Hmm, I won't say she's too much of an disappointment; She did have character development, and I love Beautifly so much. I would say she progressed into a good coordinator. Loved it when she came back in DPPt and battled against Dawn in the Beauty Contest.
Is May a disappointment?
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Hmm, I won't say she's too much of an disappointment; She did have character development, and I love Beautifly so much. I would say she progressed into a good coordinator. Loved it when she came back in DPPt and battled against Dawn in the Beauty Contest.
weedle_mchairybug
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Yes, she is a disappointment (even ignoring my own hatred of her), which I'll explain with these points:
1. She hated Pokémon and yet entered a Pokémon trainer profession despite that. I'm sorry, I don't care if she grew to love Pokémon before Ash faced Roxanne, if she hated Pokémon, she shouldn't have entered the profession, since, going by the fact that you are going to be dealing with Pokémon for a long time (the entire POINT of being a trainer), you might as well like them, because you're going to deal with them for a LONG time. It's like someone becoming a preschool teacher despite their explicitly hating children.
2. Her hatred of Pokémon made zero sense in the first place since, being the daughter of the Petalburg Gym Leader, she would have been exposed to Pokémon since she's a child.
3. She ultimately started that whole girl-swapping thing for eyecandy purposes (which, completely ignoring how sexist the whole thing is, it actually is disgusting for the fact that she and her successors are 10 year olds, meaning it's borderline child porn as a result). Heck, in Brave the Wave, she stripped in public, in a KIDS show (well, granted, it was offscreen so we didn't actually see it, but the clothes hitting the ground and especially Max's horrified reaction immediately beforehand certainly pointed at her actually stripping naked and putting on her bikini in front of them than her simply wearing a bikini underneath).
4. Her becoming a Pokémon Coordinator proved to be pointless since she got replaced with someone else who did the same goal as her, not to mention, it's not even a real goal in the games in the first place, it was a side quest, meaning that was pointless as an advertising vehicle in the first place. It's like having Max creating secret bases be his goal. On a side note, I also wasn't happy with how she was crying over losing Kanto. I can understand it if she did it when she lost Hoenn since that was the first time, but the second? I'm sorry, but she shouldn't cry like that. Did Ash cry over his loss in Johto? No. He was disappointed, yes, but he definitely didn't cry. Not to mention DP made her all the MORE pointless when she was replaced by someone who did the same goal as her.
5. Her own departure was also disappointing largely because, the way it was handled, she just left for Johto while barely even saying goodbye to Ash, Brock, or even her brother, making it look as though she didn't even care one whit about them. Didn't even look all that sad about it either.
6. Her own movie, the Manaphy one, she was not only a very poor choice for the lead character, since she's not even a Water-type trainer (it would have been better if they brought Misty back temporarily and had HER star in it), but even the one thing that could have potentially redeemed her character, her motherly bond with Manaphy, the writers outright blew it in the climax when they had May cowardly letting Phantom abduct Manaphy and get away, not making ANY attempt whatsoever to save what is essentially HER child, despite having access to Pokémon that are capable of saving Manaphy from Phantom like, I don't know, Beautifly or especially Squirtle. Instead, Ash had to save the day YET AGAIN despite it not even being HIS movie in the first place. Even worse, she makes no attempt to even aid Ash in saving Manaphy, just boarding a sub her friends and brother were in just as Ash revealed himself. I'm sorry, but when she's supposed to be Manaphy's mother, she needs to defend her child, no matter the cost if they are in danger, and not abandon them outright to said danger.
Probably the closest I'll give to a positive is that she had character development, but unfortunately, it's the cheap development that came about because of their needlessly making her hateful of Pokémon despite entering the trainer profession (and yes, that's a very cheap and shallow way to do development that if anything outright insulted the trainer profession).
And BTW, that's completely ignoring my hatred for her character's... character due to how her personality was too similar to characters from Love Hina, or the Fiorello Cappuccino Fangirls from Princess vs. Princess, and I mean that in a very bad way obviously, or my utter hatred of the fact that she was depicted in an overly sexualized manner like her having massive breasts (SHE'S 10 YEARS OLD, FOR GOODNESS SAKES!!), or my anger at how she was brought in after Misty was removed (though in that case, I'd blame Brock or Misty's sisters more than May for that. Maybe also Team Rocket).
