what are the best pokemon (non legendary)

Started by gigglegamer May 26th, 2014 4:55 AM
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  • 14 replies

ludicolodancer

Fabby the ninetails

Female
Seen July 9th, 2014
Posted June 3rd, 2014
13 posts
9 Years
Blissey, for its blockage against Pokemon that seem powerful, I can get a healing round off.
Spiritomb, for its vitality against ALL Pokemon (prior to Gen 6)
Blaziken, for its movepool and high attack
Gardevoir, design and special attack
Dragonair, design
Rotom, for his ability to type change

PlatinumDude

Nyeh?

Age 29
Male
Canada
Seen July 31st, 2020
Posted May 30th, 2020
12,958 posts
12.7 Years
question: who said mega mons aren't legendary? if you see Pokemon origins the professor clearly states that mega's are legends
Games =/= anime. While the Pokemon anime follows the games they don't follow them entirely. The general definition of legendary Pokemon is Pokemon seen so rarely their existence is questioned. Mega Evolutions are different. While most have the power on par with legendaries, they still come from regular Pokemon. Mega Evolutions are also temporary forms that only last during battle.

Furthermore at what point did the prof say Megas are legendary? I don't recall him saying that when I watched Origins.

Games =/= anime. While the Pokemon anime follows the games they don't follow them entirely. The general definition of legendary Pokemon is Pokemon seen so rarely their existence is questioned. Mega Evolutions are different. While most have the power on par with legendaries, they still come from regular Pokemon. Mega Evolutions are also temporary forms that only last during battle.

Furthermore at what point did the prof say Megas are legendary? I don't recall him saying that when I watched Origins.
"The Legend passed down in the kalos region since the ancient days" he said it in the last episode.
Male
Seen February 8th, 2015
Posted February 8th, 2015
256 posts
9.1 Years
"The Legend passed down in the kalos region since the ancient days" he said it in the last episode.
If we classed Pokemon as "Legendary Pokemon" just because they've been mentioned in some form of legend, then Deoxys is not a Legendary Pokemon as there are no legends surrounding it, whereas Arcanine, Gyarados and Absol all are legendary Pokemon as they're all mentioned in one legend or other.
If we classed Pokemon as "Legendary Pokemon" just because they've been mentioned in some form of legend, then Deoxys is not a Legendary Pokemon as there are no legends surrounding it, whereas Arcanine, Gyarados and Absol all are legendary Pokemon as they're all mentioned in one legend or other.
gyarados is mentioned in legends what? anyway there are things called pseudo legends. Also deoxys is an alien. I have never heard it being called the Legendary deoxys anywhere, its use in ubers is merely a statement to its powers.

PirateHunterZoro

The greatest swordsman in the world!

Male
East Blue
Seen June 11th, 2014
Posted June 3rd, 2014
6 posts
9 Years
It really depends on what you are looking for.

If you want an all-out offensive, Lucario is good. If defense is more your thing, you could try Shuckle or Carbink. Try different Pokemon and you will find one that you work well with.
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Male
Seen July 29th, 2016
Posted July 26th, 2016
29 posts
9 Years
Blissey, for its blockage against Pokemon that seem powerful, I can get a healing round off.
Spiritomb, for its vitality against ALL Pokemon (prior to Gen 6)
Blaziken, for its movepool and high attack
Gardevoir, design and special attack
Dragonair, design
Rotom, for his ability to type change

thanks this is a intresting team

Lihtal

Castle Guard

Age 28
Male
Hyrule
Seen January 4th, 2017
Posted December 22nd, 2016
72 posts
9.5 Years
I think you should play with the Pokemon you like...after all there is no ¨better pokemon than other¨ I dont belive GF would design pokemon like that. After all Tiers (OU UU Ubers) in my opinion is clearly unoriginal by the fact that they are based on how many people use them which in some case it could get monotone, and thus making the whole experience flat ( I mean come on out of 700+ it gets really boring to see garchomp, dragonite, salamence, gardevoir, excadrill, blaziken etc. in almost every team). The fact that you use Pokemon who are ¨the most powerfull¨ because of Tiers and/or other peoples opinion gives you a huge disadvantage, because they are so common that by this point is quite easy to come around them. To make my whole point, I´ve seen Quagsire, Ludicolo, Magikarp tearing Ubers s**t up (excuse the rude word) so after all, there is no stronger Pokemon... Create, Try, Innovate with the Pokemon that you see and you like. That´s why you have access to many different kinds of mons, Don't stop by asking what other people believe what is a better Pokemon because it puts you on a disadvantage.

Anyway, it´s only MY opinion lol, create your teams go for it, in my party currently sits a Liligant, Vaporeon, Archeops, Toxicroak, Raichu and Infernape and on the competitive scene it´s been a fun ride, this team has granted me a lot of victories.


Seen November 24th, 2014
Posted May 31st, 2014
175 posts
9.2 Years
Luckily (?) such thing as the ultimate Pokemon does not exist, even in ubers (although Ghost-ceus comes pretty clsoe to unbeatable in 1v1).

