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  #26    
Old December 6th, 2012 (12:24 PM).
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Yoshikko Yoshikko is offline
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Originally Posted by PiemanFiddy View Post
It doesn't have to have a personality. That's completely irrelevant to the point I'm trying to make, and if it was, I would like a clear explanation as to why a clone wouldn't have that attribute. If it uses my same genetic code and everything, then I really just don't see what's wrong with it.

I never said a clone would be a robot or a lifeless being either. I'm just saying that if our technology is advanced enough to the point where we can successfully clone a human being, then we should be able to speed up the growth process. It shouldn't take 8 months to grow another one of 'me' if it uses a different scientific method thing. It's all up to them really.

As for not being an adult, yeah I guess that makes more sense now. I don't see why it would be impossible though. Once again, if it uses my same genetic code, it could very easily grow to the same height and proportionate body size within the allotted time of 'completion'.

But I suppose... or I GUESS it doesn't work that way. I guess I HAVE been watching too many movies... despite me never seeing a movie about human/animal cloning before. -_-
We are not magicians. It is still science. No matter how far technology and science will have advanced, the laws of nature will ALWAYS apply and they will put a limit to what we can do. Your genes is your body. It will have a completely different personality and mind. Body and mind are separated and you cannot possibly clone that. We can barely speed up the growth process of plants without them being genetically deformed/mutated/modified to the extreme - how would that work with a human being? Not to mention it would get cancer everywhere, it just isn't a realistic idea at all. Also, it will HAVE to have a personality, it can't not have one, or do you just expect a half-dead lump of flesh?

And yes obviously it would be exactly the same as you physically once it would have grown to that age, but it will obviously not right off the bat be that? You just don't seem to understand the basic concept and the limitations to that or realize that science abides the laws of nature. Anyway this has almost nothing to do with the topic anymore so I'm gonna drop it.
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  #27    
Old December 6th, 2012 (12:49 PM).
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    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Yoshikkko View Post
    We are not magicians. It is still science. No matter how far technology and science will have advanced, the laws of nature will ALWAYS apply and they will put a limit to what we can do. Your genes is your body. It will have a completely different personality and mind. Body and mind are separated and you cannot possibly clone that. We can barely speed up the growth process of plants without them being genetically deformed/mutated/modified to the extreme - how would that work with a human being? Not to mention it would get cancer everywhere, it just isn't a realistic idea at all. Also, it will HAVE to have a personality, it can't not have one, or do you just expect a half-dead lump of flesh?

    And yes obviously it would be exactly the same as you physically once it would have grown to that age, but it will obviously not right off the bat be that? You just don't seem to understand the basic concept and the limitations to that or realize that science abides the laws of nature. Anyway this has almost nothing to do with the topic anymore so I'm gonna drop it.

    Well alright then...

    I should say that none of this really got off-topic. It was still related to how cloning works, and what scientific capabilities we have with it, so I'd say it's all good.
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      #28    
    Old December 6th, 2012 (12:51 PM).
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    Uh what? I'll explain it more clearly to you if you don't understand; Dodos went extinct because whenever they were in danger they would call out to their friends and they would actually come too, and thus get all of them killed instead of just the initial one or two. This is stupid literally, this is not a good surviving strategy obviously. It's called natural selection. And oh my god wtf? Dogs and cats are not stupid? One of the main reasons dogs and cats are still here because they aren't. I'm not going to go on about this because it's a whole other discussion.
    Just to clear this up.

    The reason Dodos (and many other animals) went extinct wasn't because they were 'stupid'. They evolved in a habitat where they had no natural predators, humans took advantage of that and hunted them all to extinction stupidly quickly.

    So would it not make sense to clone species which humans are responsible for destroying?
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      #29    
    Old December 6th, 2012 (1:45 PM).
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    Just to clear this up.

    The reason Dodos (and many other animals) went extinct wasn't because they were 'stupid'. They evolved in a habitat where they had no natural predators, humans took advantage of that and hunted them all to extinction stupidly quickly.

