Advertiser Content

Serious How much more can America stomach? Page 4

Started by Her July 18th, 2019 12:44 AM
  • 3442 views
  • 94 replies

Yurius

Age 29
Canada
Seen 1 Week Ago
Posted 1 Week Ago
15,409 posts
6.3 Years
Even if you don't like the use of the word concentration camp, you have to admit that the conditions these people are in are appalling. Testimonies from people who were forced into these places say enough, do they not? And I don't think they should be forced in indefinitely, because then it is more of a prison don't you think?
And especially with ICE actually going around to peoples houses to take them away? It's like a dystopian story but it's happening. If someone does not have their proper papers why not just help them get them and let them stay home instead of dragging them away? Especially if they have a job and family.

And the crossings are happening more because of how the economy is, it really isn't anyones fault. Venezuela is in a crisis, for one, and Honduras is the most dangerous country in the Americas IIRC.
So face the dark and I'll teach you about fire in the blink of an eye
Now drink the Cyanide
The worlds collide and you know it's pure filth that I hide
Male
Japan
Seen 4 Hours Ago
Posted 16 Hours Ago
308 posts
305 Days
Even if you don't like the use of the word concentration camp, you have to admit that the conditions these people are in are appalling. Testimonies from people who were forced into these places say enough, do they not? And I don't think they should be forced in indefinitely, because then it is more of a prison don't you think?
And especially with ICE actually going around to peoples houses to take them away? It's like a dystopian story but it's happening. If someone does not have their proper papers why not just help them get them and let them stay home instead of dragging them away? Especially if they have a job and family.

And the crossings are happening more because of how the economy is, it really isn't anyones fault. Venezuela is in a crisis, for one, and Honduras is the most dangerous country in the Americas IIRC.
If they committed a crime why should they be allowed to stay at home? What other crimes do we allow a person to just stay at home and not even go to the police station to post bail? If they are here illegally they should be kicked out, that is practically the law in every country on the planet!

Also in the news, a father of five was killed a few days ago by an illegal immigrant who was escaping deportation.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/colorado-immigration-advocate-killed-in-crash-with-salvadoran-illegal-immigrant-who-once-sought-sanctuary-in-church-report.amp

Yurius

Age 29
Canada
Seen 1 Week Ago
Posted 1 Week Ago
15,409 posts
6.3 Years
You missed my point. They should help them become legal like the prison system should be there to help rehabilitate inmates.
So face the dark and I'll teach you about fire in the blink of an eye
Now drink the Cyanide
The worlds collide and you know it's pure filth that I hide
Male
Japan
Seen 4 Hours Ago
Posted 16 Hours Ago
308 posts
305 Days
You missed my point. They should help them become legal like the prison system should be there to help rehabilitate inmates.
Doesn’t that just punish those who cannot easily get across the border? Those that want to immigrate here from say China, Africa, Russia, or the Middle East? They cannot cross the border easily they have to wait in line with the rest of the world.

Yurius

Age 29
Canada
Seen 1 Week Ago
Posted 1 Week Ago
15,409 posts
6.3 Years
Helping people with the immigration process isn't punishing them?? I didn't say only specific people? I have no idea how you're reading what I'm saying.
So face the dark and I'll teach you about fire in the blink of an eye
Now drink the Cyanide
The worlds collide and you know it's pure filth that I hide
Male
Japan
Seen 4 Hours Ago
Posted 16 Hours Ago
308 posts
305 Days
Helping people with the immigration process isn't punishing them?? I didn't say only specific people? I have no idea how you're reading what I'm saying.
If they are here illegally, and your plan is for them to stay here and get legal help to become legal citizens, then you are punishing the people who cannot easily migrate across a desert border to get here. Those illegals get to skip ahead of the line the rest of the world has to wait in, and enjoy all the benefits America provides while waiting for their citizenship, while those in other countries have to wait in their country of origin until they receive a green card or citizenship. In essence you are punishing those that follow the law by allowing those that break the law a path to citizenship and the ability to remain in the country.

