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Old November 21st, 2013 (9:42 AM). Edited December 6th, 2013 by Nah.
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What generation had your favorite starter Pokémon? Which generation had starters you couldn't stand? Share your ranking of the starters by generation here.

For me, its:

1) Gen 3: Blaziken is my all-time favorite starter (I liked it before everyone was using it cuz of Speed Boost). Swampert and Sceptile are great as well.

2) Gen 1: Sure, I started in Gen 1, but its not a nostalgia goggles thing. I have always liked Charizard (who now isn't so bad thanks to its mega evolutions), and Blastoise and Venusaur were kinda cool too. And they aren't terrible in battle either.

3) Gen 6: I'm not that into the Chespin line, but at least it gets Bullteproof. Delphox is ok. Greninja? Ninja frog? Hell yeah, sign me up!

4) Gen 4: Initially, I didn't like Infernape (I'm not a monkey person), but over time, the flaming ape got my respect for its battle skills. Torterra and Empoleon are ok.

5) Gen 2: The Gen 2 starters were really meh. Meh designs, meh stats, meh movepools.

6) Gen 5: As much as I liked Gen 5 (Gen 6 is only slightly better than it to me, and I consider Gen 6 to basically be the best one), I really did not like the starters. Didn't care for their designs (particulary the Emboar line, and Gen 2's, while meh, were a bit better)at all, and found them to not be all that useful in battle.

So what about the rest of you?

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Old November 21st, 2013 (9:54 AM).
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    Gen 2 > Gen 6 > Gen 1 = Gen 3 > Gen 5 = Gen 4

    For the record, I don't find Gen 4 and 5 starters ugly or bad or anything. I just favor the others more, that's all. I just love the 2nd evos in gen 2, for example, and the overall appearance of gen 6 starters 'til their final forms.

    in the end, they're all quite adorable...

    As for typing, only gen 1 and 3 are probably what i liked. Rest were just... blahfrjklsajr.
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    Old November 21st, 2013 (9:56 AM).
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      Ok here goes.

      1) Gen VI love them all but Dephfox looks awesome and Chesnought is cool to.

      2)Gen I because Blastoise is amazing and the other two are ok.

      3)Gen V Samarott and Serperior are Amazing, Embour really lets the side down though its horrid, its a pig and it looks like a barrel.

      4)Gen II I love Meganium he looks so happy and Typhlosion is amazing to.

      5) Gen III my favorite gen but the starters fall short, they are ok but nothing to write home about.

      6) Gen IV Infernape worst starter ever (don't like monkeys at all, in fact its a monkey not an ape it has a tail). Torterra is ok but only Empoleon is wothey of being on a team.

      (My top 5 starters are) 1) Delphox, 2)Blastoise, 3)Samarott, 4)Meganium and 5)Typhlosion
      Old November 22nd, 2013 (2:39 AM). Edited November 22nd, 2013 by Trainer Galza.
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        #6 - Probably the Johto crew. I just was never a fan of the art design in generation 2.. most of them just looked really bizare to me. Cyndiquil and Totodile are pretty cool for weird japanese doodle monsters.. it's just that Chikorita.. what is that thing?

        #5 - Gen 4. Don't get me wrong, there is some great pokemon here, but they just don't really feel like the others, you know? They just feel foreign to me.. which I fully understand it's a japanese game and all.. it just feels like something you'd see standing in a japanese shopping mall food court, if that makes sense.

        #4 - Gen 5.. yeah, they're not very good.. and I think Emboar might be a bit over designed.. but they're kind of more "traditional" as far as starters go and less speific to any one nationality's tastes.. which makes me feel a lot less weird about them.

        #3 - Gen 1 .. It was actually a toss up between this one and the one following it, but I settled on generation 1 because I think after actually playing through X/Y.. this group has really lost it's luster. I like them for the memories I had playing the game with these guys way back in the day, but my sensibilities of what makes a good pokemon have kind of changed. Unless you use megastones on these guys, they're pretty much the same as they ever were, and they don't exactly stand out amongst the others if you don't count the fact that they came first. -- Save Bulbasaur anyway

        #2 - Gen 3 .. Truthfully, I like a lot of the 3rd Gen designs.. outside of the silly paired ones like Lunatone and Solrock .. but this isn't about them. Blaziken.. a total badass, and the only starter that's been banned to ubers. Sceptile, the first super fast grass type, and wasn't too terribly bad in previous gens either. Swampert.. probably the king of support and defensive nonsense. I like this group.

