Why are there still Nazis around?

I mean, it should be obvious that Nazis are pure fucking evil, but some people are now publicly, visibly proclaiming themselves to be white supremacists and white nationalists and neo-Nazis, and who openly advocate for or defend murder and violence. Why is this evil ideology attractive to them? Is it because we didn't do anything to stop them from spreading? How did this happen?

I don't think you could ever put an ideological cat back in the bag. For every ideological has-been there's a group trying to bring it back. The out-and-out folk have always been there. What's different this time around, I think, is that white nationalism is being legitimized (through Donald Trump) and its opponents delegitimized ("fake news"). People who might be sympathetic towards white nationalism but were turned off by its fringe status would be more willing to be openly supremacist. You could think of it as similar to when the LGBT community gained more visibility.

Esper said:

Why is this evil ideology attractive to them?

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To put it quite simply, because they are people who are vehemently afraid of equality and what it means for them. To expand a little, the lack of their overt supremacy is something they cannot abide by - being equal with the people they have learned to hate is tantamount to being equal with filth. Toni Morrison talked about how racists fear the absence of racism and realising what little worth they have. If the white supremacist structures that have supported them are failing, what do they have?

Earlier I mentioned the word learned, as we all know that this kind of loathing is not an inherent feature. Learned by way of family, or learned by way of a poor interpretation of the world around them, combined with anger. We all get the general idea. It's a way of comforting oneself about their place in the world - I may be (x), but at least I'm not a faggot, a tranny, the n word and so on and so forth. The same kind of thinking goes for pride - I got to where I am today because I am a superior human being. Or because they have a cognitive dissonance which allows them to take part in well-established white supremacist structures without guilt. Just playing the game or what have you.

But that's a simple elaboration on stuff we know, or at least, should know. In terms of America, this is nothing new: white supremacist and eventually neo-Nazi ideals are inextricably linked to the country. Trump isn't even the first president being alleged to have personal identification with these ideals, you have presidents with similar murky issues. But as Kanzler mentioned, what is different is that it is being legitimised at a level which has not been seen within the majority of our lifetimes. This time, white supremacy is about reclaiming a time in which they believed they were unquestionably on top. This is different to previous flare ups where white supremacy's overt goal was extending the status quo. I am of the viewpoint that white supremacy has of course never left, but the key thing to understand is that these people believed that it did, and when it disappeared, so did all their fortunes and all that was good in the world. And while successive presidencies have played to this abhorrent ideal, none have been so overt in courting the idea that through this administration, you may rise up and reclaim what has been lost to you. Not that the Trump administration is solely to blame, of course. But there is something to behold when the highest office in the land, the definition of America for many (and usually the people who hold sympathies for these beliefs in the first place), is telling you that you are legitimate. If the president and his people are sending you signals that are playing to your sympathies, it is no small wonder that these people picked them up and ran with it.

Right wing parties spent decades cultivating their followers in a direction that was pretty much always guaranteed to reach this as the logical conclusion. Billing yourselves as the antithesis of social progression and catering to the whims of the ever further right only feedback loops the right until this eventuality is reached.

People are right to say that this is the pushback, the vocal anti-equality movement springing up to oppose modern social progress which has kind of sped ahead incredibly quickly in the last few decades, but you can't just pretend that these are people left behind or those who otherwise naturally reached this point of nazism, they're a monster of the hard right's own creation.

Trump definitely empowers these people, I mean he quite literally represents them and has made sure to stock his cabinet with them, and that lets them boil over and start feeling powerful in public.

1. Because people are stupid.
2. You can't just start killing random neo Nazi's there's too many of them scattered all through the US, yet they're still a minority.
3. I almost feel it's more media propaganda than the actual truth itself, can't trust what they say with a grain of salt.
4. Just learn to ignore it. Giving them attention only makes them stronger. This is why I ignore 99% of the crap going on. I don't have time to worry about shit like this.
5. This ones sarcasm. Trump. Again, it's sarcasm.

First off, neo-nazis are shadow puppets of Hitler.

Also, they haven't learned that there's no such thing as a master race, and that diversity is the key of any species' survival.

