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Old April 14th, 2008 (4:11 PM).
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1 People who are well off spend more and thus keep the economy humming. Imprisoning people who are well off and murder for long periods of times hurts the economy while using capital punishment on the poor has no similar effect due to them not having money. Try looking into a concept known as Capitalism and also look into the Chicago and Austrian schools of economics.

2 The poor respond better to discipline and force because they don't think like us. Things which are superflous and or negative for the upper/middle classes work well on the poor. Also, for whatever reason they completely lack any form of long-term thinking and predictions. Hence them constantly being bankrupt. Can you just imagine the problems that would result if we put in socialized medicine, expanded welfare or tried jobs programs(Not that any would actually work)?

3 Now don't be silly. Everyone knows Hitler was a leftist and not even remotely conservative. Ever read the book 'liberal fascism'? Its a good book and it goes into detail about the connections the nazis and the modern left have. Remember, conservatism is about freedom and personal responsibility.
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Old April 14th, 2008 (4:31 PM).
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I'm going to go out on a limb here and suggest that in tandem with Archon's idea we add a sliding "ethnic" scale to the whole ordeal. After all it's a well known fact that blacks commit more crime and on average have less money, so therefore are not as productive, or important, as whites and Asians or heck even Hispanics.
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Old April 14th, 2008 (4:41 PM). Edited April 14th, 2008 by Jaimes.
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Before you start using pseudo-intellect to back up your claims.. some sources would go a long way in support your twisted opinions. kthx noob.

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1 People who are well off spend more and thus keep the economy humming. Imprisoning people who are well off and murder for long periods of times hurts the economy while using capital punishment on the poor has no similar effect due to them not having money. Try looking into a concept known as Capitalism and also look into the Chicago and Austrian schools of economics.
This depends on what you define 'well off', because there will always be a significantly greater number who are 'not as well off'. This mass market will propel an economy. Not a minority who spend a bit more on expensive products.
Many poor people also support the economy via low-paid jobs, such as cleaning, social services and so on.. so don't give me that crap.
Also you didn't answer the rest of my points. There are lots of 'well off' people that do nothing in terms of benefiting society.. e.g someone who is born into rich parents (such as you).

More importantly you have one of the most barbaric and greedy idealogies concerning human life I have ever come across. Your belief that releasing muderers, terrorists and rapists because they have money, wheras slaughtering poorer people for petty crimes is disgusting. These are human lives, not stocks or shares. Human life is not expendable for your idea of 'economy'.

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2 The poor respond better to discipline and force because they don't think like us.
Hold on.. who IS the poor then? I'd like a definition if you will or at least some statistics. And not another stupid paragraph full of incorrect assumptions. Who said we were rich?

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Things which are superflous and or negative for the upper/middle classes work well on the poor. Also, for whatever reason they completely lack any form of long-term thinking and predictions.
Quoted for utter BS.

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Hence them constantly being bankrupt.
By the time I leave university in 4 more years, I will be 25 and have £80,000+ ($160k) debt on my head. I don't believe this will class me as 'poor' though?

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Can you just imagine the problems that would result if we put in socialized medicine, expanded welfare or tried jobs programs(Not that any would actually work)?
Can you imagine the problems of mass genocide? and why wouldn't it work at all? You're making a pretty big assumption there..
Being rich and poor is not something that is decided by what families people grow into. It doesn't take much to get an education (which you seem to be lacking in) and most people work to achieve money.

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3 Now don't be silly. Everyone knows Hitler was a leftist and not even remotely conservative
It's great how you tried to correct me with something that's completely wrong... especially how Hitler & the Nazi party was one of the biggest anti-communist organisations established. Ever tried reading a history textbook? Idiot.
But anyway, I was comparing your animalistic, barbaric, vile, selfish, greedy, ignorant, predujiced and tyranical attitudes towards human life to Hitlers.
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Old April 14th, 2008 (5:07 PM).
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Originally Posted by Ron Paul View Post
I'm going to go out on a limb here and suggest that in tandem with Archon's idea we add a sliding "ethnic" scale to the whole ordeal. After all it's a well known fact that blacks commit more crime and on average have less money, so therefore are not as productive, or important, as whites and Asians or heck even Hispanics.
The only way that would fully work is if we also factored in my scale as to reward the socially useful members of those communities and didn't blatantly shut them all out.
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Old April 14th, 2008 (5:49 PM).
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Originally Posted by Archon View Post
The only way that would fully work is if we also factored in my scale as to reward the socially useful members of those communities and didn't blatantly shut them all out.
Your 'scale' is biased abusing of an already controversial punishment system, to socially cleanse people in your narrow-minded concept of reality.

