pokes.

So if y'all could take one more look at it that'd be great. Having 3 part Psychic types makes the team Dark/Ghost weak though.....

GengarsTeeth January 28th, 2015 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zekrom (Post 8597643)
So after some thinking and **** I finally got 6 pokes together for the team:

Spoiler:

Kyurem-Black @ Life Orb
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 56 Atk / 252 SpA / 200 Spe
Mild Nature
- Roost/HP Fire
- Ice Beam
- Fusion Bolt
- Earth Power

Metagross-Mega @ Metagrossite
Ability: Tough Claws
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Meteor Mash
- Zen Headbutt
- Ice Punch
- Hammer Arm/Earthquake

Slowbro @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 232 Def / 24 SpD
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Psyshock
- Thunder Wave
- Slack Off

Clefable @ Life Orb
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 SpD
Calm Nature
- Moonblast
- Calm Mind
- Flamethrower
- Soft-Boiled

Landorus-Therian (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Stone Edge
- U-turn

Starmie @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Rapid Spin
- Thunderbolt
- Ice Beam


As great as SubCM Keldeo is I felt like it was not allowing me to fill enough holes, so I replaced it with CM Magic Guard Clefable to hopefully be a stall answer and Lati check. And despite wanting to not use Lando-T initially, I decided that I there probably was nothing better to put in, so there it is. Final slot went to offensive Starmie to spin, sorta check a couple of pokes.

So if y'all could take one more look at it that'd be great. Having 3 part Psychic types makes the team Dark/Ghost weak though.....


this is ou yeah? gengar would run a mock with the psychics. I can't really give you any advice though as i'm just learning, myself about this stuff. I have a team down now and I'm gonna breed it and then practice. Do I have your friend code added? i don't think we have traded yet but we have the same friends on here I think, I'll add you if you want to practise OU meta with me, I'm game for making teams specifically to counter yours for practice and you do the same to kill my teams.

Breeder Mac January 28th, 2015 4:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti (Post 8597280)
Zard X with Adamant usually runs something like 200 Speed, which iirc outspeeds +speed base 80s? With Jolly, I don't remember what the exact number is, but hit 310 to outspeed Jolly Landorus-T. Put the rest in HP in both cases.

I would try both Exca and Scizor and see which one you like better.

And sorry if I was unclear - I meant you should prepare for common VoltTurn cores, not necessary add them yourself. Of course, Landorus-T helps with that and does fit in alright, so I think you might as well try it.

Okay cool. I just wanted to make sure before I start EV training. And I will try both exca and scizor and let the best poke win. I understood what you said about voltturn coverage, but I figured Lando-T helped me there and also just a happy coincidence that it made my own little voltturn. Now, so far I have zard x, gengar, azumarill, excadrill/scizor, and lando-t. I still need a 6 poke and was considering another special attacker cuz all I have is gar. Any suggestions about who I should add?

TCB January 29th, 2015 4:04 PM

So I'm starting build a team. Right now will be focusing on Dragonite and Jolteon; the former will be a Expreme Speed Multiscale while I'm still determine what role I want to pull off with Jolteon.

Afterwards I want to have a tank on my team, but I never really utilized one before (as surprising as it sounds).

PlatinumDude January 29th, 2015 4:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheChaosBlue (Post 8599289)
So I'm starting build a team. Right now will be focusing on Dragonite and Jolteon; the former will be a Expreme Speed Multiscale while I'm still determine what role I want to pull off with Jolteon.

Afterwards I want to have a tank on my team, but I never really utilized one before (as surprising as it sounds).

The best role Jolteon can do is a special sweeper. Unfortunately, Mega Manectric, Thundurus and even Raikou outclass Jolteon in the Electric specials sweeping role because they have better stats, move pools and/or utility roles.

Anyway, here are sets you should use for each, but take note that Jolteon is still outclassed:

Dragonite:
-Dragon Dance
-Outrage/Dragon Claw
-Earthquake/Fire Punch
-Extreme Speed
Nature: Adamant
EVs: 252 Atk/4 Def/252 Spe
Item: Lum Berry
Ability: Multiscale

or
-Outrage
-Earthquake/Superpower
-Extreme Speed
-Fire Punch/Dragon Claw
Nature: Adamant
EVs: 252 Atk/4 Def/252 Spe
Item: Choice Band
Ability: Multiscale

or
-Dragon Claw
-Earthquake/Fire Punch
-Extreme Speed
-Roost
Nature: Adamant
EVs: 216 HP/64 Atk/228 SDef
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Multiscale

Jolteon:
-Thunderbolt
-Volt Switch
-Hidden Power (Ice/Grass)
-Shadow Ball/Signal Beam
Nature: Timid
EVs: 4 Def/252 SAtk/252 Spe
Item: Life Orb/Choice Specs
Ability: Volt Absorb

As for a tank Pokemon, Ferrothorn, Mega Sableye, Mega Altaria, Therian Landorus, Skarmory, (Mega) Slowbro, Mandibuzz, Clefable, Heatran, Wash Rotom, Sylveon and even Empoleon and Super Size Gourgeist are examples:

Ferrothorn:
-Stealth Rock/Spikes
-Leech Seed
-Gyro Ball/Thunder Wave
-Power Whip/Protect
Nature: Relaxed
EVs: 252 HP/88 Def/168 SDef
Item: Leftovers/Shed Shell
Ability: Iron Barbs

Sableye:
-Calm Mind
-Dark Pulse/Shadow Ball
-Will-o-Wisp
-Recover
Nature: Bold
EVs: 252 HP/252 Def/4 SDef
Item: Sablenite
Ability: Prankster

Mega Altaria:
-Return/Hyper Voice
-Earthquake/Flamethrower/Perish Song/Roar
-Heal Bell
-Roost
Nature: Impish/Bold
EVs: 248 HP/104 Def/156 SDef
Item: Altarianite
Ability: Natural Cure

Therian Landorus:
-Stealth Rock
-Earthquake
-U-turn
-Stone Edge/Rock Slide/Knock Off
Nature: Impish
EVs: 252 HP/252 Def/4 SDef
Item: Leftovers

Skarmory:
-Roost
-Defog
-Counter/Brave Bird
-Taunt/Whirlwind
Nature: Bold/Impish
EVs: 252 HP/252 Def/4 SDef
Item: Shed Shell
Ability: Sturdy

or (cartridge-friendly)
-Spikes/Stealth Rock
-Whirlwind
-Roost
-Brave Bird/Taunt
Nature: Impish/Bold
EVs: 252 HP/252 Def/4 SDef
Item: Leftovers/Shed Shell
Ability: Sturdy

Slowbro:
-Calm Mind
-Scald
-Psyshock
-Slack Off
Nature: Bold
EVs: 252 HP/80 Def/176 SDef
Item: Slowbronite
Ability: Regenerator

or
-Scald
-Psyshock/Fire Blast/Ice Beam/Foul Play
-Thunder Wave/Toxic
-Slack Off
Nature: Bold
EVs: 252 HP/232 Def/24 SDef
Item: Leftovers/Slowbronite
Ability: Regenerator

or
-Calm Mind
-Iron Defense
-Scald
-Slack Off
Nature: Bold
EVs: 252 HP/80 Def/176 SDef
Item: Slowbronite
Ability: Regenerator

Mandibuzz:
-Foul Play
-Roost
-Taunt/Whirlwind
-Defog/Toxic/Knock Off
Nature: Bold/Impish
EVs: 248 HP/136 Def/108 SDef/16 Spe
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Overcoat

Clefable:
-Calm Mind
-Moonblast
-Flamethrower/Thunder Wave
-Soft-Boiled/Moonlight
Nature: Calm
EVs: 252 HP/172 Def/84 SDef
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard

or
-Calm Mind
-Moonblast
-FlamethrowerHeal Bell/Aromatherapy/Protect
-Moonlight/Wish
Nature: Bold
EVs: 248 HP/252 Def/8 SDef
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Unaware

or
-Stealth Rock
-Moonblast
-Flamethrower/Fire BlastHeal Bell/Thunder Wave
-Moonlight
Nature: Calm
EVs: 252 HP/172 Def/84 SDef
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Unaware

Heatran:
-Lava Plume
-Taunt
-Toxic
-Stealth Rock
Nature: Timid
EVs: 248 HP/8 SAtk/252 Spe
Item: Leftovers

or
-Lava Plume
-Toxic
-Taunt/Roar
-Stealth Rock/Protect/Earth Power
Nature: Calm
EVs: 248 HP/192 SDef/68 Spe
Item: Leftovers

Wash Rotom:
-Volt Switch
-Hydro Pump
-Will-o-Wisp
-Pain Split
Nature: Bold/Calm
EVs: 248 HP/216 Def/44 Spe (Bold) or 248 HP/216 SDef/44 Spe (Calm)
Item: Leftovers

Sylveon:
-Wish
-Protect
-Hyper Voice
-Heal Bell/Toxic
Nature: Bold
EVs: 252 HP/220 Def/36 SDef
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Pixilate

Empoleon:
-Defog/Stealth Rock
-Toxic/Stealth Rock
-Scald
-Roar
Nature: Calm
EVs: 248 HP/8 Def/252 SDef
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Torrent

Gourgeist:
-Will-o-Wisp
-Leech Seed
-Synthesis
-Seed Bomb
Nature: Impish
EVs: 252 HP/160 Def/96 SDef
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Frisk

Dark Azelf January 30th, 2015 3:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zekrom (Post 8597643)
So after some thinking and shit I finally got 6 pokes together for the team:

Spoiler:

Kyurem-Black @ Life Orb
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 56 Atk / 252 SpA / 200 Spe
Mild Nature
- Roost/HP Fire
- Ice Beam
- Fusion Bolt
- Earth Power

Metagross-Mega @ Metagrossite
Ability: Tough Claws
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Meteor Mash
- Zen Headbutt
- Ice Punch
- Hammer Arm/Earthquake

Slowbro @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 232 Def / 24 SpD
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Psyshock
- Thunder Wave
- Slack Off

Clefable @ Life Orb
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 SpD
Calm Nature
- Moonblast
- Calm Mind
- Flamethrower
- Soft-Boiled

Landorus-Therian (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Stone Edge
- U-turn

Starmie @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Rapid Spin
- Thunderbolt
- Ice Beam


As great as SubCM Keldeo is I felt like it was not allowing me to fill enough holes, so I replaced it with CM Magic Guard Clefable to hopefully be a stall answer and Lati check. And despite wanting to not use Lando-T initially, I decided that I there probably was nothing better to put in, so there it is. Final slot went to offensive Starmie to spin, sorta check a couple of pokes.

So if y'all could take one more look at it that'd be great. Having 3 part Psychic types makes the team Dark/Ghost weak though.....

Id be careful. Stuff like Gengar basically gets a kill each time it comes in and SD Roost Bulky Mega Scizor sets up on and crushes your whole team as does anything fast or that can stat up see: Crunch MegaDos, Bisharp etc. :\ Breloom gets to sleep whatever it wants.

Mandibuzz (as much as i hate suggesting it) would probably fit nicely over Starmie who compounds weaknesses with Slowbro as it checks Gengar and stuff like Scizor and Bisharp and can also defog. But yeah team has questionable defensive synergy and being also very slow and not even having priority isnt a good combination.

PlatinumDude January 30th, 2015 6:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Archer99 (Post 8600918)
First of all hello!. And, I need some help.
I'm trying to make a good rain team for UU but I'm having huge issues with it. Since Politoed is banned, The best rain abusers on the tier are Kingdra and Mega Swampert. I started to use Mega Swampert because is more bulky than Kingdra, And it haves a better movepool. But I don't know if it's just me but I can't make them work... On the spoiler you have the core (If that's a core)
Spoiler:
Swampert (F) @ Swampertite
Ability: Damp
EVs: 104 HP / 252 Atk / 152 Spe
- Earthquake
- Waterfall
- Ice Punch
- Stealth Rock

Tornadus (M) @ Damp Rock
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Rain Dance
- Hurricane
- Taunt
- U-turn

Toxicroak (M) @ Black Sludge
Ability: Dry Skin
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Sucker Punch
- Gunk Shot
- Drain Punch


Thanks for your help.

I'd recommend using Kingdra alongside Swampert, as both can wear down each other's checks/counters. Swampert can hit on the physical side, while Kingdra can hit on the special side (and physical side if need be):
-Hydro Pump/Surf
-Draco Meteor
-Waterfall
-Rain Dance
Nature: Mild
EVs: 60 Atk/252 SAtk/196 Spe
Item: Life Orb
Ability: Swift Swim

Anti February 1st, 2015 6:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Syn (Post 8596594)
Alright, I need some help here. I found an interesting core of Heatran, Toxicroak, and Rotom-W earlier and decided that I’d try to team build around it. However, me being out of battling for like…five years or so, has led me to a roadblock. I find that the core itself has amazing synergy, with one of the only flaws bwing its inability to handle Mold Breaker Excadrill in certain scenarios. To remedy this, I added in a Scarf Landorus-Therian (and also unintentionally formed a secondary VoltTurn core). So now I’m pretty much stuck. I’m considering adding in a Politoed or some other weather user like Tyranitar just so that I don’t get slapped around by people who also use it. The current team is in the spoiler below.

Spoiler:

Heatran @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 248 HP / 192 SpD / 68 Spe
Calm Nature
- Lava Plume
- Earth Power
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic

Toxicroak @ Life Orb
Ability: Dry Skin
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Drain Punch
- Gunk Shot
- Sucker Punch
- Swords Dance

Rotom-Wash @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 212 Def / 44 Spe
Bold Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Volt Switch
- Will-O-Wisp
- Pain Split

Landorus-Therian @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 24 Def / 232 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Knock Off
- U-turn

If you run Toxicroak, you need to really focus on luring or overloading Landorus-T and especially Gliscor since they'll be getting free switch-ins on in.

