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The Best Overall Team (Unofficial)
First, i would like to say that this is not official in any way. This is simply the opinion of those who post. I got a lot of good responses for the Defense Thread, and i was critizied for the Attack thread. I realize a pure Defense Team is ok, but a pure attack team isnt. I realize that there is a potential for a lot of argument here, so be kind. Here is the Goal of this thread:
Make the best overall team possible. Sweepers, Walls, ect. It will have as few repeating weaknesses as possiable, and there will be no Legendary pokemon. Here are some starting suggestions: Attack Sweepers: Scizor, Dragonite, Garchomp, Metagross SpAttack Sweepers: Alakazam Walls: Blissey, Shuckle, Dusknoir, Milotic I know a lot of people will not agree, so dont tell me that, i know. This is not about what kind of team i want. It is about what the general population thinks the best Overall team is. If you have a suggestion please say why. You dont have to use the above pokemon, they are just suggestions. Dont post if you just want to critize my idea. |
well i would suggest
batton passing scizor DD dragonite DD tyrannitar dusknoir as a wall alakazam as a sweeper(special) and either vaporeon (or god forbid the uber stupid) milotic both of which have great wall purposes in some cases an annoyer such as ludicolo(only has obscure weaknesses, poison, flyinbg and bug) that suck the life of enemies and poison... thats my opinion done in five minutes XD |
Well for a Attack based based team.
Weavile (Speed) Arcanine (Attack, sp.Attack) Swampert (attack) Lucario (Attack, Sp.Attack)(i find his move pool quite useful) Dusknoir(Defense with decent Attack) Salamence Attack, Sp. Attack) |
Jesus Nameless, do you ever offer useful advice?
And for the record, I don't see Weavile defeating a Metagross OR Milotic for not even a millenium. Quote:
Now let's see what I can whip up. Dusknoir @ Leftovers Ability: Pressure EVs: 228 HP / 104 Atk / 176 Def Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk) - Substitute - Focus Punch - Pain Split - Shadow Claw A rather strange set I came up with, I'll admit, but it puts Weavile to rest. Pain Split punishes Blissey, while at the same time following up with a Focus Punch. Shadow Claw for the unwanted Ghost-Type Visitors. Metagross @ Life Orb / Leftovers Ability: Clear Body EVs: 88 HP / 252 Atk / 136 Spd / 32 SDef Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk) - Agility - Zen Headbutt - Meteor Mash - Earthquake / Explosion Classic AgiliGross. Milotic (F) @ Leftovers Ability: Marvel Scale EVs: 212 HP / 144 Def / 48 Spd / 104 SDef Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk) - Surf - Ice Beam / Dragon Pulse - Rest - Sleep Talk Sleep Talking Milotic helps prevent Status. Alakazam (M) @ Choice Specs / Wise Specs Ability: Synchronize EVs: 4 HP / 252 Spd / 252 SAtk Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk) - Psychic - Focus Blast - Substitute - Energy Ball / Hidden Power (Ice) HP Ice drops Dragon Types. Blissey (F) @ Leftovers Ability: Natural Cure EVs: 212 HP / 216 Def / 80 SAtk Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk) - Aromatherapy - Ice Beam / Thunder / Thunder Wave - Softboiled - Stealth Rock Since Blissey can't get Seismic Toss within D/P without the use of Emerald, then that's basically the only way to go there. Garchomp (M) @ Choice Band Ability: Sand Veil EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk) - Earthquake - Dragon Claw / Dragon Rush - Stone Edge - Crunch / Fire Fang CBing should be your first form of Physical Sweeping. I've used 6 of the Pokemon in your desired list. Unless you intend on running Thunderpunch on Dusknoir, your team will suffer from Chronic Gyarados weakness. Just thought I should point that out. |
Metagross wants Thunderpunch badly if you have Emerald.
Garchomp wants a Choice Scarf, with Outrage over Dragon Claw. Fire Fang over Crunch, because Outrage hits Psychics and Ghosts harder than Crunch. |
Perhaps he doesn't have Emerald, and even if he did, he doesn't have room for Thunderpunch on Metagross.
And Outrage on CS Garchomp is only reeling in another Metagross to come in and land a free Agility and attack away. |
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Anyways, this is my normal team that I use, and so far I've done pretty well (and let it be known I don't use stat-boosters besides Agility, which is my primary downfall): Skarmory Claydol Blissey Gengar Milotic Metagross One of the best staller teams, even without a Dusknoir; Between Skarmory, Claydol and Blissey (also Milotic to take physical water and physical ice attacks), they resists nearly every move in the existence. Gengar and Metagross are my only true attackers, and even then Metagross doubles as a decent physical wall (his Defense nearly matching his enormous Attack). Oh, BTW: Quote:
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Ok, we have a lot to add up here. I am very pleased with the outcome so far. Lets focus on one problem at a time. What should we use as a Physical Sweeper. We will get to the rest, but just for now, what should we use as a physical sweeper.