And, just for something that would tick off those white supremists:

It's pretty much been proven that humans originated from Africa. This means that early humans migrated from Africa to other parts of the world. After living in other types of climates for many generations, eventually *poof* white people popped out. What am I getting at here? If some event occurred that completely wiped out white people, black people could just go live in other climates for many generation until *poof* white people popped out. Not convinced? Guess what? It works the other way around, if white supremists ever completely eliminated other races, after living in different climates for many generations *poof* other races will re-emerge. It's beautiful the way DNA works, isn't it? >:3

Interesting that there's no mass hysteria/condemnations when a black lives matter protest turns a city into a war zone.

Lipstick Vogue said:

Interesting that there's no mass hysteria/condemnations when a black lives matter protest turns a city into a war zone.

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This is exactly what I was talking about. This is such a ridiculous line of thinking. It reminds me of back in primary school where one kid would break a rule, so another would and then try to use the first kid doing it as their defense - they'd always still get punished.

It's the same thing. It doesn't matter if BLM show up to a police station with freaking RPGs, advocating for racial cleansing is wrong. Any form of discrimination is wrong. Driving a car into a group of protesters is still very wrong.

I'm not a fan of BLM. I'm really not. However, can we please stop pretending that they are anywhere near as bad as the KKK or neo-nazis and can we please stop pretending any wrongdoing in their ranks validates the wrongdoing of others.

Pointing out a double standard is not a defense or endorsement of the other side.

Let's say that in Charlottesville it was instead a black person/BLM member who plowed a car through the crowd. Would people really care as much as they did when the neo-nazi/KKK guy did it? People will probably say, like Gimme, that yes, they do think it is just as bad and it doesn't matter who did it, what's wrong is wrong. But do they really feel that way, or is it just lip service? Even if everybody in this thread truly believes it, it's like yeah ok whatever so a handful of the billions of people in the world get it, big whoop.

Though there is a valid point in that people do need to stop going "hey look, someone affiliated with BLM [or insert some other group here] did something bad, clearly they all must be as bad as them nazis and KKK dudes!". You can't be a (neo-)nazi or a KKK member without advocating for and wanting genocide and racial superiority. You can be a BLM member without advocating for and wanting genocide and racial superiority. Let's not pretend the two groups are the same when they're not, especially if you're going to use the words/actions of a few to try and paint all of a group in the same light (we call that generalizations and they suck and people need to stop making them).

The idea that there's some crazy double standard seems a little ridiculous to me, because there hasn't been cases of someone who's actually affiliated with BLM driving a car through a crowd, and people are constantly bending over backwards to paint them as terrorists. Yeah, there's been riots, but in general protests that are organised by BLM are peaceful. There's also a difference between protesting unlawful killings by law enforcement and protesting because you think everyone who's Jewish or black should die.

Lipstick Vogue said:

Interesting that there's no mass hysteria/condemnations when a black lives matter protest turns a city into a war zone.

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https://www.nytimes.com/2015/04/29/...ling-crisis-across-us-obama-says.html?mcubz=0

If the President takes appropriate leadership regarding an incident, the rest of the country doesn't have to try to compensate for it for days after.

I'll concede there's something wrong with this country when black nationalists who want to oppress and deport white people have a rally and nobody speaks about it, how about that?

Lipstick Vogue said:

Interesting that there's no mass hysteria/condemnations when a black lives matter protest turns a city into a war zone.

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It's the liberal media, and people that are far "leftists" will usually defend their case in an asinine way to defend what they believe, which is fine but they look like an asshat doing so and most likely want a socialist country. This is why they're saying anyone that supports Trump is "racist". Well if that's the case, if you voted Hillary you're a "feminist". Which we all know this clearly isn't the case so the liberal media and far leftists need to just sit down and quit trying to blame the right for all these problems, same with the far right, they need to do the same. It's all an agenda to divide us and people are too oblivious to see it! It seriously irritates me that people are this blind and feeble, I just don't understand. Turn the news off and talk to your fellow neighbors and you'd realize that more of the population are peaceful citizens. It's EXTREMISTS in every group that are the problem, not citizens. Only the feeble minded believe in the medias deception and those that believe this crap are so far deep in denial that they don't even have a clue what's going on other than what they see in the media.

@Grey Wind... No... But they KILLED COPS!! What the fuck does that tell you? Huh? Defending these people don't make it right, the worlds a very cold place and it's filled with violent, hateful, and evil people. Always has, always will be.

Rant over/ I'm done here. Probably gonna get banned for stating an opinion lol, oh well.

I challenge you to make one point without going on a tangent about the machinations of the liberal media.