I guess I'm finding it awkward to build anything around this team because, besides Toxicroak, you're essentially providing a bunch of supporting players and glue Pokemon. There are a zillion iterations of Rotom/Land (many including Heatran) and they go off in different directions. I might consider forming an offensive core with Toxicroak (probably but not necessarily with your mega slot) so you can more deliberately build around them.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Varys the Galvantula (Post 8597323)
So I got this one,

Venusaur @Venusaurite
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 HP/ 240 Def/ 16 Spe
Bold Nature
- Giga Drain
- Sludge Bomb
- Synthesis
- Leech Seed

Heatran @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Lava Plume
- Toxic
- Stealth Rock
- Roar

Slowbro @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 232 Def / 24 SpD
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Fire Blast
- Thunder Wave
- Slack Off

Gliscor @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 HP / 56 Def / 200 Spe
Impish Nature
- Roost
- Toxic
- Acrobatics
- Earthquake

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Moonblast
- Wish
- Protect
- Heal Bell

Zapdos @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 168 Def / 68 SpA / 20 Spe
Bold Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Roost
- Defog
- Heat Wave

I am feeling a bit off on having two Toxic-spreaders on the team, but I guess since I am building a stall team, two is better than one. Any suggestions?

Thanks Anti!

I'm terrible with stall builds, but it's not looking bad. I would consider Psyshock on Slowbro for Keldeo though. You're not Keld weak or anything, but I always like to be extra prepared, though the Fire move is fine. I would definitely consider Knock Off on Gliscor though - Gengar is a big threat to your team.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zekrom (Post 8597643)
So after some thinking and shit I finally got 6 pokes together for the team:

Spoiler:

Kyurem-Black @ Life Orb
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 56 Atk / 252 SpA / 200 Spe
Mild Nature
- Roost/HP Fire
- Ice Beam
- Fusion Bolt
- Earth Power

Metagross-Mega @ Metagrossite
Ability: Tough Claws
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Meteor Mash
- Zen Headbutt
- Ice Punch
- Hammer Arm/Earthquake

Slowbro @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 232 Def / 24 SpD
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Psyshock
- Thunder Wave
- Slack Off

Clefable @ Life Orb
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 SpD
Calm Nature
- Moonblast
- Calm Mind
- Flamethrower
- Soft-Boiled

Landorus-Therian (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Stone Edge
- U-turn

Starmie @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hydro Pump
- Rapid Spin
- Thunderbolt
- Ice Beam


As great as SubCM Keldeo is I felt like it was not allowing me to fill enough holes, so I replaced it with CM Magic Guard Clefable to hopefully be a stall answer and Lati check. And despite wanting to not use Lando-T initially, I decided that I there probably was nothing better to put in, so there it is. Final slot went to offensive Starmie to spin, sorta check a couple of pokes.

So if y'all could take one more look at it that'd be great. Having 3 part Psychic types makes the team Dark/Ghost weak though.....

D_A covered this well, but I would second a Mandibuzz >>> Starmie move. Doubling up on types isn't the worst, but Water/Psychic is bad because a third of your team then struggles with both U-turn and Volt Switch *and* is super vulnerable to Knock Off and Pursuit.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Breeder Mac (Post 8597951)
Okay cool. I just wanted to make sure before I start EV training. And I will try both exca and scizor and let the best poke win. I understood what you said about voltturn coverage, but I figured Lando-T helped me there and also just a happy coincidence that it made my own little voltturn. Now, so far I have zard x, gengar, azumarill, excadrill/scizor, and lando-t. I still need a 6 poke and was considering another special attacker cuz all I have is gar. Any suggestions about who I should add?

I might run AV Torn-T so your ability to take on special attackers is superior. Plus, it gives you some much-needed Speed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheChaosBlue (Post 8599286)
So I'm starting build a team. Right now will be focusing on Dragonite and Jolteon; the former will be a Expreme Speed Multiscale while I'm still determine what role I want to pull off with Jolteon.

Afterwards I want to have a tank on my team, but I never really utilized one before (as surprising as it sounds).

With Dragonite, I would focus on running some hazard control and a way to lure or overload Landorus-T, Azumarill, and Clefable. Mega Lopunny might not be a bad choice for the latter role, though Mega Lop tends to leave some defensive holes. Can give more detailed suggestions later.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Archer99 (Post 8600918)
First of all hello!. And, I need some help.
I'm trying to make a good rain team for UU but I'm having huge issues with it. Since Politoed is banned, The best rain abusers on the tier are Kingdra and Mega Swampert. I started to use Mega Swampert because is more bulky than Kingdra, And it haves a better movepool. But I don't know if it's just me but I can't make them work... On the spoiler you have the core (If that's a core)
Spoiler:
Swampert (F) @ Swampertite
Ability: Damp
EVs: 104 HP / 252 Atk / 152 Spe
- Earthquake
- Waterfall
- Ice Punch
- Stealth Rock

Tornadus (M) @ Damp Rock
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Rain Dance
- Hurricane
- Taunt
- U-turn

Toxicroak (M) @ Black Sludge
Ability: Dry Skin
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Sucker Punch
- Gunk Shot
- Drain Punch


Thanks for your help.

You can always just run rain on Mega Swampert over Stealth Rock. I'm still getting used to UU so I can't say a whole lot more, though I would consider a bulkier Rain setter than Tornadus, who is also quite SR weak.

TCB February 1st, 2015 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti (Post 8602831)
With Dragonite, I would focus on running some hazard control and a way to lure or overload Landorus-T, Azumarill, and Clefable. Mega Lopunny might not be a bad choice for the latter role, though Mega Lop tends to leave some defensive holes. Can give more detailed suggestions later.

That would be helpful, yes.

Breeder Mac February 1st, 2015 8:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti (Post 8602831)
I might run AV Torn-T so your ability to take on special attackers is superior. Plus, it gives you some much-needed Speed.

Okay cool. I will def try that and thx for all your help.

Spyro PDX February 1st, 2015 9:53 PM

I know I want to build a team loosely centered around sandstorm, but I'm not very experienced at building strategies other than hyper offense, and need a few pointers. I'm thinking I want to go with T-Tar, obvious choice. Thinking of poison heal gliscor as well, but I'm looking for a few ideas to get me going in the right direction for my first themed team. Thanks in advance.

Edit: thinking if running garchomp as well, perhaps aggron but that leaves me with a lot of potential megas

Anti February 3rd, 2015 2:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Archer99 (Post 8603099)
Yeah, Actually hazards are a nightmare for my team. I'm running Donphan as spinner like a patch. But it sucks (I had Starmie before, But that made my team too weak and I didn't saw place for it)
The thing with Tornadus is I found it really usefull on my team, Hurricane is just perfect in rain. Hitting really hard, I don't know if it's that good for setting rain. The only thing on his side is Prankster.
So my main issue now is to have a good deffoger/spinner.

disclaimer: all theorymon for this reply

Yeah I mean it's hard to give concrete suggestions with the tier in transition but I definitely wouldn't run Donphan. Rain, especially in the absence of Politoed, is all about making use of those Rain turns and keeping pressure on your opponent. Donphan is a tempo killer which is really gonna suck the life out of your team. I wouldn't lose sleep over sticking a spinner in as long as you're not relying too much on Tornadus for Rain or for defensive purposes (hnnng). I maybe consider running some Spex on Torn since Life Orb wears it down a lot. With Jirachi and Raikou gone, at least in theory, Specs Hurricane would really only be taken well by Mega Ampharos and Blissey, with most everything else being 3HKOed if they're lucky. Can be run with Hurricane/U-turn/insert two coverage moves here. Life Orb could work too, and you could still toss Rain Dance on it if you did that so long as you had a more reliable setter. I would definitely consider Grass Knot to hit Suicune since it can burn Swampert and powers up its Scalds with Rain.

Torn/Pert has good type synergy offensively and defensively. In terms of support, I would definitely have something that can break well, so Heracross seems fine, in theory. Its big selling point is threatening Suicune and breaking down stall (which Tornadus can sweep in the end-game if you play it well). With that, I would get a reliably Rain support/SR mon (in theory, you want this to have defensive capacity so you can set rain more than once, maybe something like Bronzong idk). Then you'll want a secondary abuser probably (Kingdra or the Toxicroak you had work) and then a glue Pokemon. I've never run Rain w/o Politoed so idk what I'm talking about tbh but I would definitely keep in mind that you're basically by necessity running HO.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheChaosBlue (Post 8603125)
That would be helpful, yes.

Yeah so I'm not a huge fan of Dragonite, but I think that you can probably make a CB set work in the meta pretty well. Ignoring Jolteon since I'm afraid it is quite mediocre (PlatDude laid this out earlier), I would mostly be sure to have both defensive and offensive plans for Mega Diancie, Mega Altaria, Clefable, Mega Gardevoir, Azumarill, and Sylveon. From there, it depends on what you want for your team.

If you're running HO, Gengar can switch into powerful Fairy STABs maybe once and forms a nice balance breaking core with Dragonite. Excadrill can Spin and threaten Fairies with Iron Head, though it seems an awkward fit to me.

One mon I think could be really cool which I would throw my recommendation toward is SD/BP/U-turn/Roost Mega Scizor. It has nice type synergy with Dragonite while also actually beating many mons that Nite struggles with (as opposed to just resisting their attacks) and adds another mon with priority. It gives a nice late-game win-con, even with just BP. U-turn isn't necessary, but it lets you keep pressure on Heatran (you'd want at least two teammates that can switch in and/or lure it) and especially Keldeo, where you can go straight into Dragonite and start firing off attacks. Lastly, it fills the defensive niche mentioned above of checking Fairies, even though you'll want secondary checks for Flamethrower Clef, BD Azum, and Altaria. (You really can't be too prepared for Fairies in this meta). Bulky Talon is one such mon, though by no means the only one, that can do this.

Raikou can replace Jolteon if you want an Electric.

I can't build the whole team for you, but hopefully that's a nice start.

TCB February 3rd, 2015 3:37 AM

Actually I've been starting on working a Mega Scizor that can check my Dragonite's weaknesses, and you pretty much outlined what I was planning on doing.

Karma89 February 4th, 2015 2:23 AM

I was on a stream just a bit ago and we got to talking about a mostly OU attacking wall team that would be super annoying to break but fun to play with. I've got a general idea for the composition of the team but i'm not sure what else to include exactly.

Altaria @ Altarianite
255 Attack, 252 speed, 4 Spdef Adamant
Return
Dragonclaw
Dragon Dance
Roost

Slowbro @ Leftovers
255 HP, 252 Defense, 4 spdef Bold, Regeneration
Slack Off
Psyshock
Calm Mind
Scald

Registeel @ Rocky Helmet
255 HP, 160 Attack, rest in spdef, Adamant
Stealth Rocks
Earth Quake
Ice Punch
Draining Punch

Chansey @ Eviolite
255 HP, 252 Defense, 4 spdef, Bold
Toxic
Softboiled
Seismic Toss
Heal Bell

Thundurus @ ((not sure what should be on it))
255 Spattack, 252 Speed, 4 HP
Thunder Wave
Taunt
Volt Switch
Focus Blast


Thats about as far as i've gotten on it and i'm not even sure this is exactly what i want to do with it. I've gone back and forth on using either Mega Metagross, Slowbro, or Altaria. Altaria ended up being what i chose for its bulkiness and it being a physical attacker with the ability to heal itself. The idea behind Thundorus was to give me the ability to have +1 Thunder Waves and Taunts for setup pokes. Maybe Gengar for the 6th slot? Gives me a bit more steel coverage with Focuss Blast and he can have Will o wisp since it isn't on anything else.

PlatinumDude February 4th, 2015 7:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karma89 (Post 8606123)
I was on a stream just a bit ago and we got to talking about a mostly OU attacking wall team that would be super annoying to break but fun to play with. I've got a general idea for the composition of the team but i'm not sure what else to include exactly.

Altaria @ Altarianite
255 Attack, 252 speed, 4 Spdef Adamant
Return
Dragonclaw
Dragon Dance
Roost

Slowbro @ Leftovers
255 HP, 252 Defense, 4 spdef Bold, Regeneration
Slack Off
Psyshock
Calm Mind
Scald

Registeel @ Rocky Helmet
255 HP, 160 Attack, rest in spdef, Adamant
Stealth Rocks
Earth Quake
Ice Punch
Draining Punch

Chansey @ Eviolite
255 HP, 252 Defense, 4 spdef, Bold
Toxic
Softboiled
Seismic Toss
Heal Bell

Thundurus @ ((not sure what should be on it))
255 Spattack, 252 Speed, 4 HP
Thunder Wave
Taunt
Volt Switch
Focus Blast


Thats about as far as i've gotten on it and i'm not even sure this is exactly what i want to do with it. I've gone back and forth on using either Mega Metagross, Slowbro, or Altaria. Altaria ended up being what i chose for its bulkiness and it being a physical attacker with the ability to heal itself. The idea behind Thundorus was to give me the ability to have +1 Thunder Waves and Taunts for setup pokes. Maybe Gengar for the 6th slot? Gives me a bit more steel coverage with Focuss Blast and he can have Will o wisp since it isn't on anything else.

