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  #1576    
Old December 5th, 2011 (12:10 PM).
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[SIZE="a"]"Human Equality Club" sounds too politcal, imo. Rainbow Club sounds fine.[/SIZE]
  #1577    
Old December 5th, 2011 (12:26 PM).
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That was less of a suggestion, and more of me trying to say that it's nearly impossible to include everyone in a name without being somewhat political in nature. "The People's Thread," "Human Alliance," "The United Sexualties and Gender Identies of Planet Earth," etc. See what I mean?

Though I'd still be a member here regardless of whatever name Shining Raichu decides. Call it "Pudding Lovers Alliance" and I'd still be posting here. Because we're more than a name. ^^
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  #1578    
Old December 5th, 2011 (12:36 PM).
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[SIZE="a"]It seems that in our efforts to not exclude anyone, we're moving away from the purpose of this thread as an LGBT-based group.[/SIZE]
  #1579    
Old December 5th, 2011 (12:54 PM).
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I agree with Alakazam that the name doesn't really mean much. I just hope we get something rainbow related. xD
Quote:
Originally Posted by FreakyLocz14 View Post
"Human Equality Club" sounds too politcal, imo.
You keep saying that but I fail to see what's political about people living together in harmony. :/
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#077: Ponyta - The Fire Horse Pokémon
Fire ~ Field eggs
3'03" ~ 66.1lbs ~ 50/50

Its hooves are 10 times harder
than diamonds. It can trample
anything completely flat in moments.

Abilities: Run Away or Flash Fire or Flame Body
Moves: Growl, Flame Wheel, Stomp, Agility
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jp: ポニータ (Ponyta)
de: Ponita
fr: Ponyta
cn: 小火馬 (Xiǎohuǒmǎ)


  #1580    
Old December 5th, 2011 (1:08 PM).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ineffable~ View Post

You keep saying that but I fail to see what's political about people living together in harmony. :/
Some people can easily see that as being politically charged or motivated. I know you don't mean it that way, but still.
  #1581    
Old December 5th, 2011 (1:25 PM).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FreakyLocz14 View Post
Some people can easily see that as being politically charged or motivated. I know you don't mean it that way, but still.
Ehh, if someone else has their mind so involved in that kind of thing that that's all they can see, I think that's their problem. I mean, no offense and all, seriously no offense but it's impossible to avoid every single feasible secondary implication. If we don't mean it politically, then it's not political, regardless of what someone thinks the words mean. Equality is a good thing. It's not a Republican/Democrat thing; it's just a thing. A thing that I hope most people want regardless of political ideology.


NOTE: Okay I think maybe my post sounded a bit rude; sorry about that if it happened but I'm trying really hard to make a point here.
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#077: Ponyta - The Fire Horse Pokémon
Fire ~ Field eggs
3'03" ~ 66.1lbs ~ 50/50

Its hooves are 10 times harder
than diamonds. It can trample
anything completely flat in moments.

Abilities: Run Away or Flash Fire or Flame Body
Moves: Growl, Flame Wheel, Stomp, Agility
Locations: Pokémon Mansion

Cry

Other names:

jp: ポニータ (Ponyta)
de: Ponita
fr: Ponyta
cn: 小火馬 (Xiǎohuǒmǎ)


  #1582    
Old December 5th, 2011 (1:43 PM).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ineffable~ View Post

Ehh, if someone else has their mind so involved in that kind of thing that that's all they can see, I think that's their problem. I mean, no offense and all, seriously no offense but it's impossible to avoid every single feasible secondary implication. If we don't mean it politically, then it's not political, regardless of what someone thinks the words mean. Equality is a good thing. It's not a Republican/Democrat thing; it's just a thing. A thing that I hope most people want regardless of political ideology.


NOTE: Okay I think maybe my post sounded a bit rude; sorry about that if it happened but I'm trying really hard to make a point here.
I'm not commenting on if it's good or bad, just how some people might she it as a political thing. This should be a support group, not a political group, no matter how well-intentioned it is.

