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-   -   Sequels or Remakes? (https://www.pokecommunity.com/showthread.php?t=394492)

Abby June 6th, 2017 6:21 AM

Sequels or Remakes?
 
Do you think USUM will be sequels like BW2 were, or Remakes, ala platinum?

Personally I feel It'll be a remake, as there hasn't been one since Platinum, and gamefreak have been micing things up recently

Sirfetch’d June 6th, 2017 6:23 AM

Way too soon to be a remake IMO and since they announced that there will be new Pokemon and we saw new formes, I am highly inclined to believe these are sequels.

Hikamaru June 6th, 2017 6:23 AM

I think they're most likely direct sequels, similar to Black 2 & White 2. A reason I can tell is because of the appearance of what appears to be new player characters, and as we know B/W and B2/W2 had different sets of player characters, so I could see this being the case if US/UM are a direct sequel.

blue June 6th, 2017 6:24 AM

Sequels going by how the trailer went. Looks like there are some fusions going on following the Ultra Beast events from Sun & Moon.

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire June 6th, 2017 6:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hikamaru (Post 9668538)
I think they're most likely direct sequels, similar to Black 2 & White 2. A reason I can tell is because of the appearance of what appears to be new player characters, and as we know B/W and B2/W2 had different sets of player characters, so I could see this being the case if US/UM are a direct sequel.

If it's sequels then I expect Ultra Lunala to be in UltraSun to make it similar to Black Kyurem being in Black2 ^_^.

Delirious Absol June 6th, 2017 6:27 AM

I'm pretty sure he said it's an alternate story? Given the wormholes, maybe it's an alternate reality? Hmm... I'm excited to find out =D

Raffy98 June 6th, 2017 6:27 AM

I'm not sure, in the Direct they said it's gonna be an alternative story so it could be either.

Iceshadow3317 June 6th, 2017 6:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hikamaru (Post 9668538)
I think they're most likely direct sequels, similar to Black 2 & White 2. A reason I can tell is because of the appearance of what appears to be new player characters, and as we know B/W and B2/W2 had different sets of player characters, so I could see this being the case if US/UM are a direct sequel.

They looked exactly the same to me, just in different clothing. If they were different, then it probably is a sequel. But from what I seen, they are the same. Not to mention, we can choose from like 5 different looks at the start.

I also think it is a remake/enhanced version of Sun and Moon, possibly the version that the Riddler was looking at when he was leaking stuff.

Tsutarja June 6th, 2017 6:31 AM

It's gotta be a sequel. Remember that mysterious Pokémon at the end of Sun and Moon? Lunala's and Solgaleo's appearances in the video seem to resemble that, and all I can just simply think of now is Black Kyurem and White Kyurem from B2W2.

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire June 6th, 2017 6:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raffy98 (Post 9668554)
I'm not sure, in the Direct they said it's gonna be an alternative story so it could be either.

This. Could go either way.

I think we might get an Emerald scenario. I mean, Emerald was an alternate RS whose events happened slightly later in its (alternate) timeline than those that RS did.

CidHazard June 6th, 2017 6:33 AM

Alternate story could mean anything... but It's most likely just Like Emerald or Platinum... Hope we get more story content after the main campaign finishes tho.

Charlie Brown June 6th, 2017 6:36 AM

To me alternate storyline as was mentioned in the Direct implies neither a direct sequel nor a remake - but a different turn of events in the same situation/context/games. So things turning slightly differently at the start for example which completely change the outcome or what ends up happening plot-wise (e.g. more UB involvement as seems to be the case)

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire June 6th, 2017 6:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by colours (Post 9668580)
I really don't know. I feel like it'd be more blatantly obvious if it was a sequel? With how the original SM ended, you'd think there'd be mention that USUM immediately picks up afterwards at the end of SM, but there wasn't any implicit or explicit mention of that in the slightest.

Unless, of course, this is an alternate storyline that also includes what happened to Lillie after she traveled to Kanto.

I hope it includes what happened to her after if this is an alternate storyline. I wouldn't mind traveling back to Kanto post game here xD

Sabrewulf238 June 6th, 2017 6:44 AM

I wouldn't really consider it a remake in the typical sense....but it does sound like it might be based in an alternate reality of Alola. Since they said it had an alternate story, which would be a weird choice of words for a sequel.

Alternate realities are already canon though. So I guess something like this was only a matter of time.

Salzorrah June 6th, 2017 6:47 AM

It's neither a remake or a sequel. Remember that Pokemon is set in a multiverse? We're basically playing another universe of Alola, and it ties in with the Ultra Beasts, and this excites me so much.

