Gen 7 Kanto Game

[Wicked3DS]

...wow. Ok, way to complicate things

So let me see if I have this right. Flight is pushing the argument that Kanto is redundant and it doesn't matter if it's separate games or not. Betty is saying that as long as they're separate games, it doesn't matter.

Here's how I see it: From flight's perspective, Kanto has been done 4 times, period. That is a fact. Now yes, as Betty said, the Gen I/III games are obviously not the same as the Gen II/IV games, but even still, Kanto has been explorable in 4 game series. For flight's sake of redundancy, the separation of games doesn't matter if we're only talking about the region itself.

Either way, I want a Kanto remake, and I want it done better than FR/LG, even though that game will always be close to my heart. I guess I can't let go of my 12 year old self :P

 

[RedJ]

I want a remake, but more for the sake of consistency than technical reasons (which are also a good reason for it). Every single pre-Gen VI game needs to be remade now thanks to the alternate dimension thing, because right now there are a bunch of holes in the (I know I'm going to regret bringing this up) timeline where they should be. That's also why sequels can't happen; there's nothing to make a sequel to now. The only way they could possibly get around that is by removing Fairy type or Mega Evolution, and as feature-removing happy as Game Freak can be I don't see them scrapping entire battle mechanics.

That said, FR/LG and OR/AS suffered from trying to be too faithful to their originals rather than try to fix some of their problems...which is what should be at least attempted in a remake (see: HG/SS). As much as I'd like to see a (better) Gen I remake, I'm afraid all we'll end up getting is the exact same game as FR/LG but with better graphics, maybe a slightly updated story, and Mega Evolution and Fairy type added in that wont even be useable until post game, which is something I don't particularly want.

 

[BettyNewbie]

Just as I can say that it's your prerogative if you want to see every single game with Kanto in it as different even though it still bears the region name, characters, gym leaders, elite four, town/city names, buildings and all? If the only thing that's changed within each release with Kanto in it is just the story, that doesn't make it an entirely different Kanto by any means, it's still the same Gen I region most people grew up and loved.

This is why I made assumptions about your interest in stories over gameplay, because statements like these indicate that they don't mean anything to you. It's okay to admit it, and there's nothing wrong with being all about gameplay, but recognize that others see things differently.

And, no, the story isn't the only thing that's different, but I've gone over this a million times already. To you, having a (unexplorable) Radio Tower instead of a Pokémon Tower, Blaine in the Seafoam Islands instead of his gym, Cinnabar Island as an abandoned wasteland instead of a happy little island, Janine in Fuchsia Gym instead of Koga, Blue in Viridian Gym instead of Giovanni (who's nowhere to be found), and Will/Koga/Karen in the E4 instead of Lorelei/Agatha (who are also nowhere to be found) aren't significant changes at all and aren't enough to make Gen 2 different games from Gen 1.

Look, I like Gen 2. Crystal is still my favorite Pokémon game ever. But, when I want to play Gen 1, I want to play Gen 1, not another game. It's not just about Kanto being there, it's about the experience that only Gen 1 can bring.

...wow. Ok, way to complicate things

So let me see if I have this right. Flight is pushing the argument that Kanto is redundant and it doesn't matter if it's separate games or not. Betty is saying that as long as they're separate games, it doesn't matter.

Here's how I see it: From flight's perspective, Kanto has been done 4 times, period. That is a fact. Now yes, as Betty said, the Gen I/III games are obviously not the same as the Gen II/IV games, but even still, Kanto has been explorable in 4 game series. For flight's sake of redundancy, the separation of games doesn't matter if we're only talking about the region itself.

Either way, I want a Kanto remake, and I want it done better than FR/LG, even though that game will always be close to my heart. I guess I can't let go of my 12 year old self

Well, for me, it isn't just about seeing Kanto, itself, just to clarify things. Story is important, even if Gen 1's was very barebones. (Which, yes, a new, more modern remake could fix.)

I want a remake, but more for the sake of consistency than technical reasons (which are also a good reason for it). Every single pre-Gen VI game needs to be remade now thanks to the alternate dimension thing, because right now there are a bunch of holes in the (I know I'm going to regret bringing this up) timeline where they should be. That's also why sequels can't happen; there's nothing to make a sequel to now. The only way they could possibly get around that is by removing Fairy type or Mega Evolution, and as feature-removing happy as Game Freak can be I don't see them scrapping entire battle mechanics.