I could also argue how equality is not always a good thing, but that's best saved for another thread.
  #1583    
Old December 5th, 2011 (2:38 PM).
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    The human equality club is just way too vague as well. Like Freaky said, this is a LGBT and supporters club. It is too diffuse to try to cater to every type of inequality in a thread. We would have religion, gender, race, weight, age, height, nationality, income, disabilty, IQ, and tons of other issues that related to inequalities. You just want to focus on this one area that is more than enough for one thread to handle. Anyway, this name thing is starting to consume the discussion, lol.

    So shows like Glee, Modern Family, Buffy the Vampire Slayer, and everything on LOGO, that feature gay characters/protagonists are becoming more popular, but I have heard mixed reviews from LGBT and straight people alike.

    Do gay television characters help "nomalize" and/or portray LGBT people well or do you think they further sterotypes and/or negativity, or a bit of both?

    I personally think that Curt from Glee is a bit stereotypical, but honestly, some stereotypical qualities often reflect at least some of the population they ascribe to. Not to mention the show balances it out with a wide vareity of gay characters from Karofsky, to Blaine, to Sebastian. Show on LOGO, feature mainly gay characters and people(reality shows). Although some of the shows me be a bit campy and over-the-top, they also include more dry humor and drama in other shows.

    I think that most shows do a decent job when they include gay characters. However, especially in movies, there will be one or two scenes with a gay character purely for comedic affect. Or look at SNL, I would say that about 50% of all their sketches were LGBT humor. I mean, I am all for racial, sexual orientation, or gender included in comedy, but once you beat me over the head with it, it crosses a line. ...Sidenote, SNL is not funny anymore without Tina Fey.

    One last comment, I think that transgender people are often excluded from shows and movies unless they are some type of sideshow to laugh at. I guess since I am not transgender I often overlook that, but it is very unfortunate and I hope more shows start to include transgender people.
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      #1584    
    Old December 5th, 2011 (3:23 PM).
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    I was awaiting a topic besides the name!

    Do gay television characters help "nomalize" and/or portray LGBT people well or do you think they further sterotypes and/or negativity, or a bit of both?

    Well, it often depends on how they are portrayed. CSI, in particular, has mostly had homosexuals as victims of violent crimes, with only one instance of a character's homosexuality not being of any relevance to the crime at hand. This is not exactly the portrayal the community is looking for, in my opinion. Glee, on the other hand, is going in the right direction.

    On the transgender bit, I'll have to agree. There are hardly any transgender characters out there, at least that I've heard of. I do remember hearing about a male transgender character on Degrassi, so there is that. But I can't think of any others off the top of my head, and no instances of a female transgender character.
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      #1585    
    Old December 5th, 2011 (3:24 PM).
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    I think media portrayals of LGBT stereotypes are a mixed bag. While they do help normalize those behaviors, they also send the message that this is what all or most LGBT people are like.
      #1586    
    Old December 5th, 2011 (5:58 PM).
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    Quote:
    Originally Posted by -ty- View Post
    One last comment, I think that transgender people are often excluded from shows and movies unless they are some type of sideshow to laugh at. I guess since I am not transgender I often overlook that, but it is very unfortunate and I hope more shows start to include transgender people.
    I definitely see this, and I've complained about it before, but to be honest I also understand how it's a very hard thing to portray tastefully in a television show.
    There is an FTM on Degrassi, which i love. I think it's a step in the right direction.
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    #077: Ponyta - The Fire Horse Pokémon
    Fire ~ Field eggs
    3'03" ~ 66.1lbs ~ 50/50

    Its hooves are 10 times harder
    than diamonds. It can trample
    anything completely flat in moments.

    Abilities: Run Away or Flash Fire or Flame Body
    Moves: Growl, Flame Wheel, Stomp, Agility
    Locations: Pokémon Mansion

    Cry

    Other names:

    jp: ポニータ (Ponyta)
    de: Ponita
    fr: Ponyta
    cn: 小火馬 (Xiǎohuǒmǎ)


      #1587    
    Old December 5th, 2011 (10:27 PM).
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    Do gay television characters help "normalize" and/or portray LGBT people well or do you think they further sterotypes and/or negativity, or a bit of both?