Yurius

Age 29
Canada
Seen 1 Week Ago
Posted 1 Week Ago
15,409 posts
6.3 Years
I'd let others come over too, if you wish to move to and be a good citizen of another country, how come you can't? What's so wrong with people moving between countries? You know most of Europe has lax borders right? "Illegal" shouldn't be a thing, no person is "illegal" if you can fly to a country you want to live in all the power to you as well.
But you seem set in your ways so I won't waste my time further with this, I didn't mention people being able to jump ahead you just assumed it so you could fault my argument and not pay attention to the fact that it is wrong to treat people how these people are being treated.
So face the dark and I'll teach you about fire in the blink of an eye
Now drink the Cyanide
The worlds collide and you know it's pure filth that I hide
Male
Japan
Seen 4 Hours Ago
Posted 16 Hours Ago
308 posts
305 Days
I'd let others come over too, if you wish to move to and be a good citizen of another country, how come you can't? What's so wrong with people moving between countries? You know most of Europe has lax borders right? "Illegal" shouldn't be a thing, no person is "illegal" if you can fly to a country you want to live in all the power to you as well.
But you seem set in your ways so I won't waste my time further with this, I didn't mention people being able to jump ahead you just assumed it so you could fault my argument and not pay attention to the fact that it is wrong to treat people how these people are being treated.
Well before you go then let me ask, if you believe anyone should come then do you think there should be a limit? One million per year? Ten million? Infinite? Even Europe has put a cap on its number even with its lax borders, and if you want we can discuss the dangers that has brought to Europe. However again I ask should a country put a cap on the number of people it let’s in? Or should it just let everyone in and let the country fall apart as people cannot find jobs and have to overburden the welfare system to the point it crumbles?

Yurius

Age 29
Canada
Seen 1 Week Ago
Posted 1 Week Ago
15,409 posts
6.3 Years
The core issue is why do people wish to immigrate? Well, it's because:
1. Their own country is war torn, why is this so? Many middle eastern countries are only in shambles because of foreign forces going there and tearing muk up just for oil.
2. The country is poor. In my opinion no country should be poor, and they don't HAVE to be, like 100 people use up 50% of the earths resources, isn't that insane? Million and billionaires don't need all that money while countless people suffer.
3. The country is dangerous, this is linked back to poverty, if the worlds resources weren't hoarded by the mega rich and everyone had a fair share and poverty was a thing of the past you'd find people wouldn't be robbing, killing, etc because they'd be perfectly happy.
And the whole "they earned" muk is a thing of the distant past, most mega wealthy people inherited it or had rich parents, and like I said they don't need all that money, they don't need yachts, they don't need gold toilets. The rich live on the backs of the countless they exploit and this immoral and wrong.
So face the dark and I'll teach you about fire in the blink of an eye
Now drink the Cyanide
The worlds collide and you know it's pure filth that I hide
Male
Japan
Seen 4 Hours Ago
Posted 16 Hours Ago
308 posts
305 Days
The core issue is why do people wish to immigrate? Well, it's because:
1. Their own country is war torn, why is this so? Many middle eastern countries are only in shambles because of foreign forces going there and tearing muk up just for oil.
2. The country is poor. In my opinion no country should be poor, and they don't HAVE to be, like 100 people use up 50% of the earths resources, isn't that insane? Million and billionaires don't need all that money while countless people suffer.
3. The country is dangerous, this is linked back to poverty, if the worlds resources weren't hoarded by the mega rich and everyone had a fair share and poverty was a thing of the past you'd find people wouldn't be robbing, killing, etc because they'd be perfectly happy.
And the whole "they earned" muk is a thing of the distant past, most mega wealthy people inherited it or had rich parents, and like I said they don't need all that money, they don't need yachts, they don't need gold toilets. The rich live on the backs of the countless they exploit and this immoral and wrong.
You are deflecting from the question, we can go into how to fix the world’s problems and how much each country should give in aid, however I will again ask what would you put a cap on immigration? Because no matter what there are going to be millions if not billions that will want to move to first world countries, and no country on this planet can absorb that many people.

Nah

Age 27
Female
Seen 3 Hours Ago
Posted 4 Hours Ago
13,603 posts
5.8 Years
It's not really deflecting imo. If you make it so people don't have much reason to immigrate to other countries, a cap is not something worth thinking about, as you'll never have to worry about taking in more people than you can handle.

