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Old December 5th, 2017 (4:03 PM). Edited December 5th, 2017 by Disturbed.
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Disturbed Disturbed is offline
 
Join Date: May 2008
Age: 25
Posts: 1,746
HMs. What do you guys think about them? Do you think they are worth putting in hacks? Why or why not? Also, do you think making it easier for the players to make their Pokémon forget them is a good idea?

I also want to go into this saying that there is absolutely no right answer to this question. Everyone is completely entitled to their own opinions, as they might enjoy certain things differently than other people. This is less of a debate thread and more of a way to find out what other people think, and maybe this might be a good way to influence people's decisions when it comes to creating their own hacks, as they'll have further insight to what the populous thinks. I also want to say that I'd love to continue doing more of these discussions about topics similar to this one where there's no 'correct' answer. Also we totally could use the feedback of anyone, not just those making hacks.

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Anyways. I'll get the ball rolling with my own opinion and you all can tell me what you think while sharing your own opinions on the question at hand.

I think HMs play a very important role in hacks and Pokémon games in general. They serve as important gatekeepers. When you approach a route with Cut trees, and you don't have the Cut HM yet, the player will immediately understand that they'll be able to continue through this route whenever they acquire that HM. I feel like this is a better alternative than various things like, "Oh there's a blackout ahead!" or, "We're dancing here for literally no reason!"
Though, I also want to say, I don't like them being used as a gatekeeper for progressing through the main areas of the game more than one time. What I mean by that is, say you cannot continue with your adventure because of a Cut tree. Once you acquire Cut, you're able to proceed. I don't like the idea of requiring Cut in order to proceed after that point, however using Cut to block optional content is completely fine. Blocking optional content is another subject I wanted to touch upon, and is one of the reasons I love HMs. Cut and Rock Smash are functionally similar. They remove an impassable object from the game (temporarily, usually) and allow you to continue. They are also both weak moves when used in battle. Even having Pokémon on your team with them is usually less than ideal for the player, especially as you go further and further in your game. However, for dealing with that slight handicap on your team, you are rewarded with various things ranging from secret areas, shortcuts, and items that are all blocked behind these mediocre HMs. It gives the player a choice: Do I want to handicap my team slightly by teaching these crappy moves to my Pokémon to get all these cool things, or do I want to forgo using these moves, as I don't want my team handicapped in battle?

With the exception of Surf, I definitely think each field move HM (excluding Fly/Flash/Defog/whatever as well) should gatekeep the main quest only one time each, though I can see the argument for Strength being used multiple times, as it has unique interactions with creating puzzles.

Now, on the subject of having the player forget HMs... I think this is a bit silly. In Gen 3, you can't release the only Pokémon you have that knows a particular HM, like Surf for example. This is to prevent the player from ever becoming trapped, as they could easily do if they released their Fly and Surf Pokemon in Generation 1 on Cinnabar Island. Maybe if there was a way (and there probably is) of the game only letting you overwrite an HM onlyif you have another Pokémon with the HM already learned, I could see an argument for letting the players delete them then. Though, I also understand the argument of, "if you're given the freedom to delete them and you delete the only Pokemon in your party that knows Surf and you get trapped, that's your own fault." Though I don't like the idea of a player being able to trap themselves in the game.
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Anyways! Those are all my thoughts for right now. I really want to see what you all think.
Remember: Keep this civil. There are no right or wrong answers. Asking for explanations on people's reasoning is totally fine. This is less of a debate and more of a discussion. Be respectful of the opinions of others.
Looking forward to your answers!
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