4th Gen Ubers?

[Rachei]

Where can I find a list of Ubers? I heatran considered Uber?

 

[Chonlel48]

Where can I find a list of Ubers? I heatran considered Uber?

There's a thread in the Wireless Battle Stadium, and it lists the Wi-Fi battling tiers and pokes in there. Follow this link https://www.pokecommunity.com/threads/118170

 

[bob_saget]

You can find one at Smogon. Just search "dp tiers " in google, and it's the first link.

 

[El Gofre]

Smogon's list isnt as appropriate, seeing as this site has its own tier list. Why you would wanna go on another site when its here i do no know lol.

So yeah, go to battle stadium and click on the tier discussion sticky. And no, Heatran isnt an uber

 

[JTBlaze]

Hey Rachei, long time no see. How you been? How's my old Jirachi and Foretress?

I think Heatran is a legendary (Like the birds, the cats, the regis, or the sprites, the lati, etc), but not an Uber.

Ubers are:
Mewtwo/Lugia/Ho-oh,
Groudon/Kyogre/Rayquaza/Deoxys
Palkia/Dialga/Giratina/Arceus.
Legendaries are:
Articuno/Zapdos/Moltes
Raikou/Entei/Suicune
Regirock/Regice/Registeel
Uxie/Mesprit/Azelf
Latias/Latios
Heatran/Regigigas/Crescelia/Darkrai
Mew/Celebi/Jirachi/Shaymin/Manaphy

And others I may have missed.

 

[airconditioning]

For the record, many Ubers are Legendary as well (Wobbuffet may have been moved to OU, but I still consider him Uber). Uber just describes their tier.

Also, Darkrai, Mew, Manaphy, and the Latis are all Uber.

 

[JTBlaze]

For the record, many Ubers are Legendary as well (Wobbuffet may have been moved to OU, but I still consider him Uber). Uber just describes their tier.

Also, Darkrai, Mew, Manaphy, and the Latis are all Uber.

Unn we're not talking about Over-Used or Under-Used. We're talking about their general sum of stats. and those pokémon in total have higher stats than regular ones.

For example, Mewtwo has more stats total than Raichu. More speed, more special attack, more attack, more HP.

Therefore, Mewtwo is an Uber.

 

[airconditioning]

No, when we talk about Ubers, we talk about tiers. Why? Because Uber is a tier. Stats have nothing to do with it- noticed how Garchomp isn't an Uber, despite being a 600 Base Stat Pokemon like Mew or Manaphy?

 

[Azonic]

@JTBlaze: Yes, also Beautifly has a higher stat total than Caterpie, therefore Beautifly is uber. D:

@airconditioning: Stats actually do have something to do with it. An uber Pokemon is determined by their Base Stats, Movepool, and everything else. But all the uber Pokemon have already been determined. So yeah, I guess you're right. Airconditioning speaks the truth (that was an awkward sentence, air conditioners never talk ._.). Darkrai, Mew, Manaphy, and Lati@s are uber.

 

[JTBlaze]

@JTBlaze: Yes, also Beautifly has a higher stat total than Caterpie, therefore Beautifly is uber. D:

I compared Mewtwo with a Raichu, not with a Pichu.

Which would be like comparing a Beautifly with a Caterpie.

Or a Charizard with an Igglybuff.

But anywayz.

No, when we talk about Ubers, we talk about tiers. Why? Because Uber is a tier. Stats have nothing to do with it- noticed how Garchomp isn't an Uber, despite being a 600 Base Stat Pokemon like Mew or Manaphy?

Stats are one of the factors.

How come Slaking, with its HUGE 160 base attack isn't an Uber?

Because of its ability, Truant.

Regigigas has "Slow Start", which greatly hinders his "Uber" stat, thus placing him more into the "legendary" category.

Distribution of the stats also play a major role - Look at Shuckle's Def. & Sp.Def., but relatively poor HP, Att. Sp.Att. & Speed. It could die with a couple of nightshades or seismictosses.

But in such case, the most "Uber" would be "Mew", since it is the only pokémon that can learn all possible TM's & HM's, considering base stats (600), all moves, 1 type thus less weaknesses, ability...

 

[El Gofre]

What air-con is trying to say is: The definition of uber is based on an entire pokemon. JT contradicted himself there twice, first saying he based it on only stats, and then saying it was just one of the factors. He then compared mewtwo and raichu, which really IS like comparing charizard and igglybuff.

In conclusion: JT's list and aircon's additions are the complete uber TIER. Wobbuffet is debatable, i for one think it's uber

 

[BeachBoy]

Yes movesets (mew) and abilites (kyogre and groudon) also factor into what makes an Uber...