        #1 - Gen 6.. and not just because it's the new hotness either. I'm a pretty big RPG nut, so when I found out that this gen's starters were going to be classic RPG classes to some extent.. I was ALL over that. And they're all really useful guys too, though sadly Delphox is probably less so.. Greninija is all over the place, his hidden ability is fantastic.. and who knew that little Chespin would grow up to be such a bad ass with a great hidden ability of his own.
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        Old November 23rd, 2013 (12:41 AM).
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          Gen 2 > Gen 1 > Gen 6 > Gen 3 > Gen 4 > Gen 5...

          Always was a fan of the Generation 2 starters...I'm not a new-game hater, but I hate Oshawott and that's what hinders Gen 5 on my list...lol...My favorite starter overall is actually Treecko...
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          Old November 24th, 2013 (9:04 AM).
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            Gen 3- Blakizen is an awesome fire/fighting chicken, Marshtomp takes away the electric weakness by being an ground/water ty[e and treecko is just awesome.

            gen 6 Greninja an ninja frog is just awesome. Chestnaught an grass/steel type and just looks cool. braxien finally breaks the fire/fighting starters.

            Gen 4 Not another fire/fighting starter. Piplup evoles into an water steel pokemon which is cool. Turtwig evoles into an Grass/ground with an gaint tree on its back cool.

            Gen 5 go away fire/fighting starters. Oshawott evoles into an gaint shell sword thing which is cool. Snivy is just boring though.

            Gen 2 Pure starters are alays boring

            Gen 1 I hate the gen 1 starters because they are as just over rated.
            Old November 24th, 2013 (11:34 AM).
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              Well let's see here...

              #6 Gen 2 I don't like Thyplosion or Feraligator. Meganium is the only decent one, but it struggles in Johto.
              #5 Gen 1 Charizard stinks and Venusaur isn't too great either. Blastoise is a boss, and at least the other two are tolerable.
              #4 Gen 3 Mostly because I haven't used the majority of them and am not sure what to think jus yet.
              #3 Gen 6 Delphox is pretty bad, but Greninja and Chesnaught are pretty cool.
              #2 Gen 4 All of them are at least decent. Well, Empoleon anyways. Infernape and Torterra are cool.
              #1 Gen 5 I just like all of the Gen. 5 starters. That's right, even Emboar. Emboar is a total boss.
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              Old November 24th, 2013 (11:41 AM).
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              Gen. 3
              Gen. 1
              Gen. 2
              Gen. 4
              Gen. 5
              Gen. 6

              Only reason I put generation 6 last is because I haven't played it yet. But I definitely think that generation 3 has the best starters. Great typing, great moves, and awesome designs. Gotta have my Swampert, each and every time. <3

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              Old November 24th, 2013 (4:05 PM).
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              Based on design only, I'd say III > II > VI > I > V > IV. I'm not going to comment too much on usefulness in battle though, since I'm not a competitive player. Though I would say III has to be the best. I mean...it's got a starter that was sent to Ubers.

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              Old November 26th, 2013 (2:39 PM).
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                (1 is best, 6 is worst)

                6.) Gen 4; as much as I love this gen i didn't like the starters at all.
                5.) Gen 5; the only one I liked was tepig.
                4.) Gen 3; i liked them, but not as much as the ones i'm going to list next.
                3.) Gen 1; i think they are all cute.
                2.) Gen 6; gave me my new favorite starter ever, fennekin. love chespin too.
                1.) Gen 2; the only generation besides the first where i liked all the designs. i just like them better than gen 1, too.
                Old November 26th, 2013 (2:47 PM).
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                  Gen III had my favourite starters, I liked all three of them.

                  Gen I is a close second, sicne I prefer Sceptile over Venusaur.

                  Coming in third is Gen IV, Torterra and Empoleon had interesting secondary types.

                  Fourth is Gen II, Feraligatr and Typhlosion were cool. Didn't like Meganium as much...

                  Gen VI is fifth, disappointed with Chespin's evolution, not a fan of Fennekin's final form, Braixen was cool though and Froakie's line was awesome!

