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The Mathematics Club ~ *ΜΑΘ* ~

508
Posts
16
Years
Username: I like Pokemon (...)
Overall Education Level: I'm in Year 10 in England. I'm 14, going on 15.
Mathematics Education Level: Not much at all. Recently, we learned Sine and Cosine rule. I'm still rather young, so I haven't gotten much education. I'm self teaching (pre) calculus, though.
Do you think you can be asked for help in your level or lower?: Definitely, yes. I'm used to helping students in my class, and lower. Hell, if I know the topic, I might be able to help those higher XD.
What did Pi say to i and what did i say back to Pi?: "Get real", "Be rational".

Oh, I would LOVE to be a full-pledged member.

Oh, and Arc, I feel slightly betrayed T.T

I thought you might drop by sooner or later 8D Glad to see you here :D
Why do you feel betrayed? XP

Sine and cosine rule, as in sin a/a = sin b/b or as in lim (x->0) sin h/h = 1?
Self teaching... whoa

I still remember your aim to study everything you'd learn in college now and when you do get to college, you're going to annoy your lecturer with your weird questions. XD

Be rational, nice. XD
 
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MeerFall

Strong, Competitive, Cool!
254
Posts
13
Years
Username: meerfall
Overall Education Level: year 10
Mathematics Education Level: (surrpose to be) higher
Do you think you can be asked for help in your level or lower?: sure wynaut?
I wish i was a improper fraction so i can contain a great deal of you!

if you are an acute angle you are more then you seem
if you are an right angle you know where to turn
if you are an straight line you are as bright as the sun
if you are an obtuse angle you are big and full of ideas
if you are a reflex angle you can reach your true poltensal by beliving in yourself
if you are a 360 degree angle you are all of the above and more!
 
508
Posts
16
Years
I found a quote about maths and... love. XD

Math tells us 3 of the saddest love stories:
Of parallel lines, who are never meant to meet.
Of tangent lines, who were together once then parted forever.
And of asymptotes, who could only get closer and closer, but could never be together.
 
514
Posts
14
Years
  • Age 28
  • Seen Mar 29, 2017
I thought you might drop by sooner or later 8D Glad to see you here :D
Thanks to Zam.
Sine and cosine rule, as in sin a/a = sin b/b or as in lim (x->0) sin h/h = 1?
Self teaching... whoa
In school, the first one. I've learned about the second one on my own, it's to do with the Squeeze theorem, right? I wonder if I can remember enough to teach someone else the lim(x->0) sinx/x =1
I still remember your aim to study everything you'd learn in college now and when you do get to college, you're going to annoy your lecturer with your weird questions. XD
I'm slowly getting there.
At the moment, my aim is to do precalc, calc, maybe trig as well. If possible, I'd LOVE to go over non-euclidean geometry, or topology in general.
I wish i was a improper fraction so i can contain a great deal of you!

if you are an acute angle you are more then you seem
if you are an right angle you know where to turn
if you are an straight line you are as bright as the sun
if you are an obtuse angle you are big and full of ideas
if you are a reflex angle you can reach your true poltensal by beliving in yourself
if you are a 360 degree angle you are all of the above and more!
Aww, those are awesome.

Also, can someone explain to me how maths is taught in USA? Because it's very different from the English system, it seems.
 
37
Posts
13
Years
Also, can someone explain to me how maths is taught in USA? Because it's very different from the English system, it seems.

Well In my high school you first learn Algebra in 9th Geometry 10th Trigonometry 11th and pre calc 12th. (or if your like me Algebra in 8th, Geometry in 9th, Trigonometry 10th, Pre calc 11th, and I think calc 12th.
 

Cherrim

PSA: Blossom Shower theme is BACK ♥
33,267
Posts
21
Years
How's it taught in the English system?

In Canada, math doesn't branch out into separate topics until grade 12 (last grade). We learn a combination of algebra, geometry, trig, etc. until grade 11 and then it branches to... I forget what it is here in Ontario now. When I was in HS it was Calculus, Discrete Algebra, and Data Management. I think they merged the Discrete course and the Calculus course now (wtf).
 