Ill agree with Wobba is uber in my opinion.

Heatran though is NOT uber, one word: earthquake, one of the most common moves, and heatran? 400% weakness to ground, great ability and resistences, but heatran is not uber, so no worries Rachei

Also, Let us also be reminded the sole and main tier factor is pokemon's use in the metagame, and Ubers will centralize it more thats the main reason they get banned, like if we allowed darkrai, that'd be the new gengar, and dangerously centralize the game, mainly becoming unbalanced. So there, my two cents on the matter.

 

[JTBlaze]

What air-con is trying to say is: The definition of uber is based on an entire pokemon. JT contradicted himself there twice, first saying he based it on only stats, and then saying it was just one of the factors. He then compared mewtwo and raichu, which really IS like comparing charizard and igglybuff.

In conclusion: JT's list and aircon's additions are the complete uber TIER. Wobbuffet is debatable, i for one think it's uber

At first, yes, I sai it was stats, but then I rectified. So there's no contradiction.

And Mewtwo/Raichu IS NOT like comparing Charizard/Igglybuff.

Raichu is a fully evolved pokémon. Mewtwo doesn't even evolve. Charizard is a fully-evolved pokémon. Igglybuff is a baby. Just as the Beautifly/Caterpie analogy.

Other pokémon that don't evolve - Pinsir, Heracross, Kangaskhan, Stantler, Tauros.

Those pokémon have general stat sum that would equal or even surpass that of a fully evolved pokémon, although some non-evolving pokémon have rather low stats, like Farfetch'd, Ditto and the Unown.

Of course, some fully-evolved pokémon have rather low sum of stats, like the birds (Pidgeot, Noctowl, Swellow), some early-adventure pokémon's evolutions like Raticate or Furret, and Jumpluff.

My point is, non-evolving pokémon are on the same level than fully-evolved pokémon.

So Charizard/Igglybuff does NOT match the Mewtwo/Raichu analogy.

 

[Kit-Tsukasa]

Typing, Base stats, and move sets all plays into the tiers.

Ubers are the following:
-Mewtwo
-Mew
-Ho-oh
-Lugia
-Latias
-Latios
-Wobuffet
-Groudon
-Kyogre
-Rayquaza
-Deoxys
-Dialga
-Palkia
-Giratina
-Manaphy
-Darkrai
-Arceus

The following are Legendaries (not Uber)
-Articuno
-Moltres
-Zapdos
-Entei
-Raikou
-Suicune
-Celebi
-Regirock
-Regice
-Registeel
-Jirachi
-Azelf
-Uxie
-Mespirit
-Heatran
-Cresselia
-Regigigas
-Phione (?)
-Rotom
-Shaymin

The reason why some pokemon like Regigigas, Jirachi, Celebi, and Shaymin are in the Legendaries instead of Uber are not because of their base stats, but rather other factors. Regigigas's ability kills it from being competitive at all in the Uber environment. In fact, one or two Focus Blasts will send it flying and lowering it's attack just makes it worse since it will barely be able to dent its opponents even though it is going second.

Jirachi, Celebi, and Shaymin are not Uber because of their types. Jirachi being a Psychic and Steel makes opens up too many weaknesses and not enough resistances. Celebi being a Grass and Psychic only creates more weaknesses when just being one of those types and same with Shaymin.

Manaphy and Giratina are Uber because of similar factors. Manaphy is because of Tail Glow and Hydration. Kyogre combination just makes it absolutely deadly. Giratina is because of its move Shadow Force and its ridiculous typing of Ghost and Dragon blocks so many attacks.

Wobuffet is the only normal pokemon that is an Uber because of its one and only moveset when caught and not evolved from Wynaut: Mirror Coat, Counter, Safeguard, and Destiny Bond. Having the ability of Shadow Tag and it's amazing defenses and HP makes it insanely difficult to counter. It is essentially luck trying to take out a Wobuffet in one hit without getting KO'd yourself since chances are you won't take out a good walled Wobuffet in one hit and will end up receiving double the damage you did to it. Imagine this, Wobuffet can easily take out an Arceus if Arceus is not careful. Wobuffet hold Focus Band, Arceus with max special attack uses Ghost or Dark Type Judgment....Wobuffet survives with Focus Band.... Mirror Coat...bye bye Arceus :P

 

[Romo_Owens]

No, when we talk about Ubers, we talk about tiers. Why? Because Uber is a tier. Stats have nothing to do with it- noticed how Garchomp isn't an Uber, despite being a 600 Base Stat Pokemon like Mew or Manaphy?

