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Old September 18th, 2007 (10:18 AM).
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I was considering using Steelix.

Ok now i have the basic moveset for it, which is

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Impish Nature
252 HP 252 DEF 6 ATT
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Roar
- Stealth Rock


i just need someones advice who is experienced with using this


So my problem is should Rest be on here somewhere due to steelix's lack of a recovery move for a wall ?
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Old September 18th, 2007 (11:09 AM).
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I wouldn't use Rest on Steelix. He can't take a special attack AT ALL D: Explosion might be better ._. I use Steeli on my team, but not too frequently x-x Ask Anti.
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Old September 18th, 2007 (11:30 AM).
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Alright, I'll give my full analysis on steelix, since I have the time. It seems you are playing D/P, so I'll skip my 3rd gen sets...well...

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Relaxed
252 HP, 252 Defense, 6 Att (you can balance defense and attack more if you wish, though I prefer max defense to absorb as much as possible)
~Gyro Ball
~EQ
~Roar
~Explosion/Rock Slide/Stone Edge/Rest/Stealth Rock/Toxic

Pretty Standard...though steelix really needs roar in most cases...it has saved me so much. With the last slot, you can do anything, but I prefer Rock Slide or Explosion...stone edge's accuracy really ticks me off...so I prefer not to use it...and BTW, steelix is a very good exploder.

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Brave
252 Attack, 200 HP, 58 defense
~EQ
~Stone Edge
~Gyro Ball
~Explosion/elemental Fang/Double edge (rock head only)

Yeah, who uses this? No one, but it can work, especially on trick room teams...you'd be amazed at the power of my CB steelix...you'd be surprised at how well it works...though a bit novelty, I'll give you that.

Oh, I gotta go, forgot I had basketball...I'll finish later, as steelix can be utilized in many ways...
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Old September 18th, 2007 (11:33 AM).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cakekun View Post
I wouldn't use Rest on Steelix. He can't take a special attack AT ALL D: Explosion might be better ._. I use Steeli on my team, but not too frequently x-x Ask Anti.
Anti commented on Explosion.

Steelix @:Leftovers/Macho Brace/Salac Berry (With Rock Polish).
Trait: Sturdy
Impish Nature
Toxic/Taunt
Gyro Ball/Rock Polish
Earthquake
Explosion.
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Old September 18th, 2007 (1:59 PM).
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Rock polish is a waste on steelix...unless you are VERY careful with that EV spread...with 30 base speed, it aint outrunning anything...but after 2 rock polishes, maybe 3, it has nice speed...though umbreon fails in 4th gen, if you can pass a trap to steelix against a poke far outmatched by it *coughphysicalsweepernotHeracrossorVirecough* then you can set up, and sweep away...or you can use it with taunt against annoyers and trappers and walls...and wam! But it is extremely tricky to set up.

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Impish
252 Def, 252 HP, 6 Att
~Explosion
~Rest/Roar/Toxic
~Rock Slide
~EQ

My good 'ol 3rd gen set. Rock Slide or explosion can be replaced if you need to replace one, but otherwise, pick one of the 3 in the 2nd slot depending on your needs. Good thing is that this works in 4th gen too...just be careful since steelix is very weak to mixed sweepers. Good thing about roar is that steelix goes last anyways...so yeah, it can work great if you'd rather not use gyro ball...

[email protected] Orb/Wide Lens
Adamant
252 attack, split HP and defense
~Screech
~Explosion/Stone Edge/Crunch
~EQ
~Taunt/Toxic

Here's another novelty...use either taunt or toxic to get the foe to want to switch...or someother move that encourages the foe to switch...something like confuse ray, though Steel doesnn't learn it. Then, the next turn, use screech, and the foe that comes in...well, its defense is lowered...and you better hope screech hits. Then, absorb a hit (or so you hope) and attack with EQ or another move, depending on the opponent...there's a good chance for a OHKO...so blast away!

Since steelix has options like stealth rock and all that, you should consider using those moves too...so yeah, the coolest wall eva! Steelix! BTW, the novelty sets are of high risk...
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Old September 18th, 2007 (3:07 PM).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anti-Pop Culture Warrior 13 View Post
Rock polish is a waste on steelix...unless you are VERY careful with that EV spread...with 30 base speed, it aint outrunning anything...but after 2 rock polishes, maybe 3, it has nice speed...though umbreon fails in 4th gen, if you can pass a trap to steelix against a poke far outmatched by it *coughphysicalsweepernotHeracrossorVirecough* then you can set up, and sweep away...or you can use it with taunt against annoyers and trappers and walls...and wam! But it is extremely tricky to set up.