1. She hated Pokémon and yet entered a Pokémon trainer profession despite that. I'm sorry, I don't care if she grew to love Pokémon before Ash faced Roxanne, if she hated Pokémon, she shouldn't have entered the profession, since, going by the fact that you are going to be dealing with Pokémon for a long time (the entire POINT of being a trainer), you might as well like them, because you're going to deal with them for a LONG time. It's like someone becoming a preschool teacher despite their explicitly hating children.
2. Her hatred of Pokémon made zero sense in the first place since, being the daughter of the Petalburg Gym Leader, she would have been exposed to Pokémon since she's a child.
3. She ultimately started that whole girl-swapping thing for eyecandy purposes (which, completely ignoring how sexist the whole thing is, it actually is disgusting for the fact that she and her successors are 10 year olds, meaning it's borderline child porn as a result). Heck, in Brave the Wave, she stripped in public, in a KIDS show (well, granted, it was offscreen so we didn't actually see it, but the clothes hitting the ground and especially Max's horrified reaction immediately beforehand certainly pointed at her actually stripping naked and putting on her bikini in front of them than her simply wearing a bikini underneath).
4. Her becoming a Pokémon Coordinator proved to be pointless since she got replaced with someone else who did the same goal as her, not to mention, it's not even a real goal in the games in the first place, it was a side quest, meaning that was pointless as an advertising vehicle in the first place. It's like having Max creating secret bases be his goal. On a side note, I also wasn't happy with how she was crying over losing Kanto. I can understand it if she did it when she lost Hoenn since that was the first time, but the second? I'm sorry, but she shouldn't cry like that. Did Ash cry over his loss in Johto? No. He was disappointed, yes, but he definitely didn't cry. Not to mention DP made her all the MORE pointless when she was replaced by someone who did the same goal as her.
5. Her own departure was also disappointing largely because, the way it was handled, she just left for Johto while barely even saying goodbye to Ash, Brock, or even her brother, making it look as though she didn't even care one whit about them. Didn't even look all that sad about it either.
6. Her own movie, the Manaphy one, she was not only a very poor choice for the lead character, since she's not even a Water-type trainer (it would have been better if they brought Misty back temporarily and had HER star in it), but even the one thing that could have potentially redeemed her character, her motherly bond with Manaphy, the writers outright blew it in the climax when they had May cowardly letting Phantom abduct Manaphy and get away, not making ANY attempt whatsoever to save what is essentially HER child, despite having access to Pokémon that are capable of saving Manaphy from Phantom like, I don't know, Beautifly or especially Squirtle. Instead, Ash had to save the day YET AGAIN despite it not even being HIS movie in the first place. Even worse, she makes no attempt to even aid Ash in saving Manaphy, just boarding a sub her friends and brother were in just as Ash revealed himself. I'm sorry, but when she's supposed to be Manaphy's mother, she needs to defend her child, no matter the cost if they are in danger, and not abandon them outright to said danger.
Probably the closest I'll give to a positive is that she had character development, but unfortunately, it's the cheap development that came about because of their needlessly making her hateful of Pokémon despite entering the trainer profession (and yes, that's a very cheap and shallow way to do development that if anything outright insulted the trainer profession).
And BTW, that's completely ignoring my hatred for her character's... character due to how her personality was too similar to characters from Love Hina, or the Fiorello Cappuccino Fangirls from Princess vs. Princess, and I mean that in a very bad way obviously, or my utter hatred of the fact that she was depicted in an overly sexualized manner like her having massive breasts (SHE'S 10 YEARS OLD, FOR GOODNESS SAKES!!), or my anger at how she was brought in after Misty was removed (though in that case, I'd blame Brock or Misty's sisters more than May for that. Maybe also Team Rocket).
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Alexander18
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May is awesome. She is such a well designed character with lots of development and a great pokemon team. She is one of my favorites. I respectfully disagree that she was handled badly. May was handled great and i give the writers a round of applause for making her that way.
Note that this is my opinion and an opinion only.
Note that this is my opinion and an opinion only.
No, she is great and I would say she is the 2nd best PokeGirl in terms of character development.
