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Old November 21st, 2009 (7:51 PM).
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Red is an epic fail now. Sure, his Pokemon's levels are still through the roof, but levels aren't even close to what makes someone tough. Every pokemon's moves suck, his team is unbalanced, and there were no challenge-increasing upgrades from GSC. They could've kept Espeon, and added a bunch of 3rd and 4th generation movesets, like adding calm mind to Espeon and Volt Tackle to Pikachu.
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Old November 21st, 2009 (8:13 PM).
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Another thing I'm sorry to see changed is that Blue has a Machamp instead of Alakazam. Alakazam has always been Blue's (and Gary's) signature. Where did the Machamp come from?
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Old November 21st, 2009 (8:31 PM).
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I agree, Red is pretty fail in this game. Snorlax with terrible moveset, (no snore and rest, like wtf?) two waters, missing Espeon ...... and Hail to make it easier too.
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Old November 21st, 2009 (8:42 PM).
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Originally Posted by Nemaru View Post
and Volt Tackle to Pikachu.
His Pikachu does have Volt Tackle.
Fail, but points for originality.


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Originally Posted by Rubber Ducky View Post
Another thing I'm sorry to see changed is that Blue has a Machamp instead of Alakazam. Alakazam has always been Blue's (and Gary's) signature. Where did the Machamp come from?
Gary's signature was the Arcanine and later the Umbreon.
Blue's was the Starter and Pidgeot, those were like the only two Pokemon he kept from the start to the end.

He had two psychic pokemon anyway(Alakazm/Exeggutor) so it balanced it a bit, and if I recall someone said that Blue originally had a Machamp in the original Red/Green.
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Old November 21st, 2009 (9:10 PM).
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I bet the Lapras was there because of the hail. I half wish they'd do something as a revamp of JUST the old games. no different pokemon, just level rebalancing and the 3d maps.
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Old November 22nd, 2009 (4:44 AM).
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I didn't mean to say that Red wasn't hard, just that the change from Espeon to Lapras was unnecessary and dumb imo.

And you can get an Eevee in Yellow, right? In Celadon City? If so then the Silph Co. argument is null.

Although you make a valid point about Game Freak adding the hail and an Ice type, I think Espeon with Psychic was plenty of challenge.

Now that think on it, though, maybe I am complaining too much. Oh well. Still <3 Lapras.
Yes, there is the Eevee-obtainable from Celedon method there, just pointing out that Lapras isn't that odd a choice in being obtained by Red for HG/SS. (And Eevee can evolve into 7 Pokes now/5 pokes then, why Espeon out of them all doesn't appear that special. Furthermore Eevee has been obtainable as a gift Pokemon in every game bar RSE if memory serves). There is the fact it is changed from GSC, but I guess it's up to the player if they like the change or not - and nothing can please everyone. Case in point - Johto gym leaders - (mostly) kept the same in HG/SS in terms of Pokemon used, some people hate it, others like it for keeping to the GSC teams. Personally I don't mind, I feel it's a nod towards the 1st gen team idea, and Lapras wasn't easy by any means either. Ultimately that's what they went with so whether one likes it or not, that's what one's up against with Red.
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I agree, Red is pretty fail in this game. Snorlax with terrible moveset, (no snore and rest, like wtf?) two waters, missing Espeon ...... and Hail to make it easier too.
Arguably Snore isn't really a strong move and Rest does allow one to set up on it as well... and again remember this game is aimed at young kids and all, and it's unlikely many would know his team beforehand either. I don't really agree that Red is now a 'fail' - maybe easier if you know his team and all, and Snorlax not playing to his strength... but I would not be surprised to see Blizzard catch many a player out on their first battle with him. But this discussion has been had before, no? =P
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Old November 22nd, 2009 (5:13 AM).
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Isn't the final boss like Red?
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Old November 22nd, 2009 (6:06 AM).
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It was still fun... I mean, I had one pokemon left, and that pokemon had 3 hp at the end of the battle. Thank god I took that risk, and attacked, rather than healing. Again.

Stupid Charizards >.>

As for Lapras/Blastoise both being there... Meh. Those were probably the weakest links on the team anyways.
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Old November 24th, 2009 (12:40 PM).
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Arguably Snore isn't really a strong move and Rest does allow one to set up on it as well... and again remember this game is aimed at young kids and all, and it's unlikely many would know his team beforehand either. I don't really agree that Red is now a 'fail' - maybe easier if you know his team and all, and Snorlax not playing to his strength... but I would not be surprised to see Blizzard catch many a player out on their first battle with him. But this discussion has been had before, no? =P
I know it's aimed at kids, but the remake is mostly for people who have played it, it's not aimed at new players. The emphasis is for the old classic players who played GSC and want to play a remake. Red was awesomely insanely challenging back in the day because of his Rest and Snore combo, it really smashed your whole party, every single one. You had to be really good to beat him.
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Old November 24th, 2009 (1:06 PM).
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Originally Posted by Eggie Poo Poo View Post
I know it's aimed at kids, but the remake is mostly for people who have played it, it's not aimed at new players. The emphasis is for the old classic players who played GSC and want to play a remake. Red was awesomely insanely challenging back in the day because of his Rest and Snore combo, it really smashed your whole party, every single one. You had to be really good to beat him.
I honestly think HG/SS are aimed just as much at people who never played G/S/C as they are at people who have, if not more. Ten years is a long time, and there are many Pokemon fans who came in after G/S/C. To them HG/SS aren't remakes, but rather completely new adventures, which gives them all the more reason to get those games.

