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Old November 15th, 2005 (5:24 PM).
Paradise Paradise is offline
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Skarmory (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 196 HP / 88 Atk / 192 Def / 16 Spd / 16 SDef
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Drill Peck
- Rest
- Roar
- Spikes

This rocks as a leader, believe it or not. This outspeeds other Skarmories and has a chance of surviving if I see a Salamence that only does exactly 50% with its Fire move on average. Otherwise, this is just your 320 hp 400 defense skarmory.

Metagross @ Choice Band
Trait: Clear Body
EVs: 52 HP / 252 Atk / 56 Def / 148 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Earthquake
- Explosion
- Meteor Mash
- Rock Slide

I actually tried HP Bug for a while (it's just as useful as Shadow Ball if you think about it) but then I discovered that I really don't like Zapdos. This 2hkos it. (78% each time on average I think).

Tyranitar (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 68 Spd / 188 SAtk
Quiet Nature (+SAtk, -Spd)
- Crunch
- Focus Punch
- Substitute
- Thunderbolt

I invented this (lol)

Suicune @ Leftovers
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 240 HP / 208 Def / 24 Spd / 36 SAtk
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Ice Beam
- Rest
- Surf

Ice Beam>Roar imo.

Raikou @ Leftovers
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 132 HP / 104 Def / 232 Spd / 40 SAtk
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Rest
- Roar
- Thunderbolt

I tried Roar on Raikou randomly once and I was amazed by the outcome. This thing has a ton of Roaring potential. Then I needed Rest, so I replaced HP Ice with it because Thunderbolt hits almost everything anyways, except Dugtrio which will kill me no matter what set I have and Swampert who I will be switching out of.

Celebi @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 240 HP / 56 SAtk / 212 SDef
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Heal Bell
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Leech Seed
- Recover

I got really sick of all of the Dugtrios and Salamences I wasn't able to KO and all of the Tyranitars that I can't even touch. I haven't tried HP Ice yet but it seems workable in theory so I'll try it out for a while. What is the best IV spread for HP Ice?
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Old November 15th, 2005 (5:45 PM).
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Roar > Ice Beam in popular opinion
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Old November 15th, 2005 (5:56 PM).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paradise
Skarmory (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 196 HP / 88 Atk / 192 Def / 16 Spd / 16 SDef
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Drill Peck
- Rest
- Roar
- Spikes

I like Hp [Flying], and WW but sure.

This rocks as a leader, believe it or not. This outspeeds other Skarmories and has a chance of surviving if I see a Salamence that only does exactly 50% with its Fire move on average. Otherwise, this is just your 320 hp 400 defense skarmory.

Metagross @ Choice Band
Trait: Clear Body
EVs: 52 HP / 252 Atk / 56 Def / 148 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Earthquake
- Explosion
- Meteor Mash
- [b]SB

Shadow Ball over RS IMO.

I actually tried HP Bug for a while (it's just as useful as Shadow Ball if you think about it) but then I discovered that I really don't like Zapdos. This 2hkos it. (78% each time on average I think).

Tyranitar (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 68 Spd / 188 SAtk
Quiet Nature (+SAtk, -Spd)
- Crunch
- Focus Punch
- Substitute
- Thunderbolt

Sure. -_-

I invented this (lol)

Suicune @ Leftovers
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 240 HP / 208 Def / 24 Spd / 36 SAtk
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Ice Beam
- Rest
- Surf

Or Roar over Ice Beam, I like Ice Beam better too.

Ice Beam>Roar imo.

Raikou @ Leftovers
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 132 HP / 104 Def / 232 Spd / 40 SAtk
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- HP [Grass]
- Sub
- Thunderbolt

Raikou can't rest. It Subs, CMs, then rapes you.

I tried Roar on Raikou randomly once and I was amazed by the outcome. This thing has a ton of Roaring potential. Then I needed Rest, so I replaced HP Ice with it because Thunderbolt hits almost everything anyways, except Dugtrio which will kill me no matter what set I have and Swampert who I will be switching out of.

