Connecticut Supreme Court: Death Penalty ruled unconstitutional

[Livewire]

The Connecticut Supreme Court on Thursday ruled the state's death penalty is unconstitutional. The ruling will affect the 11 inmates currently on the state's death row.

Lawmakers repealed the state's death penalty in 2012, but stipulated it only applied to future crimes. Plaintiffs in Thursday's case had argued the 2012 ban should also extend to prisoners already on death row.

This is a developing story. Check back for more details...

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entr...2bb?utm_hp_ref=politics&kvcommref=mostpopular

I think is is another example where recent evidence to the contrary (botched executions, etc.) has changed the public perception enough to where attitudes on the humane-ness of the death penalty itself comes into question. Do you see the Death Penalty as humane? Constitutional? Could the US Supreme Court get involved and be forced to rule on it next term?

 

[CoffeeDrink]

This always goes back to the bleeding hearts and the "He was such a good boy" excuse. Guess what? Kill some people, get yourself killed. Makes sense to me. Don't we all follow the Golden Rule? Or have people just simply forgotten that little gem?

 

[Esper]

The golden rule is too simple to work in the modern world. Would a person with mental disabilities who can't distinguish between right and wrong be made to suffer if they happen to harm someone?

 

[Livewire]

This always goes back to the bleeding hearts and the "He was such a good boy" excuse. Guess what? Kill some people, get yourself killed. Makes sense to me. Don't we all follow the Golden Rule? Or have people just simply forgotten that little gem?

Last I checked, we didn't current live in medieval 13th century Europe. Times change and attitudes towards things like the death penalty, etc, change along with those attitudes. I think it's time society evolved a little.

 

[Pokemon Game Fan]

Yeah guys! Let's prove how bad killing is by killing the person who killed a person! That isn't small-minded at all!

 

[Ivysaur]

Glad for Connecticut. The US's justice system is all about punishment and nothing about education and rehabilitation, it's time they stop fighting fire with fire.

Don't we all follow the Golden Rule? Or have people just simply forgotten that little gem?

Well, since I wouldn't like to be murdered, I will refrain from demanding that someone be murdered, as evil as he might have been. That's what the Golden Rule says. What you are actually supporting is not the Golden Rule, but the Talion Law, you know, "an eye for an eye", you murder and you get murdered. Fun fact, the Talion Law is the origin of the English word retaliation. I don't think we should make laws based on that.

 

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

I'm glad. I don't think that the death penalty is good policy due to both practical and ethical reasons. I read that it actually costs more money to have people on death penalty (keep in mind that most of the money is taken up by courts with very few inmates who get the death penalty not actually being executed) than it would if one would keep them in prison in life or try to rehabilitate them. A lot of inmates apparently try to get the death penalty as they get solitary confinement most of the time and since most likely they don't get killed life is better than living with the other prisoners. Ethically and morally because some of the ways that the prisoners have been killed have been quite gruesome (the pain they induce) that they can be considered cruel and unusual punishment (which is unconstitutional btw), plus as a Christian I believe in giving second chances and mercy.

 

[CoffeeDrink]

Okay, call me simple minded, sure. But have any of you actually seen first hand on what one person can do to another? Any murder scenes? Anything? Life is very different from the plastic joy bubble surrounding your safe little homes. There are some crimes that just deserve no second chances. Murder is one of them.

There is always a choice and if you choose to make the wrong ones who's supposed to fix them for you? Who is going to coddle the little ones because you slew their mother and left little more than a pile of indiscernible meat? I have no patience for those that make 'mistakes'. You're sorry? Well I'm sure saying sorry to the family of the little girl you raped makes it all okay. I don't care who you are or what god or gods you believe in, but I live in a world that is plagued by the sick and deranged alike. Is their life truly worth saving? Are these people truly worth all they suck from our funding?

I may be simple minded when I say to off them, but the same can also be said if you've never so much as stubbed your toe in the territory of their aftermath. If you've never been subject to the pain and sorrow of losing someone because of another's malicious actions then please give some more thought before you up and claim that killing vermin is barbaric.

