![]() |
Quote:
|
Quote:
|
Quote:
Nevermind the fact you can use your gen 1 Pokemon to use online, EV train or what have you. |
For people whom did not start with generation 1 (Like some of you have mentioned), naturally you can't feel the nostalgic feel to it. Starting at a later game then going back certainly don't make you feel better about it, definitely, since it was much more simple back then.
I am glad they decided to use Kanto's Pokemon to boost things up-- The friends from my generations whom have stopped playing Pokemon for ancients (Since the first generation!) have started coming up to me again asking me about buying Sun and Moon. I'd say it does help. |
Quote:
I'm not going to reply to anyone else in particular but I just want to say this: The Kanto pandering in SM is so widespread that it affects everyone differently. To someone like MKC, it doesn't make sense how there can be so many Kanto Pokémon in the region when there's not only less new Pokémon than gen 1 Pokémon, and there are so many other regions to take Pokémon from, but we also just this year got VC re-releases of the original games with the huge marketing pull of being able to transfer to your Pokémon from the VC games into SM. To someone like Ewery1, it doesn't make sense why they'd put in Pokémon like Magnemite over Magcargo when the region is supposed to be volcanic and tropical. And before anyone says anything: this is a valid opinion. "The average player doesn't care about details like that" is a weak argument. The average player also doesn't care about narrative in their games--that's why even in a Pokémon-loving community of people, most people will consider gen 5 as the "worst" gen, despite BW having arguably the best story, and B2W2 arguably having the second-best story paired with arguably the second-best amount of overall content. But let's just say if SM botch their story somehow, it would be hard to make a convincing argument of "Well, the average player doesn't care about the story so it's okay that it didn't turn out so hot." That's why it's perfectly valid to think that the Pokémon picked to be in Alola's regional dex is a weak point--it matters to someone and that's what matters. To other people, maybe they expected the 20th anniversary games where " " it all comes together!!! " " to have more than just a generic NPC ripped from one gen and a reference to a legendary that may amount to nothing more than flavor text in the end from another. Hey, maybe Game Freak intended for SM to only sing the praises of gen 1. Alright then. But that's not gonna change that some people aren't big fans of gen 1, or that other people like other gens and want to see them get some love which they only seem to get in their own generation and never outside it unless they get a remake. If the Kanto pandering had been limited to Alola forms, then only the people who were super highly mega against them would be taking any issue with this. But because this goes above and beyond Alola forms, it opens the doorway to take it too far in a certain direction that individuals may not like. These individuals may be super hyped for SM but still find fault in the way some aspects are handled. Some may not be hyped at all and the gen 1 pandering adds to that feeling. And both are perfectly valid. Yeah, maybe the gen 1 pandering is helping them bring back some genwunners for the time being and is a "good business move." Sure. But that to me doesn't make the gen 1 pandering any more appealing. |
Angelica's post just before me makes a strong point - the 20th anniversary is celebrating not just Pokemon as a whole, but the beginning of Pokemon which is where Kanto came in, and its set of Pokemon have the recognition identity that Pokemon from newer generations tend to lack. Pokemon GO has also been promoting Kanto a lot and has been successful in that manner with its Kanto-only roster that has been successfully bringing back fans who fell out of favour years ago, usually around 3rd Gen since I feel that was the point when many old fans left Pokemon.
Alola Forms put a fresh spin on these iconic Pokemon and while I'm not a fan of Kanto (in fact I never even played a game that mainly took place in Kanto) I do love the concept with the Alola Forms but as we learned, everyone views the Kanto pandering differently. Heck, I'm even disappointed with some of the regional Dex distribution for Alola since a lot of my faves are lacking in it (at least what I consider my "top" faves), but that at least turned out well in my plan to use only new Pokemon and an Alola Form or two. |
Quote:
|
Can I just say Ninetales is my favorite Pokémon, and the fact the creators recognized a Pokémon, that is usually overshadowed by Arcanine, in this game by not only giving it a good Alolan form, but also revealing it first is pretty awesome.
