Torture Page 2

Started by Richard Wagner April 27th, 2009 8:11 AM
  • 1333 views
  • 44 replies

Netto Azure

Kiel

Age 30
Male
Alistel, Vainqueur
Seen November 17th, 2021
Posted September 29th, 2021
9,467 posts
15 Years
LOL. Wagner. Why was I warned not to post Political threads but you get too? XD

I posted that new development in the US Senate so YAY Politics!!!!
Alan Specter changes Party Affiliation to US Democrat. Filibuster Proof US Congress?

Anyways. I agree that Torture just gives us false confessions and fake info. Persuasion is still waaaaayyyyy better. >.>
Seriously the Bush Administrations Torture program is right out of the Chinese Red Book. <.<
Age 31
Male
Santa Isabel, Mexico
Seen July 7th, 2018
Posted February 2nd, 2016
4,000 posts
18.9 Years
Basing my reply on a television series doesn't mean my post isn't worth reading so long as it has a valid point, and I believe it does.
No, it doesn't have a valid point. It suggests a fantasy scenario. This is not fantasy we're talking about.

It's rather sad when people have to recur to popular media to base a point in which they want to defend a wicked morality.
虎穴に入らずんば虎子を得ず

Corvus of the Black Night

Wild Duck Pokémon

Age 30
Non-binary
With the Birds
Seen January 9th, 2015
Posted January 9th, 2015
3,416 posts
14.3 Years
no creature in this world has the right to be violent towards another creature.
this is including animals!!!

so, this means no.
So all the carnivores should die because they kill other creatures? That's violent, right?

Yeah, well there's this thing about TV shows...they're scripted, quite often so that the good guys win, regardless of whether their tactics would actually work in the real world.
QFT.

Both Misforutne and Axe Pichu are right, Rehkyt. Since it's scripted, it's planned out. I just didn't know that was a television series; I need to get out more =/

Torture, as said before, but repeated for emphasis, should be a last resort.
Seen January 1st, 2023
Posted April 20th, 2020
4,423 posts
15.4 Years
No, it doesn't have a valid point. It suggests a fantasy scenario. This is not fantasy we're talking about.

It's rather sad when people have to recur to popular media to base a point in which they want to defend a wicked morality.
You basically said torture is always wrong. Let's pretend I didn't mention Jack Bauer, and just asked you if you'd rather tens of thousands of people to die so someone could escape being tortured. What's your answer? Do your stand by your beliefs enough to ensure the deaths of innocent people?

Fantasy situations or not, one should be able to answer a question instead of ridiculing the posts of others.
Seen January 1st, 2023
Posted April 20th, 2020
4,423 posts
15.4 Years
Yes, I did, and I commented.
Right. In that case I'd love to know what 'evidence' you're referring to. I'm not attacking Pichu's beliefs, I just want to know if he's completely against torture or if he believes (like me) that in some cases it could be acceptable. Therefore, I asked him a question. Sure, it relied on a fantasy scenario, but what does that matter? If there's a ticking time bomb and thousands of lives are at stake, are you going to stop the torture of someone who knows what you need to know just because it's morally wrong? Would it not also be morally wrong to put a criminal in front of the lives of innocent people?
Age 32
Male
Seen May 16th, 2011
Posted October 28th, 2010
5,058 posts
18.4 Years
Why are you guys slamming on Rek even though he's already removed 24 from the statement and rephrased it as a potential scenario? I mean gosh, atleast have the decency to answer his question instead of just shooting him down.

I think in all honesty if I was in that position where if you tortured one person you'd save thousands i still wouldn't do it, not because I feel it would be wrong in that case, but because I wouldn't be able to.

Corvus of the Black Night

Wild Duck Pokémon

Age 30
Non-binary
With the Birds
Seen January 9th, 2015
Posted January 9th, 2015
3,416 posts
14.3 Years
Well, I'm not ramming on him. I just want a real scenario to prove a point, not a "potential scenario". Neither Pichu or him have changed my beliefs.

Instead of trying to argue with questions, give me a real life example in which will tip me over the fence. I prefer the logical appeal over anything.
Age 32
Male
Seen May 16th, 2011
Posted October 28th, 2010
5,058 posts
18.4 Years
Well, I'm not ramming on him. I just want a real scenario to prove a point, not a "potential scenario". Neither Pichu or him have changed my beliefs.
With a real scenario the outcome is already decided because it already happened.