    I think they do leaps and bounds to normalise homosexuality. I especially liked the way it was done in Buffy the Vampire Slayer. Willow, the main gay protagonist, who had no idea she was gay and had a boyfriend in Seasons 2 and 3, found a girl that she became fast friends with due to their mutual interest in witchcraft. Then the two grew closer and you could feel the romantic chemistry between them building until they finally kissed. It was done just like any other relationship and it flowed so smoothly that the fact that they were both women didn't even cross my mind until a particular scene in which Willow 'came out' to Buffy.

    It was done similarly well with Callie and Arizona in Grey's Anatomy. Again, the writers treated it just as they would any heterosexual couple on the show, and the fact that it was a gay couple was really a non-issue. I really like it when things are done that way, it sort of brings to mind the saying "be the change you want to see in the world".

    As to whether they push stereotypes, yeah, sometimes they do. Particularly in comedies. Modern Family's Mitchell and Cameron, Will & Grace's Jack McFarland and Glee's Kurt Hummel are great examples of this. Though personally I don't know whether that's actually such a bad thing. We need to be realistic, and the fact of the matter is this: some gay people do fit the stereotypes. And more to the point, there is not a damn thing wrong with that. If the characters on these shows can unashamedly face the world, why can't their real-life counterparts?

    The thing about the stereotypical gays in comedy is that it arguably does more for the gay community than anything else. I was raised in a household that while not exactly outspokenly homophobic, had the attitude of "ew that's a bit gross" to the idea of two men or two women (well lets face it, two men moreso) being together. So I shared that attitude, just as most kids do when their parents express an opinion. This was until I was introduced to Will & Grace. I think I was like 8 years old and my whole family got hooked on it because it's absolutely hilarious. We all loved the stereotypical Jack and I figured out that there was nothing ew or gross about a man that could make me laugh that much. I credit Will & Grace exclusively for making me non-homophobic, and furthermore for letting me know that it's OK to be gay long before I figured out that I was.

    I think my mental reaction of "Huh. Well alright then." would have been drastically different without such a groundbreaking show.
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      #1588    
    Old December 6th, 2011 (8:55 AM).
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    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Alakazam17 View Post
    Well, it often depends on how they are portrayed. CSI, in particular, has mostly had homosexuals as victims of violent crimes, with only one instance of a character's homosexuality not being of any relevance to the crime at hand.
    To be a little more fair, most people on CSI were portrayed as victims of violent crimes regardless of who they are. But it's unfortunate that queer people seem to get these kinds of roles as victims. It's true that happens in the real world, but it would be nice to have some queer main cast characters on shows that weren't already a little, well, gay to begin with. But I shouldn't really complain since I don't watch much TV and wouldn't know if there were gay characters in cop shows and so on.
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      #1589    
    Old December 6th, 2011 (10:04 AM).
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    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Shining Raichu View Post
    Again, the writers treated it just as they would any heterosexual couple on the show, and the fact that it was a gay couple was really a non-issue. I really like it when things are done that way, it sort of brings to mind the saying "be the change you want to see in the world".

    As to whether they push stereotypes, yeah, sometimes they do. Particularly in comedies. Modern Family's Mitchell and Cameron, Will & Grace's Jack McFarland and Glee's Kurt Hummel are great examples of this. Though personally I don't know whether that's actually such a bad thing. We need to be realistic, and the fact of the matter is this: some gay people do fit the stereotypes. And more to the point, there is not a damn thing wrong with that. If the characters on these shows can unashamedly face the world, why can't their real-life counterparts?

    The thing about the stereotypical gays in comedy is that it arguably does more for the gay community than anything else.
    Holy crap this this this all over. I agree totally and completely.
    I also honestly just find stereotypes to be hilarious. I mean, you gotta laugh at yourself once in a while!
    It's my favourite thing ever when they're just all nonchalant "well yeah we've got a gay character, and basically this character is gay no big deal" and it's just no difference in anyone's lives. :3
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    #077: Ponyta - The Fire Horse Pokémon
    Fire ~ Field eggs
    3'03" ~ 66.1lbs ~ 50/50

    Its hooves are 10 times harder
    than diamonds. It can trample
    anything completely flat in moments.