Here are some that you have said: Dragonite- Weaknesses: Dragon, Ice, Rock -Base Attack: 134, Speed: 80 Garchomp-Weaknesses: Dragon, Ice -Base Attack: 130, Speed: 108 Tyranitar- Weakness: Fighting, Water, Ground, Grass, Steel -Base Attack:134, Speed: 61 (also good Def and SpDef) Metagross- Weakness: Fire, Ground -Base Attack:135, Speed: 70 (Metagross also could be used for his good defense) Salamence-Dragon, Ice -Base Attack:135, Speed:100 I am guessing most of us know what EV's can do. I think the bases of a good physical sweeper are Attack and Speed. Dragonite, Salamence, and Tyranitar can learn Dragon Dance, which is always good for sweeping. Post to show which is the best choice and why and then we will pick based on what you say. |
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Milotic doesn't really need any speed EVs either as she isnt made to outrun many Pokemon thus her role as a wall and limited sweeper. Bold Nature is prefered here as suggested above. Really the EV spread should be something like this: 252 Def / 200 HP / 58 SDEF If she is going to be a bold and somewhat of a physical wall and counter to the likes of Salamence then she needs all the Defense she can get. Her Special Defense is already high as it is and not to many Pokemon can pierce it. Moveset should be: -Surf (for STAB) -Ice Beam (for pesky Dragons and Grass types etc.) -Recover -Hypnosis/Mirror Coat Personally I think Hypnosis is a way better move then Mirror Coat especially if Milotic is taking the role of physicl wall then a special wall. Sure Mirror Coat can get you a free OHKO but people are weary of attack Milotic with Special Attacks these day. They try and go for her lower Defense. Hynosis on the other hand is very viable because it can disable those other bulky water types Milotic has trouble with. |
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And dude, I've been doing research on the D/P Metagame LONG before it came to the U.S. Since November of last year actually. Hmph. Once I finish compiling my team, I'd like to have a match with you someday. |
Lets clear some things up that dont seem to be clear. I am strongly against that kind of language Nameless111. If you do it again i will report it. Weavile is not even that good of a pokemon when its all said and done. It has horrible Defense, a Dragonite could beat it easily, escpecially if you are using the wrong attacks. It could not beat Milotic, Scizor, or Metagross, and that is a good chunk of the list. Besides, i was only giving those as suggestions, not as the whole team. Can we stay on topic now.
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and iceman, its all only saying, weavile will destroy most posted up there, dang it guys why do you all hate me a whole bunch? what did i ever do to you? T_T (cept for nightofshadows, QUIT BUGGIN ME! :( ) |
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Let's say for example you send in Weavile against someone's Dragonite, and attempt to pull an Ice Punch. The enemy switches and Sends in Milotic, doing absolutely nothing to it. That cycle repeats itself over and over. I'd also like to point out that trying to send Weavile against a Dragonite OR Salamence with Dragon Dance in is completely useless. Weavile can't switch in on a Earthquake / Dragon Claw / Dragon Rush / Fire Fang / Stone Edge or whatever else while the enemy has 1 DD under his belt. I also don't see Weavile doing any type of Damage to Scizor or Shuckle at all either. The only Pokemon in that list that Weavile can ever hope to harm is Blissey and Alakazam, but they're most likely to switch out to something that can take Weavile's Hits. Weavile can hurt a Garchomp, heavily assuming it isn't carrying Choice Scarf. Other than that, Weavile can't hurt anything. Your problem is, you need to learn what counters what, and you shouldn't be thinking of just Type Weaknesses. There's a lot more to it than that. |
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There's no better team. But there are standard pokémons, wich are:
Blissey; Skarmory; Boah(Not so much, but normally Dragonite and Tyranitar). That's about how every team is made. No team is flawless. |
What is with you people. Just let it go. Those pokemon up there were not even a team, so what is the big deal. You are blowing it way out of proportion. Can we please get back on target. We need to pick a Phsyical Sweeper. Someone post about this so we can get the ball rolling in the right direction.
