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  #1    
Old September 25th, 2012 (2:56 AM). Edited October 27th, 2012 by wolf.
Bossk749's Avatar
Bossk749 Bossk749 is offline
     
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    So my friends and I have been doing some weather teams, and I decided to do some heavy rain with Drizzle Politoed, so without further ado, I present my current ideas for my rain team.


    Politoed @ Leftovers
    Ability: Drizzle
    Nature: Bold
    EVs: 252 HP/252 Def/4 Spe
    -Scald
    -Protect
    -Toxic
    -Perish Song

    Politoed is here to set up Drizzle, obviously; Scald for some rage-inducing burns, with Toxic for slow-painful death (depending on my opponent); Protect for some sort of recovery with Leftovers, also to assist with the damage done from Toxic/Burn; Perish Song to force out threats I can't deal with.

    Ludicolo @ Leftovers
    Ability: Rain Dish
    Nature: Bold
    EVs: 252 HP/216 Def/40 SDef
    -Substitute
    -Leech Seed
    -Protect
    -Scald

    This is a defensive Ludicolo that maximizes HP and HP recovery every turn with 252 EVs in HP, Leech Seed, Rain Dish, and Leftovers, which will restore the HP used for Substitute very quickly. Substitute to protect myself from high-power attacks, Scald/Protect for doing damage while I restore health.

    Toxicroak @ Black Sludge
    Ability: Dry Skin
    Nature: Adamant
    EVs: 244 HP/252 Atk/12 Def
    -Substitute
    -Focus Punch
    -Sucker Punch
    -Poison Jab/Ice Punch

    244 in HP for substitute, with Black Sludge and Dry Skin for recovery purposes; 244 HP with 12 Def to provide a Black Sludge number; max attack with an adamant nature for maximum power behind his punches. SubPunch set is obvious, with Sucker Punch for some needed priority, while Poison Jab for dual stab, or Ice Punch for better coverage.

    Dragonite @ Life Orb/Leftovers
    Ability: Multiscale
    Nature: Mild
    EVs: 76 Atk/252 SAtk/180 Spe
    -Hurricane
    -Aqua Tail/Superpower
    -Thunder
    -ExtremeSpeed/Earthquake/Roost

    I originally had a Swift Swim Kingdra, but only to learn that Swift Swim+Drizzle is banned, so I decided to abuse Hurricane's 100% accuracy with Dragonite. He provides some good team synergy and Hurricane abuse.

    Ferrothorn @ Leftovers
    Ability: Iron Barbs
    Nature: Relaxed
    EVs: 252 HP/88 Def/168 SDef
    -Spikes
    -Leech Seed
    -Gyro Ball/Protect
    -Power Whip

    This set is meant to come in, set up some spikes and seeds and then go out fighting, although he may be worth saving in the future in case of a rapid spinner or something of the sort.

    Jolteon @ Choice Specs
    Ability: Volt Absorb
    Nature: Timid
    EVs: 252 SpA/252 Spe/4 HP
    -Volt Switch
    -Shadow Ball/Signal Beam
    -Hidden Power {Fire}/{Ice}
    -Thunder

    I went with Choice Specs for more power, which I sacrificed with Timid over Modest nature- Shadow Ball and Signal Beam both Psychics super-effectively, while they each provide unique coverage of their own.

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      #2    
    Old September 25th, 2012 (11:45 AM).
    squirrelfeet
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      I advise making a Defensive Politoed, for they can fare quite well. This also works with your moveset (though don't pick Surf over Scald or Hydro Pump), which should suffice well with these EVs. You could possibly integrate HP grass to counter Water-Absorbers etc., but I am not sure how you would integrate this and which move you would drop.

      As for Ludicolo (if you're set on using it), I would go for protect. That way, you can reap the benefits of their HP massively each turn. However, this is a risky strategy due to easy switching-out. This is also a reason why I do not advise Toxic. If you use it, my advise is simply to be careful with it and predict well.

      Toxicroak will go well, especially with the defensive Politoed. I would give it higher speed though.

      As for Kingdra, I'm pretty sure that Drizzle + Swift Swim is banned. I would take this off your team and replace it with something else, or else rethink your strategy with it.

      Bronzong is fine, though Explosion is more of a GenIV move. It doesn't see much usage in GenV due to its loss of defense-lowering capabilities and would replace it.

