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We've done this too many times now

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The ones I'm referring to aren't even 3D printed. Straight machine shop stuff.
Things like this:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...s-at-home-make-philippines-deadlier-than-u-s-

Pretty much this exactly. Chinese 'knockoffs' can kill just as effectively as full bore made in a legitimate factory weapons. This is a common issue that I've argued against before. If some illiterate farmer can make a gun in his barn then what is going to stop some guy in his garage from making an AK-47 out of a shovel in his garage?

I feel like at this point we're arguing with children that have no clue as to how this entire business functions. Their hearts are in the right place, as no one here wants other people murdered for the sake of murder (or any other reason for that matter) but there is a major disconnect where (and when, if applicable) the rubber meets the road.

What's more, is the simple fact is that if guns are so easy to get now here in 2018, then why is the overall homicide rate declining since 1994? And almost as low as 1950s homicide rates?

There was that full on 'Assault Weapons Ban' for an entire decade and the homicide rate was higher with the ban than without one? Especially when the population has increased multiplicatively and not decreased in any way.

What truly sickens me is that the vast majority of the anti-gunners only care about the massive media coverage but give no credence to folk in the inner cities and other problem areas that are shot at on a daily basis by gang bangers and thugs . . . with illegal firearms.
 

EC

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Companies dropping the NRA like crazy. Good to see everyone waking up across the country and seeing this "organization" for what they really are; an extremist domestic terrorist group funded by, as it turns out, the Russians!

Change has begun, and it started with these high school kids speaking up and refusing to be quiet and go away. Marches are next. Walk outs. Demonstrations. Protests. More companies dropping the NRA. Even the president is willing to sign legislation increasing the age of purchase, banning bump stocks, etc.

No. More.
 

ShinyUmbreon189

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I don't know, you could cause quite a few casualties as well as gruesome injuries with a cannon loaded with grapeshot, which are still, and were intended to be upon it's original writing, protected under the second amendment.

Almost anything can be a weapon if used properly. Some of these killers are complete masterminds. Take the OKC bombing for example.. At least 160 deceased, more than any massacre from guns and nobody saw it coming and guns weren't even involved in the massacre.

Why? In my state, there are NO state imposed gun laws. Noneski. You do not even need a permit to carry concealed anymore. Yet, last time I checked, we have the third or fourth lowest rate of any type of crime involving firearms. That includes everything from robberies, to even yes, assault and attacks on people. Your "Evil devil black military semi-automatic assault killing machine" is something I grew up around (And I still enjoy going to the range to keep some semblance of marksman skill). I mean pretty much everyone I know has some experience with bolt and/or semi-autos. Hell, I plan on very soon even getting my own! Sig MCX Virtus, and I'm going for a Class 3 license so I can get it with a 10" SBR config and a silencer.

I've noticed this too. Generally, states with stricter gun laws have higher crime rates from firearms, (tho population of cities can make a difference) because at this point criminals know a majority are unarmed.

When I lived in Indiana, I saw many people walking around with a pistol in their holster, as well as Missouri. Nobody freaked out, or if they did they were your typical anti-gun activists that doesn't understand why the person is carrying a firearm. These people have a gun not only for their safety, but to make others feel more safe. But for some reason liberals seem to think that if someone's carrying around a firearm they intend on using it. No, they don't. I can see why some people could get intimidated, but they need to learn to understand that, that person carrying a firearm on their hip is an law abiding citizen, not a criminal. These people pray they never have to pull their gun on someone to protect themselves, their family, or even a complete stranger. Firearms in the possession of responsible law abiding citizens that know gun safety, is no threat, and can make the vicinity a safer place. Please don't say, "They'll get drunk and reckless and wave their gun around". Because, NO THEY WON'T. But guns in the hands of criminals and the mentally ill, can be a threat and turn into complete chaos.

Also here in Illinois, there is no open carry, and a concealed carry license is extremely hard to get. Here, you need a FOID card (only state) to even purchase a gun or even touch guns in this state. Which requires at least 2 weeks to either be accepted or denied and there's testings for safety and few other tests as well as extensive background checks. What's funny tho.. Chicago has the highest murder rate in the country from guns, yet the hardest to obtain here, but not for criminals!

And as much as anyone who brings this up gets called a psycho or conspiracy nut or whatever, the 2nd was also intended as a check on the govt so the people can defend themselves from any leaders who might go the more oppressive dictator route. I hope with all my heart that something like that never need be done though of course.