Sabrewulf238 June 6th, 2017 6:49 AM

I wonder if maybe they wanted to give us time to get used to the Ultra Beasts before they did anything huge with them.

Iceshadow3317 June 6th, 2017 6:51 AM

Well each game has an Alternate Universe in it. Remember to get our own Nebby, we go to an alternative world. This could be the world this game takes place in.

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire June 6th, 2017 6:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IcyIce (Post 9668654)
Well each game has an Alternate Universe in it. Remember to get our own Nebby, we go to an alternative world. This could be the world this game takes place in.

I assumed that was the world of the opposite version. But that could be.

moon June 6th, 2017 6:55 AM

Pretty convinced they'll be sequels. Sure, they like to mix things up and surprise us, but they also have been competing a lot with Yokai watch and such stuff lately, which make sequels afaik? It is cool when things progress in the pokémon world, when characters grow and change.

Iceshadow3317 June 6th, 2017 6:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire (Post 9668666)
I assumed that was the world of the opposite version. But that could be.

I thought this as well, but the pokemon don't change. If they did, it could be the other version. But since they don't, it is possible that it is this USUM world. This could have just been something they did so no one could catch all pokemon in a single version, but that would be a good explanation of why we couldn't.

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire June 6th, 2017 7:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Achromatic (Post 9668697)
DEFINITELY sequels like Black 2 and White 2. We haven't seen them do a traditional third version since Platinum.

Even if these were third versions, they wouldn't exactly be traditional ones as we got two of them instead of one.

L'Belle June 6th, 2017 7:02 AM

I HOPE sequels.

Lycanthropy June 6th, 2017 7:04 AM

An alternative storyline sounds like something new entirely. Might be something like Platinum compared to Diamond and Pearl but with a few more twists and turns.

KillerTyphlosion June 6th, 2017 7:09 AM

From the way masuda talks about the games, it seem to be like the old 3rd versions. Same world , alternative story. The character shown is even the same character, so no way it's a sequel. Just like the old 3rd versions, new clothes, some small modifications and that's probably it.

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire June 6th, 2017 7:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KillerTyphlosion (Post 9668738)
From the way masuda talks about the games, it seem to be like the old 3rd versions. Same world , alternative story. The character shown is even the same character, so no way it's a sequel. Just like the old 3rd versions, new clothes, some small modifications and that's probably it.

This is what I'm expecting.

Hopefully the story includes the Ultra beasts more. I wonder if these could be Solgaleo and Lunala reverting back to their Ultra beast form... Maybe Necrozma was created from something they casted away to adapt to the Pokeworld.

Leviathan June 6th, 2017 7:28 AM

I'm sliding with the idea that these are sequels.

blue June 6th, 2017 9:51 AM

Alternate storyline does sound questionable, but I suppose it could equally mean it is a sequel with a different focus. Interesting to see it's two games rather than one in regards to the whole third game concept.

Tom2 June 6th, 2017 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Delirious Absol (Post 9668553)
I'm pretty sure he said it's an alternate story? Given the wormholes, maybe it's an alternate reality? Hmm... I'm excited to find out =D

Now THAT would be really cool actually. I'm totally game for that!

Sabrewulf238 June 6th, 2017 10:17 AM

If it's an alternate reality then a part of me wants to see Guzma as the professor and Kukui as the leader of Team Skull. I think it would be interesting to see old characters with altered histories.

I know it sounds like a cheesy fanfic but I think it could be good anyway. Alternate reality is your chance to shake things up so you might as well take it and run with it.

L'Belle June 6th, 2017 10:17 AM

Alright, if it's a completely different story, I am fine with anything.

TequitoClown June 6th, 2017 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Delirious Absol (Post 9668553)
I'm pretty sure he said it's an alternate story? Given the wormholes, maybe it's an alternate reality? Hmm... I'm excited to find out =D

This all day! If I had to place my bets down, it's not either. It's another "universe." A remake this early would be... boring to me. Same story, but with necrozma? Eh. Remakes would be cool, seeing how all your friends grew through the years after the events of the first game. I'm going with with this being a "but what if ___ happened instead of ___?" story. Very interesting to think about, but it might be too early to tell right now.

Nah June 6th, 2017 11:29 AM

They're not sequels guys. If they were they would've made it clear from the get-go. The wording used in the Direct far more implies something like Emerald or Platinum, but with two versions.

