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Fanfiction Lounge

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JX Valentine

Your aquatic overlord
3,277
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Wow, its been a whole month, and this thread has moved 1/2 a page? what happened to the 1/2 page in 1/2 a minute?

This.

And I would help the discussion along, but unfortunately, I can't really be alone in going up to newbies and saying, "Hey. 'Sup. I'm Jax, and I want to get to know you. By the way, what do you think of what's going on in the FFL?" And, well, my opinion otherwise is stated within five posts of that.
 
10,174
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I'll take Buoysel's post as proof that no one reads announcements?

Rest of this post will be found in that thread linked to.
 

Syrynn

Writer of Tales
78
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14
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Another near-death, another last-minute save!

Just when I thought I had lost all hope of writing, an impulse of writing necessitation sparked me. So a topic...

What usually sparks your need (or desire) to write? Any unusual triggers or impulses ever hit you as far as fanficcing or any other writing is concerned?

1. Usually I'm sparked to write by the fact that I'm leaving something unfinished, or I have an especially good conversation with a friend that leads to poems or short tales.

2. The weirdest thing that ever got me writing... well, I don't really have weird impulses. The closest to weird I'll have in writing is after I've made a new RP character somewhere or played an especially good game and wanna write about it.
 

JX Valentine

Your aquatic overlord
3,277
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I'll take Buoysel's post as proof that no one reads announcements?

Mmm. *nods* Yeah, it's a shame, but it goes into the problem we've got in getting kids to read the stickies. Only probably even worse, considering the announcements don't show up as unread posts or anything like that.

Also...

What usually sparks your need (or desire) to write? Any unusual triggers or impulses ever hit you as far as fanficcing or any other writing is concerned?

It's not particularly unusual to have no weird impulses, Syrynn, so don't worry about that second point there. A number of questions along the lines of "what drives you to write" usually end up with the same kinds of answers. Music. You feel the need to do it. Boredom. That kind of thing.

As for myself, the only impulse I get to drive me to sit down and write can be summed up with the phrase "because I feel like it." I only write when I have time to do so and when it just feels like it'd be a nice way to spend my time. I wouldn't exactly call it boredom. It's just like feeling like you want to do anything that happens to suit your fancy at a given moment, basically.
 

Giratina ♀

what's your sign?
1,439
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  • Age 27
  • Seen Jul 23, 2013
What usually sparks your need (or desire) to write? Any unusual triggers or impulses ever hit you as far as fanficcing or any other writing is concerned?

Before I'm mauled for mentioning music in the conversation, I will sometimes find myself playing little AMV-style videos along to the music. So if I remember a scene that pertains to my fanfic, sometimes I will sit up and say, "Oh man! I should write that!" There's also reading other people's works (fan or otherwise), and of course browsing the fanfiction sections on this or other websites.

And Buoyzel, this place is a little dead-er because of the whole plans to renovate the section thing. XD That sure is going well.
 

JX Valentine

Your aquatic overlord
3,277
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That sure is going well.

Yeah, if we could stop arguing in circles, it'd go even better, but you know how it is.

I don't know. When I posted about this in the FFL way back when, I thought a lot of the problems had pretty straightforward solutions.

First off, we had to get the FFLers to stop sitting on their thumbs and start reviewing. That turned into an argument about what quality meant and how to get people active when, really, there's nothing we can do except, you know, review as often as possible. No excuses except "real life sucks." Just actual attempts at reaching out to people instead of talking about Sentrets with flamethrowers all the time. (/hypocrisy)

Admittedly, it's getting harder and harder to actually sit down and write the reviewing guide. (One that's meant to be for the vets, if only just to sit down and say, "Yes, you can actually write a review that's only a paragraph long so long as you don't be an idiot about it.") I'd entrust the job to someone else so long as we're clear on what the definition of reviewing actually is. This is somehow another problem that we've been going back and forth about (because most FFLers apparently thought good review = rip the thing apart). However, this is something I tried to say in the first part of the last guide, so I don't know. Maybe I should just stop complaining and actually finish it, but thoughts on this bit?