EXAMPLES of Phsyical Sweepers: Dragonite- Weaknesses: Dragon, Ice, Rock -Base Attack: 134, Speed: 80 Garchomp-Weaknesses: Dragon, Ice -Base Attack: 130, Speed: 108 Tyranitar- Weakness: Fighting, Water, Ground, Grass, Steel -Base Attack:134, Speed: 61 (also good Def and SpDef) Metagross- Weakness: Fire, Ground -Base Attack:135, Speed: 70 (Metagross also could be used for his good defense) Salamence-Dragon, Ice -Base Attack:135, Speed:100 I know attacks have a lot to do with the choice but i am to lazy to type those. Dragonite, Salamence, and Tyranitar all have DD. |
Portujesus, i never said i was trying to make a flawless team. I simply wanted to see people argue there point on which pokemon are better than others in certain situations. You cant have a flawless team, but you can try to make a team that can deal with the most situations possible, without opening yourself up to a certain weakness. I just want opinions on what the best made team could be, not The Undisputed Champion Team on Earth.
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As overrated as Garchomp is I think he is better then Metagross, Tyranitar and Salamence to a certain extent because of his abnormally high base Speed Stat.
Tyranitar is nice but I never liked his multiple weakness especially the ones to the umm common Surf. |
I like Salamence as a sweeper but I don't get why he has to be eather physical or special. With the right nature he can have fairly even stats where you can take advantage of both.
examples of moves (i won't list any low accuracy recharge moves) flamethrower, Extremespeed, Earthquake, Solarbeam, Crunch, Shadow Ball?, Fly or some flying attack, Dragon Claw etc. |
Metagross is by far one of the top physical sweepers. Because besides a Poison immunity, he has resistences out the butt hole. Many things that aren't super effective are "not very effective". The only types which are normal effective attacks that he may have problems with are Water and Electric, and Electric is basicallycovered with Earthquake (as is his Fire weakness). Water is covered by (if you're lucky enough) Thunder Punch. If you don't have Thunderpunch, thenmost bulky waters (like Milotic) laugh at 'Gross. The ONLY weakness Metagross can't counter is Ground, unless you have Ice Punch or the likes.
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This is more like it. You all had good arguments. Garchomp does have high speed and Attack. If only he had DD, he would be perfect. The reason Salamence is not a Special Sweeper is because if i choose Salamence, i would give him a nature to support Attack, and i would make his EV's Attack and Speed. This way he has the attack of a God. Metagross i think is the best choice. It has very high atttack, it doesnt need speed because it has defense, and he has numerous resistances and few weaknesses. If you feel like this would be a bad choice (or a better one exists), please post why. Next we need to pick a Special Sweeper.
Here are some examples: Alakazam Weaknesses: Dark, Ghost, Bug Base SPAttack: 135, Speed: 120 Porygon-Z Weakness: Fighting Base SPAttack: 135, Speed: 90 Gengar Weakness: Dark, Ghost, Psychic Base SPAttack: 135, Speed: 110 Espeon Weakness: Dark, Ghost, Bug Base SPAttack: 130, Speed: 110 |
I'd go with Porygon-Z for it's insane base Attack. It has an ability that powers up same type attacks so imagine a STAB Hyper Beam from this bad boy. He also has Nasty Plot at his disposal so even one of these will completely obliterate a Pokemon. He also has Tri-Attack to top it off.
What about Togekiss? It too is an awesome Special Sweeper. |
For the record, Gengar's Base SAtk is 130, not 135. ^^'
Now then, out of that list, Porygon-Z makes an excellent Sp. Sweeper. It gets Thunderbolt and Ice Beam, and can also run Tri Attack, which gets a friendly 1.5 Boost thanks to Adaptability, making it completely scary even with STAB. Nasty Plot also helps on it if you can pull one off. Otherwise, I'd usually run with Dark Pulse, and give it Life Orb, Choice Specs, or Wise Specs. |
Sorry about the Gengar mistake. I agree about the Porygon-Z. We will go with that. So far we have:
[email protected] ?? EV's: Attack-255, Defense-255 Nature: -Meteor Mash -Thunder Punch -Earthquake -?? [email protected] Choice Specs EV's SpAttack-255, Speed-255 Nature: -Tri-Attack -Dark Pulse or Nasty Plot -Ice Beam -Psychic (I put this in to make sure no fightingh types can get a shot in.) If you would like me to change something, please post. Now we are going to move on to walls. Do we need a physical AND speical wall, or do we need two good walls in both areas. Here are some suggestions. Shuckle is not on this list because his terrible HP makes his God defense not worth it. Examples: Probopass Base Def: 145, SpDef: 150 Weak: Water, Ground, Fighting Skarmory Base Def: 140, SpDef: 70 Weak: Fire, Elec Dusknoir Base Def: 135, SpDef: 135 Weak: Dark, Ghost Blissey Base HP: 255, SpDef: 135 Weak: Fighting Mantine Base Def: 70, SpDef: 140 Weak: Elec, Rock Umbreon Base Def: 110, SpDef: 130 Weak: Fighting, Bug Milotic Base Def: 79, SpDef: 125 Weak: Grass, Elec Most of these pokemon have tactics specific to them. Ex. Skarmory, Blissey. If you have another suggestion, just post. Otherwise just post which one would be the best choice and why. |
I would suggest probably skarmory and Blissey, that way you can spike rock them as well as have sturdy walls. probably give skarm whirlwind,spikes,rocks, and roost. but im not sure about blissey's moveset. im not the best person for blissey advice
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I think we should go with a Dusknoir. It has great Def and SpDef. It can cut walls down to size with Pain Split, with Pressure, you can break down PP. Not affected by Normal or Fighting, and only weak against Dark and Ghost. I also like to use a Curse Dusknoir.