Or, possibly, what we should've gotten November last year.

EC June 6th, 2017 12:16 PM

I think remake is the wrong word here. Third version might be better, even though it's two of them.

Rivvon June 6th, 2017 12:25 PM

Because "alternate" is the word being used, they're more than likely to be third versions. By definition, "alternate" implies a different version of something; you'd never use "alternate" as a synonym for "sequel," which is something that takes place after a series of events.

Compare this to B2W2, which made a lot of effort to clarify that they were sequels and not "third versions" or "retellings" of BW during its pre-release period--although the "2" in the titles should have made it clear. I would think if USUM were real sequels, that would be made clear from the get-go.

These are definitely looking to be third versions, but split into two--likely to maintain the "day-night" cycle difference between Sun and Moon.

FireSnow June 6th, 2017 1:46 PM

As Colours mentioned, I believe this isn't remake but its also not a sequel, at least with current knowledge. IT's got a similar vibe to BW2 of course, with the two games and the fusion of what is most certainly Necrozma with the SM mascots. The problem with it being sequels is that, as of now, there has been no indication that these games occur after the events of SM. In addition, in the previous sequels, BW2, there was an antagonist that was present in the first games, Ghetsis. In SM, all the main antagonists were dealt with in some way, Lusamine is in KAnto, Gladion is reforming Aether and Guzma, besides the fact he isn't capable of hatching such a plan in the mold of Lusamine, Ghetsis, Cyrus, etc..., is on the road to reform, kind've. So where could the new antagonist come from? Plumeria is a possibility though unlikely since she was pretty loyal to guzma and mainly just wanted to protect her "brothers and sisters". Faba seems a bit more likely but with Gladion keeping a close eye and Faba not being as sharp as you'd expect, I find this route unlikely as well. So unless the plan is to change Plumeria and Faba's personality as well as expand their role/introduce a completely new character, the direct sequel route seems very unlikely to me.

As for it being a remake, besides it being way too early compared to previous remakes, the phrase "alternate storyline" holds a lot of meaning. Now Platinum, Emerald, and Crystal are all technically alternate storylines, features stayed the same pretty much besides the sootopolis gym leader/champion situation. In addition, it was made a point to say it was an alternate storyline, which leads me to believe it will be very similar to SM but with changes such as, (this is an example and not what I think exactly) gym leaders instead of trials (bad example but makes my point). The best I can explain this is through a comparison to The Flash and Legends of Tomorrow TV shows. I like to think US/UM are going to be on a different timeline, like ORAS was in comparison to RSE.

Simply put, I see these games as existing on a timeline separate from SM (maybe the same one as ORAS?) with enough changes to seem like a sequel a la BW2 but enough similarities that call back to its originals a la ORAS.

As such, I think this will essentially be a a third version but with two version of said third version. In addition, as some have noticed the characters look a bit different, so this is where my alternate timeline piece comes in.

Hope that all made sense, I'm still trying to wrap my head around some bits of this too :)

Edit: I think Rivvon, evil chameleon and others explained this as well but in a lot less words than myself, as I definitely overexplained xD

RedJ June 6th, 2017 2:10 PM

They outright said it was an alternate story, showed the same protagonists with slightly different appearances (if it's not them then there's some seriously bad character designing going on here), and showed the protagonists coming out of the same house on Route 1.

Pretty sure it's the old obligatory third version but split into two separate games because gimmicks. And, like what has already been said, what we should have got in November in the first place.

jombii June 6th, 2017 4:56 PM

Sequel I hope. There's too much post-game story content material.

smocks June 10th, 2017 12:07 AM

I personally feel like its clearly a sequel, especially coming right after the release of SM.

SM's storyline kinda gave us a cliff hanger of Lillie going off to Kanto & Hau going off to train (same as Gladion). Plus, with the newly released photos of Gladion in Aether attire just scream SEQUEL to me.

Hikamaru June 10th, 2017 1:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smocks (Post 9674228)
I personally feel like its clearly a sequel, especially coming right after the release of SM.

SM's storyline kinda gave us a cliff hanger of Lillie going off to Kanto & Hau going off to train (same as Gladion). Plus, with the newly released photos of Gladion in Aether attire just scream SEQUEL to me.

That pic of Gladion was unfortunately confirmed fake, for now.

HardstyleRaver2 June 10th, 2017 3:27 AM

I definitely think that they're going to be third installments similar to Yellow, Crystal, Emerald, and Platinum. If they were sequels, they would have a 2 in their titles like B2W2.