      I would finally not have Raikou and Jolteon on the same team, due to Raikou being low-ranked (not even OU) and Jolteon's superiority (plus they're really quite similar). Also, Thundurus-T fares much better than Jolteon in the modern metagame, though keeping Jolteon would not be so bad.

      You would probably need 2 completely different Pokemon (other than Raikou/Jolteon and Kingdra). I would probably go for a dragon, Genesect, Keldeo etc.
      Your team certainly is not bad, but there is quite some need for improvement. Feel free to ask me to elaborate on any of my advice, or even to give different advice if you don't agree with these views and want different ideas.

        #3    
      Old September 25th, 2012 (12:12 PM).
      PlatinumDude's Avatar
      PlatinumDude PlatinumDude is offline
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      Building on to what squirrelfeet said:

      Definitely use defensive Politoed. You wouldn't want to lose your weather inducer too quickly because of uninvested defenses:
      -Scald
      -Protect/Ice Beam/Refresh
      -Toxic/Hypnosis
      -Perish Song/Encore
      Nature: Bold
      EVs: 252 HP/252 Def/4 Spe
      Item: Leftovers
      Ability: Drizzle

      While Bronzong seems tempting to use for its ability to get up dual screens, Explosion got nerfed in Gen V. Ferrothorn or Scizor are most likely the better alternatives because their Fire weaknesses get mitigated in rain as well. Ferrothorn should be used for defensive purposes, while Scizor should be used for offensive purposes:

      Ferrothorn:
      -Stealth Rock/Spikes
      -Leech Seed
      -Gyro Ball/Thunder Wave/Protect
      -Power Whip/Protect
      Nature: Relaxed
      EVs: 252 HP/88 Def/168 SDef
      Item: Leftovers/Shed Shell

      Scizor:
      -U-turn
      -Bullet Punch
      -Superpower
      -Pursuit/Quick Attack
      Nature: Adamant
      EVs: 248 HP/252 Atk/8 Spe
      Item: Choice Band
      Ability: Technician

      or
      -Swords Dance
      -Bullet Punch
      -Bug Bite
      -Superpower/Brick Break
      Nature: Adamant
      EVs: 252 Atk/4 SDef/252 Spe
      Item: Life Orb/Iron Plate/Leftovers
      Ability: Technician

      or
      -Swords Dance
      -Bullet Punch
      -Bug Bite/Superpower
      -Roost
      Nature: Adamant
      EVs: 252 HP/40 Atk/216 SDef
      Item: Leftovers/Life Orb
      Ability: Technician

      Raikou is viable in OU, but it doesn't really do well compared to Thundurus-T and Jolteon. If you're using Jolteon, use Hidden Power (Ice/Fire) over Shadow Ball or Signal Beam. Those moves both hit Psychics, but Shadow Ball also hits other Ghosts super effectively, while Signal Beam also hits Grass Pokemon hard. Replace Charge Beam with Volt Switch so that in the event that Jolteon is against a non-Ground Pokemon that can counter it, it can hit that Pokemon and switch out at once. And use Life Orb or Choice Specs as your item; Wise Glasses doesn't seem to cut it, due to the smaller power it provides.

      I also agree that Thundurus-T is an excellent option for the team; it's up to you whether you want to use that or Jolteon:
      -Thunder
      -Volt Switch
      -Focus Blast
      -Hidden Power (Ice)
      Nature: Timid
      EVs: 4 HP/252 SAtk/252 Spe
      Item: Choice Scarf

      or
      -Nasty Plot
      -Thunder
      -Hidden Power (Ice)
      -Focus Blast/Substitute
      Nature: Timid
      EVs: 4 HP/252 SAtk/252 Spe
      Item: Life Orb/Lum Berry/Leftovers

      or
      -Agility
      -Thunder
      -Hidden Power (Ice)
      -Focus Blast/Grass Knot
      Nature: Timid/Modest
      EVs: 4 HP/252 SAtk/252 Spe
      Item: Life Orb

      or
      -Thunder
      -Volt Switch
      -Hidden Power (Ice)
      -Grass Knot/Focus Blast
      Nature: Timid
      EVs: 4 HP/252 SAtk/252 Spe
      Item: Expert Belt

      While Ludicolo is using an offensive-based set, that set is better off with Swift Swim, which is banned if it's used with Drizzle, as outlined above. You're better off using a defensive set with it:
      -Substitute
      -Leech Seed
      -Protect/Toxic
      -Scald/Giga Drain/Ice Beam
      Nature: Bold
      EVs: 252 HP/216 Def/40 SDef
      Item: Leftovers
      Ability: Rain Dish

