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What bugs you in a ROM Hack?

277
Posts
9
Years
  • Hello everybody! My name is frog, and I'm making a ROM Hack. I have some ideas I might want to use, but I have a question. What bugs you in a ROM Hack? In other words, what do you not like in a rom hack? Kind of a short post, but I want to hear your opinions!
     
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    5,256
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    16
    Years
  • Good idea for a thread!

    I might be overly picky but some of the things I hate when playing hacks are:

    • Broken english - I can appreciate that some hackers do not have English as their native language, but I would rather either play a properly translated hack or just play a hack in its native language than have to endure a sloppy compromise
    • Annoying mapping - Far too many hackers think repetitive, one-block-wide maps filled with tall grass make good maps, and it's a very frustrating trope
    • Mega-Evolutions as regular evolutions - Seriously, I can understand the desire to want to have the shiny new thing Game Freak is pushing, but if it's just a regular evolution it feels tacky and, for want of a better term, like "downloadbait"
    • Mugshots of characters using showpokepic - I don't know why this annoys me so much but it does, lol.

    There are probably more but these are the ones I can think of off the top of my head.
     
    794
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    10
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  • Good idea for a thread!

    I might be overly picky but some of the things I hate when playing hacks are:

    • Broken english - I can appreciate that some hackers do not have English as their native language, but I would rather either play a properly translated hack or just play a hack in its native language than have to endure a sloppy compromise
    • .......
    I get where you're coming from but you leave little room for foreign hackers. You say you're willing to play a hack in another language but that would put off many players which is the exact opposite of what a hacker is trying to achieve.


    I may sound a bit hypocritical but poor grammar also bugs me. To me, though, it's more like: "wow, I didn't know you can say that like this" and later turns out you actually can't. Also, irregular verbs with "-ed" suffix. Can't stand those, lol.

    More unwanted things include:
    - little Pokemon diversity
    - Making boss fight overly difficult by increasing levels drastically(why not just change EVs and IVs?)
    - Repeated trainers' texts(Yes, I'm looking at you Light Platinum)
    - lack of special/physical split(at this point, why wouldn't you add it?)
     
    10,078
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    15
    Years
    • UK
    • Seen Oct 17, 2023
    -Hacks that try to have every feature (ALL pokemon, ALL regions, 256 Badges, etc.).
    -Sloppy scripting, like OWs appearing/disappearing on screen and minor things that can be easily fixed, most of the time.
    -Empty maps. Whilst I don't like cramped maps either, it's pretty boring walking through a world that is 99% grass tiles.
     
    417
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    9
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    • Seen Nov 20, 2016
    1) Hacks with crazy level curves/movesets in the name of "difficulty." Challenging hacks (opponents with good strategy) are good. Ridiculous level curves are not a challenge, they are merely annoying. You don't have to think, you just have to grind.

    2) This mostly applies to hacks that attempt to have a ton of obtainable Pokemon, usually including 4-6 gen mons, but it can even apply to hacks as small as 386 projects. I don't like when you go onto the first route, find 5-8 species of pokemon, walk one route over, find a completely new set of 5-8 mons, walk one more route etc. I like when hacks have a ton of species, but I don't like when they feel extremely crammed. I'd prefer being able to find new mons at a rate similar rate to normal games, perhaps with more post game routes, or even sections of regular routes for additional mons that can only be accessed later in the game. As much as people complain about all of the wild Rattatas/Tentacools/Zubats, they add connectivity. Regions feel more cohesive when routes that are close to each other feel similar.
     