Anyways, I'm hoping for the Battle Frontier in these games.

janejane6178 June 10th, 2017 3:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hikamaru (Post 9668538)
I think they're most likely direct sequels, similar to Black 2 & White 2. A reason I can tell is because of the appearance of what appears to be new player characters, and as we know B/W and B2/W2 had different sets of player characters, so I could see this being the case if US/UM are a direct sequel.

But how could it be new characterts when they live in the same house the first two lived?

blue June 10th, 2017 3:39 AM

The difficult thing right now is defining what they actually mean by alternate story. Technically, that can still mean sequel since we really haven't got much to go off at this point. Having two games, fusions, and what looks like new areas could indicate a sequel just as much as it could indicate an updated third version game, but it does seem like it's more likely that these games are sequels imo.

janejane6178 June 10th, 2017 3:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blue (Post 9674363)
The difficult thing right now is defining what they actually mean by alternate story. Technically, that can still mean sequel since we really haven't got much to go off at this point. Having two games, fusions, and what looks like new areas could indicate a sequel just as much as it could indicate an updated third version game, but it does seem like it's more likely that these games are sequels imo.

I would really love these games to be sequals, but unfortunately I dont see that happening.
Alternative story sounds more like a third version to me. Secondly, the main character starts off in the same house the one in SuMo did..(Unlike Bw2 which introduced a new town).

smocks June 10th, 2017 4:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hikamaru (Post 9674259)
That pic of Gladion was unfortunately confirmed fake, for now.

Ah okay, but I can see Gladion somehow be afflicted with Aether in USUM. Just kinda makes sense for him too imo

FireSnow June 10th, 2017 4:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smocks (Post 9674906)
Ah okay, but I can see Gladion somehow be afflicted with Aether in USUM. Just kinda makes sense for him too imo

Gladion is already confirmed to be the current acting president of Aether at the end of SM, so i assume the same thing will occur in USUM whether its a sequel or remake. Though i personally think its gonna be closer to a remake than a sequel as described in my earlier post

Hikamaru June 11th, 2017 8:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smocks (Post 9674906)
Ah okay, but I can see Gladion somehow be afflicted with Aether in USUM. Just kinda makes sense for him too imo

As Fire mentioned, Gladion is currently the acting president of the Aether Foundation while Lillie was away in Kanto to get treatment for Lusamine after her Nihilego ordeal. We could see that focused on more in US/UM.

pkmin3033 June 11th, 2017 9:48 PM

I don't think US/UM are going to continue the story of SM in the way people generally seem to want or expect...if these are a reimagining, as the trailer claimed, then I'd imagine one of two things: they'll either take the same roles that they did last time and the plot will play out differently, or they'll take completely different roles entirely. To avoid repetition and criticism, I think the latter route more likely; a reimagining is not a clone...or at least, it shouln't be.

The whole thing feels more like a "what if?" scenario to me at the moment than a true sequel or remake, to be honest.

shadowmoon522 June 12th, 2017 8:27 AM

i think i should note this from gamefaqs
https://image.prntscr.com/image/O6Ahb0IrR96UgpVUxJ62XA.png
also theres more to it then just that
http://www.pokemon-sunmoon-cn.com/usum/sc/

????????????????????????????????????
translation
Story and the system of both evolution of another "sun / moon" story, waiting for all the players to experience!
the
"another" part can also be translated into "other"
the whole "alternative" thing seems to be a translation error
i don't think these game are sequels or remakes, but rather a side story like xd & gale of darkness where or for an even better example like what a certain scientific railgun is to a certain magical index

PlatinumDude June 12th, 2017 9:18 PM

I'm leaning towards remake because it's been advertised that US/UM are alternative retellings of the original S/M.

shadowmoon522 June 13th, 2017 7:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PlatinumDude (Post 9677533)
I'm leaning towards remake because it's been advertised that US/UM are alternative retellings of the original S/M.

unless of course that part was mistranslated and "alternative" was never the right word to be used

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire June 13th, 2017 8:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PlatinumDude (Post 9677533)
I'm leaning towards remake because it's been advertised that US/UM are alternative retellings of the original S/M.

An 'alternate retelling' sounds more like something that a third version is.

PlatinumDude June 13th, 2017 8:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shadowmoon522 (Post 9677954)
unless of course that part was mistranslated and "alternative" was never the right word to be used

Quote:

Originally Posted by OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire (Post 9677990)
An 'alternate retelling' sounds more like something that a third version is.

Well, we did see that we got new protagonists in the trailer, so now I'm on the fence.