 

[Her]

Okay, call me simple minded, sure. But have any of you actually seen first hand on what one person can do to another? Any murder scenes? Anything? Life is very different from the plastic joy bubble surrounding your safe little homes. There are some crimes that just deserve no second chances. Murder is one of them.

There is always a choice and if you choose to make the wrong ones who's supposed to fix them for you? Who is going to coddle the little ones because you slew their mother and left little more than a pile of indiscernible meat? I have no patience for those that make 'mistakes'. You're sorry? Well I'm sure saying sorry to the family of the little girl you raped makes it all okay. I don't care who you are or what god or gods you believe in, but I live in a world that is plagued by the sick and deranged alike. Is their life truly worth saving? Are these people truly worth all they suck from our funding?

I may be simple minded when I say to off them, but the same can also be said if you've never so much as stubbed your toe in the territory of their aftermath. If you've never been subject to the pain and sorrow of losing someone because of another's malicious actions then please give some more thought before you up and claim that killing vermin is barbaric.

I'm not trying to diminish your feelings, but you are far too swayed by the thoughts of vengeance, which is not comparable to justice. Your anger is completely understandable, as everyone should feel the same disgust when presented with a story of a heartless murderer or unrepentant serial rapist. But the death penalty is just not the way to go about things. Moral standpoints aside, it's not an effective deterrent against the people we are revolted by. It has a minimal effect on preventing more horrific crimes of any nature. By that logic alone, capital punishment is wrong and needs to be discontinued. Factoring in moral standpoints, the death penalty has a higher chance of hindering the healing of families whose causes of grief were given death sentences. In short, the study shows that the families of victims had higher rates of psychological & physical health when the criminals involved were given life sentences as opposed to the lower rates when the death penalty was given. The belief that the death penalty is the only way to truly help victims' loved ones move on is a flawed belief supporting a flawed punishment.

There is nothing the death penalty can do that can't be achieved through a life sentence. Especially in the American prison system which, if anything, would be a prolonged stay in Hell given what they allow there and what they ultimately cannot control in prison society.
But the point of criminal justice is (or should be to) not only to uphold the law and punish those who break it, but to rehabilitate individuals and society as a whole. To rise above vengeance, as valid as our emotions are. Capital punishment violates that belief on every level.

 

[Nah]

I agree with the idea that the prison system should be primarily used to rehabilitate people. And the US justice and prison systems are doing a very poor job at doing that.

But I don't think that the death penalty needs to be completely done away with either. The reality is that there are and will always be people who cannot be rehabilitated, and those are the only people it should be used on. Because like has been said just about every time this topic comes up on the internet, the death penalty has been a very poor crime deterrent, and I think that if there's a chance for someone to be rehabilitated and try to atone that we should take that chance. But again, there are people where that chance doesn't exist, and I've never understood why a life sentence is what the majority seems to usually prefer even in that case. What does a life sentence accomplish in regards to the unrepentant serial killer in cell #37 that hasn't shown any signs of change in the past decade? All he seems to be doing is eating up space, resources, and money to me.

And they really need to stop using those chemical cocktails for the executions. Why an expensive and not guaranteed to work/work well method is the preferred method of execution is beyond me when cheaper and more surefire methods exist.

 

[gimmepie]

I won't say much on this since it's an American political issue which is well outside my area of expertise, but I'm of the opinion that rehabilitation and release should always be the priority and that as things currently stand the existence of the death penalty carries too much risk of wrongly killing someone. Who punishes the government when they wrongly murder an innocent person?

If money is such a big deal, prisons need to be made as cheap as possible (I know for one thing that our prisons here are much too cushy). Besides is death - an instant out really - anywhere near as bad as living the rest of your life with regret for your actions (or for getting caught I guess) and fear of harm coming to yourself?