I'm as well a firm believer in our 2nd Amendment. But the US military has beyond what any citizen has when it comes to firearms. We wouldn't accomplish much. Just being realistic here, but it's our morals that make a difference.
The weaponry the US military has is frightening as fuck. If they really wanted to, they could wipe out the population. It doesn't matter the amount of guns in our country. Not everyone knows how to shoot a gun, lots would be afraid, leaving only the ones that would risk their lives for their rights and the rights of others.
But if a scenario like that were to happen. The military would split.


On the other hand, I'm all for more intense background checks and additional state-handled legislation for states that need it. The background checks to get a NFA Class 3 license are pretty thorough so maybe something like that needs to implemented f or all firearms purchases. I'm sure there are plenty of other options to consider as well (as long as I can put my say into whether I think we should have it or not)

I as well believe in stricter testings to get a gun, but it's not as easy as it sounds. Most mental illnesses are undiagnosed or misdiagnosed. What good does psychological testings really do at this point? You can't just "watch" someone for 2 weeks to a month to find out if they're "mentally ill" or not. That would be invasion of privacy.

I also want to add something.. Instead of banning guns or desperately pushing for gun control. PUT METAL DETECTORS IN FUCKING SCHOOLS! Nobody would be dumb enough to shoot up a school knowing there's metal detectors, and security guards waiting for that idiot to try. Just like nobody's dumb enough to run up on a stranger that's armed! Signs stating it's a gun free zone doesn't stop them, obviously. Murder being a capital and heinous crime at that, doesn't stop them. When was the last time you heard of someone shooting up a place that had metal detectors? But I guess they're more worried about "gang violence" in bad neighborhoods and put metal detectors in those schools instead of safe neighborhoods. No, put them in all our schools! Why isn't this a thing? Oh wait, gun controls part of their agenda I forgot, and I'm sure tax payers wouldn't mind a tiny increase in taxes for a short period of time to make sure our children are more safe. If I had children, I'd feel more safe them being in a school with metal detectors than in a school without, sadly.

There's over 200 million guns in America. If guns were the problem there would me MANY more deaths per year from guns. Given the population and the amount of people murdered from firearms in a given year, is such a miniscule scale compared to the rest of the population. And most gun violence, is gang violence. Btw, there's not as many "massacres" as the media tries to portray. Yeah, there's been a lot of massacres in America and I'm as heartbroken as everybody else but there's a pattern in the media that anti-gun activists don't see. All the media talks about is "we need gun control" rather than coming up with "realistic" solutions to the problem, and these are the same people that's trying to change or erase history! Those deaths in the percentage to general gun violence in this country isn't even a fraction.. And as I said. Most gun violence is gang violence. Which are CRIMINALS!!

Besides, only 3-18 or so percent of the murders are caused by legal gun owners. Rest are illegally owned.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...long-time-about-crime/?utm_term=.91fd89a682e0
 
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Nah

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Companies dropping the NRA like crazy. Good to see everyone waking up across the country and seeing this "organization" for what they really are; an extremist domestic terrorist group funded by, as it turns out, the Russians!

Change has begun, and it started with these high school kids speaking up and refusing to be quiet and go away. Marches are next. Walk outs. Demonstrations. Protests. More companies dropping the NRA. Even the president is willing to sign legislation increasing the age of purchase, banning bump stocks, etc.

No. More.
I'm pretty sure that companies cutting ties with the NRA en masse has a lot more to do with the US's deep-seated dislike of Russia, as well as pressure from the companies' consumers, than that they've "seen the NRA for what it really is" or something.

What truly sickens me is that the vast majority of the anti-gunners only care about the massive media coverage but give no credence to folk in the inner cities and other problem areas that are shot at on a daily basis by gang bangers and thugs . . . with illegal firearms.
I'm just gonna take a bit to expand on what JD is saying here. Talks about gun violence in America and gun control in America usually crop up whenever one of these highly televised mass shootings occur. When talking about gun control, it seems that most people focus on rifles and the term semi-automatic is often thrown about.
But: https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u....016/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-4.xls
Rifles make up a fraction of the gun-related homicides in the USA. Consistently (I remember seeing a table that was 2010-2014 instead and 2010 and 2011 showed the same pattern). The vast majority of gun deaths come from handguns. Even if we were to be very generous and assume that 90% of the gun homicides where the firearm type is unknown/unstated were with "assault rifles", it still ends up being that 2 to 3 times more people are killed each year via handguns than with rifles.