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire June 13th, 2017 8:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PlatinumDude (Post 9678003)
Well, we did see that we got new protagonists in the trailer, so now I'm on the fence.

That's true. Maybe in this alternate world Sun and Moon look significantly different (but not too much as they do resembled those two still). Or it's customization. Or something else.

janejane6178 June 13th, 2017 9:01 AM

They looked like the previous players in my eyes

Caaethil June 13th, 2017 9:27 AM

More like Platinum, but maybe more changes than we're used to. So I guess you could say it's somewhere in between?

Sequel would be a HUGE selling point. If it was a sequel, they wouldn't be so vague about it. The only way the vagueness makes sense is if it's a Platinum-style game they're just trying to hype up.

shadowmoon522 June 13th, 2017 9:52 AM

found it
Quote:

Game Informer: Fans assumed after the release of Pokémon Black and White that we’d see something like a Pokémon Grey. And after Pokémon X and Y, fans were expecting something like a Pokémon Z. Will we no longer see those type of Pokémon games in the future? Extensions of already released Pokémon titles?

Game Freak:
For the Pokémon brand, and for Game Freak, our first and foremost goal and top priority with these titles is to always surprise and excite our fans. I’m not going to say we won’t ever do those things again, but we consider the timing and what would be the most surprising or exciting for fans at the time. Everyone was really expecting Grey, so it was exciting to come up with something fans really didn’t expect.
-http://www.gameinformer.com/b/features/archive/2014/10/14/pok-233-mon-s-developers-on-virtual-console-absences-twitch-and-super-smash-bros.aspx

Harmonie June 14th, 2017 4:09 PM

I think the games will be like a third version, meaning they'll pretty much be the same game, but with some differences. I hope there will be some more substantial differences, but I don't know.

Pepperton June 14th, 2017 7:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Harmonie (Post 9679432)
I think the games will be like a third version, meaning they'll pretty much be the same game, but with some differences. I hope there will be some more substantial differences, but I don't know.

I can get behind this line of thinking. I also think and hope they'll be like a third version, but I hope it's closer to Emerald than Platinum in terms of the quality increase from the original titles. SM were great, of course, but there was room for improvement, just like in RS, and Emerald delivered in a big way. Emerald's post-game is still un-matched in the core title line of the Pokemon franchise. I'm hoping to be blown away enough to warrant purchasing a copy.

pkmin3033 June 15th, 2017 10:19 PM

Whatever happened to...?
 
This has come up a few times in other threads, but I thought it warranted a topic of its own.

Whether you think these will be direct sequels, remakes, or titles that are completely unrelated to the original games in terms of plot, they will still be set in Alola and present an opportunity to answer those questions that Sun/Moon either didn't have time or didn't see fit to go into in great detail. Have any burning questions you have as a result of USUM that you hope these games answer?

Personally, I'd like to know what Grimsley was doing in Alola. Compared to the other cameos, Grimsley was just kinda...there. Sure, he was in the Battle Tree, but unlike other Battle Tree trainers he was also out and about in Alola, being the one who gives you Sharpedo. So he was obviously there for more than just that, I think. What was he up to?

Mikewind June 15th, 2017 11:23 PM

I don't think US/UM will answer any questions from S/M. The pokemon direct made it sound like US/UM would have a different story than S/M. At least that's how it sounded to me.

Alexander18 June 16th, 2017 2:05 AM

Neither. Remakes are older games that are remade when no longer compatible with newer games. This is likely a third version split in two.

Intelligence June 16th, 2017 3:47 AM

Let's just get this one out of the way. Dream Park should be expanded completely. Fossil Pokémon all around you.

blue June 16th, 2017 4:19 AM

Agreed on the cameos.

It sort of felt like Colress and Grimsley should've served a real purpose rather than literally just showing up so you can later fight them in the Battle Tree. I'd like to see more development for them in USM so that they actually become involved in the storyline. It would be great to see Colress as the head of the Aether Foundation and Grimsley recruited as a Gym Leader/E4 member.

shadowmoon522 June 16th, 2017 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alexander18 (Post 9680522)
Neither. Remakes are older games that are remade when no longer compatible with newer games. This is likely a third version split in two.

3ed versions are remakes, like platinum & emerald.

Alexander18 June 16th, 2017 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shadowmoon522 (Post 9680893)
3ed versions are remakes, like platinum & emerald.

No actually they are not. Third versions are just a better version of the first pair of games. Games like FRLG, HGSS and ORAS are remakes. This is fact.