I actually started playing the games during Red and Blue, I'm most familiar with Gen 1 and 2 and to an extent 6. I lost interest in Pokémon around Generation 3, then XY brought me back to the games. So personally I would have been fine with seeing some of the later Generation's more popular Pokémon such as Lucario and Chandelure get Alolan forms. I probably wouldn't have wanted a Cricketune or Wurmple Alolan form in the vein of Gen 1's more annoying Pokémon like Rattata and Geodude. Of course since Gen 1 is the oldest game and thanks to Pokémon Go I'm also the most sick of a lot of the lower Gen 1 Pokémon and so am glad they have an update along with the cooler Alolan forms. |
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I also don't get why you continue to use the "every region, every Pokémon, every character" argument. Like, I get that you're trying to exaggerate for the sake of your point, but I don't think any of the ideas presented by the people in this thread are that unfeasible. Of course there can be no game with "all regions and all Pokémon and every single character." But... there can be another game with a PWT, which doesn't include every region or every Pokémon or every character, but it can include a sizable number of them. Or just keep it simple and bring back the Battle Frontier. Your argument is too drastic for what people have actually been saying. Quote:
And like, a lot of the people here have said they're hyped for the games regardless, they just don't like the Kanto pandering. Maybe SM will turn out to be their favorite games regardless of it. Maybe they'll enjoy the games but it won't be their favorites because the Kanto pandering was too much for them. Maybe they'll enjoy the games but it won't be their favorites because Lillie keeps giving them the stink-eye. So what? That's their opinion and that's fine. Is it really that important for everyone to see every single little thing about SM in a positive light? Quote:
So yes, Alola is its own region with its own culture and characters. But it also has "Alolan Prof. Oak," Red and Blue reappearing, alongside others potentially. Not to mention how few new Pokémon there are; there are more Kanto Pokémon in the region than new Pokémon, not to mention what happens when you add the rest in there. You're right... This isn't Kanto we're playing. But it's way too soon to know if Alola will suffer a similar fate as Kalos or not. And no, I don't think just because they have Trial Challenges they're automatically in the clear. Quote:
I think a lot of people view Pokémon as games that should progress from each other, regardless of what anniversary they're celebrating, which is why so many viewed gen 6 as a disappointment. So at the same time, while they probably look at stuff like the Festival Plaza and say "cool beans" they probably don't think of that as being the whole "this is our big gen 5 reference because we know you all played gen 5 for the Join Avenue!!" So I get what you're saying but I also totally understand why people don't look at stuff like that and think that that's how they're paying respects to the other gens. |
Quote:
Ultimately, I'm very disappointed with Gamefreak and this is taking away from my enjoyment of SM a little preemptively, although I can't say how this will affect me in the game, and I'm sure it'll still be great, just not as amazing as it could be. |
Personally I think the Kanto marketing in Sun and Moon was a good move. The only reason I even came back to Pokemon was the fact Sun and Moon sparked my interest. I only played up to gen 4 before the announcement of Sun and Moon. I've been spending my time playing gen 5 and 6 to catch up while waiting for Sun and Moon. Considering they got me to buy a New 3DS XL plus Sun and Moon...I'd say it was a good business move. Rip wallet.
|
Quote:
I'm sorry but, I think you're really trying to tie this whole thing around how I personally am not hyped for SM, as opposed to actually making this about the Kanto pandering subject... I dunno what it is about me not being hyped for SM that you don't like, but is this really the way to go about attacking me for it? Quote:
Quote:
If someone's shown information about something, they're gonna have an opinion on it. If they show a lot of gen 1 pandering, people are gonna have their opinions on the gen 1 pandering. That's how it goes. Quote:
Quote:
Maybe I'm the only one who thinks so, but I thought it was very clever how, say, in Unova you had Pokémon such as Pidove and Trubbish, since pigeons are very common in New York, and it's (sadly) a very polluted place. Pokémon such as these were appropriate for the region, and I thought that was a very nice touch--these and other certain Pokémon made Unova "feel" like New York. It's just fascinating to me that you put such a particularly heavy emphasis on Alola's "identity" but completely dismiss the Pokémon available there as a part of it. |
Quote:
Like, I'm legit trying to keep my expectations low while also giving Game Freak the benefit of the doubt that they actually can potentially make this facility worthwhile even though it's just another Battle Tower, which is the exact thing I was hoping we wouldn't be getting. How is that bad? You're so intent on calling me out on any little thing that you can't even see when I'm trying to be positive and keep my expectations from going too high ("but if we actually get a large number of returning major characters to fill in the role of "Tower Tycoon," this could still be the most enjoyable Battle Tower yet" "but we may just be getting some Champions and some rivals" "Oops this got too long too fast" "but I'm worried that would start pushing it" all from the posts you selected). And to keep this on the topic of Kanto pandering, the potential to actually include at least one character from each gen in the Battle Tower would be a fairly nice nod to them so there's that aspect that I like about it, too. Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
And I get that this isn't going to happen and we should just let it go and move on, but I just wanted to say it to show there are other ways to do "references" than just "Wally's here, hey how you doin'" or "if you squint just right, it reminds you of Join Avenue." And it's because those exact methods of reference are used exclusively for gen 1 that it's easy for them to become a focus in some people's minds. |
I wouldn't mind the pandering again if it wasn't for XY having a whole bunch of it (like it really should have been saved for now). I was okay with it then a bit, because it didn't seem like a lot, getting a second pair of starters was nice, making those weak final evolutions given a needed boost was great too, and then we got Mewtwo which I'm kind of neutral on but it was cool to see it in 3D doing it's pose with a sweet new remix to go along with it.
