Moveset Help & Other Questions (FAQ in first post) Page 14

Started by Zeffy March 22nd, 2015 5:47 AM
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wolf

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Posted October 23rd, 2022
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Looking for a support Chimecho. I ended up hatching a Bold Chingling but I want to make use of it because it's Shiny, so I was thinking of a support Chimecho. (I don't need an attacking Chimecho, I already have a second one for that) I just want to make use of this one because it's Shiny. It was born with Recover and Skill Swap, I'm going to let it learn Entrainment before I let it evolve and want it to learn Heal Pulse, problem is I also want it to know Heal Bell and I don't know which of it's ability moves to get rid of. It was born with Skill Swap so I can reteach that whenever, but Once it evolves, if I get rid of Entrainment it can never learn it again, so I am wondering if I should keep one of these abilities over the other and why. In addition to the healing of team mates, I was also wanting to use it to get rid of bad abilities (such as Slow Start, for example) and then, if it lives, giving that ability to the opponent, or simply giving it's own ability to something that can use it (like an Electric type team mate that doesn't have good ability options and giving it Chimecho's levitate) I'm really stumped because if it had 5 move slots I would be fine, but with four I really have to pick which one to get rid of, and one of those options I can't go back on. Thanks for advice!

So Chimecho:
Bold (non negotiable, it's shiny)
Item: Dunno yet. Maybe Focus Sash
Heal Bell
Heal Pulse
Skill Swap
Entrainment
Recover

Which should I get rid of?

EDIT: Also, what's the point of forfeiting when you're in your last turn? I get if it's a battle that drags on and on, or you know you're hopelessly outclassed, but I was fighting in Triples a Diancie, Kyurem White, Zekrom, Rayquaza Giratina and Dialga which I got them down to just two (Giratina and Dialga) with my team of Greninja, Mega Manectric (Intimidate and Snarl are insanely useful together!), Hawlucha, Golurk and Smeargle with Transform who transformed into Diancie. Anyway, I got the other team down to just two pokemon and they forfeited, SO I was wondering why? It still counts as a loss for you if you forfeit, right? So why not just take the loss. That's what I do because why bother forfeitting?
If I'm not too late to this, Entrainment seems like a worse version of Skill Swap to me. It might be more useful in situations where you need to Earthquake in doubles or triples, but you'd be giving your opponent that immunity as well.
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Seen October 9th, 2017
Posted July 13th, 2017
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If I'm not too late to this, Entrainment seems like a worse version of Skill Swap to me. It might be more useful in situations where you need to Earthquake in doubles or triples, but you'd be giving your opponent that immunity as well.
I'm not sure what you mean, in doubles and triples you can use Entrainment on the opponent or a team mate (you can choose anyone adjacent to you) so I'm not sure what you mean by giving your opponent the immunity.
Need a specific Berry? I have literally every kind. Need a Friend Safari HA pokemon? I have them all. Need a gen 1 - 3 (and a few from gen 4) Move Tutor Egg Move that can no longer be obtained? I might be able to help. Drop me a DM if you need anything and maybe I can help!
My first battle in a competition, January 2016: I call this "never give up!" :D YNUW-WWWW-WW3F-FMAQ

wolf

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Posted October 23rd, 2022
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14.7 Years
I'm not sure what you mean, in doubles and triples you can use Entrainment on the opponent or a team mate (you can choose anyone adjacent to you) so I'm not sure what you mean by giving your opponent the immunity.
It depends on the team. With Skill Swap you're accomplishing almost the same purpose, and Chimecho might get a better ability in the process. Like I said, Entrainment seems only useful if you absolutely need to keep Levitate on Chimecho, or if you're using it on something like Slaking.

Also, by using it on the opponent I was thinking along the lines of crippling Pokemon that heavily rely on their abilities.
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Male
Seen October 9th, 2017
Posted July 13th, 2017
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It depends on the team. With Skill Swap you're accomplishing almost the same purpose, and Chimecho might get a better ability in the process. Like I said, Entrainment seems only useful if you absolutely need to keep Levitate on Chimecho, or if you're using it on something like Slaking.

