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[Gen V] 2013 International Challenge January Master Division Team Advice?

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  #1    
Old January 19th, 2013 (8:07 AM).
TheMattleHead TheMattleHead is offline
     
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    I have entered the January Wi-fi battle Tournament and I have two teams that I use and both seem to do fairly well in online wi-fi battles, I use a Volt-Turn team and a Drizzle team but I am wondering given the current Meta what team should I use?
    Here are my Teams;

    Volt Turn:

    Forretress (m) @ shed skin
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 252 HP / 177 Def / 80 Spd
    Relaxed Nature ( +D, -S)
    - Toxic Spikes
    - Spikes
    - Rapid Spin
    - Volt Switch

    Rotom @ Leftovers
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 185 Hp / 4 Def / 144 SDef / 176 Spd
    Modest Nature (-A, +SA)
    - Volt Switch
    - Will-O-Wisp
    - Hydro Pump
    - Hidden Power (Ice)

    Landorus @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Sheer Force
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Naive Nature (+ Spd, - SDef)
    - U-Turn
    - Earthquake
    - Hidden Power (Ice)
    - Stone Edge

    Jolteon (M) @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Volt Absorb
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+ S, - A)
    - Volt Switch
    - Thunderbolt
    - Shadow Ball
    - Hidden Power (Ice)

    Scizor (M) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Technician
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 ATk / 8 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+ A, - SAtk)
    - U-Turn
    - Bullet Punch
    - Superpower
    - Pursuit

    Infernape (F) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Blaze
    EVs: 184 HP / 70 Atk / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Naive Nature (+ Spd, - SDef)
    - U-Turn
    - Overheat
    - Close Combat
    - Stone Edge

    Drizzle Team:

    Politoed (M) @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Drizzle
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 SAtk / 4 Spd
    Modest Nature (+SA, -A)
    - Hydro Pump
    - Ice Beam
    - Hidden Power (Grass)
    - Encore

    Kingdra (F) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Swift Swim
    EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Rash Nature ( + SA, - SD)
    - Outrage
    - Waterfall
    - Draco Meteor
    - Hydro Pump

    Dragonite (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Multiscale
    EVs: 76 Atk / 252 SAtk / 180 Spd
    Mild Nature ( +SA, - D)
    - Hurricane
    - Thunder
    - Aqua Tail
    - Roost

    Vaporeon (M) @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Hydration
    EVs: 212 D / 252 SAtk / 44 Spd
    Modest Nature ( +SA, -A)
    - Surf
    - Ice Beam
    - Hidden Power (Grass)
    - Rest

    Raikou @ Air Ballon
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Rash Nature (+SA, -SD)
    - Weather Ball
    - Aura Sphere
    - Calm Mind
    - Thunder

    Quagsire (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Unaware
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
    Impish ( +D, -SA)
    - Scald
    - Substitute
    - Recover
    - Earthquake

    I am thinking about switching something out for this as well in the Drizzle team:
    Forretress (m) @ (don't know what item yet)
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 252 HP / 177 Def / 80 Spd
    Relaxed Nature ( +D, -S)
    - Toxic Spikes
    - Stealth Rock
    - Rapid Spin
    - Gyro Ball

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      #2    
    Old January 19th, 2013 (8:38 AM). Edited January 19th, 2013 by PlatinumDude.
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    PlatinumDude PlatinumDude is offline
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    Volt-turn:
    Shed Shell, not Shed Skin (latter is an ability). Forretress has a bad case of 4-moveslot syndrome, which makes it setup bait if it opts for 2 hazards:
    -Spikes/Stealth Rock/Toxic Spikes
    -Rapid Spin
    -Volt Switch
    -Gyro Ball/Hidden Power (Ice)
    Nature: Relaxed/Bold
    EVs: 252 HP/252 Def/4 SDef
    Item: Leftovers/Shed Shell
    Ability: Sturdy

    None of Landorus' current moves benefit from Sheer Force. Sheer Force only benefits the moves that have secondary effects with a chance of occurring (like Earth Power, which has a 10% chance of lowering Special Defense):
    -Earth Power
    -Focus Blast
    -Hidden Power (Ice)
    -Rock Polish/Substitute/Psychic
    Nature: Timid/Modest
    EVs: 252 SAtk/4 SDef/252 Spe
    Item: Life Orb
    Ability: Sheer Force

    Choice Scarf Landorus should use Sand Force as the ability to benefit off of opposing sand teams.

