![]() |
Birds > Dogs, possible now with XD assist?
Articuno < Suicune, obvious back then
Zapdos < Raikou, obvious back then too Moltres ? Entei, both suck pretty badly (both of them has bad movepool, but one got calm mind+solarbeam while the other got agility) But now that Gale of Darkness gave the birds 3 moves each. Articuno got haze and heal bell. Zapdos got metal sound and baton pass. Moltres got will o wisp and morning sun. All the birds got extrasensory too so they can finally do more than just the STAB 95 attack along with Hidden Power. Possible that the legendary birds will finally regain some status and be at least hanging loosely behind, finally having some use that's worth considering instead of being completely shadowed by the legendary beasts? |
heh molres... sunnyday, mornina sun, flamethrower, hpgrass. okay that pwns entei always.
zapdos gets freaking BP, thats insane. pass some speed to sumthin, cm, pass back, and sweep. articuno- cleric+hazer, okay doesn't get much better than that. im gonna be using the birds A LOT once XD moves are incorporated into NB... a lot. |
They're almost uber-ish. lol
|
Do the Shadow Attacks disappear when the Pokemon are purified?
Also, ExSensory is awesome. That goes on all of them with their standard 95 POW STAB attacks. Also, Zapdos could always learn Drill Peck. That helps a lot. Without it, it could not touch Ground types, could barely hurt Venusaur, and could not use a STABed supereffective strike on Fight types. In my opinion, Zapdos was always >Raikou. |
Quote:
|
Oh i forgot about that. Well, Drill peck is still very useful. Fight and Grass types fall to it, the only Electric type that can kill them. Also it is useful against Zam/Espy/any other poor defense sweeper.
|
Problem with Articuno is that anything that needs hazing probably got rock slide in terms of physical (except Gyarados), or a SE attack for special. That's my fear about Articuno to be a hazer. Luckily, ice punch is getting used more and more instead of thunderpunch/thunderbolt lately, so Articuno may regain some luck to haze calm mind. However, I'm still leaning to Articuno being only cleric but not cleric+hazer at the same time...
Possibly thinking of... Articuno -ice beam -reflect -heal bell -extrasensory (rather take the brute force than the standard HP Water) Zapdos can baton pass agility, but I was thinking about metal sound more. Even Blissey will have to reconsider facing Zapdos if sp.def got dropped to 150s in one turn. I don't think bp agility to something that cm then bp back will really help. That's like relying on old baton pass chain. Either way... Zapdos -thunderbolt -metal Sound/agility -extrasensory/baton pass -HP Grass/Ice Moltres is still not that good I think. It's better than Entei now, but still it's dead against rock slide regardless of will o wisp or not. Hopefully you got the burn on the switch and then run away before the weakened but still deadly rock slide comes in. Can't really tank, so I personally don't find too much use for Moltres to have morning sun. Moltres -Flamethrower -Will o wisp (or extrasensory for pure sweeping Moltres) -Agility -HP Grass |
Quote:
|
Well some grass types do risk attacking electrics because you're pretty much guessing what their HP is. There are some with HP Ice and some with HP Grass (but then Swampert is upsetting the balance lately). Venusaur does stand a chance against Zapdos with seed and sludge bomb. However, not like drill peck will help too much against sleep powder or a high defense. Even Alakazam's STAB psychic will not OHKO Venusaur if Venusaur maxed sp.def. But now, Zapdos with extrasensory will definitely 2HKO Venusaur unless it is throwing heals around.
Fighting types will always destroy Zapdos with rock slide if they are confident enough to stay in. That means they probably can survive one thunderbolt to activate salac, then prepare for rock slide to beat Zapdos and reversal whatever is coming out next. Again, extrasensory shall upset this balance by ensuring OHKO from now on =D (except for Hera, but meh) |
It looks like the birds FINALLY get some major attention in order to keep up w/ the dogs.