Also, by using it on the opponent I was thinking along the lines of crippling Pokemon that heavily rely on their abilities.
Oh I see! Yeah, I was thinking (on the rare occasion that it lasts more than a couple turns) of skill swapping a negative or even not useful ability (like light metal if you have a weight based attack or your team, or Slow Start) from a team mate and then giving it to one or both opponents, but I do see you point thought.

On a side note, is there any actual benefit to making your pokemon lighter? Between Light Metal and Float Stone and Autotomize (although I don't think anything with Light Metal learns autotomize) you can make your pokemon weight up to 1/4 of it's normal weight (1/8 if it was possible to have all 3 on one pokemon), but is there any benefit to this whatsoever? Other than someone using Low Kick, grass knot, Heat Crash or Heavy Slam on you, is there any benefit that you can use whatsoever? Heavy Metal is obvious because you can use weight based attacks, but making yourself lighter seems to offer no purpose whatsoever, and I kind of find it hard to believe that they gave 5 pokemon the ability and a hold item to defend against or be hindered by 4 moves and that's it. Is there some secret to weight in the game or is it seriously a whole series of abilities and a hold item solely built around those four moves?
Need a specific Berry? I have literally every kind. Need a Friend Safari HA pokemon? I have them all. Need a gen 1 - 3 (and a few from gen 4) Move Tutor Egg Move that can no longer be obtained? I might be able to help. Drop me a DM if you need anything and maybe I can help!
My first battle in a competition, January 2016: I call this "never give up!" :D YNUW-WWWW-WW3F-FMAQ

wolf

he/him
Seen 15 Hours Ago
Posted October 23rd, 2022
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14.7 Years
Oh I see! Yeah, I was thinking (on the rare occasion that it lasts more than a couple turns) of skill swapping a negative or even not useful ability (like light metal if you have a weight based attack or your team, or Slow Start) from a team mate and then giving it to one or both opponents, but I do see you point thought.

On a side note, is there any actual benefit to making your pokemon lighter? Between Light Metal and Float Stone and Autotomize (although I don't think anything with Light Metal learns autotomize) you can make your pokemon weight up to 1/4 of it's normal weight (1/8 if it was possible to have all 3 on one pokemon), but is there any benefit to this whatsoever? Other than someone using Low Kick, grass knot, Heat Crash or Heavy Slam on you, is there any benefit that you can use whatsoever? Heavy Metal is obvious because you can use weight based attacks, but making yourself lighter seems to offer no purpose whatsoever, and I kind of find it hard to believe that they gave 5 pokemon the ability and a hold item to defend against or be hindered by 4 moves and that's it. Is there some secret to weight in the game or is it seriously a whole series of abilities and a hold item solely built around those four moves?
There's no competitive value to going out of your way to make a Pokemon lighter. The only notable instance that comes to mind is Light Metal Scizor @ Scizorite. It lets Scizor switch in stuff like Weavile's Low Kick better. It doesn't need Technician since it'll Mega Evolve immediately.
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Male
Seen October 9th, 2017
Posted July 13th, 2017
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There's no competitive value to going out of your way to make a Pokemon lighter. The only notable instance that comes to mind is Light Metal Scizor @ Scizorite. It lets Scizor switch in stuff like Weavile's Low Kick better. It doesn't need Technician since it'll Mega Evolve immediately.
Alright thank you very much for explaining that!

So, I'm not asking if this is a GOOD moveset, It's just a gimmick I'm trying out, I jsut want to know if it will actually work or if there's some mechanic I'm not seeing that would prevent something from working the way I think it should:

Heatmor @ Starf Berry (unless there's another berry that raises a specific stat sharply rather than a random one)
Gluttony Ability
Giga Drain (to cover all it's weaknesses and recover HP)
Heatwave/Flamethrower (not sure yet, not important)
Belch
Recycle