Capital punishment is not a tool for genocide. Being poor does not make you useless nor does rich make you useful. Eitherway neither factor should determine who lives and who dies.

Nor can I acknowledge what makes you "socially useful" and why you think you have the right to decide the outcome of millions' lives.
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Old April 14th, 2008 (7:51 PM).
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There's simply some people you can't argue with. Archon is one of them. He has twisted views, to be sure, and I don't think he's going to be very intent on changing them anytime soon. I say let him spout his nonsense. See how far it gets him in society. He'll probably be put in jail for hate crimes.
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Old April 14th, 2008 (8:55 PM).
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Originally Posted by Jaimes View Post
Oddly enough, I was thinking about this this morning..


In the UK, the death penalty is completely banned and a life sentence is the strongest penalty.
Uh, sure yeah...: Life sentence > Death penalty

I am sure no one wants to be in prison until they rot to death, while they can just be fried in 3 secs and be relieved of prison...
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Old April 14th, 2008 (9:31 PM).
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I have mixed feelings about Capital Punishment. I tend to support it because some people have done something so heinous that they deserve to die a slow painful death, but for some people, death is just too easy for them and it would be much better for them to live the rest of their existence in some small, closed in cell until they die thinking about what they did and how nice it would be to finally be free.

Either way, the whole CP debate is a very razor sharp double-edged sword that will contiune to be a hot button topic for many years.

So, I'm really kind of half anf half about it.
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Old April 15th, 2008 (5:14 AM).
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Originally Posted by txteclipse View Post
There's simply some people you can't argue with. Archon is one of them. He has twisted views, to be sure, and I don't think he's going to be very intent on changing them anytime soon. I say let him spout his nonsense. See how far it gets him in society. He'll probably be put in jail for hate crimes.
My views are reasonable and moderate unlike your leftwing radicalism.
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Old April 15th, 2008 (5:28 AM).
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Originally Posted by Archon View Post
My views are reasonable and moderate unlike your leftwing radicalism.
NO

You're an arrogant and deluded racist. You're ideas are not only despicable, but only supported by your low mental incapacity. They are completely unreasonable and you have not contributed anything intelligent besides extreme Nazi-like beliefs of using a Punishment system to eradicate people without money.

Being poor is not a crime.

Spoiler:
Considering what you posted on another thread, I can imagine you'll be banned soon.
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Old April 15th, 2008 (5:30 AM).
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Resorting to ad hominem attacks already? Why?
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Old April 15th, 2008 (5:36 AM).
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Originally Posted by Archon View Post
Resorting to ad hominem attacks already? Why?
Because I deem them important to illustrate your lack of intelligence (which alone nullifies most of your points), stupid idealogy and your completely inhumane attitudes?
You resorted to attacking millions of people in your first post on this thread.
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Old April 15th, 2008 (5:38 AM).
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Why do socialists attempt to repress those who don't buy into their ideology? I honestly don't get it.
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Old April 15th, 2008 (5:43 AM). Edited April 15th, 2008 by Jaimes.
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Originally Posted by Archon View Post
Why do socialists attempt to repress those who don't buy into their ideology? I honestly don't get it.
Only bad idealogies are repressed.


I have never seen a 'good' idealogy that encourages mass murder.

Yours is not good.. Yours is psychopathic. Nor can I imagine anyone sane agreeing with you.



Edit: Amachi- meh fine.. I'll try not to stray off-topic here ¬_¬
Though in my defence, he started it and it's hard to not respond/question/bash such an inhumane & sociopathic attitude.
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Old April 15th, 2008 (5:45 AM).
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Ron Paul earlier in this thread agreed me, However he goes further than I would.
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Old April 15th, 2008 (6:34 AM).
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The posts as of late have strayed from the topic of Capital Punishment, and hence needs to return to it immediately. Any further off topic discussion in this thread will lead to the issue of infractions.
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Old April 15th, 2008 (8:33 AM).
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Originally Posted by Archon View Post
Ron Paul earlier in this thread agreed me, However he goes further than I would.
To be honest you're as bad as each other. The idea of factoring in social class to punishment is obscene. Jaimes has illustrated this point far better than I can, but resorting to shifting the attention is plain cowardly. Your arguaments are incomplete, mostly because you haven't thought them out past the point of "poor people should die"
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Old April 19th, 2008 (6:52 PM). Edited April 19th, 2008 by Wilt.
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Originally Posted by MissMegano View Post
-A vast majority of executed criminals were poor. About 90% could not afford a lawyer and had to rely on one appointed by the court.
..... That is offensive to public defenders everywhere *coughmymomcough* Also that doesn't necessarily mean that it's the lawyers fault. Most people actually did do the stuff. I've been with my mom to court millions of times and most people there are poor. They grew up around things like drugs and crap so they don't think it is that bad. Basic psychology actually. Like how racists grew up with people telling them that black people are bad. This case it's drugs are not bad. Lots of them have mental problems.