[email protected]
Impish
252 Def, 252 HP, 6 Att
~Explosion
~Rest/Roar/Toxic
~Rock Slide
~EQ

My good 'ol 3rd gen set. Rock Slide or explosion can be replaced if you need to replace one, but otherwise, pick one of the 3 in the 2nd slot depending on your needs. Good thing is that this works in 4th gen too...just be careful since steelix is very weak to mixed sweepers. Good thing about roar is that steelix goes last anyways...so yeah, it can work great if you'd rather not use gyro ball...

[email protected] Orb/Wide Lens
Adamant
252 attack, split HP and defense
~Screech
~Explosion/Stone Edge/Crunch
~EQ
~Taunt/Toxic

Here's another novelty...use either taunt or toxic to get the foe to want to switch...or someother move that encourages the foe to switch...something like confuse ray, though Steel doesnn't learn it. Then, the next turn, use screech, and the foe that comes in...well, its defense is lowered...and you better hope screech hits. Then, absorb a hit (or so you hope) and attack with EQ or another move, depending on the opponent...there's a good chance for a OHKO...so blast away!

Since steelix has options like stealth rock and all that, you should consider using those moves too...so yeah, the coolest wall eva! Steelix! BTW, the novelty sets are of high risk...
Yay for novelty sets!

Steelix @: Enigma/Ganlon/Chople/Occa Berry
Trait: Sturdy
Brave Nature
Hidden Power Water/Rock
Roar/Block
Stealth Rock/Protect
Toxic/Earthquake/Psych Up/Explosion. Risky novelty set. Why? Because he won't be ohko'ing anything with low special attack, and the fact that now, all Hidden Power's are special.
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Old September 18th, 2007 (4:04 PM).
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Stealth Shuffling Steelix fails.

Use this moveset:

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Earthquake
Stone Edge
Rest/Toxic/Stealth Rock
Rest/Toxic/ Stealth Rock
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Old September 18th, 2007 (4:58 PM).
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After using it in competitive battling, I decided Steelix isn't that good as it appears to be. Its types surely screw things over... pretending to be the great physical wall, it actually isn't, when taking damage from common fighting / ground attacks.

Taunt on him is somewhat unneeded, when he can't be poisoned or paralyzed. You can always Roar away the stat uppers, although other pokemon do much better job at this.

Like suggested, CB Steelix is extremely efficient with Trick Room support. But other than that, it's not so recommended.
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Old September 18th, 2007 (5:08 PM).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Syaoran View Post
After using it in competitive battling, I decided Steelix isn't that good as it appears to be. Its types surely screw things over... pretending to be the great physical wall, it actually isn't, when taking damage from common fighting / ground attacks.

Taunt on him is somewhat unneeded, when he can't be poisoned or paralyzed. You can always Roar away the stat uppers, although other pokemon do much better job at this.

Like suggested, CB Steelix is extremely efficient with Trick Room support. But other than that, it's not so recommended.
Well, steelix>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>shuckle at least:) But really, if prediction is used, steelix shouldn't be absorbing too many EQs and close combats. What kind of idiot lets steelix get hammered by heracross? Really, Steelix is a brute monster. Being my 3rd favorite pokemon, I've used about every single moveset possible on it and have had great success with most. Stealth Rock Shuffling, as Penguin said, didn't work so well, since he was dead pretty quick...but CB steelix is not the best set.

While opinions are opinions, steelix has been proven to be able to take hits. With poor prediction, steelix=dead, since it can't take too many EQs...but if you use simple prediction tactics, steelix gains power. Have a pokemon that resists EQ on your team always when you use steelix, or one that resists it REALLY well.

So yeah, my vent about steelix. BTW, that screech novelty set actually worked pretty well...
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Old September 18th, 2007 (5:15 PM).
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I love Steelix!I personally like the common EQ,Gyro Ball,Roar,Rock Slide set but thats just me!as Anti said with a little prediction he can RIP through teams completly!
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Old September 18th, 2007 (5:16 PM).
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I don't see a point to using Steelix as a wall when it can't take the common hits. IMO he's only greatness is not being poisoned or paralyzed. I'd rather use Forretress or Skarmory for their better types.

and Shuckle > Steelix.
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Old September 18th, 2007 (5:17 PM).
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Well, steelix isn't a sweeper, but he can PREVENT sweepers from ripping through it. IT can hit TTar pretty hard too, and since EQ isn't STABed, you will survive longer than you think...so yeah, steelix might not have the resistances Skarm has, but it has everything else better IMO.