So obviously it's to make use of the sharply raised random stat at 50% health, recycle/recover and repeat. Again, I know it's a gimmick, and relies on survivability and randomness, but I just want to know if there is anything that I'm not seeing that would prevent any part of this from not working (like my initial Delibird Bestow/Recycle plan wouldn't work, I just want to know if there's anything in this set that is specifically being blocked from working before I go to the trouble of breeding one) Thanks for the input!
Need a specific Berry? I have literally every kind. Need a Friend Safari HA pokemon? I have them all. Need a gen 1 - 3 (and a few from gen 4) Move Tutor Egg Move that can no longer be obtained? I might be able to help. Drop me a DM if you need anything and maybe I can help!
My first battle in a competition, January 2016: I call this "never give up!" :D YNUW-WWWW-WW3F-FMAQ

Nah

Age 30
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Seen 11 Hours Ago
Posted 19 Hours Ago
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What EV spread(s) does Geomancy Xerneas typically run these days? The Smorgen page lists what is likely a kind of outdated spread (since it references Genesect), and I've had a few lately outspeed my Yveltal, which has significant Speed investment.
Nah ンン
“No, I... I have to be strong. Everyone expects me to."

wolf

he/him
Seen 15 Hours Ago
Posted October 23rd, 2022
8,259 posts
14.7 Years
Alright thank you very much for explaining that!

So, I'm not asking if this is a GOOD moveset, It's just a gimmick I'm trying out, I jsut want to know if it will actually work or if there's some mechanic I'm not seeing that would prevent something from working the way I think it should:

Heatmor @ Starf Berry (unless there's another berry that raises a specific stat sharply rather than a random one)
Gluttony Ability
Giga Drain (to cover all it's weaknesses and recover HP)
Heatwave/Flamethrower (not sure yet, not important)
Belch
Recycle

So obviously it's to make use of the sharply raised random stat at 50% health, recycle/recover and repeat. Again, I know it's a gimmick, and relies on survivability and randomness, but I just want to know if there is anything that I'm not seeing that would prevent any part of this from not working (like my initial Delibird Bestow/Recycle plan wouldn't work, I just want to know if there's anything in this set that is specifically being blocked from working before I go to the trouble of breeding one) Thanks for the input!
Belch seems too situational to work. It also doesn't provide any notable coverage. You're better off with Hidden Power Ice for Dragons. Use Substitute to help with status.

This strategy definitely won't work by the way.
What EV spread(s) does Geomancy Xerneas typically run these days? The Smorgen page lists what is likely a kind of outdated spread (since it references Genesect), and I've had a few lately outspeed my Yveltal, which has significant Speed investment.
For what it's worth, here are usage stats from last month:
 +----------------------------------------+ 
 | Spreads                                | 
 | Modest:248/0/0/252/8/0 19.694%         | 
 | Modest:184/0/28/252/0/44 13.626%       | 
 | Hardy:0/0/0/0/0/0  3.047%              | 
 | Timid:4/0/0/252/0/252  2.921%          | 
 | Modest:4/0/0/252/0/252  2.307%         | 
 | Mild:248/8/0/252/0/0  2.226%           | 
 | Other 56.178%                          | 
 +----------------------------------------+
Higher ladder (+1760):
 +----------------------------------------+ 
 | Spreads                                | 
 | Modest:184/0/28/252/0/44 14.224%       | 
 | Modest:248/0/0/252/8/0  7.718%         | 
 | Modest:104/0/80/248/0/76  2.890%       | 
 | Timid:0/0/72/252/0/184  2.692%         | 
 | Timid:4/0/0/252/0/252  2.687%          | 
 | Modest:0/0/0/252/4/252  2.621%         | 
 | Other 67.168%                          | 
 +----------------------------------------+
Aside from standard, max Spe or 72 Def / 184 Spe seem most common.
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Male
Seen October 9th, 2017
Posted July 13th, 2017
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Belch seems too situational to work. It also doesn't provide any notable coverage. You're better off with Hidden Power Ice for Dragons. Use Substitute to help with status.

