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-   -   Banned/Cheap Moves and Pokemon? (https://www.pokecommunity.com/showthread.php?t=96099)

thread_killer July 27th, 2007 10:13 AM

Banned/Cheap Moves and Pokemon?
 
What Pokemon and moves are banned in competitive play or considered "cheap"? Like Double Team, Wobbuffet...

Smarties-chan July 27th, 2007 10:24 AM

Pokémon that are banned from standard play:

Arceus
Groudon
Kyogre
Rayquaza
Palkia
Dialga
Giratina
Lugia
Ho-oh
Mewtwo
Mew
Latias
Latios
Wobbuffet
Deoxys
Darkrai

That's about it for the Ubers list. As for banned moves:

Minimize
Double Team
Horn Drill
Sheer Cold
Fissure

sims796 July 27th, 2007 10:25 AM

And Gullotine. Don't forget Gullotine

Towlie July 27th, 2007 12:03 PM

Hax items too.

Quick Claw
Brightpowder
Scope Lens
Razor Claw
Razor Fang

Lots others I missed.

Shiraishi July 27th, 2007 7:15 PM

I use hax items as fillers sometimes..WHY WONT THE DUDE GIVE ME WISE GLASSES..

Darkw00t July 27th, 2007 7:24 PM

what about Endeavor? I think It's basically cheap..

Smarties-chan July 27th, 2007 11:49 PM

Quote:

what about Endeavor? I think It's basically cheap..
Maybe you think it's cheap, but Endeavor doesn't rely on luck. Endeavor requires skill to be truly effective and Endeavor can only be used to take down one Pokémon unless your opponent has no clue about what he/she is doing.

Kraka-chan July 27th, 2007 11:53 PM

I know about the Uber Pokemon. But what about the illegal moves and items?
<curious>

MKDS_PoKE July 28th, 2007 12:33 AM

Pokemon (only banned from plays that aren't uber):

Arceus
Groudon
Kyogre
Rayquaza
Palkia
Dialga
Giratina
Lugia
Ho-oh
Mewtwo
Mew
Latias
Latios
Wobbuffet
Deoxys
Darkrai

Moves:

Minimize
Double Team
Horn Drill
Sheer Cold
Fissure
Guillitine

Items:

Quick Claw
Brightpowder
Scope Lens
Razor Claw
Razor Fang

Marcy_11 July 28th, 2007 12:36 AM

oo i didnt realise razor claw was banned whys that?

MKDS_PoKE July 28th, 2007 12:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marcy_11 (Post 2677207)
oo i didnt realise razor claw was banned whys that?

It raises the chance of critical hits, which is hax.

Azonic July 28th, 2007 3:39 AM

Manaphy is also banned, I'm not too sure the Latis are Uber but they are banned sometimes

Marcy_11 July 28th, 2007 5:17 AM

Sorry but what is a hax? o.O

Nightofshadow July 28th, 2007 7:35 AM

A hax is when something of very low chance of happening happens at the most unsuspecting time. Razor claw which raises critical hits used with a move that already has a high critical hit ratio AND Happens to have super luck is kinda haxy

Im not a noob July 28th, 2007 8:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nightofshadow (Post 2677605)
A hax is when something of very low chance of happening happens at the most unsuspecting time. Razor claw which raises critical hits used with a move that already has a high critical hit ratio AND Happens to have super luck is kinda haxy

Just because you guys can't stack up your team properly doesn't mean razor claws/scope lens should be banned :<


WAAAAAAAAAHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!! :<

RAZOR CLAW FOR LIFE :<<<<<<!!!!!!!!!

Lone--Wanderer July 28th, 2007 8:09 AM

But it's still a Hax item, so it is banned. Critical Hits can mean the difference between losing and winning a battle, and raising your chances for one is unfair and looked down upon. So it's hax, and is therefor banned. Put on your big girl panties and deal with it.

Towlie July 28th, 2007 8:11 AM

Yes. Let's just play pokemon so everything is based on luck. The one who has the most luck wins. Skill means nothing then.

Lone--Wanderer July 28th, 2007 8:16 AM

Indeed...luck altering is hax. The Pokemon games are based on strategy and skill, not luck. Critical Hits make sense, though, so the regular ratio for them, whatever it is, is fine.

sanjay120 July 28th, 2007 8:42 AM

Hax items aren't banned by anyone I know of, except for Pokerealm. And they ban everything haxy.

