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  #1    
Old January 12th, 2018 (8:34 PM).
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    I hope so, but there's always conflict, greed, elitism etc. The list of endless crap goes on. I think society has its priorities very screwed up.
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    Old January 12th, 2018 (8:59 PM).
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    Help define exactly what you mean by 'anywhere' - off the planet? A return to a state of nature? Transhumanism? By definition, we will end up 'somewhere', better off or as a dying species, but I'm curious as to where you want humanity to be.
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    Old January 13th, 2018 (2:00 PM).
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      I think what he/she means, will humanity ever stop resorting to violence, hate, war, and finding differences to divide eachother and awaken our souls and unite by spreading love and peace and realizing we're just a reflection of one another, just a different frame of mind is all. We're all the same, we all bleed the same color and shed the same tears. Yet we're so divided as the human race due to religion, money, politics, ethnicity, that we destroy nature and ourselves in the process. So no, I don't see humanity going anywhere. When it's time, mother nature will rid of the virus, or we'll destroy the planet as we know it through war.
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      Old January 14th, 2018 (12:07 AM).
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      Just to be more specific, use this thread to talk about the direction you think we will evolve in as a society. Maybe also how you think we should develop as a society compared to that.
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      Old January 14th, 2018 (6:51 AM).
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      I think a very large and important part of what makes us so human is our individuality and difference in opinions (the latter especially in societal levels). This also, in my opinion, suggests we will never reach a point of complete peace and unison on the planet. There will always be differing political views, ideas and senses of morality that will cause conflict.

      To end all conflict would be to have all of us agree on every point of debate - thus eliminating any need for intellectual conversation. After all, we wouldn't even have this thread if there was nothing to debate. In fact, I couldn't imagine a healthy society where every person agrees entirely.

      I think this is good, though. I don't want to be the same as you, or anyone else, and I strongly believe conversation and differing opinions drive intelligent thought and discovery forward.

      Should we have wars? No, definitely not. Will there be always be conflict? Absolutely.
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      Old January 14th, 2018 (10:15 AM).
      LDSman LDSman is offline
         
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        Conflict drives innovation. Things are always improving. If we can get a viable space program going, things will get even better.
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          #7    
        Old January 14th, 2018 (11:06 AM). Edited January 14th, 2018 by ShinyUmbreon189.
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          Just because someone has a different opinion doesn't mean they have to resort to conflict. I have friends with different political views, religious views, different views for everything, etc and it's what makes us more intellectual as a human being. How can one learn, if they've only stuck to what they've been told?
          How do you make an unreasonable person see reason? How do you make an illogical person see logic? As I stated; money, politics, religion, and ethnicity divides us the most. Politics, a brainwashing tactic to control your way of thinking and ideals into beleiving what is right or wrong, right and wrong are determined by those in power. Religion, to divide and separate man through spirituality with "Gods" that can't be proven and practiced by people that have no evidence whatsoever to back their statements up. Ethnicity, to divide and separate man based on color. Then money, it's what operates this factory. Money leads to greed which leads to war.
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          Old January 14th, 2018 (12:18 PM). Edited January 14th, 2018 by Vragon.
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            I mean not everyone resorts to conflict about it. And frankly, humanity is a flawed species which makes sense. All these things are a hindrance to a perfection that humanity can never attain. At the same time though, just because there's a lot of flaws in humanity doesn't mean they haven't dealt with them well. Basically peeps disagree and some go far. Everyone has their own perception on what is acceptable, that's just the nature of having a thinking brain.

            I do agree with "Her" in that this question is really vague, but I see humanity still being flawed, but at least getting somewhere. I mean sure there will be events and maybe horrid scenarios, but from what I can see humans can move on making themselves better. Not everyone human is going to be good and faulting the entirety of humanity as a species that cannot survive in an environment of war and the such is kinda a generalization.

            I doubt humans will be removed from the Earth and if they are it is only by their own doing. Frankly, Humanity has shown traits of strength and right now isn't one of those times "for some". It boggles my mind how peeps can say we haven't gotten anywhere when we've made the computer, seen stars, been to the moon, come together even in times of war, ponder life, helped our planet in many cases and overall be something more than anything on this planet has.

            Again, humans are flawed, but they also are a curious specimen that I anticipate a future for. Humans to me will always have a future so long as they can still keep making generations to come. I mean it's not always going to be pretty, but not everything is when it comes to life.