I've been trying to say this for a long time, myself. Thanks to the alternate timeline stuff, GF can't make any sequels to games besides XY and ORAS, because the odds of them going back to an older timeline and removing Fairies/Megas are slim-to-none.

That said, FR/LG and OR/AS suffered from trying to be too faithful to their originals rather than try to fix some of their problems...which is what should be at least attempted in a remake (see: HG/SS). As much as I'd like to see a (better) Gen I remake, I'm afraid all we'll end up getting is the exact same game as FR/LG but with better graphics, maybe a slightly updated story, and Mega Evolution and Fairy typed added in that wont even be useable until post game, which is something I don't particularly want.

Yeah, that is a very big risk. I want to hope, though, that new Gen 1 remakes would be something better than that.

 

[Wicked3DS]

To flight's point a bit, even though they are different games, consider how many characters have been in all 4 sets of games:

- All of the original Gym Leaders except Giovanni, whether in the same state or different (Koga)
- Blue
- Professor Oak
- Bruno and Lance
- Red (Technically not if you played as Leaf and never touched Red, but either way, he's in all four)

The thing we have to remember is that even though there are two games, there are MANY of the same characters and that can be tiring to some people. Obviously that can't all be addressed during a remake or it wouldn't be a remake, but that is a reason for the people that don't want to see a remake of it soon.

 

[BettyNewbie]

To flight's point a bit, even though they are different games, consider how many characters have been in all 4 sets of games:

- All of the original Gym Leaders except Giovanni, whether in the same state or different (Koga)
- Blue
- Professor Oak
- Bruno and Lance
- Red (Technically not if you played as Leaf and never touched Red, but either way, he's in all four)

The thing we have to remember is that even though there are two games, there are MANY of the same characters and that can be tiring to some people. Obviously that can't all be addressed during a remake or it wouldn't be a remake, but that is a reason for the people that don't want to see a remake of it soon.

So, just because all these characters appeared in both Gens, poor Green, Lorelei, and Agatha should just be left to rot? :P

(I'd also mention Jessie/James, but they, at least, have the anime. Plus, like Kris and to a lesser extent, Juan and the Hoenn Frontier Brains, they were retconned out of the remakes.)

 

[SnowpointQuincy]

Santalune Forest in XY is a carbon copy of Viridian forest, so You can count that as a Fifth appearance of the Kanto Region. Wouldn't it be awesome if you made a 3ds Kanto game and the first big area was copy/pasted from XY? I would pay $40 for that.

Even if you told a new story in Kanto, GF doesn't excel at telling stories.

The game are so similar already, don't need to revisit old places.

 

[27thColt]

I would like to say one thing (or a couple of things). It has not been 11 years. It actually only has been 5 years since we last saw Kanto which was in HGSS. Sure it wasn't the same, but it had the same essence. Plus, we had Kanto for the first four generations. I think we need a couple of generations to take a break. Anyways, the only reason why we would get another Kanto remake is becausse it is Pokemon's 20th anniversary next year with Red and Green releasing in 1996. Even then, I don't think GF will remake Red and Green. I think they will do something different and crazy (like they have been doing for Gen V & Gen VI Spin-off or no). Maybe a Pokemon Snap remake? Maybe the Pokemon Fighting game or Pokemon Detective game we saw screenshots of a couple months back.

And IMO, Kanto is a bit boring to remake. Just look at a map of it (Gen III or I) compared to other regions. They have better regions to remake (Like Sinnoh, it's almost been 10 years since the release date of DP, I'm crossing my fingers).

 

[BettyNewbie]

I suppose new characters could be introduced? A whole new storyline with new characters (Including some old) wouldn't be so bad, but like it has been said it would most likely still have reused characters that we have seen time and time again.

Dumping popular, iconic characters for a bunch of newbies nobody cares about? Yeah, that'll go over REAL well. :rolleyes2: Many people (myself included) already think they went too far with the E4 replacements in GSC.

And IMO, Kanto is a bit boring to remake. Just look at a map of it (Gen III or I) compared to other regions. They have better regions to remake (Like Sinnoh, it's almost been 10 years since the release date of DP, I'm crossing my fingers).

Kanto being "boring" means there's more to fix in a remake. On the other hand, I can't really see a Gen 4 remake improving much on Platinum. (Unless, they flat-out ignore it in favor of DP, which would be a mistake.)

 

[OmegaRuby and AlphaSapphire]

This is why I made assumptions about your interest in stories over gameplay, because statements like these indicate that they don't mean anything to you. It's okay to admit it, and there's nothing wrong with being all about gameplay, but recognize that others see things differently.