514
Posts
14
Years
  • Age 28
  • Seen Mar 29, 2017
Well In my high school you first learn Algebra in 9th Geometry 10th Trigonometry 11th and pre calc 12th. (or if your like me Algebra in 8th, Geometry in 9th, Trigonometry 10th, Pre calc 11th, and I think calc 12th.
Ah, okay, that's a bit... odd. Is that ALL you learn in each grade?
How's it taught in the English system?
Throughout the year, we all learn different things. I'm only in year 10 (equivalent to... I THINK 9th grade) and yet I've already done trigonometry.
I wouldn't be able to properly explain how it works, though, since it seems to change JUST for my year group.
In Canada, math doesn't branch out into separate topics until grade 12 (last grade). We learn a combination of algebra, geometry, trig, etc. until grade 11 and then it branches to... I forget what it is here in Ontario now. When I was in HS it was Calculus, Discrete Algebra, and Data Management. I think they merged the Discrete course and the Calculus course now (wtf).
Well, actually, thinking about it, that's quite similar to what we do. But I don't know if it splits off in Year 13 (last grade for us).
 
18
Posts
13
Years
  • Age 30
  • USA
  • Seen Mar 15, 2011
math O.O

I LOVE MATH :D

May I join?

Username: Pikagirl3
Overall Education Level: 12th Grade in High School
Mathematics Education Level: regular math, Algebra I and II, Geometry (although not that good at geomertry ^^;), Advanced Functions and Modeling, and Discrete Math.
Do you think you can be asked for help in your level or lower?: Yuppers ^^
I wish I were a _______ so I could lay tangent to your curves:
Derivative ^^

Another Math Joke: (cause EVERYONE LOVES JOKES!)
-What do you get if you divide the circumference of a jack-o-lantern by its diameter? PUMPKIN PI XD
 

Spinor

<i><font color="b1373f">The Lonely Physicist</font
5,176
Posts
18
Years
  • Age 27
  • Seen Feb 13, 2019
Also, can someone explain to me how maths is taught in USA? Because it's very different from the English system, it seems.
Generally, 9th graders take Algebra I. In 10th grade, some schools elect Algebra 2, and others elect Geometry. 11th graders take the one not taken. In Texas, a course in Math modeling can be taken BEFORE Algebra 2 to satisfy the 4 credit requirement without taking math above Algebra 2. Otherwise, 12th Grade is most generally Pre-Calculus or Trigonometry. Pre-Calculus is more dominant. In the US, The College Board also has an AP program which allows schools to include Calculus AB, Calculus BC, and Statistics as classes. The state of Texas approves these AP courses for high school credit, allowing people to graduate with up to 7 math credits.

In my case, I'll be brooming Multivar Calculus, Vector Calculus, Differential Equations, Analysis, Non-Euclid Geo, and Topology before graduating from High school ^__^ Hopefully. Of course, this means I had to concurrently enroll with an university because there doesn't seem to be any high school that offers anything above Calculus II or a second course relating to Statistics.

In Canada, math doesn't branch out into separate topics until grade 12 (last grade). We learn a combination of algebra, geometry, trig, etc. until grade 11 and then it branches to... I forget what it is here in Ontario now. When I was in HS it was Calculus, Discrete Algebra, and Data Management. I think they merged the Discrete course and the Calculus course now (wtf).
;_; Ever since 8th grade ended, I've never been able to imagine a life without subjects split apart. Specialization and even choice was pretty good.
Another Math Joke: (cause EVERYONE LOVES JOKES!)
-What do you get if you divide the circumference of a jack-o-lantern by its diameter? PUMPKIN PI XD
That'd be a nice thing to tell during Halloween XD

And wow, so many people are joining already ^__^ So glad there's a significant population with an interest in math.
 

ShinyMeowth

Gone forever
397
Posts
13
Years
Even with AK47's explaination I still don't get how Mathematics is taught in the US. Etymologically, Precalculus means everything before Calculus, which would include 1st-grade education, like addition of single-digit numbers. Yet apparently people have somehow limited it to something between Algebra and Calculus, but adding the split of Algebra to Algebra I and Algebra II just confuses me even more.

On topic now, I love Mathematics. That's why I am definitely going to join this group.