See I never got that.
Theres the 5 "Elite" pokemon: Garchomp, Salamence, Tyranitar, Dragonite and Metagross. They all have base 600 stats and in the OU community anyway all act as impecabble sweepers (as long as you know how to use metagross and Dragonite).
Then theres the lati twins. They also have base 600 stats. Latios' base attack is either equal or less than that of either of those pokemon, but a slightly higher base speed stat (the closest being Garchomp at base 102). Then theres Latias which acts as a semi-decent wall. So why are the Lati twins ubers.
Then theres Mew which is an uber while Celebi, Jirachi and Shaymi have equal stats but remain in the OU. So why is mew an uber as well?

Typing, Base stats, and move sets all plays into the tiers.

Ubers are the following:
-Mewtwo
-Mew
-Ho-oh
-Lugia
-Latias
-Latios
-Wobuffet
-Groudon
-Kyogre
-Rayquaza
-Deoxys
-Dialga
-Palkia
-Giratina
-Manaphy
-Darkrai
-Arceus

The following are Legendaries (not Uber)
-Articuno
-Moltres
-Zapdos
-Entei
-Raikou
-Suicune
-Celebi
-Regirock
-Regice
-Registeel
-Jirachi
-Azelf
-Uxie
-Mespirit
-Heatran
-Cresselia
-Regigigas
-Phione (?)
-Rotom
-Shaymin

The reason why some pokemon like Regigigas, Jirachi, Celebi, and Shaymin are in the Legendaries instead of Uber are not because of their base stats, but rather other factors. Regigigas's ability kills it from being competitive at all in the Uber environment. In fact, one or two Focus Blasts will send it flying and lowering it's attack just makes it worse since it will barely be able to dent its opponents even though it is going second.

Jirachi, Celebi, and Shaymin are not Uber because of their types. Jirachi being a Psychic and Steel makes opens up too many weaknesses and not enough resistances. Celebi being a Grass and Psychic only creates more weaknesses when just being one of those types and same with Shaymin.

Manaphy and Giratina are Uber because of similar factors. Manaphy is because of Tail Glow and Hydration. Kyogre combination just makes it absolutely deadly. Giratina is because of its move Shadow Force and its ridiculous typing of Ghost and Dragon blocks so many attacks.

Wobuffet is the only normal pokemon that is an Uber because of its one and only moveset when caught and not evolved from Wynaut: Mirror Coat, Counter, Safeguard, and Destiny Bond. Having the ability of Shadow Tag and it's amazing defenses and HP makes it insanely difficult to counter. It is essentially luck trying to take out a Wobuffet in one hit without getting KO'd yourself since chances are you won't take out a good walled Wobuffet in one hit and will end up receiving double the damage you did to it. Imagine this, Wobuffet can easily take out an Arceus if Arceus is not careful. Wobuffet hold Focus Band, Arceus with max special attack uses Ghost or Dark Type Judgment....Wobuffet survives with Focus Band.... Mirror Coat...bye bye Arceus :P

Dude... Jirachi's Psychic and Steel typing creates 8 resistances and one immunity while having 2 weaknesses. Bronzong has the same typing just levitate and look at how popular it is. And for good reason. Have you ever been up against one? It's ridiculously strong if you're not prepared for it.
Besides Mew still has Bug, Dark and Shadow Ball. Any scarfcross Gengar or Darkrai easily one shot it and outrun it.

 

[El Gofre]

Romo, the latis are ubers because they have access to soul dew, which offers a 1.5 boost to SpAtt AND SpDef. With this item, latias is capable of reaching a massive 591 SpDef, with 6 resistances and an immunity to ground and therefor EQ (The most common move in the game). On the other side of the coin latios can reach just as high with his special attack. It's like SpecsTwo with the ability to swap moves. They're beasts, i personally rate latias as THE uber special wall, it counters kyogre like an absolute dream.
Mew is also uber due to the sheer unpredictability of it. Sure, its not that strong but it can baton pass ANYTHING. Give a mew swords dance and nasty plot, then SD. Watch as they switch in the appropriate wall and then watch their dismay as NP, now who do they switch in? You'll just pass to the opposite sweeper (Or worse, mixed deoxys)
The other 100>100 spreads are OU (Or even BL) because their movepools are relatively limited. Especially shaymin, what the heck could it possibly do against ubers such as dialga? It gets so completely walled by steel types, BL is the only place for it. Manaphy is a bit more variable due to hydration support, but when was the last time celebii wasnt a Baton passer?

JTBlaze: You failed to specify that you'd changed your mind, how were we to know that you'd taken it back?

 

[Tanro]

I was under the impression that Lati@s was only uber if holding soul dew. May be thats just outdated information.