And, no, the story isn't the only thing that's different, but I've gone over this a million times already. To you, having a (unexplorable) Radio Tower instead of a Pokémon Tower, Blaine in the Seafoam Islands instead of his gym, Cinnabar Island as an abandoned wasteland instead of a happy little island, Janine in Fuchsia Gym instead of Koga, Blue in Viridian Gym instead of Giovanni (who's nowhere to be found), and Will/Koga/Karen in the E4 instead of Lorelei/Agatha (who are also nowhere to be found) aren't significant changes at all and aren't enough to make Gen 2 different games from Gen 1.

Look, I like Gen 2. Crystal is still my favorite Pokémon game ever. But, when I want to play Gen 1, I want to play Gen 1, not another game. It's not just about Kanto being there, it's about the experience that only Gen 1 can bring.



Well, for me, it isn't just about seeing Kanto, itself, just to clarify things. Story is important, even if Gen 1's was very barebones. (Which, yes, a new, more modern remake could fix.)



I've been trying to say this for a long time, myself. Thanks to the alternate timeline stuff, GF can't make any sequels to games besides XY and ORAS, because the odds of them going back to an older timeline and removing Fairies/Megas are slim-to-none.



Yeah, that is a very big risk. I want to hope, though, that new Gen 1 remakes would be something better than that.

I don't have much hope at this point for them making a Kanto remake all that different from the originals or expending it's story further in ways that weren't in FrLg. I expect it to be an ORAS like remake at most.
Anyways it's been six years since Kanto last appeared in a game in Japan (even if it's not the same experience) so it may be time for another visit in some shape or form (either as a remake or even a Gen I Kanto prequel (which could lead to a remake)).

 

[BettyNewbie]

I don't have much hope at this point for them making a Kanto remake all that different from the originals or expending it's story further in ways that weren't in FrLg. I expect it to be an ORAS like remake at most.
Anyways it's been six years since Kanto last appeared in a game in Japan (even if it's not the same experience) so it may be time for another visit in some shape or form (either as a remake or even a Gen I Kanto prequel (which could lead to a remake)).

Well, even an ORAS-like remake would be step above FRLG, even if not really what I was hoping for.

As for those counting HGSS as a "Kanto" game, remember that only 3 years separated GSC from FRLG. If 5-6 years later is still "too soon" for a Gen 1 remake, then FRLG were made WAY too soon!

 

[ST2111]

I'd love to see a Gen 1 remake for the 3DS, although I don't think that is where GameFreak is going with the franchise.

 

[Wicked3DS]

As for those counting HGSS as a "Kanto" game, remember that only 3 years separated GSC from FRLG. If 5-6 years later is still "too soon" for a Gen 1 remake, then FRLG were made WAY too soon!

Just a thought, but I think the issue is that there were so many games with Kanto in them that people just want as long of a break from it as they can get. Then again, HG/SS were released 5-6 years (depending on region) after FR/LG, and it's been 5 years since that, so that argument is starting to lose some ground If you ask me.

 

[Zeleia]

I really don't want to see Kanto again for the next ten years or so, honest. Kanto has too much appearance and it's not like Gen II to Gen I doesn't feel like BW2 to BW. Everything in Kanto has been done to death, and the Pokemon of that region has been featured in every other games as well, I doubt revisiting that region nothing but boring for most, except few that are too deep in their nostalgia.

Kanto wasn't my first Pokemon game, so I definitely didn't feel that attachment to that region if at all.

We need Pokemon Z that fixed Gen VI's storyline, and a new region afterward. As much as I love Kalos, Gen VI main game is terribly disappointing. Same could be said for DPPt and if a game should be remade, it should be gen IV.

 

[Wicked3DS]

I really don't want to see Kanto again for the next ten years or so, honest. Kanto has too much appearance and it's not like Gen II to Gen I doesn't feel like BW2 to BW. Everything in Kanto has been done to death, and the Pokemon of that region has been featured in every other games as well, I doubt revisiting that region nothing but boring for most, except few that are too deep in their nostalgia.

Kanto wasn't my first Pokemon game, so I definitely didn't feel that attachment to that region if at all.

We need Pokemon Z that fixed Gen VI's storyline, and a new region afterward. As much as I love Kalos, Gen VI main game is terribly disappointing. Same could be said for DPPt and if a game should be remade, it should be gen IV.