Celebi @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 240 HP / 56 SAtk / 212 SDef
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Psychic
- Baton Pass
- Recover

I use this with different EVs, don't want to check though, I'm to lazy. I also use my cool no attack Celebi too.


I got really sick of all of the Dugtrios and Salamences I wasn't able to KO and all of the Tyranitars that I can't even touch. I haven't tried HP Ice yet but it seems workable in theory so I'll try it out for a while. What is the best IV spread for HP Ice?
Hope this helps.
:D
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Old November 15th, 2005 (7:03 PM).
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I always use WW/HP:Fly on Skarm because I don't like BP teams, and find I rarely if ever use DP.

RS>SB in almost everyone else's opinion, Mullet. Beating Zapdos>beating some random ghost with an attack with only 10 more bp than MM.

Not much to say about Boah, except that it'll be a nice surprise on your opponents, as the trend has shifted toward DDTar.

Roar is an option on Cune, as you do have Spikes, but if you prefer IB go for it.

Cool Kou. You sure this thing has the defenses though?

My favorite Celebi set is CM/HP:Ice/Psychic/Recover with enough for 300 Spd and 240 HP/255 Def. Being able to OHKO Mence won't do you any good if you can't outspeed it, and it needs enough for 255 Def if you plan on countering Dugtrio (it also needs a CM to OHKO - w/o CM you'll just deal a good amount of damage, but not KO, and end up dead yourself; TTar is a bad partner for this as you could be left with as little as 1 HP after HP:Bug). The best IVs for HP:Ice would have to be 30 in Spd, 31 everything else. Although you do have a lot of stuff you could pass CMs to on this team, making BP more than likely a better option over HP:Ice (as in the Celejump set). If it weren't for all the Resters, I'd say change it, but since you have 3 of them, you'll have to keep HB on there.
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Old November 15th, 2005 (7:49 PM).
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Suggestions in Bold.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paradise
Skarmory (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 196 HP / 88 Atk / 192 Def / 16 Spd / 16 SDef
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Drill Peck
- Rest
- Roar
- Spikes

Ignore people who are paranoid of BP teams, imo. DP/Roar works fine, unless random Cradilys/Mr. Mimes/Explouds in OU have you worried some. As much as it may do good, I don't like this overall as a leading pogey compared to the others on your team.

Metagross @ Choice Band
Trait: Clear Body
EVs: 52 HP / 252 Atk / 56 Def / 148 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Earthquake
- Shadow Ball
- Meteor Mash
- Rock Slide

Shadow Ball over Explosion. Dusclops/Gengar/Steels come in and laugh at your asplosion, as they will most likely survive, if not, then they probably weren't spread correctly EV wise anyway =/

Tyranitar (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 68 Spd / 188 SAtk
Quiet Nature (+SAtk, -Spd)
- Crunch
- Focus Punch
- Substitute
- Thunderbolt

I've never ever seen the need for all the speed T-Tar is given on Boah sets...but w/e. Go with the majority, I suppose.

Suicune @ Leftovers
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 240 HP / 208 Def / 24 Spd / 36 SAtk
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Roar
- Rest
- Surf

Roar definitely over Ice Beam. This thing is not only supposed to be meant as a Calm Minder, and Blisseys come in and laugh at this thing when you can't roar them out and they keep STing you until you're annoyed.

Raikou @ Leftovers
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 132 HP / 104 Def / 232 Spd / 40 SAtk
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Substitute
- HP (Ice)/(Grass)
- Thunderbolt

Dugtrio will not kill this thing if spread correctly: Rule #1 in using Raikou is to Sub first, Calm Mind later. Give it the standard set, please, and give Roar back to Suicune, so that harmony is restored to the world.