What is deflection however is the constant mentioning of trivial things like immigration caps and "it's not fair to people who have to cross an ocean!" and inflexible adherence to the law over important things like the poor treatment of other human beings simply coming here to escape the awful conditions of their homelands, with said awful conditions caused in significant part by the wealthy elite of the West.
Nah ンン
“No, I... I have to be strong. Everyone expects me to."

Yurius

Age 29
Canada
Seen 1 Week Ago
Posted 1 Week Ago
15,409 posts
6.3 Years
You are deflecting from the question, we can go into how to fix the world’s problems and how much each country should give in aid, however I will again ask what would you put a cap on immigration? Because no matter what there are going to be millions if not billions that will want to move to first world countries, and no country on this planet can absorb that many people.
Literally how am I deflecting there shouldn't be third world whatever the psyduck countries in the first place which has everything to do with immigration because with a more equal spread of wealth in every country there wouldn't be a need to immigrate. Please connect the dots here you just don't want to admit that I am in the right.
So face the dark and I'll teach you about fire in the blink of an eye
Now drink the Cyanide
The worlds collide and you know it's pure filth that I hide
Male
Japan
Seen 4 Hours Ago
Posted 16 Hours Ago
308 posts
305 Days
It's not really deflecting imo. If you make it so people don't have much reason to immigrate to other countries, a cap is not something worth thinking about, as you'll never have to worry about taking in more people than you can handle.
We can go into the discussion on how it is impossible to do that, but even if the western countries were to attempt something like that it would still require decades of change, in the meantime there would be millions upon millions who would refuse to wait for their countries to change and want to immigrate immediately.

What is deflection however is the constant mentioning of trivial things like immigration caps and "it's not fair to people who have to cross an ocean!" and inflexible adherence to the law over important things like the poor treatment of other human beings simply coming here to escape the awful conditions of their homelands, with said awful conditions caused in significant part by the wealthy elite of the West.
The discussion was not about that, it was about helping illegals obtain citizenship over those who have to wait for citizenship.

Literally how am I deflecting there shouldn't be third world whatever the psyduck countries in the first place which has everything to do with immigration because with a more equal spread of wealth in every country there wouldn't be a need to immigrate. Please connect the dots here you just don't want to admit that I am in the right.
So can you please answer it then, but let’s say we do this magical change, something that would take decades, what should the cap be in the meantime, or should we force people to stay in their countries while said change is happening.

Now to answer what you proposed let’s say we did “spread the wealth” around, there are numerous countries that are ruled by drug lords and criminal organizations, do you plan to use the military to overthrow those drug lords?

In Africa we see numerous countries ruled by dictators and warlords that take western aid and money and use it to prop themselves up with a lavish lifestyle do you plan to use the military to overthrow them?

There are countries that are very resource poor, do you plan to constantly provide those countries aid to support a first world lifestyle?

You blame the west on wars in the Middle East, however some of the greatest tension in the Middle East is Shia vs Sunni, ala Saudi Arabia vs Iran, do you plan to use the military to constantly keep those two apart? The same could be said for Pakistan and India, another flash point that has nothing to do with the west.

Ivysaur

You found a heart!

Age 28
Male
Madrid
Seen 9 Hours Ago
Posted 2 Days Ago
20,471 posts
12.5 Years
The same could be said for Pakistan and India, another flash point that has nothing to do with the west.
Oh boy have you heard of Louis Mountbatten. Because if there is something the West is totally responsible for is the cold war between Pakistan and India, two countries that did not even exist until a random British Earl was dispatched to India with a map and told to draw borders for two countries in a few days, without the slightest clue of how it looked on the ground or whether there even was apetite for partition. Please do read the history of the Partition of India and then tell me again the West has nothing to do with it.
Male
Japan
Seen 4 Hours Ago
Posted 16 Hours Ago
308 posts
305 Days
Oh boy have you heard of Louis Mountbatten. Because if there is something the West is totally responsible for is the cold war between Pakistan and India, two countries that did not even exist until a random British Earl was dispatched to India with a map and told to draw borders for two countries in a few days, without the slightest clue of how it looked on the ground or whether there even was apetite for partition. Please do read the history of the Partition of India and then tell me again the West has nothing to do with it.
Alright fair enough, although I would say that 71 years later the problems the two nations face have little to do with the west and mostly with their current inability to deal with radical jihadism in their own borders, the debacle over Kashmiri, and increased military support from China.