 

[Esper]

I am concerned with innocents being wrongly put to death so I'd only like it to be used in circumstances where you can be as certain as humanly possible that the person committed such a horrible crime. Increasingly sophisticated forensic science, technology and investigative techniques make this the most reliable time in history to execute the right person for the crime.

I'm also concerned with people being wrongly put to death. I don't want to say "innocent" because sometimes there isn't a doubt about what happened, but why it happened is still a mystery. There are cases where, because of DNA evidence and so on, we can know that someone is a murderer, but we don't necessarily know why or whether there are any mitigating factors. If someone were under the influence of drugs and killed someone, or several someones, or generally did something completely terrible, how would you treat that person? And if the person has an untreated mental illness, what then? If they were still a child (meaning their brain is still developing)? If they were being threatened?

Basically, how can forensic science account for non-physical mitigating factors?

 

[Her]

I'm for the death penalty if a) the prisoner wants it as an alternative to life (euthanasia essentially) or b) Their murder can be proved to a much higher standard than beyond a reasonable doubt e.g. some combination of being filmed, DNA evidence, witnesses, confesses to intimate knowledge of the crime etc etc. I am concerned with innocents being wrongly put to death so I'd only like it to be used in circumstances where you can be as certain as humanly possible that the person committed such a horrible crime. Increasingly sophisticated forensic science, technology and investigative techniques make this the most reliable time in history to execute the right person for the crime.

I think this is an interesting stance re: prison euthanasia. I definitely believe in the right to die, but you have to wonder who would opt for the option and how the entire process itself would work out. Would it be initially offered at sentencing if the criminal gets life with no parole? Would it only be offered after a certain time period? Would it only be offered if the prisoner has the same sort of condition a person on the outside has to have for euthanasia to be considered (debilitating/terminal illness)? I'm sure many people in prison right now would rather die than face another 10, 20, 30 years in the place, but that itself isn't exactly a just cause for euthanasia. It's hard enough to convince people to support one's right to die outside of prison, let alone trying to convince people to give a modicum of human decency to prisoners. Regardless of whatever the ethics of the situation may be, many people would say it's just a way for those inside to get around the punishment they've been handed and choosing the option that's preferable to them. It would be very, very hard to pass.

It's certainly an interesting point to consider.

 

[Hiidoran]

Speaking in generalities, I oppose the death penalty. As Ivysaur mentioned, Talion Law is too overly simplistic for a society that has advanced as much as we have in terms of offering a fair trial and in understanding the mens rea behind a person's crimes. I wholeheartedly agree that it is costly to house the convicted, and the appeals processes can easily result in ungodly amounts of tax money tied up in the court systems. When you get right down to it though, life is life. One person's life is not inherently better than another's, and while I might get some gruff for these statements, I do not believe society would be better off just, well, offing these people.

Why you may ask? To be blunt, it just doesn't seem to solve anything.

As God mentioned, it really doesn't help the surviving families feel better when you look back on it, and it certainly doesn't prevent it from happening again. Will it save money? Maybe in the short-term, but I don't believe it's a long-term financial solution.

Besides, by murdering the murders... we create martyrs. Isn't that what most convicted, unapologetic, and sadistically-driven murderers throughout history have wanted? To be known for their crimes? Why give them what they want? Why plaster their faces and names all over television and the internet? Shouldn't we pay more attention to the victims and their families? It doesn't really matter who did it, it matters that it was done, and that's a shame. Prison, in general, should be about fixing society; let's make it better. If we cannot rehabilitate people, let's make sure they cannot rejoin society, but who are we to take another life?

I think this is an interesting stance re: prison euthanasia.

This, on the other hand, is not a point I have ever really considered. If you're generally for euthanasia, to me, this comes down to whether you see it as a human right. If so, prisoners deserve human rights. If they meet the criteria, I don't see why not.