Username: ShinyMeowth
Overall Education Level: 9th grade
Mathematics Education Level: No idea what course this would apply to, since I've been studying at home, but I have studied Calculus up to triple integration, in Cartesian, Cylindrical and Spherical coordinates, and am currently studying Probability.
Do you think you can be asked for help in your level or lower?: Sure, always glad to help.
I wish I were a _______ so I could lay tangent to your curves: Derivative.

Anyway, Now that I have finished watching every Pokemon episode aired so far, 6 hours per day have been freed in my life. I plan to use these hours to study more, and I am planning to study, and finish number theory and group theory before I get to the 10th grade.

Anyway, I would like to bring up a topic of conversation, what do you think of teachers teaching us incorrect rules that are to be removed or disproved later on? I personally have told my teacher off many times, but still she insists that negative numbers have no square root. My opinion is the same opinion I have about reproduction. Teachers should tell their students the truth, while leaving out unnecessary details. Teaching them something that is incorrect and even insisting on it when somebody refuses to take it? That is terrible teaching in my opinion.
 

Otherworld9)

Bard of Rage
1,951
Posts
13
Years
  • Age 27
  • honk
  • Seen Jan 5, 2014
TEACHERS

Anyway, I would like to bring up a topic of conversation, what do you think of teachers teaching us incorrect rules that are to be removed or disproved later on? I personally have told my teacher off many times, but still she insists that negative numbers have no square root. My opinion is the same opinion I have about reproduction. Teachers should tell their students the truth, while leaving out unnecessary details. Teaching them something that is incorrect and even insisting on it when somebody refuses to take it? That is terrible teaching in my opinion.

I agree with you on your method of choice, on how teachers teach you something that isn't true to begin with, or actually incorrect later on. Some people just take it, and then wonder how they got a question wrong when they completely did what they were taught? I think teachers should either go over their notes/lessons, or just tell the truth.
 

Cherrim

PSA: Blossom Shower theme is BACK ♥
33,267
Posts
21
Years
I disagree with insisting on it--if someone disagrees with it, teachers should go with the flow and sort of explain ahead a little bit if anyone's interested before going back to the curriculum.

In the case of negative fractions, I can see why they'd teach it that way. Quite often in the maths and sciences, they'll gloss over a lot of details and teach the general blanket rules before they start teaching the exceptions. I learnt that you couldn't take the root of a negative number and then a few years later (or later in the semester or the next year... I forget when I learnt square roots xD), we learnt about i and imaginary numbers. But for the most part, my experience is that a lot of people are only in math because their school requires it and for a LOT of people, tossing ~imaginary numbers~ into the mix just sounds silly and they can't grasp the material as easily so early on, or they just lose interest because "now it's getting ridiculous". :/ Sounds like you just have a bad teacher who thinks they have to follow the curriculum rigidly and with no wiggle room.

(Relatedly, I know I learnt about imaginary numbers in 11th grade math but apparently it's not even in the high school curriculum in my province anymore and I think that is unacceptable, nevermind just coming back to it later. <_<)
 
514
Posts
14
Years
  • Age 28
  • Seen Mar 29, 2017
Generally, 9th graders take Algebra I. In 10th grade, some schools elect Algebra 2, and others elect Geometry. 11th graders take the one not taken. In Texas, a course in Math modeling can be taken BEFORE Algebra 2 to satisfy the 4 credit requirement without taking math above Algebra 2. Otherwise, 12th Grade is most generally Pre-Calculus or Trigonometry. Pre-Calculus is more dominant. In the US, The College Board also has an AP program which allows schools to include Calculus AB, Calculus BC, and Statistics as classes. The state of Texas approves these AP courses for high school credit, allowing people to graduate with up to 7 math credits.
That... just sounds complicated.
The English system has a lot less room for choice, but we tend to cover a good variety of non-specific branches of mathematics. And then it depends on what course you take in university.

And wow, so many people are joining already ^__^ So glad there's a significant population with an interest in math.
I completely agree with you there.
Even with AK47's explaination I still don't get how Mathematics is taught in the US. Etymologically, Precalculus means everything before Calculus, which would include 1st-grade education, like addition of single-digit numbers. Yet apparently people have somehow limited it to something between Algebra and Calculus, but adding the split of Algebra to Algebra I and Algebra II just confuses me even more.
I think "Pre-calc" is more specific to "the things you'll need to learn before proper calculus, ignoring basic things that you've probably learnt like addition."

