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  #1    
Old August 9th, 2018 (2:46 PM).
Jonathan1990 Jonathan1990 is offline
     
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    Just built a water deck which has won some matches.

    Palkia EX with Aqua Turbo and Perl Hurricane
    2x Piplup with Splatter
    2x Piplup with Water Splash
    2x Prinplup with Bubble Beam and Water Splash
    2x Prinplup with Ice Beam
    2x Empoleon with Total Command and Whirlpool
    Blastoise EX with Rapid Spin and Splash Bomb
    Glalie EX with Ice Breath and Instant Freeze
    Pidgeot EX with Mirror Move and Feather Lance
    3x Alolen Vulpix with Powder Snow and Icy Snow
    Alolen Vulpix with Beacon and Icy Snow
    Alolen Ninetails GX with Ice Blade, Blizzard Edge and Ice Path GX
    Palkia GX with Spatial Control, Hydro Pressure and Zero Vanish GX
    Volcanion with Sauna Blast (Jet Geyser Ability)
    Wishiwashi GX with Water Gun, Torrential Vortex and Blue Surge GX
    2x Drampa GX with Righteous Edge, Berserk and Big Wheel GX

    2x Heavy Ball
    Energy Retrieval
    Potion
    Greedy Dice
    Hau
    Professor Kukui
    2x Lana
    Brock's Grit
    Wishful Baton

    3x Double Colourless Energy
    22x Water Energy
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      #2    
    Old August 9th, 2018 (7:10 PM).
    donavannj's Avatar
    donavannj donavannj is offline
     
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    I think you're trying to spread yourself too far by using too many different Pokemon. Which ones do you find yourself using the most when you play it?
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      #3    
    Old August 13th, 2018 (11:34 PM).
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    Hands Hands is online now
    I was saying Boo-urns
     
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    22 water energy is absolutely way too much in any deck.

    There's not really any consistency here. Focus on Empoleon, I can give you two to make it up to a set.

    Loosely you want something like

    4-3-4 Empoleon line
    2 Alolan Vulpix (Beacon)
    3 Dunsparce (Strike and Run)
    1 Shaymin (Shining Legends one)

    Empoleon is your main guy, Vulpix and Dunsparce exist to help set him up (Dunsparce grabs three basics out of the deck, Vulpix lets you grab the evolutions into hand) Shaymin is a retaliation attacker (Rally back does 120 if your opponent took a knock out against you their prior turn. It hits big threats like Zygarde GX, Lycanroc GX, Lapras GX and Greninja GX for 240, which knocks out all of them in a single move).

    You run 4x Counter Energy and 10x Water. Counter Energy acts as two of any kind if your opponent is winning (this is how you utilise Shaymin)

    Run 4x Brooklet Hill, 3x Rare Candy, 4x Ultra Ball and 4x Aqua Patch to ensure you can set up. Choice band, crasher wake, rescue stretcher, counter catcher and enhanced hammer are all essential too, although their counts can be played around with a bit.

    Cards like potion are completely irrelevant, they cannot heal enough damage to be meaningful. Greedy Dice are also dead cards as you don't have any prize manipulation. Having a slew of GX/EX cards that do not support or sync well with each other is also a bad idea, they're just easy prizes for an opponent.
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      #4    
    Old August 15th, 2018 (8:31 PM).
    Jonathan1990 Jonathan1990 is offline
       
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      Quote:
      Originally Posted by Hands View Post
      22 water energy is absolutely way too much in any deck.

      There's not really any consistency here. Focus on Empoleon, I can give you two to make it up to a set.

      Loosely you want something like

      4-3-4 Empoleon line
      2 Alolan Vulpix (Beacon)
      3 Dunsparce (Strike and Run)
      1 Shaymin (Shining Legends one)

      Empoleon is your main guy, Vulpix and Dunsparce exist to help set him up (Dunsparce grabs three basics out of the deck, Vulpix lets you grab the evolutions into hand) Shaymin is a retaliation attacker (Rally back does 120 if your opponent took a knock out against you their prior turn. It hits big threats like Zygarde GX, Lycanroc GX, Lapras GX and Greninja GX for 240, which knocks out all of them in a single move).

