![]() |
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
|
Quote:
And, Red and Blue's sprites were changed to look more like their official art, which is what Ash and Gary's original designs happened to be based on. They use those exact same sprites in GSC. And, what from the story was changed to be more like the anime? You mean, Jessie and James? ...They weren't exactly a whole lot like their anime counterparts, you know. Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Here's how Bulbapedia defines game canon: Quote:
Quote:
How does that NOT describe Yellow? Sure enough, it's listed on the page as a CORE SERIES game, right there with Red and Blue. Just give it up. I get it, you hate Yellow. (You wouldn't call it a "cheap spin-off" and get so worked up over its canonicity if you didn't, otherwise.) It's still a canon main series game, though, like it or not. |
Quote:
This a Team Rocket grunt: http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/upload/a/a1/Spr_RG_Rocket.png This is a better looking version of it: http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/upload/1/1b/Spr_GS_Rocket_Grunt_M.png This is Yellow's version (and proof that the concept of the game was to be an adaptation of the anime): http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/upload/8/8f/Spr_Y_Jessie_James.png Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
|
Quote:
I can't help but notice that your signature depicts Red's canon team... But, with Pikachu replaced with Aerodactyl. You obviously dislike Pikachu, so it's no wonder that you're not a fan of Yellow. (Although, you can always BOX the little yellow rat if you don't want to use it, you know.) The fact that you picked Aerodactyl, of all things, to "replace" Pikachu also suggests that you're an Adventures fan, as that's the only place that I know of where Red owns an Aerodactyl... ... Seems like somebody might be a teensy bit bitter that GF pays more attention to the anime than his favorite non-canon adaptation. (Seriously, it's been almost 20 years, and you can count the number of Adventures references in the games on one hand. Less than a hand, in fact.) |
I didn't bother to read the whole thread, but there is one comment I'd like to make: Yellow is not a spin-off. It is an enhanced version of Red/Blue/Green. If you say that Yellow is a spin-off, you'd also have to say that every 3rd version (Crystal, Emerald, Platinum) is also a spin-off. But they're not. A spin-off would be something that uses the franchise as a basis but is wholly different. Examples of Pokemon spin-off games would be stuff like Pokemon Conquest or the Ranger sub-series.
I believe the reason why Yellow features several components of the anime in it is not because it's an adaptation of the anime (the plot and game structure is still very similar to that of R/B/G), but to draw in fans of the anime to the games. Not everyone's first exposure to Pokemon was through the games. Adding anime components into Yellow helps entice fans of the anime into buying the games if they've never played the games before. |
Quote:
I think many people fail to realize how intertwined the marketing for the games and anime was back in the Pokémania days. Even if the games came first, it wasn't until the anime became a huge success that the "Fad" took off, so it made sense to view the anime as an expansion of the games and treat them as one-in-the-same. It wasn't uncommon for game-based materials to use anime artwork and treat Red/Blue and Ash/Gary as the same people. Like, the Monopoly and Master Trainer board games, for example. Both were actually based on the games' story (just look at the Gym Leaders' Pokémon on the Monopoly board), yet they used anime artwork for the Pokémon and Ash, Gary, and Jessie/James in place of Red, Blue, and the generic Rocket Grunts. The fact that "Ash" and "Gary" were default names of the PC and Rival in RB only helped this. Yellow was only a natural extension of this marketing, a main series game that openly embraced the then-popular anime and successfully merged the two together. The end result was a game that enhanced Gen 1's setting and was arguably superior to RB. Once Gen 3 hit and Pokémania had turned into backlash, the games and anime started to go their separate ways. Ash and Red both got redesigns that made them look more like different characters (same goes for Gary and Blue), and marketing materials based on the games no longer used anime artwork or put Ash and Pikachu on the cover (most blatant in the recent rerelease of Monopoly, which replaced all of the anime art with game art and swapped out Ash, Gary, and Jessie/James for Red, Blue, and generic Rocket Grunts). While the games still include nods here and there to the anime (like the reference to Alain in ORAS, most recently), they're not as big or as numerous as the references in Yellow... But, that still doesn't make Yellow any less of a main series game. |
I will admit, I have a soft spot for Pokemon FR/LG. It was the first Pokemon game I ever played, I love the thing to death. But I do have to admit it's a more boring version of Pokemon Red and Blue. It would have been a lot better if they kept the day and night cycle and maybe integrated later evolutions like Crobat into the regional Pokedex. It sucked if you had a Golbat that was ready to evolve but couldn't because you didn't have the National Dex yet. The music isn't that bad, what with just being transposed up or down a few keys, but still it could be better. But the game needed more elaboration, especially with the Sevii Isles. There were so many mysterious things there that badly needed more explanation, like Pattern Bush and Altering Cave. (Also Birth Island and Navel Rock. Why were they event exclusive? WHY!? I remember seeing Lugia in the Pokedex you bought in stores for 3rd Gen and it had Navel Rock there and I kept wondering what it was. :( )
Also why don't we have weather? What kind of region doesn't have rain or snow? And finally Pokemon Yellow IS a mainstream game. Gold and Silver have Red with all 3 starters and Pikachu in his team, and you can get all 3 starters in Yellow. Also Pikachu is unevolved, and in Yellow you could not evolve the Pikachu you were given at the start of the game. |
Yellow may be enhanced version of Red/Blue.....however there are aspects of Yellow that tries harder to be a separate entity.