    Or you can go for Landorus-Therian, as it has higher Attack (at the cost of Speed) and can make itself physically bulky with Intimidiate:
    -Stealth Rock/Gravity
    -Earthquake
    -Stone Edge
    -U-turn
    Nature: Adamant
    EVs: 200 HP/64 Atk/244 Def
    Item: Leftovers

    or
    -Earthquake
    -Stone Edge
    -U-turn
    -Hidden Power (Ice)/Superpower
    Nature: Naive/Jolly
    EVs: 32 HP/252 Atk/224 Spe
    Item: Choice Scarf

    or
    -Gravity
    -Earthquake
    -Stone Edge
    -U-turn/Hidden Power (Ice)
    Nature: Jolly/Naive
    EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spe
    Item: Life Orb

    or
    -Rock Polish
    -Earthquake
    -Stone Edge
    -Hidden Power (Ice)/Explosion
    Nature: Naughty/Adamant
    EVs: 252 Atk/4 SAtk/252 Spe
    Item: Life Orb

    or
    -Substitute
    -Earthquake
    -Stone Edge
    -Hidden Power (Ice)/Swords Dance
    Nature: Naive/Adamant
    EVs: 252 Atk/4 SAtk/252 Spe
    Item: Leftovers/Expert Belt

    Since you're mostly using physical moves on Infernape, how about a 252 Atk/4 SAtk/252 Spe spread?

    Drizzle:
    I do recall that Swift Swim + Drizzle is banned on simulators, but I see nothing with it on wi-fi.

    Choice Scarf makes Kingdra's Speed under Swift Swim totally overkill. What it really needs here is power:
    -Rain Dance (in the event Politoed goes down and weather is changed)
    -Hydro Pump/Surf
    -Draco Meteor
    -Ice Beam/Surf/Dragon Pulse
    Nature: Modest
    EVs: 40 HP/252 SAtk/216 Spe
    Item: Life Orb/Damp Rock
    Ability: Swift Swim

    or
    -Draco Meteor
    -Hydro Pump
    -Dragon Pulse/Ice Beam
    -Surf/Ice Beam
    Nature: Modest/Timid
    EVs: 28 HP/252 SAtk/228 Spe
    Item: Choice Specs
    Ability: Swift Swim

    or
    -Substitute
    -Dragon Dance
    -Waterfall
    -Outrage
    Nature: Adamant
    EVs: 40 HP/228 Atk/12 Def/228 Spe
    Item: Leftovers
    Ability: Swift Swim

    or
    -Dragon Dance
    -Waterfall
    -Outrage
    -Rest
    Nature: Adamant
    EVs: 152 HP/96 Atk/32 SDef/228 Spe
    Item: Chesto Berry
    Ability: Swift Swim

    or
    -Dragon Dance
    -Outrage
    -Waterfall/Hydro Pump
    -Draco Meteor/Hidden Power (Fire)
    Nature: Lonely/Naughty
    EVs: 136 Atk/136 Spe/236 Spe
    Item: Life Orb/Lum Berry
    Ability: Swift Swim

    Vaporeon is too bulky for Focus Sash. Change the item to Life Orb.

    Really, I don't see the point of Sub on Quagsire. Just saying, not everyone on the team has to be a Water Pokémon. You have a pretty big weakness to Ferrothorn there. Outside of Raikou's Aura Sphere, none of your 'mons are safe from it. How about Dragonite? It can take advantage of the rain while it has a chance of bringing down Ferrothorn too:
    -Outrage
    -ExtremeSpeed
    -Waterfall
    -Superpower/Earthquake
    Nature: Adamant
    EVs: 252 Atk/4 SDef/252 Spe
    Item: Choice Band
    Ability: Multiscale

    or
    -Hurricane
    -Thunder
    -Aqua Tail/Superpower
    -ExtremeSpeed/Earthquake/Roost
    Nature: Mild
    EVs: 76 Atk/252 SAtk/180 Spe
    Item: Life Orb
    Ability: Multiscale

    or
    -Hurricane
    -Thunder
    -Dragon Tail
    -Roost
    Nature: Calm
    EVs: 252 HP/4 SAtk/252 SDef
    Item: Leftovers
    Ability: Multiscale