      I'll disagree with squirrelfeet on Toxicroak. The only time that Toxicroak should use more Speed is when it's using Swords Dance or Nasty Plot, when it must hit hard and fast. The goal of the Focus Punch set is to hit opponents hard with Focus Punch behind the Sub. The reason why upping Speed isn't advised on SubPunch is if a Sub goes up before the opponent uses an offensive move, then there's a good chance the Sub will break. However, if the Sub goes up after the offensive move (assuming Toxicroak can take it), then Toxicroak is free to use that Sub to protect itself from future attacks. The preferred spread is 244 HP/252 Atk/12 Def to give Toxicroak a Black Sludge/Leftovers number.

      Swift Swim + Drizzle is banned, so you'll have to replace Kingdra. Dragonite is a good alternative to it because it can abuse Rain with STAB Hurricane:
      -Hurricane
      -Aqua Tail/Superpower
      -Thunder
      -ExtremeSpeed/Earthquake/Roost
      Nature: Mild
      EVs: 76 Atk/252 SAtk/180 Spe
      Item: Leftovers/Life Orb
      Ability: Multiscale

      or
      -Hurricane
      -Thunder
      -Dragon Tail
      -Roost
      Nature: Calm
      EVs: 252 HP/4 SAtk/252 SDef
      Item: Leftovers
      Ability: Multiscale

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        #4    
      Old September 28th, 2012 (12:21 PM).
      Bossk749's Avatar
      Bossk749 Bossk749 is offline
         
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        Quote:
        Originally Posted by PlatinumDude View Post
        -Scald
        -Protect/Ice Beam/Refresh
        -Toxic/Hypnosis
        -Perish Song/Encore
        Nature: Bold
        EVs: 252 HP/252 Def/4 Spe
        Item: Leftovers
        Ability: Drizzle

        I like this set, but what's the point of 4 EVs in speed? What would it help me outspeed?

        While Bronzong seems tempting to use for its ability to get up dual screens, Explosion got nerfed in Gen V. Ferrothorn or Scizor are most likely the better alternatives because their Fire weaknesses get mitigated in rain as well. Ferrothorn should be used for defensive purposes, while Scizor should be used for offensive purposes:

        Quote:
        Ferrothorn:
        -Stealth Rock/Spikes
        -Leech Seed
        -Gyro Ball/Thunder Wave/Protect
        -Power Whip/Protect
        Nature: Relaxed
        EVs: 252 HP/88 Def/168 SDef
        Item: Leftovers/Shed Shell

        I love this set for a Ferrothorn, so I'm going with this over Scizor, as I would like to be able to set up some entry hazards.

        Quote:
        Raikou is viable in OU, but it doesn't really do well compared to Thundurus-T and Jolteon. If you're using Jolteon, use Hidden Power (Ice/Fire) over Shadow Ball or Signal Beam. Those moves both hit Psychics, but Shadow Ball also hits other Ghosts super effectively, while Signal Beam also hits Grass Pokemon hard. Replace Charge Beam with Volt Switch so that in the event that Jolteon is against a non-Ground Pokemon that can counter it, it can hit that Pokemon and switch out at once. And use Life Orb or Choice Specs as your item; Wise Glasses doesn't seem to cut it, due to the smaller power it provides.

        What Hidden Power would go with which move? I would love to use a Thundurus-T on my team (more specifically the first set you provided), but I have no way of obtaining it, so I will have to go with Jolteon.

        Quote:
        While Ludicolo is using an offensive-based set, that set is better off with Swift Swim, which is banned if it's used with Drizzle, as outlined above. You're better off using a defensive set with it:
        -Substitute
        -Leech Seed
        -Protect/Toxic
        -Scald/Giga Drain/Ice Beam
        Nature: Bold
        EVs: 252 HP/216 Def/40 SDef
        Item: Leftovers
        Ability: Rain Dish

        I'll disagree with squirrelfeet on Toxicroak. The only time that Toxicroak should use more Speed is when it's using Swords Dance or Nasty Plot, when it must hit hard and fast. The goal of the Focus Punch set is to hit opponents hard with Focus Punch behind the Sub. The reason why upping Speed isn't advised on SubPunch is if a Sub goes up before the opponent uses an offensive move, then there's a good chance the Sub will break. However, if the Sub goes up after the offensive move (assuming Toxicroak can take it), then Toxicroak is free to use that Sub to protect itself from future attacks. The preferred spread is 244 HP/252 Atk/12 Def to give Toxicroak a Black Sludge/Leftovers number.