Corvus of the Black Night

Wild Duck Pokémon

Age 30
Non-binary
With the Birds
Seen January 9th, 2015
Posted January 9th, 2015
3,416 posts
14.3 Years
So then from enough of real scenarios, we can determine whether or not torture is worth it. Rather than try to assume, we will need hard evidence, which is rather unfortunate for this topic, but true.

But, if it's PuretortureSHIPPING, then I'm all over it ^^
Age 31
Male
Santa Isabel, Mexico
Seen July 7th, 2018
Posted February 2nd, 2016
4,000 posts
18.9 Years
Right. In that case I'd love to know what 'evidence' you're referring to. I'm not attacking Pichu's beliefs, I just want to know if he's completely against torture or if he believes (like me) that in some cases it could be acceptable. Therefore, I asked him a question. Sure, it relied on a fantasy scenario, but what does that matter? If there's a ticking time bomb and thousands of lives are at stake, are you going to stop the torture of someone who knows what you need to know just because it's morally wrong? Would it not also be morally wrong to put a criminal in front of the lives of innocent people?
Our point is, in any scenario, anything could be justified. In the end, fantasizing or the making of unprovable hypothesis doesn't contribute a thing to the topic.

Discuss a real problem in a realistic scenario. I apologize if it seemed I ridiculed you, it was not my intention. I just disagree with the way you base you argument.
虎穴に入らずんば虎子を得ず
They
Unknown.
Seen July 6th, 2022
Posted March 4th, 2018
834 posts
14.5 Years
Personally, I think torture is neccessary in some cases. If we have a man who has killed many and holds information to a terriorist campaign or location, and he isn't spilling, and we need answers before people die, then yes, we need torture. However, if a man beats his wife because she doesn't agree with him, then yes, that is unneccessary torture. Torture only with reason do I accept, but if it is pointless and only for sadistic pleasure, then no.
Seen May 24th, 2009
Posted May 23rd, 2009
129 posts
14.2 Years
Personally, I think torture is neccessary in some cases. If we have a man who has killed many and holds information to a terriorist campaign or location, and he isn't spilling, and we need answers before people die, then yes, we need torture. However, if a man beats his wife because she doesn't agree with him, then yes, that is unneccessary torture. Torture only with reason do I accept, but if it is pointless and only for sadistic pleasure, then no.
What I want is for one of you to cite an example where torture has worked, where people have been saved because someone who was tortured gave accurate, reliable information. There are countless examples for the opposition - al-Libby being a particularly telling one, in which the CIA wrote in their notes that he appeared to be trying to make up any answer that would please the interrogaters.

Melody

Banned

Female
Cuddling those close to me
Seen March 4th, 2018
Posted March 2nd, 2018
6,459 posts
18.6 Years
I believe that no matter what crime a person is suspected of committing, or has been convicted of should ever warrant torture. By torturing detainees at Guantanamo Bay, we have given the terrorists even more reason to hate us.

I don't care how many millions of lives the government claims it could save, nothing justifies physical torture. Now, there are likely certain means of mental and psychological torture one could employ to get them to speak. But as far as actually doing anything to harm them or cause physical pain. That is wrong. We're civilized people, and we need to show it. If we don't it just gives terrorists more reason to throw their lives away trying to bring us down.

If you starve them of attention, then they will give up. As long as they think they can inspire fear, they will try...and not give up until their last breath.

Yes. I am against physical torture of any variety. I am also against any kind of brutality against them, but everyone in the armed forces remembers September 11th, and the hatred for that is still there, so it's practically impossible to prevent them from being mistreated. Sad, but true.
Male
My evil little world....
Seen November 25th, 2010
Posted April 20th, 2010
392 posts
14.1 Years
If the person being tortured is innocent: Ooops.

If the person being tortured is GUILTY: YOU DESERVE IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
They wouldn't be there in the first place. They asked for it.
-----------------------:t140: -----------------------
Pokémon HeartGold | 1978 2716 2742
Pokémon Platinum | 1849 4303 8906
-----------------------:t155:-----------------------