Yet it seems that few people, if any, call for stricter gun control regarding handguns. Nobody appears to talk about all the random individuals killed all the time by your run of the mill criminal. Lot of it probably has to do with the fact that the news doesn't report much on it--"some guy killed by some thug with a handgun, like basically every day here" doesn't draw in views and generate emotion in people the same way as "9 children and a teacher murdered in latest school shooting, AR-15 used!" does. So there is a little truth to what he's saying in that particular part of his post I would think.

----

It might sound like it, but my intent is not really to take a side here, I'm just trying to participate in the discussion is all. I'm not going to pretend that I'm so well informed that I can say with great confidence that X is certainly the solution and Y is certainly not. I'm not going to pretend that what I think or say even really matters--I'm just some random bitch on the internet. But what I do know is that a lot of people needlessly die in this country, and something needs to be done about it. Over the past several years it feels like either nothing has been done or attempts to do anything have been blocked by one part of the government or another. Need to try something at this point (doing nothing rarely solves problems), whether it's more gun control or arming teachers or whatever. Even if whatever is the first thing tried doesn't work out, there is at least some small value in that in that we can say "well, we now know that doesn't work, let's try one of the other things now".

----

small miscellaneous side things:
a) regarding states with stricter/less strict gun laws have more/less gun crime, which is it really?
b) what is a bump stock (I think I have some idea of what a stock is on a gun in general) and why is this on people's short list of things to ban regarding guns lately?
 
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Arsenic

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----

small miscellaneous side things:
a) regarding states with stricter/less strict gun laws have more/less gun crime, which is it really?
b) what is a bump stock (I think I have some idea of what a stock is on a gun in general) and why is this on people's short list of things to ban regarding guns lately?

I'm on a tenno at work RN so I can answer these.

A.) Depends on a lot of factors. I think primarily culture. Like I said above other than MA I'm surrounded by mostly unregulated states including mine, yet my state has the third lowest crime rate in the country (which shows guns are only a part of the equation.

B.) More or less a rife stock that lets your hand bump back and forth like it had an elastic in it. It lets you pull the trigger on a semi auto really fast.
 
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ShinyUmbreon189

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I'm just gonna take a bit to expand on what JD is saying here. Talks about gun violence in America and gun control in America usually crop up whenever one of these highly televised mass shootings occur. When talking about gun control, it seems that most people focus on rifles and the term semi-automatic is often thrown about.
But: https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u....016/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-4.xls
Rifles make up a fraction of the gun-related homicides in the USA. Consistently (I remember seeing a table that was 2010-2014 instead and 2010 and 2011 showed the same pattern). The vast majority of gun deaths come from handguns. Even if we were to be very generous and assume that 90% of the gun homicides where the firearm type is unknown/unstated were with "assault rifles", it still ends up being that 2 to 3 times more people are killed each year via handguns than with rifles.

Thing is, in most states.. These fully auto rifles are already illegal. A very small percentage of the population of gun owners actually has the proper licensing to own such weaponry, and they're not the ones committing crimes with these firearms, the criminals that have access to them through other sources are. Last I checked you need a type I federal as well as a class III license. These are not only difficult to obtain, (requires many testings) but also very expensive as well. But a criminal or some loonie that can't obtain one, but wants one, will obtain a firearm regardless of the laws. Gang bangers have AK 47's and Uzi's for more firing power, they don't just have pistols. They will get one one way or another. If a criminal had the money and really wanted to, they could purchase a rocket launcher through the black market. Which are illegal, just sayin.

Yet it seems that few people, if any, call for stricter gun control regarding handguns. Nobody appears to talk about all the random individuals killed all the time by your run of the mill criminal. Lot of it probably has to do with the fact that the news doesn't report much on it--"some guy killed by some thug with a handgun, like basically every day here" doesn't draw in views and generate emotion in people the same way as "9 children and a teacher murdered in latest school shooting, AR-15 used!" does. So there is a little truth to what he's saying in that particular part of his post I would think.