      You run 4x Counter Energy and 10x Water. Counter Energy acts as two of any kind if your opponent is winning (this is how you utilise Shaymin)

      Run 4x Brooklet Hill, 3x Rare Candy, 4x Ultra Ball and 4x Aqua Patch to ensure you can set up. Choice band, crasher wake, rescue stretcher, counter catcher and enhanced hammer are all essential too, although their counts can be played around with a bit.

      Cards like potion are completely irrelevant, they cannot heal enough damage to be meaningful. Greedy Dice are also dead cards as you don't have any prize manipulation. Having a slew of GX/EX cards that do not support or sync well with each other is also a bad idea, they're just easy prizes for an opponent.
      So I took your advice and edited the deck putting some of the cards you've recommended in but I'm not doing very good with this set up. The cards I used before just go to my experiences of playing the game. Tool and stadium cards like are mostly useless as about 90% of opponents always have a Field Blower card to remove them. Some of the cards mentioned I don't have such as Shaymin and I only have 1 Rare Candy. Counter energies are rubbish once you have the same prize cards as your opponent and with less water energy it can take loads of turns to get 2 more which is why I had 22. I also put loads of the GX and EX in as people seem to win all the time doing that.
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        #5    
      Old August 15th, 2018 (11:11 PM).
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      Hands Hands is online now
      I was saying Boo-urns
       
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      Quote:
      Originally Posted by Jonathan1990 View Post
      So I took your advice and edited the deck putting some of the cards you've recommended in but I'm not doing very good with this set up. The cards I used before just go to my experiences of playing the game. Tool and stadium cards like are mostly useless as about 90% of opponents always have a Field Blower card to remove them. Some of the cards mentioned I don't have such as Shaymin and I only have 1 Rare Candy. Counter energies are rubbish once you have the same prize cards as your opponent and with less water energy it can take loads of turns to get 2 more which is why I had 22. I also put loads of the GX and EX in as people seem to win all the time doing that.
      I've got a combined 8 years playing competitively over the E-Reader, EX, XY and SM formats. In that time I've won city championships, league challenges, league nights at the most competitive league in the UK and top 8'd League Cups and the now non existent State Championships. Trust me when I say that 22 energy is far too much and that just throwing in random EXs and GXs is a bad idea.

      Decks need to be consistent to do well, I'm happy to give you rare candies and the stadiums you need. Counter energy is far from rubbish, if you look at any sanctioned event that matters (regionals, internationals etc) you'll see many decks running them in the top 8s. Your argument that it's useless after you equalize or take lead on prizes is moot. It still acts as a single energy, it's no different to having to attach two basic by that point.
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        #6    
      Old August 15th, 2018 (11:12 PM).
      Hands's Avatar
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      I was saying Boo-urns
       
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      I mean most decks (with the exception of Zoroark and Garbodor decks) run a 1-2 field blower count. Most are running just the single one. Tools and Stadiums are hugely important.
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        #7    
      Old August 16th, 2018 (1:59 PM). Edited August 16th, 2018 by donavannj.
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      donavannj donavannj is offline
       
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      Quote:
      Originally Posted by Jonathan1990 View Post
      So I took your advice and edited the deck putting some of the cards you've recommended in but I'm not doing very good with this set up. The cards I used before just go to my experiences of playing the game. Tool and stadium cards like are mostly useless as about 90% of opponents always have a Field Blower card to remove them. Some of the cards mentioned I don't have such as Shaymin and I only have 1 Rare Candy. Counter energies are rubbish once you have the same prize cards as your opponent and with less water energy it can take loads of turns to get 2 more which is why I had 22. I also put loads of the GX and EX in as people seem to win all the time doing that.
      Can we get a list of what your decklist looked like during this so we can better assess where you're running into problems?

      Tools and Stadiums are very important. It's not just having them in, it's knowing when to place them down and attach them.
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        #8    
      Old August 18th, 2018 (12:50 PM).
      Jonathan1990 Jonathan1990 is offline
         
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        I can show you how I've edited the deck with 4 screenshots.