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    277
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  • What personally bugs me is when people hack firered, and use the vanilla tiles. To make matters worse, some people get lazy and make the grass look very ugly. Also, when hackers create no effort to change any part of the intro, it grinds my gears.
     

    daniilS

    busy trying to do stuff not done yet
    409
    Posts
    10
    Years
    • Seen Jan 29, 2024
    I am often disappointed if I see a hack has an enormous feature list, but then it turns out half of them can be implemented within less than a minute (seriously, disabling running shoes inside or having applied some patch is NOT a feature) and the other half of them are, like Spherical said, downloadbait: ugly implementations of overhyped things that essentially make the hack worse. (If you want megas, learn ASM (or don't do them at all :p), if you want difficulty, give trainers balanced teams with EVs and make puzzles. And everybody knows we look at quality rather than quantity when it comes to regions.)

    If you want your hack to be good, come up with some original features, I think most of us will agree on that.
     

    Splash

    But nothing happened.
    658
    Posts
    14
    Years
  • Nothing really bugs me in a rom hack and I don't complain that much
    As long as they worked hard on it and released it in the proper time well I have no trouble..


    -Hacks that try to have every feature (ALL pokemon, ALL regions, 256 Badges, etc.).
    -Sloppy scripting, like OWs appearing/disappearing on screen and minor things that can be easily fixed, most of the time.
    -Empty maps. Whilst I don't like cramped maps either, it's pretty boring walking through a world that is 99% grass tiles.

    Thank you for inspiring me to make a hack with 99% grass tiles in the future! O.O
     
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    10
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  • I personally tend to dislike Fakemons. Some can be good, even excellent, but most of the time they're pretty ugly/not in touch with GameFreak's designs. Obviously the idea of having new Pokemon in a hack is always nice, especially if they fit the region. But it's usually poorly done... and I won't blame them, it must be incredibly hard to do. I just don't like it. :[
     
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  • -The absence of Physical/Special Split
    -Poor grammar (ex. Resolute, Victory Fire)
    -Being too difficult (ex. Dark Rising)
    -Having crappy pokemon on each route
     
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    Lycanthropy

    [cd=font-family:Special Elite;font-size:16px;color
    11,037
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    10
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  • -Too many Pokémon. Seriously, you just end up using only six on a team, why bother to make tons of them obtainable, it makes the game quickly chaotic. 150 of them is enough, but I don't have a problem with less.
    -Both Fakemon and regular Pokémon. I don't know, it just feels weird, I say the one or the other, not both, but that might be very personal.
    -Changed Pokémon data. I've seen some hacks which for example change the type of a Pokémon. Let's say the hacker thinks for some reason that Dunsparce should be a ground type instead of normal, but that doesn't mean all players would agree. A Pokémon has set data, otherwise it is a completely different Pokémon who just looks the same. If the hacker wants to do a change, it should be obviously be a change and the effort to design a Fakemon should be taken.
     
    It may be worth noting that there are a bunch of threads like this already in existence that are locked that OP may want to look over. Here's a long one by a devilishly handsome guy with a Mismagius avatar. Honestly, this topic comes up so often that maybe it should be another stickied thread.

    -Too many Pokémon. Seriously, you just end up using only six on a team, why bother to make tons of them obtainable, it makes the game quickly chaotic. 150 of them is enough, but I don't have a problem with less.
    -Both Fakemon and regular Pokémon. I don't know, it just feels weird, I say the one or the other, not both, but that might be very personal.
    -Changed Pokémon data. I've seen some hacks which for example change the type of a Pokémon. Let's say the hacker thinks for some reason that Dunsparce should be a ground type instead of normal, but that doesn't mean all players would agree. A Pokémon has set data, otherwise it is a completely different Pokémon who just looks the same. If the hacker wants to do a change, it should be obviously be a change and the effort to design a Fakemon should be taken.

    I agree with these points. Too much variety is detrimental to a hack. Too little is, well, too little. There's a balance that has to be struck. For me personally, I think somewhere around the 200 mark is good.

    Fakemon and Pokemon together is weird for me as well. I liked Quartz (for what it was, I'm not saying it was good) but I probably wouldn't've had regular Pokemon been included as well.

