3rd Gen Kanto's E4 Vs. Hoenn's E4.

I prefer Hoenn's elite four, since they employ a mix of some of the strongest types (Minus wallace, though he does have the most plentiful type) and also feature both dark and steel, which both got thier 'real' type intro in 3rd gen, catching up with the other types in terms of moves, pokemon, etc.
The Kanto elite four isn't without it's charms, though.

I prefer the Kanto Elite 4 as I'm more used to them. I always played Fire Red, and got to the Elite 4 many more times than I did in R/S/E.
The Hoenn E4 are total strangers to me.

I prefer the Hoenn 4. Mainly because their types are exotic and vibrant and I played Ruby and Sapphire more than FR and LG :D

Kanto Elite Four is propably the hardest one I've challenged, so Kanto.

Hoenn Elite Four is easily the easiest I've challenged so far.

TheGoddessOfDiscord said:

Kanto Elite Four is propably the hardest one I've challenged, so Kanto.

Hoenn Elite Four is easily the easiest I've challenged so far.

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Agreed. Plus, I didn't find the members themselves terribly interesting.
Drake was clearly a Lance imitator, and the other members weren't memorable enough for me to name before seeing the images.

This may be nitpicking, but Kanto's champion theme was also far better than Hoenn's, both the Gen 1 and Gen 2 versions.

Kanto Kanto Kanto!
Regardless of how many playthroughs leading to their defeat I do they are always my favourite =D

Buggyo said:

Agreed. Plus, I didn't find the members themselves terribly interesting.
Drake was clearly a Lance imitator, and the other members weren't memorable enough for me to name before seeing the images.

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How does an old mustache pirate guy copy a redhead spy guy? Well, they imitate in type specialty and cape usage, I'll give you that. >_> I hated how Drake replaced a Flygon with Kingdra in Emerald, because Lance had one in his FireRed rematch team as well, and Juan has one on all his teams. And it feel like nearly everyone uses a Gyarados (Lance, Gary, and Wallace use one at some point).

dragonomega said:

So, which do you prefer? The nostalgic first Elite's? Or the Hoenn Quads? Which one and why?

Maybe the good ol' Kanto Elite 4; Consisting of Lorelei, Bruno, Agatha, Lance and of course, Blue! Who prefer the types of Ice, Fighting, Ghost, Dragon & Mixed.

Or, do you prefer the Elitist's from Hoenn? Sydney, Phoebe, Glacia, Drake, Steven and Wallace. Who prefer Dark, Ghost, Ice, Dragon, Steel and Water.

Note: Steven is the champ in R/S Whilst Wallace is the Champ in Emerald.

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I prefer the Hoenn Elite 4 and RS Champion. I mean, the Kanto Elite 4 starts out superior - Lorelei is like a freaking challenge with her team comprised of Water-types and Ice-types, Bruno is a freaking muscleman, Agatha is wise in years, Lance is BA and tames Dragon-types, and Gary is just Gary Fire-Truckin' Oak (with a diverse team as well).

Sidney and Phoebe seem to fall short to them, but then you get Glacia who poses a challenge, and Drake and Steven just mop the floor with challengers, primarily with Salamence and Metagross, so you have to deal with two "pseudo-legendaries", as opposed to only Lance's Dragonite in Kanto (though Gary snagged a Tyranitar for his FRLG rematch team). And Steven got even more BA in Emerald. He also strays away from Steel-types a bit, which is evident with his Claydol (Ground-type), Armaldo (Bug/Rock), and Cradily (Grass/Rock).

Wallace is cool, just not so much as a Champion. >_> Plus, it seems like the Hoenn Elite 4/Champion would have more chemistry than their Generation 1 Kanto counterparts. Also, Hoenn E4 is classic, as I am way more used to them.

The Kanto and Hoenn Elite 4 themes rival each other just as the Kanto and Hoenn Champion themes songs tie for me, though Steven's theme has a bit of an edge due to being a bit more fast-paced and intense.

In conclusion, the Hoenn Elite 4 and Champion rock a bit more!

-I admit, Hoenn's Elite 4 could have used much more leveling in Emerald for rematch teams. I mean, Gary's rematch team peaks at Level 75, and even Lorelei's weakest rematch team Pokemon is stronger than the Hoenn Champion's strongest Pokemon in Generation 3. Not to mention that two-fifths (2/5) of Lance's original team clear the Levels of the Hoenn Elite 4 and Champion effortlessly. Hopefully, there'll be drastic re-leveling in RS remakes. >.<

fenyx4 said:

How does an old mustache pirate guy copy a redhead spy guy? Well, they imitate in type specialty and cape usage, I'll give you that. >_> I hated how Drake replaced a Flygon with Kingdra in Emerald, because Lance had one in his FireRed rematch team as well, and Juan has one on all his teams. And it feel like nearly everyone uses a Gyarados (Lance, Gary, and Wallace use one at some point).