Anyway, I liked the whole code of Babylon with the whole eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth thing. I think if you kill someone you should die, but only if it can be totally proven, if it can't than I'm not sure. It depends on what degree too. 3rd defentiallyl should be punished. Self-defense should be allowed. I SUPPORT the death sentence.

It's sad though, in Tennessee the jails have become the mental hospitals. No one is funding them and they lowered the level of mentally handicapped you have to be to get in, because of a certain murderer that got out of the death sentence for that reason.
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Old April 19th, 2008 (7:57 PM).
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It's really hard to say because there are so many cases out there with so many factors, I can't say whether I'm for it or against it. I just want people to get what they deserve, but the only person that knows what happened was the criminal, and let's face it. People lie.

Therefore, I have no opinion on the matter :[
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Old April 20th, 2008 (3:08 AM).
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I dont think people deserve the death sentence, even if he is guilty of doing something, it wont change anything. Plus I reckon living in jail for your whole life would be even worse. Take Salvador Puig Antich for example, he didnt deserve the death penalty, but Franco wanted to show people that if they do the same the same will happen to them.

The death penalty is really a stupid thing. Someone gets killed for killing other people, and then he gets sentenced to death? Maybe the person that did the job should get killed aswell? Its just my opinion :S.
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Old April 20th, 2008 (11:27 AM).
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I am 100% for capital punishment. If there is someone sick and disturbed enough to try to/succeed in taking human life, then why should they be allowed to continue their own. They shouldn't, and concerning the whole "new evidence" issue, the accused are put on death row for extended periods of time, giving them the chance to appeal, and for the potential for new evidence to arise. And chances are, if new evidence is discovered after the sentence(s) are given, than a mistrial is probably not far behind it.
One also has to consider what capital punishment takes away though. The crime has to be strictly examined to make sure that what this person has done is worth stripping their life for.
I agree totally with you. Why should someone else die for what you did and you shouldn't die?

I couldn't be bothered to write out what was in my mind :D
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Old April 21st, 2008 (2:51 AM).
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Capital punishment<life imprisonment

Jail for the win.
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Old May 2nd, 2008 (12:12 PM).
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Tough call. The main problem is that for some criminals, just flat out killing them would be letting them off easy.
That's pretty much my entire view on it. The Death Penalty is NOT a punishment. There's a reason that the suicide rate in prison is so high, and that's because they can't hack the long sentences. The death penalty may rid our life of these particular criminals, but it sure doesn't act as a deterant.

If I were criminally minded, I wouldn't think twice about killing someone if I knew my life would be ended, it's like getting a game over in GTA. But the thought of the rest of my life behind bars scares the **** out of me.
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Old May 3rd, 2008 (3:06 AM).
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I can't really see the death penalty as a suitable punishment for any crime. In some cases... it would be too soft.

Personal bias comes in to this, admittedly... but I can't imagine stooping to the level of a murderer. Death will come to them naturally anyway. Let them stew a while first... let nature take its course.

There can often be times when the death penalty is issued only for the criminal to be proven innocent after death. It happens, not all the time, but it happens.
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Old May 3rd, 2008 (5:07 AM).
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I think if people are facing a prison sentence, they should have the option of a death sentence instead. I would prefer death over prison, plus if I really did commit a "horrible crime" I would no longer be able to commit any more.

I think it depends on your views of afterlife though, whether you believe in the Christian "Hell" or equivalent.

I'm guessing alot of people who believe in some sort of torturous afterlife would pick prison so that they can say that they've been punished etc and not go to Hell (which they think will be worse than prison).

Alot of people who believe death means your just dead, no afterlife, might think that prison is a far worse punishment.
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