Second, we had to up the quality of fanfic in the main forum, which would have been solvable once the first problem was resolved. As was pointed out many times before, no one reads the stickies. Breezy even said it best: that the rules will be enforced by the regular members if the regular members actually went out and did something. So, yeah, the rules are fine as-is. It's good that the guides have been booted out, though, because there are a few kids out there who use them for advice and inadvertently end up with misinformation. (I stand by my opinion that the link list will definitely serve as enough in terms of guides. It'll at least be there if people want it.)

Third, the FFL. We can't decide what to do about it. The entire problem, though, is the fact that it's too closed-off, and this is solvable just by asking the newbies whether or not a new FFL (read: something that talks about fanfics and connects writers with one another without drowning discussion in disjointed bold topics and inside jokes up the wazoo) would attract them or what they'd like to see in a general catch-all topic for writers. The question doesn't even have to be solicitation-like. It can just start off as a simple conversation that gradually eases into the question about the FFL. Like, "Hi. I've seen you around the FF&W. You seem like a cool person I want to get to know."

Really, the key issue here is communication. Ironic, but yes, that's all. The FFLers have to reach out to the newbies, one way or another. That's why Project Max Revive got started, and that's why I really do encourage you kids to go out and VM kids. You're not there to solicit information, and you're not here to argue about the little things that won't solve the key problems around here. You're just doing it because there's a ton of new authors out there who are either scared to post or who could use help, and the only way to get them to come out of their shells or feel comfortable with asking for help is by reaching out to them and talking to them to figure out how to make the FF&W an actual community again.

Or, in shorter terms, what really makes me feel like this is one massive wallbanger in my book is the fact that somehow, the point of the project got lost in translation. Kids, when you go to the other thread or whenever you suggest something, please keep in mind that the entire shebang is meant to bridge the gap between us (the vets) and them (the newbies). There's some very simple answers that we're missing because we keep going back and forth about the little things instead of asking the right people what's up.

Or maybe you kids knew that, and I'm being redundant. I don't know. I'm just voicing why I'm feeling frustrated over all the back-and-forth shenanigans. *shrug*
 
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10,174
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Since I was quickly reading things over to answer Delusions of Originality's post, I was able to reread a few things. And to go a little bit off Jax's post with reaching out to new members, I felt it would be a nice time to quote a few questions that she asked that were never answered, and would have been really helpful if they were.

So, let's start by approaching the problem in a different direction. Why don't you (in general) review? Is it because of a lack of time? If we establish the idea that a review only has to be a paragraph or a handful of things you can spot right off the bat, would that make you review more? If not, what would?

There we go.

Because that is what's missing in this section. Members come here to post their stories, and if no one reviews, then they stop posting and go elsewhere. There are people who post their stories to get reviews because they want to know where they can improve their writing, and to just get that feedback. If no one is reviewing, they don't see any point to posting.

That will help the new members feel welcome. They see those that are the known names taking time to come out and mingle with the strangers. And pretty soon it's hard to see who's new and who's not because everyone is one and the same.

But that wasn't happening before this change was proposed. The vets were only talking to themselves. The new kids were left to wander around, confused. And the gap between new and old was a chasm that wasn't closed.

So where did everyone go? Is real life beating down everyone right now at the same time? (It is for me, but I'll soon defeat it.) Or are there other reasons that could be changed somehow, like knowing that you don't have to tear into a fic to review it, or write a multi-page review.

And not only reviewing stories, but something has to happening to make people pose their questions or post previews of their works/ideas. Responses to those, and answers to questions (no matter what level they're on) would help. And the FFL. Something to make it feel more open.

Hey, look at that. I repeated everything that was said before. I think right now there actually needs to be something done. Anything done. Because this is getting rather frustrating.
 

Neo Pikachu

Forever Gold
180
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19
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I think some of the issues with reviewing stories is regarding how much time and interest people have, but also because 99% of the time, fan fictions are never actually completed the way they should be. Its hard getting into a story that shows little promise of ever having an ending with closure. Would you go to the bookstore and buy a novel that's only about 3/4 completed? This is the thing, some readers feel that if the author can't remain committed, why should they?

True, reviews are helpful and they encourage the author to both improve and keep going, but the author needs to play a role in it too. It's not just about writing it anymore, a story needs to be marketed like the person is trying to sell it. Make some banners for it, maybe even a wallpaper, and give the story its own site. I saw one fan fiction do this and they proved to be really captivating supplements that made the difference between a story that shines and promotes itself, and a story that's just a story. From what I see, most of these fan fictions don't even have a banner. How do you think a movie would do at the box office if it was never advertised, didn't have its own website, never had a trailer, never had coming attractions, and never had screenshots to preview it?