        1. The Piplup set: http://prntscr.com/kk8icc - I only have the 2 Empoleon cards from the Imperial Command theme deck.
        2. Other cards: http://prntscr.com/kk8jcn - I kept that Palkia GX in as I like it. Alolan Ninetails from Luminous Frost deck can't be hit by GX Pokemon. I already mentioned that I don't have Shaymin and wouldn't know what set it's even in.
        3. Trainer cards: http://prntscr.com/kk8lw0 - Yes I only have 1 rare candy.
        4. More trainers and energy cards: http://prntscr.com/kk8mh7 - I have 3 counter energies as I'm buying Crimson Invasion booster packs to try and get Guzzlord GX for a possible Dark/Psychic deck as that card always wins me.
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          #9    
        Old August 19th, 2018 (11:04 PM). Edited August 20th, 2018 by Hands.
        Hands's Avatar
        Hands Hands is online now
        I was saying Boo-urns
         
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        Quote:
        Originally Posted by Jonathan1990 View Post
        I can show you how I've edited the deck with 4 screenshots.

        1. The Piplup set: http://prntscr.com/kk8icc - I only have the 2 Empoleon cards from the Imperial Command theme deck.
        2. Other cards: http://prntscr.com/kk8jcn - I kept that Palkia GX in as I like it. Alolan Ninetails from Luminous Frost deck can't be hit by GX Pokemon. I already mentioned that I don't have Shaymin and wouldn't know what set it's even in.
        3. Trainer cards: http://prntscr.com/kk8lw0 - Yes I only have 1 rare candy.
        4. More trainers and energy cards: http://prntscr.com/kk8mh7 - I have 3 counter energies as I'm buying Crimson Invasion booster packs to try and get Guzzlord GX for a possible Dark/Psychic deck as that card always wins me.
        What's your PTCGO handle? I'll set up a private trade offer with whatever rare candies, empoleon and some other bits I can spare for you and you can just give me an energy or something

        I've sorted two fairly robust lists you could look into below. The first one is a counter deck that makes use of your opponent taking the lead. Counter catcher lets you control their side of the field and Mimikyu covers popular threats like Necrozma GX (and Malamars, Mewtwo GX etc) alongside Buzzwole and its GX and Garbodor. Shaymin covers water threats and big guys like Lycanroc GX and Zygarde GX. Tapu Lele covers Ultra Necrozma GX and Rayquaza GX. Empoleon is your main attacker still, but your counter buddies will be able to reliably net you 2-prize knock outs whilst your opponent can only take one prize knock outs against you. Shrine of Punishment softens awkward to hit numbers on big GXs (making a one hit on things like Zoroark GX much, much more manageable) and doesn't effect you due to you not running GXs

        The second list is straight Empoleon, with Ninetales as a staller. It's a bit more straight forward. You still use Shrine to soften GXs, but Brooklet is there for an early set up. Lusamine ensures you can keep the pressure with Shrines even if they're field blown away.


        Counter Control list

        Spoiler:

        Pokemon: 16

        4x Piplup
        3x Prinplup
        4x Empoleon
        2x Alolan Vulpix
        1x Shaymin (Shining legends)
        1x Mimikyu (GRI)
        1x Tapu Lele (Ultra Prism)

        Items: 19

        4x Ultra Ball
        4x Aqua Patch
        3x Rare Candy
        3x Choice Band
        2x Counter Catcher
        2x Rescue Stretcher
        1x Field Blower

        Supporters: 10

        4x Cynthia
        2x Guzma
        2x Tate and Liza
        2x Crasher Wake

        Stadiums: 4

        4x Shrine of Punishment


        Energy: 11

        7x Water
        4x Counter


        Stall and strike list

        Spoiler:
        Pokemon: 15

        4x Piplup
        3x Prinplup
        4x Empoleon
        2x Alolan Vulpix
        2x Alolan Ninetales (LB)

        Items: 18

        4x Ultra Ball
        4x Aqua Patch
        3x Rare Candy
        3x Choice Band
        2x Rescue Stretcher
        1x Field Blower
        1x Counter Catcher

        Supporters: 12

        4x Cynthia
        4x Lillie
        3x Guzma
        2x Crasher Wake
        1x Lusamine

        Stadiums: 5

        3x Shrine of Punishment
        2x Brooklet Hill


        Energy: 10

        10x Water
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