    Abilities: Run Away or Flash Fire or Flame Body
    Moves: Growl, Flame Wheel, Stomp, Agility
    Locations: Pokémon Mansion

    Cry

    Other names:

    jp: ポニータ (Ponyta)
    de: Ponita
    fr: Ponyta
    cn: 小火馬 (Xiǎohuǒmǎ)


      #1590    
    Old December 6th, 2011 (12:41 PM).
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    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Scarf View Post
    To be a little more fair, most people on CSI were portrayed as victims of violent crimes regardless of who they are.
    True, but in most cases these gay characters were portrayed as victims because of who they are.
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      #1591    
    Old December 6th, 2011 (1:25 PM).
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    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Alakazam17 View Post
    True, but in most cases these gay characters were portrayed as victims because of who they are.
    Well, as Scarf said, some people are victims because of who they are.
    I don't watch TV as much anymore, I've only seen a few parts of Glee episodes so I haven't seen much of the gay character, and other than that the only show I know of with a gay character that happens to be one of the main cast was on Grey's Anatomy. Again, haven't seen too much of that, but I've seen enough to know that it's great and that they did a good job with the lesbian . . . er . . . cannot remember the name, lol.
    I do recall one . . . Without a Trace episode with a gay character on it. He wasn't the victim, but the woman that he was supposed to marry was. They were like children of some . . . strict asian family, although I can't remember what they were, exactly, so no one knew he was gay, besides the girl he was going to marry.

    I think I'm going to put "What Shining Raichu said." in my signature, because I'm probably going to say that quite a bit around here, like now for example. xD
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      #1592    
    Old December 7th, 2011 (12:05 AM).
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    What is your guy's style?
    Like how do you dress and what kind of music do you listen to?
      #1593    
    Old December 7th, 2011 (12:12 AM). Edited December 7th, 2011 by Alice.
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    Quote:
    Originally Posted by FreakyLocz14 View Post
    What is your guy's style?
    Like how do you dress and what kind of music do you listen to?
    I currently am wearing plain blue jeans, a plain white t-shirt, and a very old/tattered grey hoody(really only because we don't have the money to get a new one.) This is pretty much how I dress every day though. I really don't care much about it. lol

    I really only listen to metalcore/death metal in English. Although, in Japanese, I listen to pretty much everything but rap.
      #1594    
    Old December 7th, 2011 (2:38 AM).
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      What is your guy's style?
      Like how do you dress and what kind of music do you listen to?


      I like plaid button ups, and solid color sweaters. I try to do the sexy-gay-yooper look.
      Spoiler:


      OH, I even have a plaid "bomber hat". Aka, the hat with furry ear flaps that yoopers wear, except mine is way better than everyone else's boring brown ones.
      Spoiler:


      As far as music goes...I would be lying if I said I didn't like Lady Gaga, Bruno Mars, Pink, Adele, Kelly Clarkson, and other mainstream pop artists. I also like some indie, dance, and classic rock. I also like listening to music of guy I have a crush on, whether they are bad or good, I just pretend they are singing to me. Recently I threw Darren Criss to the curb, and upgraded Chris Salvatore as my new imaginary boyfriend, lol.

      Spoiler:
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        #1595    
      Old December 7th, 2011 (5:26 AM). Edited December 7th, 2011 by Shining Raichu.
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      Quote:
      Originally Posted by FreakyLocz14
      What is your guy's style?
      Like how do you dress and what kind of music do you listen to?
      I'll answer that question if you can tell me what relevance it has here lol - as both owner of this club and moderator of OVP I think it probably belongs there lol, though if people wanna keep answering it that's cool.