    As for changed Pokemon data, I agree that it is jarring to have types mixed up without warning, but I can definitely understand why a hacker would want to make a well-intentioned change. I'm meh on this issue.

    ----

    What truly bugs me is low effort hacks. You all know the kind of hacks I'm talking about. All of my points will be related to this main one.

    Maps that obviously took less than an hour to plan out and make are usually bad. Like, universally so. GameFreak's "simple" maps aren't simple because they were quick and easy to make. The layouts were clearly thought out and went through several iterations before they looked good. The evidence for this is sitting in GSC's beta maps and prerelease screenshots. You can not expect to open A-Map for the first time and make a beautiful map. Heck, even I can't open A-Map with no plan and produce an "almost okay" map; and mapping is probably my strongest hacking ability. My latest map took me about 45 minutes to plan: basically a sketch of the layout on an index card or something similar. The flow and direction of this particular map had been predetermined by the numerous previous iterations of the map (there were at least three earlier versions of this map, the time for generating those I am not counting here). Placement of key elements as well as defining trees, grass patches, mountain ridges, and pathing happens at this stage. Then, it took about 4 hours to actually map out from scratch. And that's just the map. I'm not including tile work, events, connections, etc. Good maps look good because they take time. Most of the mapping advice out there right now is garbage, and fledgling hackers are producing garbage as a result.

    Bad storylines. It amazes me how many, I guess I'll call them "consumers", in our community will eat up the worst hacks with the worst storylines and then speak of them with hushed reverence and starry eyes. Hacks that I simply have to read the opening paragraphs in the thread or glance at the first couple of screenshots to know that I have to skip over this one. Even at the ages that these consumers are likely at, I knew what concepts simply aren't going to work. I knew what a decent storyline would look like. And I knew what red flags to look for in a hack's presentation to know what was going to be awful. You simply can't string a bunch of "this would be so cool" ideas together and make a good hack. No, Arceus and the supporting cast of EVERY. DAMN. LEGENDARY. PLUS. FAKEMON. ONES. threatening the world with powers you just made up five minutes ago is not a good hack. No, your really evil this time look how badass they are team with no motivation or actual ability to do any real damage is not a good antagonist. People who know what quality is are laughing at you. Read a book. Come to think of it, I'm so glad that none of these hackers are published authors.

    Bad level curve. I admit, years ago I had a pretty bad level curve in the one hack that I decided to release to the community. That was simply a bad hack and I won't try to justify it. Level curves are difficult to get right. Like everything else in hacking, they do and should take time to ferment and perfect. That said, I'm again baffled at the consumers worshiping the hacks that demand you to grind for hours or cheat to outdo their satanic level curve that no thought was put into other than "let's make this hard". That's not difficulty. That is the fakest form of difficulty a developer can throw at you. I understand that Pokemon is a bit shallow with how skilled the AI can be, but there are other ways to make the hack difficult. Look at Colosseum as one possible way among the multitude, for example. It was difficult because it restricted your Pokemon to ones with low BSTs and crappy movepools until you were almost done with the game. Meanwhile, the enemy Trainers started out with even crappier Pokemon, and eventually ramped up to just okay Pokemon with very slight level advantages. You don't need to place your players at the bottom of a level cliff to make them think about their battles. Grinding to win should be an option, not the only viable one. The community needs to stop encouraging this.