Truth be told.. Media don't care about crime committed by thugs, it's not part of their agenda. America has more of a gang problem than a gun problem but the media obviously ignores this. They ignore black on black crime like it doesn't exist, only focus on white on black, police on black, etc because they want to keep racial inequality intact in this country and we allow it to happen. Then of course, when school shootings happen they wanna scream "gun control" without looking at the root of the problem instead make assumptions that aren't true because we're too brainwashed to notice we're being manipulated through the media. They just tend to over exaggerate the truth A LOT . Wanna stop children from getting massacred in schools? Put metal detectors in our schools, it's common sense really. But you never see the media talking about that. Also, stop making these killers famous. If the media quit targeting this as their agenda to push for gun control, you'd be surprised at what happens.

----

It might sound like it, but my intent is not really to take a side here, I'm just trying to participate in the discussion is all. I'm not going to pretend that I'm so well informed that I can say with great confidence that X is certainly the solution and Y is certainly not. I'm not going to pretend that what I think or say even really matters--I'm just some random ***** on the internet. But what I do know is that a lot of people needlessly die in this country, and something needs to be done about it. Over the past several years it feels like either nothing has been done or attempts to do anything have been blocked by one part of the government or another. Need to try something at this point (doing nothing rarely solves problems), whether it's more gun control or arming teachers or whatever. Even if whatever is the first thing tried doesn't work out, there is at least some small value in that in that we can say "well, we now know that doesn't work, let's try one of the other things now".

Thing is, government could care less about our safety. They only care about money and power, they're an evil organization controlled by evil people.
All they wanna do is fear monger the population with scare tactics to keep us distracted from what's actually going on and most get blindly sucked into this deception, It's called "fake news" for a reason. Not because we're "conspiracy theorists". Been telling most you guys this for years now, and look where America's at. It's all part of their agenda, doesn't take a genius to realize this.

Also, there's no need to arm teachers, but it could be an option. As I said, put metal detectors in schools and have armed security guards. Put 2 exit doors in classrooms and if the teachers wish to be armed, I don't see why not.

And to you anti-gun activists.. A teacher having a firearm for safety is no different than a law abiding legal gun owner having a firearm therefore making them a hypocrite. Nobody should be getting "special treatment" when it comes to firearms. Frankly, I'd bet half our teachers never shot or gun, or are against guns. Most teachers in all sections of education, have liberal views after all.
 
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I regret making this thread. Thought this time it would be different.

small miscellaneous side things:
a) regarding states with stricter/less strict gun laws have more/less gun crime, which is it really?
b) what is a bump stock (I think I have some idea of what a stock is on a gun in general) and why is this on people's short list of things to ban regarding guns lately?

a) The states with least strict gun purchasing laws have the highest gun death ratio to population.

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/pressroom/sosmap/firearm_mortality/firearm.htm

For example, the 5 highest gun death rates were (per 100,000 people, based on 2016 data): Alaska (23.3), Alabama (21.5), Louisiana (21.3), Mississippi (19.9), and Oklahoma (19.6). The lowest were Connecticut (4.6), Hawaii (4.5), New York (4.4), Rhode Island (4.1), and Massachusetts (3.4).

b) Bump stocks are parts that can be added to a semi-automatic weapon to make it shoot as fast as an automatic weapon. It's what the shooter in Las Vegas last year used.

Luckily, it looks like there is a chance to get those restricted/removed/outlawed/etc. since the NRA apparently doesn't sell very many of them and is looking for some good PR with a token effort.
 
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I regret making this thread. Thought this time it would be different.



a) The states with least strict gun purchasing laws have the highest gun death ratio to population.

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/pressroom/sosmap/firearm_mortality/firearm.htm

For example, the 5 highest gun death rates were (per 100,000 people, based on 2016 data): Alaska (23.3), Alabama (21.5), Louisiana (21.3), Mississippi (19.9), and Oklahoma (19.6). The lowest were Connecticut (4.6), Hawaii (4.5), New York (4.4), Rhode Island (4.1), and Massachusetts (3.4).

b) Bump stocks are parts that can be added to a semi-automatic weapon to make it shoot as fast as an automatic weapon. It's what the shooter in Las Vegas last year used.

Luckily, it looks like there is a chance to get those restricted/removed/outlawed/etc. since the NRA apparently doesn't sell very many of them and is looking for some good PR with a token effort.
There is a side note in the source you posted by the CDC stating that smaller state firearm related deaths may not be entirely reliable duebto massive population differences.

Further more there is no extrapolation of data in your source. Firearm related homicide and firearm related suicide are both firearm related deaths but wildly different beasts.