Ivysaur

You found a heart!

Age 28
Male
Madrid
Seen 9 Hours Ago
Posted 2 Days Ago
20,471 posts
12.5 Years
Alright fair enough, although I would say that 71 years later the problems the two nations face have little to do with the west and mostly with their current inability to deal with radical jihadism in their own borders, the debacle over Kashmiri, and increased military support from China.
Except the Kashmir issue was created by Earl Mountbatten himself by drawing a randomly drunken line crossing through a 50-50 territory, Jihadism is exacerbated by Pakistan being created as a Muslim-only state as opposed to the multicultural country India once was -aided by the British "Divide the religions and rule" policy that kept them in power for two centuries- and the Chinese are drawn to, and concerned by, the fact that their two neighbouring countries are in a permanent state of war, with nukes on a hair trigger, over the issue of Kashmir.

So yes, literally everything about the India-Pakistan problem was created by the West, by the United Kingdom to be precise. Everything you see right now is the effects of the decision of a British dude, just amplified by 70 years of anger because of what he did.
Male
Japan
Seen 4 Hours Ago
Posted 16 Hours Ago
308 posts
305 Days
Except the Kashmir issue was created by Earl Mountbatten himself by drawing a randomly drunken line crossing through a 50-50 territory, Jihadism is exacerbated by Pakistan being created as a Muslim-only state as opposed to the multicultural country India once was -aided by the British "Divide the religions and rule" policy that kept them in power for two centuries- and the Chinese are drawn to, and concerned by, the fact that their two neighbouring countries are in a permanent state of war, with nukes on a hair trigger, over the issue of Kashmir.

So yes, literally everything about the India-Pakistan problem was created by the West, by the United Kingdom to be precise. Everything you see right now is the effects of the decision of a British dude, just amplified by 70 years of anger because of what he did.
You neglect to mention that Pakistan was created because a Muslim minority feared losing to a Hindu majority and was seeking their own country.

https://www.hoover.org/research/islam-and-early-history-pakistan

http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/historic_figures/jinnah_mohammad_ali.shtml

You also neglect the 1937 elections that saw the Muslims League do poorly and resulted to being largely shut out of the government, fueling discontent and driving the need for a separate country.

https://www.britannica.com/biography/Mohammed-Ali-Jinnah

Her

Age 25
Seen 6 Hours Ago
Posted 2 Days Ago
11,178 posts
11.3 Years
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-49425624

How's that 'they're not concentration camps' argument going, for those that still rally against the idea? You still feel comfortable, secure? Enjoying the taste of boot?
Male
Japan
Seen 4 Hours Ago
Posted 16 Hours Ago
308 posts
305 Days
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-49425624

How's that 'they're not concentration camps' argument going, for those that still rally against the idea? You still feel comfortable, secure? Enjoying the taste of boot?
As noted before those being released are not showing up for their hearings, thus holding them ( or making them wait in Mexico if they do not illegally cross the border ) is the only way to make sure they do not disappear into the US, before pleading their case for asylum. How does this change anything by the way in your argument? If anything all it does is discourage the purchasing of children to get through.

Ivysaur

You found a heart!

Age 28
Male
Madrid
Seen 9 Hours Ago
Posted 2 Days Ago
20,471 posts
12.5 Years
https://www.vox.com/2019/8/22/20827949/trump-chosen-one-greenland-bizarreness-explained?utm_campaign=vox.social&utm_content=1566605472&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/stocks-set-to-head-slightly-higher-as-wall-street-awaits-powells-jackson-hole-speech-2019-08-23

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1164914610836783104

Seriously, this man is mentally unstable. I don't know what kind of illness he suffers from (or maybe he's just blind), but this week he was totally deranged and every three hours he's been doing something that would have sent Republicans into asking for a coup to remove Obama had he done one single of these things. "I hereby order companies to leave China and move production to the US", says the candidate of the party that loves free enterprise and warns against socialists telling companies what to do or nationalising them.

And these things are not even productive for him. He's pushing the US into an economic crash, which is very much what he doesn't need by next year.
Advertiser Content