There's literally no reason to use Dragon Claw on Mega Altaria when Pixilate Return already hits Dragons super effectively:
-Dragon Dance
-Return
-Earthquake
-Roost/Fire Blast
Nature: Adamant
EVs: 252 Atk/4 Def/252 Spe
Item: Altarianite

Registeel isn't that useful because it tends to be rather passive; also, it can't learn Drain Punch. Ferrothorn is the better option simply because it has Leech Seed to deter setup on it, while Skarmory has access to Defog for hazard removal and Whirlwind for phazing set uppers:

Ferrothorn:
-Stealth Rock/Spikes
-Leech Seed
-Power Whip/Protect
-Gyro Ball/Thunder Wave
Nature: Relaxed
EVs: 252 HP/88 Def/168 SDef
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Iron Barbs

Skarmory:

on Showdown!:
-Roost
-Defog
-Counter/Brave Bird
-Taunt/Whirlwind
Nature: Bold/Impish
EVs: 252 HP/252 Def/4 SDef
Item: Leftovers/Shed Shell
Ability: Sturdy

on cartridge (because Defog Skarmory is hard to get a hold of in cartridge play):
-Stealth Rock/Spikes
-Whirlwind
-Roost
-Taunt/Brave Bird
Nature: Bold/Impish
EVs: 252 HP/252 Def/4 SDef
Item: Leftovers/Shed Shell
Ability: Sturdy

Mega Slowbro is better at pulling off Calm Mind better than regular Slowbro because Shell Armor prevents an untimely critical hit from ruining its sweep. Regular Slowbro should stick to support roles:
-Scald
-Psyshock/Fire Blast/Foul Play/Ice Beam
-Toxic/Thunder Wave
-Slack Off
Nature: Bold
EVs: 252 HP/232 Def/24 SDef
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator

Chansey functions best on stall teams because of its passive nature; Sylveon or Clefable are better options because the former's offensive presence is better, while the latter can fare well in balanced teams:

Sylveon:
-Wish
-Protect
-Hyper Voice
-Heal Bell/Toxic
Nature: Bold
EVs: 252 HP/220 Def/36 SDef
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Pixilate

Clefable:
-Moonblast
-Heal Bell/Thunder Wave
-Wish/Moonlight
-Protect/Stealth Rock
Nature: Bold
EVs: 248 HP/252 Def/8 SDef
Item: Leftovers
Ability: Unaware

Thundurus desperately needs Hidden Power Ice to hit Gliscor and Therian Landorus hard. Volt Switch isn't that useful on it; it doesn't have much space for a scouting move:
-Thunderbolt
-Hidden Power (Ice)
-Focus Blast/Psychic/Taunt
-Thunder Wave
Nature: Timid
EVs: 4 Def/252 SAtk/252 Spe
Item: Leftovers/Life Orb
Ability: Prankster

Gengar can act as a utility attacker, making it a neat option in the last slot:
-Shadow Ball
-Sludge Wave/Sludge Bomb
-Focus Blast
-Destiny Bond/Taunt
Nature: Timid
EVs: 252 SAtk/4 SDef/252 Spe
Item: Life Orb/Focus Sash

or
-Substitute
-Shadow Ball
-Will-o-Wisp
-Taunt/Sludge Bomb/Sludge Wave/Disable
Nature: Timid
EVs: 28 HP/148 SAtk/80 SDef/252 Spe
Item: Black Sludge

or
-Hex
-Taunt
-Will-o-Wisp
-Sludge Wave/Sludge Bomb/Substitute
Nature: Timid
EVs: 8 HP/248 SAtk/252 Spe
Item: Black Sludge

Crady February 4th, 2015 9:06 AM

Been trying to get into Doubles lately... Here's something I came up with.


Can't seem to find the right mega, Tried Scizor and Beedrill. They work sometimes but... are... Eh.

I wanted to try M - Sableye but not sure how that would work.

Spoiler:
Hitmontop @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 136 Atk / 60 Def / 60 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Fake Out
- Close Combat
- Quick Guard
- Sucker Punch

Sableye @ Lagging Tail
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Fake Out
- Knock Off
- Will-O-Wisp
- Trick

Gardevoir @ Choice Specs
Ability: Telepathy
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 116 HP / 52 Def / 144 SpA / 4 SpD / 192 Spe
Modest Nature
- Dazzling Gleam
- Psychic
- Energy Ball
- ThunderBolt

Darmanitan @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- Protect

Beedrill @ Beedrillite
Ability: Sniper
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Protect
- U-turn
- Poison Jab
- Drill Run

Noivern @ Focus Sash
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Draco Meteor
- Tailwind
- Super Fang
- Taunt


srinator February 4th, 2015 11:17 PM

Spoiler:

Hippowdon @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 240 HP / 16 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Slack Off
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic

Excadrill @ Life Orb
Ability: Sand Rush
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- Iron Head
- Rapid Spin

Celebi @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 220 HP / 252 Def / 36 Spe
Bold Nature
- Giga Drain
- Recover
- Nasty Plot
- Psychic

Gyarados @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Gentle Nature
- Waterfall
- Thunder wave
- Roar
- Protect

Scizor @ Scizorite
Ability: Light Metal
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Bullet Punch
- Bug Bite
- Roost



So I havnt really got the time to work on this a lot and I still can't find a suitable sixth member, I needed something that could lure Rotom wash in, and elf suggested staraptor but sadly I saw my whole team was walled skarmory and hence tried power herb solar beam Heatran, but it didn't really help much and the team didn't really do that well.
Hope u guys could help.

Anti February 5th, 2015 5:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by srinator (Post 8607266)
Spoiler:

Hippowdon @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 240 HP / 16 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Slack Off
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic

Excadrill @ Life Orb
Ability: Sand Rush
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- Iron Head
- Rapid Spin

Celebi @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 220 HP / 252 Def / 36 Spe
Bold Nature
- Giga Drain
- Recover
- Nasty Plot
- Psychic

Gyarados @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Gentle Nature
- Waterfall
- Thunder
- Roar
- Protect

Scizor @ Scizorite
Ability: Light Metal
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Bullet Punch
- Bug Bite
- Roost



So I havnt really got the time to work on this a lot and I still can't find a suitable sixth member, I needed something that could lure Rotom wash in, and elf suggested staraptor but sadly I saw my whole team was walled skarmory and hence tried power herb solar beam Heatran, but it didn't really help much and the team didn't really do that well.
Hope u guys could help.

Well, first off, I'm not quite sure what that Gyarados is doing there. I'm wondering if you could explain it a bit more? Actually, I'm generally a little confused by the parts, what they're trying to accomplish from a synergistic point of view, etc. Defensively you're not too bad off though Mega Gyarados is a big weakness, but it common defensive cores are a major problem. I would invest in a breaker for the last Pokemon. Will edit post later to give detailed suggestions (have to go now).

srinator February 5th, 2015 5:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti (Post 8607471)
Well, first off, I'm not quite sure what that Gyarados is doing there. I'm wondering if you could explain it a bit more? Actually, I'm generally a little confused by the parts, what they're trying to accomplish from a synergistic point of view, etc. Defensively you're not too bad off though Mega Gyarados is a big weakness, but it common defensive cores are a major problem. I would invest in a breaker for the last Pokemon. Will edit post later to give detailed suggestions (have to go now).

gyarados is basically there to take on charizard y which i am very weak to,
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Gyarados in Sun: 113-133 (28.7 - 33.8%) -- 98.6% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery

252 SpA Life Orb Sheer Force Landorus Psychic vs. 248 HP / 252+ SpD Gyarados: 110-130 (27.9 - 33%) -- 90.8% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery

etc.

srinator February 5th, 2015 7:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Archer99 (Post 8607616)
Ok, Gyarados walls Zard Y. If it helps, Use it. You could use Heatran to swallow the Fire attacks and OHKO with Stone Edge but you don't want to use it on this team.
In theory Celebi handles Rotom-W without even bothering about it. None of their moves can damage it but... You don't have EV's on speed and that thing runs some EV's on speed. That means, It uses Volt Switch and done. Maybe you could invest some EV's on speed?.

i know celebi takes care of it but the point of a lure so i can actually kill and not just force it to switch out, since exca cant touch it and i dont really like that situation sinc that p much my only speedy mon thanks to sand.

also tran doesnt like focus blast, so i woudnt really use it to beat chary esp since scarf tran would really not fit here.
also celebi most of the time switches in on rotom so it could just vswitch me on that turn and its not ever gonna switch on me, also 36 speed celebi already outspeed 40 speed rotom wash which is the most common so it can outspeed and beat all azumarills.
so i dont get how giving more speed ev's help.

Dark Azelf February 5th, 2015 9:07 AM

Cant you use SD Liechi Berry Natural Gift Talon to Lure Rotom-W? (Base 100 power Grass move). Though really thats the least of your issues, Raptor lures in rotom-w anyway with DoublE-Edge/Return and Skarm walls your whole team lol.

Edit: Thunder Gyara really lol

Id sooner use Fire Blast + Toxic on Gyara and move Whirlwind to Hippo. Fire Blast lets you hit more stuff than Thunder and Toxic covers most of the other stuff you cant hit.

Anti February 5th, 2015 9:33 AM

my b i wasn't very clear with what i was asking. rather, i was asking for a process of how the team came to be, the intent behind the decisions, etc. (can be brief) since i'm just not seeing the synergy and i feel like having that information would allow me to better give advice without compromising what you want out of the team.

and yeah sorry again i was unclear but i was mostly referring to the "gentle thunder gyara" part.

but yeah to go into more detail now that i have time, i am going to assume that your core mons are exca and scizor here since the other mons are primarily support (though obviously hippo is pretty central since exca can't function w/o it). i think trying to use the last slot to lure rotom-w is somewhat flawed since the problem goes beyond rotom-w when very common mons typically seen on balance/bulky offense cores (which are p dominant atm) are gonna give you issues. for example, just think of what rotom-w is often paired with. let's say the core is rotom/landt/ferro. it's very common and it can lay hazards on you pretty much all day and exca can't really touch any of them, and while scizor has a better time, it's going to have a lot of trouble early game to do much of anything with bad initial power and limited coverage. plus keldeo is everywhere. speaking of keld, it is a big problem here - not for its offensive presence, which celebi and to a lesser extent gyara handle ok, but that it actually walls both of your main sweepers at full health. exca eq takes out a huge chunk but you won't be ohkoing it. hp fire latios just flat-out doesn't have a switch-in, and even those without can defog all day on you etc. if your opponent has a ferro it won't have too much of a problem keeping control of the match since again, scizor can switch in and set up but can't really get going in time for it to be more than the tactical victory of forcing ferro out. basically what i'm saying is you don't really have any balance breakers except scizor (but with no way to beat the mons that wall it).

so idk i mean you could throw in a lure/breaker but i think the exca/scizor core is fundamentally limited and has poor synergy offensively (not great defensive either). like, if you just threw on a mega gardevoir instead your offensive presence becomes so much more diversified and garde is a decent balance breaker if you can pressure the ferro/tran (you can always run earth power over psychic on celebi) and gives you a fighting chance vs. stall (mega sableye and even mew eats this team alive atm).

not trying to give you a trial by fire here but offense needs to have consistent offensive presence or you might as well run a defensive team. that's what i'm tryna get at with the questions here - what is the logic of the building? then i can give more constructive criticisms than what i've just given since i'll have a much better idea of what i should be fixing, though i do think that the fundamental flaw i've pointed out is correct. (choose between exca and scizor since running both necessitates running hippo or tar and then you're really putting a strain on the last few slots. unless you really wanna run the combo in which case i can hit the drawing board a bit but yeah that's my take.)

srinator February 5th, 2015 8:21 PM

Okay so originally I had
Chary- ttar-glisc-exca-celeb-suicune
This is p self explanatory since u helped me with this. I noticed that suicune wasn't helping me much and that I depended on exca more than char y to sweep. So If I want to concentrate on exca to sweep chary was becoming a more of an hindrance if anything, it also makes celebi weaker. I changed char y for a more bulky sweeper like mega Scizor who isn't uncommon in sand, can take dragon hits, has roost and comfortably set up a lot and sweep. Then the major Char y weakness, and it was really bad. So I used spdef gyara instead of suicune, I knew I was burn weak but I thought celebi could take them wisps. Sadly tho mega sableye is v annoying here. Also since wash sort of walls my sweepers and can easily burn them I was looking a lure, but I am always open to changing anything if it isn't really profitable.

Edit: AND OMG IT IS SUPPOSED TO BE THUNDER WAVE GYARA STUPID TEAM BUILDER AAAAAA.

srinator February 6th, 2015 9:15 AM

Okay so after discussing with anti....a lot.....the team looks like this
Spoiler:

Hippowdon @ Leftovers
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 248 HP / 172 Def / 88 SpD
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Slack Off
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic

Excadrill @ Life Orb
Ability: Sand Rush
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- Iron Head
- Swords Dance

Breloom @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 12 HP / 244 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Seed Bomb
- Superpower
- Facade

Latias @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Defog
- Roost
- Draco Meteor
- Psyshock

Metagross @ Metagrossite
Ability: Clear Body
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Meteor Mash
- Grass Knot
- Hammer Arm
- Zen Headbutt

Keldeo-Resolute @ Leftovers
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Substitute
- Calm Mind
- Scald
- Secret Sword



Heil me anti.

Anti February 7th, 2015 7:53 AM

hmm pretty bored w/ ou atm (just been playin it too much uu 4 lyfe) but building and theorymoning is fun so imma toss out something i've been thinking about.

http://www.pkparaiso.com/imagenes/xy/sprites/animados/scizor.gif
Scizor @ Choice Band
Trait: Technician
EVs: idek man max atk and then yolo
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- U-turn
- Bullet Punch
- Superpower
- Knock Off

i'll talk about the mates i'm thinking about in a minute, but yeah i was inspired to try this guy cause its uturns hit harder than anything else's except like mega beedrill or something but yeah i like its potential to wear away at very common balance mons (rotomw landt heatran ferro keld) that hate taking uturns, getting their item knocked off, or taking superpower. also very useful defensively since fairies are op af and it can check or rk then, plus priority is always really nice to have. idk it just struck me as a useful mon since a lot of teams rely on keld to check this (esp if they think it's mega sd) but

252+ Atk Choice Band Scizor Superpower vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Keldeo: 235-277 (72.7 - 85.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
(235, 238, 240, 243, 246, 249, 252, 254, 257, 260, 263, 265, 268, 271, 274, 277)

ruh roh

in terms of teammates i'll run through non-mega and mega considerations:

non-mega:
rotom-w: could go this route but would prefer to at least wait until later and see if it's the "right" vs mon for a voltturn or not. would prefer not to but not totally opposed to popping this guy in there.
garchomp: best offensive rocker money doesn't buy
azumarill: belly drum variant, bd azum has its issues but scizor actually supports it quite well. if i ran this i might consider pursuit since the latis can rk azumarill fairly easily.
sylveon: don't hate, appreciate. heatran isn't exactly the hardest thing in the world to lure w/ scizor and ferro isn't so bad either, and i like the it can dry pass and keep momentum. (spex just so we're clear.)
bisharp: guess who appreciates a weakened keldeo?
gengar: kinda sounds like a cool balance breaker and can wear down steels with sciz but i'm iffy on the synergy

mega:
gyarados: wow, let's see, appreciates weakened rotom/keld (or even dead ferro w/ a well-timed superpower i guess), effortlessly pivots into various scizor checks off a uturn (heatran land even keld though to hell w scald lol x_x), really nice mid game sweeper.
gardevoir: still a top of the line breaker and is way better vs stall than altaria, can weaken ferro and tran for scizor (!) and is an all-around baller. have my doubts that it's so much better than sylveon that i shouldn't run m gyara tho.
slowbro: would definitely take the team in a much bulkier direction but this is probably the most low-key ridiculous mon in the tier so i'll toss it in here for fun even tho gyara is a better fit.

i should probably get this out of the embryonic stages before posting but figured i'd post since i've been wanting to do a uturn team for awhile now (and not just the piss weak scarf lando-t variant) so thought i'd toss it out there, will probably have more solidified in a few days but feel free to offer suggestions.

if i had to commit this very second i'd roll with sylveon/sciz/mgyara i guess but not sure that's even good lol.