The outlines for this kind of discussion is probably a bit too loose to make points in. What is considered good? Is having the least amount of checks good, or rather it having centralizing effects? Doubles or Singles? Should we only judge single sets or consider the Pokemon as a whole?

Now, there aren't any non-Uber examples in Smogon because they usually strife to prevent overcentralization. Good (albeit Uber) examples of something being overcentralizing but nonetheless not being uncounterable are probably Xerneas and its predecessor Kyogre. Both of them dominate the Singles Uber metagame (Kyogre even leads the Uber Doubles - TopOgre anyone?), Xerneas being in almost 40% of all teams while Kyogre in the past generations even managed to break the 60% mark at times. However, both of them have in common that they can be countered, unlike some of the lesser powerhouses. Xerneas runs against a hard counter Aegislash and the wall of steel Mawile while Kyogre usually can't break Gastrodon and Ludicolo (and Shedinja of all things).
Don't get me wrong, even though it is possible to stop them they are considered the leader of the metagame for a reason; many people use them and many more have to be prepared to face and survive them. Come to think of, DPP Garchomp probably comes close to fill this role until it got the boot. It is not entirely unstoppable but works on the broken evasion mechanics which makes every encounter inherently luck-based, considering that sand was basically the only weather in OU and permanent.

The second kind of powerful comes in them not being counterable. A good standard example is probably BW MixMence (not DPP Salami becasue it got kicked to Ubers) or BW2 Hydreigon. The first one can smash its way through many walls with the two most powerful and almost unresisted moves in the game coming form both spectra while Hydreigon is able to tech its way through with its coverage moves (Blissey was a workable wall before it got Superpower in BW2).
However, both of them are relatively easy to check because at that time the metagame was revolving around base speed 108+ which leaves them rather easily checked and revengekilled.


The closest examples we can think of that fit both criteria are Mega-Gengar, Mega-Kangaskhan and Mega-Lucario to a lesser extent in the 6th gen Singles. Gengar is the most broken thing in the game as far as support is concerned thanks to Shadow Tag. Being immune to Toxic allows it to dispatch anything in the game that is not able to dish out enough damage and Perish Trap it while the nature of its ability allows the player to choose exactly which target dies. Its top speed makes it able to fire off Destiny Bond on anything that does not carry a Choice Scarf or rely on priority which, again, cannot be outplayed because of Shadow Tag. All in all, it basically always trade at least 1-1, just that the player dictates the conditions.
Mega-Kangaskhan and Mega-Lucario are powerful in a much simpler way. They are primarily sweeper, they just smash things and things die. Lucario gains enough speed to outrun any common Pokemon while Kangaskhan can allieviate her middling speed with the equivalent of a CB Sucker Punch. While they are pretty similar in function we think that Kangaskhan is more powerful because of the stronger coverage moves and the titanic bulk, even though Lucario has less counters and checks. Kangaskhan can only be countered by Gourgeist and Cohagrigus and only be checked by faster Fighting types resistant to Sucker Punch, namely Infernape, ponies and Mienshao. Except for Terrakion the subpar Cohagrigus everyone is easily checked by the omnipresent Talonflame, so that idea flew right out of the window (pun probably intended).
Lucario is much frailer and relies mostly on the STAB Adaptability moves to deal massive damage. Other than Kangaskhan Lucario cannot fit all its potential onto one single set but relies on the opponent making the guess which one it is running, similar to DPP Salamence, except that there is even less room for mistakes considering how powerful a Adaptability CC is. Still, we think it is a lesser Kangaskhan despite it being a Kangaskhan check.
So yeah, the best Pokemon is either Mega-Gengar or Mega-Kangaskhan.

Note, that it only applies to Singles. In Doubles Lucario is a bit too frail and is only able to target one opponent a turn and this kind of Gengar is limited to dedicated Trapper teams. Kangaskhan lacks the important Earthquake coverage because of the weakened power (and the sheer utility of Fake Out) but still is one of the most powerful Pokemon alongside with Charizard-Y.
Ironically, because both of them are the most dominant forces of VGC, Garchomp is the most used one despite being quite weak compared to them. Its main selling point is it being faster than both of them, Rough Skin against Kangaskhan and Rock Slide against Charizard.

Jakeremix

Poképro~

Male
Ohio
Seen March 16th, 2015
Posted January 29th, 2015
124 posts
9.1 Years
Games =/= anime. While the Pokemon anime follows the games they don't follow them entirely. The general definition of legendary Pokemon is Pokemon seen so rarely their existence is questioned. Mega Evolutions are different. While most have the power on par with legendaries, they still come from regular Pokemon. Mega Evolutions are also temporary forms that only last during battle.

Furthermore at what point did the prof say Megas are legendary? I don't recall him saying that when I watched Origins.
Just saying, Pokemon Origins isn't THE anime. It takes place in the same world/universe as all of the games. With the main series that follows Ash, the same can't be said, but everything that takes place in Origins applies to the games as well. Pokemon Origins is basically Red/Blue in a different form.