Anyway, I would like to bring up a topic of conversation, what do you think of teachers teaching us incorrect rules that are to be removed or disproved later on? Teaching them something that is incorrect and even insisting on it when somebody refuses to take it? That is terrible teaching in my opinion.
Ah, yes, I definitely have an opinion on this.
I always HATE it when my teacher says that something can't be done "you can't subtract a bigger number from a smaller number/you can't square root a negative number/etc." and then next year they contradict themselves.
If I were a teacher, I would specifically mention this but I wouldn't go into much detail, instead telling the student "if you want to know more, you can research it or ask me after lesson, but you won't need to know for this module". This way, students who WANT to know this learn it, and those who don't need to know it now, won't.
(Relatedly, I know I learnt about imaginary numbers in 11th grade math but apparently it's not even in the high school curriculum in my province anymore and I think that is unacceptable, nevermind just coming back to it later. <_<)
I've used imaginary numbers so much in my spare time, I don't even remember if the curriculum in England teaches it or not XD.

I have a question. I don't know how to do integrals yet, but I've seen that it can be used to find the volume of a sphere. Can this be done to find the area of a regular shape (something simple, like a triangle or a square) and more specifically, can it be used to find the area of a trapezium?
 

Spinor

<i><font color="b1373f">The Lonely Physicist</font
5,176
Posts
18
Years
  • Age 27
  • Seen Feb 13, 2019
Even with AK47's explaination I still don't get how Mathematics is taught in the US. Etymologically, Precalculus means everything before Calculus, which would include 1st-grade education, like addition of single-digit numbers. Yet apparently people have somehow limited it to something between Algebra and Calculus, but adding the split of Algebra to Algebra I and Algebra II just confuses me even more.
Don't think of Pre-Calculus as a branch of mathematics or the set of all math down to first grade math before calculus >__> Algebra is split into Algebra I and II mostly because high school algebra is a deep subject and does require two years of proper study. Algebra II is also pretty expanded from the concepts of Algebra I, which was much more introductory to get the algebraic thinking straight.

And Pre-calculus should be thought of as a superset to Algebra II. First semester it's just accelerated Algebra II with preparation for skills in calculus. Second semester gets more abstract and gives advanced trigonometry and other subjects like polar coordinates in preparation for common topics in Calculus. Obviously, trig is abused in calculus like a doll under a dog o_o And other skills are also learned to apply calculus in other ways later on.
Username: ShinyMeowth
Overall Education Level: 9th grade
Mathematics Education Level: No idea what course this would apply to, since I've been studying at home, but I have studied Calculus up to triple integration, in Cartesian, Cylindrical and Spherical coordinates, and am currently studying Probability.
Do you think you can be asked for help in your level or lower?: Sure, always glad to help.
I wish I were a _______ so I could lay tangent to your curves: Derivative.
Woah woah what?! XD You're kidding right?! Multivariable Calculus in the ninth grade?! Are you Asian? I think I'd understand if you're homeschooled and you've been emphasized mathematics. I'll say, I'm impressed.
Anyway, Now that I have finished watching every Pokemon episode aired so far, 6 hours per day have been freed in my life. I plan to use these hours to study more, and I am planning to study, and finish number theory and group theory before I get to the 10th grade.
Slow down, you're making me feel bad o__o
Anyway, I would like to bring up a topic of conversation, what do you think of teachers teaching us incorrect rules that are to be removed or disproved later on? I personally have told my teacher off many times, but still she insists that negative numbers have no square root. My opinion is the same opinion I have about reproduction. Teachers should tell their students the truth, while leaving out unnecessary details. Teaching them something that is incorrect and even insisting on it when somebody refuses to take it? That is terrible teaching in my opinion.
Giving the wrong information is bad. If you do wonder and ask, teachers should be obligated to explain a little bit. At the very least send you to the library to do your own research. The dilemma of the square root of a negative number wasn't introduced to me until later in Algebra. I did my own researching to clear the question, and I had to wait until second semester of Algebra II to be introduced to i. >__>

Then again, I also still remember my 3rd grade teacher saying a number can't be subtracted something larger than itself >__> They're called negative numbers, people. I swear, I was bored in elementary school all the time.