Pain Split Noir [email protected] Leftovers EV's Def: 255, SpDef:255 Nature:Calm -Pain Split -Rest -Mean Look -Shadow Punch Curse Noir [email protected] Leftovers EV's Def: 255, SpDef:255 Nature:Calm -Curse -Rest -Mean Look -Destiny Bond |
Dusknoir is awesome. There are so many good walls but so little space. Most of these walls serve a dual purpose too. Skarmory is a Spiker, Bliss a Healer, Milotic a Special Attacker, Umbreon a Toxi-tank Wish supporter. Kinda hard to choose.
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I agree Punishment. i like Dusknoir, but we need to pick the two that stand out above the rest. I think Dusknoir could handle the most situations that could occur. It will be hard to choose two that everyone agrees with.
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It's actually kinda funny though, that mixed infernape can take apart most of these walls by himself. flamethrower takes care of skarmory, close combat takes care of blissey and umbreon, and grass knot with good prediction on switch-ins or after nasty plot takes care of milotic...
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Thank you for pointing that out c_dog (i am not being sarcastic if it sounds like it). We have already choosen a pokemon that has a weakness to fighting, Porygon-Z, and we already have a weakness to fire, Metagross. We could POSSIBLY have two of the same weakness, but i would rather not. Dusknoir fits these requirements.
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Well lets eliminate Probopass and Mantine. Sure Probopass has an insane base defense stat his weaknesses are to commmon.
So we have Skarmory, Blissey, Milotic and Umbreon left. |
I say we go Milotic and Dusknoir. That way we have no repeating weaknesses. Agree or Disagree?
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With the advent of powerful fighting moves, Blissey and Umbreon dont last as long as they use to. Everyone is expecting a Skarmory on nearly every team so it ownt last long as it use too.
Milotic on the other hand is a handy dandy Pokemon. IT can switch into a sweeper or special sweeper. I've seen it take Grass and Electric attacks like nothing. Though the latter you have to be a bit cautious. Not to mention Ice Beam takes care of those pesky grass types. (and the rampaging dragons) So yeah I agree on Dusknoir and Milotic. |
Agreed. I always had a bit of trouble fighting Milotic. However, I wouldn't rule out Blissey just yet. Sure, she's spoken of so much her name sounds redundant, but with the right moveset, she still last. Problem with her is that her moveset is also too standard (I'm tired of hearing Siesmec Toss).
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I think Milotic makes the best physical wall these days since most teams have counters for Skarms and Blissey. Skarms fall easily to any decent mix sweeper with fire attacks, as opposed to 3rd gen when people had to carry magnimite with magnet-pull. Blissey is a victim of the new poweful fighting attacks such as close combat, effectively cutting its usefulness. Umbreon was never that good a wall to be honest and it hasn't changed(Vaporeon always was and always will be better).
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But Boltbeam Blissey is getting quite popular these days too.