Is there a table that they show the difference between the two? What were to happen if I found a suicide map and overlayed that on the 'high gun death' states? Would suicides correllate with firearm suicides?

Why does saying Alaska has a gun violence problem when like, eight people live in the entire state help? What does it prove? Is there any evidence other than this source? Where is the violent crime statistic for Alaska? Is it a trend? Trending up? Down?

I absolutely loathe the 'gun death' statistic as all it does is show X amount of people died with bullets. It doesn't give accidental deaths nor homicides or suicides or even what type of firearm. While the CDC has some nice graphs and data, I feel that you have misused their data table and haven't proven much.

Would it be fair to require all of the US to carry around snow chains in their car because of some random accident in Alaska? Despite there being only three people in the entire state? (five recently died due to hazerdous road conditions).

This debate is about homicide and as such, I must discount the 'gun death' table, as they do not explain who, what, where or when, with what, or how. Crucial components to actually crafting a law.

There is nothing to regret here. There are plenty of sources available to you for free to fully research this topic from reliable, law enforcement and governmental websites.

Do you only care when a shooter makes it on tv? If so, you'll never, ever make a change. If you care about the daily life of millions of Americans, like myself, you'll try to combat actual criminals and not the lone wolf individuals, as that leads to nowhere fast.

Gangland is responsible for roughly 80% of all firearm related homicide. I posted these sources about a month or so ago so itll take me a time to find the posts.

I'll try and find them by the end of today.

edit: didn't make it back until 0200. Soon, is the answer. If you are so inclined, you can find them in my previous posts. Shouldn't be too hard to find. I believe tgey're under the 'repeal tge 2nd amendment' thread.
 
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I regret making this thread. Thought this time it would be different.

Why would it be different? It's literally SSDD. Same claims and counterclaims.
a) The states with least strict gun purchasing laws have the highest gun death ratio to population.

Other studies show no clear or significant difference. Some studies focus on just homicides and don't differentiate between self defense or not.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_59f0807ce4b01ecaf1a3e838/amp
So finally we found a study with data from the CDC, the NRA-ILA, and The Law Center to Prevent Gun Violence. It seems like as unbiased a data source as any. It compared the averages of states where background checks are required for all gun sales, including private ones. And the average gun-related homicide rate per 100,000 people among gun control states (3.31) was lower than those with no regulation of private gun sales (4.28).

But there's a problem. Two gun control states, and nine gun rights states had too few gun homicides to calculate a rate, and were left out of the study. Rather than ignore this important result, my students and I created a 2x2 table, with high (1) and low (0) gun homicide rate states, and those that regulate private sales (1), and those that do not (0). And here are our results.


In comparing our observations to a random model, we found that there was little to no difference in the results. We cannot conclude that states that regulate private gun sales have a higher, or lower, gun homicide rate.
b) Bump stocks are parts that can be added to a semi-automatic weapon to make it shoot as fast as an automatic weapon. It's what the shooter in Las Vegas last year used.

Luckily, it looks like there is a chance to get those restricted/removed/outlawed/etc. since the NRA apparently doesn't sell very many of them and is looking for some good PR with a token effort.

NRA doesn't sell any. Any ban would be pointless as there are other legal objects that give the same effect and anyone who practices enough can do the same with just a finger. Look up bumpfire without a bumpstock on YouTube.
Plus a bumpstock is easily made on a 3D printer. It's plastic and a spring.
 
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Yes, we must always keep this discussion going. If repealing the 2nd is ever going to happen, anti-gun voices have to drown out the pro-gun ones. After all, the children of America deserves to live out their lives without fear.
 
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Yes, we must always keep this discussion going. If repealing the 2nd is ever going to happen, anti-gun voices have to drown out the pro-gun ones. After all, the children of America deserves to live out their lives without fear.

The 2nd will never get repealed. Too many justifiable uses of firearms occur everyday. Nice appeal to emotion though. Just what I've come to expect from the antigun crowd.
 
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The 2nd will never get repealed. Too many justifiable uses of firearms occur everyday. Nice appeal to emotion though. Just what I've come to expect from the antigun crowd.

Well, I'm not really trying to appeal to anything. Just simply stating the basic facts. Now, I have indeed mentioned it many times but I really have to wonder why you Americans need guns while we Europeans don't have that right (and in fact CAN'T have that right. Any such attempt would be turned down by EU.) and yet we still do fine in our daily lives. Yes, the 2nd Amendment might have made sense back when it was written but I hardly can find any justifications for it in today's world. And no, protection against a supposedly tyrannical government doesn't count. You can't imagine how tired I am of that particular argument.
 