Having all pokemon is a mechanic aspect, not a story aspect. The reason why there are alternate version (version A and B) is to encourage trading between fans and completing the Pokedex, to find which version of Red/Blue/Yellow is canon based on the pokemon that you can capture is iinnacurate and irrelevant. Also keep in mind that when yellow was made, pokemon 2 was already in the process of being made, (gold/silver). So some of the sprites were definitely able to be carried over. Also Jessie, James, Meowth, how come we dont see them again? Other things such as Beach House in Route 19 dont appear, not even as a reference. Blue/Green also doesn't even have eevee, flareon, cvaporeon or jolteon. So how come its valid to apply it to Red for having all starter and pikachu but doesnt even apply to Blue/Green? Regardless, it wouldnt have hurt to used "some" elements from those games but not all too much. The problem with adding new routes is changing the set routes in Johto region. I definitely wouldve liked to see the companion system. However I will say this, FRLG feels just as entertaining as Red/Blue.....im not a huge fan of those games. I prefer yellow. But I never expected that FRLG would use Yellow. Did I hope for it? But never expected it. |
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
|
Quote:
Their absence in FRLG and HGSS doesn't mean anything, as those games take place in a different timeline than RBY and GSC. Quote:
Quote:
Just admit your bias and move on. You hate the anime, and you hate Pikachu, and it absolutely offends you that GF ever acknowledged either enough to to create a main series "tribute" to both (as opposed to a certain manga that you undoubtedly consider to be a "superior" and "faithful" adaptation, despite it being even more far-off from the games' story than the early anime ever was... there's a reason why the anime took off and Adventures didn't). |
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
And since you have a problem reading what I post, I'll re-post again, in bold (I can also increase the size, if you still can't read), my previous reply against your baseless accusations: Quote:
|
Luso. Everybody. Calm down. Yellow is the official gen 1 game on which Gold and Silver is based on, and while it DOES include things from the anime it is STILL canon and is STILL the canon gen 1 game, or at least it was before FireRed and LeafGreen retconned it. Now can we just continue talking about how FireRed and LeafGreen could have been better, instead of squabbling over whether Yellow is canon or not?
|
Quote:
|
Quote:
|
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
|
Quote:
|
Quote:
I'm the one who actually provided a definition of what a "main series" game was. You, on the other hand, dismissed it without providing a source of your own. Quote:
Here are some other posts you've made elsewhere in the forum: Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Now, can we please get back to the topic of the thread? |
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
|
Quote:
|
Quote:
To get back on topic, what are some things you would've changed about FRLG? Here are mine: - All later Gen pre/evolutions obtainable in Kanto, along with every other Gen 2 Pokémon that was originally planned for Gen 1 (giving us a Regional Dex of around 190) |
Throwing my hat in here. :) Long(ish) post...
I think it's possible we're looking at these games with the benefit of hindsight. The games were released almost 11 years ago and we've had two quite impressive remakes since which have set a precedent. We mustn't forget these were the very first Pokémon remakes, and there was no precedent set. It was a different time. What do you do? Do you try and stay as faithful as possible to the originals or do you add features, regions and plot to bring it in line with the current generation? The risk with the second strategy is that you may end up diluting and ruining the experience. If the FRLG remakes were proposed to me right now after HGSS and ORAS, I would say yes, absolutely add the extra features and plot additions we've come to love because I know that it's possible to add them and still stay faithful to the originals, that'd be fantastic. But back in 2004, I would've err'd on the side of caution. This was RBY we were talking about. This was genesis. This was hallowed ground. I would have been very nervous that it would be ruined by Hoenn Pokémon or different plots arcs or characters, etc. Personally I thoroughly enjoyed FRLG, more so than RSE. I certainly found myself coming back to FRLG during the DS era as opposed to RSE, but it's a little difficult to say why. I think what I liked about it was that instead of concentrating on gameplay gimmicks and features, the developers instead concentrated on refinements, i.e. making the game as smooth and clutter-free as possible. It's certainly a huge improvement over the RS engine, it's noticeably faster, the text is more readable and there are quite a few gameplay enhancements (icons for the bag for instance), a lot of which patched into Emerald (which is more than can be said for the initial pre-patched Diamond & Pearl experience *shudders*). They're little things, admittedly, but I do love small, thoughtful touches above all. It's quite nice for a game to get out of the way and just let me play if you know what I mean. I think that this refined gameplay is possibly the reason why the FireRed engine seems to be the defacto choice for ROM hackers. I also liked the extent the developers went to to keep faithful to the originals - little things like the START menu deliberately resized from RSE to not take up all the screen, or the hero deliberately