This strategy definitely won't work by the way.
No, no, you misunderstand, I wasn't asking if it was a GOOD strategy, I was asking if it was technically capable of working. For example, a Delibird having Bestow and Recycle WON'T work because recycle is specifically prevented from restoring an item that is given away in this fashion, so I wasn't asking if the Heatmor strategy was a good one or whether or not it would work well in battles, I was asking if the game prevented any part of it from occuring because of the way teh game is coded (like the Bestow/REcycle thing) and I don't battle on simulators and I don't have the patience to breed for hidden power, so ANY kind of Hidden power that isn't Dark or Dragon is out of the question unfortunately.
Need a specific Berry? I have literally every kind. Need a Friend Safari HA pokemon? I have them all. Need a gen 1 - 3 (and a few from gen 4) Move Tutor Egg Move that can no longer be obtained? I might be able to help. Drop me a DM if you need anything and maybe I can help!
My first battle in a competition, January 2016: I call this "never give up!" :D YNUW-WWWW-WW3F-FMAQ

wolf

he/him
Seen 15 Hours Ago
Posted October 23rd, 2022
8,259 posts
14.7 Years
No, no, you misunderstand, I wasn't asking if it was a GOOD strategy, I was asking if it was technically capable of working. For example, a Delibird having Bestow and Recycle WON'T work because recycle is specifically prevented from restoring an item that is given away in this fashion, so I wasn't asking if the Heatmor strategy was a good one or whether or not it would work well in battles, I was asking if the game prevented any part of it from occuring because of the way teh game is coded (like the Bestow/REcycle thing) and I don't battle on simulators and I don't have the patience to breed for hidden power, so ANY kind of Hidden power that isn't Dark or Dragon is out of the question unfortunately.
I tried it out on Pokemon Showdown and it worked. PS is very reliable but it may not be 100% accurate.

Also, Snorlax would be better for this. Though at that point you might as well Curse + Rest.
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Male
Seen October 9th, 2017
Posted July 13th, 2017
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I tried it out on Pokemon Showdown and it worked. PS is very reliable but it may not be 100% accurate.

Also, Snorlax would be better for this. Though at that point you might as well Curse + Rest.
Oh good, thank you for checking that out! I will now go breed one. Thank you very much!
Need a specific Berry? I have literally every kind. Need a Friend Safari HA pokemon? I have them all. Need a gen 1 - 3 (and a few from gen 4) Move Tutor Egg Move that can no longer be obtained? I might be able to help. Drop me a DM if you need anything and maybe I can help!
My first battle in a competition, January 2016: I call this "never give up!" :D YNUW-WWWW-WW3F-FMAQ

Nah

Age 30
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Seen 11 Hours Ago
Posted 19 Hours Ago
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9.5 Years
I'm breeding Skarmory right now and kinda up in the air on how I want to build it up. What would be some recommendations from y'all?
It generally works best as a defensive/support 'mon. Usually want to run max HP and either max Def or Sp.Def EVs (though the physically defensive version is more common. Roost is a must, and then the rest of its moves are typically some combination of Whirlwind, Stealth Rocks/Spikes, Taunt, Toxic, and Defog. An attacking move is often used too, like Iron Head, Brave Bird, or more rarely, Counter.
Nah ンン
“No, I... I have to be strong. Everyone expects me to."
Male
Seen October 9th, 2017
Posted July 13th, 2017
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9.5 Years
I'm breeding Skarmory right now and kinda up in the air on how I want to build it up. What would be some recommendations from y'all?
I'm in the process of doing that right now, I'm going to be trying out a Weak Armour/Guard Swap set (so a couple of physical hits lower it's Defenses but raises it's speed, then you use guard Swap to exchange your lowered defense with the opponent, which swaps stat changes to your defenses with the target) which I am going with an Impish nature and max EV in Defense so it can handle the lowered defense. I haven't decided on what other moves to put on it yet or how the rest of it's EVs will go, as I am just trying it out to see how it goes, so if you're willing to experiment, you can try that out.
Need a specific Berry? I have literally every kind. Need a Friend Safari HA pokemon? I have them all. Need a gen 1 - 3 (and a few from gen 4) Move Tutor Egg Move that can no longer be obtained? I might be able to help. Drop me a DM if you need anything and maybe I can help!
My first battle in a competition, January 2016: I call this "never give up!" :D YNUW-WWWW-WW3F-FMAQ

PlatinumDude

Nyeh?