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By copying I meant...well, he just doesn't seem to differentiate himself from Lance enough to be memorable for me. Also, why does an old sea captain dude use Dragons? XD
But I guess it really just comes down to which one you're more familiar with. To me, Sid is an inferior Karen, and Phoebe is an inferior Agatha. Type usage is the main factor for me that I compare people to.
And I'd agree that Wallace is not suited for a champion. Steven was fairly varied in Emerald (although still dominated by fire), and had more of a BA personality than Wallace. Wallace is just...flamboyant. :P

Buggyo said:

By copying I meant...well, he just doesn't seem to differentiate himself from Lance enough to be memorable for me. Also, why does an old sea captain dude use Dragons? XD
But I guess it really just comes down to which one you're more familiar with. To me, Sid is an inferior Karen, and Phoebe is an inferior Agatha. Type usage is the main factor for me that I compare people to.
And I'd agree that Wallace is not suited for a champion. Steven was fairly varied in Emerald (although still dominated by fire), and had more of a BA personality than Wallace. Wallace is just...flamboyant. :P

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I see what you mean, though; Lance and Drake do give off similar draconic vibes. They even occupy parallel positions (4th slot preceding the Champion) in their respective Leagues! XD And an old sea captain dude uses dragons because dragons are just...awesome. :D Plus, you have all those sea dragons and sea serpents swimming about that are comparative to the leviathan in power, so it makes sense...

I've only fought Karen in Pokemon Stadium 2 (barely), so I can't draw a good comparison of her to Sidney. Phoebe does seem a bit inferior to Agatha, but that's probably because of her Elite 4 ranking and because the Gengar line is classic. Furthermore, while Agatha got to pool Ghost and Poison-types, Phoebe was limited strictly to Ghost-types, of which there were only three Ghost families introduced in the Hoenn regional Dex.

Technically, she could have used Shedinja in her team as well (Bug/Ghost), which receives the same super-effective damage like regular Ghosts would. I guess due to Shedinja's frustrating ability, Wonder Guard, it was left out. It really shouldn't have been a problem, though - if you were already hitting Phoebe's Ghost-types for super-effective damage before, Shedinja is hardly a threat. It only becomes a problem when you don't have super-effective moves to KO it. Hope it returns in RS remakes.

Personally, I try not to judge Elite 4 members by type usage much, since there's a limited amount in the first place. XD Steven was indeed BA in like all of his appearances. And yeah, he was typically dominated by Fire-type moves - but woe to the Trainer who underestimates him and thinks they can sneak by the whole challenge with just a Fire-type; barring Skarmory, all of his Pokemon have moves that are super-effective against Fire-types. Wallace is quite flamboyant, though - but it works better when he is in Sootopolis Gym, not at EverGrande's Pokemon League headquarters. >_>

fenyx4 said:

I see what you mean, though; Lance and Drake do give off similar draconic vibes. They even occupy parallel positions (4th slot preceding the Champion) in their respective Leagues! XD And an old sea captain dude uses dragons because dragons are just...awesome. :D Plus, you have all those sea dragons and sea serpents swimming about that are comparative to the leviathan in power, so it makes sense...

I've only fought Karen in Pokemon Stadium 2 (barely), so I can't draw a good comparison of her to Sidney. Phoebe does seem a bit inferior to Agatha, but that's probably because of her Elite 4 ranking and because the Gengar line is classic. Furthermore, while Agatha got to pool Ghost and Poison-types, Phoebe was limited strictly to Ghost-types, of which there were only three Ghost families introduced in the Hoenn regional Dex.

Technically, she could have used Shedinja in her team as well (Bug/Ghost), which receives the same super-effective damage like regular Ghosts would. I guess due to Shedinja's frustrating ability, Wonder Guard, it was left out. It really shouldn't have been a problem, though - if you were already hitting Phoebe's Ghost-types for super-effective damage before, Shedinja is hardly a threat. It only becomes a problem when you don't have super-effective moves to KO it. Hope it returns in RS remakes.