                  Then theres Gen V... I only liked Oshawott's line, the others... not so much. Had enough of Fire/Fighting and Serperior's movepool was really lacking.
                  Old November 26th, 2013 (3:07 PM).
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                    In terms of designs, I really like all the starters from Gen 1 - 5 equally. The starters themselves where all great in Gen 6, but man, those evolutions... Quilladin is the only one I like.
                    Battle-wise, for me: Gen 1 = Gen 4 > Gen 6 = Gen 3 > Gen 5 > Gen 2
                    Old November 26th, 2013 (3:38 PM).
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                      They've all grown on me, at one point I disliked some of the designs and would never have been caught dead using them, but I have grown up and matured since then and that is no longer the case. However my ranking would be the following.

                      1) Gen 2 - I loved all three starters, and think not only are the base forms cute but the final evos are powerful when used correctly.
                      2) Gen 1 - The gen that I started in like so many others, similar to gen 2 I liked them all however I thought gen 2's starters were just the coolest.
                      3) Gen 6 - The current gen I think has the best designed starters since the first two, and finally they got away from the Fire/Fighting starter(gods).
                      4) Gen 4 - I disliked gen 3 in general when it first came out, and was expecting the same thing when gen 4 arrived. However I was gladly proven wrong. Piplup and Turtwig are among the coolest two starters I have ever seen. Chimchar has grown on me, but I did not like it when it first came out, also being a second Fire/Fighting starter was kind of a turn off for me.
                      5) Gen 5 - Owshawott is the starter I feel in love with here, Snivy is pretty cool too and has grown on me. However, again I do not like Tiepig. Tiepig itself is cool, but the evolutions didn't appeal to me, and another Fire/Fighting really?
                      6) Gen 3 - The generation that I almost stopped playing all together, as I have said though I have grown to like many of generation 3's Pokemon but at the time it was difficult for me. Mudkip was the only starter I could stand, and as it is my favorite from gen 3. Treecko was weird, and Torchic never really appealed to me despite fire being my favorite type... Fire/Fighting Pokemon are apparently not my thing at all.
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                      Old December 3rd, 2013 (4:57 AM).
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                        1)Gen 4 is just awesome. I love Empoleon and it was my first gen! Torterra and Infernape were just as good design and type wise.

                        2)Gen 3 actually. Swampert has a great typing and Blaziken is lovable.

                        3)Gen 6 did pretty good. It is better than Gen 5 and Greninja is a beast! I don't think Delphox or Chesnaught was good however.

                        4)Gen 5 was nice. Samurott and Emboar were decent. Serperior was just meh. Why? Too many pure grass types.

                        5)Gen 1. I am actually tired of looking at them. The reason why I kept them in 5th place is because they got mega'd and 'cause they have Bulbasaur.

                        6)Gen 2. All of it was just meh to me. sorry dudes.
                        Old December 3rd, 2013 (1:17 PM).
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                          1) Gen IV - Torterra, one of my favourite pokemon!

                          2) Gen VI - Braixen, love the design so much.

                          3) Gen V - Snivy, Snivy is plain awesome.

                          4) Gen I - Wartortle, I was a squirtle girl

                          5) Gen II - Totodile, didn't like the other two so water it is!

                          6) Gen III Grovyle. I really dislike all the starters from this gen if I'm honest.
                          Old December 3rd, 2013 (1:56 PM).
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                            6. Generation 3
                            I can't like these starters even if I tried. My flame shield is ready!

                            5. Generation 2
                            The final evolutions are personal favourites of mine but what really disappointed me was that none of them got dual typings.

                            4. Generation 5
                            While I adore Oshawott and think Samurott is a beast (and I've taken a liking to Tepig), I just felt like the designs were lacking overall.

                            3. Generation 1
                            Who can't love the original trio? I certainly do! But they've just been out-shined by other starters.

                            2. Generation 4
                            Holy crap I love this gen! The only one I dislike is Chimchar but Infernape makes up for that.

                            1. Generation 6
                            I couldn't decide which one I wanted to use when I got the game. I was disappointed with Quilladin, Braixen and Delphox at first but they've grown on me. Yes, I honestly do like Chestnaught. I have no complaints about these.

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                            Old December 3rd, 2013 (3:02 PM).
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                              1. Generation One- (Charmander)

                              Charmander :D I actually really like Charmander and Charmeleon, but not really Charizard so much. I do like Charizard, but he's sort of bland :\ Squirtle is fun, and he's a very very very close second as a favourite for gen one, and even though Bulbasaur is adorable I've never really liked him as much as the other two.