Milotic is the choice then. Not to many people are running Grass moves these days. As for the Umbreon/Vaporeon thingy Umbreon servs a different purpose. Her role is a Toxi-tank and I am pretty sure Vaporeon can never take that role. But Blissey and Umbreon falter to the new mosts such as Close Combat and even a Focus Punch. |
Ok. Sounds like we all agree on Milotic. I think that Blissey is always used too. People are starting to put powerful fighting moves to take on Blissey, and besides, we already have a normal type, and two normal types on a team is a bad idea. Alright. This is the total team we have so far:
[email protected] ?? EV's: Attack-255, Defense-255 Nature: -Meteor Mash -Thunder Punch -Earthquake -?? [email protected] Choice Specs EV's SpAttack-255, Speed-255 Nature: -Tri-Attack -Dark Pulse or Nasty Plot -Ice Beam -Psychic (I put this in to make sure no fightingh types can get a shot in.) [email protected] Leftovers EV's SpDef: 255, Def: 255 Nature: Calm -Mean Look - - - [email protected] Leftovers EV's SpDef: 255, ??? Nature: ??? -Ice Beam -Surf -Recover - We will figure out natures, attacks, EV's after we pick all the pokemon. Now we need to decide on the last two pokemon. Do we want a Baton Passer, another wall, or an all around good pokemon? We will take any suggestions. Remember, we already have weaknesses to: Fire Fighting Ground Grass Elec Dark Ghost We want as few repeating weakness as possible. |
What we need in there is an annoyer. May I suggest Ludicolo which is a Grass/Water which is weak to only Bug (meh), Poison and Flying. It is one of the few Pokemon, Milotic and most bulky types have troble taking out. It laughs at all attempts of Surf and Ice Beam.
I also think we need a FLying type in there or a Pokemon with Levitate. |
I agree that we need a levitate, flying type, or a pokemon that is resistant to ground attacks. Someone with a Sweeping Garchomp could really hurt us. Ludicolo is OK. It has a shaky Def. Poisn Fang, Poisn Tail, X-Scissor is probably a OHKO. I think we use a Heracross. It is resistant the Ground attacks, Base Attack:125, Base SpDef: 95. We have Megahorn for Grass, Psychic, and Dark. Close Combat for Blissey, Earthquake for fire types, Rock Slide for flying types.
[email protected] ?? EV's Attack-255, ?? Nature: -Earthquake -Megahorn -Close Combat -Rock Slide |
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Here's my personal Choice Band setup: Metagross @ Choice Band Adamant Nature EVs: 252 Attack, 252 HP, 6 Speed - Meteor Mash - Earthquake - Thunder Punch/Explosion - Pursuit/Ice Punch (Metagross will often cause a switch, so Pursuit can do some serious damage, and maybe even a OHKO, as you then switch out against the one coming in). Magnet Rise is more of a novelty, BTW... but a Metagross without a Ground weakness is so much harder to take down, being that his ONLY weakness becomes Fire. It essentially becomes Levitating Bronzong, but with amazing Attack, which is why I mention it. You could even replace Explosion/Thunder Punch with it. If you're lucky enough to Agility AND use Magnet Rise, it's nearly a clean sweep for Metagross, as Earthquake will take care of most Fire-using Pokes. |
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Maybe Skarmory in the set? It does Fly and be the overused Spiker. I still stand by Ludicolo. Sure those attacks can kill it but how many people would really leave it out to get KOED?
It is a perfect staller again bulky Pokemon. (especially water types) |
Ok, how is this set up Richard Steel.
Metagross @ Choice Band Adamant Nature EVs: 252 Attack, 252 Speed, 6 HP. - Meteor Mash - Earthquake - Thunder Punch - Magnet Rise/Explosion Personally, i dont like Magnet Rise. It only lasts for 5 turns, and even with Choice Band, it can get outrun and hit by an Earthquake. Metagross has a Defense instead of HP, so i think EV's should focus on speed if he is a sweeper. I am sorry about EV's mistake. The Serebii.net description didnt say anything about that. |
Ok, First the Salamence. I have no problem adding Salamence to the team. It would be a good flying type, good against Garchomp, except for Dragon moves (Salamence could outrun Garchomp anyway). It would be hard finding a GOOD team without repeating any weaknesses. Rock Slide is out, Stone Edge is in. If a Garchomp came out, i would switch to Milotic. You are right about Garchomp, most people run him with a Fire Fang. I think Milotic does its job of stalling, and Ludicolo is no good against protecting physical attacks. A good fighting type could take care of Ludicolo.
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Oh, and with Choice Band, it's customary never to use a non-attacking move, like Agility or Magnet Rise. The only things I would change in that lineup is switch HP and Speed for EVs, and bag Magnet Rise in favor of Explosion. With Choice Band, Explosion is nearly a guaranteed OHKO, even on a Skarmory, who otherwise resists it. Choice Band Metagross is seriously a monster (one of the more feared CBers, if you ask me), and if played right he can sweep an entire team, despite not having acess to Swords Dance, or the likes. |
Ok, i agree 100%. This is the new lijne up for Metagross.
Metagross @ Choice Band Adamant Nature EVs: 252 Attack, 252 HP, 6 Speed - Meteor Mash - Earthquake - Thunder Punch - Explosion I've gotta say, thats a nice Metagross. |
Okay I am going to hammer out Milotic's Move Set.