Anti February 23rd, 2015 6:36 AM

Oh yeah, this kinda died so I might as well revive it (omg double post op) with the team that came out of this core since I would describe the team as "very nice but not quite there yet" so it's pretty much in tweak mode but could use a facelift. It's really more geared toward suspect but can kinda-sorta hang with Mega Metagross I guess? Lol.

Many of y'all have faced this team, and if you have then you know I like to play it aggressively as I am not super confident in the defensive core. My suspect ladder record is 31-13 though I think the team's record is closer to 26-8 because I started on suspect with an offense team whose defensive stopper was MegaZard X haha, so you can guess how that went. Anyway, here's what I have:

http://www.pkparaiso.com/imagenes/rubi-omega-zafiro-alfa/sprites/animados/slowbro-mega.gif
Slowbro (M) @ Slowbronite
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 80 Def / 176 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Scald
- Psyshock
- Slack Off

The old post explains why I like Mega Slowbro so much, but let's just say that he's a really terrifying win condition. I think in practice the only thing I have been annoyed with is that, if he doesn't get Scald burns (which *would* happen to me), breaking iffy pseudo-checks like Ferrothorn and Rotom-W does get a bit more difficult. I have this paired with Healing Wish support (spoiler alert) which allows me to play it very aggressively early on, which is nice. Even though it can be stopped, I kind of find this to be a BS poke tbh. :/

http://www.pkparaiso.com/imagenes/xy/sprites/animados/heatran.gif
Heatran @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 248 HP / 12 SpA / 208 SpD / 40 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Lava Plume
- Stealth Rock
- Earth Power
- Toxic

I tossed in Heatran for SR support, a kinda-sorta Talonflame check, a little status, and much-needed special bulk. I'm not a huge fan of Heatran but he does his job pretty well and closes some gaps on the team. I would be open to a replacement here. Oh, and idek about the EVs. I think they all just made the numbers pretty (like 300 satk or something?) so don't ask.

http://www.pkparaiso.com/imagenes/xy/sprites/animados/tornadus-therian.gif
Tornadus-Therian (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 40 Atk / 252 SpA / 216 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Hurricane
- Superpower
- Knock Off
- U-turn

I actually removed this for a bit because Hurricane's accuracy kept costing me games. No matter: I still love his Speed, utility, and ability to grab momentum, even though I really wish that Hurricane didn't suck. He's a great early game breaker against some teams as well though I wouldn't say it's as good as the mixed Defiant Thundurus I enjoyed spamming in XY. The big thing with Tornadus is that he can safely switch into Serperior and especially Celebi and get me back momentum. It allows me to play Slowbro aggressively and not fear an incoming vegetable mon. sry sims.

http://www.pkparaiso.com/imagenes/xy/sprites/animados/clefable.gif
Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Thunder Wave
- Calm Mind
- Soft-Boiled

I always use this mon lol. It's just too useful. I liked the idea of dual CM with MegaBro, and her utility actually supports Slowbro nicely, especially on the status absorption front. Otherwise, it can spread status, somewhat alleviate the pressure from weak VoltTurns, and checks numerous Pokemon or can at least prevent them from sweeping, because Fairy type is insane. Thunder Wave gets the nod over Flamethrower because I find it more useful defensively and for Heatran, though given how spotty this team is against fast Mega Scizor, I think Flamethrower is a fair choice even though Heatran can check it if it gets paralyzed.

http://www.pkparaiso.com/imagenes/xy/sprites/animados/keldeo.gif
Keldeo @ Leftovers
Ability: Justified
EVs: 248 SpA / 8 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Scald
- Secret Sword
- Substitute

Ehhhh I feel like the metagame has started to adapt to this guy a bit (as evidenced by the rise of Celebi, Starmie, etc.) and I find it less effective than I did when ORAS started. Even so, this is my primary stall-breaker (translation: stall is a difficult matchup for me) and still puts pressure on a lot of teams and checks Scizor and Bisharp, though not all that well. I feel like this is where my team building got a tiniest bit lazy.

http://www.pkparaiso.com/imagenes/xy/sprites/animados/latias.gif
Latias (F) @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
- Draco Meteor
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Defog
- Healing Wish

This guy has actually been really clutch and is a great synergy mon. For some reason, I find people to be more careful about coverage moves when playing vs. Latios than Latias, so I've found HP Fire to be a surprisingly effective Scizor/Ferro lure. It provides a *badly* needed Electric resist and a good switch-in to Charizard Y and non-SubMind Keld I guess. The real story here is Healing Wish, which is usually when I make my move in a game and corner my opponent. Often I find that teams can check any one of my CM sweepers but not all that well, so I can weaken them and then come back for round two. This is especially true of MegaBro who can actually beat/severely maim some of its checks 1v1 but is left at really low health (think vs. like LO Thund or something) which effectively kills Slowbro since it's too slow to recover on anything. Healing Wish changes that equation, which is awesome.


Okay so here are the issues I want to have fixed:

- Fairies: For a suspect ladder team you'd think I'd be better against these guys, but nah, Clefable can completely shut me down (Slowbro is not the best Clef check in the world, I'll just say that) and my Mega Diancie check is uhhh Slowbro lol? I can survive, but it's not ideal. Oh, and don't even get me started on Azumarill, who I basically just sacrifice mons to.

- VoltTurn: Oh look, balance is super popular and VoltTurn mons like Rotom-W, Landorus-T, and Mag are really common, and they check the mon I'm building around! BRB I'm going to make myself obnoxiously weak to this strategy.

- Stall: I can outplay this match-up, but it requires really sound execution.

- Mega Pinsir: I have literally not seen a single one of these, but lol.

These flaws haven't been crippling because I am a prodigy they can be played around to various degrees and I have four Pokemon that are really frightening win-cons on their own, which gives me tremendous in-game flexibility. I feel like the build is just a little flabby, meaning that I'm not quite making efficient use of my team slots. I've been stuck on what exactly I should be shifting around. Suggestions welcome etc.


As for Band Scizor I ran him with a few different builds and just found him to be a liiiittle too slow and too frail (or perhaps easy to wear down) than I would have liked, and while the advantages I mentioned were there, I just found it to be iffy on the whole. Oh well not every idea can take off. ;(

Detox March 1st, 2015 4:18 PM

So I was considering building around Sheer Force Gatr earlier, but I was preoccupied with other things and forgot about it until now. This thread needs more love so I thought that I’d see what you good people think that I should do.

http://pldh.net/media/pokemon/gen5/blackwhite_animated_front/160.gif
Feraligatr @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Waterfall
- Ice Punch
- Crunch

Crunch is there simply because Mega/non Mega Slowbro is one of the most common things people will switch into Gatr, and any amount of damage I can get off of him is appreciated. I opted for an adamant nature because honestly jolly is just so underwhelming, even after a boost. Gatr has no way to break bulky waters, so any suggestions for a partner that helps out there would be gladly appreciated. I was also considering some sort of SD+ Baton Pass Celebi but in hindsight that sounds like a very horrible idea. Ferrothorn is also a problem since I do not plan to run Superpower, and I am considering running Spikes in conjunction with Stealth Rock to soften things up for my guy.

srinator March 1st, 2015 6:05 PM

specs zone sounds cool since it can deal with bulky waters and also kill ferro, scizor etc. all you need now is 25 counters for croagunk ;]

Dark Azelf March 1st, 2015 6:19 PM

I hate to be that guy, but is it superior to MGyara to warrant its use? Unless you're using another mega but yeah just something to think about.

Anyway as its slow Tailwind support might not go amiss. Tornadus-I can probs set up rain too which would probs be really fun to play with to help it wreck even more. Sheer Force LO Gatr Waterfalls in rain with Tail Wind Support! Sounds scary and good lol.

I agree with Mag being a good partner too.

champagnepapi March 2nd, 2015 1:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti (Post 8630212)
Oh yeah, this kinda died so I might as well revive it (omg double post op) with the team that came out of this core since I would describe the team as "very nice but not quite there yet" so it's pretty much in tweak mode but could use a facelift. It's really more geared toward suspect but can kinda-sorta hang with Mega Metagross I guess? Lol.

Many of y'all have faced this team, and if you have then you know I like to play it aggressively as I am not super confident in the defensive core. My suspect ladder record is 31-13 though I think the team's record is closer to 26-8 because I started on suspect with an offense team whose defensive stopper was MegaZard X haha, so you can guess how that went. Anyway, here's what I have:

http://www.pkparaiso.com/imagenes/rubi-omega-zafiro-alfa/sprites/animados/slowbro-mega.gif
Slowbro (M) @ Slowbronite
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 80 Def / 176 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Scald
- Psyshock
- Slack Off

The old post explains why I like Mega Slowbro so much, but let's just say that he's a really terrifying win condition. I think in practice the only thing I have been annoyed with is that, if he doesn't get Scald burns (which *would* happen to me), breaking iffy pseudo-checks like Ferrothorn and Rotom-W does get a bit more difficult. I have this paired with Healing Wish support (spoiler alert) which allows me to play it very aggressively early on, which is nice. Even though it can be stopped, I kind of find this to be a BS poke tbh. :/

http://www.pkparaiso.com/imagenes/xy/sprites/animados/heatran.gif
Heatran @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 248 HP / 12 SpA / 208 SpD / 40 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Lava Plume
- Stealth Rock
- Earth Power
- Toxic

I tossed in Heatran for SR support, a kinda-sorta Talonflame check, a little status, and much-needed special bulk. I'm not a huge fan of Heatran but he does his job pretty well and closes some gaps on the team. I would be open to a replacement here. Oh, and idek about the EVs. I think they all just made the numbers pretty (like 300 satk or something?) so don't ask.

http://www.pkparaiso.com/imagenes/xy/sprites/animados/tornadus-therian.gif
Tornadus-Therian (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 40 Atk / 252 SpA / 216 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Hurricane
- Superpower
- Knock Off
- U-turn

I actually removed this for a bit because Hurricane's accuracy kept costing me games. No matter: I still love his Speed, utility, and ability to grab momentum, even though I really wish that Hurricane didn't suck. He's a great early game breaker against some teams as well though I wouldn't say it's as good as the mixed Defiant Thundurus I enjoyed spamming in XY. The big thing with Tornadus is that he can safely switch into Serperior and especially Celebi and get me back momentum. It allows me to play Slowbro aggressively and not fear an incoming vegetable mon. sry sims.

http://www.pkparaiso.com/imagenes/xy/sprites/animados/clefable.gif
Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Thunder Wave
- Calm Mind
- Soft-Boiled

I always use this mon lol. It's just too useful. I liked the idea of dual CM with MegaBro, and her utility actually supports Slowbro nicely, especially on the status absorption front. Otherwise, it can spread status, somewhat alleviate the pressure from weak VoltTurns, and checks numerous Pokemon or can at least prevent them from sweeping, because Fairy type is insane. Thunder Wave gets the nod over Flamethrower because I find it more useful defensively and for Heatran, though given how spotty this team is against fast Mega Scizor, I think Flamethrower is a fair choice even though Heatran can check it if it gets paralyzed.

http://www.pkparaiso.com/imagenes/xy/sprites/animados/keldeo.gif
Keldeo @ Leftovers
Ability: Justified
EVs: 248 SpA / 8 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Scald
- Secret Sword
- Substitute

Ehhhh I feel like the metagame has started to adapt to this guy a bit (as evidenced by the rise of Celebi, Starmie, etc.) and I find it less effective than I did when ORAS started. Even so, this is my primary stall-breaker (translation: stall is a difficult matchup for me) and still puts pressure on a lot of teams and checks Scizor and Bisharp, though not all that well. I feel like this is where my team building got a tiniest bit lazy.

http://www.pkparaiso.com/imagenes/xy/sprites/animados/latias.gif
Latias (F) @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
- Draco Meteor
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Defog
- Healing Wish

This guy has actually been really clutch and is a great synergy mon. For some reason, I find people to be more careful about coverage moves when playing vs. Latios than Latias, so I've found HP Fire to be a surprisingly effective Scizor/Ferro lure. It provides a *badly* needed Electric resist and a good switch-in to Charizard Y and non-SubMind Keld I guess. The real story here is Healing Wish, which is usually when I make my move in a game and corner my opponent. Often I find that teams can check any one of my CM sweepers but not all that well, so I can weaken them and then come back for round two. This is especially true of MegaBro who can actually beat/severely maim some of its checks 1v1 but is left at really low health (think vs. like LO Thund or something) which effectively kills Slowbro since it's too slow to recover on anything. Healing Wish changes that equation, which is awesome.


Okay so here are the issues I want to have fixed:

- Fairies: For a suspect ladder team you'd think I'd be better against these guys, but nah, Clefable can completely shut me down (Slowbro is not the best Clef check in the world, I'll just say that) and my Mega Diancie check is uhhh Slowbro lol? I can survive, but it's not ideal. Oh, and don't even get me started on Azumarill, who I basically just sacrifice mons to.