                              2. Generation Three- (Treecko)

                              Gen one and three (for starter Pokémon) are very very close, but Charmander has nostalgic value for me. Treecko and Grovyle (again, not a big fan of Sceptile) are among my absolute favourite Pokémon and Treecko stuck with me for a long time during my Pokémon is boring now phase. Torchic and Mudkip are also really awesome!

                              3. Generation Two- (Totodile)

                              Didn't play Gen 2 as much as 1 and 3 when I was growing up, but I've always loved both Totodile and Cyndaquil. When I was a kid, Cyndaquil was my favourite and I picked him again despite myself when HG and SS came out, but Totodile is my favourite these days.

                              4. Generation Four- (Piplup)

                              The last generation that I thought had all decent starters (visually). I personally picked Chimchar, but I really like all three of them especially Piplup looking back, and Turtwig's final evolution is awesome!

                              5. Generation Six- (Froakie)

                              Froakie and his evolution set are just amazing, I love frogs, ninjas are just inherently cool, and water/dark? That's just awesome! I picked him in a heartbeat, especially over the other two. Fennekin looks good at first, but I absolutely hate it's evolutions (visually, since Fire/Psychic is kinda cool). Delphox, sorry to say, just sort of looks weird and Chespin looks like this generation's Oshawott, his final evolution is okay but he's overall sort of meeeehhh.

                              6. Generation Five- (Tepig)

                              I just, I just hate all of them. They aren't actually that bad, they're just, to be honest, they're all sort of bland to me. I still hate Oshawott's design (an Otter with a shell, is that a Japanese thing? Because I swear I saw something like that in Sonic Adventure 2 when I was a kid.) though Snivy has sort of grown on me, I still don't like it and Tepig is the best looking one (though I despise Fire/Fighting) and that's the one I picked. This was just, the least memorable starter set in my opinion.

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                              Old December 3rd, 2013 (3:18 PM).
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                                This was harder to rank than I imagined...

                                6. Gen IV- This is not to say that Chimchar, Turtwig and Piplup are the worst of all starters, but as a trio, something about them just didn't seem to gel. I'm also not the biggest fan of their final forms.

                                5. Gen V- While Snivy and Tepig are good on its own, their evolutions really drag them down. I will wholeheartedly state Emboar is my least favorite starter Pokemon. The only reason I rank it higher than VI is because of Oshawott, who is one of my all-time favorite Pokemon in general.

                                4. Gen I- The Gen I starters have been so well remembered for a reason. They all have great designs and evolutions, but as Farred Sky said, they've been outshined over the years. All of these choices were safe, a dragon for fire and a turtle for water, and it wasn't until later that GF really started getting creative with them.

                                3. Gen VI- Now we're getting to where the list gets difficult. I really have zero complaints about the Gen VI starters and their evolutions. They're all creative concepts, each rather useful Pokemon, and have great designs all around.

                                2. Gen III- Another well-designed, well-rounded trio. Gen III was when Pokemon designs became more complex, but this group showed that wasn't neccessarily a bad thing. Plus, Blaziken is my all-time favorite Pokemon.

                                1. Gen II- This generation was just perfect in design. Some complain they remained monotypes, but I didn't mind because each design was unique yet simple and cool. I'll admit bias because Johto was my favorite generation and region, but hey, whatever I suppose.
                                Old December 3rd, 2013 (8:25 PM). Edited February 13th, 2016 by Hikamaru.
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                                I'm ranking from best to worst, 1 for best and 6 for worst.

                                1. Gen VI (Kalos) - The first generation where I love all three starters' and their evos at the same time, something Game Freak rarely accomplishes imo because there's always one starter that someone hates (or likes the base form but hates the evos) and I have to say the RPG theme was a good idea on their part, plus all have typings we may have seen before, but never seen before on a starter. Froakie's line is my fave of this bunch but the other two aren't bad either.

                                2. Gen V (Unova) - Yeah this is my fave generation and these ones were designed quite well imo (don't understand why Tepig's line is getting hated so much, or why this generation is getting hated a lot in general) and despite Emboar being Fire/Fighting I still think Tepig's line did well for me, same with Oshawott's. It was Snivy's line that was my least fave here, mainly because his movepool is so shallow. Oshawott is clearly the one I loved the most of this trio.

