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Alabama passes strictest abortion law in the United States
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/may/14/abortion-bill-alabama-passes-ban-six-weeks-us-no-exemptions-vote-latest
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Alabama has passed the first realistic threat to Roe vs. Wade, via designing an overtly draconian law crafted solely to get booted up to the Supreme Court. What do you think? |
Good preview of a post Roe v Wade US, the states will decide how far they want their abortion laws to go and the people will either support such a thing or vote the lawmakers out.
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This is embarrassing for the state of Alabama. If a woman wants to terminate her pregnancy enough, she’ll do it through whatever means necessary. God forbid it occurs in a safe, controlled environment, right?
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I generally don't consider myself either pro-life or pro-choice, I believe that abortion should absolutely be well-regulated and not treated as a "contraceptive" option, but I think there are definitely times when it becomes a potentially valid option. I'm okay with the existence of a bill in this manner that creates heavier regulation - I am not okay with the total lack of nuance and flexibility in the bill.
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Also you can tell these laws are made by people who have no idea how women's bodies work. Periods are not always definite, it may take more than 6 weeks to find out if you are pregnant. I myself have PCOS so I haven't had a period in a year but I'm not pregnant, it's just my body. |
Personally, I think something like this shouldn't be up to politicians. It should be up to the pregnant woman if she wants to get an abortion or not. It's their choice.
I definitely agree that life is precious and such but if people are gonna worry about that then just make birth control and such easier to get, promote people to use it. Or y'know.. don't have intercourse at all if you don't want a kid, but that would be waaay too much to ask people.. -_- |
Yeah, the politicians making this do have the same experiences as the women who are likely seeking the abortion. Also I think proper sex ed in schools and more access to contraceptives and making them more available would help but, being blunt, there are unfortunate a lot of people out there who see women as baby making machines.
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I can't wait to see the lawsuits about this in federal court, and I'm sure that and competent judge would overturn this if it does get challenged.
However, it's ultimately the president's job to uphold federal decisions above state decisions, which I do not foresee the current executive branch holding these up. |
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Trump has outright said that he wants to see Roe v. Wade overturned and has deliberately appointed justices that are anti-abortion, so I really doubt that he'll do anything other than defend the states passing these sorts of laws.
Given the composition of the current Supreme Court, I'm not optimistic about the direction this is all going. |
This wouldn't survive a challenge in court. It seems that the law as it currently is in the state, it would violate the ruling of Roe V. Wade. If anything is to be said of the current state of the Supreme Court, I don't see it going in a positive direction.
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Here, Pat Robinson's take on it:
https://www.rawstory.com/2019/05/this-onell-lose-even-christian-fundamentalist-pat-robertson-is-against-alabamas-extreme-anti-abortion-bill/ Yep, even he says this one goes too far. |
I guess in Alabama they look down on sex before marriage, and marriage means that the woman agrees to become a baby making machine? Since, you know, no birth control measure sans abstaining or sterilization is 100% effective.
It's depressing to see how social development goes backwards in some parts of the world. |
catch me uhhh ashamed to live here. dont get me wrong i was ashamed to live here before but now i am even more so.
i honestly think this is a horrible decision. women are just going to resort to back alley ways of abortion and it's going to cause so much chaos everywhere. women have the right to do what they want with their bodies. i'm so disgusted that this bill managed to get passed. then again alabama seems to be full of conservatives and it's in the bible belt, so.. |
I really am ashamed of my state. We cannot even afford to take care of the children that we already have and rank 50th in education. This has nothing to do with caring about unborn babies but the men who run this state just want to have complete power over women. It's disgusting. Abortion is a fucking right and it is being yanked away in so many states by old white men.
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This is absolutely appalling and disgusting. It's not up to the government what a woman wants/does w/her body. It's a woman's choice if she wants to carry a baby or not. What's worse is that more states are trying to ban abortion or already have. Why the fuck should cishet rich white men get to decide abortion isn't allowed? This is literally a violation of human rights.
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To be frank abortion has taught irresponsibility, women should know having unprotected sex can lead to pregnancy. If said women didn't want a child or couldn't afford having a child then why are they having sex in the first place? Mainly because even if your using protection it could fail, so why take the risk? The only exception to me is if it is rape, incest, or a legit threat to a womens physical health. Also I think we need to try to mandate some sort of birth control measure.
I also don't get the my body arguments when that developing human being is not your body, but somebody elses even if it is in a womens womb. If I was a governor of a state I would definitely be demanding sex-ed courses be mandatory in school for all students and ensure that birth control was reachable by all women in a aid to attempt to prevent unwanted pregnancies, but I would also put out there that not having sex is the best form of birth control that there is. Would I go out of the way to insult a women who had a abortion? No. I am actually a christian, but I wouldn't dislike anyone for a mistake an women made. I know some religions despise birth control, but I don't know why as I don't see it as being against a religion. As for this bill it went to far because it didn't include exceptions for rape, incest, or physical health for a women. While some of you support abortion, I simply can't for the reasons I said above minus my exceptions. That is my opinion on this matter, and while not all of you will agree with my thoughts I think women need to learn to take measures to not risk pregnancy. |
I'm Libertarian so the Libertarian in me says that Government needs to just get the hell out of the way when it comes to issues such as this. That said, I have a few statements I'd like to get off my chest. Firstly, Abortion is not explicitly mentioned in the USA Constitution so when Elected officials or anyone says that its a "Constitutional Right" are either lying or are blatantly ignorant. Secondly, the biggest provider of Abortions is Planned Parenthood. Rather ironic name when you think about it since the name implies support and advice on reproducing and not doing the exact opposite(which is what Abortion is). Third, one of the root causes of this whole debate that doesn't get enough attention is the $$$$$$$$$$$$$. Planned Parenthood gets gobs of Federal and State cash to run their operations, some of which they funnel back into Lobbyists and Elected Officials to keep the $$$$$ train coming. I don't know about you but that reeks of Corruption(Taxpayer funded may I add). Four, the bill that Alabama passed went over the line because it left little time(6 weeks? Fuck that... even the Catholic in me knows that's too short) or flexibility with respect to exceptions. I know that if I were female and I was raped that I would not want the baby as it would give me a daily reminder of what happened to me.