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire June 16th, 2017 7:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shadowmoon522 (Post 9680893)
3ed versions are remakes, like platinum & emerald.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alexander18 (Post 9680924)
No actually they are not. Third versions are just a better version of the first pair of games. Games like FRLG, HGSS and ORAS are remakes. This is fact.

Technically third versions are 'partial remakes'/enhanced editions.

Harmonie June 17th, 2017 5:50 AM

Remakes are games rebuilt from the ground up. Third versions are altered versions of existing games/code and are thus not remakes at all. I have no idea why people confuse the term remake so much.

shadowmoon522 June 17th, 2017 6:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alexander18 (Post 9680924)
No actually they are not. Third versions are just a better version of the first pair of games. Games like FRLG, HGSS and ORAS are remakes. This is fact.

Quote:

Originally Posted by OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire (Post 9681182)
Technically third versions are 'partial remakes'/enhanced editions.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Harmonie (Post 9681437)
Remakes are games rebuilt from the ground up. Third versions are altered versions of existing games/code and are thus not remakes at all. I have no idea why people confuse the term remake so much.

https://image.prntscr.com/image/UxXeLzrgQI2bMSUabjRPfA.png
https://www.mememaker.net/static/images/memes/4373716.jpg

pkmin3033 June 17th, 2017 6:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Harmonie (Post 9681437)
Remakes are games rebuilt from the ground up. Third versions are altered versions of existing games/code and are thus not remakes at all. I have no idea why people confuse the term remake so much.

Because video game developers realise that "remake" sounds and sells better than "remaster" so an exact definition of the term can be pretty hard to pin down when the two are used interchangably, and "re-release" sounds even more unappealing. Most people don't actually know what a remake is...

Harmonie June 17th, 2017 6:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Meyneth (Post 9681473)
Because video game developers realise that "remake" sounds and sells better than "remaster" so an exact definition of the term can be pretty hard to pin down when the two are used interchangably, and "re-release" sounds even more unappealing. Most people don't actually know what a remake is...

I understand why companies want to disingenuously label/sell remasters as remakes, but I don't understand why the general populace accepts it.

If you went to someone and asked them the difference between a remake and a remaster in terms of movies, it would be as clear as crystal for them. But somehow when it comes to video games people have so much confusion. It's really not any more of a complicated matter when it comes to games.

Third versions of Pokemon games aren't even remakes or remasters, they're just rereleased with new/different content added in some places. Has Gamefreak ever even marketed Yellow/Crystal/Emerald/Platinum as remakes? I most certainly don't remember them ever having done so. Seems like the label was placed on them solely by fans.

pkmin3033 June 17th, 2017 6:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Harmonie (Post 9681483)
I understand why companies want to disingenuously label/sell remasters as remakes, but I don't understand why the general populace accepts it.

If you went to someone and asked them the difference between a remake and a remaster in terms of movies, it would be as clear as crystal for them. But somehow when it comes to video games people have so much confusion. It's really not any more of a complicated matter when it comes to games.

Third versions of Pokemon games aren't even remakes or remasters, they're just rereleased with new/different content added in some places. Has Gamefreak ever even marketed Yellow/Crystal/Emerald/Platinum as remakes? I most certainly don't remember them ever having done so. Seems like the label was placed on them solely by fans.

Because the general populace doesn't care...or, where they do, they want to portray their precious game in as favourable a light as possible to enhance their own self-image amongst their peers. It's the same sort of marketing strategy in a way - it sounds more fresh and exciting when you call it a remake, no?

I think there is more to it with video games than there is with movies, which is why there is more room for disagreement. Video game remakes typically add more content than was present in the original game, which is what third versions do. There is much more to it than that - a visual upgrade at the very least - but that is enough to blur the line for some people. I don't agree with that, but I CAN see the rationale behind it.

I don't disagree with any of your points. I don't think you could really consider the third versions of Pokemon games as remakes in any sense other than that most literal definition, which is generally not how it is applied to video games. I don't think they'll be able to apply it to US/UM...if they had been on the Switch, I think there would have been a stronger argument for it. But even if these are the equivalent to third versions, or reimagined versions of the originals with a different story, I don't think that would be enough to call them remakes.

BettyNewbie June 17th, 2017 7:13 AM

USUM are most likely third versions, which is why I was so underwhelmed and disappointed when they were announced. :( I thought GF had moved past the idea of making people plunk down cash on "upgraded" versions of games they had already bought.