                                3. Gen IV (Sinnoh) - I seem to be someone who thinks newer generations get better designs, and these ones were well-designed, plus had good stats to make them usable without someone wanting to ditch them. Plus, we gotta love the fact that Piplup and Turtwig's final evos have unique typings. The next two gens may have gotten better on appearance but I still love this bunch.

                                4. Gen III (Hoenn) - The designs looked a bit weird at first but they were all good stat-wise not to mention they gave us our first Uber starter (Blaziken yeah) not to mention how memorable Hoenn is as a whole. They did a good job giving Mudkip's evos a Water/Ground-type, but all three perform great in battle as well.

                                5. Gen I (Kanto) - They were my least faves of all (I hated the fact they were all reptilian-based) but their Mega Evolutions saved me, especially Charizard. I would have still despised him had they not shown me how awesome his Mega Charizard X form is. Plus, they are the classics so yeah we all know them.

                                6. Gen II (Johto) - These guys were alright, but the main problem was the fact they all stayed pure-typed even in their final evos. I usually love dual-type starters more not to mention this bunch contains the only Water starter I didn't really like (sorry Totodile, you just aren't as cute as the others I'm afraid). I did enjoy the Johto region a lot but its resident Pokemon didn't have good designs imo.
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                                Old December 3rd, 2013 (9:10 PM).
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                                  1. Gen II - All three designs are excellent, and they're all super fun to use. The Chikorita line is my favorite, though, because I have some really fond memories of using Meganium in Colosseum.

                                  2. Gen III - I love the whole Treecko line, and while I don't particularly like Marshtomp, Mudkip and Swampert look pretty good as well. Torchic is cute, but even though I don't care for its evolutions, Blaziken's usefulness saves it in my book. Treecko and its evolutions, especially Grovyle, are my favorites of this set.

                                  3. Gen V - My opinions of the starters, when they were first revealed, were pretty much the same as everyone else's. Snivy was the best thing since sliced bread, Tepig was alright, and what the heck was up with Oshawott? When the evolutions were revealed, I gained more respect for Oshawott's line, liked Snivy even more, and was pretty disappointed with Tepig's evos. When I got the games, it turned out that I preferred using Tepig over Snivy, so what dislike I had for Pignite and Emboar disappeared. Design-wise, though, my favorite is still Snivy.

                                  4. Gen I - While all three are great in battle, I've never liked the designs of Bulbasaur and its evolutions. I'm lukewarm on the Squirtle line's designs, but Blastoise has been my bro ever since I solo'd Silver with him. And like most people, I LOVE the Charmander line; they're my favorites of this gen. Aside from Mega Charizard Y, though, I don't like any of the Mega Evolutions.

                                  5. Gen VI - I watched the reveal of XY as it happened, and my immediate opinions were that Fennekin was the best fire starter in an extremely long time, Froakie was okay, and Chespin could go burn. The evolution reveals made me like Fennekin and Chespin less, and Froakie more. Overall, even though I currently have nothing against the Fennekin and Froakie lines, they're just not as great as other starters. Chespin is still terrible and bumped this gen down on the list quite a ways.

                                  6. Gen IV - I hate monkeys, so of course I dislike Chimchar's line. While I don't have the same loathing of penguins, they don't really do much for me either, so I don't really care for Piplup's line. Turtwig and Grotle are pretty mediocre designs, and don't even stand out as starters that well. I do love Torterra, though - I'm a Discworld fan, so of course I adore a world turtle Pokemon! But its awesomeness wasn't enough to save its generation from the bottom of this list.
                                  Old December 3rd, 2013 (9:25 PM).
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                                    1. Gen III - I love every single one of these starters and I also love every form of their evolutions.
                                    2. Gen I - Ahhh... The originals. These are the ones that I grew up on. However, I'm not too fond of the 2nd evolution of all of these.
                                    3. Gen V - I love the full evolution of Snivy and Oshowott. I don't really like the Tepig evolution.
                                    4. Gen IV - Turtwig, Piplup, Infernape, Empoleon, and that's all.
                                    5. Gen II - I love the Cyndaquil evolution and Tododile.
                                    6. Gen VI - Honestly, I don't like any of the Gen VI starters. Maybe Froakie...
                                    Old December 3rd, 2013 (9:57 PM).
                                    I've Come to Bargain's Avatar
                                    I've Come to Bargain I've Come to Bargain is offline
                                    • Silver Tier
                                    Join Date: Jul 2012
                                    Location: New York, USA
                                    Posts: 12,008
                                    In terms of looks, it would have to gen one > two > six > four > three > five. Fifth-gen starters are my least favorite, because, well, I just don't feel that they've put enough effort into their designs. If they tried a little harder, then I'm sure they would have turned out better. And competitive-wise, it would have to be generation three > one > gen six > four > five > two. Swampert was introduced in gen three, which was quite a heavy staller. Not only that, but gen three had Blaziken as well—it was a great sweeper. Due to these reasons, generation three deserves the first spot. d:
                                    Old December 3rd, 2013 (10:00 PM).
                                    Ash's Avatar
                                    Ash Ash is offline
                                    • Crystal Tier
                                    Join Date: Jul 2008
                                    Nature: Gentle
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                                    Generation 2 - Love all the starters and each of their evolutions. Yes, shame that they're not dual typed but I've never had any complaints.