I agree about Gen VI and I think we need that, I don't think ten years is A. a necessary time to wait B. logical because we have the 20th and 25th anniversaries of the games coming up very soon, so there will probably (at least I hope) be something for one of those dates.

 

[Zeleia]

I sincerely doubt they would have a main game celebration for the 20 year milestone. They certainly didn't do the same thing to the 10 year anniversary. There would probably be special anime episodes, merchandize, and if I'm allowed to be terribly optimistic, there might be another Pokemon tournament that is a bit different from the VGC.

Not that I don't enjoy watching VGC, but their rules and ban list means you see two or three Pokemon in pretty much every.single.team.

Except for Pachirisu. Of course.

 

[BettyNewbie]

Just a thought, but I think the issue is that there were so many games with Kanto in them that people just want as long of a break from it as they can get. Then again, HG/SS were released 5-6 years (depending on region) after FR/LG, and it's been 5 years since that, so that argument is starting to lose some ground If you ask me.

But, the thing is that the ONLY reason Kanto appeared in four sets of games was because it got a sequel and both the prequel and sequel were later remade. It's not four 100% different sets of games that include the region. Kanto wouldn't have been a part of Gens 3 and 4 at all if not for remakes.

Besides, it's not like everyone has even played all four sets of these games, anyways. Many older fans who dropped the franchise around Gen 3 missed FRLG and HGSS, so a new remake would feel fresh and might draw them back into the series. And, then, you have those youngsters who started with the DS era, at the earliest, and probably never saw Kanto outside of HGSS, if at all. Gen 1's story would be something new to them.

or even better, move on to create a new region altogether.

Well, that's pretty much what GF has been doing with the games since RS: micro-reboots in all new regions with all new casts that have no connection to any other region. Notice how we haven't revisited older regions again outside of remakes?

 

[Wicked3DS]

But, the thing is that the ONLY reason Kanto appeared in four sets of games was because it got a sequel and both the prequel and sequel were later remade. It's not four 100% different sets of games that include the region. Kanto wouldn't have been a part of Gens 3 and 4 at all if not for remakes.

Besides, it's not like everyone has even played all four sets of these games, anyways. Many older fans who dropped the franchise around Gen 3 missed FRLG and HGSS, so a new remake would feel fresh and might draw them back into the series. And, then, you have those youngsters who started with the DS era, at the earliest, and probably never saw Kanto outside of HGSS, if at all. Gen 1's story would be something new to them.

...I know why Kanto was in 4 games. And it doesn't matter why it was in 4 games, just the fact that is was in 4 games is enough for people. Take this into account: I'm not arguing with your logic, I'm simply trying to point out and speculate the logic of others.

 

[BettyNewbie]

...I know why Kanto was in 4 games. And it doesn't matter why it was in 4 games, just the fact that is was in 4 games is enough for people. Take this into account: I'm not arguing with your logic, I'm simply trying to point out and speculate the logic of others.

I know that, but what I'm saying is that not everybody is equally "sick of Kanto," because not everybody played all 4 games it was in. A lot of older fans missed the remakes (especially FRLG, which came out in the middle of the "Pokémon is for Babies" era), while a lot of younger fans missed the originals (and, in most cases, FRLG). The number of people who have stuck with the games since Day One (and thus, were there for all 4 Kanto games) is actually quite small.

I'm well aware of that, and they should continue doing such

Remakes are getting a bit stale in my personal opinion, but I digress.

If anything's gotten stale, it's the new region formula they've been using since RS. Look no further than XY's forgettable characters and bland, unoriginal story to see that GF has been running out of steam. (Thank goodness that Masuda is stepping down as director of the series, because he's driven it into the ground, IMO. GF could use some new blood.)

 

[Z25]

While these posts all raise good scenarios, I have a feeling it would be a yellow remake not FRLG. However I'm not sure if this would actually happen and if it does, E3 would probably have it.

 

[SparklingMistral]

I think it'd be cool if we got a Yellow remake. We pretty much got R/B/G remakes, so why not Yellow? They could do it in a pair with Blue since they gave us FireRed and LeafGreen back in gen 3. .-. I just think Yellow is a unique experience where you don't get to pick your starter and therefore have a completely different experience of the games. They could make us start with Pikachu in Yellow and Eevee in Blue to make it even more interesting; people that don't usually buy both versions might get both since it's two different experiences in a way.

I just think something that takes us away from the traditional Fire/Water/Grass starter trio would be nice.