      Quote:
      Originally Posted by Pikapal642 View Post
      When my parents discovered I was gay, my brother was only 8 years old. My parents didn't want him to know about it until he was older, so I kept it a secret from EVERYONE, for fear that someone would leak it and it would get around somehow.
      I might have addressed this when you first said it here, but I just saw this post in OVP and it enraged me all over again. It makes me so angry that their attitude was "we'll wait until your brother is old enough to handle this."

      Firstly, this news wasn't about them and it wasn't about your brother. It was about you. In this instance, your needs and your feelings should have been put above all else. The fact that your parents believed that 8 years old is too young to know about gay people notwithstanding, things became different the moment you came out. It's one thing to choose not to expose your children to such things at a young age to defend their delicate sensibilities [INSERT ROLLEYES.GIF HERE] when there's no actual pressing need for it, but if your other child has just told you that he is gay, you know what this means?

      It means CIRCUMSTANCES HAVE CHANGED.

      Now whether you like it or not, for the emotional stability of your elder son, you are just going to have to expose your 8-year-old to the "big nasty" and trust that he will be resilient enough to get the hell over it. What exactly were they afraid of, in letting him know? That he'd think it sounded like a cool idea and decide to follow in his brother's footsteps? That he'd go to school and tell his friends about his big brother who kisses other boys and bring embarrassment on the family?

      I'm sorry Pikapal, I don't mean to disrespect you or your family, but this was a terrible parenting decision; an abominable misstep on so many levels and a disservice to both you and your little brother. I mean, obviously things turned out OK in the end, you seem fine... but it was a risky little game they were playing, and it was your self-esteem that hung in the balance if it didn't turn out right.
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        #1596    
      Old December 7th, 2011 (8:14 AM).
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      Quote:
      Originally Posted by Shining Raichu View Post
      I might have addressed this when you first said it here, but I just saw this post in OVP and it enraged me all over again. It makes me so angry that their attitude was "we'll wait until your brother is old enough to handle this."

      Firstly, this news wasn't about them and it wasn't about your brother. It was about you. In this instance, your needs and your feelings should have been put above all else. The fact that your parents believed that 8 years old is too young to know about gay people notwithstanding, things became different the moment you came out. It's one thing to choose not to expose your children to such things at a young age to defend their delicate sensibilities [INSERT ROLLEYES.GIF HERE] when there's no actual pressing need for it, but if your other child has just told you that he is gay, you know what this means?

      It means CIRCUMSTANCES HAVE CHANGED.

      Now whether you like it or not, for the emotional stability of your elder son, you are just going to have to expose your 8-year-old to the "big nasty" and trust that he will be resilient enough to get the hell over it. What exactly were they afraid of, in letting him know? That he'd think it sounded like a cool idea and decide to follow in his brother's footsteps? That he'd go to school and tell his friends about his big brother who kisses other boys and bring embarrassment on the family?

      I'm sorry Pikapal, I don't mean to disrespect you or your family, but this was a terrible parenting decision; an abominable misstep on so many levels and a disservice to both you and your little brother. I mean, obviously things turned out OK in the end, you seem fine... but it was a risky little game they were playing, and it was your self-esteem that hung in the balance if it didn't turn out right.
      I really thank you for defending me to the death on this one. xD And I don't want to disrespect that, but I feel the need to defend my parents. Sorry. v__v

      While yeah, it would have been nice to just come out and get it over with, I personally agree that 8 is just to young for a child to even know what sex is. When I was 8, I hadn't even HEARD that word, let alone knew what it meant. So when my parents found out and told me to wait, I felt like that was a good idea. (Then again, that is probably the over protective older brother in me. xP)

      Secondly, my parents were never actually ashamed of me. Never. They were worried that people would harass me, worried that I wouldn't get hired for jobs when I grew up, worried that my life would be hell, but never once were the ashamed or embarrassed. And they made sure that I knew that. ^__^ So there was no worry about my brother "becoming" gay or anything, they knew and know that being gay was something you were born with. They just decided he was too young to have that talk yet, since they are somewhat old fashioned in that manner. I didn't get "the talk" until I was like, 12 or 13. xD

      So yeah, in the end, I don't know for sure whether it was a bad decision or not., But even if it was, here's the thing:

      Every parent on earth will, at some point in time, make a horrible decision regarding raising their child. There is no manual for parenting, and the only sure guide one can have is their own parent's, and maybe other friends or something, and even that isn't reliable enough. SO if my parents made a mistake, then hey, it happens. The fact that they made DAMN sure I was loved, and felt loved, regardless of orientation, or interests, or personality, or anything, I think more than makes up for any mistakes in parenting.