(IMO, everyone has their thoughts on how their Pogeys should be, and I have my own.[Why do sooo many people use Hidden Power as a filler move when there are sooo many other possibilities like surprise type-trumping?{And how can some Pogeys can't dish out damage but can only inflict stat conditions, raise/lower stats, and BP? Hell, damaging attacks are the FOUNDATIONS of battles.}]) |
Thats pretty cool...Finally articuno can do something.Extrasensory is awesome.Morning sun is a waste on moltes tho.Arty could have utilized moonlight alot better...And well Zapdos has a range of possibilities now.Metal sound will do a no. on blissey and snorlax.Especially when thunderbolt does ~30% to lax without it.
:).... |
i'll rather unload a metal sound, then keep pounding Snorlax with extrasensory (flinch) ;p unless I can finish it off with thunderbolt, of course.
I somehow still feel that Moltres will get wasted in battles. Will o wisp isn't a good solution to the terrible defense on top of one of the worst type combination out there. Personally, I predict Zapdos to be completely used INSTEAD of Raikou now. Zapdos may not have calm mind, and is still slower than Raikou, but there's a very valuable trait about Zapdos that Raikou is fatally weak to. =D The Dugtrio trap immunity Start fixing teams to anti-Zapdos before NB makes the changes, kids >>; |
True, 2 good stall/defensive style moves on a pokemon that cannot defend what so ever.Sad.
I'm still not very confident abt zapdos dominating raikou tho.Neck and neck competition is certain IMO.. heal belling articuno still has me all happy. |
Currently, Dugtrio is used solely to trap a few important opponents and KO them in one hit. Tyranitar is one, and Raikou is the other main Pokemon. Of course there's Metagross too, but Meta can survive one earthquake if it's at full health, while these two cannot. Dugtrio's EV is setup especially to resist Raikou. It's made so that it can survive one Raikou HP Grass/Ice as long as Raikou didn't calm mind. If Zapdos replaces Raikou, Dugtrio's specific situational setup will be damaged a bit.
Zapdos can evade the arena trap, and even if Zapdos is forced to stay (maybe it's down to last Pokemon, Dugtrio vs Zapdos or something stupid like that), fighting Dugtrio on Rock Slide is somewhat better than fighting STAB EQ? We'll have to see... I still think that Zapdos will see a LOT more action while Raikou will lose its heat... |
duggy would lose 1 on 1 to a full health zapdos...makes sense.
And then metal sound gives it something to do to blissey and lax.Either forcing a switch or a KO.Something even raikou has an issue with [pressure..Meh]. |
Nah Zapdos lose 1vs1 to Duggy, but Zapdos can run and Raikou cannot.
Just that it's more hopeful to fight against Rock Slide than Earthquake ^^; Mainly, it's the running that Zapdos can do |
Bu just remeber, no Pogey will "go out of style", someone might show up and dominate with it, AI, player-controlled, who knows?
|
If zapdos has a sub up then it can beat dugtrio 1 on 1...but i guess i'm jumping ahead of myself by thinking that duggy will be switched in.
whatever the case, the worst part abt dugtrio would be eliminated.... one thing tho, this is all new information for me and i'm wondering if the legendary birds get new moves, don't the dogs get new moves too? and if so, how useful are they?...Possibly good enough to still overshadow their flying counterparts? |
am I the only one who thinks metal sound is better than BP for zapdos
since it will be able to beat snorlax and possibley blissey 1 on 1 zapdos vs dugtrio who hasn't used earthquake yet, is sort of an odd situation since dugtrio wouldn't switch into a pokemon that wouldn't be effected by arena trap so, zapdos wouldn't be able to switch in on dugtrio until the trapped pokemon was K.O'ed. And even then if it was K.O.'ed by rock slide they you wouldn't switch zapdos in. And if the pokemon was K.O.'ed by a differen't move then dugtrio wouldn't stay in because it wouldn't be able to damage zapdos. Btw WoW moltres is looking really cool, since a lot of people are using snorlax now I think there will be a rise in zapdos usage, then a rise in regice usage, and then a rise in moltres usage, and then we'll start making teams with two special sponges. blizzard blissey will be on the rise..........lol |
umm no ur not.