Celebi @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 240 HP / 56 SAtk / 212 SDef
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Heal Bell
- Hidden Power (Grass)
- Leech Seed
- Recover

How about implementing a STAB that everybody seems to forget on Celebi? Takes care of your Duggy/T-Tar problem. Another reason you may be having big troubles with those three is the fact that Celebi has no EVs spread into defense, despite being a supportive pogey. I can't supply the spread, but you can definitely afford to drop a lot of that SDef and put it into Def, as well as change the nature to Bold. That way Celebi has at least a prayer against Duggy and T-Tar to get at least one HP Grass hit in.
Overall CBMence weak, so make sure that you use Raikou correctly to counter that, or get some more BoltBeam support on the team. Golden Rule of Raikou: Sub first, ask questions later.
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Old November 16th, 2005 (6:05 AM).
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Thanks for the rates everyone, I think I will switch to Roar Suicune (which, however, will just mean I have an even bigger CBmence problem, Pyrotechnix)

Pyrotechnix, you said you wondered why speed was necessary on Boah. Well, it's to outspeed Weezings. Some people put a few points more if they want to outspeed Weezings with speed EVs. If you're slower than Weezing, or if you lose the tie, then Focus Punch basically becomes worthless. Also, standard Heal Bell Celebi has little or no Defense EVs.
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Old November 16th, 2005 (8:17 AM).
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I also would like to point out that I've beaten BP teams with DP Skarm, because 75% of them phail to almost any kind of phazer, whether WW is present or not.
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Old November 16th, 2005 (9:01 AM).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paradise
Thanks for the rates everyone, I think I will switch to Roar Suicune (which, however, will just mean I have an even bigger CBmence problem, Pyrotechnix)

Pyrotechnix, you said you wondered why speed was necessary on Boah. Well, it's to outspeed Weezings. Some people put a few points more if they want to outspeed Weezings with speed EVs. If you're slower than Weezing, or if you lose the tie, then Focus Punch basically becomes worthless. Also, standard Heal Bell Celebi has little or no Defense EVs.
First off, this team will not have a CBMence weakness if you use HP Ice on your Raikou instead of the bizarre (but not uneffective) set you have on it. Second, I understand it's to outspeed Weezing, which is why I've never understood why people put the speed on. You have T-Bolt and Crunch as SAtks, so why do you have to use Focus Punch? Let it burn you then counter back with T-Bolt or Crunch, and WHOAMG those deal damage too. if you're in a sub, Weezing is a non-factor anyway. Sludge Bomb can't do much to Boah, neither can Fiyah Blast.
What you call the "Standard" Heal Bell Celebi would be an idiot to not have Defense EVs. Yhalothar, CBMence, Heracross, HP Bug Duggy, CB Shadow Ballers, how are you doing today? Oh, you want to kill me? Go right ahead. =/ You can keep HP Ice on the Celebi, boost its defenses, and then you've got the CBMence problem taken care of. With the right defensive spread, none of these save maybe Heracross will score a OHKO, and they are all weak to Ice or Grass. Let them hit you, score a OHKO, and Recover off the damage the next time you get an opportunity. Heal Bell Celebi is having a lot less of a need than what you put on it for SAtk and SDef, as a true STAB'd Ice attack is rare.
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Old November 16th, 2005 (6:05 PM).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leafgreen386
RS>SB in almost everyone else's opinion, Mullet. Beating Zapdos>beating some random ghost with an attack with only 10 more bp than MM.
Some random Ghost, tell that to Gengar which is OU.:\
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Old November 16th, 2005 (6:18 PM).
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Thanks for pointing that out captain obvious. MM is a OHKO anyway.