      So again, thank you for defending me, and I don't wanna disrespect you by arguing with you, but I personally feel my parents deserve to have someone to defend them and I am the only one who can do so. xD

      And I will say that your approach to parenting is probably how I would have handled it if I was in their situation, so I don't wanna say you are wrong or anything, just that my parents took a different route and don't deserve to be lambasted for it. xD
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        #1597    
      Old December 7th, 2011 (8:23 AM).
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      Big news!

      U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton gives pro-LGBT speech, declaring: "Gay rights are human rights." This means, essentially, that now it's official foreign policy of the U.S. to defend and support gay and trans people around the world. (Now if only we could get more done here within the country to show how much we take this seriously.)

      You can read more about it here or just google it.

      Here's a short clip from the speech:



      And the whole speech:



      And of course, predictably, ~some people~ are upset by this.
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        #1598    
      Old December 7th, 2011 (11:40 AM).
      Alice's Avatar
      Alice Alice is offline
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      Wow, I didn't realize anything like that was happening. That's awesome. I have to wonder though... how exactly does a government care about people outside of its country so much as to protect them, but continue to oppress its own?

      I suppose that will come with time though.
        #1599    
      Old December 7th, 2011 (11:51 AM).
      FreakyLocz14's Avatar
      FreakyLocz14 FreakyLocz14 is offline
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      And Perry wonders why his campaign is going nowhere.

      To answer that, the Department of State deals with foreign policy. The Congress deals with domestic policy. Congress did repeal DADT, so they're not that bad. They're too busy with more important things like declaring pizza a vegetable.

      I think progress has been made, but things are yet to be done at both the federal and state level.
        #1600    
      Old December 7th, 2011 (2:13 PM). Edited December 7th, 2011 by Nakuzami.
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      Nakuzami Nakuzami is online now
       
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      What is your guy's style?
      Like how do you dress and what kind of music do you listen to?

      Well, like Shining Raichu said, I don't see too much relevance . . . some, but not much. I'm going to answer anyways! >:D

      Okay, my normal outfit consists of dark blue/black jeans, or my dark gray dressy pants that I luv, a t-shirt of . . . some random color, but that doesn't matter because you rarely ever see my t-shirts thanks to my HOODIES. I am always wearing a hoodie, at least when I'm in public. I usually where a hoodie at home, too, but there are some moments when I'm not (like now, lol) but . . . well, just by looking around, I have 4 hoodies in my room. . . and like 20 more in my room at my dad's house. I couldn't live without mah hoodies.
      Oh, I also where a light grey beanie, lol. Sometimes light blue/black striped fingerless gloves, but they're being sewed so . . . I can't wear them right now, lol.

      As for music . . . anything except for rap and heavy metal/screamo/things like that. I'll tolerate them, but I'm not a fan.
      I was literally just listening to Three Days Grace and Selena Gomez. I also listen to Lady Gaga, Panic! At The Disco, sometimes Skillet, and then most everything else. I'm not too picky as to what type of music I'm listening to, as long as it sounds good. :3

      I see you Hillary Clinton video. I'm going to watch you in a few minutes too. Then I'm going to edit this little post here and give my thoughts about you, unless, of course, I don't finish watching you until someone else posts. If that happens . . . I'll either have to reverse time, edit this post anyways or type up a new one. We shall see, Mrs. Clinton . . .

      EDIT: . . . *Clap, Clap, Clap* I think I like Hillary Clinton now~ I never really payed attention before, but I've decided that I like her. :3 That was. . . well, my the gears in my brain still haven't started turning, so the best I can say is amazing.
      Oh, and, SCREW YOU RICK PERRY >:C
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