            Quote:
            Originally Posted by ShinyUmbreon189 View Post
            Just because someone has a different opinion doesn't mean they have to resort to conflict. I have friends with different political views, religious views, different views for everything, etc and it's what makes us more intellectual as a human being. How can one learn, if they've only stuck to what they've been told?How do you make an unreasonable person see reason? How do you make an illogical person see logic?
            Peeps do look beyond and such. I mean if you learn skills to solve things for yourself and move forwards then you can be classified as "not stuck in the past". Our technological advancements, Knowledge of science and even more acceptances from religions is showing that peeps are staying in the past and are in fact moving on.

            Also logic, while important, isn't everything. A computer can do sooo much, but it's limited since it doesn't think outside the logic it has nor has a mind that would even consider an means outside what it knows it more "logical". It would be more logical to get a good job and earn money, but not all peeps do that. Some even do more with that situation and have meaningful lives as a result of them following their passion in a field.

            As for the reason, peeps have different perspectives. It's only natural that I'd disagree with others, hence this reply in a way. I mean not everyone is always right and not every "reasonable decision" is what we think. Conflicts and stuff happen and not everyone gets a fair amount from it. Impossible equations have to be dealt with and well somethings don't go the way we want.

            Quote:
            Originally Posted by ShinyUmbreon189 View Post
            As I stated; money, politics, religion, and ethnicity divides us the most. Politics, a brainwashing tactic to control your way of thinking and ideals into beleiving what is right or wrong, right and wrong are determined by those in power. Religion, to divide and separate man through spirituality with "Gods" that can't be proven and practiced by people that have no evidence whatsoever to back their statements up. Ethnicity, to divide and separate man based on color. Then money, it's what operates this factory. Money leads to greed which leads to war.
            Politics is a concept about how a group should do things. There's been plenty of good from politics, it's just due to a lot of bad threads that cause negative things. Politics isn't a perfect ideal and I'll agree it does affect peeps in a lot of negative ways. But the evolution we've had in politics has shown humans have moved and at least discussed these issues. Yeah, right and wrong is determined by those in power, since those in power think differently and may have a different concept of right and wrong. The concepts of right and wrong I believe will never be fully realized since there's so many diverging opinions on the matter as well as the whole "how much is white and black, but where is the grey?" bit.

            Religion is how one explains the universe to that person. It purpose is to divide and any that do is a result of the person taking the concept for such a reason. I mean, if you take a faith based religion then of course there wouldn't be evidence. I mean, technically nothing should exist since we have yet to create life from parts. Religion I see it is how peeps explain why they're here and what to do about it.

            Ethnicity is just there cause of region. Peeps can get along regardless of it and sometimes it can make the bond even better. I like many people like seeing new things just like some peeps like staying in familiar places. I mean that's not a bad concept and just cause it's used as a means to divide in "some" ways doesn't mean our differences are a negative to our species.

            Money is merely a form of currency to do value. Peeps that misuse money for purposes isn't the fault of the money concept. Peeps do wrong things with stuff like peeps do right with the same stuff. I mean, yeah I can rob someone for money, but I can also donate money to help someone since I know it'll help.

            But in all fairness and respect let's agree to disagree.
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              #9    
            Old January 14th, 2018 (1:32 PM). Edited January 14th, 2018 by ShinyUmbreon189.
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              Quote:
              Originally Posted by Vragon View Post
              Peeps do look beyond and such. I mean if you learn skills to solve things for yourself and move forwards then you can be classified as "not stuck in the past". Our technological advancements, Knowledge of science and even more acceptances from religions is showing that peeps are staying in the past and are in fact moving on.

              Also logic, while important, isn't everything. A computer can do sooo much, but it's limited since it doesn't think outside the logic it has nor has a mind that would even consider an means outside what it knows it more "logical". It would be more logical to get a good job and earn money, but not all peeps do that. Some even do more with that situation and have meaningful lives as a result of them following their passion in a field.

              As for the reason, peeps have different perspectives. It's only natural that I'd disagree with others, hence this reply in a way. I mean not everyone is always right and not every "reasonable decision" is what we think. Conflicts and stuff happen and not everyone gets a fair amount from it. Impossible equations have to be dealt with and well somethings don't go the way we want.
              Not exactly what I was saying. I was implying that many humans think the info they obtain, is the truth and will block anything out that's against their beliefs, when in the end it's just an opinion. All humans are the same, just different frame of minds so different opinions are to be expected. But we'd rather conflict than respect anothers opinion. That's why I said, you can't learn if you don't expand your mental, but these are for the closed minded individuals. But I get where you're coming from.