- VoltTurn: Oh look, balance is super popular and VoltTurn mons like Rotom-W, Landorus-T, and Mag are really common, and they check the mon I'm building around! BRB I'm going to make myself obnoxiously weak to this strategy.

- Stall: I can outplay this match-up, but it requires really sound execution.

- Mega Pinsir: I have literally not seen a single one of these, but lol.

These flaws haven't been crippling because I am a prodigy they can be played around to various degrees and I have four Pokemon that are really frightening win-cons on their own, which gives me tremendous in-game flexibility. I feel like the build is just a little flabby, meaning that I'm not quite making efficient use of my team slots. I've been stuck on what exactly I should be shifting around. Suggestions welcome etc.


As for Band Scizor I ran him with a few different builds and just found him to be a liiiittle too slow and too frail (or perhaps easy to wear down) than I would have liked, and while the advantages I mentioned were there, I just found it to be iffy on the whole. Oh well not every idea can take off. ;(

you could try a mega scizor with superpower>keldeo and a regular slowbro, that and taunt over EP on heatran should take care of most fairies

m-diancie and m-scizor are still annoying but these pokes are always difficult to defend against on teams like yours but it's possible to play around them, you could try the 252/160/96+ spread on Clefable to take moonblasts better, since Slowbro can take on lopunny. mega gyara might become more annoying if you do that, though

m-diancie has to carry hp fire and predict correctly to beat scizor too, so maybe it isnt that bad a weak

Dark Azelf March 3rd, 2015 4:29 AM

There isnt much to really do with your team anti. I would suggest a ground type over Keld since that appears to be the most replaceable member of your team. Something that might be interesting is Krookodile. Yeah i know its not something you'd usually use but hear me out. It can psuedo check Bisharp still and you can scarf it if you want and rack up Moxie boost Knock off sweeps late game, can even pursuit shit like Celebi if you're feeling frisky which helps bro obv. Scarf or CB or w/e lol. It helps slightly vs volt turn too as in can block volt switches from stuff like Mag and Manectric and i guess from rotom but not really lol.

100% agree with Taunt on Heatran. Then you could either run TrapTran/Taunt+Toxic to lure in shit like Chansey for megabro thus improving your match up against stall whilst also beating fairies better than your current set does.

Karma89 March 9th, 2015 6:50 PM

I don't exactly have a team in mind or anything, its just that recently i've fallen in love with a few pokes and i was curious to see if anyone could come up with a team that could make them work together.

Lately i've been really enjoying the combo of Mew and Porygon2 in my teams but beyond that i can seem to put something together that flows well.

My typical set up for the two pokes seems pretty standard i think

Mew @ Leftovers
Defog
Will-O-Wisp
Soft Boiled
Knock Off


Porygon2 @ Eviolite
Thunderbolt/Tri-Attack
Ice Beam
Toxic
Recover


I've also been enjoying Umbreon a lot lately but it doesn't need to be in the team. I'm looking for something OU related and really i'm just looking to hear about some teams that might be able to fight the above two pokes in them.

Dark Azelf March 10th, 2015 2:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti (Post 8630212)
Oh yeah, this kinda died so I might as well revive it (omg double post op) with the team that came out of this core since I would describe the team as "very nice but not quite there yet" so it's pretty much in tweak mode but could use a facelift. It's really more geared toward suspect but can kinda-sorta hang with Mega Metagross I guess? Lol.

Many of y'all have faced this team, and if you have then you know I like to play it aggressively as I am not super confident in the defensive core. My suspect ladder record is 31-13 though I think the team's record is closer to 26-8 because I started on suspect with an offense team whose defensive stopper was MegaZard X haha, so you can guess how that went. Anyway, here's what I have:

http://www.pkparaiso.com/imagenes/rubi-omega-zafiro-alfa/sprites/animados/slowbro-mega.gif
Slowbro (M) @ Slowbronite
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 80 Def / 176 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Scald
- Psyshock
- Slack Off

The old post explains why I like Mega Slowbro so much, but let's just say that he's a really terrifying win condition. I think in practice the only thing I have been annoyed with is that, if he doesn't get Scald burns (which *would* happen to me), breaking iffy pseudo-checks like Ferrothorn and Rotom-W does get a bit more difficult. I have this paired with Healing Wish support (spoiler alert) which allows me to play it very aggressively early on, which is nice. Even though it can be stopped, I kind of find this to be a BS poke tbh. :/

http://www.pkparaiso.com/imagenes/xy/sprites/animados/heatran.gif
Heatran @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 248 HP / 12 SpA / 208 SpD / 40 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Lava Plume
- Stealth Rock
- Earth Power
- Toxic

I tossed in Heatran for SR support, a kinda-sorta Talonflame check, a little status, and much-needed special bulk. I'm not a huge fan of Heatran but he does his job pretty well and closes some gaps on the team. I would be open to a replacement here. Oh, and idek about the EVs. I think they all just made the numbers pretty (like 300 satk or something?) so don't ask.

http://www.pkparaiso.com/imagenes/xy/sprites/animados/tornadus-therian.gif
Tornadus-Therian (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 40 Atk / 252 SpA / 216 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Hurricane
- Superpower
- Knock Off
- U-turn

I actually removed this for a bit because Hurricane's accuracy kept costing me games. No matter: I still love his Speed, utility, and ability to grab momentum, even though I really wish that Hurricane didn't suck. He's a great early game breaker against some teams as well though I wouldn't say it's as good as the mixed Defiant Thundurus I enjoyed spamming in XY. The big thing with Tornadus is that he can safely switch into Serperior and especially Celebi and get me back momentum. It allows me to play Slowbro aggressively and not fear an incoming vegetable mon. sry sims.

http://www.pkparaiso.com/imagenes/xy/sprites/animados/clefable.gif
Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Thunder Wave
- Calm Mind
- Soft-Boiled

I always use this mon lol. It's just too useful. I liked the idea of dual CM with MegaBro, and her utility actually supports Slowbro nicely, especially on the status absorption front. Otherwise, it can spread status, somewhat alleviate the pressure from weak VoltTurns, and checks numerous Pokemon or can at least prevent them from sweeping, because Fairy type is insane. Thunder Wave gets the nod over Flamethrower because I find it more useful defensively and for Heatran, though given how spotty this team is against fast Mega Scizor, I think Flamethrower is a fair choice even though Heatran can check it if it gets paralyzed.

http://www.pkparaiso.com/imagenes/xy/sprites/animados/keldeo.gif
Keldeo @ Leftovers
Ability: Justified
EVs: 248 SpA / 8 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Scald
- Secret Sword
- Substitute

Ehhhh I feel like the metagame has started to adapt to this guy a bit (as evidenced by the rise of Celebi, Starmie, etc.) and I find it less effective than I did when ORAS started. Even so, this is my primary stall-breaker (translation: stall is a difficult matchup for me) and still puts pressure on a lot of teams and checks Scizor and Bisharp, though not all that well. I feel like this is where my team building got a tiniest bit lazy.

http://www.pkparaiso.com/imagenes/xy/sprites/animados/latias.gif
Latias (F) @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 2 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
- Draco Meteor
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Defog
- Healing Wish

This guy has actually been really clutch and is a great synergy mon. For some reason, I find people to be more careful about coverage moves when playing vs. Latios than Latias, so I've found HP Fire to be a surprisingly effective Scizor/Ferro lure. It provides a *badly* needed Electric resist and a good switch-in to Charizard Y and non-SubMind Keld I guess. The real story here is Healing Wish, which is usually when I make my move in a game and corner my opponent. Often I find that teams can check any one of my CM sweepers but not all that well, so I can weaken them and then come back for round two. This is especially true of MegaBro who can actually beat/severely maim some of its checks 1v1 but is left at really low health (think vs. like LO Thund or something) which effectively kills Slowbro since it's too slow to recover on anything. Healing Wish changes that equation, which is awesome.


Okay so here are the issues I want to have fixed:

- Fairies: For a suspect ladder team you'd think I'd be better against these guys, but nah, Clefable can completely shut me down (Slowbro is not the best Clef check in the world, I'll just say that) and my Mega Diancie check is uhhh Slowbro lol? I can survive, but it's not ideal. Oh, and don't even get me started on Azumarill, who I basically just sacrifice mons to.

- VoltTurn: Oh look, balance is super popular and VoltTurn mons like Rotom-W, Landorus-T, and Mag are really common, and they check the mon I'm building around! BRB I'm going to make myself obnoxiously weak to this strategy.

- Stall: I can outplay this match-up, but it requires really sound execution.

- Mega Pinsir: I have literally not seen a single one of these, but lol.

These flaws haven't been crippling because I am a prodigy they can be played around to various degrees and I have four Pokemon that are really frightening win-cons on their own, which gives me tremendous in-game flexibility. I feel like the build is just a little flabby, meaning that I'm not quite making efficient use of my team slots. I've been stuck on what exactly I should be shifting around. Suggestions welcome etc.


As for Band Scizor I ran him with a few different builds and just found him to be a liiiittle too slow and too frail (or perhaps easy to wear down) than I would have liked, and while the advantages I mentioned were there, I just found it to be iffy on the whole. Oh well not every idea can take off. ;(

To expand on my earlier rate, Altaria REALLY hurts this team badly after play testing. Especially Dragon Dance. EQ mix special sets arent much better. Basically the only thing you can do to them is hope for a burn with bro otherwise its a 6-0 you. If it has sub or Facade then you're pretty much done.

Im not sure what the next move would be cos of it obs ruining the synergy. Id probs replace Keld (as i said earlier) and Torn. Those are definitely the weak links here. Krook is doing really well over Keld as it checks stuff like Manectric and softens up bros countes, i.e Celebi etc so its working really well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karma89 (Post 8649177)
I don't exactly have a team in mind or anything, its just that recently i've fallen in love with a few pokes and i was curious to see if anyone could come up with a team that could make them work together.

Lately i've been really enjoying the combo of Mew and Porygon2 in my teams but beyond that i can seem to put something together that flows well.

My typical set up for the two pokes seems pretty standard i think

Mew @ Leftovers
Defog
Will-O-Wisp
Soft Boiled
Knock Off


Porygon2 @ Eviolite
Thunderbolt/Tri-Attack
Ice Beam
Toxic
Recover


I've also been enjoying Umbreon a lot lately but it doesn't need to be in the team. I'm looking for something OU related and really i'm just looking to hear about some teams that might be able to fight the above two pokes in them.

You could probably run stall with these two. Porygon-2, Umbreon and Mew seems to be a nice core.

Karma89 March 10th, 2015 3:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dark Azelf (Post 8650142)
You could probably run stall with these two. Porygon-2, Umbreon and Mew seems to be a nice core.

Yeah, i was thinking about that. I ended up going Mega Sableye instead of Umbreon though.

Anti March 11th, 2015 8:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dark Azelf (Post 8650142)
To expand on my earlier rate, Altaria REALLY hurts this team badly after play testing. Especially Dragon Dance. EQ mix special sets arent much better. Basically the only thing you can do to them is hope for a burn with bro otherwise its a 6-0 you. If it has sub or Facade then you're pretty much done.

Im not sure what the next move would be cos of it obs ruining the synergy. Id probs replace Keld (as i said earlier) and Torn. Those are definitely the weak links here. Krook is doing really well over Keld as it checks stuff like Manectric and softens up bros countes, i.e Celebi etc so its working really well.

first off, thanks for playtesting and giving me in-depth suggestions etc.

will definitely toss on krook and see how it goes, but i really like the suggestion. also quirky and hopefully decently viable :p ginger elf in da building

gotta disagree on torn-t tho, if the version u battled yoshi with is what u playtested, then yeah torn is gonna suck because air slash is just terrible lol. hurricane misses suck but i'd rather roll the dice on it then consistently *never do any damage*. anyway, torn-t is great for grass-types that come in on big bro and unlike heatran, it actually applies pressure to my opponent, and its utility is simply fantastic. gotta say i've had a different playtest exp than u w this one haha.

as for alt it's def a problem. my phys def evs let it come in on return somewhat reliably at full health (28% chance to 2hko with max atk adamant) but it is admittedly shaky at best. even so, altaria is decently easy to pressure though it does restrict my play a lot since keld and lati become major liabilities until it's weakened or killed. i've actually struggled more with mega diancie but same difference lol, usually just sack slowbro to get a scald hit on it and then RK with torn t. often tries to bounce sr back but gets hit with ep from tran. anyway, krook doesn't help with this so much but uhhh i could drop hp fire for psyshock on the lati so i can peed tie diancie and at least put some pressure on altaria. might just be a weakness i have to accept, and hopefully the return of metagross (who btw is a pain, slowbro or not) will lessen those mons' usage. hehe :x

Alfieri March 11th, 2015 9:53 AM

Hey guys, I'd like to create a doubles rain team with Kabutops as one of my sweepers. However I don't know which Pokemon is best suited for setting up rain and what good abilities besides Swift Swim really take advantage of rain.

Kabutops @ Life Orb
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Speed
Jolly Nature
- Waterfall
- Stone Edge
- Aqua Jet
- Protect

Nah March 11th, 2015 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alfieri (Post 8651231)
Hey guys, I'd like to create a doubles rain team with Kabutops as one of my sweepers. However I don't know which Pokemon is best suited for setting up rain and what good abilities besides Swift Swim really take advantage of rain.

Kabutops @ Life Orb
Ability: Swift Swim
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Speed
Jolly Nature
- Waterfall
- Stone Edge
- Aqua Jet
- Protect

Swift Swim is the only ability you're gonna be looking at really since it's hard to go defensive on rain in doubles and Hydration/Rain Dish are more of a defensive thing. But Manaphy gets Hydration and could be fun to try out. Politoed is needed on your team since it's the only legal auto-rain summoner:

Politoed @ Leftovers
Ability: Drizzle
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Encore/Icy Wind
- Encore/Perish Song
- Protect

It's a good idea to have a backup rain maker. Lotta Pokemon can learn Rain Dance, but maybe you could try like Pranskter Thundurus or something, idk. Other Swift Swim/Rain abusers include Mega Swampert, Kingdra, Ludicolo, etc. You'll also probably wanna put in something like Amoongus to keep Grass and Electric attacks off of your Water types, or a more offensive Grass type to directly deal with them, like Mega Venusaur, Breloom, Celebi, etc.