She is pretty good balanced in character development and goal-wise. She started as a trainer who didn't like Pokemon and didn't know what her goal was and she decided to do contests on which she did great and as time went by she learned to love Pokemon and became more confitent in herself. Her rivals are very good and her relationship with Ash is well-written as they've got such nice teacher-student relationship.
I have some problems with her character though. I feel her dislike for Pokemon was one-dimensional as they didn't explain about it much. I also didn't like her steak victories in the contests. She had some deus ex machina victories which made no sense for a beginner like her, there wasn't much struggle.
Overall she's very well-written and she's not a disappointment at all.
She is pretty good balanced in character development and goal-wise. She started as a trainer who didn't like Pokemon and didn't know what her goal was and she decided to do contests on which she did great and as time went by she learned to love Pokemon and became more confitent in herself. Her rivals are very good and her relationship with Ash is well-written as they've got such nice teacher-student relationship.
I have some problems with her character though. I feel her dislike for Pokemon was one-dimensional as they didn't explain about it much. I also didn't like her steak victories in the contests. She had some deus ex machina victories which made no sense for a beginner like her, there wasn't much struggle.
Overall she's very well-written and she's not a disappointment at all.
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May hated Pokemon and had no business becoming a Pokemon trainer in the first place, and her character development wasn't all that good either.
She was worst female character to ever appear in the anime. May had no personality, she was okay but she could have gotten much better character development, because she really needed it.
She was worst female character to ever appear in the anime. May had no personality, she was okay but she could have gotten much better character development, because she really needed it.
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Alexander18
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That is an opinion and i disagree. May has demonstrated better development and skills than i seen in certain others. But that is my opinion.
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May did developed her skills as a Pokemon trainer, but her character still sucks. She had no good personality and she did suck as a female lead character, she wasn't good like Misty was, she could have been handled much better.
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Alexander18
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No. I am not gonna agree with you. May rules as a female character for me. We are going to agree to disagree. Can we leave it that and stop repeating our opinions?
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I don't have to agree with you either.
May was an one note character, she did developed a little bit as a female lead character. She did change her mind and started to do Pokemon contests, those are one of the few good things her character was good about. May is not a ruler, her character was terrible and boring.
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weedle_mchairybug
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Misty better than May? Good one.
Spoiler:
Eh, to be honest, I thought Misty was better handled overall. At least she didn't pretty much insult the profession of being a Pokémon trainer due to hating Pokémon, especially when her mere background betrayed the idea that she should hate Pokémon (she'd have direct personal interaction with a lot of Pokémon as a gym leader, even BEFORE she hit it off on her own. Same goes for May, who as you know was the daughter of a Gym Leader and thus would have the same experience overall.). Plus, her relationship with Togepi beats May's relationship with Manaphy any day of the week. At least with Misty and Togepi, if the latter is in danger, goes missing, even both, you can count on Misty to do whatever it takes to get Togepi back within her abilities, and more importantly, NOT let the kidnapper get away with it by standing around and doing nothing except be in fear like some coward, which is exactly what happened with Manaphy and May in the climax to that flick. Oh, and she also wasn't used to peddle child porn by the writers via eyecandy and girl-swapping, while May started that trend. Probably the only thing May's got that actually is BETTER than Misty overall was that unlike Misty, May actually was ALLOWED to pursue her goal. That's it. Everything else, Misty did better than May, heck, even Dawn did better than May (and I don't even LIKE Dawn either).
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Alexander18
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Sorry about that. I will move on and do a better job at posting.
Anyway, no character is perfect. Each has their ups and downsides. We can share or have different opinions as long as it is respectful.
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I will make sure that i stay on topic.
If you think Misty is the best female handled good, I can respect that but I don't think Misty is the best at all as she barely had goal-wise focus and did little about her goal. I don't understand how can anybody (I am not referring to you, I dunno if you also think that) say May is the worst when she actually had clear development both personality and goal wise talking. Likewise, everyone has an opinion so that's fine even if I disagree.
