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Jay-Kunn
December 14th, 2011, 01:20 PM
I've been wondering this.

Why did it take almost 6 installments, over 5 movies, 2 whole generations and a load of countless redundant episodes for Pokemon to come back to their former glory?

I mean, while I thought the Hoenn saga was pretty okay... I still felt it was lucking, since Hoenn was considered a pinnacle of what Game Freak was capable of xD

However, Diamond and Pearl was a decent game (in my opinion). However, the anime... was just... just HORRIBLE.

Now, finally we're in Unova; and things have become so great again. However, I haven't watched a lot of English episodes. At all, actually. Really, I follow the Japanese versions.

Best Wishes has gotten such a good reception, but I can't help but feel that the ball was caught way after the foul was called. So, what do you think everyone?

Does this series still have a chance? Or is it too late to correct the ample mistakes?

Ash-Anime
December 14th, 2011, 01:34 PM
I've been wondering this.

Why did it take almost 6 installments, over 5 movies, 2 whole generations and a load of countless redundant episodes for Pokemon to come back to their former glory?

I mean, while I thought the Hoenn saga was pretty okay... I still felt it was lucking, since Hoenn was considered a pinnacle of what Game Freak was capable of xD

However, Diamond and Pearl was a decent game (in my opinion). However, the anime... was just... just HORRIBLE.

Now, finally we're in Unova; and things have become so great again. However, I haven't watched a lot of English episodes. At all, actually. Really, I follow the Japanese versions.

Best Wishes has gotten such a good reception, but I can't help but feel that the ball was caught way after the foul was called. So, what do you think everyone?

Does this series still have a chance? Or is it too late to correct the ample mistakes?

I think the serie has got a lot of chances left! Because every season is different than eachother! I hated diamond and pearl in first places but when i was at episode 20 i loved the serie!

And they wont end The Pokemon anime in a while because why should they lots of people still watch it and they make tons of money with the Anime!

And the only season that I hate is Black & White/Best Wishes! Not because of Ash but because of the pokemon and his new 2 frends! They have to stop changing ash his frends! iris and cicilian have to be gone they dont match for ash. (Thats My opinion) So u see everyone has got other Opinion's about the anime seasons etc!

Best Wishes,
Ash

Xeberos
December 14th, 2011, 01:36 PM
Kanto and Johto saga was great. Hoenn was even better and Sinnoh saga was best. But I don't watch BW episodes because they are horrible. But to the point. Series can be continued many many years or not. Who knows? This has been discussed and many have other opinions.

Ash-Anime
December 14th, 2011, 01:58 PM
Kanto and Johto saga was great. Hoenn was even better and Sinnoh saga was best. But I don't watch BW episodes because they are horrible. But to the point. Series can be continued many many years or not. Who knows? This has been discussed and many have other opinions.

Xeberos! I totaly Agree with u!

Kenshin5
December 14th, 2011, 02:55 PM
Wouldn't there have to be some sort of glory in the first place? About his greatest extent was him winning battle Frontier after already losing to Brandon. Yes I will agree his pinnacle was at the point of winning Frontier. But he was looking pretty strong until he ran into Tobias at the Semis of Lily of the Valley.
Would you explain how it was horrible DP was compared to Series prior i.e. Original and Advanced? All of them had their pros and cons so I don't see what made Diamond and Pearl so bad.
I can't really put my finger on how great Best Wishes is since it is still ongoing. But I can say I favor Cilan over stale Brock of Sinnoh, I like Iris and love to see them keep expanding on her goals of being a Dragon Master like Misty as a Water Master. I like the role of Team Rocket thus far, since they don't appear in every episode. And are secret agent like at times. The rotation concept was good at first but it's pretty apparent atm Pikachu, Tepig, and Oshawott are hogging most of the spot light and battles. The development of pokemon seems to be lacking as well. One thing I think they dropped the ball on his Team Plasma. We haven't even seen them since the delayed it indefinitely, so we really can't get a feel for how Team Plasma conducts themselves and what not. So I feel they have dropped the ball since then since it's Episode 60 and they haven't even showed up since 23&24(which again we haven't seen).
As for the continuation of the series it will keep going as long as the gaming franchise, since it is used as a promotional tool. Which is probably one reason why Ash and Pikachu are still main protagonists and they have made progression just to have it go away at the start of a new Saga.
As for the pointless redundant episodes, if we didn't have those we would have some sort of fillers since they would run through the series in like two years when Generations are usually about four years apart.