 

[Esper]

I want to add that, while the feelings of those who have been wronged is important to consider, it can't form the basis of a punishment. People's feelings can vary widely and if everyone is to be equal under the law we all have to be subject to predetermined punishments that fit a particular crime. Of course every crime is going to be unique, but it wouldn't be right to have two similar crimes be punished in widely different ways if the only major difference was that in one case a family member demanded a severe punishment and in the other case there was no family member who felt the same way.

 

[Spacy]

Okay, call me simple minded, sure. But have any of you actually seen first hand on what one person can do to another? Any murder scenes? Anything? Life is very different from the plastic joy bubble surrounding your safe little homes. There are some crimes that just deserve no second chances. Murder is one of them.

There is always a choice and if you choose to make the wrong ones who's supposed to fix them for you? Who is going to coddle the little ones because you slew their mother and left little more than a pile of indiscernible meat? I have no patience for those that make 'mistakes'. You're sorry? Well I'm sure saying sorry to the family of the little girl you raped makes it all okay. I don't care who you are or what god or gods you believe in, but I live in a world that is plagued by the sick and deranged alike. Is their life truly worth saving? Are these people truly worth all they suck from our funding?

I may be simple minded when I say to off them, but the same can also be said if you've never so much as stubbed your toe in the territory of their aftermath. If you've never been subject to the pain and sorrow of losing someone because of another's malicious actions then please give some more thought before you up and claim that killing vermin is barbaric.

I completely agree to this. People like that don't deserve second chances and aren't worth the prison food.

 

[gimmepie]

I completely agree to this. People like that don't deserve second chances and aren't worth the prison food. (sorry if this sounds harsh.)

Honestly if you have to finish a comment on this topic with "sorry if this sounds harsh", that tells me that you know very well that it sounds like a harsh stance to take. I'm not going to tell you straight up to change your views, but if your own stance on an issue sounds harsh to you then you may want to consider reevaluating it.

 

[donavannj]

Okay, call me simple minded, sure. But have any of you actually seen first hand on what one person can do to another? Any murder scenes? Anything? Life is very different from the plastic joy bubble surrounding your safe little homes. There are some crimes that just deserve no second chances. Murder is one of them.

There is always a choice and if you choose to make the wrong ones who's supposed to fix them for you? Who is going to coddle the little ones because you slew their mother and left little more than a pile of indiscernible meat? I have no patience for those that make 'mistakes'. You're sorry? Well I'm sure saying sorry to the family of the little girl you raped makes it all okay. I don't care who you are or what god or gods you believe in, but I live in a world that is plagued by the sick and deranged alike. Is their life truly worth saving? Are these people truly worth all they suck from our funding?

I may be simple minded when I say to off them, but the same can also be said if you've never so much as stubbed your toe in the territory of their aftermath. If you've never been subject to the pain and sorrow of losing someone because of another's malicious actions then please give some more thought before you up and claim that killing vermin is barbaric.

It's late and I'm posting from my phone so I've got no sources handy for this, but did you know the death penalty is just as costly as life in prison? Those appeals don't pay for themselves, you know. Can't ignore those if you're going to make the cost argument.

 

[shadowmoon522]

The golden rule is too simple to work in the modern world. Would a person with mental disabilities who can't distinguish between right and wrong be made to suffer if they happen to harm someone?

depending how far gone they are, it might just be better to just put them down in the same manor one dose to a dog with rabies for the same exact reasons why dogs with rabies get put down: their just to dangerous & the best life that can be given to them is being caged. at that point their not living, their just laying in a box waiting to die & be put into either another box or the incinerator.

Yeah guys! Let's prove how bad killing is by killing the person who killed a person! That isn't small-minded at all!

true, but all human-beings are contradictory hypocrites in one way or another. I'm more then likely gonna get a bunch of backlash for what i say again, but i don't make judgements based on emotions. this is one of those things where you have to understand that "right" & "wrong" are not the same hing as "good" & "evil". it might be "good" to let them live, but that dose not make it "right" to let them live. the death penalty at its purest form is just getting rid of them before they have a chance to kill again. locking them away in prison dose not guarantee that they won't just kill someone else while their in there. its not that hard to kill people, humans are weak creatures with various fatal weaknesses that can be exploited with a single hand

Okay, call me simple minded, sure. But have any of you actually seen first hand on what one person can do to another? Any murder scenes? Anything? Life is very different from the plastic joy bubble surrounding your safe little homes. There are some crimes that just deserve no second chances. Murder is one of them.