On another note, I don't think I've ever had trouble with Red's Snorlax in G/S/C.
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Old November 24th, 2009 (4:47 PM).
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Then you must be the #1 king of all Pokemon history from day 1, up to now. You cannot be touched, you are the god and master.
I'm sure at 110% he wasn't meaning that.
He's just saying that Snorlax never was a challenge to him, so he didn't saw the difference for some people no?

Anywayz. Maybe people think he's harder on G/S/C Because they had a strong fighting type?
As Fighting gets owned by Espeon but owns Lapras
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Old November 24th, 2009 (4:49 PM).
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Then you must be the #1 king of all Pokemon history from day 1, up to now. You cannot be touched, you are the god and master.
You know, cuz the sarcasm helps things.

On topic.
I think that it's aimed at BOTH.
Remade with new additions for the old fans,
Challenging (?) things for the new.
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Old November 24th, 2009 (5:36 PM). Edited November 25th, 2009 by FreakyLocz14.
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Espeon could be the Eevee from Celadon.
The fact it evolved into Espeon could reflect the fact that there was no night in R/B/Y/FR/LG
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Old November 24th, 2009 (5:40 PM).
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I have to admit, for some reason the change from Espeon to Lapras really disappoints me, and is the only thing in the game I know of thus far that does.

It just seems... redundant to have two Water-types in. I mean, yeah, Lapras gets boosted by the hail and all, but they didn't need to add the hail. The whole thing just feels like an excuse to throw Espeon out, for some reason.

Plus the reason why Red originally had Espeon in the first place- all of his team were available as one-time (or two in Snorlax's case) events in Yellow. The starters are obvious enough, Lapras is Water just like Blastoise, and Snorlax is fairly popular... then consider that Fire, Electric, and Water are already covered in his team, and that Karen had an Umbreon- Espeon was the only Eeveelution left, of course.

I dunno, I always used Espeon myself, so maybe I'm biased, but I miss the guy.
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Old November 24th, 2009 (5:41 PM).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FreakyLocz14 View Post
Espeon could be the Eevee from Celadon.
The fact it evolved into Eevee could reflect the fact that there was no night in R/B/Y/FR/LG
We've already established that.
By the way-
Something I didn't add before. Lapras would actually make more sense because you're more likely to run into it during the course of the story, providing you don't check every nook and cranny.
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Old November 24th, 2009 (6:03 PM).
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My friend got the game imported, and he showed me the battle against Red. To say the least, I liked the inclusion of Lapras. They are making this Red more like Ash. The original Red was based in the guy in Pokemon Special, explaining why he had an Espeon.
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Old November 24th, 2009 (6:10 PM).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FreakyLocz14 View Post
Espeon could be the Eevee from Celadon.
The fact it evolved into Eevee could reflect the fact that there was no night in R/B/Y/FR/LG
The latter part I'm not quite sure with... the fact they went without a day-night system in FR/LG or RBY is why it's an Espeon? IDK, just seems a bit iffy for me, I suppose. =/ Can't say that they mean for Kanto in FR/LG to have eternal sunshine. Plus along with the fact in FR/LG you couldn't get either Espeon or Umbreon directly, if memory serves, but you had to trade to RSE instead. (But obviously the Eevee-in-Celedon thing stands and all that jazz).
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Old November 24th, 2009 (6:23 PM).
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The original Red was based in the guy in Pokemon Special, explaining why he had an Espeon.
Red from Special didn't have an Espeon until after GSC came out. Red is based on no one.
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Old November 24th, 2009 (6:24 PM).
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He's still the strongest trainer in the game.
you mean 2nd strongest. i'm the strongest haha
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Old November 24th, 2009 (7:11 PM).
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Red from Special didn't have an Espeon until after GSC came out. Red is based on no one.
correct, Red is supposed to be the character you played as is the generation 1 games of which Ash is based off of.
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Old November 25th, 2009 (3:18 AM).
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it still doesn't change the fact that most opponents ingame are too easyly defeatable and mostly the AI sucks
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Old November 25th, 2009 (4:15 AM).
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it still doesn't change the fact that most opponents ingame are too easyly defeatable and mostly the AI sucks
Sure, but that's not the topic of this thread. =P Again as well, the game IS aimed at kids, so an easy AI is only to be expected at times. One does wish for, say, a Hard mode, at times though... When I battled Red his AI didn't seem off, really, but it might have just been my battle with him using a rather underlevelled team for the heck of it. *shrug*
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Old November 25th, 2009 (8:15 AM).
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I really liked Red's team in GSC but i wanted to know why the hell he had an Espeon it just seemed out of place where as the Lapras is a really nice touch. I mean yeah Lapras is a water type but is also an ice type so it can help Red against the Garchomp users.
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Old November 25th, 2009 (9:47 AM).
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To be fair. I can't remember Ash ever having a Espeon. I always thought they put Espeon in to advertise the two new eevee evolutions. Ash i think is better with lapras in my opinion.
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Old November 25th, 2009 (12:38 PM).
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To be fair. I can't remember Ash ever having a Espeon. I always thought they put Espeon in to advertise the two new eevee evolutions. Ash i think is better with lapras in my opinion.
It's not Ash, it's Red.

I guess Ash did indirectly influence Red, since his team is based on Yellow which is based on the Anime, but they're different.
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