Such interesting stuff I'm noticing, that more and more people seem to be advanced in their math studies, yet there's also many that are just normal or behind. I do wonder if legislatures for education should consider 'raising the bar'. Maybe the standard should be that advanced math studies should begin in 7th grade. It doesn't require too much compression of pre-algebraic mathematics, since it's a simple 10 year to 8 year compression. And I am confident that people should be perfectly capable of understanding advanced mathematics at a young age. So let Algebra and Geometry be things of 7th and 8th grade, and we have ourselves Advanced Algebra, Pre-calculus/Trigonometry, Calculus I, and Calculus II before college. Would it be a good idea to have that be the norm?
 

Cherrim

PSA: Blossom Shower theme is BACK ♥
33,267
Posts
21
Years
My province outright lowered the bar. :/ Lots of idiots in standard schooling here.

(A lot of forum users are computer nerds who are more likely to be interested in math so you're gonna get a biased sample in this club. :P)
 

ShinyMeowth

Gone forever
397
Posts
13
Years
Don't think of Pre-Calculus as a branch of mathematics or the set of all math down to first grade math before calculus >__> Algebra is split into Algebra I and II mostly because high school algebra is a deep subject and does require two years of proper study. Algebra II is also pretty expanded from the concepts of Algebra I, which was much more introductory to get the algebraic thinking straight.

And Pre-calculus should be thought of as a superset to Algebra II. First semester it's just accelerated Algebra II with preparation for skills in calculus. Second semester gets more abstract and gives advanced trigonometry and other subjects like polar coordinates in preparation for common topics in Calculus. Obviously, trig is abused in calculus like a doll under a dog o_o And other skills are also learned to apply calculus in other ways later on.
Yeah, I can see how most of that works now.
Woah woah what?! XD You're kidding right?! Multivariable Calculus in the ninth grade?! Are you Asian? I think I'd understand if you're homeschooled and you've been emphasized mathematics. I'll say, I'm impressed.
Slow down, you're making me feel bad o__o
I have Asperger's. As a result, I have more advanced Mathematics skills than normal, but that is balanced out by my terrible Literature grades. I would love to be homeschooled, but unfortunately the Greek educational system is terrible, and there is no such thing here.
Then again, I also still remember my 3rd grade teacher saying a number can't be subtracted something larger than itself >__> They're called negative numbers, people. I swear, I was bored in elementary school all the time.
Wow, they refused to acknowledge negative numbers? That is like a billion times more ridiculous than ignoring imaginary ones.
Such interesting stuff I'm noticing, that more and more people seem to be advanced in their math studies, yet there's also many that are just normal or behind. I do wonder if legislatures for education should consider 'raising the bar'. Maybe the standard should be that advanced math studies should begin in 7th grade. It doesn't require too much compression of pre-algebraic mathematics, since it's a simple 10 year to 8 year compression. And I am confident that people should be perfectly capable of understanding advanced mathematics at a young age. So let Algebra and Geometry be things of 7th and 8th grade, and we have ourselves Advanced Algebra, Pre-calculus/Trigonometry, Calculus I, and Calculus II before college. Would it be a good idea to have that be the norm?
Actually, I completely disagree with that. Raising the bar, especially on obligatory lessons is bound to make people focused on other topics fall back and fail the grades. What should be done in my opinion, would be to allow students to unrestrictedly skip grades (No idea if that's done in the US already, but it certainly is not here), allow homeschooling globally, and finally, let people choose lesson paths before the 4th grade, and allow them to switch later on, effectively limiting the hours spent at school, without doing any harm to the amount of knowledge people actually get. I mean, seriously, I calculated that I've wasted about 8,500 hours in that dump since the first grade. And I've been taught what I could study myself in about 100 hours. Talk about a waste of time. Another thing that I believe could work, would be to completely scrap off the first 5 grades, and push everything you are taught in these to the 6th. You don't learn much there anyway, and most of what you do will be contradicted later on. I never paid any attention at elementary school, and I had no problem functioning in the 7th grade at all.
 