And Rock Slide > Stone Edge on Kabutops because doubles.

Alfieri March 11th, 2015 11:07 AM

Thundurus sounds like fun. I'll give it a go along with Politoed and maybe Mega Swampert. Are Damp Rocks unnecessary since Double Battles go by faster? And will the reduced spread damage of Rock Slide hinder Kabutops?

Nah March 11th, 2015 11:15 AM

I'm not sure if Damp Rock is as vital in doubles as it is in singles, but it's still something to consider putting on anyway. As for Rock Slide, mainly what you're hitting with it is stuff like Mega Zard Y and Talonflame, who die if a rock looks at them the wrong way. Most everything else can be dealt with by rain boosted Water STABS. Rock Slide's also a bit more accurate and has a flinch chance, so it makes up for the reduced base power.

Dusclops101 March 12th, 2015 9:16 AM

So, I'm not very good at building teams, but it's not bad to try, right? I just want to know if my team is good as it is or could use little to lots of working on. Here I go:

Thundurus (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Thunder Wave
- Taunt
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Volt Switch

Sylveon @ Leftovers
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpA
Bold Nature
- Baton Pass
- Wish
- Hyper Voice
- Calm Mind

Gallade (M) @ Galladite
Ability: Steadfast
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Knock Off
- Drain Punch
- Protect

Ferrothorn @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 168 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Spikes
- Gyro Ball
- Leech Seed
- Thunder Wave

Gothitelle @ Leftovers
Ability: Shadow Tag
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Psychic
- Calm Mind
- Rest
- Heal Bell

Jirachi @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Head
- U-turn
- Ice Punch
- Trick

That's my team. If someone would like to make suggestions on my team, then that'd be great. Thanks

PlatinumDude March 12th, 2015 9:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dusclops101 (Post 8652469)
So, I'm not very good at building teams, but it's not bad to try, right? I just want to know if my team is good as it is or could use little to lots of working on. Here I go:

Thundurus (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Thunder Wave
- Taunt
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Volt Switch

Sylveon @ Leftovers
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpA
Bold Nature
- Baton Pass
- Wish
- Hyper Voice
- Calm Mind

Gallade (M) @ Galladite
Ability: Steadfast
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Knock Off
- Drain Punch
- Protect

Ferrothorn @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 168 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Spikes
- Gyro Ball
- Leech Seed
- Thunder Wave

Gothitelle @ Leftovers
Ability: Shadow Tag
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Psychic
- Calm Mind
- Rest
- Heal Bell

Jirachi @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Head
- U-turn
- Ice Punch
- Trick

That's my team. If someone would like to make suggestions on my team, then that'd be great. Thanks

Thundurus is meant to be played as a utility sweeper. While Volt Switch is good for gaining momentum, Thundurus is one of those Pokemon who would rather stay in to beat on things, so Thunderbolt is the better option.

Gothitelle is meant to be a trapper, eliminating counters that the team comes across, so I don't think it's cut out for support:
-Psychic/Psyshock
-Hidden Power (Fire)/Calm Mind
-Trick
-Rest
Nature: Timid
EVs: 80 HP/176 SAtk/252 Spe
Item: Choice Scarf
Ability: Shadow Tag

or
-Psychic/Psyshock
-Thunderbolt/Energy Ball
-Hidden Power (Fire)
-Trick
Nature: Modest
EVs: 168 HP/252 SAtk/88 Spe
Item: Choice Specs
Ability: Shadow Tag

In that case, give Heal Bell to Sylveon.

Even though Protect allows Gallade to Mega Evolve safely, it's not worth it because it needs the third slot for STAB Zen Headbutt. Without it, it gets walled by Fairies. Close Combat is also preferred over Drain Punch, as it packs more raw power, something Drain Punch lacks:
-Swords Dance
-Close Combat
-Zen Headbutt
-Knock Off
Nature: Jolly
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spe
Item: Galladite

Gyro Ball and Thunder Wave don't mesh well together on Ferrothorn, because the former gets stronger the slower Ferrothorn is than the opponent, while the latter slows down the opponent to be about as slow as Ferrothorn itself, weakening Gyro Ball's power significantly. Drop either one of them for Power Whip (for a secondary STAB) or Protect (to stall for extra Leech Seed/Leftovers recovery).

Bisharp is also an excellent partner to Mega Gallade because it can get rid of the Ghost and Psychic Pokemon that plague it:
-Knock Off
-Iron Head
-Sucker Punch
-Swords Dance/Pursuit
Nature: Adamant/Jolly
EVs: 252 Atk/4 Def/252 Spe or 252 Atk/52 SDef/204 Spe
Item: Life Orb/Black Glasses/Dread Plate
Ability: Defiant

or
-Knock Off
-Iron Head
-Sucker Punch
-Pursuit
Nature: Adamant
EVs: 192 HP/220 Atk/96 Spe
Item: Assault Vest
Ability Defiant

Dusclops101 March 12th, 2015 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PlatinumDude (Post 8652517)
Thundurus is meant to be played as a utility sweeper. While Volt Switch is good for gaining momentum, Thundurus is one of those Pokemon who would rather stay in to beat on things, so Thunderbolt is the better option.

Gothitelle is meant to be a trapper, eliminating counters that the team comes across, so I don't think it's cut out for support:
-Psychic/Psyshock
-Hidden Power (Fire)/Calm Mind
-Trick
-Rest
Nature: Timid
EVs: 80 HP/176 SAtk/252 Spe
Item: Choice Scarf
Ability: Shadow Tag

or
-Psychic/Psyshock
-Thunderbolt/Energy Ball
-Hidden Power (Fire)
-Trick
Nature: Modest
EVs: 168 HP/252 SAtk/88 Spe
Item: Choice Specs
Ability: Shadow Tag

In that case, give Heal Bell to Sylveon.

Even though Protect allows Gallade to Mega Evolve safely, it's not worth it because it needs the third slot for STAB Zen Headbutt. Without it, it gets walled by Fairies. Close Combat is also preferred over Drain Punch, as it packs more raw power, something Drain Punch lacks:
-Swords Dance
-Close Combat
-Zen Headbutt
-Knock Off
Nature: Jolly
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spe
Item: Galladite

Gyro Ball and Thunder Wave don't mesh well together on Ferrothorn, because the former gets stronger the slower Ferrothorn is than the opponent, while the latter slows down the opponent to be about as slow as Ferrothorn itself, weakening Gyro Ball's power significantly. Drop either one of them for Power Whip (for a secondary STAB) or Protect (to stall for extra Leech Seed/Leftovers recovery).

Bisharp is also an excellent partner to Mega Gallade because it can get rid of the Ghost and Psychic Pokemon that plague it:
-Knock Off
-Iron Head
-Sucker Punch
-Swords Dance/Pursuit
Nature: Adamant/Jolly
EVs: 252 Atk/4 Def/252 Spe or 252 Atk/52 SDef/204 Spe
Item: Life Orb/Black Glasses/Dread Plate
Ability: Defiant

or
-Knock Off
-Iron Head
-Sucker Punch
-Pursuit
Nature: Adamant
EVs: 192 HP/220 Atk/96 Spe
Item: Assault Vest
Ability Defiant

So, it's good for a first time creation?

Anti March 23rd, 2015 1:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dusclops101 (Post 8652469)
So, I'm not very good at building teams, but it's not bad to try, right? I just want to know if my team is good as it is or could use little to lots of working on. Here I go:

Thundurus (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Thunder Wave
- Taunt
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Thunderbolt

What PlatDude said.


Sylveon @ Leftovers
Ability: Pixilate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpA
Bold Nature
- Baton Pass
- Wish
- Hyper Voice
- Calm Mind

Sylveon really has two viable roles: WishPasser and Choice Specs attacker (and a lot of players will tell you that Clefable is better as a WishPasser, and they're pretty much right). Specs is cool though. I don't have EVs for you, but the set is [email protected] Voice/Shadow Ball or Psyshock/Hidden Power [Ground or Fire]/Baton Pass. Baton Pass is used for momentum, though using the move from the second slot that you passed up isn't indefensible since you're mostly going to be attacking once you get it in.

Gallade (M) @ Galladite
Ability: Steadfast
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Knock Off
- Close Combat
- Zen Headbutt

I personally think this mon kinda blows (just an "eye test" thing - never been pressured by it in battle the way other mons like ZardX, MMeta, or MScizor will) but it's perfectly usable. Take advantage of its high base power STAB though.


Ferrothorn @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 88 Def / 168 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Gyro Ball
- Leech Seed
- Power Whip

Spikes are a luxury; Stealth Rock is a NECESSITY on EVERY competitive team. I put Power Whip over Thunder Wave to help with Mega Gyarados and Manaphy, who are big threats to your team.


Gothitelle @ Leftovers
Ability: Shadow Tag
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Psychic
- Calm Mind
- Rest
- Heal Bell

Use PlatDude's set, though I would honestly just use a different Pokemon. Gothitelle is kind of frowned upon since most players think that Shadow Tag removes a skill element from the game, though it is perfectly legal. Anyway, dumb poke; I'd put in something like Latias that can do some cool things like Healing Wish and otherwise be more useful defensively.

Jirachi @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Head
- U-turn
- Ice Punch
- Trick

Can't say I see this often but seems reasonable enough. Not sure what Jolly is outrunning though, so you might as well run Adamant, unless you're really worried about Mega Gardevoir post-Trick.

That's my team. If someone would like to make suggestions on my team, then that'd be great. Thanks

And yes, it is good for a first time. :P

So, I also have my own idea I want some help with. I am in a big team-building rut but have really been intrigued by Klefki lately:

http://www.pkparaiso.com/imagenes/xy/sprites/animados/klefki.gif
Klefki @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 248 HP / 100 Def / 160 SpD
Careful Nature
- Spikes
- Thunder Wave
- Play Rough
- Magnet Rise / Toxic

Basically, in large part because of the ridiculous power creep of some top megas (glad we didn't ban Metagross!!!!), the metagame has gotten fairly bulky. A lot of popular balance mons like Heatran, Hippowdon, Slowbro, and especially Ferrothorn are ground-bound, making Spikes a very legitimate option to wear them down. Klefki has a nice match-up against [email protected], the most common Defoggers, while Magnet Rise can let Excadrill wear itself down with Life Orb recoil. Starmie can be Pursuited or lured, and defensive Defoggers' passivity can be taken advantage of in the remaining 5 team slots. (I want this team to be bulky offense, so fairly aggressive.)

Meanwhile, Klefki eases team-building by providing a safety valve against dangerous set-up sweepers (and Metagross, lol) as well as a nice switch into Fairies, though it has to tread carefully. Steel/Fairy is excellent defensive typing and covering so much while simultaneously executing a strategy makes Klefki appeal a lot to me. Also, it's super unique and sounded cool.

The EVs always avoid a 2HKO from Mega Gardevoir's Focus Blast, and the rest are tossed into physical defense to take Psyshock from [email protected] better. I'll mess with them more later.

In terms of partners, I thought it might be cool to pair it with:

http://www.pkparaiso.com/imagenes/xy/sprites/animados/charizard-megax.gif
Charizard @ Charizardite X
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 72 HP / 252 Atk / 184 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance / Earthquake
- Flare Blitz
- Dragon Claw
- Roost / Earthquake

Zard-X seems like it's constantly underrated, so I thought he'd be cool to try out. Hippowdon, Slowbro, Rhyperior, Mega Altaria, Mega Diancie, etc. all really do not like Spikes (which will of course be paired with SR). The EVs outspeed Scarf Landorus-T (and Scarf Exca too I guess) after a DD. This mon is very self-explanatory.

And now I've hit a snag in building. Lots of mons have come to mind - Weavile seems like a really cool offensive partner for Zard while bulky SR Garchomp completes the hazards core and further helps with Exca - but it's all somewhat embryonic. Also, Zard pretty much requires a Spinner - and not a Defogger given Spikes - so that's a bit of a strain.

Hit me up with ideas. :)

Dark Azelf March 23rd, 2015 3:02 AM

Having used Klefki, play rough actually sucks on it. It doesnt hit sableye for relevant damage and not being shat on by Excadrill helps every time you go for spikes, also doesnt hit starmie for any damage. Foul Play is so much better imo. I kinda prefer Toxic over Wave too but thats just me.

Magnet Rise is amazing though so id keep that. Seeing Landorus and friends go oh shit and give up momentum against you is hilarious.

As for Spinners you're basically stuck with Starmie and Excadrill offensively lol. Unless you wanna run Tentacruel (rofl) or Cloyster (lool).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dusclops101 (Post 8652546)
So, it's good for a first time creation?

Id use CM Clefable with MGuard over Sylveon. That is just asking to be burned and worn down and then crushed by MSable which your whole team is otherwise.

Detox March 31st, 2015 10:30 AM

What’s up thread. Today I had the idea of building a Diancie-Mega squad. I settled on the standard all out attacker set and was wondering where you guys thought I should go from here. I added a bulky Stealth Rock Garchomp because it’s a cute way to get up rocks and check a few things that Diancie doesn’t want any part of. Anyways, suggestions are appreciated. A few of the other pokemon I have considered using are Hetran, Magnezone, Rotom - Wash, and Ferrothorn. The current setup is below:

http://sweepercalc.com/css/images/sprites/garchomp.png
Garchomp @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 160 Def / 92 Spe
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Dragon Tail
- Fire Blast

http://sweepercalc.com/css/images/sprites/diancie-mega.png
Diancie @ Diancite
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 16 Atk / 240 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Protect
- Moonblast
- Diamond Storm
- Earth Power

Anti March 31st, 2015 11:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dark Azelf (Post 8668281)
Having used Klefki, play rough actually sucks on it. It doesnt hit sableye for relevant damage and not being shat on by Excadrill helps every time you go for spikes, also doesnt hit starmie for any damage. Foul Play is so much better imo. I kinda prefer Toxic over Wave too but thats just me.