Personally, I try not to judge Elite 4 members by type usage much, since there's a limited amount in the first place. XD Steven was indeed BA in like all of his appearances. And yeah, he was typically dominated by Fire-type moves - but woe to the Trainer who underestimates him and thinks they can sneak by the whole challenge with just a Fire-type; barring Skarmory, all of his Pokemon have moves that are super-effective against Fire-types. Wallace is quite flamboyant, though - but it works better when he is in Sootopolis Gym, not at EverGrande's Pokemon League headquarters. >_>

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I suppose that does explain the Kingdra he has in Emerald(?). :P

As for Phoebe vs. Agatha, I was pretty much comparing them based on their characters. A creepy old woman seems more...ghostly? than a girl dressed for a beach outing. XD As frustrating as it would be, I would have liked to see Shedinja in her roster. It would have made her more interesting. I agree that it should make an appearance in the R/S remakes.

I remember kinda dominating Steven with a Salamence with Flamethrower...nevertheless, his team was certainly more balanced than Wallace's. He did fit in very well as the gym leader of Sootopolis, and actually liked him as a character. Just not as a champion. XD


I don't remember if this has been mentioned, but Bruno was actually fairly disappointing in that he used as many Rock types as fighting types. Granted, he used all the [fully evolved] Fighting types in the game, but I guess I'd have liked to see Tauros or something instead of Onix. I did like his HG/SS roster very much, however.

Buggyo said:

I suppose that does explain the Kingdra he has in Emerald(?). :P

As for Phoebe vs. Agatha, I was pretty much comparing them based on their characters. A creepy old woman seems more...ghostly? than a girl dressed for a beach outing. XD As frustrating as it would be, I would have liked to see Shedinja in her roster. It would have made her more interesting. I agree that it should make an appearance in the R/S remakes.

I remember kinda dominating Steven with a Salamence with Flamethrower...nevertheless, his team was certainly more balanced than Wallace's. He did fit in very well as the gym leader of Sootopolis, and actually liked him as a character. Just not as a champion. XD


I don't remember if this has been mentioned, but Bruno was actually fairly disappointing in that he used as many Rock types as fighting types. Granted, he used all the [fully evolved] Fighting types in the game, but I guess I'd have liked to see Tauros or something instead of Onix. I did like his HG/SS roster very much, however.

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LOL...it somewhat explains the Kingdra. I still think way too many people use Kingdra though (and I just remembered that Claire uses one too, just like her cousin does. >.<)

Yeah, Agatha's physical appearance complements Ghost-type Pokemon better than Phoebe's Hawaiian-like, joyous appearance. But Phoebe is hot, so yeah. I'll take a hot Ghost-type specialist Elite 4 lady over a creepy old Ghost-type specialist E4 lady any day. :3

Shedinja would be perfect for Phoebe's roster, and would also let people confront the ability in-game. I remember back in Generation 3 when one of my friends whipped out a Shedinja against another friend he was battling, everyone was confused about why it kept avoiding damage. The limited Gen 3 ability flavor text hardly helped. XD

Eh, with Salamence, of course you're going to dominate stuff; LOL. And excluding Whiscash and Shiftry, Wallace was basically "Thunderbolt spam!" ad nauseum. >_>

Bruno only used two Rock-types (2 Onix), and he had three Fighting-types in his original roster (Hitmonchan, Hitmonlee, and Machamp)! +1 Fighting-type Pokemon, as I see it! Though I kind of like Bruno's usage of rock/metallic Pokemon, as it hints at his fighting ability, being able to shatter boulders as if they were made of crackers. Or something.

Avoiding Bruno's HGSS team(s) to avert spoilers. >>

Lorelei > Glacia
Bruno > Sidney
Agatha > Phoebe
Lance > Drake
Gary kida even with steven (rhyme :D), but definitely Gary > Wallace

Plus in Emerald you had a chance to catch rayquaza level 70 before challenging E4 so they should've been almost no match at all... (I've played Emerald... only with VBA :P)

Kanto, simply because I can't even remember who was in the Hoenn E4.

Definitely Kanto. They are more powerful than Hoenn E4.
In FireRed and LeafGreen, most of the E4's Pokémon are like Level 60 plus plus! Not to mention Blue. He'll kick Wallace's/Steven's butt anyday...

In Emerald, the E4's Pokémon's maximum level is 54... It's not much of a challenge. I could beat them on first try in 2-3 minutes! No need for special items unlike the Kanto E4, where you would still require Revives, Full Restores, etc. no matter what level you're in!