    Or you can opt for Toxicroak, who also hits Ferrothorn hard while checking Terrakion at the same time:
    -Swords Dance
    -Drain Punch
    -Sucker Punch
    -Ice Punch
    Nature: Adamant/Jolly
    EVs: 24 HP/252 Atk/232 Spe
    Item: Life Orb
    Ability: Dry Skin

    or
    -Bulk Up
    -Drain Punch
    -Sucker Punch/Ice Punch
    -Substitute
    Nature: Adamant
    EVs: 244 HP/132 Atk/120 Def/12 Spe
    Item: Black Sludge
    Ability: Dry Skin

    or
    -Substitute
    -Focus Punch
    -Sucker Punch/Payback
    -Ice Punch
    Nature: Adamant
    EVs: 244 HP/252 Atk/12 Spe
    Item: Life Orb/Black Sludge
    Ability: Dry Skin
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      #3    
    Old January 20th, 2013 (2:21 AM). Edited January 20th, 2013 by TheMattleHead.
    TheMattleHead TheMattleHead is offline
       
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      Okay thank you very much! Looks like my teams need a bit of a rebuild :L

      I think I will go for the Therian Landorus with this to get a bit more atack power in, also I will try that Infernape set up out I will try out all the others as well, Thank you for this it has really helped!

      I also possibly need a SDef wall for my volt switch, what should I go for?
        #4    
      Old January 20th, 2013 (1:54 PM). Edited January 20th, 2013 by Griffinbane.
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      Griffinbane Griffinbane is offline
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      @PlatinumDude - Anything goes in doubles VGC. Restrictions are item clause and species clause, and that banned pokemon list. And that you can only send in 4 pokemon.

      Back to op.
      Have you battled over wifi rated? That will give you a much better idea of what you'll be facing in the tournament. Keep in mind that the tournament is in doubles, not singles. Your two teams look as if it's built more for singles than for doubles.

      The Volt-turn team looks like a disaster waiting to happen to me. ATM I can't explain why. I'll need to study that team a bit more before I can decide what can be improved or whether it should be scrapped completely. The rain team, I may be able to help since I run primarily rain.
      Edit: Scrap that Volt-turn team completely. It's a glass cannon team (powerful, but easy to kill). You don't want glass cannons in the team unless you have something bulky that can take hits in return and dish them back out.

      Ditch the Forretress. You can try using set-up moves but most of the time, all you will manage to send out is a Stealth Rock or a single layer of Spikes. The other problem is that Forretress will only be able to stall, and won't dish nearly enough damage to do well, anything. It's setup bait and near worthless in doubles. Use Ferrothorn instead. It's far superior than Forretress, it's got the ever-useful water resist AND sandstorm boost (weather teams run amuck in doubles), its defenses on both ends are useful (Forretress can't defend against special attacks and there's far more special attackers than physical in doubles) and its standard set is extremely annoying.

      Ferrothorn w/ Leftovers
      Nature: Relaxed
      EVs: 252 HP / 148 Def / 108 SpD
      ~ Leech Seed
      ~ Protect
      ~ Power Whip
      ~ Gyro Ball
      Note: The speed IV must be at 0 in order to use Gyro Ball at full power.

      Your team is terribly weak against teams that are anti-rain. I'm talking about pokemon like Ferrothorn, electric types (rare), Jynx, Gastrodon, anything that has Dry Skin, Water Absorb, Storm Drain, Hydration or grass moves. If you dislike the accuracy of Hydro Pump but want something strong and useful, you can swap it for Scald (burn chance) or Surf (hits everything on the field).

      Politoed and Kingdra looks good. You can turn Dnite into a revenge killer by changing Aqua Tail or Roost to Extremespeed. You might want to switch out Roost. My experience is that when the opponent starts to target Dnite, they won't leave it surviving long enough to get a Roost in. Multiscale works only if your HP is at maximum so Roost becomes ineffective if it doesn't heal the HP fully. Not everything on your team needs water moves. You will need a great deal of flexibility in doubles. I'm hesitant about Vaporeon, Quagsire and Raikou.