As a Marketing major, one of the earliest things you learn is the Marketing Mix, which consists of product, price, place, and promotion. You could apply all of these to fan fiction writing. Yes, even the price aspect. Time is money, and people generally like getting their money's worth.

The "Product" aspect is the fan fiction itself. In the beginning, this is the thing that people generally want to focus on, making the fan fiction as good as it can be and to make sure its clean of spelling, grammar, and plot errors. Completion of this "product" would also be essential, since not completing it is like getting a car without seats, brakes, air conditioner, radio, etc. In general, you want to present your fan fiction like readers are getting the best quality product they can get. Let them know and feel like they're getting an epic adventure that will have a fantastic opening, excellent rising action, breathtaking climax, and an incredible ending. Don't throw it down like its just another run of the mill, uncompleted story that's just going to end up in the gutter a few months from now.

The "Place" aspect can be applied to where its posted. This is probably the easiest aspect, since posting the same fan fiction on multiple forums costs nothing and signing up for these places can be done in generally less than three minutes. Most of the time the main issue is someone on another forum took your usual member name and now you've got to come up with something else without that unsightly random number at the end of it. Still, getting the fan fiction to circulate around helps it become a bit more renown and familiar.

The "Price" aspect relates to how much time and effort the author put into making their story the best and most epic thing it could be, and how much satisfaction the reader is getting out of reading it. Yes, time is the currency paid with reading fan fictions, and right now, whenever you're writing a fan fiction, you're competing with that person's other responsibilities and interests. Your fan fiction has to draw them in so much that they'll want to continue reading it over everything else they would probably like to do, such as playing XBox 360, watching a movie, going out with friends, and so on. The minute they become bored beyond reclamation with your fan fiction, you've pretty much lost them for good. And if it looks like you're becoming bored with your own story, how do you think that will cause them to react?

And lastly, the "Promotion" aspect can be applied to how well the fan fiction is marketed to the general Pokemon-loving public on these forums. Sure, its wrong to judge a book by its cover, but people do it anyway, its a fact of life. Since fan fictions don't get book covers or book art, do it in the form of a Photoshop banner. Give the fan fiction its own website as well, it makes the story go well beyond just being words on a page toward becoming more of an experience. Draw your own characters, make a wallpaper that fans can use for their desktop, and so on. And if your forte isn't art, it never hurts to ask some of your friends to give it a shot, but don't rely on solely one person. Either that, or give it your ultimate best shot to try and draw the characters yourself. For the longest time, I once thought my art skills were craptastic beyond recovery but slowly I've pulled myself out of that.

The problem is, most people just think the fan fiction alone is good to go, and most people start it with just beginning ideas and no real spur to make it epic and remain committed to finish it through thick and thin. Imagine how different things would be if only completed stories could get posted (hypothetically speaking, I don't think it would be fair to most people)? Sure, an unfinished story with strong and detailed reviews helps the author get better to understand what worked and what needs to be adjusted, but what about the readers that never find out what happened to the characters and the story? How do you think they would feel after spending hours reading chapter after chapter, leaving detailed reviews, and looking forward to updates only to have the captain abandon his/her own ship?

Sure, it helps to encourage people to review, but the best reviews will come from people that show interest in the story and aren't feeling like they have to force-feed it down and write a term paper's worth of analytical feedback.
 

TurtleKing

Turtles > You
849
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  • Seen Dec 12, 2016
I know I haven't been on in a while, but I'm trying to come back. I'm interested in writing again, but I think I'm ready to shut down Poke Special Manga: DP. I'm brainstorming on what my new fic will be about, but at the same time it's a struggle. So, guys just encourage me. I started this journey as a freshman in high school, now I'm a freshman in college! Time sure flies when you're writing. Thus, begins a new journey! Turtleking has returned.
 
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Aw, TurtleKing. I could have easily closed this thread, but then you posted, and now things are awkward.

That said, it's great that you're back. I'm sure that whatever idea you have for a new fic you'll be able to carry it out, even better than your beginning chapters of Poke Special Manga: DP. Since you have definitely grown as a writer.

That said, I am closing the FFL and de-stickying it as part of the Max Revive project.
 
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