The fact that they announced that they were making a Switch game so soon after at E3 also told me that USUM are nothing but a stopgap that they're throwing together on the cheap to buy time until the new Switch game is ready.

Alexander18 June 17th, 2017 11:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire (Post 9681182)
Technically third versions are 'partial remakes'/enhanced editions.

They are not remakes in any sense. Remakes applies to games that have been remade due to original not compatible with latest games and handheld.

smocks June 17th, 2017 1:02 PM

Another +1 of the appearances just being cameos

For example, Cynthia appearing in the B2W2. There wasn't a real reason why she was there than for the sake of just being there.

I don't think their cameos will be explained, but I do see them effecting the USUM's plot, specifically with Colress. I firmly believe that Colress is going to inspire/be behind the Necromza fusions due to hime being behind the Kyreum fusions in B2W2.

Intelligence June 18th, 2017 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smocks (Post 9681717)
Another +1 of the appearances just being cameos

For example, Cynthia appearing in the B2W2. There wasn't a real reason why she was there than for the sake of just being there.

I don't think their cameos will be explained, but I do see them effecting the USUM's plot, specifically with Colress. I firmly believe that Colress is going to inspire/be behind the Necromza fusions due to hime being behind the Kyreum fusions in B2W2.

Colress had nothing to do with the Kyurem fusions. Drayden's family passed down the DNA Splicers generation after generation.

Lunar June 18th, 2017 12:59 PM

Cameos for me too, but I feel like they can make the Pokemon experience more immersive and realistic imo, like, significant trainers would actually travel and journey to other regions to explore, hence why we see Cynthia in Unova and Sinnoh respectively.

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire June 18th, 2017 7:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alexander18 (Post 9681677)
They are not remakes in any sense. Remakes applies to games that have been remade due to original not compatible with latest games and handheld.

Those are considered 'true remakes'.

pkmin3033 June 18th, 2017 9:36 PM

If these ARE re-imagined versions of Sun/Moon, it's going to be interesting to see what people classify them as if there is this much debate about what constitutes a video game remake in this day and age. Part of the issue here is the time gap between remakes closing, though. I mean, Atelier Rorona had a regular and a Plus version on PS3 and the latter had a substantial visual upgrade alongside additional content, so it could perhaps be considered a remake instead of a remaster...so having a remake of a game on the same console isn't outside the realms of possibility, rare as it may be. Although a year later? Seems unlikely. But then, Sun/Moon had a very rushed feeling to them I thought, so perhaps they were mere prototypes for US/UM...

Alexander18 June 19th, 2017 3:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire (Post 9682696)
Those are considered 'true remakes'.

Third versions are not remakes. This is fact.

janejane6178 June 21st, 2017 11:27 AM

The fact that the player starts at the same house as the one in in the original SuMo means that its not a sequal, unfortunatelly..

Hikamaru June 23rd, 2017 6:55 AM

I feel most of the cameos in S/M felt like they added nothing to the plot, like Grimsley. And considering US/UM is marketed as an "alternate universe" I can't see how that will be addressed.

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire August 18th, 2017 8:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by janejane6178 (Post 9684842)
The fact that the player starts at the same house as the one in in the original SuMo means that its not a sequal, unfortunatelly..

And this from the official site confirms that they are the same player characters from Sun and Moon-
The look of the main characters’ outfits has changed from the first trip through the Alola region—just in time for them to begin a new adventure! Choose the Pokémon that will become your partner, and set out on a journey through the world of Alola!

Aka the same as Brandon and May getting new outfits and Emerald, and Dawn and Lukas getting new outfits in Platinum.

And then there's this- Pokémon Ultra Sun and Pokémon Ultra Moon have been powered up with new additions to the story and features of Pokémon Sun and Pokémon Moon! These titles are coming to the Nintendo 3DS family of systems on November 17, 2017.

Alexander18 August 18th, 2017 9:09 PM

So this is a third version. I guess i can get back into third versions. I loved emerald and platinum.

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire August 18th, 2017 9:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alexander18 (Post 9734961)
So this is a third version. I guess i can get back into third versions. I loved emerald and platinum.

As did I!

Fun fact: This will be the first time since Crystal that the 'third version' doesn't have a dragon mascot. Even if one includes the Gen V sequels, that's still the case xD. Unless, if the mascots suddenly gained the dragon typing :/ xD.

Desert Stream~ August 18th, 2017 9:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire (Post 9734968)
As did I!