              Quote:
              Politics is a concept about how a group should do things. There's been plenty of good from politics, it's just due to a lot of bad threads that cause negative things. Politics isn't a perfect ideal and I'll agree it does affect peeps in a lot of negative ways. But the evolution we've had in politics has shown humans have moved and at least discussed these issues. Yeah, right and wrong is determined by those in power, since those in power think differently and may have a different concept of right and wrong. The concepts of right and wrong I believe will never be fully realized since there's so many diverging opinions on the matter as well as the whole "how much is white and black, but where is the grey?" bit.
              Yes. But at the same time, you need to put into consideration the media and how the "politics" are presented to the public. It's biasism to attack the opposite side and twist stories to manipulate others into their ideologies and policies. Left says right is wrong right says left is wrong, when in reality they're both right and wrong.

              Quote:
              Religion is how one explains the universe to that person. It purpose is to divide and any that do is a result of the person taking the concept for such a reason. I mean, if you take a faith based religion then of course there wouldn't be evidence. I mean, technically nothing should exist since we have yet to create life from parts. Religion I see it is how peeps explain why they're here and what to do about it.
              Again I understand where you're coming from. But is it not an issue to have religious people shoving their beliefs down throats? It's okay to have faith, and practice your religion but when you go around spreading it to others like you were there, that's the problem. In my experience, Christians are by far the most judgemental religious people I've witenessed. Clearly not stating all Christians are like this, it's the minority but didn't the bible say something like, "Don't judge and you shall not be judged"? If so, and if the Bible is the book of Christ like they believe, why go against that reference?

              Quote:
              Ethnicity is just there cause of region. Peeps can get along regardless of it and sometimes it can make the bond even better. I like many people like seeing new things just like some peeps like staying in familiar places. I mean that's not a bad concept and just cause it's used as a means to divide in "some" ways doesn't mean our differences are a negative to our species.
              This question is more for America... But America and employers says they're a equal opportunity employer. Why does it ask for race and sexuality on an application? Why must we still be labeled differently as a color or our gender? Why are the prisons filled with African American/blacks? Why can't we just accept that we're all humans and get over our ethnic backgrounds? There's no need to categorize humans into ethnic groups, that causes segregation and the belief you're superior to those of a different ethnic background than you.

              Quote:
              Money is merely a form of currency to do value. Peeps that misuse money for purposes isn't the fault of the money concept. Peeps do wrong things with stuff like peeps do right with the same stuff. I mean, yeah I can rob someone for money, but I can also donate money to help someone since I know it'll help.
              Those in power are definitely misusing money. Most US (I live here I can't speak for other countries) people that work, live paycheck to paycheck or in poverty. Not because we have a spending problem, but because those in power make it hard for us to support ourselves because we have no college opportunity unless you go in debt or have rich family so we're stuck doing hard labor jobs or entry level work, it's not a liveable salary. They also use that money to fund the war on drugs to imprison us, send us to war for oil and gold and when soldiers come back with PTSD we don't give them proper treatment because our health system is a joke here, not to mention the suicide rate of veterans increasing. Along with other evil deeds they invest their money into for a profit.
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              Old January 14th, 2018 (2:30 PM).
              Vragon
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                But my main overall point is yeah some peeps do wrong with that and others do right with it. So basically we're outlining the fact that humanity is a flawed group that can make tools and do good and bad with them. I'm not denying the actions nor the fact that humans mess up with these tools.

                Upon further inspection on your comments and mine, I think I've drawn not exactly a difference of conclusion, but rather perspective. I mean, neither you, ShinyUmbreaon, or I exactly disagree with one another (or at least from a factuality standpoint) but more or less are focusing on specific examples of the two polarities of peoples and tools.

                Yeah get what you're saying and you and I can debate on all these factors but I don't think we entirely far from the cycle thinking about humans never becoming perfect. Course, I can probably attribute my response as more a reaction to something you didn't intend and for that I apologize.

                But yeah the question would be sooooo much better if detailed as 'Her' put it.

