The Champions League

However, moves still get depth. Now that there is more logic involved, of course some moves can't be used in specific situations. But you're still ignoring the fact that when you use Dig, it doesn't necessarily mean you have to attack. For example, in the battle against Paul in the Lily of the Valley Conference, Ash had Infernape use Dig and Flare Blitz so that the toxic spikes were neutralized. The example you used isn't about depth; it's about adding in some logic.

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Yeah sorry, I have a tendency to not answer the question asked and just write some thoughts of mine on any matter, be it closely related or not.

So, I'm actually wondering, who do you think would win? Cynthia or someone else?

I kind of like to lean on Lance, since he's a bit underrated and went unmentioned in this conversation. He's a pretty good battler and from the anime, he had a lot of noteworthy Pokemon and it's obvious he's strong. But I don't remember if the anime clearly stated that he was the Champion or not. Anyway, from the manga, he had a lot of powerful Pokemon during the end of the first arc of the Pokemon Special manga, though he did eventually lose.

Conversely, Cynthia has made a lot of anime appearances and is shown to be a really competent battler. So I think she wins in that department, but in the manga, she loses to Cyrus. I guess Cynthia would still beat Lance in the anime, though in the manga, I'm favoring Lance in that battle. The other Champions aren't too noteworthy in those regards, partially because their anime appearances are either nonexistent or slim, so I think the only competition is between Cynthia, Lance, and Alder. And I don't count Alder that much since he's too much of a hippie.

Anime-wise, we have seen less of Steven, so yeh. he sucks in that area. ****hia and Lance are both shown to be good battlers, though Lance's battling style was more old-school. If Lance's team could be updated to include real dragons, like Garchomp or Haxorus, it would be an epic battle between Cynthia and Lance. i mean, bothj are really mighty in their own right, and each has their own niche to fulfill. I am favoring Cynthia, but I am guessing if this battle happens in the anime, it will be a big tie.

In the anime, Red is Ash. I don't have high hopes for him... even though he does have a balance team and all, he isn't at that Champion level. In the manga, I guess Red would be one of the strongest. He's resourceful and yes, his team is quite balanced. But just because his team is balanced doesn't mean too much in other media; only in the games does it hold significance. In terms of battling, I'd definitely put Red up there. He did beat a few Elite Four members before he got injured, so he has a chance.

Anyway, this topic looks like it's nearly dried up D:

Do you think Frontier Brains are as strong as the Elite Four or even Champions?

Yay, Togekiss!

Anyway, I think Brandon deserves some kind of mention. He has a nice plethora of strong Pokemon and I thought he was a difficult Frontier Brain, not to mention his facility was hell. It was still fun though. In the anime, Ash took what, three tries to finally beat him?

Let's see. Several of the Frontier brains could actually give people a challenge as much as a normal gym Leader could, but when they are compared to the E4 and the champion, very few could be of that level. Bolded in are the ones that are comparable to them.

Anabel could be one. She possesses three legendary Pokemon plus a freaking Snorlax. This alone could gauge her ability as in par with... Wallace at the very least.

Brandon has two sets of legendary trio. If it is not powerful enough, [considering anime-wise] I do not know what is.

Palmer is the best of all the brains. I mean, look. He chooses nicely, employs different tactics, and is really strong. Plus he has the legendaries.

Dahlia has a good team, plus it is coupled with good attacks.

Darach I am not quite so sure. I could not judge him by the looks of his team, so yeah. Mixed emotions here.

Spencer is meh. His team has just too many drawbacks. Also is Noland, Argenta and Thorton. Do they even have their own Pokemon? Noland could pose a trouble with his Articuno but I am not sure. Tucker is just happy, though I compliment him on his choice of Pokemon. Same thing with Greta and Lucy.

I was wondering if you could include Darach, and I was tempted to mention him. He does work for Caitlin, who is an Elite Four member, so I'd imagine he would have a lot of battle experience backed up with those claims. Not to mention his Entei...

I bet Palmer would give Cynthia a run for her money. His Pokemon are pretty strong and his team could take down Cynthia's just as easily her's could take down his.

Yeah, but the problem with Regigigas is Slow Start and that really brings it down. If it can last, then that thing alone will dismantle Cynthia's team.

Definitely. Garchomp could take Dragonite, but the battle would be deathly close. It would be like that for the majority of the battle in my opinion. He totally could beat Cynthia. Their teams practically counter each other.

Haha, I can't imagine Cynthia as a Tower Tycoon or anything. She reminds me of Steven, but instead of rocks, she likes mythology. I bet she'd travel around and research. But that would totally make Platinum a lot more interesting, especially if you could see Barry battle and lose against his father.

They should totally do that, if they remake it. Cynthia in the Distortion World sounds creepy, but I bet she'd find Cyrus and they can keep each other company for a while haha. That sounds so... Cynthia-y. I'd hope that she'd have a ridiculously over leveled team.