                                    Generation 3 - The only one I don't really like out of like all three lines that much is Sceptile. Overall though they're also really amazing okay yes good.

                                    Generation 1 - Nostalgia maybe? But I really so love the starters in this generations especially the midevos which to me are the most important hahaha. Guess you can put me in the minority or something there.

                                    Generation 6 - Froakie Froakie Froakie Froakie Froakie. The other two are amazing as well and I love their typings.

                                    Generation 4 - These guys have grown on me since I first played Generation 4 but... compared to the generations before I guess I just don't like 'em as much?

                                    Generation 5 - In all honesty I really only like the entirety of the Snivy line. Tepig line? Only Tepig. Oshawott line? Only Dewott I guess. I like more of the gen 4 evolution likes than these guys ngl.
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                                    Old December 3rd, 2013 (10:31 PM).
                                    waveguidebuizel's Avatar
                                    waveguidebuizel waveguidebuizel is offline
                                      Join Date: Aug 2007
                                      Location: rhythm heaven
                                      Age: 28
                                      Gender: Male
                                      Nature: Timid
                                      Posts: 1,037
                                      Hmm, seems tough to rank, but I'll try.

                                      1. Gen III - My favorite batch of starters; I'd consider all nine of them pretty high up there in my favorites.

                                      2. Gen II - This is the only generation in which I can't choose a favorite (or least favorite) starter.

                                      3. Gen V - I grew to like all of them with a bit of time. Watching some LPs of PokéPark 2 helped a lot.

                                      4. Gen VI - Great batch! I especially love Chespin's entire family. Fennekin's is pretty good too. Froakie's alright, but I think they're way too serious for me.

                                      5. Gen IV - I like them, but I think the only ones I can consider favorites are Turtwig and Torterra. Conquest helped me like Infernape a bit better, solely because of its mischievous grin. Empoleon's pretty cool too.

                                      6. Gen I - Blasphemy! I actually grew up with this generation, but I guess I grew kinda bored with these starters over the years. I still love Squirtle though!
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                                      Old December 4th, 2013 (3:15 PM).
                                      AaronAbsol's Avatar
                                      AaronAbsol AaronAbsol is offline
                                        Join Date: Dec 2013
                                        Location: United States
                                        Gender: Male
                                        Nature: Lonely
                                        Posts: 6
                                        I've never really knocked starters. I've always liked and used them on my teams. But for me, it'd have to go:

                                        1) Gen 1: Blastoise will always be my favorite. Charizard is great. Venisaur isn't bad either. Gen 1 is perfect in my eyes.

                                        2) Gen 4: I actually, really love Gen 4's lineup. Chimchar, Piplup, and Turtwig each have beast final evolutions in my opinion and great types.

                                        3) Gen 3: Sceptile's design is the coolest. Blaziken and Swampert are nice too.

                                        4) Gen 2: I too feel like the second gen. has some kind of "meh" starters, but I have a soft spot for Tododile.

                                        5) Gen 5: I don't seem to care too much for the starters in this gen. They're not bad, but they just feel dull, so to speak.

                                        6) Gen 6: The reason I put it so low, is because I haven't played X or Y yet. Looking forward to it, but I can't judge what I haven't seen. They do look like great starters though.
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