                So yeah I agree, humans are pretty f***** up individuals, but eh there's some good ones out there. Take care
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                  #11    
                Old January 14th, 2018 (7:04 PM). Edited January 14th, 2018 by KetsuekiR.
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                Quote:
                Originally Posted by ShinyUmbreon189 View Post
                Just because someone has a different opinion doesn't mean they have to resort to conflict. I have friends with different political views, religious views, different views for everything, etc and it's what makes us more intellectual as a human being. How can one learn, if they've only stuck to what they've been told?
                How do you make an unreasonable person see reason? How do you make an illogical person see logic? As I stated; money, politics, religion, and ethnicity divides us the most. Politics, a brainwashing tactic to control your way of thinking and ideals into beleiving what is right or wrong, right and wrong are determined by those in power. Religion, to divide and separate man through spirituality with "Gods" that can't be proven and practiced by people that have no evidence whatsoever to back their statements up. Ethnicity, to divide and separate man based on color. Then money, it's what operates this factory. Money leads to greed which leads to war.
                The issue here is that what's "reasonable" and "logical" is nit defined in a consistent manner. It may be reasonable to someine to want people of your specific ethnicity dead. To you and I, that may be wrong and unethical but differing opinions between people of power will always cause conflict if the opinions involved are dorectly related to the other.

                As much as we can say that we should be able to respect the opinions of others without resorting to conflict, human tendency for individuality and opposing ideas will always break that down.

                By your standard, we would have to resort to an anarchial society that has no people in power, no currency and no other purpose to life than survival. After all, any aspirations will lead to all the above.

                To put it simply, your opinion is yours and mine is mine. If you and I are in power, and our views towards each other and our relationship are contradictory, it will cause conflict on a violent level. To avoid this would be to remove individual thought or remove government. Neither of these are nice prospects.

                PS: Please ignore typos - using forums on a mobile phone is like trying to put out water with fire.
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                  #12    
                Old January 15th, 2018 (9:41 AM).
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                  Logic can be used to justify many unethical things.

                  Politics - there are huge differences in how people determine how they want to do things. It’s difficult to determine right and wrong. Example - help the poor. Person A says help the poor by giving them donations. Person B says help the poor by creating jobs. Neither is completely right or wrong.

                  Money - I don’t see how a modern society can function without it. It’s nit like I can barter office work for food.

                  Religion - many people believe in science and religion. God created the universe and I want to know how it all works. They want to see all of the things God did to make a functioning universe. The early churches were repositories of scientific knowledge. The monks were the only ones with the time to study the heavens and the earth.

                  Ethnicity- people are getting better at this. Doesn’t help that sometimes “outsiders” really are dangerous.
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                  Old January 17th, 2018 (5:09 PM).
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                  There is far more peace, democracy, wealth, health, innovation, science, and freedoms then there has ever been. And these are only increasing.

                  Humanity is "getting somewhere" even if things look bleak right now.
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                    #14    
                  Old January 18th, 2018 (11:29 AM).
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                    Quote:
                    Originally Posted by BadSheep View Post
                    There is far more peace, democracy, wealth, health, innovation, science, and freedoms then there has ever been. And these are only increasing.

                    Humanity is "getting somewhere" even if things look bleak right now.
                    People are always complaining about the current state of things. All the way back to the Romans.
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                      #15    
                    Old January 19th, 2018 (8:20 AM).
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                      Old January 19th, 2018 (9:43 AM).
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                      Originally Posted by LDSman View Post
                      Conflict drives innovation.
                      I disagree, somewhat. Conflict can drive innovation, but so can having other goals and aspirations, non-conflict competition, or responding to an emergency like a natural disaster or disease. Likewise, conflict doesn't always drive innovation and can even make things worse.

                      I think the best thing to drive innovation is giving more people the chance to innovate. So... more education and opportunity. If, for instance, you took all the resources that governments poured into WWII and took out the war you'd have all kinds of new developments without all the loss of life.
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                      Old January 19th, 2018 (8:06 PM).
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                        Quote:
                        Originally Posted by Esper View Post
                        I disagree, somewhat. Conflict can drive innovation, but so can having other goals and aspirations, non-conflict competition, or responding to an emergency like a natural disaster or disease. Likewise, conflict doesn't always drive innovation and can even make things worse.

                        I think the best thing to drive innovation is giving more people the chance to innovate. So... more education and opportunity. If, for instance, you took all the resources that governments poured into WWII and took out the war you'd have all kinds of new developments without all the loss of life.
                        True, I was a little broad in my statement.

                        Competition/conflict helps drive innovation. People want to outdo others or see a way to meet a need brought out in a conflict/competition.

                        The innovations that came out of WW 2 were because of the war. Removing the war wouldn’t result in the same innovations.
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