I can't remember anyone talking abt BP, but i do remember saying that metal sound zappy can actually do something to blissey/lax. ... still disagree.If moltres goes on the rise then all that will happen is that lax will be equipped with rockslide.Rest can deal with will-o-wisp.Milotic would have fun switching in on moltres's will-o-wisp too.I think extrasensory is a real kicker for moltres tho. I'm so against regi ice.... Blizzey [thats blizzard blissey for all u super smart ppl] is so dominating right now anyway...lol. |
what Husk meant is that Moltres will just burn then run ^^; No Moltres will stay even with will o wisp on Snorlax already (assuming Snorlax got full hp). Or, we may shift our EV styles on Moltres a bit from now on instead of 252sp.atk + 252 speed XD
The thing is, when player see Raikou, Dugtrio comes almost asap (and this turn Raikou subs), Dugtrio breaks sub while Raikou desperately HPs Dugtrio who will survive. Finally, Dugtrio goes for the kill. This will not happen with Zapdos cause Dugtrio can't come out to trap to begin with. If the player is desperate or has lost the special-sponge already, then Dugtrio maybe forced out to use Rock Slide. If this is the scenario, since Zapdos probably won't sub and just use sp.atk directly, Dugtrio is weakened on the turn of the switch instead. Zapdos then can run to something that takes rock slide, and then whatever comes out new can quick attack to finish Dugtrio if Dugtrio isn't running. That's my theorycraft of the day. Milotic's use may possibly be reduced, not increase. If it's true that Zapdos goes up in usage, then Milotic should go down due to Zapdos (in theory.) In return, I'm actually looking at Mr.Mime to be the number 1 anti-Zapdos. Soundproof > metal sound, so free time to calm up for bp! |
Milotic use would go up IF wow-moltres is suddenly used...it was in that context that i mentioned him.
Frostweaver...u never answered the whole 'are the dogs getting other moves too' question. |
No they aren't... since Gale of Darkness doesn't have the dogs. Aren't they good enough with calm mind? XD;; Well, Entei can always use a little help, like getting earthquake or something decently physical.
|
Thats good.Don't want to go rambling off but who is 'gale of darkness' and what game is she/he/it froM?...
Entei needs ALOT of help..At least he got nice hp...too bad he's a fire type |
whee, more uber-like legendaries -_- my ash team's gonna get whooped now.
how bad can moltres be anyway? considering i use a special zard, moltres can't be THAT bad.. i use flamethrower+hpgrass+dragonclaw on my zard and i don't see why moltres, with supreme stats, can't be utilized as a special sweepert with STAB, hp, and extrasensory. i think it's a decent pokemon, just not as up to par with the rest of the legendaries. certainly people who dislike using OU's will take a look into moltres. and zapdos is pretty OU as it is... hate to imagine how much more OU he'd become.. |
| All times are GMT -8. The time now is 5:51 AM. |
![]()
© 2002 - 2018 The PokéCommunity™, pokecommunity.com.
Pokémon characters and images belong to The Pokémon Company International and Nintendo. This website is in no way affiliated with or endorsed by Nintendo, Creatures, GAMEFREAK, The Pokémon Company or The Pokémon Company International. We just love Pokémon.
All forum styles, their images (unless noted otherwise) and site designs are © 2002 - 2016 The PokéCommunity / PokéCommunity.com.
PokéCommunity™ is a trademark of The PokéCommunity. All rights reserved. Sponsor advertisements do not imply our endorsement of that product or service. User generated content remains the property of its creator.
Acknowledgements
Use of PokéCommunity Assets
vB Optimise by DragonByte Technologies Ltd © 2023.