    So would it not make sense to clone species which humans are responsible for destroying?
    Yeah I know about that, but they did call their friends and got them all killed. That speeded up the process and if they did that with humans they would have done that with other animals too so it makes no difference. Also, they were hunted by us for food because that is how we had to survive, there were no grocery stores and whatever so it is just survival of the fittest. However the black rhino that went extinct because of poachers that wanted their horns for jewellery, or the whales that are being killed because the Japanese fancy a whale sandwich is a completely different story. Those are luxuries, not survival instinct.
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    Old December 6th, 2012 (2:04 PM).
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    Originally Posted by Yoshikkko View Post
    Yeah I know about that, but they did call their friends and got them all killed. That speeded up the process and if they did that with humans they would have done that with other animals too so it makes no difference. Also, they were hunted by us for food because that is how we had to survive, there were no grocery stores and whatever so it is just survival of the fittest. However the black rhino that went extinct because of poachers that wanted their horns for jewellery, or the whales that are being killed because the Japanese fancy a whale sandwich is a completely different story. Those are luxuries, not survival instinct.
    No, no.

    There were no predators. Nothing native to Mauritius was a threat to the Dodo. The only things that ended killing them off were people and pests introduced to the island by people.

    I'm pretty sure the 'calling other birds over' thing is a myth too, just exaggerated over time. The entire species was wiped out from a presumably stable population to zero in around 75 years - which is ridiculously quick. People were hunting them for sport rather than food.

    On another note, the Dodo would be much easier to clone/breed/reintroduce than the black rhino simply because of it's size. Much easier to care for a medium sized bird than it is to car for a car-sized rhino.
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      #31    
    Old December 6th, 2012 (2:19 PM).
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    No, no.

    There were no predators. Nothing native to Mauritius was a threat to the Dodo. The only things that ended killing them off were people and pests introduced to the island by people.

    I'm pretty sure the 'calling other birds over' thing is a myth too, just exaggerated over time. The entire species was wiped out from a presumably stable population to zero in around 75 years - which is ridiculously quick. People were hunting them for sport rather than food.

    On another note, the Dodo would be much easier to clone/breed/reintroduce than the black rhino simply because of it's size. Much easier to care for a medium sized bird than it is to car for a car-sized rhino.
    Oh is that so, well I suppose you're right then. Forget what I said earlier, I learned it in school but maybe it was outdated or just bad information.
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      #32    
    Old December 9th, 2012 (7:54 PM).
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    It would be nice, from an intrinsic value standpoint, to put back lost biodiversity that we as a species are responsible for wiping out.

    And as for the Dinosaurs, go to your nearest farm and find a chicken. Or any type of bird, particularly the predatory ones. Same thing.
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      #33    
    Old December 10th, 2012 (8:29 AM).
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    Mononoke Hime Mononoke Hime is offline
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      Quote:
      Originally Posted by Digimon Kaiser View Post
      I'm not talking about dinosaurs here, but species much more recently extinct.

      Like Woolly Mammoths, Tasmanian Wolves and Dodos, among other species humans had at least some role in extinction.

      Do you think we'll see some of these in our lifetime?

      Cloning a Woolly Mammoth may take quite a while, but scientists are slowly working on it, using an Indian Elephant as a surrogate mother, apparently.
      I don't feel confortable with cloning any species and I don't agree with this process.
      By making a clone of the animal x and creating an entire population by this individual is nonsense.

      Just the fact that it's cloned already is something that will make it debilitated. By supressing a population's DNA to only one ancestor will weaken even more they DNA until the day they'll go extinct again.
      There's no way an animal could survive at wild like this.

      I think that cloning and bringing extinct species back to life is purely selfish. We want to bring back to life the animals we think are cool or something like that, we don't care about presenvation nor nature's balance, and we were most likely to clone some individual and let it at some zoo to be an attraction.
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        #34    
      Old December 13th, 2012 (11:42 PM).
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      Quote:
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      Just the fact that it's cloned already is something that will make it debilitated. By supressing a population's DNA to only one ancestor will weaken even more they DNA until the day they'll go extinct again.
      There's no way an animal could survive at wild like this.
      They'd have to be cross bred a few times with other species, and then bred again, and have their genetic codes altered in order to re-create an entire species from a single reservoir of DNA.
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