-Ice Beam -Surf -Recover -Hypnosis Ice Beam is a given. Hit those dragons hard and cover her grass weakness. Surf is for STAB, so anything that doesn't resist it will be washed away. Recover over Aqua Ring because it is about quantity. If Milotic is going to take a hit from an electrical attack from a slow Pokemon it needs means of recovering the lost HP fast. Plus we already have Leftovers. Hypnosis because it goes in hand with Recover. Opponents cringe when their Pokemon is slumbering. Sure Mirror Coat is good and might get a nice KO over something but Milotic usually gets swept next turn from a revenge kill. Most people are also expecting Milotic to have Mirror Coat so they usually send out a Physical Sweeper to take care of her. |
On Ludicolo, that seems nice. With Swift Swim, it could be unmercifully fast, and with base 90 sp.att, and pretty good type in my opinion, it could be of use.
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Ludicolo is nice. Not to mention it covers other weaknesses not already taken. It is meant to be a Drainer/Annoyer. Ludicolo isnt supposed to be put up against Physical Sweepers anyways. With Leech Seed and a combination of Toxic to top it off with Leftovers Ludicolo can easily sap opponents into submission.
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I gotta agree that is a nice Metagross but (maybe it's just me) see more of a down side to using a Choice Band, I just don't like the idea of having to use the same move over and over again. Sicne we're focusing a lot on HP, what about a Life orb, I don't know how much it decreases HP but it'd give us a chance to use more of a variety and beready for a baton passer.
Just my opinion, it's already very intimidating. |
I too am not a fan of Choice Bands. Life Orb only takes down about 10% of the HP so I would go with that. Explosion can compliment this because once Metagross looks like it can take no more send if off with a good bang.
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So you're sayin' use Metagross till you can't use 'im no more with Life Orb, then pull a kamikaze? Not bad, since he's built to pull that off.
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Sorry, I posted too late. what are we up to now?
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First, let me start by saying that i have never met a person who likes Milotic more than Punishment. I put in Hypnosis, i know you really like that move (i have read those same two paragraphs in many differnet threads). I will put in Ludicolo if someone can give me a GOOD moveset for him. I still am not even sure about Ludicolo, but if you guys put faith in him, then we will try.
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Ludicolo-Swift Swim
Energy Ball Surf Leech Seed Rain Dance/Substitute I don't really know if this is a great moveset, but I believe so. Rain Dance for speed boost, or Substitute for Staller tactics. Then again, The last time I used him was in Emerald. |
Milotic is my favorite Pokemon after all.
A moveset for Ludicolo could go like this. This is the stall/wall/annoyer set by the way. Ludicolo @ Leftovers Calm | Rain Dish -Rain Dance/Ice Beam/Surf/Energy Ball/Grass Knot/Giga Drain -Leech Seed -Toxic -Substitute The reason I chose Rain Dish over Swift Swim is because if it is to be an annoyer it doesnt need the speed. Rain Dance is something nice people overlook these days especially with all the Tyranitars running around with Sandstorms. A nice way to counter the effect and set up for Milotic. Of course we can drop Rain Dance altogether for Ice Beam, Surf, Energy Ball, Giga Drain or Grass Knot. |
I'm not a big fan of Ludicolo I'd rather have one of the R/S/E fossils, better move pool IMO. I say all three arn't "worthy"
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I will replace choice band with Life orb. I dont like Leech Seed. Mabye a Toxic instead, but i really dont like Leech Seed. If he does use Toxic, then he needs to be more defensive.
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Leech Seed and Toxic tobether makes a pretty good combo, but if we are looking for another annoyer/staller, how about Crobat?
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Leech Seed is a good recovery move in itself. It can drain up to 1/8 of your opponents. Think about the amount it would take off a Blissey. Not to mention Toxic is at its disposal.
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Whoops I guess I am taking this into a really situational scene. Well I'd do awesome damage against a Blissey if it was the last Pokemon. Hmm well there must be better annoyers out there.
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I did say Crobat...I find him annoying when I battle him...
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Yeah Crobat would do. It is part flying and really speedy. Not to mention annoying. I noticed this team lacks a naturally speedy Pokemon. We may need one of those an Crobat fits the description.