    Bad dialog. Whether it be that no character is interesting or there are grammar errors and spelling mistakes everywhere, that is the quickest way to get me to not play your hack. I understand that typos slip through. I understand that the lesser-used grammar conventions aren't natural or fresh to most people. But make an effort. Playtest your hack and talk to everyone. Fix the mistakes that you see. (Heck, I've already corrected things in this post, and I'm sure I'll miss a bunch.) Say the text out loud to yourself to catch awkward pauses or phrasing. In addition, be aware of how your text is fitting in the textbox. You should try to avoid using the "\l" at all costs. Try to end your sentences or complete thoughts at the end of a single textbox's available space if at all possible. Do not allow your phrasing to generate awkward pauses in the text because the textbox has to make a new line to continue; format everything so that new lines are generated at natural pauses in the dialog. If English is not your native language, you get a complete and absolute pass at this. I'll play your hack in your native language if there is an option to. I know enough of the Latin-based languages to get the jist of what's going on. If not, I know that English is hard and inconsistent and it sucks and I can't expect people who aren't native speakers and haven't been educated in the language for their entire lives to get everything right. For the rest of you, again, pick up a book. Reading is the best way to improve your vocabulary and internalize grammar so that you don't make these mistakes constantly.

    These are the bulk of my gripes with the hacks of today. If you can manage to piece together a hack with minimal offenses in these categories that is also even remotely interesting, you will win HotY. You will win every subsequent HotY. We will have to revise the previous HotY's so that you can win those too. Basically what I'm saying is this, these are the three ingredients that, when done right, make an objectively good hack. You don't even need Chemical X, or anything special. Do this, and you will have a better hack than 90% of the hacks out there today. The bar is set that low.
     
    Last edited:
    34
    Posts
    9
    Years
    • Seen Jun 26, 2016
    Good idea for a thread!

    I might be overly picky but some of the things I hate when playing hacks are:

    • Broken english - I can appreciate that some hackers do not have English as their native language, but I would rather either play a properly translated hack or just play a hack in its native language than have to endure a sloppy compromise
    • Annoying mapping - Far too many hackers think repetitive, one-block-wide maps filled with tall grass make good maps, and it's a very frustrating trope
    • Mega-Evolutions as regular evolutions - Seriously, I can understand the desire to want to have the shiny new thing Game Freak is pushing, but if it's just a regular evolution it feels tacky and, for want of a better term, like "downloadbait"
    • Mugshots of characters using showpokepic - I don't know why this annoys me so much but it does, lol.

    There are probably more but these are the ones I can think of off the top of my head.

    This seems directed at Wind1158 because he does almost everything listed. How can you hate mughsots?? It allows you to see the character better.
     

    Dreg

    Done after the GT.
    1,496
    Posts
    12
    Years
    • Seen Jul 11, 2016
    I knew that I wouldn't have to click on the thread to know that Fakemon would be mentioned here.

    I would say, being far too difficult a hack. Meaning, that you gotta level up so much to just get past a certain part (Pokemon Vega first version being this, level 16's going up against level 27's in a gym)
     

    DyingWillFlareon

    Burning Candle
    4,309
    Posts
    9
    Years
  • -Fakemon
    Yeah, I don't say anything but fakeymanz are pretty high on the list, since I don't know their types, moves, whether they evolve or not, or even if I don't like the designs or names. Some are ok(like Moocano in Sienna XD) and Pokemon Sweet version did this well.

    -Broken English
    Actually, I don't care. I'll read a game in text speak if I like the plot.

    -No plot
    I need plots and stories, that's my number one must have in a game. If the game is based on grinding, I'm less likely to play it. I'm slow at growing a team, but I go through storylines and such like nothing. Another point:

    -Difficulty
    I don't mind a game that has increased levels, in fact, I like the idea of beating the League with Level 100s instead of 50s. But most hacks I play that aren't the 'increased difficulty' hacks are usually just crazy high with Level 5s in that area, that makes me unmotivated to train and get my butt kicked by the third Gym in the game. >.>
     

    Dragon

    lover of milotics
    11,151
    Posts
    10
    Years
  • Augh, the difficulty for sure. Specifically the level curves...

    Like in some hacks I had to fight against evolved pokemon who would normally evolve at around the level 30s or so, but they're around level 16. I mean, I get it might be a part of a storyline, but the stats make it needlessly difficult, haha. They could at least tone it down a little bit, I mean, they don't have to have ridiculous stats in order for us to engage in the storyline!
     