Magnet Rise is amazing though so id keep that. Seeing Landorus and friends go oh muk and give up momentum against you is hilarious.

As for Spinners you're basically stuck with Starmie and Excadrill offensively lol. Unless you wanna run Tentacruel (rofl) or Cloyster (lool).

Thanks for this. I didn't ignore, just got busy and wanted to test the current version which you've no doubt seen by now.

So, I have actually appreciated Play Rough in random situations like "I just need a hit on Mega Diancie to put it into Weavile KO range" or "this is the only thing that stands up to this Gardevoir and I need to hit it." Anecdotal, but it has its uses. Nevertheless, I will test Foul Play, especially if some of the stuff that Play Rough hits are handled by the team a little better than they are now.

I have enjoyed Charizard X, and for once, I have seen my team-building strategy actually playing out in real battles which is always neat, but I dislike that Charizard X compounds some of Klefki's weaknesses (Heatran, Exca) and forces me to run hazard control, which I don't want to have to run. I'll be experimenting with other megas that enjoy Spikes. Some ideas so far have including Mega Lopunny, Mega Gyarados, and Mega Gardevoir. (In terms of non-megas, Gegnar seems to be an excellent candidate as well!) If any particularly nice offensive cores come to mind I'm willing to hear them, as I want to run a bulky offense build here.

Oh yeah, and I've definitely missed Toxic at times, though I like the extra freedom Thunder Wave gives both in-battle (can play more aggressively) and in building (failsafe to some set-up sweepers). If anything I'd replace Magnet Rise even though it is pretty hilarious as you mentioned.

I'll keep you posted on the progress. Trying to iron out Lopunny at the moment and seeing if it will yield the results I want.

Quote:

Originally Posted by King Syn (Post 8683261)
What’s up thread. Today I had the idea of building a Diancie-Mega squad. I settled on the standard all out attacker set and was wondering where you guys thought I should go from here. I added a bulky Stealth Rock Garchomp because it’s a cute way to get up rocks and check a few things that Diancie doesn’t want any part of. Anyways, suggestions are appreciated. A few of the other pokemon I have considered using are Hetran, Magnezone, Rotom - Wash, and Ferrothorn. The current setup is below:

http://sweepercalc.com/css/images/sprites/garchomp.png
Garchomp @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 160 Def / 92 Spe
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Dragon Tail
- Fire Blast

http://sweepercalc.com/css/images/sprites/diancie-mega.png
Diancie @ Diancite
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 16 Atk / 240 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Protect
- Moonblast
- Diamond Storm
- Earth Power

Diancie is a beast lol.

Run Naive on it so you don't weaken Diamond Storm. (Naive over Hasty for Lati Psyshock/EQ and Brave Birds etc.)

That tweak aside, before adding supporting pieces like Heatran, Rotom, Ferro, etc., I would try to form an offensive core with Diancie.

One poke that might be cool is mixed Thundurus. Its Knock Off is really nice for weakening Ferrothorn and a lot of Diancie's soft checks like Celebi, Hippowdon, and even Clefable (though you can just mow this poke down it's always nice to weaken it no matter what you're running lol). Its Speed tier is also very nice so you don't have to risk Diancie to a Speed tie in a pinch. Thundurus in general is good for softening up cores and can form a powerful duo with Diancie.

If you wanna go a little hipster, I think a Victini could be neat, though it will reinforce some defensive weaknesses. It checks/pressures all of Diancie's checks. Scarf or Band could both work. An offensive Heatran could also fill this function, and I actually like the Magma Storm set's offensive synergy as it can help remove Chansey in stall match-ups. It has similar problems with Victini defensively though. And then you mentioned Mag. Very self-explanatory. It works. Use it if you want. :P

If you want to go a bulkier route, then I think Keldeo is a very standard but solid option, mostly because it can help with Mega Scizor and Ferrothorn. If you ran it, I would definitely go Specs, as I think the immediate power and breaking ability would support Diancie well.

Nah April 13th, 2015 6:48 AM

Felt like making another OU team but then realized I can't make OU teams worth a shit so I need some help again.

Black Kyurem @ Leftovers/Life Orb/Expert Belt/some other shit
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 56 Atk / 252 SpA / 200 Spe
Mild Nature
- Ice Beam
- Fusion Bolt
- Earth Power
- Hidden Power [Fire]/or something

Like the previous team I posted about in here this one has Cube in it.....idk i just like it for some reason despite the fact that it's part Ice and has bleh Speed. Not sure what to do with the last move slot or the item though.

Bisharp @ Assault Vest
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 192 HP / 220 Atk / 96 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Iron Head
- Knock Off
- Sucker Punch
- Pursuit

Then I thought that maybe I could do a little Dragon/Steel/Fairy core (that is a thing right?) so I put in Bisharp. Went with the AV set because base 70 Speed doesn't sound like it's gettin' anywhere fast even with max investment (it has Sucker Punch anyway) and I never liked how the non-bulky versions die so fast.

Gardevoir (F) @ Gardevoirite
Ability: Trace
EVs: 24 Def / 232 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hyper Voice
- Psyshock
- Focus Blast
- Taunt

And then threw in Garde because you're not gonna get very far if you don't have something to deal with stall/defensive cores and Garde does a pretty good job at dealing with that and 4x resists Fighting.


But idk where to go from here. There's some obvious things like SR and hazard control but idk what'd be the best fit. I probably could complete the team myself but that'd probably result in some really meh team that'll just end up getting stuck in the low 1400s on the ladder like all my OU teams tend to do. None of the above stuff absolutely has to stay on the team, and I don't care if it becomes a HO or a semi-stall team or whatever (just not balance or full stall pls). I suppose that what I'm really getting at is that after doing this for nearly 4 years now I need to learn how one builds a good team because I never really know wtf I'm doing when I make teams and need people to enlighten me. Even though that's probably asking a lot of y'all.....

Anti April 13th, 2015 11:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zekrom (Post 8705102)
Felt like making another OU team but then realized I can't make OU teams worth a muk so I need some help again.

Black Kyurem @ Leftovers/Life Orb/Expert Belt/some other muk
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 56 Atk / 252 SpA / 200 Spe
Mild Nature
- Ice Beam
- Fusion Bolt
- Earth Power
- Hidden Power [Fire]/or something

Like the previous team I posted about in here this one has Cube in it.....idk i just like it for some reason despite the fact that it's part Ice and has bleh Speed. Not sure what to do with the last move slot or the item though.

Bisharp @ Assault Vest
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 192 HP / 220 Atk / 96 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Iron Head
- Knock Off
- Sucker Punch
- Pursuit

Then I thought that maybe I could do a little Dragon/Steel/Fairy core (that is a thing right?) so I put in Bisharp. Went with the AV set because base 70 Speed doesn't sound like it's gettin' anywhere fast even with max investment (it has Sucker Punch anyway) and I never liked how the non-bulky versions die so fast.

Gardevoir (F) @ Gardevoirite
Ability: Trace
EVs: 24 Def / 232 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hyper Voice
- Psyshock
- Focus Blast
- Taunt

And then threw in Garde because you're not gonna get very far if you don't have something to deal with stall/defensive cores and Garde does a pretty good job at dealing with that and 4x resists Fighting.


But idk where to go from here. There's some obvious things like SR and hazard control but idk what'd be the best fit. I probably could complete the team myself but that'd probably result in some really meh team that'll just end up getting stuck in the low 1400s on the ladder like all my OU teams tend to do. None of the above stuff absolutely has to stay on the team, and I don't care if it becomes a HO or a semi-stall team or whatever (just not balance or full stall pls). I suppose that what I'm really getting at is that after doing this for nearly 4 years now I need to learn how one builds a good team because I never really know wtf I'm doing when I make teams and need people to enlighten me. Even though that's probably asking a lot of y'all.....

I would pick two of the above Pokemon. All three of them together are compounding weaknesses. The biggest one, as weird as it sounds, is just how slow they are overall. Speed is nice in its own right, as it gives you flexibility dealing with threats you simply do not have if you (and your opponent) know that you have to take a hit first. Sucker Punch has some nice utility but can be used as set-up bait. They also just don't cover that much, so you'll have to cram checks to a lot of threats into the last three slots (Altaria, Zards, Metagross, etc.) which will basically force you to run a balance.

I'll focus on the Gardevoir. Gardevoir is a very nice breaker Pokemon, and its team support is pretty much just "pressure Ferro/Tran and have switch-ins to Metagross and Scizor." Kyurem-B is a nice way to wear down Ferrothorn, and even getting chip damage on non-mega Scizor is nice. I like it better than AV Bisharp here, so I'd make Bisharp the one you replace.

The best Pokemon in terms of offensive synergy for Gardevoir is probably Choice Specs Keldeo. It gives a decent rush of Speed (albeit less, relatively speaking, than in XY) and rips up Ferro/Tran/Scizor. Finding offensive checks for Metagross is a pain, but it can be done. I think. I'm going to go douse myself in kerosene, so give me a minute.

I think a Garde/Keld/Cube core looks much more sound offensively. (I also like that Celebi is easy pickings for the Cube.) You'd need something for Fairy-types and Metagross, so you could run a sand core with it or go with a more conservative backbone, but it sounds like you want something more aggressive. Excadrill would actually fit nicely, providing Rapid Spin support and a failsafe against numerous sweepers while Tyranitar could fill Bisharp's shoes nicely.

If you want aggressive but not sand, Jirachi is a very nice fit. You'll need backup against Metagross still (hnng) but can provide SR, a check to Fairy-types, and status, momentum...really, whatever you want it to. Fire Punch can even lure Scizor, which is a nice bonus.

If you don't like those options I can come up with others. GL.

Nah April 13th, 2015 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti (Post 8705514)
I would pick two of the above Pokemon. All three of them together are compounding weaknesses. The biggest one, as weird as it sounds, is just how slow they are overall. Speed is nice in its own right, as it gives you flexibility dealing with threats you simply do not have if you (and your opponent) know that you have to take a hit first. Sucker Punch has some nice utility but can be used as set-up bait. They also just don't cover that much, so you'll have to cram checks to a lot of threats into the last three slots (Altaria, Zards, Metagross, etc.) which will basically force you to run a balance.

I'll focus on the Gardevoir. Gardevoir is a very nice breaker Pokemon, and its team support is pretty much just "pressure Ferro/Tran and have switch-ins to Metagross and Scizor." Kyurem-B is a nice way to wear down Ferrothorn, and even getting chip damage on non-mega Scizor is nice. I like it better than AV Bisharp here, so I'd make Bisharp the one you replace.

The best Pokemon in terms of offensive synergy for Gardevoir is probably Choice Specs Keldeo. It gives a decent rush of Speed (albeit less, relatively speaking, than in XY) and rips up Ferro/Tran/Scizor. Finding offensive checks for Metagross is a pain, but it can be done. I think. I'm going to go douse myself in kerosene, so give me a minute.

I think a Garde/Keld/Cube core looks much more sound offensively. (I also like that Celebi is easy pickings for the Cube.) You'd need something for Fairy-types and Metagross, so you could run a sand core with it or go with a more conservative backbone, but it sounds like you want something more aggressive. Excadrill would actually fit nicely, providing Rapid Spin support and a failsafe against numerous sweepers while Tyranitar could fill Bisharp's shoes nicely.

If you want aggressive but not sand, Jirachi is a very nice fit. You'll need backup against Metagross still (hnng) but can provide SR, a check to Fairy-types, and status, momentum...really, whatever you want it to. Fire Punch can even lure Scizor, which is a nice bonus.

If you don't like those options I can come up with others. GL.

Yeah, I think that you're right about Bisharp so I'ma drop that. It's not a bad poke and it has its uses but maybe it's just not for this particular team. Are there other options for the Keldeo slot though? It is very good but I just wanna know what my options are. I'm not sure which to go with on the Jirachi/sand pair thing though. On one hand the Sand Rush Exca+T-tar provides a couple of really useful things (Mega Meta check, Rapid Spin, possibly SR, beats a lot of sweepers), but then there's the fact that it's weather reliant, there's the chip damage on the rest of the team, and Excadrill is pretty frail (not to mention the shared Fighting weakness between Exca, Cube, and T-tar).

But in either scenario, where do I go from here?

Charcoal Embers May 2nd, 2015 11:27 AM

Alright, so I am working on a team for a Tournament that I am going to be in at the end of this month. And I have a few ideas for what I can do. But I am locked into Grass and Normal types, and one idea that I had for singles was was going with Ambipom and then using Sticky Web to support him and let him out speed the few pokemon that are faster than him. Problem is, I don't know exactly what other pokemon to put on the team. So far, here is all I have. And I know that the Aibipom set is strange, but it works surprisingly well for what it's worth.

Spoiler:
Ambipom @ Life Orb
Ability: Technician
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Fake Out
- Last Resort

Leavanny @ Focus Sash
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 Atk / 30 SpA
- Grass Whistle
- Sticky Web
- Leaf Blade
- Struggle Bug

Serperior @ Focus Sash
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Leaf Storm
- Dragon Pulse
- Giga Drain
- Glare

Anti May 5th, 2015 7:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zekrom (Post 8705577)
Yeah, I think that you're right about Bisharp so I'ma drop that. It's not a bad poke and it has its uses but maybe it's just not for this particular team. Are there other options for the Keldeo slot though? It is very good but I just wanna know what my options are. I'm not sure which to go with on the Jirachi/sand pair thing though. On one hand the Sand Rush Exca+T-tar provides a couple of really useful things (Mega Meta check, Rapid Spin, possibly SR, beats a lot of sweepers), but then there's the fact that it's weather reliant, there's the chip damage on the rest of the team, and Excadrill is pretty frail (not to mention the shared Fighting weakness between Exca, Cube, and T-tar).