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I will gladly agree to a Crobat. We do need a fast pokemon, and it is part flying. I also want more opinions on the Heracross idea. If you dont want Heracross, just post why. I know somone commented on it earlier. Here is the updated list:
[email protected] Life Orb EV's: Attack-252, HP-252, Speed-6 Nature: Adamant -Meteor Mash -Thunder Punch -Earthquake -Explosion [email protected] Choice Specs EV's SpAttack-252, Speed-252, HP-6 Nature: -Tri-Attack -Dark Pulse or Nasty Plot -Ice Beam -Psychic [email protected] Leftovers EV's SpDef: 252, Def: 252, HP: 6 Nature: Calm -Mean Look - - - [email protected] Leftovers EV's SpDef: 252, ??? Nature: ??? -Ice Beam -Surf -Recover -Hypnosis [email protected] EV's Speed: 252, Attack: 252, HP: 6 Nature:?? - - - - I dont know the usual moves for Crobat so you will have to fill me in. |
How about:
Crobat Adamant Nature -Cross Poison -Brave Bird -X-Scissor -Steel Wing Maybe? Or you could use Hypnosis and Roost |
Crobat-Adamant
Posion Fang/Cross Poison Haze Confuse Ray/Mean Look Aerial Ace/Mean Look This set is both annoying and effective, in my opinion. Poison Fang for STAB and Toxic chance. Haze is truly annoying, and most importantly, annoying. Confuse Ray for more annoyance, Aerial Ace for additional attacking move. Either could be exchanged with Mean Look, to further annoy & cripple EDIT: Espeon Master just reminded me, Cross Poison could work instead of Poison Fang, but it loses the chance to Toxic. |
Ok updated moveset for Crobat. If you dont like it, just post the change and why. We still need a last pokemon. I like Heracross. I also think we could use a baton passer. Scizor?
[email protected] Life Orb EV's: Attack-252, HP-252, Speed-6 Nature: Adamant -Meteor Mash -Thunder Punch -Earthquake -Explosion [email protected] Choice Specs EV's SpAttack-252, Speed-252, HP-6 Nature: -Tri-Attack -Dark Pulse or Nasty Plot -Ice Beam -Psychic [email protected] Leftovers EV's SpDef: 252, Def: 252, HP: 6 Nature: Calm -Mean Look - - - [email protected] Leftovers EV's SpDef: 252, ??? Nature: ??? -Ice Beam -Surf -Recover -Hypnosis Crobat-Adamant EV's Attack- 252, Speed-252, Hp-6 -Posion Fang -Haze -Mean Look -Aerial Ace/Confuse Ray |
Scizor to me is the ultimate baton passer. He could pass Swords Dance, Agility, and Iron Defence.
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Well then we can't have a Crobat. If we add Scizor as cool as he is then half the team would have a glaring weakness to Fire.
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So you're saying that Scizor can take Crobat's place? No scarcasm, I'm just confused. And I didn't even notice our little fire weakness.
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I'm saying if we plan to include two of these Pokemon: Metagross, Crobat, Scizor, one of them has to go. Half the time is weak to fire which can be exploited.
I'm not trying to suggest Scizor takes Crobats place. We all want to keep Metagross so it is either Scizor or Crobat that has to go. Personally I dont think we need Scizor. (as great as he is) |
Oh yes, yes yes. We have five, and need one more. My mistake. This is kinda fun, everyone coming up with a great team (which we probably won't use ourselves)
So, on Heracross,how bout this Heracross-Guts Adamant Megahorn Close Combat/Brick Break Pursuit Stone Edge With this, it could sweep through almost anything, but don't we have a sweeper? |
all right we have some decisions to make. We have several pokemon to chose from. As Punishment said, we can only have one of these pokemon, due to the weaknesses to fire. We will not have more than two pokemon with the same weakness. Here are the pokemon:
Scizor (Baton Pass) HP-70 A-130 D-100 SA-55 SD-80 S-65 Crobat (Annoyer/Speed) HP-85 A-90 D-80 SA-70 SD-80 S-130 Heracross (Attack Sweeper) HP-80 A-125 D-75 SA-40 SD-95 S-85 Its funny how all of these pokemon are from the Johto Region. The reason i suggested Heracross was because i wanted to find a decent pokemon that could resist ground attacks. I have posted the Base Stats for each of these pokemon. i think that we should go with either Heracross or Scizor. Crobat is fast and annoying, but he is unable to compete with pokemon like Dragonite, Milotic, plus many people run steel types, and i hate how poison cant even effect them. |
We can go with Scizor but even if we choose Heracross along with it we still have half the team weak to fire. Metagross, Scizor and Heracross. We need something with speed so I am going to suggest a Garchomp.