How about you just open your eyes? Maybe read articles on the right side for once or watch conservative media for a change so you can see what the media twists on both sides? You'd see exactly what I'm talking about. Let me guess. You're the typical liberal that only pays attention to liberal media? Thought so. Explains why you don't see the obvious. Real eyes realize real lies. I'm not mad tho, I find it hysterical you or your fellow liberals can't see it thought. It's comical really. It's common sense I don't need to put it on a silver platter for you. Yet we wonder why society's so divided. Hmmmmm.

In retrospect, I suppose my request was overly strenuous for you.

ShinyUmbreon189 said:

How about you just open your eyes? Maybe read articles on the right side for once or watch conservative media for a change so you can see what the media twists on both sides? You'd see exactly what I'm talking about. Let me guess. You're the typical liberal that only pays attention to liberal media? Thought so. Explains why you don't see the obvious. Real eyes realize real lies. I'm not mad tho, I find it hysterical you or your fellow liberals can't see it thought. It's comical really. It's common sense I don't need to put it on a silver platter for you. Yet we wonder why society's so divided. Hmmmmm.

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All media is bad, but liberal media is badder, yes?

It's interesting to notice the victim complex here with the constant claims that they're ready to be banned for "stating their opinion" before/after saying nonsense/controversial things, as if it's a preempt to vindicate themselves when they're inevitably banned for crossing some line somewhere.

I can't tell if shinyumbreon is one of those centrist elitist types, the whole "both the left and right are crazy and wrong and only i, the rational centrist, can see the true truth" thing or if they're just a run of the mill kind of conservative who'd happily call liberals "libt__ds" but with a dose of self awareness in the nature of right wing media that's immediately displaced and channelled into a "only the farthest right news sources that still reaffirms my views and perceptions are true news" sort of shtick

ShinyUmbreon189 said:

@Grey Wind... No... But they KILLED COPS!! What the **** does that tell you? Huh? Defending these people don't make it right, the worlds a very cold place and it's filled with violent, hateful, and evil people. Always has, always will be.

Rant over/ I'm done here. Probably gonna get banned for stating an opinion lol, oh well.

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What? You mean that, like, one unhinged guy who killed police and supported BLM? It sure is unfortunate that the hivemind entity that BLM is decided to puppet the body of a supporter for a while in order to do some random crime completely unrelated to their central cause

@Kanzler.. I'm not going to argue with someone that doesn't have basic comprehension of contexts. Come back when you take your barrier down. I clearly said BOTH SIDES but you just saw liberal and put your leftist barrier up. Yes?
This is the absolute LAST time I'm going to say this. THE MEDIA IN GENERAL HAS AN AGENDA TO KEEP SOCIETY DIVIDED!! If you lack the intellect to see this, then you aren't worth arguing with, period.

ShinyUmbreon189 said:

@Kanzler.. I'm not going to argue with someone that doesn't have basic comprehension of contexts. Come back when you take your barrier down. I clearly said BOTH SIDES but you just saw liberal and put your leftist barrier up. Yes?
This is the absolute LAST time I'm going to say this. THE MEDIA IN GENERAL HAS AN AGENDA TO KEEP SOCIETY DIVIDED!! If you lack the intellect to see this, then you aren't worth arguing with, period.

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Don't you know it's biased to say both sides suck but then harp on one side in particular? Who am I kidding if I say something like "Republicans and Democrats are both corrupt, but man those Republicans..." it's obvious I'm demonstrating a liberal bias. Likewise with you, you mention "both sides" once and criticize Her for being liberal several times, you might not want to admit it, but the bias comes through in what you're saying. I think you've got a couple barriers of your own to take down before you start raving at other people for it.

I'm not even sure if you've understood my post anyways - I called you out for an anti-liberal bias, and you haven't even addressed it - all you did is turn it around and accused me of having a liberal bias. Do I need to have a liberal bias to call out your anti-liberal bias or do all I need is to have some critical thought and ask some darn questions?

I think the neo-Nazis are suddenly revealing themselves as a part of a reactionary movement against the Left's focus on social issues, such as gay marriage and transgender rights. This focus has resulted in a significant amount of identity politics, and the neo-Nazis are the flip side of this identity politics. Especially considering how anti-egalitarian they are by nature and how increasingly egalitarian-minded the Left has become. In some weird twisted sense, they feel "left behind."