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ShinyUmbreon189

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Who said we need guns? There's a difference between a want and a need. Some people have guns for protection, some for hobbies, hunting, going to the range, etc because it's a right we have unless you have a criminal record (violent misdemeanors and all felonies) . The only people that NEED guns are police because there's savages and nut cases running around in the streets concealed with a pistol or even submachine guns, some are even crazy enough to strap a sawed-off or a rifle on them and all which are illegal for them to have. This leads into law abiding citizens wanting a gun for their own protection, especially if they live in or near any bad neighborhoods; while lot's of other law abiding citizens have them because they enjoy shooting (and no, not people). I'm sure you've heard it many times but for the millionth time gang violence is the main cause of gun violence in America, or just criminals in general. Rarely will you ever hear about a law abiding citizen catching murder cases, unless they're mentally ill. Which then they shouldn't have a gun for not just others safety but theirs as well. Anyway you slice it, banning the 2nd Amendment will only hurt law abiding citizens and there's many law abiding citizens that have firearms to protect them and their families and they will use if necessary, and some have had to.
I'm also smart enough to know civilians don't stand a chance against a tyrannical government. But if that were to ever happen I'd bet the military would split and help out the civilians because they're fighting for the Americans to keep their rights intact, those would be the true Americans.

Why should the 2nd Amendment be erased? If school shootings is your response... I'm sorry, but I've heard that way too many times. Banning guns won't stop mass murders. Evil people will do evil deeds. It doesn't matter what path lies in front of them. If they want to achieve something through hatred, they will find a way.
 
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Banning guns won't stop mass murders. Evil people will do evil deeds. It doesn't matter what path lies in front of them. If they want to achieve something through hatred, they will find a way.

Weird how all the places with better gun control have fewer mass killing then...
 
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Who said we need guns? There's a difference between a want and a need. Some people have guns for protection, some for hobbies, hunting, going to the range, etc because it's a right we have unless you have a criminal record (violent misdemeanors and all felonies) . The only people that NEED guns are police because there's savages and nut cases running around in the streets concealed with a pistol or even submachine guns, some are even crazy enough to strap a sawed-off or a rifle on them and all which are illegal for them to have. This leads into law abiding citizens wanting a gun for their own protection, especially if they live in or near any bad neighborhoods; while lot's of other law abiding citizens have them because they enjoy shooting (and no, not people). I'm sure you've heard it many times but for the millionth time gang violence is the main cause of gun violence in America, or just criminals in general. Rarely will you ever hear about a law abiding citizen catching murder cases, unless they're mentally ill. Which then they shouldn't have a gun for not just others safety but theirs as well. Anyway you slice it, banning the 2nd Amendment will only hurt law abiding citizens and there's many law abiding citizens that have firearms to protect them and their families and they will use if necessary, and some have had to.
I'm also smart enough to know civilians don't stand a chance against a tyrannical government. But if that were to ever happen I'd bet the military would split and help out the civilians because they're fighting for the Americans to keep their rights intact, those would be the true Americans.

Why should the 2nd Amendment be erased? If school shootings is your response... I'm sorry, but I've heard that way too many times. Banning guns won't stop mass murders. Evil people will do evil deeds. It doesn't matter what path lies in front of them. If they want to achieve something through hatred, they will find a way.

Lemme ask you an another question then. Do you believe in chemtrails? Do you believe that there's a Clinton/Soros/Rothchild cabal out to get you and take away all of your freedoms? And yes, the claim that taking away guns will only hurt law-abiding citizens is again an argument I'm tired of hearing.
 

ShinyUmbreon189

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Weird how all the places with better gun control have fewer mass killing then...

Lmfao. Most these countries have nowhere near the population as America. Look at lots of the middle east, most central America, Mexico, etc. Lots the cities in those areas got banned gun laws yet have the highest murder rates in the world and mass murders happen whenever they feel like it but you wouldn't know that, right? It comes down to governments not whether or not guns are legal or not. Criminals with be criminals, terrorist will be terrorist, and evil people will be evil. You need to realize America's fucked and it's not because of guns. Try a new argument.

And to be real with you.. I'd choose Australia, Canada, even lots of cities in Europe over America to live in. America's a fucking disaster and shit progressively gets worse.