Fun fact: This will be the first time since Crystal that the 'third version' doesn't have a dragon mascot. Even if one includes the Gen V sequels, that's still the case xD. Unless, if the mascots suddenly gained the dragon typing :/ xD.

Well is it really a third version if there's 2 versions? :p
More like 3rd and 4th :p

Hikamaru August 19th, 2017 1:07 AM

I think it's fair to say US/UM is a third version and a sequel in one. The protagonists aren't completely new, but just the S/M protagonists with new outfits. The last time that happened within games of the same generation was Lucas and Dawn's outfit changes between D/P and Platinum.

However, US/UM is following an entirely different story, much like B2/W2 had a very different main story from S/M.

Alexander18 August 19th, 2017 2:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hikamaru (Post 9735056)
I think it's fair to say US/UM is a third version and a sequel in one. The protagonists aren't completely new, but just the S/M protagonists with new outfits. The last time that happened within games of the same generation was Lucas and Dawn's outfit changes between D/P and Platinum.

However, US/UM is following an entirely different story, much like B2/W2 had a very different main story from S/M.

That seems a bit farfetch'd to me. A third version and a sequel? That doesn't seem possible to me. It sounds really weird.

Just notice the thread title is wrong. It should say sequels or third versions. Third versions and remakes are not the same. That is fact.

Altairis August 19th, 2017 7:32 AM

not sure why we always have to categorize these things. why can't they just be an unconnected game that also happens to be set in Alola, not like that's kind of what they told us anyway.

Desert Stream~ August 19th, 2017 8:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Altairis (Post 9735226)
not sure why we always have to categorize these things. why can't they just be an unconnected game that also happens to be set in Alola, not like that's kind of what they told us anyway.

That's what it seems like to me. You can't really describe it with any of the current terms.

shadowmoon522 August 19th, 2017 8:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MUDKIP!!! (Post 9735248)
That's what it seems like to me. You can't really describe it with any of the current terms.

remix

OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire August 19th, 2017 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shadowmoon522 (Post 9735260)
remix

Yeah, that term seems to fit better :). Though technically the third versions are a form of remix xD

Desert Stream~ August 19th, 2017 2:09 PM

I've heard it referred to as a "Director's cut" which also makes sense. Third versions would fit under that as well.

Ida13 August 20th, 2017 10:37 AM

Both?

WingsofBliss August 20th, 2017 3:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Intelligence (Post 9682340)
Colress had nothing to do with the Kyurem fusions. Drayden's family passed down the DNA Splicers generation after generation.

Finally somebody pointed this out. People forget that the DNA splicers didn't originate with Team Plasma to begin with, they were stolen from Drayden who had it in his family.

Regarding 3rd versions, here's an interesting thought. Emerald and Platinum had all 3 Pokemon of their Legendary Trios play a part in the story. USUM seems to be pulling a BW2 in that there is only 2 Legendaries out of the 3 that are playing a part. If USUM were a singular game with Solgaleo, Lunala, and Necrozma in it, then I would consider it a true "3rd version". If the storyline is totally different than in SM, that would deviate it even further away from being a 3rd version. It would be an entirely alternate game, I think.

PkmnTrainerElio August 20th, 2017 7:44 PM

They're Requels (Remake + Sequel).

I do have a possible plot idea for the games.

Alexander18 August 20th, 2017 7:58 PM

Remakes - games remade from originals that are no longer compatible with the current ones.

Third versions - an enhanced version from the first pair of games of their respective generation.

Remakes and third versions are two different things. This is fact. USUM are more third versions than sequels as they do not have events that are year apart from SM. USUM are not remakes.

Desert Stream~ August 20th, 2017 8:13 PM

Third versions are really only a pokemon thing. Any other series would probably call it a "remaster" or something.

Alexander18 August 20th, 2017 8:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MUDKIP!!! (Post 9736316)
Third versions are really only a pokemon thing. Any other series would probably call it a "remaster" or something.

I don't agree but i leave it at that. Anyway USUM won't have the story a year after the original since this games have an alternate story.

Phyrrhic August 20th, 2017 10:34 PM

I like Mudkip's "Directors Cut" idea. It seems like the game will be a remake, with some parts following up on the events of the original.

Alexander18 August 20th, 2017 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phyrrhic (Post 9736354)
I like Mudkip's "Directors Cut" idea. It seems like the game will be a remake, with some parts following up on the events of the original.

No it isn't. Remakes are games like FRLG, HGSS & ORAS. USUM are not remakes and not sequels. That is fact. The events in USUM are not following up from SM. USUM has an alternate story. That is it.


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