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Has anyone been watching the polls?
Even among Evangelicals, support for this law does not even exceed 30%. IMOHO, this will only hurt the Republican Party. Badly. Watch: https://www.rawstory.com/2019/05/gop-extremism-is-scaring-the-hell-out-of-americans-msnbcs-morning-joe-drops-the-hammer-on-former-party/?utm_source=push_notifications Edit: Btw, speaking of Evangelicals, one guy who supports this bill gave what is, IMOHO, the lamest pro-life argument I have EVER heard: https://www.rawstory.com/2019/05/twitter-eviscerates-christian-blogger-for-his-idiotic-argument-why-12-year-old-rape-victims-shouldnt-be-allowed-abortions/ |
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So, while it's not explicitly in the constitution, the 14th Amendment is why it was made legal. Quote:
Also, "(while Planned Parenthood) does receive federal funding, but the money cannot be used for abortions by law. Fun rant though. In related news, Missouri Senate Advances Fetal Heartbeat Abortion Bill. Big yikes on that. |
If you ask me, passing obviously illegal laws should come with mandatory restitution to those harmed when they're overturned. For extra fun, take the funding out of the paychecks of everyone who voted for the malignant bill. It'd be a good lesson in civics for the people responsible for the abuse.
Can you imagine if state legislatures just started passing bills every few years that restrict e.g. freedom of the press? It wouldn't matter what the constitution said because it takes time for the laws to get challenged in the courts. In the meantime, the press isn't allowed to report on the abuse of the system or, worse, is shut down, either by corrupt officials or due to inability to profit in an environment where they can't report anything meaningful. Maybe they can sue for damages afterward... if they still have the resources to do so. What's the purpose of even having a court if the legislature just ignores its decisions and the courts can't undo the damage those invalid laws have done? That's similar to what's happening here. Abortion clinics take significant resources to operate. Did Alabama pass this bill to try and test Roe v Wade given the new makeup of the court? Probably, but that's not the only reason. A large part of the reason they, and others, pass bills like these is because it forces abortion clinics to shut down. They don't even care if it gets overturned because it accomplishes their goal of shutting down abortion clinics either way, although I'm sure they'd like it to get overturned. It doesn't matter to them whether their law is legitimate or not, their primary goal is to cause abortion clinics to close and prevent abortions. What we have here is elected officials, people who swore an oath to uphold the Constitution, abusing their station to pass laws that (in the best reading of the situation) suit their moral viewpoint. That this is being done by people who wrap themselves in the flag and call themselves patriots is even more disgusting to me. Regardless of my personal thoughts on abortion and how it should be handled by the law, deliberate abuse of the legal system is unacceptable; our social order relies on peoples' belief in the legitimacy of our systems. If you swear an oath to uphold the law of the land and then break that oath, you don't get to call yourself a patriot. This is why I think we need some kind of punitive measures for laws that are obviously and deliberately passed in the face of existing legal precedent if it can be proven that such a law causes direct harm to existing people, businesses, or organizations. The Alabama legislature here is acting in blatant conempt of court, and if the courts can't undo the damage these invalid laws do, they should at least hold responsible those passing the laws. If Alabama disagrees with Roe v Wade, they can bring a case against it if they can argue from some unique legal perspective that hasn't already been explored; otherwise, the correct path for the legislature to override a judicial decision is through a constitutional amendment. "Just keep passing laws that fly in the face of precedent and see if something sticks" is not (or at least should not) be a valid tactic and should come with real consequences. As far as the issue of abortion itself, I think abortions should only be permitted if it can be argued that there is a strong case that it would improve the wellbeing of the mother (or potentially some other kind of mitigating circumstance). However, this is less important to me than the abuse of the law, because while abortion does affect a lot of people, it doesn't threaten the integrity of the legal system itself. Its potential impact is, therefore, comparatively limited. Quote:
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The oath to office varies from state to state, but I believe that all of them swear to uphold both the State and United States Constitutions. The exact text of the Alabama oath of office specifically is as follows: Quote:
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Alright, so I have been clear that for the most part I don't support this bill, but something keeps coming up in response to it that I think isn't the best argument. That being "the government can't tell women what to do with their bodies". Yes it can. A rather large portion of laws out there are specifically telling you what you can and cannot do with your bodies. You can't expose it publicly, you can't drink at a certain age, you can't risk your life in the army until a certain age, you can't put certain substances in your body etc. etc. Just because this is something that is largely directed at women doesn't change the fact that laws are telling us what we can and cannot do with our bodies all the time.
Personally, I think there has to be a limit to that somewhere, but that's another discussion entirely. My thoughts on this bill going too far remain the same and of course, it's illegal too. Hadn't even thought about that. |
As a compromise on abortion as there seems to be two extremes going in the US. I was wondering what people would think if the US were to implement something more akin to Europe, in that Abortions for the first trimester ( 12 weeks ) are paid for by the Government, after that Abortion is illegal unless it endangers the woman. It has things in there both sides would want, and both sides would hate, but it would give some uniformity to the laws.
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Honestly, this debate has to stop. So, who care if someone does an abortion? Does it affect YOU personally? The fact is, abortion is a completely voluntary procedure. It's time for these so-called 'pro-life' people to accept that simple fact. Don't want any abortions in your household? Well, that's your choice plain and simple.
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