BronzeHeart92 said:
Lemme ask you an another question then. Do you believe in chemtrails? Do you believe that there's a Clinton/Soros/Rothchild cabal out to get you and take away all of your freedoms? And yes, the claim that taking away guns will only hurt law-abiding citizens is again an argument I'm tired of hearing.

So I'm automatically a conspiracy theorists cause I don't agree with your liberal viewpoints on guns? Gtfoh and come back when you have an actual argument. But that's expected from an anti gun activist. Or you need to learn to read in context, I said IF it were to happen. Comprende?

Also, not saying it's the case but where is proof these school shootings aren't created by the government? Just asking because I feel there might be a few holes here. The media can and will portray what they want and skew the truth a lot more than you think or cover something that never happened to push an agenda and get those sucked into the media on board (especially America's media). It's called a broadcast for a reason, and they're all actors. Just saying I wouldn't be surprised is all. It's also funny most of these reporters and news anchor hosts don't know what they're talking about and how they push bias agendas. It's why it's called "fake news". You also know, those people you mentioned... Yeah, they do own the most power? Same with Trump. Anyone that voted Trump for his "make America great again" is a sucker. If given the chance both Hillary and Trump would turn to tyranny. It's fucked because people that are far right can't grasp Trump is actually left. But slowly more and more Americans are starting to see the holes.

There's many reasons I don't follow a particular political belief. They're all corrupt in their own ways. But if I were to tell you politics is to divide and conquer would you believe me? You don't need politics to have an opinion. We control us, not politics unless we allow the politicians and media to do it. All it does is cause arguments over the same shit over and over and over and over and over and over and nothing ever changes. It's time to wake the fuck up.
 
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Lmfao. Most these countries have nowhere near the population as America. Look at lots of the middle east, most central America, Mexico, etc. Lots the cities in those areas got banned gun laws yet have the highest murder rates in the world and mass murders happen whenever they feel like it but you wouldn't know that, right? It comes down to governments not whether or not guns are legal or not. Criminals with be criminals, terrorist will be terrorist, and evil people will be evil. You need to realize America's fucked and it's not because of guns. Try a new argument.

Countries with corrupt or failing governments naturally are going to have higher crime rates. The US' government isn't good but it's not that bad.

You have a functioning government and a disproportionately high gun violence rate. It's really not complicated.
 

ShinyUmbreon189

VLONE coming soon
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Countries with corrupt or failing governments naturally are going to have higher crime rates. The US' government isn't good but it's not that bad.

You have a functioning government and a disproportionately high gun violence rate. It's really not complicated.

What? America's system isn't corrupt? What planet do you live on? Seriously man.. America's government doesn't give a shit about it's citizens, they only care about what benefits them. Look at our debt problem, drug problem (America created war on drugs for other reasons, not what they told you), gang problems, immigration problems, racial inequality, the judicial and prison system, etc.. Most of us can't afford to live here comfortably, it's why so many of us Americans are in debt, I'm in debt from a surgery 12k AFTER insurance my appendix was leaking for 2 months and I literally almost fucking died, they were surprised I was alive and I'm in debt cause they kept doing wrong testings and wouldn't take me seriously. Fuck our health system as well, and our education system for shits and giggles. Not to mention the ridiculous amounts of money they spend on war and how the "NSA is to protect us from terrorist", yeah bullshit. Yeah it's kinda off topic but I hope you see my point.
 
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What? America's system isn't corrupt? What planet do you live on? Seriously man.. America's government doesn't give a shit about it's citizens, they only care about what benefits them. Look at our debt problem, drug problem (America created war on drugs for other reasons, not what they told you), gang problems, immigration problems, racial inequality, the judicial and prison system, etc.. Most of us can't afford to live here comfortably, it's why so many of us Americans are in debt, I'm in debt from a surgery 12k AFTER insurance my appendix was leaking for 2 months and I literally almost fucking died, they were surprised I was alive and I'm in debt cause they kept doing wrong testings and wouldn't take me seriously. Fuck our health system as well, and our education system for shits and giggles. Not to mention the ridiculous amounts of money they spend on war and how the "NSA is to protect us from terrorist", yeah bullshit. Yeah it's kinda off topic but I hope you see my point.

Don't get me wrong, your government is god awful but the US isn't run by cartels or a dictator in the middle of a civil war. You draw unreasonable parallels.
 
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