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I only meant for us to chose one of those pokemon on that list. Garchomp would be a good pokemon for the last choice. We could have Salamence and Dragonite for that matter. I do think it should be at least part dragon, seeing as we dont have one of those yet. Since we will probably have at least two pokemon weak against fire, we should balance it out with many pokemon resistant to fire(i.e. Dragon type).
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Okay I noticed that Dusknoir doesn't have a move set and we don't have a designated annoyer.
So how bout -Curse -Confuse ray/Calm Mind -Toxic -Shadow Punch and we change his nature from Calm to Sassy, which raises Sp.Def and lowers Speed. |
I am gonna go with Scizor. He is only weak to Fire and his Defense and Attack stats are great. Heracross is weak to flying and fire etc.
As for the last Pokemon I nominate Garchomp definately. This team needs Speed and he has it. |
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Edit:Garchomp's base speed stat is only 2 better than Salamences, 100 to 102, he is better defensively though, but water attacks do normal damage. |
I was wondering why you guys wanted a annoyer. Dusknoir is an annoyer, he just also makes a great wall. His moveset should probably be:
[email protected] Leftovers EV's Def-252, SpDef-252, HP-6 Nature: Sassy -Curse -Mean Look -Rest -Shadow Punch Or Confuse Ray He does not need Toxic because by the time toxic kicks in, he will already be killed by Curse. (1/4) of HP each turn. Mean Look makes it so he cant run from Curse (Muhahahah). Rest so that he can get healed after Curse. Shadow Punch or Confuse Ray to shave off more HP or to annoy even more. |
If we do go with Salamence I did always like the Draco Meteor one. I went up against one and it completely dented my teams walls. All it does it hit and run but still enough to cripple teams.
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Curse Mean Look Rest/Confuse Ray Shadow Punch And just a random thought here, we could get a speedy pokemon like Ninjask/Crobat/Weavile as a fifth with Sunny Day and then throw a Salamence out there as a sixth with Solarbeam to take care of any pesky Milotics. I'm not going to serious with this just something that could be grown apon. Edit: Woops got Salamence mixed up with Arcanine, Salamence can't learn Solarbeam, ignore^^ |
This is a tough choice. On the one hand, Salamence is uneffected by ground attacks, has DD under his belt, and honestly, he looks better than Garchomp. On the other hand, Garchomp has one less weakness than Salamence, and has more speed (even if it is only a little). If we go with Scizor, we should go with Salamence. If we go with Crobat or Heracross, then we go with Garchomp.
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I personally find Heracross very overrated. Ice moves are more effective on Salamence but because of Garchomp ground types some moves that are ussually not very efective are of normal effect.
My main reason for posting, whats DD? |
I agree Mr.May16. We will go with Rest. Confuse Ray is fun to do to people, but it is only useful 50% of the time. Final Choice:?
[email protected] Leftovers EV's Def-252, SpDef-252, HP-6 Nature: Sassy -Curse -Mean Look -Rest -Shadow Punch |
Metagross
Porygon-Z Dusknoir Milotic Scizor/Heracross/Crobat/Weavile Salamence/Garchomp What looks scarier? |
I would just like to add that Dusknoir could doom a Blissey. Not even Aromatherapy can cure a curse. It can use softboiled all it wants, its not going to win.
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Nothing Mr.May 16, Nothing. This is the line up i think we should use.
Dusknoir Milotic Metagross Porygon-Z Scizor Salamence Once again. Nothing. |
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Lookin at this makes me sad, makes me miss the Salamence my brother traded when he stoll my Pearl, but anyways I think we've made a scary team. Now we need move sets for Salamence and Scizor. |
Does Salamence still do the Dragon Dance thing?
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We will wait till the other usualls have a chance to respond. It took a while but i think we made some good choices. Plus, besides the sticky threads, we have the most popular string on this topic. I am going to change my trainer card to fit the team we made if the others agree.
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Well do we want to go with the Physical Sweeping Salamence or the Hit and Run Draco Meteor-mence. Personally I'd go with the Draco Meteor Salamence. Being the first Pokemon it can just use Draco Meteor heavily damaging what is out in front of it. If the opponent is smart they'd swithc out their crippled Pokemon. Basically that is when we pull Salamence out and rest the field with Dusknoir.
As for one of Dusknoir's moves... why isn't Will-o-Wisp one of them? It can basically stop all Physical Sweepers in their tracks. I also agree on the team we have chosen. A sCizor would setup a Porygon-Z perfectly. |
The reason Dusknoir doesnt have wil-o-wisp is because it is unnessary with Curse on hand.
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But what else would Dusknoir do after it does Mean Look and Curse? It would just sit there and wait for the Pokemon to die.
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