Age 29
Male
Canada
Seen July 31st, 2020
Posted May 30th, 2020
12,958 posts
12.7 Years
I'm in the process of doing that right now, I'm going to be trying out a Weak Armour/Guard Swap set (so a couple of physical hits lower it's Defenses but raises it's speed, then you use guard Swap to exchange your lowered defense with the opponent, which swaps stat changes to your defenses with the target) which I am going with an Impish nature and max EV in Defense so it can handle the lowered defense. I haven't decided on what other moves to put on it yet or how the rest of it's EVs will go, as I am just trying it out to see how it goes, so if you're willing to experiment, you can try that out.
Weak Armor + Guard Swap is a waste of Skarmory's defensive potential. Yes, it has high enough Defense to abuse the ability, but don't forget that priority moves are everywhere, making it tough for Skarmory to get a Guard Swap off.

Male
Seen October 9th, 2017
Posted July 13th, 2017
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So, Durant with Hustle and using Stone Edge, since hustle makes the accuracy of a move 80% of what it was, does that mean this Durant using Stone Edge (unaided by accuracy boosting) would have an accuracy of 64%?
Need a specific Berry? I have literally every kind. Need a Friend Safari HA pokemon? I have them all. Need a gen 1 - 3 (and a few from gen 4) Move Tutor Egg Move that can no longer be obtained? I might be able to help. Drop me a DM if you need anything and maybe I can help!
My first battle in a competition, January 2016: I call this "never give up!" :D YNUW-WWWW-WW3F-FMAQ

PlatinumDude

Nyeh?

Age 29
Male
Canada
Seen July 31st, 2020
Posted May 30th, 2020
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12.7 Years
So, Durant with Hustle and using Stone Edge, since hustle makes the accuracy of a move 80% of what it was, does that mean this Durant using Stone Edge (unaided by accuracy boosting) would have an accuracy of 64%?
Simply put, yes. Hustle decreases affected moves' accuracy by 20% of their original values. 20% of 80 is 16 in the case of Stone Edge.

Age 25
Male
Massachusetts
Seen April 29th, 2020
Posted November 30th, 2016
24 posts
9.7 Years
Alright, so I'm breeding a competitive Shuckle and I have a moveset, but I was wondering which IV I should make low or even 0
Moveset:
Power Trick
Power Split
Guard split
Gyro Ball
Now I was thinking a Relaxed Shuckle with a 0 or low speed, but then the thouht of a Bold with 0 or low attack, and I can't decide which would be better, could I get some opinions with reasons?
Current challenges: Avatar mode-Ultimate (on hold- my ds broke, so I can't continue my Firered run)
POTTERLOCKE-Platinum and Soul Silver

PlatinumDude

Nyeh?

Age 29
Male
Canada
Seen July 31st, 2020
Posted May 30th, 2020
12,958 posts
12.7 Years
Alright, so I'm breeding a competitive Shuckle and I have a moveset, but I was wondering which IV I should make low or even 0
Moveset:
Power Trick
Power Split
Guard split
Gyro Ball
Now I was thinking a Relaxed Shuckle with a 0 or low speed, but then the thouht of a Bold with 0 or low attack, and I can't decide which would be better, could I get some opinions with reasons?
In terms of the set, Shuckle's Speed should be 0. And in terms of practically, it's not practical simply because Shuckle is way too slow to pull this set off. In the time it takes for Shuckle to set up any of those three moves, any physical attacker can easily take it out. Shuckle also doesn't learn any priority moves, making the usefulness of that set even more questionable.

The best niche that Shuckle can pull off here is an entry hazard setter with Sticky Web and Stealth Rock, as it has just enough bulk to set up both hazards:
-Stealth Rock
-Sticky Web
-Encore
-Infestation/Knock Off/Toxic
Nature: Bold
EVs: 248 HP/252 Def/8 SDef
Item: Mental Herb
Ability: Sturdy

As Shuckle is very weak and very slow, its Attack, Special Attack, and Speed IVs don't matter.