Hikamaru
December 14th, 2011, 03:47 PM
I remember watching the Kanto and Johto saga but it didn't impress me.

Didn't see much of Hoenn but I might catch up on those websites where you watch anime.

Sinnoh I really enjoyed cos of Dawn.

I like Unova cos of new graphics and Iris is ok but not as good as Dawn. And it made me like Oshawott as well.

I don't think the anime has declined in any way.

Railgun
December 14th, 2011, 03:48 PM
I find this is the one series that gets better with every passing series. While I'm not a fan of DP since I did not like Dawn I will say it pushed the bar for battles. I'm happy that with BW they toned it down. DP seemed to focus more on battles then the adventure aspect. I like how its even now.

chella182
December 15th, 2011, 06:14 AM
Huh, I preferred the Galactic Battles series over any of the Hoenn ones really. And probably even over the Black & White ones so far.

Nothing has been as good as when they were travelling around Johto, though. I think I just miss Brock :P

Sheep
December 15th, 2011, 09:13 AM
Well, the series will never be as great as it was during Kanto days. Viewership used to reach as high as 17% on the weekly TV rankings scale in Japan but now it ranges from 5-7% on average (which is still very good actually). Best Wishes is really amazing, though, and feels like a fresh start since Ash seems to have lost all his knowledge (haha) and we have two brand new companions instead of one, so it's like we're meeting Misty and Brock for the first time... a second time.

Brock was a good character but there really wasn't much the writers could have done with him. His role was really just to stay in the background and explain typing/battles to the kids who wouldn't get it. I felt like that wasn't fair to his character - I'm glad they decided to finally give him closure, lol.

tough
December 16th, 2011, 04:22 AM
Wouldn't there have to be some sort of glory in the first place? About his greatest extent was him winning battle Frontier after already losing to Brandon. Yes I will agree his pinnacle was at the point of winning Frontier. But he was looking pretty strong until he ran into Tobias at the Semis of Lily of the Valley.
Would you explain how it was horrible DP was compared to Series prior i.e. Original and Advanced? All of them had their pros and cons so I don't see what made Diamond and Pearl so bad.
I can't really put my finger on how great Best Wishes is since it is still ongoing. But I can say I favor Cilan over stale Brock of Sinnoh, I like Iris and love to see them keep expanding on her goals of being a Dragon Master like Misty as a Water Master. I like the role of Team Rocket thus far, since they don't appear in every episode. And are secret agent like at times. The rotation concept was good at first but it's pretty apparent atm Pikachu, Tepig, and Oshawott are hogging most of the spot light and battles. The development of pokemon seems to be lacking as well. One thing I think they dropped the ball on his Team Plasma. We haven't even seen them since the delayed it indefinitely, so we really can't get a feel for how Team Plasma conducts themselves and what not. So I feel they have dropped the ball since then since it's Episode 60 and they haven't even showed up since 23&24(which again we haven't seen).
As for the continuation of the series it will keep going as long as the gaming franchise, since it is used as a promotional tool. Which is probably one reason why Ash and Pikachu are still main protagonists and they have made progression just to have it go away at the start of a new Saga.
As for the pointless redundant episodes, if we didn't have those we would have some sort of fillers since they would run through the series in like two years when Generations are usually about four years apart.