To start with, May didn't hate Pokemon. I dunno how long this myth about May ''hating'' Pokemon will go on as in the official japanese version she said she disliked them which is not the same. There is no an universal law that says May had to have experience prior to her journey as she was a gym leader's daughter, besides this suits her very well as when she started her journey all what she wanted was to travel around the world so it wouldn't make sense whether she were experienced and wanted to to travel around. On the other hand I can agree May's dislike for Pokemon was contrived because they didn't bother to explain more about it.
As for May starting trend, I also disagree. May clearly didn't care about Pokemon and she only wanted to ''become' trainer as an excuse to travel over the world but when she saw Ash and his dream to become Pokemon Master she began to question herself if there was actually something she could do as trainer but she didn't know what to do and it took her some episodes to decide her goal and then she decided she'd try participating in contests and through contests is how she starts to forge bonds with Pokemon and actually comes to like them as she trains hard for her first contests. This is was the true reason why Ash and May had a teacher-student relationship. If this is starting trend or not having development then lol.
May being allowed to persue her goal and doing it good enough it's what makes her to me one of the best well-written characters, that and the fact she got a good development personality-wise as well. As for May and Misty comparison you did about them bonding with their Pokemon, I won't argue about it since that's actually off-topic.
I don't usually bother to reply but I did because I wanted to say how I disagreed on your opinion about May, not the Misty related, which I disagree though. That said, I am done with this thread because you and I know very well we will agree to disagree in our opinions.
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weedle_mchairybug
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She's still ultimately better than May, though. And quite frankly, I thought she got a lot more character development, better one at that. I'll give you the goal bit, that's probably the one thing May has Misty beat in (though if they didn't try to keep Team Rocket, we definitely would have seen actual focus on Misty's goal). I'd comment that Misty actually had more of a developed goal than Ash and Brock in the original series, but that's neither here nor there.
Hate, dislike, it means the same thing overall for me. If she didn't like Pokémon in any way, she shouldn't even bother with Pokémon in the first place. I know I wouldn't if I even disliked Pokémon, let alone hated them. And as far as your point about May didn't have to have experience prior to her journey, while it's true that she didn't necessarily have to have experience actually battling with Pokémon prior to her journey, it's pretty obvious that she had to have at least some direct interaction and experience with the Pokémon her dad had since he was a gym leader, whether it be actually watching him fight challengers, or otherwise taking care of the Pokémon as they're family owned ultimately, like how Brock's family had to take care of the Pokémon they had alongside Brock himself as shown in AG. And for the record, there are a few examples of characters who travel without even their being implied to be trainers. Like, for example, Seymour the Scientist, or maybe some COTDs who clearly didn't have access to any Pokémon due to not using them, or hey, even Misty's sisters, as most if not all of their Pokémon were left in the gym during their "trips". So no, she didn't NEED to become a Pokémon Trainer to travel.
Like I said, there were plenty of other characters in the series who travelled without even being trainers or bringing Pokémon along (Seymour the Scientist, that eccentric German scientist who studied Clefairy aliens, Misty's sisters, etc., etc.), so she didn't even NEED an excuse to travel the world, much less need to become a Pokémon Trainer to get that excuse.
And the trend I was referring to was this bit, actually:
Like her, hate her, even you can't deny she ultimately started that crap about girl-swapping due to eye candy, which IS a negative about her, especially given her age being 10 years old. And bear in mind, this came directly from Masamitsu Hidaka's own words, and certainly explains why the writers gave her a chest that one would expect from a sixteen year old than an actual ten year old, or a few scenes of fanservice that were extremely inappropriate and crass for a children's show even by Japan's standards like in Brave the Wave.
I still say that, pursuing their goals aside, Misty actually had far more actual development than May did (Misty attempted to gain her sisters respect, and that's the reason she even became a Gym Leader, and she ultimately succeeded before the eighth gym, and she also pursued her goal and even developed genuine camaraderie with Ash, matured to quite an extent, and there was even some development on her past and some of her quirks), but yes, I'll leave it at that, to avoid getting off topic (though to be fair, the bit about the Manaphy movie is technically on-topic due to it dealing strictly with May).
Fine by me.
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Quiji
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Eh, she was decent in Hoenn since her focus episodes were generally better than Ash's in my opinion, and she was new back then, so she was a novelty. She declined in quality in the BF arc, though. Too much overuse of Squirtle for appeals and some questionable wins with Eevee made me dislike her Contests back then.