What mostly annoys me about it in SM isn't the Kanto pandering itself, I mean.... Red and Blue back with new designs? Hell yeah! Giving some Kanto Pokemon fresh new designs? Sweet. Professor Oak has an Alolan Cousin? That's hilarious, I missed the old fart, so it's nice to see some reference to him. Alola forms are Kanto only? Eh... that's annoying but whatever. Special Z-Moves seem to only be for Kanto mons too so far (excluding the Tapu's) that's.... really a waste isn't it? I mean we don't exactly know if it's for sure yet, but there are many many Pokemon that could use a special new move. Johto gets...... special PokeBalls? I mean, that's cool I guess, but it probably means literally nothing to people who don't want to customize their Pokemon with special balls. Oh, and a guy wears a Meganium shirt. okay. Slowpoke Tails reference is kind of funny it'll admit. Hoenn gets.... riding a Sharpedo, and Wally's there (Which I'm assuming the Battle Tree will get one character from each gen anyways, so it doesn't make a difference). So cool I guess nobody likes Gen 3 anyways right? We're all still mad because it cut off connection with Gen 1 and 2 games right? What dumb Pokemon designs am I right? Misty is better than May. Sinnoh gets a new Rotom design! But it's not a Pokemon, it's a Pokedex.... alright. Well it still might be fun but eh. Type: Null and Shivally were made out of Arceus design which is cool, and maaaay tie in with Gen 4 remakes. Also Cynthia is there, which I'll admit is awesome, cause I love Cynthia and we didn't see a 3D Model of her yet, but she is one of the most popular Pokemon characters anyways and my point with Wally still stands. Unova gets..... an NPC pose. k. oh, and possibly a professor I've never even heard about until now. I'm happy I get to ride on a Stoutland though. But who likes this region i mean the pokemon designs were soooooo bad am i right? and who cares about the features BW2 gave or the story we got this is where pokemon went downhill totally Kalos actually gets a decent amount of stuff, with all the Zygarde stuff, Ash-Greninja, and seeing Dexio and Sina a bit grown up, which is nice but I feel the first stuff was just rammed in there just because they couldn't make Z happen. I like the Kanto love, it's all pretty damn good, and of course Kanto is going to get more love since it's mostly it's anniversary, but it just pains me to see SO little of the other generations. Pokedex distribution doesn't matter THAT much later because of Pokebank making it so easy to port over whatever Pokemon you wanna use in your journey. And again, the game actually isn't even out yet, so we don't even know what could await us, for all we know there could be many more references sprinkled throughout the game. Maybe there will be more ride Pokemon, maybe we'll get some more champions and rivals showing up, maybe gamefreak managed to scrub mega evolutions off the demo, whatever, I'm not going to let this favouritism affect my enjoyment of the game, and I still have yet to discover Alola and all of it's unique cultures and traits too, so that will be fun. I'm sure these games will be fantastic, but if we really get that little representation of the other generations, I can't help but feel that a little potential was wasted. |
I dont mind that only the kanto pokemon gets a alola form But i wouldn't mind seeing other forms I have seen a few interesting fan made ones like this one for example
https://camo.derpicdn.net/8da1241a30b9423b2889e562fc56a2426af42512?url=http%3A%2F%2Fpre01.deviantart.net%2F8760%2Fth%2Fpre%2Fi%2F2016%2F214%2F7%2F2%2Fdoublade___alola_form_by_locomotive111-dacemmy.png I have also seen a few more cool ones in this video right here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSasp79HOC8 New alola forms of others generations would be amazing It would take a lot more work But think of how awesome the ending result could be. |
^ Yeah I agree. Not just in terms of cool designs but from a logical point of view, it doesn't make sense that only Kanto Pokémon would need to adapt to the different climate, geography and way of life in Alola through developing new forms - surely non-Kanto-Pokémon would need to do so as well? tbh Alola Forms is the form of Kanto 'pandering' that annoys me the most, because it's such a cool concept but because it's been restricted to Kanto Pokémon for no apparent reason other than '20th Anniversary so Kanto everythingggg' is quite disappointing and a bit of a missed opportunity.
|
| All times are GMT -8. The time now is 9:04 AM. |
![]()
© 2002 - 2018 The PokéCommunity™, pokecommunity.com.
Pokémon characters and images belong to The Pokémon Company International and Nintendo. This website is in no way affiliated with or endorsed by Nintendo, Creatures, GAMEFREAK, The Pokémon Company or The Pokémon Company International. We just love Pokémon.
All forum styles, their images (unless noted otherwise) and site designs are © 2002 - 2016 The PokéCommunity / PokéCommunity.com.
PokéCommunity™ is a trademark of The PokéCommunity. All rights reserved. Sponsor advertisements do not imply our endorsement of that product or service. User generated content remains the property of its creator.
Acknowledgements
Use of PokéCommunity Assets
vB Optimise by DragonByte Technologies Ltd © 2023.