I argee the DP series was so damn terrible the plots were way too boring and way to grown up that it really needed to be,plus Team Galactic ,J ,Paul characters were really horrible and bland, DP series plots were way too serious and the humor was gone.

The BW series toned down the show and brought back the good humor that the DP series mess up to start with,Iris is a whole lot better then Dawn since Iris have a great personality and a sexy design. The BW series gotten much better in tune with the show and Pokemon improve a whole lot better after that horrible DP series brought it down.

mrpengo88
December 17th, 2011, 05:45 PM
Every single series Bulbasaur isn't in sucks. His older Pokemon were so complex and had so much personality. The new ones are awful. I want Pidgeot, Squirtle and Chiarzard back.

Kenshin5
December 18th, 2011, 09:40 AM
Yeah Kingler, Tauros, Pidgeot, Butterfree, Lapras had soooo much of a complex and overflowing of personality! Kanto pokemon he had don't have any more or less personality then his later pokemon. In Johto his pokemon had plenty of personality; Heracross sucked on Bulbasaur Bulb, Bayleef was so affectionate toward Ash, Totodile had a biting quirkiness about him. There was Sceptile in Hoenn that had that lone wolf personality. Infernape had a personality and story behind it as much as any pokemon Ash has had. So I really don't see where you are saying his new ones are awful?

Jorah
December 18th, 2011, 09:48 AM
I'm finding BW disappointing. I enjoy Cilan and Iris (as annoying as she is). The thing that's irritating me is Ash's borderline Flanderisation of his series 1 personality and his poor rivals. I enjoyed Ash's serious personality in DP much more.

tough
December 18th, 2011, 08:53 PM
I never liked Ash serious personality in the DP series because he was bland boring and unlikable with no humor at all. Ash in the BW series is full of life with a funny personality ,Iris isn't annoying like Dawn was she is much better ,Cilan is really great and funny aswell.

The truth is the DP series was terrible as hell hardly any good plots at all,Kanto and Johto sagas are a lot better then Sinnoh anyday.

~*!*~Tatsujin Gosuto~*!*~
December 18th, 2011, 09:06 PM
Yeah Kingler, Tauros, Pidgeot, Butterfree, Lapras had soooo much of a complex and overflowing of personality! Kanto pokemon he had don't have any more or less personality then his later pokemon. In Johto his pokemon had plenty of personality; Heracross sucked on Bulbasaur Bulb, Bayleef was so affectionate toward Ash, Totodile had a biting quirkiness about him. There was Sceptile in Hoenn that had that lone wolf personality. Infernape had a personality and story behind it as much as any pokemon Ash has had. So I really don't see where you are saying his new ones are awful?

also adding to this, Torkoal was extremely emotional, it practically cried every time it came out of its Pokeball. Oshawott is also another Pokemon of Ash's that has a complex personality which I like.

I personalty don't have a problem with the series as it is now other than Iris catch phrase which annoys me just a tiny bit. I don't think the anime has went down in anyway either


:t354:TG

tough
December 18th, 2011, 09:31 PM
Yeah Kingler, Tauros, Pidgeot, Butterfree, Lapras had soooo much of a complex and overflowing of personality! Kanto pokemon he had don't have any more or less personality then his later pokemon. In Johto his pokemon had plenty of personality; Heracross sucked on Bulbasaur Bulb, Bayleef was so affectionate toward Ash, Totodile had a biting quirkiness about him. There was Sceptile in Hoenn that had that lone wolf personality. Infernape had a personality and story behind it as much as any pokemon Ash has had. So I really don't see where you are saying his new ones are awful?
All of Ash's pokemon have great personality, but Ash didn't have a Sceptile until after the Hoenn series ended other then that Oshawott have a great personality and Snivy is really great full of life she is with her personality.

Kenshin5
December 18th, 2011, 10:01 PM
also adding to this, Torkoal was extremely emotional, it practically cried every time it came out of its Pokeball. Oshawott is also another Pokemon of Ash's that has a complex personality which I like.