EDIT: Shuckle sucks! It is walled by almost anything, like aromatherapy bliss. Until you give me a way shuckle can inflict damage with a stalling movest, steelix pwns shuckle...that's hardly an opinion...how many shuckles have you seen in OU? None...
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Old September 18th, 2007 (5:30 PM).
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Are you saying Steelix beats EQ Tyranitar? Hell no. Not to mention you're even more screwed if Tyranitar happens to carry Fire Blast.

Steelix's type is exactly why it's black listed and not OU. He is mediocre as a wall, and less than sufficient as an attacker.

As for Shuckle, I already explained in the other topic why it doesn't have to cause damage. Not every pokemon is resistant to Toxic, and I don't see people running Aromatherapy Blissey everywhere. -- I suggest we keep the Shuckle argument at the Shuckle thread tho. ;)
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Old September 18th, 2007 (5:33 PM).
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Aromatherapy Blissey IS everywhere. O_o WTF? WHY WOULD T-TAR HAVE FIRE BLAST O_O He NEEDS a Sp atk- nature because he needs both his defensive stats to be high. His massive attack can chew right through walls with a few DD's anyway.
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Old September 18th, 2007 (5:36 PM).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Syaoran View Post
Are you saying Steelix beats EQ Tyranitar? Hell no. Not to mention you're even more screwed if Tyranitar happens to carry Fire Blast.

Steelix's type is exactly why it's black listed and not OU. He is mediocre as a wall, and less than sufficient as an attacker.

As for Shuckle, I already explained in the other topic why it doesn't have to cause damage. Not every pokemon is resistant to Toxic, and I don't see people running Aromatherapy Blissey everywhere. -- I suggest we keep the Shuckle argument at the Shuckle thread tho. ;)
Who says the art form known as conversation id dead? What TTar carries fire blast? Maybe garchomp, but not TTar...its special attack is high enough to use flamethrower. If steelix switches in to TTar on a move that hardly hits it, like crunch, steelix will win...EQ+EQ=bad news for TTar. That being said, it can't switch into EQ, so we're both right.

There is no way steelix is mediocre if it is weak to EQ and can take at least two of them...you may not think it's good, but mediocre...no. Anybody will tell you it is at least above average. And I posted in the shuckle thread...look there for my take on it.
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Old September 18th, 2007 (5:39 PM).
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Why would Tyranitar use Fire Blast? You really need to start thinking out of the box. Also, I battle at least 20 times a day, and believe me, Aromatherapy Blissey is quite rare.
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Old September 18th, 2007 (5:48 PM).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Syaoran View Post
Why would Tyranitar use Fire Blast? You really need to start thinking out of the box. Also, I battle at least 20 times a day, and believe me, Aromatherapy Blissey is quite rare.
What was a happy argument just turned me mad...think outside of the box? I have a 4.3 GPA, I have to think outside of the box...tell me, how many TTars have fire blast? Flamethrower, okay, but fire blast is nononononononononono. When you back up your opinion with some facts, I'll listen. And aromatherapy is rather common on blissey, not all the time, but many have it...no TTar should have fire blast IMO...skarm? Meh. Use flamthrower, but this is a steelix thread after all.

Steelix has 200 BASE DEFENSE!!!!!!!!!!!!!Its typing is pretty bad, but rhyperior has bad typing...and last I chaecked it was OU...Steelix can take ANY hit not powered up, and has a nice movepool. Why steelix pwns:

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relaxed
252 HP, 252 def, 6 Att
~Gyro ball
~EQ
~Roar
~Rest

That and aromatherapy blissey...see ya!
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Old September 18th, 2007 (5:51 PM).
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[email protected]