        I'll be editing my post with those two changes now.

        Quote:
        Swift Swim + Drizzle is banned, so you'll have to replace Kingdra. Dragonite is a good alternative to it because it can abuse Rain with STAB Hurricane:
        -Hurricane
        -Aqua Tail/Superpower
        -Thunder
        -ExtremeSpeed/Earthquake/Roost
        Nature: Mild
        EVs: 76 Atk/252 SAtk/180 Spe
        Item: Leftovers/Life Orb
        Ability: Multiscale
        I'm assuming to go with Roost in the last slot if I pick Life Orb, and Leftovers if I pick Earthquake/Extreemspeed?

        Thank you for the help, and sorry if it seems I ignored your post Squirrelfeet, but PlatinumDude's post was a more-indepth look at what you said.

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          #5    
        Old October 5th, 2012 (11:22 AM).
        Thunder_Chad Thunder_Chad is offline
           
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          hey i think if you're running rain offense then you should probably consider better pkmn than ludicolo and toxicroak. although they're pretty cool, stuff like starmie, tornadus, or even calm mind jirachi are so much more potent that (one or two of them, not all) are staples on heavy offense offense. you might want to try to run some sort of scarf pkmn over one of them as well preferably one that keeps up momentum since that is very important on offense. you should probably run stealth rock over spikes on ferrothorn. stealth rock hits everything and is really just more important than spikes especially for an offensive team.

            #6    
          Old October 5th, 2012 (6:10 PM).
          Bossk749's Avatar
          Bossk749 Bossk749 is offline
             
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            I do like the idea for Stealth Rock, but I must wait until White 2's move tutor to be able to do that; I will put it over Gyro Ball, to be honest, as Ferrothorn can survive long enough to have Leech Seed, Spikes, and Stealth Rock set up.

            As far as 'Scarfing a Pokémon, I find it unnecessary as my main offensive Pokémon is Jolteon, who doesn't need speed with a Timid nature, base 130 speed, 252 spe EVs.
            Ludicolo and Toxicroak perform better in the rain, which why I'm using them on the rain team; Toxicroak gains 12.5% HP every turn from just rain, nevermind the amount from Leftovers, allowing him to set up multiple subs (provided he survives the first hit) which allows him to be able to deliver Focus Punch, which makes him one scary Pokémon. Ludicolo has max HP EVs, Leech Seed, Leftovers, and Rain Dish; this also allows maximum HP recovery, recovering subbed health nicely, especially with Protect; don't forget about the 30% for Burn status with Scald, making Ludicolo an amazing stalker in the rain.

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              #7    
            Old October 5th, 2012 (7:29 PM).
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            PlatinumDude PlatinumDude is offline
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            Quote:
            Originally Posted by Bossk749 View Post
            I do like the idea for Stealth Rock, but I must wait until White 2's move tutor to be able to do that; I will put it over Gyro Ball, to be honest, as Ferrothorn can survive long enough to have Leech Seed, Spikes, and Stealth Rock set up.

            As far as 'Scarfing a Pokémon, I find it unnecessary as my main offensive Pokémon is Jolteon, who doesn't need speed with a Timid nature, base 130 speed, 252 spe EVs.
            Ludicolo and Toxicroak perform better in the rain, which why I'm using them on the rain team; Toxicroak gains 12.5% HP every turn from just rain, nevermind the amount from Leftovers, allowing him to set up multiple subs (provided he survives the first hit) which allows him to be able to deliver Focus Punch, which makes him one scary Pokémon. Ludicolo has max HP EVs, Leech Seed, Leftovers, and Rain Dish; this also allows maximum HP recovery, recovering subbed health nicely, especially with Protect; don't forget about the 30% for Burn status with Scald, making Ludicolo an amazing stalker in the rain.

            IMO, Ferrothorn is better off not having Stealth Rock, Spikes and Leech Seed all at once because that leaves it as serious Taunt/setup bait. Sometimes it likes the hard-hitting power of STAB Gyro Ball. Having both Gyro Ball and Power Whip at once also makes it less vulnerable to Sap Sipper users.

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              #8    
            Old October 7th, 2012 (4:33 PM).
            Thunder_Chad Thunder_Chad is offline
               
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              who ever said that he was going to have them all at once? He either runs stealth rock or spikes, one or the other.

               
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