I personalty don't have a problem with the series as it is now other than Iris catch phrase which annoys me just a tiny bit. I don't think the anime has went down in anyway either


:t354:TG
I was just throwing in a couple examples, but yes Unova pokemon have as much as the rest expect for maybe the reserves who barely get spotlight but yeah they evolve before the starters...

All of Ash's pokemon have great personality, but Ash didn't have a Sceptile until after the Hoenn series ended other then that Oshawott have a great personality and Snivy is really great full of life she is with her personality.
I know it happened in Battle Frontier, I was including Sceptile as part of the line... He still had the said personality from Treecko and Grovyle where he had the twig in mouth.

Although I disagree how the plots horrible? I mean how are they any better or worse then your beloved Johto Series? And the characters bland is rather subjective as well. I thought Paul was really ehhh fierce/intimidating character and Barry like you referenced with Snivy is full of life, as he is always energetic. J brings something Team Rocket trio never really did which is a legit antagonist. So to say the characters are horrible and bland I don't really see where you are coming from. Also every series has there comic moments so I don't see how this differs or as that more serious in nature then previous ones or BW.

Jorah
December 19th, 2011, 01:18 AM
The truth is the DP series was terrible as hell hardly any good plots at all,Kanto and Johto sagas are a lot better then Sinnoh anyday.

The truth is the BW series is terrible as hell hardly any good plots at all,Kanto and Sinnoh sagas are a lot better then Unova anyday.

SomariFeyWright
December 19th, 2011, 01:57 AM
Why is everyone complaining about the series' path?

I'll admit that the "everyday disasters" comedic effect that the first series had was great, but I fail to see how the series is failing, that aside.

I'll admit, I'm not that big a fan of the Black & White series myself, but I still like it even if they did completely destroy Team Rocket's signature exit... my favorite joke with them....

I really liked Sinnoh. It was a good series. You saw character in the characters. They started making new decisions, that would change their path onward. I also really liked Dawn, and I don't get why people complain about her. She was a very kind, very sweet character. The way her determination was comparable to Ash's just grew on me, and I realized how great she is. She quickly became my favorite female companion for Ash.

Hoenn was alright... although, that was during a stage in my life where I temporarily forgot about Pokemon, so I didn't get to watch much of it. Still, May and Max were awesome characters. The point-dexter style of Max and the kindness of May were things I truly came to enjoy.

Kanto and Johto... I'll admit I loved these. These were my childhood, and it's the only show I can remember watching when I was young. The comedic disasters in the show is something I'll never forget. Misty was an amazing character. She was so round; so dynamic; certainly respectable traits in any main character of a series. I admit it; even though Dawn is my favorite, I would love to have Misty come back for another go.

So yeah, I don't care WHAT people say about the series; bring back blasting off, and stop sending characters we've grown on away, and the show has to stay.

DawnLover
December 19th, 2011, 10:28 AM
Yes this series is very disappointing now imo. BW is horrible because of how much it's downgraded from DP.

Sheep
December 19th, 2011, 10:53 AM
I found Dawn to be extremely boring - she was the generic cute girl and there wasn't anything to make her stand out. D/P Ash was, as some have already said, bland and lacking personality... but I do wish B/W Ash kept some of D/P Ash's maturity. At least in Sinnoh, one could tell Ash had gone through numerous regions. In Best Wishes, it feels like he's traveling for the first time, haha.

That's both a good and bad thing; good because it's reminiscent of the Kanto days to me when he just started out and bad because the writers constantly have him making silly mistakes that he should've known about. I realize past regions really don't matter anymore once Ash moves onto the next one, but I'd really like to see just a little more competence from him while still keeping his laughable personality that he gained back this region.

That said, I still love Best Wishes and it will always be my favorite. Iris and Cilan both feel fresh and unique and they're both getting episodes centered around them rather than Sinnoh where the series should've been called, "The Journeys of Ash and Dawn."