Earthquake
Stone Edge
Rest/Toxic/Stealth Rock
Rest/Toxic/ Stealth Rock

[email protected] Brace

Earthquake
Stone Edge
Gyro Ball
Stealth Rock/Rest/Toxic
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Old September 18th, 2007 (5:52 PM).
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How is Steelix mediocre? He is a 'Vire killer. He lols at cross chop and EQ and so using Steelix on 'Vire is definite switch out so you can SR. 'Vire rapes loads of teams so having your physical wall being able to take him out is handy indeed.
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Old September 18th, 2007 (5:55 PM).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cakekun View Post
How is Steelix mediocre? He is a 'Vire killer. He lols at cross chop and EQ and so using Steelix on 'Vire is definite switch out so you can SR. 'Vire rapes loads of teams so having your physical wall being able to take him out is handy indeed.
Thank you!!!!!!!!!!!!! Calling steelix mediocre is like calling magikarp uber...whether or not you like to use steelix, anybody will tell you steelix is a good wall. At least good. Shuckle I lol at...steelix can do this thing called inflicting damage. So yeah, facts are facts, and 200 BASE DEFENSE IS A FACT!
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Old September 18th, 2007 (6:12 PM).
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It has a Defense reaching over 500, yes, but stats aren't everything. It carries a variety of resistances, so it does result it as quite a useful pokémon. It can absorb several physical threats, is immune to Sand Streamers and carries a 4x resistance to Stealth Rock. Too bad it has doesn't have a self-healing move like Skarmory does, and its weaknesses to common attacks lower its potential as a physical wall. Steelix is easily countered by any Special super-effective move, and it sure doesn't like anything that uses Will-O-Wisp against it. Overall, it still remains a worthy pokémon to use in your team.
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Old September 18th, 2007 (6:37 PM).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shirosaki View Post
It has a Defense reaching over 500, yes, but stats aren't everything. It carries a variety of resistances, so it does result it as quite a useful pokémon. It can absorb several physical threats, is immune to Sand Streamers and carries a 4x resistance to Stealth Rock. Too bad it has doesn't have a self-healing move like Skarmory does, and its weaknesses to common attacks lower its potential as a physical wall. Steelix is easily countered by any Special super-effective move, and it sure doesn't like anything that uses Will-O-Wisp against it. Overall, it still remains a worthy pokémon to use in your team.
Yea, you're quite right.
--

Oh, and as for arguing about Fire Blast of Flamethrower, how petty can you get, seriously? It still does a lot of damage to Steelix.
Also, why would Electivire stay on him? Just saying it counters Electivire doesn't grant it immediate bonus points. And even that, it would still take some notable damage from Cross Chop before he kills him.
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Old September 18th, 2007 (6:56 PM).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shirosaki View Post
It has a Defense reaching over 500, yes, but stats aren't everything. It carries a variety of resistances, so it does result it as quite a useful pokémon. It can absorb several physical threats, is immune to Sand Streamers and carries a 4x resistance to Stealth Rock. Too bad it has doesn't have a self-healing move like Skarmory does, and its weaknesses to common attacks lower its potential as a physical wall. Steelix is easily countered by any Special super-effective move, and it sure doesn't like anything that uses Will-O-Wisp against it. Overall, it still remains a worthy pokémon to use in your team.
That about sums up steelix. If only it had decent typing...but the boled part is what I've been trying to say the entire time...
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Old September 18th, 2007 (7:00 PM).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Syaoran View Post
Yea, you're quite right.
--

Oh, and as for arguing about Fire Blast of Flamethrower, how petty can you get, seriously? It still does a lot of damage to Steelix.
Also, why would Electivire stay on him? Just saying it counters Electivire doesn't grant it immediate bonus points. And even that, it would still take some notable damage from Cross Chop before he kills him.
While I've never been put in the situation, I doubt Cross Chop would do that much to Steelix. Impish Steelix simply has unmatched Defense (besides Shuckle), so any physical super effective hit (like STAB Earthquakes) still does mediocre damage to him. He would probably take about as much damage from an Earthquake as Donphan would. Cross Chop from a Jolly Electivire wouldn't even do 50%, if my instinct is correct. Either way, someone would be insane to keep Electivire in against Steelix. Claydol still makes one of the best Electivire killers, if you ask me; immune to two of his attacks, resists the other, and takes less than 50% damage from Ice Punch.

As for Steelix advice... try maxing out its Special Defense with an Impush nature. Without any EVs, Steelix sill has amazing Defense, and maxed Special Defense may add to how much damage he'll take from Surf or Flamethrower, etc. Another common rout is to go with Adamant, and a few EVs in Defense, since he welcomes the Attack boost with a STAB Earthquake. And Gyro Ball... I don't think Steelix would pull it off quite as well as Bronzong, but it could work. You'll want a Relaxed nature if you go with Gyro Ball, though.

Oh, and:

Quote:
Why would Tyranitar use Fire Blast? You really need to start thinking out of the box. Also, I battle at least 20 times a day, and believe me, Aromatherapy Blissey is quite rare.
It could be a variation of the Tyrani-boah set, but instead of Thunder(bolt), it has Fire Blast. Actually not a bad idea, come to think about it, since Thunder(bolt)ing Tyrani-boah will kill Skarm/Bliss with ease, but may have some trouble with Steel/Bliss.
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Old September 18th, 2007 (7:04 PM).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Steel View Post

It could be a variation of the Tyrani-boah set, but instead of Thunder(bolt), it has Fire Blast. Actually not a bad idea, come to think about it, since Thunder(bolt)ing Tyrani-boah will kill Skarm/Bliss with ease, but may have some trouble with Steel/Bliss.

I wasn't questioning why it would use Fire Blast, you misread my post. I was quoting what they said in the form of a question.
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