    5,256
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    16
    Years
  • This seems directed at Wind1158 because he does almost everything listed. How can you hate mughsots?? It allows you to see the character better.

    I admit I have been watching a let's play of Mega Power recently and noticing things I don't like, but it's unfair to imply they're things only 1158 does, lol. I tend not to like mugshots because the pixel art is usually not-great, which I suppose I should've clarified, and it's always distracting when they look very similar to the vanilla HG/SS/etc. mugshots.
     
    7
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    13
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    • Seen Nov 25, 2018
    If this is still open, I've got one HUGE one

    Gen/Other continuity bashing - It's rather annoying an unprofesisonal to have characters in your game bash on specific gens just because you don't like some of Gen 4 or 5's Pokemon and completely forgetting Gen 1 and 2 had equally goofy designs, or things like the anime or manga by claiming the character from said story died (or worse SHOWING them dying) or a blatant character based on them in personality is repeatedly bashed.
     

    Lance32497

    LanceKoijer of Pokemon_Addicts
    792
    Posts
    9
    Years
  • What really bugs me when playing hacked roms,
    well, I do appreciate hacker's effort on their rom hacks, but there are things that bug me.

    1: Minor Bugs bug me- Some completed hacks had "minor bugs" in their rom. Even though those bugs could be fixed less than an hour, they didn't spend time to fix it because I don't know if they knew how to fix it or they were just lazy, well, Major bugs cannot be avoided cuz a rom connot be called rom if it doesnt have bugs, but minor bugs can be prevented if you spend some time to fix those.

    2: Boring story- I had played Victory fire and Resolute (sorry for mentioning these rom hacks) but the story is very common, you know, things were happening because it just happened, you can tell on your mind that the ending is this or that, there's no twist. I rather play FR/LG or RSE than playing games that will surely put me in Boredom zone.

    3: No challege, if it has, over! You know, there are rom hacks that you will ask yourself, why am I playing this? (No offense), because you can even walk in all routes without worrying that your pokemon will be fainted or somewhat that will mess your adventure. In short, TOO EASY, and some hacks which is not hard, very hard! Now you will be worrying if this trainer's eye will catch me because it has a f**king Low level Absol although it is just Route 1, or in short! IMPOSSIBLE GAME!

    4: Ported features- as what have daniils said, there are ported features in R&D and even TT&R, you just need to do some hex edit.

    5: It just disappears?- I had played some hacks which OWs who are supposed to disappear had just disappeared.
    fadescreen 0x1
    hidesprite 0x4
    setflag 0x200
    fadescreen 0x0
    There are some applymovement commands that will make an OW disappears without using hidesprite. Movements made Pokemon roms more exciting and more beautiful to play,.
     
    78
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    15
    Years
  • I don't like it when the level curve of a hack is weird or when there's a totally unexpected jump in the level curve. Don't give me a trainer that has one level 16 Pokemon, and then a few steps later one that has 2 level 20 Pokemon. And really, sometimes it's not the level curve that's frustrating about trainers. It's the Pokemon they have. You should not be expected to plow through certain tough Pokemon early in the game (level isn't everything, so a lower level doesn't necessarily mean a smooth battle). I also dislike it when there aren't enough opportunities to heal/gather resources and it's just "go go go" all the time.

    I also don't like it when a hack sort of makes you feel like it's trying to make you fail. If you notice, in the real Pokemon games, there is never an air of total frustration/impossibility at any point in the game, whether it involves a puzzle or a battle, and they don't spam hard/lengthy challenges on you. I don't fancy a "challenge" that would send you off to grind for an hour in order to advance. It's even worse when a hack does this throughout the entire game. It essentially becomes a grinding game when that happens, and that's boring to me, personally. It's fine if there's a bit of grinding required here and there, but not after every gym battle. "Oh hey! Got a badge! Great! Now it's time to grind for a long time so I don't get destroyed by the next set of battles."
     
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