PlatinumDude

Nyeh?

Age 29
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Seen July 31st, 2020
Posted May 30th, 2020
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I forgot to mention that this is a double battle breed with trick room. That's a major detail...
In VGC12 (4 years ago), Shuckle was used to an extent, by using either Power Split to weaken attackers or Guard Split to support tanky Pokemon (not both, since it leaves Shuckle strapped for moves). However, Cresselia does general support better in VGC formats, thanks to its higher bulk compared to Shuckle (230 defenses don't really mean anything when it only has 20 HP). As I already mentioned, Power Trick Shuckle is high risk-low reward, since any physical attacker can easily take it out after a Power Trick and the presence of priority moves makes this more difficult.

These are the Split sets that Shuckle used in VGC12; they may not be as effective now, given the power creep:
-Bug Bite/Helping Hand
-Rock Slide
-Power Split
-Rest
Nature: Impish
EVs: 252 HP/252 Def/4 SDef
Item: Chesto Berry
Ability: Sturdy

or
-Guard Split
-Helping Hand
-Toxic
-Protect
Nature: Impish/Careful
EVs: 4 HP/252 Def/252 SDef
Item: Lum Berry/Mental Herb
Ability: Sturdy

Age 25
Male
Massachusetts
Seen April 29th, 2020
Posted November 30th, 2016
24 posts
9.7 Years
In VGC12 (4 years ago), Shuckle was used to an extent, by using either Power Split to weaken attackers or Guard Split to support tanky Pokemon (not both, since it leaves Shuckle strapped for moves).
See, my idea was to go in and use Power split, weakening the enemy, then use trick room on the same turn. Use Power trick to swap my Atk and Def, then, possibly depending on if it's a tank/wall, use guard split, lowering what they have as a Def with what used to be my Atk and balancing that, or not if its a sweeper. Then making use of my very low speed and very high attack use gyro ball in the trick room environment.
Current challenges: Avatar mode-Ultimate (on hold- my ds broke, so I can't continue my Firered run)
POTTERLOCKE-Platinum and Soul Silver

PlatinumDude

Nyeh?

Age 29
Male
Canada
Seen July 31st, 2020
Posted May 30th, 2020
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12.7 Years
See, my idea was to go in and use Power split, weakening the enemy, then use trick room on the same turn. Use Power trick to swap my Atk and Def, then, possibly depending on if it's a tank/wall, use guard split, lowering what they have as a Def with what used to be my Atk and balancing that, or not if its a sweeper. Then making use of my very low speed and very high attack use gyro ball in the trick room environment.
Trick Room lasts for only 5 turns, including the turn it's first used. In that case, Shuckle will only have 3 turns to attack before Trick Room wears off. Don't forget that Protect, which can stall out field conditions like Trick Room, is rampant in VGC formats. There's also priority, which can easily take out Shuckle after a Power Trick. That being said, Power Trick is a terrible move, despite the temptingness of giving Shuckle absurd Attack.

Male
Seen October 9th, 2017
Posted July 13th, 2017
1,900 posts
9.5 Years
I am currently breeding a Shuckle myself, so I was wondering should it have a nature to boost it's Defense or a nature to boost it's Special defense? Does it have more physical or special weaknesses?
Need a specific Berry? I have literally every kind. Need a Friend Safari HA pokemon? I have them all. Need a gen 1 - 3 (and a few from gen 4) Move Tutor Egg Move that can no longer be obtained? I might be able to help. Drop me a DM if you need anything and maybe I can help!
My first battle in a competition, January 2016: I call this "never give up!" :D YNUW-WWWW-WW3F-FMAQ

PlatinumDude

Nyeh?

Age 29
Male
Canada
Seen July 31st, 2020
Posted May 30th, 2020
12,958 posts
12.7 Years
I am currently breeding a Shuckle myself, so I was wondering should it have a nature to boost it's Defense or a nature to boost it's Special defense? Does it have more physical or special weaknesses?
Bold is preferred on Shuckle to minimize confusion and Foul Play damage. As all multi-hit attacks are physical, Bold also helps Shuckle take them better.