Against something like a Dusclops switchin, 150 bp vs. 160 bp isn't that big of a difference, and doesn't justify using Shadow Ball.
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Old November 17th, 2005 (5:22 PM).
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I'm having problems with Heracross after Skarm dies (which is quite easy due to magneton), Swampert's typing is becoming annoying as ever, and Boah seems to be uncounterable. Any suggestions?
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Old November 17th, 2005 (5:30 PM).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paradise
I'm having problems with Heracross after Skarm dies (which is quite easy due to magneton), Swampert's typing is becoming annoying as ever, and Boah seems to be uncounterable. Any suggestions?
Okay, Boah dies to Medicham, or Mcgar, and stuff like that. Swapert is killed by HP [Grass] users. Hera dies to Dusclops.:D
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Old November 17th, 2005 (6:05 PM).
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everyone has Heracross problems.

that's why I have the slogan HORN WEAK!
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i once was in double battle and constantly kept attacking myself but won anyway
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Old November 17th, 2005 (7:10 PM).
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Quote:
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Okay, Boah dies to Medicham, or Mcgar, and stuff like that. Swapert is killed by HP [Grass] users. Hera dies to Dusclops.:D
Is there anyway I can do it without changing half my team? Also, McGar can't counter Boah, it's Subs are breakable each turn. FP probably isn't even a OHKO.
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Old November 18th, 2005 (5:58 AM).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paradise
Is there anyway I can do it without changing half my team? Also, McGar can't counter Boah, it's Subs are breakable each turn. FP probably isn't even a OHKO.
First off, FP is a OHKO, you can't get hit by a 200+ attack power, 150 base power 4x weakness and pray to survive, but McGar is hardly a counter to Boah, Yhalothar Crunch. Weezing counters Hera/Medicham for the most part, just don't burn Hera, and Swampert is a nifty counter for any type of T-Tar.
Boah is indeed counterable (you have Metagross, for pete's sakes: None of Boah's attacks deal SE damage against it)

And Mullet, you can't really say that Hera dies to Dusclops. YHalothar Guts+(name Hera attack or HP Ghost), and how are you today? If you don't burn it, you're screwed, if you do burn it, you're screwed even more.
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Old November 18th, 2005 (1:59 PM).
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Quote:
Boah is indeed counterable (you have Metagross, for pete's sakes: None of Boah's attacks deal SE damage against it)
And you can't say that Metagross is a counter when it can't take repeated switchins.
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Old November 18th, 2005 (2:27 PM).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leafgreen386
And you can't say that Metagross is a counter when it can't take repeated switchins.
Ah, 'tis true. My apologies. =/
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Old November 18th, 2005 (3:05 PM).
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Quote:
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First off, FP is a OHKO, you can't get hit by a 200+ attack power, 150 base power 4x weakness and pray to survive, but McGar is hardly a counter to Boah, Yhalothar Crunch. Weezing counters Hera/Medicham for the most part, just don't burn Hera, and Swampert is a nifty counter for any type of T-Tar.
Boah is indeed counterable (you have Metagross, for pete's sakes: None of Boah's attacks deal SE damage against it)

And Mullet, you can't really say that Hera dies to Dusclops. YHalothar Guts+(name Hera attack or HP Ghost), and how are you today? If you don't burn it, you're screwed, if you do burn it, you're screwed even more.
I kill Boah's all the time with McGar.

Dusclops does kill Hera, I've done it plenty of times, I S-Toss it to death. I don't have to burn it, and I've never seen a Hera with HP [Ghost].
:\
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Old November 18th, 2005 (3:18 PM).
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HP Ghost became an option for CBCross sets a while back for Clops, although most people prefer the standard of Megahorn/Focus Punch/Earthquake, Brick Break/Rock Slide. It's kind of waned in popularity, but that's because Clops has waned in popularity. This, friends, is how the metagame ebbs and flows...a constant maelstrom of change..
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Old November 19th, 2005 (10:54 AM).
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boah is dead now okay

SHUT THE **** UP 25 CHARACTERS
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Old November 19th, 2005 (1:28 PM).
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kows Boah being dead is actually a good thing for those using it.

Boah was sent out!
Foe switched to phsyical wall expecting DDTar!
Boah used Sub!
Foe got killed!
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Old November 20th, 2005 (10:06 AM).
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k i mean boah sucks. DDTar can **** up skarmbliss just as well and then can sweep a team 6-0 after skarmbliss is gone.

boah can just hurt skarmbliss and that's it. no one uses skarmbliss anymore anyways.
 

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