      Quagsire is doing absolutely zilch for your team. It's too weak, not bulky enough, the ability is useless since almost no one uses status up moves. Use Gastrodon. Same weaknesses but Storm Drain is infinitely more useful, especially if opponent is using an opposing rain team.

      Gastrodon w/ Rindo Berry, Sitrus Berry, Leftovers
      Ability: Storm Drain
      Nature: Bold
      252 HP|252 Def|4 SpD
      ~ Surf / Muddy Water
      ~ Icy Wind / Ice Beam
      ~ Toxic / Earth Power
      ~ Recover / Protect

      Raikou has only one purpose in Doubles and that's to do as much damage as possible before it dies. It's a glass cannon, Calm Mind will not help whatsoever. Use the standard Special Attacker set.

      Raikou @ Air Balloon / Life Orb / Choice Scarf / Choice Specs
      Ability: Pressure
      Nature: Rash / Timid
      ~ Thunderbolt / Thunder
      ~ Hidden Power Ice / Hidden Power Grass
      ~ Aura Sphere / Rain Dance
      ~ Protect / ExtremeSpeed

      Alright, I'll admit I took a few liberties with this set. The reason I added Choice Scarf/Specs is to let you decide what you want to do. Scarf will let you attack before just about anything not using priority or Prankster or holding Scarf. Specs let you get far more power off than Life Orb. With both, you sacrifice adaptability. Consider it carefully. No matter which item you select for Raikou, it will be crippled by paralysis. ExtremeSpeed to pick off anything nearly dead.

      Vaporeon's item needs to be changed to Leftovers. Sash is useless on it.

      Make your changes and test it on wifi. Then come back if anything else needs to be ironed out.

      One more thing. Your team is also terribly weak against Trick Room, because it's so reliant on speed. Unfortunately that's the curse of rain teams, they're all speed-based. There's no easy answer for this particular problem.
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        #5    
      Old January 21st, 2013 (6:06 AM). Edited January 21st, 2013 by TheMattleHead.
      TheMattleHead TheMattleHead is offline
         
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        @Griffinbane Thank you that has helped a lot! I will go and test these changes to my team, I will let you know how it goes Also instead of Raikou is Zapdos a viable option instead or is it a good idea just to stick to Raikou? Also you said you were hesitand about Vaporeon, Quagsire and Raikou what should replace them?Thank you
          #6    
        Old January 21st, 2013 (8:05 AM).
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        Griffinbane Griffinbane is offline
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        Zapdos would work super well, actually. I'd forgotten about it because my team actually had a 4-'mon weakness to ice back when I was still using it. Well, you have two choices when it comes to Zapdos: a bulky attacker or a fast and bulky attacker.

        Modest Zapdos
        Ability: Pressure
        Item: Sitrus Berry / Charti Berry / Yache Berry
        EVs: 140 HP / 252 SpA / 116 Speed
        ~ Thunderbolt / Discharge
        ~ Hidden Power Ice / Hidden Power Grass
        ~ Heat Wave
        ~ Detect / Tailwind

        Quiet / Modest / Calm Zapdos
        Ability: Pressure
        Item: Leftovers
        EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpD or 4 Def / 252 SpA
        ~ Thunderbolt / Discharge
        ~ Hidden Power Ice / Hidden Power Grass
        ~ Heat Wave
        ~ Detect / Roost


        Both are meant to absorb hits and dish them out in return. Both will still fall to 2 Blizzards or 2 Rock Slides but it'll absorb just about everything else. First set is meant to outspeed some threats and attack before they can. The second is meant to absorb more damage than the first and frustrate your opponent as Zapdos recovers.
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          #7    
        Old January 21st, 2013 (8:25 AM).
        TheMattleHead TheMattleHead is offline
           
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          Okay I will probably switch Raikou for the first Zapdos set up, also you said you were hesitant about Vaporeon what should replace it with? Thank you!
            #8    
          Old January 21st, 2013 (9:05 AM).
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          Griffinbane Griffinbane is offline
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          Not a clue. I could be wrong about Vaporeon, since everytime I've use it, it's been a disaster. You'll have to figure out if it's a dead weight or not first.
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