There is always a choice and if you choose to make the wrong ones who's supposed to fix them for you? Who is going to coddle the little ones because you slew their mother and left little more than a pile of indiscernible meat? I have no patience for those that make 'mistakes'. You're sorry? Well I'm sure saying sorry to the family of the little girl you raped makes it all okay. I don't care who you are or what god or gods you believe in, but I live in a world that is plagued by the sick and deranged alike. Is their life truly worth saving? Are these people truly worth all they suck from our funding?

I may be simple minded when I say to off them, but the same can also be said if you've never so much as stubbed your toe in the territory of their aftermath. If you've never been subject to the pain and sorrow of losing someone because of another's malicious actions then please give some more thought before you up and claim that killing vermin is barbaric.

have you ever gone berserk? lost control of yourself? do you know what its like to just blank out in rage & not even know what you doing til after it's been done? I've been on both ends and was fortunate to never do more then break a few bones when i went completely nuts.
there's more then a few people who have lost control & killed someone they loved without knowing what they where doing til it was too late. they don't need forgiveness, they will suffer for what they did all of their lives, living in fear of making the same mistake again. locking them up or killing them more often then not is just giving them what they want, putting them out of their misery. is a big enough world for them & the family's of their victims to never see each other again. humans learn "right" from "wrong" by experiencing traumas.
as for the whole raping thing, that can go a lot of different ways depending upon the circumstances. there have been guys who have gotten raped only for the woman who raped said guys to play the victim and get those guys arrested for it. next thing you know the media blows it out of perpetration & the double standards of this word come out in full force. i've already had something similar nearly happened to me cause one of my exs was completely nuts. i never even had sex with her & only dated her for a day. luckily i was not the first one she tried pulling that crap on: the cop that came after her 911 call she sent right up front of me was.the way that cop looked at her was the way my cats look at mice.
and people wonder why i stopped bothering with dating...

I definitely believe in the right to die,

no one has the right to die, because death is the promise made that will always be kept. now suicide on the other hand should not be illegal, but should require the permission of all relatives, legal guardians, co workers, former &/or current teachers & students in their classes over the years via written signature of approval (unless their dead, at which point their signature is unneded), as well as the requirement to be over 25 years old.

I want to add that, while the feelings of those who have been wronged is important to consider, it can't form the basis of a punishment. People's feelings can vary widely and if everyone is to be equal under the law we all have to be subject to predetermined punishments that fit a particular crime. Of course every crime is going to be unique, but it wouldn't be right to have two similar crimes be punished in widely different ways if the only major difference was that in one case a family member demanded a severe punishment and in the other case there was no family member who felt the same way.

do some digging & you'll find that there's quite a few of those around.

 

[Nah]

It's late and I'm posting from my phone so I've got no sources handy for this, but did you know the death penalty is just as costly as life in prison? Those appeals don't pay for themselves, you know. Can't ignore those if you're going to make the cost argument.

This is kinda part of the reason why I think that we should focus on fixing issues in our prison and judicial systems instead of just doing away with the death penalty. You can do 3254258 appeals for all major prison sentences and not just death sentences, correct? So even if you remove the death penalty and no longer have to pay for the appeals for death row inmates, you still have to pay for the appeals for all the other things anyway.

I think what would be better in the long-term and for more people if the courts "got it right", so to speak, the first time and proved innocence/guilt well beyond a shadow of a doubt during the trial so we don't need to give people a zillion appeals because the prosecution/defense might have fucked up, or played on the jury's emotions and biases (because let's be real, some lawyers are just interested in winning cases and not justice). Of course that's all a lot easier said than done but....