not turning around to face a trainer who's spotted them, echoing the programming oversight in the originals. I also like the lava cookie near the truck as a small tribute to fans and the legendary Mew theory. I like how legendary Pokémon, instead of having their own theme, have kept the standard wild battle theme but with a remixed twist. I quite enjoyed the addition of the Sevii Isles and their links to Johto. I would have liked to seen more out of them but I was more than happy with what I got. Weirdly enough, the only feature I actively missed out of RSE was berry trees, though I could live with it. :P I actually miss the VS Seeker - I much preferred that than having to either wait for someone to call me or look them up on the PokéNav, though ORAS really came through in that regard with its trainer alerts so I'm happy. I had no issues per-say with the addition of the help system, the battle tutorial and the Teachy TV, since it helped ease brand new players into the game. Considering that the games are designed to be playable for children of 3-10 years, it was slightly baffling that something like this hadn't been introduced before. I think they may have gone a little overboard, and they obviously reigned it back in later releases, but it's by no means a game breaker because, as a veteran player, you can just switch them off. It also meant that you didn't have to buy a strategy guide or look through the manual as a first-time player - by providing an easy-to-understand all-digital in-game help system, it was arguably ahead of its time. Despite lack of gameplay features compared to RSE, they were still the second best-selling games of all time for the Gameboy Advance behind Emerald, and they also received a Player's Choice edition (a distinction not shared with RSE), suggesting that they did at least do something right. In any case, I regard FRLG as a vital first step - testing the waters (including wireless play). Players were more than receptive of the remakes, the additional features that were present and were hungry for more, and it gave Game Freak the confidence to make more remakes with even better features and additional plot extras that we've all come to enjoy. |
Very interesting post, Kip.
Quote:
With FRLG, it was different. RBY could still be played on the GBA, they weren't plagued with dead batteries, and the games were only 5-6 years old--out of print, but not terribly hard to find for a reasonable price. Instead, the only real issue was Ruby and Sapphire. They couldn't trade with the earlier Generations, and they only had 200 of the 386 total Pokémon, leaving a whopping 186 completely MIA. Many people feared that the franchise had been rebooted for real and that those "missing" Pokémon were gone for good, along with the regions and characters from RBY/GSC (as Ruby and Sapphire contained few to no references to Kanto/Johto). So, thus, FRLG could be seen as a last-ditch attempt on GF's part to win back the people repelled by Ruby and Sapphire and bring back those "missing" Pokémon. There's just no other way to explain why the games were rushed out so early, years before they should've been made, IMO. If it hadn't been for Ruby and Sapphire's hard reboot, we probably wouldn't have gotten FRLG until well into the DS era, at the earliest. Things have changed since then. Now, both RBY and FRLG are 10 or more years old, neither of which can be played on a 3DS. Age has also finally started to catch up to RBY's cartridge batteries (since they lacked a clock, they took longer to die than GSC and RSE). And, both versions of Gen 1 are long out of print and are literally selling for a fortune on sites like eBay. ($900 for a 15 year old Pokémon game, whoo-hoo!) And, if it's any cheaper than an arm and a leg, it's probably a bootleg. And, most importantly, GF has learned how to make remakes since then. These are all reasons why Gen 1 could use another go and get its own HGSS or ORAS. Give the original games the remakes they deserve, not the remakes another pair of games need. |
I remember when FireRed and LeafGreen were announced Pokemon fans everywhere were happy they were going to get to play the remakes of Red and Blue for the Gameboy Advance.
It seems to me that since that people's expectations have grown along with the franchise. I enjoy FireRed/LeafGreen because they didn't deviate too much from what made their predecessors so successful. It wasn't about having a Night/Day system or any of the bells and whistles R/S/E had. So when compared to HGSS or ORAS, FRLG are going to pale in comparison, however I don't believe it was the goal of GameFreaks to remake Red/Blue to begin with. Their premise was simple...recapture the novelty and creativity of catching Pokemon in the GameBoy Advance era. With the releases HGSS and ORAS people's expectations are much more strict than it was when FRLG were first released. |
| All times are GMT -8. The time now is 7:35 AM. |
![]()
© 2002 - 2018 The PokéCommunity™, pokecommunity.com.
Pokémon characters and images belong to The Pokémon Company International and Nintendo. This website is in no way affiliated with or endorsed by Nintendo, Creatures, GAMEFREAK, The Pokémon Company or The Pokémon Company International. We just love Pokémon.
All forum styles, their images (unless noted otherwise) and site designs are © 2002 - 2016 The PokéCommunity / PokéCommunity.com.
PokéCommunity™ is a trademark of The PokéCommunity. All rights reserved. Sponsor advertisements do not imply our endorsement of that product or service. User generated content remains the property of its creator.
Acknowledgements
Use of PokéCommunity Assets
vB Optimise by DragonByte Technologies Ltd © 2023.