So, what's the difference between using Super Luck and using Scope Lens? With Super Luck, you're not even losing anything by switching traits. Sure, Pressure is good, but on a Pokemon like Absol Super Luck is the obvious better choice. With Scope Lens, you forfeit Leftovers, Choice Band, Salac Berry, or anything else you might want to use. It's the same as if you use Focus Energy. You sacrifice a moveslot to get a better CH chance. That's not banned.

I can kind of understand Quick Claw, but things that might use it (Rhyperior, Snorlax) really want Leftovers instead.

And what's so bad about Razor Fang? 10% flinch chance that doesn't stack with Serene Grace or other flinch moves isn't much.

EDIT: Manaphy shouldn't be uber. You wnat to say otherwise, get on Shoddy Battle right now and challenge me with it.

Jolt July 28th, 2007 8:44 AM

IMO, Luck plays a big part of the game, in addition to Strategy and skill. To "ban" items and moves because they alter luck is kind of stupid to me. So what if they raise your chance of doing something.. does it mean it'd happen? Why not ban Choice Scarf, Choice Band or Choice Specs while you're at it? These items make a Pokemon MUCH stronger than they should be. Hell, why not take out all equip items, and remove status effects from all moves that have a non-100% chance of it happening?
There are easily counters to these (Aerial Ace, Haze, Battle Armor, etc.), so perhaps if you're worried about them, you should come prepared for them.
These were put in the game for a purpose.. to be used. Ubers however, I will agree wholeheartedly with, since they are on a whole other ball park when it comes to power.

sanjay120 July 28th, 2007 8:47 AM

Not everything gets Battle Armor, not everything gets Haze, and the only thing that can really afford to sacrifice a moveslot for Aerial Ace is Gliscor. Maybe Weavile or Tyranitar, but they have much better things to do. The same could be said of Rapid Spin, but then again, most Rapid Spinners don't have better things to do. Besides, do you know what they could do? Devote two Pokemon to killing your hazer and DT up with the other 4. Double Team Skarmory? Aerial Ace fails. Blissey? Pulse Bomb and Shock Wave fail. Add to that that Roar and Whirlwind can miss, and Machamp's the only thing with No Guard, and you have an overcentralized metagame. Which is bad.

Choicers are easy to counter with prediction. Choice Scarf Water Spout Kyogre, as deadly as it is, is walled completely by Blissey, Shedinja, and other Kyogre. Not to mention anything with Water Absorb. Or Dry Skin. CB Earthquake is taken by flyers and levitaters with ease. CB Dragon Claw is nothing against Skarmory, Forretress, and Bronzong. Pretty much anything Choice Specs fails against Blissey, but even without her, all you need is prediction.

Towlie July 28th, 2007 8:56 AM

Luck doesn't play as much a part to pokemon as strategy does. Why not ban Choice items? How do they alter luck? It was lucky to have a greater speed than someone? No.

And about Battle armor. Yes let's all pack teams of Armaldos and Kabutops with battle armor, just so we won't get critical hits against us!

And now we don't only need to counter all the OU pokemon to make a good team, but we now have to counter any pokemon with Double Team too. Oh but wait, now if my pokemon with Haze gets KOed, I can't stop double team. Oh, I better make a team of Blastoise/Weezing/Vaporeon/Crobat/Quagsire/Honchkrow. Oh crap, now I can get hit by critical hits now! Darn.

sims796 July 28th, 2007 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MKDS_PoKE (Post 2677209)
It raises the chance of critical hits, which is hax.

That is completly cheap. If a person is foolish enough to rely on luck, let them. Moves that force your opponents to rely on luck (Double Team) is another story, but not if I wanna rely on it myself.

pokejungle July 28th, 2007 11:10 AM

Shouldn't luck play a part though?

I would see an item that raises crit, plus leaf blade as being hard to deal with...but items like Quick Claw? It balances things out for pokemon like snorlax or slaking.

Towlie July 28th, 2007 11:20 AM

Example of quick claw:

Both of you have 1 pokemon left. Say you have a Weavile about to Brick Break a 20% health Snorlax. Snorlax's quick claw activates, and Returns you for the win. Sounds very fair.

By the way, Slaking isn't slow.
It's very fast.


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