But in either scenario, where do I go from here?

sorry for taking soooo long to get to this.

kyurem-b and mega gardevoir form a nice breaker duo that you'll have to cover defensively. you can either speed the team up and make it a bulky offense, or slow it down and make it a balance. i definitely think cube with life [email protected] + 3 atks is your best bet. rotom-w fits nicely so you don't get rolled by mega scizor and you can't voltturn your breakers in. offensive stealth rock heatran is nice, but you might be getting into "slow and overly reliant on resistances" territory. dd gyarados would be cool since it would give you a sweeping threat to clean up messes from cube and garde. i like rotom-w since it lets you switch into mega scizor, but you'll want to be prepared to actually damage it. an offensive garchomp could work.

if i'm being truthful, keldeo just really fits like a glove here. you certainly don't *have* to use it, but it'd be really optimal. i think the other really excellent option would be magnezone. it's deterministic and annoying etc., but it would be a very nice poke for you. either of those two mons would be my choice, and then you can round it out with either fastmons or slowmons (or a combo, your call). i like keld better defensively, though mag's trapping is super nice.

sorry, this was kinda rushed, feel free to reject keld again/mag as well haha. but the options i listed above are usable too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Charcoal Embers (Post 8733704)
Alright, so I am working on a team for a Tournament that I am going to be in at the end of this month. And I have a few ideas for what I can do. But I am locked into Grass and Normal types, and one idea that I had for singles was was going with Ambipom and then using Sticky Web to support him and let him out speed the few pokemon that are faster than him. Problem is, I don't know exactly what other pokemon to put on the team. So far, here is all I have. And I know that the Aibipom set is strange, but it works surprisingly well for what it's worth.

Spoiler:
Ambipom @ Life Orb
Ability: Technician
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Fake Out
- Last Resort

Leavanny @ Focus Sash
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 30 Atk / 30 SpA
- Grass Whistle
- Sticky Web
- Leaf Blade
- Struggle Bug

Serperior @ Focus Sash
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Leaf Storm
- Dragon Pulse
- Giga Drain
- Glare

run miracle seed or life orb on the serp, sash isn't great.

that ambipom is too inconsistent in a metagame crawling with ferrothorn, rh garchomp, heatran, gengar, sableye-mega, etc. it also doesn't offer defensive utility, so i think now would be a good time to replace.

i'm not sure i love webs + serp synergy since serp is already so fast and webs don't hurt its two main checks (tornadus-t and talonflame). since serp is a very good mon, i'm going to focus on that. i think sr is your key hazard here with a major focus on removing heatran. i would also toss hp fire over dragon pulse or glare, as leaf storm blows past most mons that dpulse hits, though it has its uses (especially the zards).

manaphy is an awesome partner for serp, and zard x can lure heatran with eq. keldeo fits on any team, but i might refrain from adding it this early. there are lots of options! grounds and waters are particularly good - take your pick.

Charcoal Embers May 5th, 2015 8:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti (Post 8737574)
sorry for taking soooo long to get to this.

kyurem-b and mega gardevoir form a nice breaker duo that you'll have to cover defensively. you can either speed the team up and make it a bulky offense, or slow it down and make it a balance. i definitely think cube with life [email protected] + 3 atks is your best bet. rotom-w fits nicely so you don't get rolled by mega scizor and you can't voltturn your breakers in. offensive stealth rock heatran is nice, but you might be getting into "slow and overly reliant on resistances" territory. dd gyarados would be cool since it would give you a sweeping threat to clean up messes from cube and garde. i like rotom-w since it lets you switch into mega scizor, but you'll want to be prepared to actually damage it. an offensive garchomp could work.

if i'm being truthful, keldeo just really fits like a glove here. you certainly don't *have* to use it, but it'd be really optimal. i think the other really excellent option would be magnezone. it's deterministic and annoying etc., but it would be a very nice poke for you. either of those two mons would be my choice, and then you can round it out with either fastmons or slowmons (or a combo, your call). i like keld better defensively, though mag's trapping is super nice.

sorry, this was kinda rushed, feel free to reject keld again/mag as well haha. but the options i listed above are usable too.



run miracle seed or life orb on the serp, sash isn't great.

that ambipom is too inconsistent in a metagame crawling with ferrothorn, rh garchomp, heatran, gengar, sableye-mega, etc. it also doesn't offer defensive utility, so i think now would be a good time to replace.

i'm not sure i love webs + serp synergy since serp is already so fast and webs don't hurt its two main checks (tornadus-t and talonflame). since serp is a very good mon, i'm going to focus on that. i think sr is your key hazard here with a major focus on removing heatran. i would also toss hp fire over dragon pulse or glare, as leaf storm blows past most mons that dpulse hits, though it has its uses (especially the zards).

manaphy is an awesome partner for serp, and zard x can lure heatran with eq. keldeo fits on any team, but i might refrain from adding it this early. there are lots of options! grounds and waters are particularly good - take your pick.

Two things I have to say. 1, I can't agree with Life Orb or Miracle Seed on Serperior. The results I have had have shown me that Focus Sash works great. 2, I can't use Manaphy or Ground and Waters because I have to use either Grass Types or Normal Types with this team. And off the top of my head, I can't think of many Ground types that are also Normal or Grass (besides Tortera)

Anti May 5th, 2015 8:12 AM

oh sorry, oversight. what is the ruleset for the tournament you're in?

Charcoal Embers May 5th, 2015 8:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti (Post 8737603)
oh sorry, oversight. what is the ruleset for the tournament you're in?

6v6, can be doubles or singles (depending on preference), I can only use 2 types, and I can change my team between battles. Smogon rules.

I think that is everything.

Anti May 5th, 2015 8:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Charcoal Embers (Post 8737606)
6v6, can be doubles or singles (depending on preference), I can only use 2 types, and I can change my team between battles. Smogon rules.

I think that is everything.

does your opponent have the same restriction, and if so, do you know what types your opp is using? can you change yours or are you stuck?

Charcoal Embers May 5th, 2015 8:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti (Post 8737611)
does your opponent have the same restriction, and if so, do you know what types your opp is using? can you change yours or are you stuck?

Yes. Everyone in the tournament has the same restrictions. Everyone has 2 types they can use and only those types. And every type can only be used by two people. So if one person has Ghost and Dark as their types, they can only use pokemon who has at least one type that is Ghost or Dark. And if someone else was using Ghost and Ice, they have the same restriction. But since Ghost was chosen by two people no one else can use Ghost.

Anti May 5th, 2015 8:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Charcoal Embers (Post 8737616)
Yes. Everyone in the tournament has the same restrictions. Everyone has 2 types they can use and only those types. And every type can only be used by two people. So if one person has Ghost and Dark as their types, they can only use pokemon who has at least one type that is Ghost or Dark. And if someone else was using Ghost and Ice, they have the same restriction. But since Ghost was chosen by two people no one else can use Ghost.

what are your opp's types?

Charcoal Embers May 5th, 2015 8:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti (Post 8737617)
what are your opp's types?

Fighting Flying, Ground Dragon, Water Ground, Electric Bug, Ice Ghost, Ghost Dark, Dark Fairy, Psychic Fairy, Poison Fairy, Grass Rock, Poison Steel, Fire Bug, Water Dragon

Nah May 5th, 2015 8:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti (Post 8737574)
sorry for taking soooo long to get to this.

kyurem-b and mega gardevoir form a nice breaker duo that you'll have to cover defensively. you can either speed the team up and make it a bulky offense, or slow it down and make it a balance. i definitely think cube with life [email protected] + 3 atks is your best bet. rotom-w fits nicely so you don't get rolled by mega scizor and you can't voltturn your breakers in. offensive stealth rock heatran is nice, but you might be getting into "slow and overly reliant on resistances" territory. dd gyarados would be cool since it would give you a sweeping threat to clean up messes from cube and garde. i like rotom-w since it lets you switch into mega scizor, but you'll want to be prepared to actually damage it. an offensive garchomp could work.

if i'm being truthful, keldeo just really fits like a glove here. you certainly don't *have* to use it, but it'd be really optimal. i think the other really excellent option would be magnezone. it's deterministic and annoying etc., but it would be a very nice poke for you. either of those two mons would be my choice, and then you can round it out with either fastmons or slowmons (or a combo, your call). i like keld better defensively, though mag's trapping is super nice.

sorry, this was kinda rushed, feel free to reject keld again/mag as well haha. but the options i listed above are usable too.

Nah I understand the love for Keld {XD} Just to clarify though, are you suggesting DD Gyarados/Rotom-Wash in place of Keldeo or alongside Keldeo? Garchomp sounds good though, just dunno if I wanna do offensive SR or SD.....


Oh, and the tournament that Charcoal Embers is talking about is this, in case that helps.

Anti May 5th, 2015 8:58 AM

you should change your team depending on the match-up then. lots of good mons to choose from too like m lop, serp, m venu, amoonguss, blissey/chansey (bliss would be better in certain matchups), chesnaught, etc.

edit: definitely don't run keld and gyara together, youre going to get creamed by fast voltturns if you do.

sd chomp can offensive sr too if youre into that X)

KorpiklaaniVodka May 7th, 2015 4:32 AM

Garchomp @ Focus Sash
Trait: Rough Skin
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature

- Swords Dance
- Outrage
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock

Emboar @ Life Orb
Trait: Reckless
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature

- Flare Blitz
- Sucker Punch
- Wild Charge
- Superpower

I would really like to bulid around this core (yeah yeah using Emboar once again). chomp takes out a lot of early-game threats and provides SR support while Emboar breaks down a lot of walls and is almost impossible to switch into. I'll probably need to cover Mega Alt, so I guess AV Meta, Mega Gardy or CB Scizor would make a good partner.

srinator July 16th, 2015 5:51 AM

I was planning to build a wincon scoli team with swords dance poison jab mega horn and substitute, I was wondering if someone can help me in figuring out how the team would look like? I used a version in this week's Pcl match but that was purely non-serious. But I noticed it could actually work.
Any suggestions?


Also @aps I found this nice emboar ho you could look at for some inspiration, ironically tho it can be better without emboar lol! I will pm it to u if u want

Dark Azelf July 16th, 2015 8:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by static (Post 8848718)
I was planning to build a wincon scoli team with swords dance poison jab mega horn and substitute, I was wondering if someone can help me in figuring out how the team would look like? I used a version in this week's Pcl match but that was purely non-serious. But I noticed it could actually work.
Any suggestions?


Also @aps I found this nice emboar ho you could look at for some inspiration, ironically tho it can be better without emboar lol! I will pm it to u if u want

If you're using Scoli i suggest either Mag or Dug to trap steels or both lol. Probs want hazard control and some way to stop shit like Talon/Lando smiting you. [email protected] would remove Talon. Stuff like Lando and Gliscor are another problem though. Aforementioned Aqua Tail or Ice Punch CB Tar might be nice to "lure" those in or weaken then.

WingedDragon July 18th, 2015 9:24 PM

So with this check list. Do you need some sort of counter for EVERY one of these scenarios?


Also are there ways to build a team around a Mega Garchomp or even regular one?

Anti July 18th, 2015 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdrianD (Post 8852167)
So with this check list. Do you need some sort of counter for EVERY one of these scenarios?

You definitely don't want to straight-up auto-lose to something. I would build your team with your own strategy being the focus (as opposed to focusing on trying to stop others), but you'll want a defensive backbone of some sort. It depends on what type of team you're building.

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdrianD (Post 8852167)
Also are there ways to build a team around a Mega Garchomp or even regular one?

Both are perfectly fine. Regular Garchomp tends to be more of a supporting Pokemon. The chic set right now is the defensive Stealth Rock set with Rough Skin + Rocky Helmet to pile stack chip damage, but offensive Stealth Rock Garchomp is still perfectly viable. It isn't used much beyond that though, though SD and Scarf sets theoretically exist.

MegaChomp is a very strong breaker and can definitely be the foundation of a successful team. It very much appreciates Hippowdon or Tyranitar so it can get the power boost from Sand Force, though I think the team support it really needs is pivoting or some other way to regain momentum from faster revenge killers that will force it out (especially the ubiquitous Lati twins) since its goal is to maximize damage output rather than to have the staying power of a sweeper. You'll probably want some more reliable win conditions of your own to maximize the impact of Garchomp's breaking.

WingedDragon July 18th, 2015 10:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti (Post 8852194)
You definitely don't want to straight-up auto-lose to something. I would build your team with your own strategy being the focus (as opposed to focusing on trying to stop others), but you'll want a defensive backbone of some sort. It depends on what type of team you're building.

Thing is Ive had the strategy of strike first and hard doesnt seem to work. Especially since Everyone likes to bulk up. I would try to do some bulking and then I dont have enough punch in my hits. I couldnt figure this out which is why I left a year ago

Anti July 18th, 2015 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdrianD (Post 8852212)
Thing is Ive had the strategy of strike first and hard doesnt seem to work. Especially since Everyone likes to bulk up. I would try to do some bulking and then I dont have enough punch in my hits. I couldnt figure this out which is why I left a year ago

breaking down well-played defensive teams is one of the higher learning curve parts of the game and could be in-battle execution as much as team structure. (i'd have to see replays to say with any certainty.) mega garchomp is very solid but can be a little difficult to use, so if you want more straightforward breakers to make breaking down defensive cores more intuitive for you, i might try using regular garchomp as a stealth rock setter (assuming you really want to use garchomp--there are lots of pokes that can fill that role) and pairing with something like manaphy, kyurem-black, mega gardevoir, gengar, or mega charizard y. regular garchomp is actually pretty difficult to switch into, which helps as well.

WingedDragon July 19th, 2015 7:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anti (Post 8852221)
breaking down well-played defensive teams is one of the higher learning curve parts of the game and could be in-battle execution as much as team structure. (i'd have to see replays to say with any certainty.) mega garchomp is very solid but can be a little difficult to use, so if you want more straightforward breakers to make breaking down defensive cores more intuitive for you, i might try using regular garchomp as a stealth rock setter (assuming you really want to use garchomp--there are lots of pokes that can fill that role) and pairing with something like manaphy, kyurem-black, mega gardevoir, gengar, or mega charizard y. regular garchomp is actually pretty difficult to switch into, which helps as well.

I dont generally play on Smogon. I play in the battle spots in game


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