Pokemon Trainer Touko

春野サクラ ♥
1,712
Posts
13
Years
Username: Pokemon Trainer Touko
Overall Education Level: Year 8
Mathematics Education Level: I study in Hong Kong so we have a different system. I might be the youngest here but I can beat year elevens :3 I've tried multivariate calculus and it wasn't that hard =]
Do you think you can be asked for help in your level or lower?: I guess so :D
I wish I were a _______ so I could lay tangent to your curves: Derivative

Please don't smash me with super hard stuff- I'm only 12 ~~
 

ShinyMeowth

Gone forever
397
Posts
13
Years
=:3 I've tried multivariate calculus and it wasn't that hard =]
I'm only 12 ~~
And now I can't boast at my school without feeling horrible anymore :P. Anyway, in the words of AK47, I'm impressed. Welcome to the Mathematics club, hope enjoy your stay :D
 
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514
Posts
14
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  • Age 28
  • Seen Mar 29, 2017
Woah woah what?! XD You're kidding right?! Multivariable Calculus in the ninth grade?! Are you Asian? I think I'd understand if you're homeschooled and you've been emphasized mathematics. I'll say, I'm impressed.
Slow down, you're making me feel bad o__o
The beautiful and dreadful thing about maths is that as long as you have a logical mind, EVERYTHING in math can be made easy. Honestly. The reason why you have those child prodigies who can do Uni level maths at the age of 5 is because they have a logical mind, and their parents allowed them to do that.
I know for certain that everyone in this club, if they had been given the opportunity, would be like the prodigies I mentioned. That's the beauty of maths; if I want to, I can learn anything I want as early as I want, unless it develops on some other branches (like calculus and trig).
The "dreadful" bit is that some ARE allowed to do higher level work much earlier than others who could, but aren't allowed. Take the example of ShinyMeowth and Pokemon Trainer Touko, they were allowed to do calculus and such at a young age, and we're feeling bad XD

AdvancedK47 said:
Such interesting stuff I'm noticing, that more and more people seem to be advanced in their math studies, yet there's also many that are just normal or behind. I do wonder if legislatures for education should consider 'raising the bar'. Maybe the standard should be that advanced math studies should begin in 7th grade. It doesn't require too much compression of pre-algebraic mathematics, since it's a simple 10 year to 8 year compression. And I am confident that people should be perfectly capable of understanding advanced mathematics at a young age. So let Algebra and Geometry be things of 7th and 8th grade, and we have ourselves Advanced Algebra, Pre-calculus/Trigonometry, Calculus I, and Calculus II before college. Would it be a good idea to have that be the norm?
Here's the thing.
Obviously, mathematics and literacy are INCREDIBLY important for getting jobs, correct? If you can't read/write or do arithmetic, then, well, you're screwed.
But when you reach the age of, say, 14-15 at school, what you learn isn't really all that important for the average worker. Why do I need to learn to analyse a book, or learn quadratics? I don't.
I think that all the really important things should really be pushed until Year 9 (which is the final year, in England, that all subjects are compulsory). After that, it should really be optional. Of course, others would disagree.
I might be the youngest here but I can beat year elevens :3 I've tried multivariate calculus and it wasn't that hard =]
Please don't smash me with super hard stuff- I'm only 12 ~~
Mhm, like mentioned before, as long as you have someone that can explain every step and a logical mind, stuff like this can be taught to 12 year olds Unless you're going to tell me you learnt it when you were 8?
 

Otherworld9)

Bard of Rage
1,951
Posts
13
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  • Age 27
  • honk
  • Seen Jan 5, 2014
Skipping

(No idea if that's done in the US already, but it certainly is not here)

Being in Florida, my school is going to start doing that due to too many students getting a very low education and low skills in both math and literature. It hasn't started yet, but the principal did announce that if it were to happen(I only know it will happen in my middle school), yet he also mentioned it might not happen due to the economy. If it were though, 6th graders could skip to 7th and so on....as of skipping by will, I don't know much of that stuff, I'm still in research and barely turned 14 years old.
 
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